I Am forced ( gentle Reader ) though I hate contention , to contend with a contentious man : or else , having the better end of the staffe , to forsake a good cause . It is not possible that the Lordes fielde should want tares , his net bad fishe , or his Church offences : but wo to them , by whome they rise . This wo in controversies pertaines to the one side . It is hard , ( and almost impossible , that both bee guiltie . Wherefore , as I am cleare before the Lord , so , to purge my selfe before thee , I will set down how this dissension first beganne . The Bishop of Salisburie that last was , before his remooving to Yorke , tooke order , that certaine preachers should keepe lecture on the market daies , in the cheefe market townes of his Diocese . There is a great market euerie Satterday at a towne called Chippenhame , in North Wilshire . Within 4. myles of which , dwelleth one M. Wisedome , a man for integritie of lyfe , and exceeding paines in his calling loued of all the godlie , hated of the wicked and admired of both . This man was one of the prechers appointed to that place , and preached there once in a fourtnight , or a month , I know not which . Wherfore on Satterday the 14. day of Februarie or thereabout Anno 1589. expounding in that place the articles of the beleef , he deliuered this opinion , which I defend , concerning the descense of Christ into hel . When he had done , one Chalfont Vicar of that towne stood vp , and protested to the people , that hee had taught false doctrine : and promised , that if they would come that day seuen night , they should heare him confuted by a learned man . . That day seuen-night commes . The people flockes to the Church in great multituds , exspecting some famous man , with some new matter . At length , in came this . M. Chalfont himself . Hee climbes into the pulpit , and pyles vp a heap of books , as high as his head . Then after a psalme , and a formall prayer , hee beginnes like an Oratour at his own person and his adversaries , that he was M. Wisedomes senior , that he was a Bachelor when M. Wisedome was a Scholler : and a Maister of Arte. before he was a Bachelour . That hee had read more , and knew more , then he . That he had learned arithmetick , and could reckon the articles of the creed , better then hee . That there was 12. of them , made by the 12. Apostles . That his memorie serued him to remember , which Apostle made which article . That M. Wisedome did reckon them wrong , and made but 11. of them . That al learned Fathers were on his conspiracie . That M. Wisedome did falsefie Calvine , and other learned writers : That Christ might bee the day when he su●●ered , as well both in Paradice and Hell : as M. Wisedome was that morning at Gritleton ( that is the place where he dwelleth ) & then there vnder the pulpit . That he did contradict the convocation , and therefore had depriued himselfe of the Ministrie , ipso facto . And so was no more Parson of G●●tleton , then hee was Bishop of London . He lookes downe manie times on M. Wisdome , where he sat vnder the pulpite , amazed at his impudencie , like a meeke sheep , ( as hee is indeede ) and calles him by his name . This saieth Augustine , this saieth Ierome , this saieth Cyprian , and you say that . Where was your learning ? Where was your reading ? Where was your simplicitie and plain dealing , which you make show of ? And turning to the people he warned them to be ware of false Prophets that going in sheepes clothing , were inwardlie rauening wolues , meaning M. Wisedome because of his plainnesse , and simplicitie . This exclamation , ( for sermon I cannot call it ) being ended , the people departed some saying this , and some saying that : and all , ( sauing such as loue , or malice did carrie more then truth or matter ) condemning Chalfonts impudencie . That day seuen-night , the people meets againe , hoping to heare M. Wisdome reply , for that was his day by the Bishops order . But M. Hil beeing then at a towne called Leycocke , within 2. myles of this Chippenhame by accident , or of set purpose , I know not , came thither that morning , and tooke the place . The same man not manie yeares before , had dipped in the same controuersy almost after the same manner at Sarum , against one M. Connam , a man both learned , and Chaplane to my L. of Pembroke . But to let that passe , at this sermon 28. Feb. Anno 1589. I was my selfe , vpon the occasions expressed in the beginning of my letter to M. Hill , ( for as yet he was not Doctor ) which he hath printed . In it with painted words , and great names of Doctors he so varnished the matter , that at the first hearing it seemed not improbable . Towards his aduersaries hee behaued himselfe modestlie , geuing them the praise both of learning and godlinesse , namely Calvine and Beza . To blaze their error in this point , he rubbed the Hebrew words Sheol and nepheshe , and the greeke hades , psyche & pneuma , as white , as a whetstone . Then after a solempne challenge to all the learned men in the world , that did dissent from him , he offered his notes to anie that would haue them : he promised faire play , if anie man would answere him : he protested loue to him , that coulde confute him : and vowed a recantation in the same place , if his forces could not bide the battle . I hearing this braue challenge , and mistrusting his cardes for all his facing : wrought a freend that had acquaintance with him , to help mee to his notes . After two moneths or there-abouts , hee sent them to mee vnder his owne hand . Perusing them , I found them out of their coullours , nothing answerable to the shewe that they made in the pulpite . Wherefore , hearing of no man , that did reply : saving M. Wisdome in a sermon that M. Hill was not at : and hoping that his protestations had beene as farre in his heart , as they were faire in his mouth : I resolued to answere him for the truthes sake , though my leasure was not much , promising my self as much thank for my labour , as his great offers led mee to beleeue . To keep it secrete , I wrote in latine . I seasoned my wordes , with all moderation , that might bee in a contrarie style . I offered to confesse , if it could be shewed , that my answeres turned not the edge of his argumentes . To be short , I promised to yeelde to anie truth , that he could proue . I was in hope that this conference should haue beene priuate , amongest vs , and such freends onelie , as hee or I , might haue acquainted with it . Indeed , he offered mee to haue talked of the matter at a freends house . But I considering , that in such disputations , stormes of wordes rysing out of hearts , heated with contradiction , doth hinder reason , and stop judgement , refused any conference , but with the pen . The second consideration is better than the first . This reply I finished within few daies : But mistrusting mine own infirmities , and knowing that 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 , I kept it in my hand till the next May following . Then going home to visite my naturall freendes , I left it with a freend or two to be deliuered him . They beeing doubtfull of my returne , though it not best to sturre a coale , that they knew no man in my absence to put out . At my returne vnderstanding that they had not deliuered it : I tooke it into my handes againe , I added and altered diuerse things . I wrote it new : and sent it him inclosed in a letter . In time of my absence , ( which was half a yeare and more ) he had receaued by some secret meanes , an englishe copie of the first draught , which I my selfe had translated at the request of a freend , not aboue fiue daies before my journey . It I deliuered him with condition to bring it mee againe He brought it not , and I forgot it . In time of my absence , he lent it to another , & the other gaue a coppie of it to one , that put it in M. Hills hands . To that before my returne , he had fumbled vp this answere , that now he hath printed . I not knowing it , sent him ( as I haue said ) the latine . Vpon receit whereof hee sent the other amongst his freends . It went amongst them from one to another , from November ( for in Nouember I sent mine , ) till the September following and then he sent it mee . In this meane time speaches were giuen out , that I had answered his sermon , that he had replied , and I recanted . These speeches grew dailie , and lifted his heart as high as his name . Whereon hee resolued to dispute in Oxenford for a scarlet hood . He promised his freends to make that one of his questions . He gaue out , that al Oxford was on his side . But when it came to proof , hee was faine to promise to his friends , and they to others , that he would conferre with learned men : that hee woulde yeeld to anie truth , The admitting of a man to a degree of schoole in Oxford is called a grace . that could be proued out of the word : that he would not deall in that question , but as he should be led by such conference , or els he had gone as graceles out of Oxford , as he came thither . Notwithstanding , when he was sure of his grace , to maintain his credit amongst his friends in the cuntrie : he took that question to maintaine in Oxfoord on the Viper day of the Act. howe manfully hee defended it , I report me to them that heard him . A filius terrae at the lower end of the schoole ( a thing neuer seene before in that place at that time ) got a placet of the Doctor of the chyre , to brush his skarlet gowne : who trimmed it so neatly , that if his cheeks wold haue taken the staines of shame , he had worne as much skarlet in his face , as he did on his back . In this story ( thou maiest see good Reader ) that my adversary did thrust his hooke in an other mans haruest at Chippinhame : that he took not my reply so wel as he promised in the pulpit . That he made that publick which I wrote in private . That he went farther abroad , & hunted for contention in Oxfoord . That hee plaied at the same bale before , in Sarum . That he bare the simple in hand , that all the learned of the Vniversitie were of his mind . That hee fed an vntrue rumour , that I had recanted . That he printed my privat letter without my consent or knowledg . And that to trouble the simple with it , he published that in english , which I wrote in latine . For my part I hope I did nothing but that which the dutie of a Christian required . hearing the trueth impugned I did defend it : fearing that he had bene deceiued on simplicitie , I laboured to reforme him . I wrote in faire tearmes to avoide offences . I wrote in a strange tongue to keepe it secret . And I hunted not for this contention : but was drawen into it with faire promises of great thanks : wherfore I hope if thou haue but one dramme of indifferencie , that thou wiltest wipe this bleamish from my face . If I fall nowe into rougher tearmes impute the fault to him , that kept not himselfe within the same bounds as I beganne . Moreover , it is impossible to answere this booke , wherein are so many errours in al kinds of learning without tearms of offence . The humour also of this adversary is such , and his estimation amongest the simple , that if I spare him , I shall feede it , and hinder the trueth . Add that it is impossible for me to passe over such vnmanerly disgraces of lies , impudent lies , shameles lies in matters politicall , damnable lies in maters theological : disagreing with Mathew , Mark , Luke , Iohn , Paul , Peter , Christ himself , & al the scriptures , and never turne the bale comming so faire to the other end of the tennise . In some places hee giueth my words a meaning , that I neuer meant : In some places he giues my arguments a shape , that I neuer made . In some places hee bends his proofes to things not denied : In many places hee slipps the point in controversie , and passes by arguments , as if he neuer sawe them . And in no place answeres one argument like a scholler , much lesse a Doctor . If I rippe vp these things in their places freely : I hope good Reader , that thou wiltest rather lay the fault on him , that made them such ; than me , that cal them as they are . Thus beseeching thee to weigh the cause throughly ▪ and to giue every colour his own name : I leaue thee to the Lord .

GRace and peace . There was brought to me in August last an answere made to my sermon preached at Chippenhame the 28. of February by your selfe , which for that I was then riding to London , I laid vp in my studie till my returne . At which time examining it : I found that you had indeauored to answere some part of my sermon : and some things you left vnanswered . Hereupon I had thought to make no replie . But ●he : I vnderstoode , that speeches were blazed abroad that neither I could , nor durst answere it : I entered into a resolution either to defend my self or els to recant , to stay the sp●eches of the multitude . And therefore to satisfie your request haue made a replie , wherein I haue proued my former reasons to be firme & v●controleable , and your answer to be weak & vnsufficient : for that you disagree with Dauid , Esay , Ezechiel ▪ Mathew , Peter , Paul , yea Christ himself , as it shal appeare in the conference . It is an easie matter to set your selfe against M. Hil. But it is not so easie 〈◊〉 mater to set your self against the Prophets , and Apostles , and Christ himselfe . Hee will say to you as he said to Paul , 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 . Wherefore I pray you , if you will proceed in this conference to lay downe the whole as I do : and consider what , whe● , and where you write . You write of an article of our faith , which must be confirmed by Gods word . If therefore it shal appeare , that you haue gainsaid the Apostles wordes and meanings : who will beleeue you for an orthodoxall teacher ? you write in the most perrillous times . When therefore , the Papists shall see your deceiptfull handling of Gods word , they will reioice at it . Lastly , you write against an opinion imbraced in the Church of England alwaies , and confirmed by our learned synod , and convocation in the Parliament . Therefore you must assure your selfe , that you cannot cary this cause away without weightie , & irrefragable reasons . I receiued also the last of November , an answere in Latine . I will at successiue houres frame by Gods grace , an answer to that . In the meane season , you may peruse this , and see by this replie , what good successe you may promise your selfe , and your friends in the other . Thus desiring God to direct this conference , and al other our labours to his glorie , I end .

IN May before the Moneth of August , you speake of going home to visite my naturall friends , I left my reply to your sermon to be delivered you . But it was kept backe vppon the considerations , which I haue saide in my Epistle to the Reader . What other Coppy you receiued in August , I cannot tel : But wel I am assured I sent you none . Howsoeuer you came by that coppy , plaine dealing wold haue answered that which I sent you my selfe ▪ you tell me , that going vp to London , you receued an answere to your Sermon , & pervsing it at your returne , you found it an endeavoure to answere some peece of it : and within few lines you will me to set downe al as you do . Your simile is vnfit , for you set not downe all , that you had of me . Neither could I set down all your Sermon : for I had but the notes of it : and them also written with your owne hand so confusedly , that it woulde haue troubled your selfe , to tell which was the beginning ▪ middle , or end . Therefore this quarrell , that I did not set downe all , seeing I had not all , is very vnreasonable . As for your notes I answered them all , sauing two arguments , which being forced to seek hee●e one , and there an other , I missed in that confused Chaos of non bene i●●ctarum discordia semina verum . If you had bene disposed to speake properly , they were too small a qui●let , to make all the rest be called , but a peece of your Sermon . Bu● your warinesse heere is notable . Least some might think too well of my reply : you will not vouchsafe it the name of an answere : but an indeavoure to answere some peece of your Sermon . Such it ●eavours as this , may well blind the simple : but amongst the wise wil never purchase much credit to your cause . But you would haue let all alone you say , if the speeches of the people disgracing your abilitie had not set you a worke : my desire was either to winne you to vs , or reasons from you to drawe me to you . But nowe it appeareth that your owne estimation was more precious in your eies , than the defence of the trueth , or winning men from errours . This will be a foull blot in the face of a Doctor : except you wash it with a bale of truth and plaine dealing , confessing that I was in no errour at all . But then you say you resolved to defend your selfe , or else to recant . I thought you had bene resolute in Chippinhames pulpit six moneths before , if you were not as resolute then as now , I will not take your word for shoe-buckles : for I had then more witnesses to your word , than I haue now to your hand . But me thinks it is strange , that I oppugning David , Esay , Ezechiell , Peter , Paul , and Christ himself , could haue escaped the check of your pen , if it had not bene to maintaine your owne credite amongst the people . It is without doubt , that you loued that most , that moved you most . If you were not as jelous of their maintenance as your owne estimation you were not so sure a friend , as many supposed . But it is hard for me you say , to kicke against the prick . It were so if I did so . but looke you M. Doctor to your owne heeles : for my part I haue the testimony of a good conscience . No other cause , than the simple loue of the trueth set me on worke . I levelled not at preferment . I commended not my work to great persones . I published not my book till you opened the gate : & I could do no lesse than followe . As for Christ and his Apostles I hope to make it clear in al indifferent eares , that I haue not opposed one syllable against them : And that you pull my wordes , as Cacus did Hercules his Kein into what stinking dennes , it pleseth your wrangling braine to devise . I know both what , when , and where I write . I write of an Article of our faith , in which I am so much more earnest , as the Children of God shuld be more diligent to vnderstand their faith aright . As for these dangerous times it is you that neglect them . It is you , that devide the coat of Christ : it is you that handle the Scriptures guilefully : it is you , that publish private things to make the Papists sport , and trouble the Church . That which divers learned Papists affirme the Scriptures , never saide you put them to the rack to make them confesse . Scotus saith , that the discense of Christ into hell cannot be prooued by Scriptures . And radius one of the learnest that was in the counsel of Trent , saith it , and proues it . Hesselius another of the same counsell construeth the place of Peter against you . To him accordeth Th●mas Aquinas . and Dionysius Carthusianus agreeth with Andradius . It were easie to quote many : If the seeking of them were not more laborious , than their testimonies will be effectuall in this cause . I bring onely these to set their ingenuitie against your partialitie . As for the Church of England , it hath not alwaies fostered your opinion , as you vntruely avouch . The times of popery , we yeeld you : because you agree in the name , and the places be but severall roomes of one dungeon . Neither can we denie you the times of King Edward , which creeping but out of the shelles of Popery , had not shaken of the buddes of your errour , about that time the greatest part of your favorities liued : and in that time your opinion ( for want of better ) was confirmed by convocation . But anno 1564. in the beginning of her Majesties raigne , in a convocation assembled to reestablish the Acts of King Edward , which Queene Mary had taken away , that article only was reformed , and your opinion defaced , no more being left , but the naked article of the beleefe in wordes equivalent . wherevpon I build this reason . No counsell nor convocation censuring a former taketh that away , Synod . Ed. which it selfe alloweth . But this convocation censuring the convocation of King Edward , Quemadmodum Christus pro nobis mortuus est , & sepultus : ita est etiam credendus ad inferos descendisse . Nam corpus vsque ad resurrectionem in sepulchro iacuit : spiritus ab illo emissus cum spiritibus , qui in carcere , siue in inferno detinebantur fuit , illisque predicauit queadmodum testatur Petri locus . hath taken your opinion away . Ergo , this convocation allowed not your opinion . But contrariwise , the same Church of England hath made our opinion her owne , by publishing by her authoritie , Thomas Rogers exposition of these Articles , wherein he agrees with vs : and countenansing it with her owne name , in titeling it the English Creede . She hath also printed and allowed by her authoritie many books against you . The Geneva Bible , I know not how many times : The newe Testament with Beza and Villerius his notes : Fulkes answere to the Remishe Testament : Baro his Lectures vpon Ionas : Synod . Eliz. principium tantum retinuit . Quemadmodum Christus pro nobis mortuus est , & sepultus : ita est etiam credendus ad inferos descendisse . Calvins Institutions at large , and abridged : Northbrooks Confession : Fulk against Gregory Martine , and the Rhemists : Whitaker against Campion and Duraeus : Vrsinus his Catechisme : Bastingius his Catechisme : Andrewe Willets vewe of Popery , with many others : Some dedicated to the Queene her selfe , Some to my Lord Treasurer , some to my lord of Huntington , some to my lord of Leister , some to my lord of Bedford , some to my lord of Warwick , some to one , some to another , all allowed , and all against you , Lastly our opinion hath bene taught in the Pulpits , defended in Schooles , allowed in the Vniversities , so that one Doctor Husse , his grace was denied in Cambridge aboue 20. yeares agoe for your opinion : and y●●r owne had bene denied you within this three yeares in Oxford , if you had not promised more than you meant to performe . Whatsoeuer other men hath done , or spoken for their owne : you are the first that ever I heard of , that oppugned ours in the Church of England : saving D. Husse in Leister . Against whome the Bishop of that Diocesse did oppose himselfe , procuring from Cambridge their Reader , countenanced with the authoritie of their convocation , to confute that opinion , which the english name of hel did make more popular , and probable to the ignorant , by the countenance of that famous , and worthie Vniversitie . Thus men may see how truely you challenge the Church of England , to haue allowed your opinion alwaies ▪ your alwaies commeth short of all that time , which you desired most to take your part : for men of your livery , if you may get autoritie on your side , count your self otherwaies sufficiently armed . As for me , If I handle the scriptures deceitfully : let not onely the Papists laugh at me : but let al Christians spit at me . if I reforme it not , when I am convicted . Howe strong my reasons are , to cary this cause cleare through the midst of the aduersaries of it : I hope the sequell will proue : and I referre it to the advised judgment of the indifferent Reader : I cannot tell how to frame irrefragable reasons to you . There was a Prophecie ( as Curtius recordeth ) that hee who could vndoe the knottes of Gordius his chariot , should be Emperour of Asia . Alexander intending that conquest , came to the temple where those knottes were kept , to see , if hee could open them . But they beeing insoluble by mans reason , hee tore all assunder with his sword . So you serue my arguments , be they never so irrefragable : when you cannot open them with reason : you teare them all assunder with violence . As for my latine answere , which I indeed did send you , and you in trueth should haue answered me , and not this wandring vagabound : you haue had it these three yeares and more , wherein were successiue houres ynough to answere two sheets of Paper : if you haue not bin more busie about greater matters , than you would haue the world to knowe . In the meane time I haue pervsed this , and put my friends in hope of good successe in the other : when your long leasure will serue you to answere it . Thus beseeching God to giue vs all one heart and one minde , I end .

THe hebrewe word SHEOL , which the Greekes call hades , the latines infernus , and wee hell , hath three significations in the scriptures .

First and properlie it signifieth the graue , or common condition of all the dead , expressed in the greek hades by the priuation of light or lyfe .

Secondlie , the place of tormentes , appointed for the punishment of the wicked : for this the hebrewe word is least , and our inglish worde most vsuall , or rather as it is commonlie taken , hardlie signifieth any thing els .

Thirdlie , the torments of hel , which by a Metonymicall hyperbole for amplifications sake , is manie times attributed to the sorrowes of this life . These things are known to al the learned . And this D. confesseth them sect . 4. See also sect. 8. sect. 9. and sect. 14.

Nowe , where our beleefe hath that Christ descended into hell : the question is which of these three significations doth best fit that article of our faith : We say , that seing euery article of our faith must haue an vndouted sense confirmed by the Scriptures , it must needs signifie the hellish torments that he suffered for our redemption , or the darknesse of death , which swallowed him the three daies that he was in the graue . That these thingt are true , and may be the true sense of that article , our aduersaries cannot denie . Yet not contented heerewith , they wil sinke deeper , and send Christs soule to the damned pit of hell , neither to suffer himself , nor to helpe 〈◊〉 that suffered there . Nowe , because this is a thing that no man can avouch vpon his owne knowledge , but God himself : We refuse to take their words without his warrant . Wherefore to mend this crooke , they lay three te●●s of Scripture in the presse . The first is out of the 16. Psalme : the second is out of the 3. chap. of the 1. Pet. the last & weakest , out of the 4. to the Ephes. But these proofes being doubtfull , that is , implying other plainer senses We denie them to be sufficient to make this doubtfull assertion , an vndoubted article of our faith . Our reason is , no doubtfull proofes can make a doubtfull assertion an vndoubted article of our faith : But these proofes be doubtfull . Ergo , these proofes cannot make this doubtfull assertion , an vndoubted article of our faith . That these profes be doubtfull , the words , drifts , and circumstances , offering other senses both plainer , and better fitting the places , and agreeable to the rest of the Scriptures , will driue anie reasonable head to confesse . Neither doeth diverse learned Papists denie it . But this aduersarie more impudent then they , blusheth not like a wyer drawer , to pull these Scriptures through narrowe holes , to make them smal inough , to tie our faith to his fantasie . Moreouer , with like violence , hee is forced to break down two other walls that stands in his way . The one is in the 23 of Luke , ver. 46. Father into thy hands I commend my spirit ▪ and the other in the 43. ver of the same cap. spoken to the theef , This day shalt thou be with mee in Paradice . By which two places it is cleare , that Christs soule was then in heauen , and not in Hell . Vpon the true sense of these places riseth this disputation , to which I referre the discreet and indifferent Reader , beseeching them to read with a single eie , and iudge with an vpright hart . Onelie I will lance an impostume of absurdities , which breeding in the bowels of this opinion , like the worme that breeds in the nut , hath putrified all the probabilitie of it , and made all men of indifferent iudgement in this age to caste it vnder the boord amongest the shreddes .

First , that Christ went down to Hell to triumph , contrarie to the nature of Hell , which yeeldeth nothing but horrour and torments . And contrarie to the nature of a triumph , which was vsuallie solemnized amongst them , to whom the joy of the victorie did appertaine

Secondlie , that Christs soule did preach in Hell , contrarie to the nature of a soule , that cannot preache : and the condition of those hearers , who could reap no profite of his sermon having their jugement alreadie .

Thirdlie , that he did preach neither to convert the hearers , nor to condempne them for the contempt of his word : but to aggrauate their sorrowes . Contrarie to the office of Christ , which was to offer mercie to all his hearers .

Fourthlie , that Christs soul did preach in Hel reallie , not vocallie : that is , did preach in Hel and say nothing : contrary to the nature of the word preach , which neuer man did , without voice & words .

Fiftlie , that Christ meaning to go to Hell , ( as they say ) did notwithstanding commend his soule into the hands of God . Contrarie to the true and common vse of these words vsed by Stephan , Act. 7. and all other godlie men , that craue to be i● heauen .

Sixtlie , that his soule was in Hell with●●t torments , contrarie to the name and nature of Hell , which presenteth to the care and hart , nothing but hainous and hideous torments .

Seventhlie , that in these words ( Thou shalt be with mee in Paradice ) Christ spake onelie of his God-head . Contrarie to the nature of the pronoune ( me ) which doeth alwaies note the whole person that speaketh .