To the Christian Reader , being none of I. B. those men , who ( according to S. Pauls Prophecie ) a a 2 Tim. 3. 4. loue pleasures more than God .

To the same Christian Reader , being T. G. none of those men , who ( contrary to S. Iames his Rule ) b b Iam. 2. 1. hold the Faith of Christ , or the Truth of God , with respect of persons .

I Could haue wished , good Reader , that Mr. B. had obserued those two Rules sometime prescribed their Orators at Athens , that they should speake when they spake , c c 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 . Lucian . de gynmas . without preface , or passion . For if any d d 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 . Plato de rep. l. 4. Nimis ●…diosa pempa res Circensibus . Sen. praefat. controvers. Preface whatsoeuer , as Plato saith , seeme long to those that desire to come to the maine matter ; much more must a prolix and impertinent Preface , needs be no other than a meere Purgatorie to the studious Reader , either diuerting or with-holding him from that that most he desireth . And for passion and affection , it is apparent , that Ab ipsa veri contemplatione 〈◊〉 abducunt . Quintil. inflit . l. 6. c. 3. Ratio id iudicari vult quod aequum est ▪ iraid aequum videri vult quod iudicauit . Ratio nihil praeter ipsum de quo agitur , spectat : ira vanis & extra causam oberrantibus commovetur . Saepe infesta patrono reum damnat : & si ingeritur oculis veritas , amat & tuetur errorem : coargui non vult ; & in malè coeptis honestior illi pertinacia , quàm poenitentia ( aut palnodia ) videtur . Sen. de ira , l. 1. c. 15. they doe not onely not helpe or further ought , but hinder much the discouerie either of truth or of right . But Mr. B. it seemeth , liked not to be tied to either of those Lawes : for he beginneth his Booke with a long Proeme , and his Proeme with much passion . Which course since he hath taken , and there is a necessitie of examining what he here saith , I must intreat thee to blame him ( who hath giuen the occasion ) and not me , if thou be kept longer than is fit , from that which thou hastn●…st vnto , and that should haue beene our principall aime in this worke .

SOme yeeres are past since Mr. G. tooke occasion , I. B. from casting of Lots to finde out for whose sake a dangerous storme was , to iustifie playing with Dice , Cards , &c. and to confute me by Name in open Pulpit .

It hath beene euer deemed that f f Pri●…ipus omen inesse 〈◊〉 . 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 . Eurip. Aeol . Rarus principi●…est exi●…us bonus mal●… . Principi●… qu●… sunt incho●…a ●…alo , vix est ●…t bon●… per●…gantur exi●… . Leo ad M●…ur . Ep. apud Gr●… . caus. 1. q. 1. Vbi tamen Gl●…a paulò seve●…ius , Vix ●… . n●…quam . Malum principium ●…alus finis sequitur . Petr. ●…ns r●…g . i●…r . ●…iv . Hinc Cic. ad Attic. l. 10. ep. 20. Malè p●…suimus initia ; sic caetera sequentur . Beginnings T. G. are ominous : and such matter as men meet with at the first entrance of a worke , they are wont commonly to looke for and expect in the processe . If this worke of Mr. B. should by this rule be iudged of , it would receiue no small preiudice ; sithence it beginneth at the first entrance with a flat vntruth , to wit , that I confuted him by name in open Pulpit .

True it is , that handling the first of g g Iona. 1. ●… . Ionas , I tooke occasion , by the Lot there cast , to entreat at large of the Vse of Lots in generall , the rather for sundry doubts and scruples that by diuers had beene moued vnto me concerning the Vse of them : And that among other things I defended the Vse of a Lot generally vsed in disport , either for combination of the sporters onely , or for prosecution and determination of the sport ; and consequently did iustifie the Lot vsed in Cards and Dice &c. rather than the Games themselues simply , or any otherwise , considered . For my maine question concerning lusorious Lots is , whether the light Vse of a Lot be a thing vtterly vnlawfull , as Mr. B. and some others auouch it to be ; and so whether that make such games among others to be vnwarrantable , not whether in other respects they be vnwarrantable or no.

But that by name in open Pulpit I confuted Mr. B. or that in propounding of any Argument in this Argument by me refuted , I did in Pulpit once name any Author thereof , is a thing altogether vntrue ; concerning which I haue cleared my selfe by solemne protestation to Mr. B. himselfe , as shall h h Post-script to his Preface . after by his owne confession in part also appeare : And many also that heard me and tooke notes of what was deliuered , can yet testifie as much .

I hearing thereof by many sent him this message ; I. B. If it would please him to send the substance of the Confutation ( for I dare not relie vpon report ) I would either reply or change mine opinion with thanks to God for him ; though for the present I thought he failed in Iudgement , Discretion , and Charitie .

By whom Mr. B. heard this I know not . If T. G. they told him ought that was vntrue , the fault was not mine but i i Exod. 23. 1. Levit. 19. 16. Falson' an vero laudent , culpent , quem velint , Non floccifaciunt ; dum illud quod lubeat sciant . Plaut. Trinum . 1. 2. theirs ; peraduenture k k Atque egomet me adeò cum illis unâ ibidem traho , Qui illorum verbis falsis acceptor fui . Ibid. Multum enim derogatio praevalet , quando deroganti fides habetur . Foelix 2. ad Athan. c. 10. Detrabere an detrabentem libenter audire , utrum sit damnabillus non facilè dixerim . Bern. de consid . lib. 3. Pari reatu de●…rabentes & audientes detinentur . Idem medit . cap. 42. Similiter culpabilis est is qui detra●…it , & qui detrabentem audit . Idem mod. viv . c. 33. Itaque sci●…e Hier. ad Nep●…t . Cave ne aut ling●… aut aures prurientes habeas , i. ne aut ipse alijs detra●…as , aut detrabentes audias . Nemo invito 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 ▪ Dis●…at detractor , d●…te videt non libenter audire , non facilè detra●…ere . his also , in being ouer-credulous in that which the party , whom he made vse of betweene himselfe and me , could haue informed him to be otherwise . And I cannot but wonder by the way , that Mr. B. who here telleth his Reader that he dareth not relie vpon reports , yet hath not doubted vpon bare report , ( if any such were ) especially hauing since the same beene bettet informed , to auow peremptorily in print , that I confuted him by Name in open Pulpit . l l 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 These things sure doe not agree well together . If he durst not relie vpon report then , how dare he now so far forth relie vpon it , as to auerre that in print , which he could not haue but by report ? vnlesse his iudgement be altred since concerning that point .

But hearing indeed , it seemeth , that among other Arguments answer was giuen to those also contained in his Dialogue ; He shewed himselfe , as I was informed , therewith to be much offended , and sent me word , that if I would let him haue in writing what I had deliuered , it should be answered . Whereupon I sent him so much of it as concerned his Dialogue extracted out of the rest . Which he promised to consider of , and returne answer vnto .

Yea , but in this businesse , Mr. G. in Mr. B. his opinion , hath failed much many waies . If he had then either told me so meeting me , as he did many times , or had sent me such word , I might then haue giuen him some satisfaction therein . But let vs now at length heare , and others determine , wherein .

1. In Iudgement : Because that Doctrine was I. B. not drawne from his Text ; Except this be a iudicious deduction .

Gentiles cast Lots in a most serious matter : Therefore Christians may vse Lotterie in Dicing , Carding , &c.

I perceiue if Mr. B. might haue the framing T. G. of Mr. Gs. ●s . Arguments , there would be very iudicious deductions in them indeed . But if without any such iniudicious deduction , the Question of the Vse of Lots in generall might well by occasion of that Text be discussed , then is Mr. B. his deduction nothing iudicious , from thence taxing Mr. G. as failing in Iudgement , for taking occasion thereby to discusse that Question . But herein Mr. B. dealeth with me as he doth with Peter Martyr in his Dialogue ; where , because m m Petr. Martyr in Iud. cap. 14. Peter Martyr relateth in his discourse entreating of Dice-play , how n n 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Plat. de repub. l. 10. & apud Plut. de tranquill . & consol . ad Apollon. Sed & Socrates apud Stob. c. 123. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 . Plato compareth the Life of Man thereunto , he denieth , yea and seriously consuteth this Consequence , implying the same to be Peter Martyrs ;

Plato compareth mans life to Table-play , Therefore Table-play is lawfull .

I will not here stand vpon the Ordinarie plea , that it is o o Magnos bonestus error est sequi duces . Quintil. instit . l. 1. n●… great disgrace for a man ( a meane man , as my selfe especially ) to goe astray with great Guides , before he be informed ( as my selfe neuer was till now ) of their error . Nor will I say , as one sometime did ( it was no warrantable saying ) p p Malo ego cum Platone errare , quàm cum istis vera sentire . Cic. Tascul . l. 1. Verum hoc est Platonem Deum sacere : prout ipse alibi de eodem ; Deus ille noster Plato . Cic. ad Attic. l. 4. ep. 15. Melius sanctiusque Aristot. ethic. l. 1. c. 6. 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Vnde & illud eiusdem sertur ; Amicus Plato : sed magis amica veritas . Sed & Plin. ep. 8. l. 5. Honestissimum maiorum vestigia sequi , si mo●…ò recto itmere processerint . I will chuse rather to erre with such , than to goe the right way with any other : as if it were safe , as some q q Cùm Pastor ordinarius & a●…quis ●…lius qui praedicat non voca●…us contraria docent , debet omninò populus Pastorem suum potius sequi quàm illum alterum qui non est Pastor , etiam si fortè contingeret , vt Pastor erraret . Bellarm. de Cleric . l. 1. c. 8. Quasi cum Cic. pro Balb●… diceret , Vti●…us bonesti●…sque illo duce errare , quàm hoc magistr●… erudi●…i . Papists auow , to erre at all with any . But yet , considering the ordinarie practise of some r r Peter Martyr , Dr. Whitakers , Mr. Perkins , and others . An ego verear ne me non satis deceat , quod illos decuit ? Plin. ep. 3. l. 5. principal Diuines of our times , and such as Mr. B. himselfe ( I am sure ) esteemeth for iudicious ; as also treading in the track of s s The now Lord Archbishop of Canterbury ; and the late L. Bishop of London . two Reuerend Prelates ( besides others ) in this very particular , who take occasion vpon the same Text ( though not so largely as I doe ) to consider of Lots in more generall manner than concerneth the particular Lot in the Text mentioned , and to speak the t t B. King on Ion. lect. 9. one of them somewhat of the Lusorie Lot also now questioned ; I shall craue leaue of Mr. B. to incline to their Iudgements herein rather than his , till he bring better Reasons for his Opinion than as yet he hath brought . Nor will Mr. B. euer be able to proue that euery by - point handled by occasion of a Text , must of necessitie be necessarily deduced euer from the words of the Text. Howsoeuer it be , it mattereth not much , since it neither mendeth Mr. B. his cause , nor yet marreth mine in the Point betweene vs controuerted .

2. In Discretion . Because that Doctrine ( though I. B. occasioned by his Text , yet ) so insisted vpon , incourageth Gamesters in their sinfull course , and buildeth vp those Abuses , which the Lawes of our Land would pull downe .

The Charge , you see , riseth , From a grosse T. G. failing in Iudgement to a fouler faulting in Discretion , if all that Mr. B. here auerreth , be true . But whether my discourse doth , either incourage Gamesters vnto any sinfull course ; ( vnlesse to vse any Lot in Game be a sinfull course , which Mr. B. must not yet take for granted ) or build vp such Abuses as our Lawes would pull downe ; I appeale to the Booke it selfe ; let Mr. B. either shew so much out of it , or else his u u Calumniatur , qui quod defert , non probat . Reg. Iur. Charge here is but a meere Calumnie .

But of this more hereafter .

3. In Charitie : Because he confuteth me by I. B. Name ( as I was certified ) not hauing had any conference with me either by speech , or by writing , though I be his Neighbour Minister .

The heauiest Charge commeth last . A breach T. G. of Charitie at least . To faile in Iudgement or Discretion , may argue some weaknesse of braine ; to faile in Charitie argueth x x Ideò imperitiam confiteri solemus , ut malitiae suspicionem vitemus . Hieron . adv. error . Ioan. Hierosol . much more , an euill minde . But let Mr. Bs. words here and else-where be well weighed , and peraduenture they will giue ouer-much ground of suspition of some want of that in him , that he chargeth me here to haue failed in . Mr. G. saith he , failed in Charitie , because he confuteth me by Name , as I was certified , hauing had no conference with me by speech or writing , though I be his neighbour Minister . Not to insist much on by-matters ; that Mr. B. is my neighbour Minister , is more than euer I heard before : that he is y y A divisis ad conjuncta nulla est consecutio . Aristot. soph . elench . l. 2. c. 3. my neighbour and a Minister , it may well be ; yet it is more than I knew , when I dealt in this point ; nor doe I yet know , where his place of abode is , saue that himselfe of late hath told me , that I goe oft by his doore ; and so he may be termed my neighbour , yet in no very strict sense , as any other Inhabitant in the Borough of Southwarke may . But to let that passe , if Mr. B. his meaning be that I confuted him by name in the Pulpit , as he charged me at first , and which I vtterly denie ; how will it stand with Charitie or Conscience vpon a bare report , which he saith else-where he dareth not relie on , and that a●…ter better information acknowledged to haue beene giuen him , yet still so oft , and so peremptorily to charge me therewith , and with breach of Charitie therein ? If his meaning be that I haue since that confuted , and doe ( the z z Vox audita perit : litera scripta manet . letter of my Booke still abiding ) by name confute him , not in the Pulpit , but in print , because he saith in the present tense , he confuteth me by name , I denie it not , nor doe I hold it any breach of Charitie so to doe . His Booke is abroad vnder his Name , as well as mine is vnder mine : Nor is it any more a breach of Charitie for me by Name so to confute him in the one , than it was in him by Name to controll and oppose Peter Martyr in the other . But neither could this be any ground for Mr. B. then to iudge me guilty of vncharitablenesse , when as yet it was not ; nor could any certifie him then of it , vnlesse they knew more of my minde then , than I my selfe did ; nor was it done before I had dealt with Mr. B. by writing , as himselfe in the next passage freely acknowledgeth . Mr. Bs. words therefore hang but vnhandsomly together , when he saith , he thought I failed in Charitie , because I confute him by Name , as he was certified , &c. His minde and his pen , or both , and the knowne truth , it may be feared , a a Illic mihi aliud dictabat animus , aliud scribebat calamus . Erasm epist. ad Ludov. Viv. lib. 19. had some strugling together , when he wrote thus .

Well ; Mr. G. sent me his Answer to my Dialogue . I. B. I acknowledge it with hearty thanks . But why haue I not replied in so many yeeres ? I answer : Sat citò , si sat benè . To speake freely ; I thinke I should neuer haue replied , in hope that the Question would haue died , had not Mr. G. confuted my Dialogue in Print . But now , the rather , being prouoked by many learned Ministers and other . who tell me , that seeing of all those whom Mr. G. confuteth , viz. Peter Martyr , Zwinglius , Cartwright , Danaeus , Perkins , Fenner , &c. I onely liue , I ought to reply , lest my silence should giue way to impious iniquitie ; I am ready to performe my promise in replying . Which indeed I could not haue done so conueniently before , because the answer , which Mr. G. sent me , had not the positiue grounds of his Opinion , which the printed booke hath .

True it is , I was not daintie to deliuer Mr. B. T. G. an Answer to the whole Substance of his Dialogue , but vpon promise returned me first from Mr. B. that in defence of his owne Arguments he would reply thereupon . Which himselfe also , after long delay , being vrged either to doe or tredeliuer it , did by word of mouth to my selfe againe oblige himselfe either to doe or to yeeld the truth ; for so his words both times were . But after a yeere or twoes stay longer , when nothing would be returned , and I was by diuers informed , how I was in meetings oft traduced and backbited , mine intentions scanned , my positions taxed , some as senslesse , some as impious , diuers assertions fastned on me , that I neuer deliuered , diuers of those b b - nihil est , Quin malè narrando possit depravarier . T●…r . Phorm. 4. 4. depraued that were deliuered , and that Mr. B. himselfe among others was not sparing herein : I condescended at length to the importunitie of those ( yet hauing had the whole worke viewed and reviewed first by diuers , as well religious as iudicious Diuines , and hauing by writing dealt with diuers others of contrary Iudgement , ) that had pressed me to the printing of it .

Now why Mr. B. did not all that while reply vpon mine Answer , which he was so instant to haue , he rendreth two Reasons ; in my minde very weake ones .

1. He hoped , it would haue died . And how was that likely , when his Challenge had reuiued it ; and that bruited abroad , a Replie was expected . But his former Dialogue belike was enough to dash all that either had beene or could be said without further Reply .

2. The writing I sent him , had not my positiue grounds . As if his owne Arguments , had they beene effectuall , could not without them haue beene sufficiently defended .

Why now at length he doth it , he hath two Grounds likewise , but those suggested to him from others , as the former were from himselfe .

1. Because he onely liueth of all those whom Mr. G. refuteth . Where in the Catalogue of those whom he saith I refute , he reckoneth some , as Zwinglius , whom I refute not at all , as not knowing certainly what they held , some that himselfe refuteth as well as I doe , and that allow Cards and Tables as not simply vnlawfull , as Peter Martyr , Danaeus , and Perkins ; that so both I might seeme vtterly to dissent from them concerning the lawfulnes of those Games , whereas c c Mr. G. maintaineth no more concerning Cards and Tables , than Peter Martyr , Danaeus , and Perkins doe . I maintaine no more concerning the lawfulnesse of them in themselues than they doe , ( though in our grounds , I confesse , wee differ ) and that himselfe might seeme , as the last man aliue amongst them , to stand vp in the defence of them , when as indeed he opposeth and impugneth them , and these Games , by them not vtterly disallowed .

2. Lest by his silence he should giue way to impious iniquitie . Here is againe terrible imputations . They were before in the priuatiue ; Want of Iudgement , want of Discretion , want of Charitie ; in the manner of my dealing . They come now in the positiue : Impious Iniquitie ; Not Iniquitie alone , but Impietie and Iniquitie , the breach of both Tables , combined in one : where , thinke we , but in the matter of my discourse ? Surely , if such impious Iniquitie be maintained by me in this Argument , I beshrew Mr. B. for sparing his pen , when he might by discouerie of it in his reply haue preuented the printing of it : And little cause I haue to thanke those my friends before spoken of , that hauing had many the view of it before it came forth , would not any of them doe me the fauour to aduertise me thereof . But d d 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 . Plato apud Plut. de adul . & de util . ex inim . Amantium coeca sunt judicia . Hieron . ad Ioan. Hierosol . 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 . Greg. Naz. ep. 13. & 27. & erat . de Eccl. Naz. Fallit affectus . Plin. ep. 44. l. 4. affection peraduenture might ouersway iudgement in them . And e e 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 . Plut. de util . inim . 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 . Ibid. an Aduersarie many times is sharper-sighted then a Friend . Meane while remember , I pray thee , good Reader , that there is f f Si accusasse sufficiet , quis innocens erit ? Iulianus Delphidio apud Ammianum hist. l. 18. nothing easier than to charge and accuse : all the skill is , which Mr. B. must looke to , to make good .

Before I proceed , I protest before God , that I I. B. esteeme Mr. G. as a learned , painfull , and faithfull Minister , and a right honest man ; and therefore pray thee ( Christian Reader ) that whatsoeuer I write may be considered as concerning the Question betweene vs , and not in any wise applied to the least preiudice of so reuerend a Brother , or to any of his excellent parts .

If Mr. Bs. purpose were to deale onely T. G. with the Question in controuersie , why runneth he out into g g 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 . Aristot . rhet . l. 1. c. 1. such by-matters , as make nothing at all thereunto ? Why doth he labour so much to cast such aspersions , to procure h h 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 . Arist. ib. preiudice , as well vpon my manner of my dealing , as on the matter that I deale in ? Or what is this but as if one should cast filth and durt openly in a mans face , and yet beare the standers by in hand , that he did it not to disgrace him ? But proceed we .

So excellent that I wonder what moued him to I. B. publish his Opinion in print ; and the more because of many passages in his Booke .

Me thinks I heare some of those here , that T. G. i i Videas praemitti alta suspiria , sicque quadam cum gravitate & tarditate moesto vultu , demissis supercilijs , & voce plangentiegredi maledictionem , & quidem tanto plausibiliorem , quanto creditur ab his qui audiunt , corde invito & condolentis affectu proferri . Doleo , inquit , vehementer de eo , quia diligo illum satis . Grande damnum : nam-alias quidem in pluribus valet : caeterum in hac parte excusari non potest . Bern. in Cant. 24. Bernard speaketh of , who when they desire most to disgrace a man , begin first to tell of his good parts , and how much it grieueth them that one otherwise so well qualified , should be so far ouer-seene . But to let that passe .

Mr. B. here wondreth what should moue me to put mine opinion ( not relating what it is ) in print . As if some new opinion were now broached by me that either had neuer beene heard of , or neuer published before . Whereas he cannot be ignorant , that both the Opinion held by me concerning the lawfulnesse of a lusorious Lot in generall , is , and hath euer beene ( for ought that can be shewed to the contrary ) more generally receiued than that that he holdeth , and hath beene in print maintained by others before me ; yea concerning Cards and Tables , ( which I deale with principally , in regard of the Lot in them , defending them onely as not in that regard vnlawfull ) that they were in print defended by k k Peter Martyr , at least ; if not Danaeus too . some of those that himselfe mentioneth , before I was borne , or he either .

I might wonder rather that Mr. B. should thinke either himselfe or any other now adayes so priuiledged , that they might take libertie to themselues to publish new conceits in Print , contrary to what is and hath beene generally receiued , and yet thinke much that any other in Print should oppose them .

But many passages in my Booke shew that I ought not so to haue done .

First , He taketh knowledge of many enormious I. B. Crimes , which accompanie Dice , Cards , &c. p. 193. and in the quotations .

Secondly , He giueth this Rule , That that , which is no necessarie dutie , but a thing indifferent onely otherwise , may not be done , where is strong presumption vpon good ground , that it shall spiritually endanger a mans selfe , or others , by giuing occasion of sin vnto the one or the other , p. 107 , 108 , 109.

If many and grieuous sins attend Dice , Cards , &c. If those games be too too commonly abused , as he confesseth , p. 194. and if an indifferent thing may not be done which giueth occasion of sinne : I wonder why Mr. G. writeth in defence of Dice , &c. And the more , because he granteth , that where the vse and abuse of a thing are so enwrapped and entangled together , that they cannot easily be seuered the one from the other , then the vse of the thing it selfe ( if it be vnnecessarie otherwise ) would be wholly abandoned , p. 262 , 263.

Here is the summe of Mr. Bs. Argument . T. G. Mr. G. taketh notice that many enormious Crimes oft ( for so I say onely ) accompanie Cards and Dice : and they are by many too commonly abused : and he granteth further , that things indifferent may not be done when they giue occasion of euill : and that where the vse of a thing and the abuse of it are so entangled together , that they cannot easily be seuered , the thing being vnnecessarie , would wholly be abandoned . Therefore Mr. G. ought not to haue deliuered his Opinion , that a Lot vsed in game is not simply vnlawfull ; and that it is not the Lot either in these games or in any other ( for it is vsed in many besides these ) but such abuses attending them , when they are not , or cannot well be seuered from them , that makes them euill or vnlawfull . For this is my maine opinion giuen of them . Or rather , if you will haue the truth of it ; Therefore Mr. G. ought not to haue contradicted M. B. his opinion , that no Lot in game is lawfull .

Hee might haue added , what l l Tu id quod boni est , excerpis , dicis quod mali est . Ter. Phorm. 4. 4. I adde , that those euils attend other Games wherein no Lot is , as well as those wherein it is : And that it is not the Lot therefore from whence they arise : and that the vse and the abuse may easily be seuered by those that be well affected , as well in these Games as in any other . And I might adde , that Martyr , Danaus , yea and m m Istiusmodi ludi non ita prorsus damnarentur à nobis , si in eorum usu , quod licet , locum haberet . Calvin . epist. 374. Caluin himself , though they saw all that he saith I say , yet durst not passe such a sentence on them as Mr. B. hath done . But what force is in the Consequence , let any indifferent man iudge .

Thirdly , He sheweth in many pages , how seuerely I. B. Tables , but especially Dice , be condemned by Lawes Ciuill , Canonicall , and Municipall , that is , our English Statutes , as he sheweth at large , Lib. 8. §. 5. 8. He wisheth the Lawes were yet more seuere , and put in better execution , p. 206. He saith , that our common dicers may be marshalled among the flocke of the Deuils followers , p. 217. He affirmeth most rifelings and Lotteries to be little better than vnlawfull Games , p. 120. And he teacheth that by these Games we must not giue offence to the Lawes vnder which we liue , p. 251. Now I wonder that so good a man is not afraid to offend our Law by allowing forbidden Games , euen Dice , as well as Cards &c. which consist not only of Lotterie . T. G.

To all this , that is indeed nothing but a deale of dust and smoke raised to dasle mens eyes , that they may not discerne what the point in Controuersie is , I haue already in my Discourse of Lots n n Of Lots , chap. 8. sect. 8. answered at large . And it is a friuolous course for Mr. B. to produce it here , passing dry-foot by the Answer that is thereunto there giuen .

Thither therefore I might iustly send Mr. B. for an answer . But I answer here againe in few words .

1. Our Lawes doe not simply or generally condemne or forbid Cards or Dice , but to some onely , vsed in some manner , and at some times .

2. It is not in regard of any such superstitious conceit of the vnlawfulnesse of a Lot in them , as Mr. B. maintaineth , that either ours or any other Lawes condemne or inhibite them .

3. It is a grosse falshood that I offend our Lawes by allowing any Games that are thereby forbidden , so far forth as the Law forbiddeth them . Mine owne words by Mr. B. himselfe produced cleare me thereof : And it is too palpable a Calumnie to charge me therewith . If a man should defend the lawfulnesse in themselues of bowling , coiting and logeting against some fantasticall spirit that should question the same , ( as o o Nihil tam absurdum est , quod non ab aliquo etiam Philosophorum dictum sit . Postremo nemo aegrotus quicquam somniat Tam infandum , quod non aliquis dicat Philosophus . Varro Eumenid . Anaxagoras nivem esse nigram dixit . Xenophanes Lunam habitari , eamque terram esse multarum urbium & montium . Cic. Lucull . Terram moveri , coelum consistere , Philolaus , Cleanthes , alij . Laert. Philol. Plut. Num. Cic. Lucul . Sen. nat. quaest. l. 7. c. 2. Iam Haeretici quorum illi Patriarchae , ut scitè Tertull. pr●…siript . quae portenta dogmatum protulerunt ? Nec nuptias contra●…ere , ●…ec corpus vestire Ad●…mitae ; n●…c vinum gustare , Severiani & Encratitae ; nec carnibus vesci , Saturniani , & Ebionitae ; nec panem frangere , aut olus scindere Manichaei ; nec judicia exercere Tertullianistae ; nec gladio uti , bellare , jurare , magistratum gerere , porcina , sangu●…e , suffocato vesci Anabaptistae ; nec nisi precibus . duntaxat vacare Mesaliani , & ç. licitum cense . bant . V. dendi Epiphan. Aug. Theodor. Danae . de Haeres . Iudaeuli verò quam in hoc genere foecundi ? nec quo spinam è pede evellat , nummūve lapsum attollat , coram imagine incurvare se licitum ; nec potandi causasimulacro labia admovere , cujus per os aqua profluat ; nec ornamenti causa humanam effigiem , Solisve aut Lunae imaginem sculptam habere ; nec mulieri et●…icae obstreticari ; nec per sabbatum super herbam ambulare , nec pomum assare , nec manus lavare , nec lucernam extinguere , nec supellectilem incendio subtra●…ere , &c. Vide Pr●…cept . Mos. negat . there is nothing almost so absurd but some or other haue held ) would any man , thinke we , be either so malitious or so senslesse , as to tax him for the same as offending our Lawes , because in the same Lawes these are also prohibited , though there be no Lot in them , euen as strictly as those other are ? Or were he a iustifier therefore of the abuses accompanying the same , that should defend them as in themselues not vnlawfull ?

4. I will not answer Mr. B. here as the Philosopher did one , that telling idle stories , was still asking , p p 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 Is it not a wonder ? q q 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 . Aristot. apud Plut. de garrul . It is a wonder , quoth he , rather that any man can endure to heare thee thus trifle . But I wonder that Mr. B. since he deemeth it so fearefull a thing to be faulty herein , is not afraid himselfe to offend our Lawes , I might say , by fastning vpon them or the makers of them such superstitious conceits concerning the vse of a Lot , as I verily thinke Mr. B. himselfe cannot imagine , euer entred into their braines ; as supposing that these Lawes were framed vpon such Grounds as his Booke is built vpon : but I say rather , by condemning that that they allow and approue of , and that not in the meaner sort , but in those of best fashion , that should be examples vnto others , and I might adde , at such times , when , if at one time more than other , they ought to be most religious of any . Mr. B. therefore if he doe well remember himselfe , may turne his wonderment here from me to himselfe .

Lastly , though I grant that common Dicers may well be ranked among the Deuils followers , yet followeth it not that all vse of a Die is therefore to be condemned ; no more than it will follow that because Tauerne-haunters may well goe in the same ranke with such , therefore all resort to any Tauerne on any occasion whatsoeuer is to be vtterly disallowed .