A temperate vvard-vvord, to the turbulent and seditious VVach-word of Sir Francis Hastinges knight vvho indeuoreth to slaunder the vvhole Catholique cause, & all professors therof, both at home and abrode. Reduced into eight seueral encounters, vvith a particuler speeche directed to the Lordes of her Maiesties most honorable Councel. To vvhome the arbitriment of the vvhole is remitted. By N.D.

A TEMPERATE WARD-WORD , TO THE TVRBVLENT AND SEDITIOVS Wach-word of Sir Francis Hastinges knight , who indeuoreth to slaunder the whole Catholique cause , & all professors therof , both at home and abrode .

Reduced into eight seueral encounters , with a particuler speeche directed to the Lordes of her Maiesties most honorable Councel . To whome the arbitriment of the whole is remitted .

By N. D.

Psalm. 71. vers. 4. Iudicabit Dominus pauperes populi , & humiliabit calumniatorem . God wil iudge his poore and afflicted people , and wil make the st●nderer to stoop .

Imprinted with Licence .

ANNO M. D. XCIX .

THE PREFACE TO THE READER .

I Could much haue wished that Sir Francis Hastinges , who geueth himself for author of a certayne iniurious pamphlet , published some monethes past , agaynst Catholiques , and intituled : Awache-word , or whosoeuer made that byting libel for him , with intention to dishonor him with the title , as on the one syde , he nameth himself knight ( and all men know the Hastinges to be of a verie honorable familie , and one also to be knight of that name ) so on the other , had he obserued some terme and stile of nobilitie or gentrie in his wryting : in which case , I had either wholy spared this labour of answering him at all , leauing him only to the censure and rebuke of his equals , for medling in so base an excercise , as calumniation and rayling is , in this his old yeares , or at leastwise , should he haue receyued his check and refutation , with that regard of worship and honor , as otherwise had byn due to his rank , place , and person .

But fynding him so far forgetful of all knightly temperance in his tongue , and of all ciuil cariage in the drift and current of his book , as he holdeth no rule or limit of modestie at all , but inraged rather ( as it seemeth ) with a furious veyne of inuectiue spirit , spareth neither God nor man , so far forth as they concerne the catholique cause , or the cause them : he must beare with me , and lay it to his owne demerits , if I be driuen to encounter with him in some more egar and sharp manner , at certayne meetinges , then either I allow of by myne owne lyking , or then the reuerend respect I carie to his house and familie , and the particuler affection I feele towardes some of his owne name and linage , would otherwise haue induced me .

Who will not confesse , but that lying , forging , and fal●ifying , ignorant vaunting , odious scoffyng , malitious calumniations , seditious interpretations , bloodie exaggerations , Barbarous in sultations ouer them that already are in affliction and calamitie , ought to be far from the nature , pen , and tongue of a knight or gentleman ? and yet these are the flowers or rather furies of this skolding discourse , as afterward you shall see by that which is to be treated . Wherin if the lyues honors , states , and liuinges , of home-borne subiectes , were only touched , and brought in question ( as they be ) it were more tolerable , though no way tolerable , being don vniustly , but the heat of this hastie knight resteth not here , but rusheth further , to the open assault of forayne monarches also , their honors , fame , and reputation , which is lesse tolerable , and consequently , hath need of some more sharpe and forcible reiection .

The violence of the Puritan spirit is not vnknowen to the wise of England : wherunto also France and Scotland wil beare sufficient witnesse . It hath byn kept downe many yeares , by the valour and prudenee of the Protestant , and the knowen professors therof haue byn held leane and hungrie by her Maiestie , to no smale benefyt of publique peace and so may be stil , whyle the Catholique partie hath also some poyse and sway in the balance agaynst them . If Sir Francis be one of them , it may seeme perhaps expedient in his wisdome , that ( her Maiestie growing now fast in yeares ) thinges be brought to some trial by garboile in her dayes , for that afterward , more then one parte may chance to ioyne agaynst them : wherfore if they might now oppresse the catholique partie by the hand of her Maiestie , their owne would serue afterwardes more easely to do the lyke agaynst her and hers , and the way and meanes to effectuate them both may seeme perhappes no wise to be more potent or speedie , then to dryue many at home to desperation , by feares and terrors of oppressions , and by opprobrious iniuries , and personnal slaunders , to inforce forayne princes , of the same religion , to implacable yre and indignation . And this is the proper course that Sir Francis taketh , throughout his whole sedious wach-word . Which to couer the better , he falleth to extreme flaterie of the other syde , espetially of the state , and of her Maiesties person in particuler ; which are the fittest baytes to couer such hookes , as angle after popular fauor , for a further fetche .

To this man then I am to answer , as the substance and tenour of his accusations , fictions , or calumniations , shall leade me , reducing all that I am to saie , for better order and memorie , to eight or nyne principal heades , branches , and argumentes , vnder the name of encounters , wherin I dout not , but the apparent truth of diuers poyntes wil come to light , which hitherto haue layen hidden and obscure , in the vnderstanding of many , hoping that the discret reader will passe ouer these few lynes , with a beneuolent , or at least , an indifferent eye ; reseruing the final iudgment of all , to the Lordes of her Maiesties Councell ; whome , I my self haue chosen for vmpires and arbitres of the whole controuersie , and so I end this entrance and wil passe to my first combat and incounter with Sir Francis Hastinges .

Your harty freend that wisheth your best and greatest good , N. D.

THE PRINCIPAL PARTES OF THIS WARD-WORD . THe preface to the reader , about Sir Francis Hastinges manner of proceeding . The first encounter , about blessings or cursings , receyued by change of catholique religion in England . page . 1. The second encounter , concerning certayn absurd growndes of catholique religion , faigned by the knight : and the defence of Saynt Thomas of Canterbury . page . 11. The third encounter , touching forged perils , to haue byn procured to her Maiestie by Catholiques , both before and since her raigne . page . 27. The fourth encounter , about certain principal Englishmen , iniured by name , as Bishop Gardener , Cardinal Allen &c. also about father Persons , and other Iesuites . page . 41. The fifth encounter , about Iesuites , and father Persons in Particuler , whether they seek the Queenes blood , as S. Fra. affirmeth . page . 55. The sixth encounter , of Catholique recusants now in England , and the fault of disloyalty falsly layd against them . page . 72. The seuenth encounter , of forayn princes slandered , and first about the Bishop of Rome , whether he be Antichriste or no. page . 90. The eight encounter , about the present king of Spayn , and the Spanish nation , iniured by Sir Francis . page . 102. A speech to the Lords of her Maiesties priuie Councell , remitting the iudgement and arbitrement of the whole controuersie , to their censures : as also the iudgment and petition of the answerer , for ending or composing of matters . page . 119.

THE FIRST INCOVNTER , ABOVT THE BLESSINGES AND BENEDICTIONS , which Sir Francis affirmeth to haue come to England by the change of Catholique Religion .

WITTIE was the answer of him who being demaunded , Antigo. of flatterie . what enimy was to be holden for most perilous and pernitious ; sayd , that of domestical enemies , the flatterer ; for that his wound is receiued commonlie with delectation , and by couering the truth , and praysing the vices and imperfections of the party flattered , he doth lead him pleasantly and without resistance , to perdition .

And as this is true in particuler men ( as all the world doth experience daily ) so much more hath it his effect in great communities and common wealthes ; where the greater part being lightly of the simpler and more imperfect sort , they are easily caried away with the poysoned melody of these Sirens songes of adulation , & so he that will read ouer the stories of the beginninges , proceedinges , fall and ouerthrow of realmes and countries , shal find the principall root of their ruine or changes ; to haue bin the eare and credit giuen to flatterers , before the sincere councell of them that spake more plainlie , though les pleasantlie . Let the onl●e example of the people of Israell serue for this tyme , who being often told by holie men , and prophets of God , of their dangerous estate , would neuer beleeue them , but harkened rather vnto flatterers that smoothed all , and told them of blessinges ; in so much as God himself resolued one daie to saie plainlie vnto them ( though it profited little ) P●pule meus qui te beatum dicunt , ipsi te decipiunt , Esa. 3. & viam gressuum tuoru● dissipant : My people , they who say thou art happie , they are those that deceiue thee , and doe mar the way , where thou art to passe , therby to ouerthrow thee .

He that will consider with iudgement and indifferencie , the present estate of matters in England and round about it ( & this especially by reason of change made in religion ) & shal read together the flearing tale , The present state of English blessings . which Sir Francis Hastinges telleth vs in the first lynes of his booke , of the i●finit and innumerable blessinges receiued ( as he saith ) by the sayd change : he will either say , that the man lacked witte and discourse to see the deformitie and contradiction of his owne talke , or els modestie and shame fastnesse in vttering it .

For notwithstanding the rare partes , and good intentions , of her Maiestie in this her gouernement ( which no man denieth , nor yet conioyneth with the euil successe of this alteration of religion , as well knowen not to haue proceeded of her owne inclination at the beginning ) who is there so simple that discouereth not , or so euil affected that rueth not from his harte , the difficulties alredy growen and growing daily by this most vnfortunate and fatall alteration of religion ? which this man calleth , The fountaine and wellspring whence all the rest of this our little Ilandes benefites and blessinges doe issue and flow . Nay doth not the seely fellow himself in all this furious , and scornefull libell of his , indeuour to lay before vs a thowsand feares and frightes of imminent perilles , which he saieth hang ouer vs by the diuision of hartes , of handes , of iudgementes , of affections , of partes and partial●ties , and factions within the realme ? Or is his whole argument any thing els in effect , but a timerous abodement of infinite ruines , that doe beset the realme , at this day ? And are not his owne wordes these , after a long discourse of perilles ? I doubt not ( deare countriemen ) but that you are men of wisdome , and can easilye conceyue , what dangers we stand in , by that which hath bin set downe before . And a little after : The life of Religion , of Queen , & Countrie , is at the stake , &c. And how then doth he pype vnto vs this feigned note of melancholie musike , amiddest so many dreadfull cares and sorrowes ? hath he not redde that : Musica in luctu importuna narratio , ●●cles 22. it is importun chaunting , when other men are weeping ? but let vs heare his manner of speache .

If I should take vpon me ( sayth he ) to enter into the enumeration of all the benefites , and blessinges , that from the almigh●i haue bin powred vpon this little Island of England , &c.

Here Sir Knight , seing you mention our little Island , you must take in Scotland also , or els you erre in Cosmographie , and then your meaning must be , that Scotland in like manner as well as we , hath tasted of the same benedictions , by change of religion , as no doubt but it hath , with all other regions and countryes neere about vs , who being quiet before and setled in one vniuersall and generall religion , did by Englandes alteration , receyue the like impression and motion in themselues ; yet more then the rest ( by their neerenesse ) Scotland , Ireland , Flanders , and Fraunce . Into the enumeration of all which countryes miseries , tumultes , calamities , and desolations , happened by that chaunge , if I should enter with Sir Frauncis to recount them , I should finde a far more ample subiect to inlarge my self vpon , then he in recyting his blessinges , though he descended vnto verie poore ones .

For to begin with Scotland , Scotland . and to say nothing of the Battailes , Murders , destruction of Countries , Prouinces , Townes , Citties , Howses , and particuler Men , which we haue seen in that Realme within thes fourtie yeares , that the change of religion hath bin attempted ; no man can deny but that three Princes , two Queenes , and one King , the Mother , Daughter , and Husband , haue bin all brought to their bane , by this occasion ; besides the ouerthrow and change of so many Noble Howses and Linages , as Scotish-men can recount , mong their Hamiltons , Dougleses , Stewardes , and others ; as also the Irish will tell of their Noble Desmondes , and other Peeres destroied . But Flaunders & Fraunce Ireland● Flaunders● Fraunce . haue no end at all in these coumptes , when they begin , they are so many . And all this , as they say ( and is euident ) by the Lamentable consequence of our change of Religion in England , which drew them after vs , or at least-wyse gaue example , hart , and help , to their change and euersion also .

But not to steppe from England England . it self , wher principally this blessing bringer doth vaunt that his blessings are powred out in abundance , let vs examine the matter indifferentlie among our selues : we are English-men , and we talke to men of the same language and nation , that know the countrie and condition therof : and many haue seen the change , and knew the stare of thinges therein before the alteration , or at least-wyse haue heard thereof since : by their fatheres and grandfathers , This is not a contention about Terra Virginea , where only we must beleeue Sir Walter Rawleighes Relations , or Sir Humfrey Gilbertes about Terra Florida . Let euery man then looke about him , and say what he findeth or feeleth of these blessings , or maledictions in himself or others .

I for my part shal onely for better direction of mens iudgments , geue this aduertisement , that all blessings of a common-wealth may seeme to be reduced to two heades or braunches , the one spirituall , belonging to the soule and conscience ; the other temporall , that concerneth the body and weale-publique . Let the consideration of the spirituall , goe before , for that they are the worthier and most important for true Christians to be considered and esteemed .

There was in England before the alteration , Spiritual effectes by change of religion . one God worshipped and adored after one and the self same manner , not onely thoroughout this little Iland of England , and Scotland , but also of the whole body of Christendome , one fayth , one beleefe , one forme of seruice , one number of sacramentes , one tonge in celebration , one sacryfice , one head of the Church , one obedience , one iudgement in all , Ioan. 17. Act. 4. Eph. 4. Gal. 3. 2. Thes. 5. 1. Cor. 4. with other lyke poyntes and circumstances of vnion and vnitie , which made a generall vniformitie also in the peace of mens myndes , and is a benediction so highlie esteemed & commended by the Apostles and Christ himself as nothing more in Christian doctrine .

This was in England before the change , but now in these poyntes , we English of the new profession , are not onelie different & deuided from the generall body of Catholiques in Christendom ( with whome we were vnited before ) but also among our selues and with other new sectaries sprong vp with vs or after vs , we haue implacable warres and are deuided in opinions , as from Lutherans in Germanie and Denmarke , from Zwinglians in Swizer-land , from Caluinistes in Geneua , Fraunce , Holland , and Scotland ; and at whome what combates our Bishoppes , Counsellors , and moderate sorte of Protestantes , haue to defend their Parlament Religion and Q. proceedings as they call it , against Puritanes , Brownistes , and other lyke good fellowes , that by shew of Scriptures doe impugne it : All Englishmen knowe and see by their bookes daylie , so as this first and greatest spirituall blessing of vnity and vniformitie , we haue lost and not gained by out change of Religion .

But here our Knight perhappes will say , that the blessing consisteth in that by this change , they who follow the Parlament Religion allowed by the state of England , ( I doe say Perhappes , for that I know not but rather doe doubt much , whether Sir Francis doth followe it or no ) haue the onlie true Religion among all others , that doe erre , or at least-wyse his puritan Religion , and thereby that they only haue this blessing by the change .

And , no doubt , but he saied much if he could proue it of the one or of the other , About certayntie in religion . but this seemeth impossible ( I meane ) that he should either proue it to me , or knowe it himself , but onlie by his owne particuler ghesse , which maketh not faith , but opinion and fansie ; for I would aske Sir Francis , or any such man as he is , that determineth so resolutely , that his onlie Religion among so many others ( as are extant at this day ) is true , and all others false ; whereon doth he ground his certaintie ?

Two only meanes can Sir Francis haue to guide himself in this case , first , that he hath receyued his doctryne of such or such persons , preachers , Ministers , or Doctors , whose learning and knowledge in this ●ehalf he trusteth absolutely : & then is his whole fayth builded vpon the credit of man , as is euident , and consequently is nothing worth , nor no fayth at all . The other waie is , that he beleeueth it , for that it ●s founded in scripture ; but this waie to Sir Francis must needes be as vncertayne as the other , if not more ; for that to be sure that it is ●oundly grounded vpon scripture , he must first reade himself his whole beleef expresly in scriptures , which is much for a man of Sir Francis occupation to do , & then he must be able to iudge of manie other poyntes , belonging to the same , as namely , that the booke is surely scripture , that he readeth . And then that the translation which he vseth is trulie made , out of the learned tongues of Hebrue , Greek , and Latin : And lastelie he must be sure of the true sense and exposition , which also are hard matters , for a man of Sir Francis learning , and much more for others that knowe lesse then he .

Yea and when all is done , if he had all these helpes needfull for such a matter ( as he hath not ) yet were it but a priuate mans opinion , and consequentlie his faith should be grounded but vpon his owne particuler iudgement , which maketh no faith at all , but opinion only as often hath byn saied , for that faith must haue Gods expresse authoritie for her foundation .

So that to conclude , the first blessing which Sir Francis in particuler thinketh to haue rec●yued by this change of his religion , is in effect , that , wheras before , when he beleeued the Catholique and vniuersal fayth of Christendome , deliuered vnto him by the vniuersal churche , as founded on scripture ( which churche Christe and his Apostles , gaue him expresse comission to credit ) his beleef was properly fayth and founded vpon a rocke , that could not fayl : now , hauing left that fortresse , and cast himself into the waues of new opinions , he hath nothing certayne at all , but so much as he list to chuse of himself , or of other mens opinions ; which choise is properly called heresy , for that the woord heresie in Greek ( as all learned men know ) signifyeth nothing els , but a certayne election and choise in matters of religion , to witt , when a man leauing the common consent of the generall Churche , chuseth only to follow that which his owne priuate iudgement induceth him vnto .

And to make this more playne , A playne demonitiation agaynst Sir Francis . how all these people haue no other rule of beleef but only what their owne fa●sie leadeth them vnto , I aske Sir Francis ( not of any Catholyque Doctor , nor of anie auncient father , as S. Augustin , S. Ierom , or the rest , whome easely he would contemne ) but rather , of his owne Doctors , Martin Luther , Iohn Caluyn , Theodore Beza , and such others , whome he supposeth to haue bin seruantes of God , and indued with his holie spirit : and all the world knoweth that they were more learned then Sir Francis ; yet why should he beleeue his owne iudgment more then theirs in poyntes of faith ? wherin they differ from him , as Luther about the real presence , and the number and forme of Sacraments , and many other pointes ; Caluyn in matter of the Q Supremacie , which he denieth . Beza in the whole gouernement of their churche . Or why should I beleeue Sir Francis or his new maisters of England , rather then these that were more learned then hee or his ? or what reason , rule , or foundation , haue any of these men , to beleeue their owne opinion , more then others , but only self will and fansie ?

This then is the first and greatest spiritual benediction ( or malediction rather ) that I fynd to haue happened to our realme and nation by this wofull alteration of religion , that whereas before we had ● direct rule , squyre and pole-starre to follow , which was the vniuersal churche ; now , euery man being set at libertie , holdeth , beleeueth , and teacheth what he listeth . Nor is there any waie or meane lefte to restrayne him , for streight way he appealeth boldly and confidently to the scriptures , and there he wil be both maister and pilot , and boteswayne himself , to gouerne the barke at his pleasure , for he admitte●● no iudge , no interpreter , no authoritie , no antiquitie , nor anie other manner of triall ; which is the greatest madnes and malediction that euer could happen amonge men of reason .

And I haue byn the longer in this first blessing , for that it is the head and welspring of all other spirituall miseries , insued by this alteration vpon vs , which now in haste I will runne ouer as men are wont to drinck a medicine with as litle stay or reflexion as may for the euil sauour .

After assurance , stabilitie , and vnion in beleef , the next greatest spiritual benedictions that can be expected of any doctryn , What effectes of vertue new religion hath wrought . are the good effects of vertue which it woorketh in mens myndes and manners , as it was foretold by Esay the prophet , that Christes doctrine , should so alter mens conditions and natures , that such as were most fearce , sauadge , and wicked before , should by this doctryn become most humble , Esa. 11. kinde and gentle . The wolfe ( sayth he ) shall dwell with ●he lambe , and the parde shall lye with the goat ; the calfe , lyon , and sheep shall abyde together : and a litle childe shal be able to gouerne them all .

Well then : hath the protestantes doctryn wrought these effects of peace , meekenesse , mansuetude and agreement ? I haue touched before the bloody tragedies raysed in Fraunce , Flaunders , Scotland , and other places , vpon the first rysing therof , I might adde Swizerland , and Germanie , where their owne stories do testifie , that aboue a hundreth thowsand people were slayne within one yeare , by the rebellion and warres of the countrie-men agaynst their Lordes , Sledan . for the controuersie of religion , such humilitie obedience , and meeknes of hart im●rinted presently this new doctryn when it came .

But let vs see other effects , Christes doctrine exhorteth to Pe●ance , to Mortification of the flesh , Math. 3. 8. 4. Luc. 3. Act. 2. 2. Corinth . 7. & 2. Rom. 8. Coll. 3. Math. 19. 17 1. Cor. 7. Luc. 11. & 14. to Continencie , Virginitie , Fa●ting , Praying , Almes , voluntarie Pouertie , renouncing of the world , & the lyke . Are there more of these effects now adayes in England or before ? Or are there more in Sir Francis and his men , then in ours ? doth he and his ghospellers pay their debtes better then Catholiques doe , or keepe better Howses , or more Hospitalitie , or ●rayse their Rentes lesse , or take lesse Fines , or vse their Tenantes ●etter , or lend their Neighboures more money , without vsurie ? Or doe they helpe to Marrye more Poore mens daughters , and other such like good Woorkes of Charitie ? Is Pryde in apparayle , Glut●onie , Dronkennesse , Lecherie , Swearing , and For swearing , Coue●ousnesse , Crueltie , Falsehood , Deceipte , Theeuerie , Lack of Con●cience , Oppressing of poore men , more of lesse noweadayes in vre or before , when yet this change was not made ? Let Sir Francis an●were me to this and not he only but the whole countrie round about him , and then let him tell me with wittnesses , whether they be Spirituall blessinges or curses that haue insued vpon this change of Religion so much commended by him , and so I sh●l passe to weigh his temporall benedictions , which perhappes he esteemeth farre more then these spirituall .

For better vnderstanding whereof , Temporal effectes by change of religion . men are wont to bring into consideration two poyntes . First , what was likely to haue bin , or ●allen out , if the the change of Religion had not bin made in her Ma●esties tyme , and then what hath insued vpon the change made .

To the first they saie , that if as her Maiestie entered most happily and ioy fullie into the Crowne of England , by generall consent of all , and promoted especiallie by the peculier forces of Catholiques , that were at that day moste potent without comparison ; and that , as her Maiestie entered Catholiquely , that is to say , shewing her●self in all poyntes of religion and behaueour à Catholique , according as she had done also before in her sister Q. Maries r●●gne and was now crowned and anoynted Catholiquely by a Catholique bishop , at a Catholique masse , and other like circumstances ; i● she had continued that course still , & not yeelded to the persuasion● of some new counsellors , agaynst the iudgement of all her olde ( a● in deed she was hardly brought to yeelde therunto at the beginning , for that she foresawe by her wisdome , diuers of the inconueniences , that sythence haue insued ) then say these men , if this had byn● so , both her Maiestie and the realme had byn moste happie at this day . And in particuler they alleadge these benefytes following , which of all probabilitie would haue fallen vpon vs .

First , her Maiestie at this day had had a moste florishing kingdome vnited both to her , Strength & felicitic by vnion . and among themselues , in Religion , iudgment , affection , fidelitie , and frendshippe , as other realmes Catholique of the worlde are seen to be , and as ours for aboue a thowsand yeares together with much honour and felicitie , is knowne to haue remayned .

Here of had insued that none of these feares and terrors of Conquestes , Inuasions , Securitie . Assaultes , Treasons , Conspiracies , and the like , which this Wach-man indeuoreth to lay before vs , had euer come in consideration . For that England vnited in it self , hath euer since i● was a Monarchie , made other Kingdomes and Prouinces rown● about it to feare her forces ( as by matters happened in France , Ireland and Scotland , for many ages is euident ) and she neuer greatlie feared any .

Thirdly , England had had her Maiestie at this day by all likelihood a ioyfull mother of many fayre and princely children , Issue of her Maiestie . for tha● the principall cause of her graces not marying is to be presumed to haue proceeded of the different Religion of forrayne Princes , who desired the same on the on side : and on the other , the inequaliti● of blood in her owne subiectes , for such aduauncement . For to attribute this great resolution of her Maiestie , to the onlie loue of sole lyfe and Mayden head , I doubt how it can be ius●ifiable , seing that among Catholiques where such profession is more praised and practised , they vse sometymes to draw out euen vowed Nunnes from their Cloisters to mariadge , for so weightie a cause , as is the sauing of succession in so great a crown as England is known to be . And among protestants virginitie is not of that necessitie or merit , as for it to incurr so great inconueniences , notwithstanding the base and seruile flatterie of this crowching Knight , who casteth in now and then the memorie of a Mayden Queen , without respecting the deadly wound which his countrie receiueth thereby .

Fourthly , Establishment of suecession . of this had followed the sure establishment of the succession of this Imperiall crown in the blood and race of the vnited Royall Howses of York and Lancaster , and of the lyne of the Noble King Henry the seuenth , which lyne being now to end with her Maiestie , in the direct discent , is lyke to bring great dangers to the realme . For albeit there want not of collateral branches , yet their causes are otherwise so implicated for diuerse respects , but espetiallie by difference of religion ( which had neuer happened if the change had not byn made ) as no man can tell what wil be the end , and most men do ●eare extreme calamities therby .

Fifthly , if religion in England had not byn changed , we had had no breach with Rome , Vnion with Rome & see Apostolique . nor consequently had the excommunication followed , whereof so great noise hath byn made in the world abroad , and so great trouble at home . And what the vnion and frendshipp of the Bishop of Rome may importe , euen as a temporall Prince , the effects shewed of late in Fraunce , where espetiallie by his indeuour and authoritie matters haue byn compounded that seemed verie hard and desperate before , not only between that King and his owne subiectes , but also between that crown and Spayn and the states of Flaunders , which without such an arbiter and vmpyre would verie hardly , haue euer byn accommodated .

Sixthly , England had continued in her old ancient amitie and leagues moste honorable with Spayn and Burg●ndie , Ancient leagues . and with their dependents , and consequently had auoyded all these long and costly warres , which by that breach we haue byn inforced to manteyne with losse of so many worthie men , and expence of so great treasure , as easelie maie be imagined , and the quarell not yet ended .

Seuenthly , so great and bloody warres and tumultes in Christian kingdomes round about vs , Warres abroad . had neuer happened , as before in part hath byn declared ; and all the world doth impute the principal causes and motions therof , vnto the diuersitie of religion in England .

And lastly , most dolefull alterations in our own countrie had byn auoyded , Damages receaued at home . as the depriuation in one day of all the sacred order of Bishops in England , with their perpetual imprisonment , for that they would not subscribe to this infortunate change of religion , wroong out in Parlament , as all men know , by the oddes only of one or two voices of lay men . The disgrace and abasing of so many noble houses , with ouerthrow of others , wherof let Norfolk , Arundel , Northumberland , Oxford , Westmerland and Dacres giue testimonie . For of the rest I will not make mention , seing perhaps themselues would be loth I should , all which had passed otherwise by probabilitie , if religion had not byn altered . The continual and intollerable affliction also of so many honorable and worshipfull Gentlemen , had neuer happened , for perseuering in their fathers fayth , wherto our country was first conuerted from infidelitie , without any other offence obiected or to be proued agaynste them , but only refusing to accommodate themselues to this change . Recusantes . The torturing , hanging , and quartering , of aboue a hundreth Preestes for the same cause ; the moste of them good Gentlemen , and youthes of rare witt , learning , and other partes , which other Common wealthes would highly haue esteemed , and so would ours too in tymes past , and will agayne in tyme to come , when these blastes shall once be ouerblown .

All these inconueniences and calamities had bin auoyded , or the moste of them , if change of Religion in England had not byn made ; so that the innumerable benedictions , which this poore man would needs threap vpon vs , by the change , do come to be in effect these that follow .

First , The some of all that hath byn saide . in Spiritual affayrs to haue no certaynty of Religion at all , as hath bin proued ; no stay , no foundation , no rule , but only euery mans own priuate iudgment , and fansie , wrangling and iangling without end , and without iudge or meanes to make an end : Nouelties without number , and liberty of lyf without feare or force of Ecclesiasticall disciplyne to restrayn it . And then in temporall matters the blessings are such as haue bin discouered ; our Realme deuided and shiuered in a thowsand peeces ; our Princess olde , without children , or hope of any , our Crown without Succession , our olde frends and allyes made our enemies , our new frends vncertayn , our own flesh and countrymen most pitifully deuided within their own bowels , and most miserably tossed and turmoyled both abroad and at home : abroad and in other countries , with Prisons , Yrons , Chaynes , Gallyes , and other Afflictions , euen to Death it self ; for being Protestants , Pirats , Spies , Practisers , or other such imputations incident to enemyes . At home afflicted with no less persecutions of our own Magistrates for being Catholiques , or deemed to be such . So as I would fayn know , who are they in our litle Iland that feel these innumerable benifits and blessings by change of Religion , which this gentleman talketh of , seeing there are very few either of one Religion or other , that taste not of the miseries wherof I haue spoken , either in themselues , their frends , children , seruants , kinsefolks , goodes , honours , or otherwise , and most of all the Realm and Commonwealth it self .

It may be Sir Francis sitteth easier then other men , hauing gotten som fat morsel to feed on , by this change , yet ought he to haue some sens and feeling also of other mens greefs , or at least-wise so much wit as not to put himself to sing in publique , when so many thowsands of other men do weep and complayn . And so much of his blessings .

THE SECOND INCOVNTER , ABOVT CERTAIN ABSVRD GROWNDS and principles , forged by this Knight to be in Catholique Religion .

WE haue taken a scantling in the former incounter of this our knightes folly and flatterie , now followeth a fuller view of his cogging and lying ; for these two vertues commonly go together , Senec● . qui adulator , idem & mendax , sayth one ; the flatterer is a lyar in lyke manner . For neither truth can stretch herself to flatter : nor flattery can be manteyned without lying . This man then , after he hath flattered the state of England so grosly and fondly as you haue heard , by telling them of the innumerable benedictions powred out vpon the whol Iland by the change of religion , now he will needes take vpon him to set before our eyes the spiritual miseries and maledictions that Catholiques were in before this change , to witt in Queen Maries dayes , and in former raignes of ancient Catholique Princes , by reason of certayne absurd and false principles , which ( as he sayth ) were then receyued for truthes in matters of Religion .

But before he come to set down those principles , he maketh for his preface acertain poetical description of the dark , clowdy , and mistie state of thinges in Queen Maries tyme , in these woords .

It is not vnknown ( sayth he ) to many yet liuing , Deuised da●●●enes . nether can it be altogether ●idden from the yonger sorte that liued with them , what a dark mistie clowd of ignorance ( which brought in popish idolatrie and all manner of superstition ) did ouershadow the whole Land , &c. ( and againe after . ) In these dark and clowdy daies , least the sun-shine of knowledge should dispearce the mists of ignorance and giue light to the dimm of sight , &c.

Doth it not seeme that this graue gentleman describeth the lake of Auernus in Italy , or some foggy marsh in England , or some smoaky kitchin or wood-howse of his own without a window , when he speaketh of our famous Country in former tymes ? Aboue a thowsand years the state of England and the Princes , People , Nobility , and Learned men thereof had continued in that Egiptian or rather Cimmerian darknes which he describeth vnder , clowds , mists , and shadows , vntil his new Sun-shyne doctors came in to inlighten the same . And it was accounted then as w●se , learned , valiant , noble , and florishing a Kingdom , as France , Italy , Spayn , and other Catholique kingdoms be at this day ; where if one of these our inlightened , & Sunborne , English ministers should appeer , he would not dare to open his mouth in schooles or matters of learning , among the great number of most excellent learned men , which there are found , as we haue well experienced by such of our protestant people as now and then do go abroad to forrayn Vniuersities , and are quikly brought to confess , their inequalitie in this kynd , for that they skarse vnderstand the very ordinary tearms of the learned sciences which the other do possess . And as for Q. Maries reign in England , Learning in Q. Maries reigne . it is euident to all those that haue iudgment to discern what learning and wisedom meaneth ( and indifferency to confess it ) that there was not a more learned Clergy in many ages before . And in respect of these poore creaturs that occupy now their prebends , and sitt in the Sun-shine of their New-pretended-gospel with their wiues and children round about them , they wer great Rabbins and Patriarchs . One Tonstale of Duresme , one Watson of Lincoln , one Christoferson of Chichester , for learning : one Fecknam of Westminster , one Gardener and on Whyte both Bishops of Winchester , for wisdom and learning together , were able to hold at school all your Sun-shine Clergie at this day , for terme of life and after , as by their woorks and wrytings yet extant doth well appeer .

But let vs see how the knight goeth forward in his tale ; after he hath tolde vs of these clowds , mists and darknes , that then raygned , he addeth these woords : whereunto ( sayth he ) was added , and wherwith was mixed , all bloody and sauadg cruelty agaynst those that desired knowledge and were any way inlightened by Gods grace , Manifeste vntruthes . with a glimering or smale insight into true religion . For though it were but only a desire to read vpon the holy booke of God ; ether the olde or new testament , then heretique was his title , heresy was his fault ; ●●d for this was he called before the Romish Cleargy to receyue their censure , and ●●ch neuer departed from their clowtches till they had brandeled them to the ●aughter .

This is his narration . Wherin first we must separate open and ma●ifest lying , from fond and rude ignorance : for that the former is less ●ufferable ( in a Knight that holdeth accompt of honor ) then the second , ●specially in matters of Diuinity . And truly I am sory that the writer of this booke calleth himself knight , to whom in law of Chiualry a ●●ā should not giue the lye , but with obligation to defend it in the field , ●ut for that I do presume when he resolued to write and publish this booke , and to diuulge so fals , fowl , and slaunderous a libel , and to iniure ●o many mens honors therin , as he hath donn , and the honor of God and of his Saintes especially , which is less to be tolerated , he made accompt to renounce all priuiledge of Knighthood , Gentry , and Nobi●ity . For this cause I am moued to make less scruple in that behalf when necessity is offered .

And heere I must begin in this very place to tell him , that two manifest vntruthes , properly called lyes ( for that they are wilfull ) are set downe by him in the woords alleadged , and known to be such to very children and nouices in the Catholique Religion .

The first , that it is holden for heresy , or euer was , to read vpon the Bible or booke of God ( as he calleth it ) in what language soeuer , Vntruth . for euen in vulgar tongues it is permitted to infinite lay people in all Catholique countryes , by lycence of the ordinary , as all men know , and it can not be denied .

The otherly is , that for this fault only men were called before the Romish Cleargie in England , Vntruth . and brandeled to the slaughter .

These I say are apparent fictions ; let the Knight defend his honor in auowing them . It remaineth only to me to lay downe what the Catholique Church did ordayne in this behalf , and what reasons she might haue to restrayne some of this mans dim and glimmering people from reading at their pleasure , vpon vulgar B●bles without lycence , or without the spectacles of competent learning and vnderstanding requisit for to profitt thereby ; & how far this prohibition of the Church streched , and whether this may iustly be accompted bloody and sauage proceedings or rather prudent and prouident circumspection for simple mens safty .

First then , most certayn it is , that no man or woman , was euer forbidden How reading of Scriptures was forbidden & whie . to read any parte of the holy Scriptures in any of the three learned languages , wherin they were written , to witt Hebrew , Greek , and Latin . And secondly , the restraynt that was made of vulgar translations , as French , Duch , English and the lyke , was only that no such translation , should be admitted or vsed , except it were first examined by learned men by order of the Bishop , & Ordinary to see whether it were well and truly translated or no. And then such men and women of the laity were permitted to vse the sayd translation approued , as should haue lycence of the sayd Ordinary , and be thought fit and able to profit , and not to take hurt or hinderance therby ; others had the same in effect and substans deliuered vnto them by sermons , bookes , and other means .

This was the order ; let indifferent men iudge and determine what cruelty or mercy , impiety or piety , might be herein . For first , no man will deny but if the translator did not put downe truly and sincerely the wordes of Scriptures in his vulgar translation , then the simple reader that cannot discerne , should take mans word for Gods word , which were great inconuenience , and for this cause only ( if none other were ) most necessary was it , that some order should be set downe for examining of translations , whereby might be distinguished when God and when man speaketh in the Scriptures . And secondly though it were certayn that the words of Scripture were ●et downe truly in vulgar translations , yet if the same reader by ignorance did take out of the true woords a fals sence ; then sucked he poyson in steed of wholesom doctrine . Comparason . If then in a fayr and pleasant garden , there should be this danger , not only that one hearb taken for another might indaunger a mans lyf , but the self same heard gathered and dressed in different sorte , might be eigher poyson or treacle , who would condemn the maister of the garden , if he suffered not euery one indifferently to gather hearbs there , but such as either had skill of themselues to discerne , or were directed by others how to gather and vse those hearbs to their help and health , and not to their hurt and distruction : and to the very same end was the prohibition that ignorant people should not read Scriptures , but with leaue and direction .

Who can deny but that S. Paule talking of the Scriptures as they were in the Learned tongues ( especially of the olde testament ) sayth of them ; ● . Cor. 3. liter a occidit , Spiritus autem viuificat . the letter or literall ●ound doth often tymes murder the reader , & the only spirit that is the internall true and spirituall meaning of the Scriptures , doth giue lyf . And albeit S. Augustin in his learned booke de Spiritu & litera , Ad Marcellinum . doth extend these woords of the Apostle to a farther meaning also , yet he teacheth this too , and so do the rest of the ancient fathers , namely S. Hierom ●d Nepotianum , handeling the story of king Dauid 3. Reg. 1. where the ●ong virgin Abisag was sought out to heat him in his olde adge : S. Hierom sayth , that if we should follow literam occidentem , the mur●hering letter , it seemeth a iest and fable , but if we fly to the hidden spirituall sence and meaning , it is most holy .

But now let vs aske of you Sir Knight , how wil your vnlearned ●eaders those whome you cal dim & glimering people , discerne these things without a guyd , such as the Catholique Church doth appoynt for ●xpounding the Scriptures to simple people , by Catechisms , Sermons , Homelies , teaching of pastors , and the lyke , without deliuering the whole Bible into their handes , to be vsed or abused to their destruction .

Furthermore you cannot deny , but that the vnderstanding of Scriptures is a particuler gift of God , Vnderstanding of Scriptures a peculier gift . Apoc. ● . reserued especially vnto Christe , who had the key to open the booke sealed with seuen seales , as S. Iohn testifieth , and to the same effect is it recorded in S. Lukes Gospel for a singuler grace , bestowed by our Saueour vpon the Church , tun●●peruit illis sensum , vt inteligerint Scripturas . Luc. 24. Then after his resurrection did he open to them the sence , wherby they might vnderstand Scriptures of themselues . For euer before he had interpreted the same lightly vnto them , as in the Gospel apeareth . Act. ● . He sent also S. Phillip the Apo●tle by commaundement of his Angell , to goe and interpret a certain place of the Prophet Esay , vnto the great Eunuch & Tresurer of the Q of AEthiopia , when he would conuert him . And it is to be obserued , that albeit Christe might haue opened the sence of the Scripture to himself immediatly , yet would he send him a guide . Yea though the sayd Eunuch were learned ( as may appeer by that being an AEthiopianred the Prophet in Hebrue ) and though he were also instructed in the Iews religion ( as it is proued by that the storie recordeth that ●he came to adoie in Hierusalem ) yetall this notwithstanding , was he so far from the pryde of our peeuish prowd protestant people now a dayes , which make no bones at any difficultie of Scriptures , as when he was asked by S. Phillip , Putasneintellig●s , quae legis ? Ibidem . thinkest thou that thou vuderstandest the Scripture which thou readest ? he answered , how can I vnderstand it , except some body do expound the same vnto me ? which answere I beleeue many a good wife in London , that goeth vp and downe with her Bible vnder her arme , would be ashamed to giue if she were asked whether she vnderstand the whole Bible or no.

These then ( Sir Knight ) are the reasons why some of those your glimmering and inlightened people , were restrayned by Catholique discipline to read vpon ( Gods booke as you call it ) vulgar translations ; no● to bar them from light as you malitiously calumniate , but rather leas● they being but half blynde should become whole blynde , that is t●● say madd and obstinate blynde of ignorance , and vnlearned blynde ; for such effects doe insew some times of the rash reading of this booke of God , when therof is ingendred falshood and Heresyē , that is , the doctrine of the diuel , for proofe wherof , let vs consider whether in a● thowsand years together in England , France , Germany and other places of Christendome , while this prudent restraint of Catholiqu● church lasted , of not permitting all ignorant people to read Scriptures at their pleasures , Experience of hurtes come by permitting the reading of scriptures to the ignorant . in vulgar languages , without an interpreter , there arose so many Sects , Heresyes , and alterations about Religion , as there haue risen in fifty or threescore years , since this reading was left open to all ; there is no comparison . And if we consider only England , the● matter is euident , that more sects haue sprong vp of late by many degrees . Yea though we leaue all other sects that are permitted , or wi●ked at in England , & respect such only as haue bin punished openly by the magistrate , namely such persons as haue bin whipped or burned in London , Norfolk , and other places for Heretiques , in the tyme o● her Maiestyes raign that now is , for denying Christe himself or other● poyntes of the blessed Trinity , being altogether vnlearned people , as our Chronicles testifie , of whome I ask , had they euer fallen into such errors and obstinacie , but only by reading Sciptures in the vulgar language ? had euer william Hacket dreamed himself to be Christe , or william Geffrey before him , but by this way ? we see then the inconuenience .

In King Henries tyme when Tindal had translated and printed the new Testament in English at Colen , and began to seck meanes to haue them dispersed in England , the laws and kings commandment being then against it ; there was a certayn foul fusteluggs , dishonest of her body with base fellows , as was openly reported , whose name was Ioan knell alias Burcher , Ioan● Burcher burned . if I forget not , who beginning to be a great reader of Scriptures her self became a principall instrument also in that tyme to deuulge such Bibles as were sent , especially in the courte , where she became known to certayn women in authority ; and to conuey the bookes more safty , she vsed to bynde them in strings vnder her aparrell , and so to pass them into the courte : but her neerest frendship was with An Askew , whome king henry afterwards caused to be burned for denying the reall presence in the Sacrament of the Aulter .

But this other scripturian profited so wel , as in the fifth yeare of king Edwards reygn she was burned also by the protestants of that time , for denying Christe to haue taken flesh of the Virgin Marie . Who when she was codemned to dye , spake very scornfully to the Iudges , and saied : It is a goodly matt●er to consider your ignorance ; it is not long agoe since you burned Ann Askew for a peece of bread , and yet came your selues soone after to beleeue and professe the same doctryne , for which you burned her : & now ( for sooth ) you wil needs burne me for a peece of fleshe , & in the end you will come to beleeue this also , when you haue red the scriptures and vnderstand them , and when she came to dye in Smithfield and D. Story endeuored to conuert her she skoffed at him , saying , he lyed like , &c. and bad him god read Scriptures .

And thus much may serue for the repelling those clowds , mists , and darknesse which this wach-woord-giuer wil needs imagin to be among vs , for that all coblers do not clowt Scriptures in our commonwealth . But let vs see now what positions and principles he sayth we haue for our direction amiddest this darknesse .

In these darke and clowdy dayes ( sayth he ) least the sun-shine of knowledge should dispers the mists of ignorance , and giue light to the dimm of sight , this position was set down for their maxime or rule in fallible ; The first forged position . that ignorance is the mother of deuotion , and that the sacred woord of God , which was giuen to be a lantern to all our feet , and a light to our steps , was forbidden to the lay sorte ( for so they called them ) as matter vnfit for them to looke into , &c.

How manifest a falshood it is that reading of Scriptures is forbidden to all laie men , is sufficiently shewed by that which goeth before ; for in any of the three learned tongues , any laie man or woman may read them at their pleasure , & in vulgar translations also such as haue lycence . And I think Sir Frauncis will not deny , that many of the laitie vnderstand latin ; how then , and with what face complaineth he so piteouslie or rather hipocritically , that the sacred worde of God which was giuen to be a lantern to our feet , &c. was forbidden to the laye sorte ? Again what malepart ignorance is it in him to scoff ( as he doth ) at the worde laye sorte , with this parenthesis ( for so they called them ) as though the Catholiques of late dayes had made this distinction between laytie and clergie-men ; Distinction of laytie & cleargie . wheras from the very Apostles tyme in all Fathers and general Counsels the wordes and distinction is ordinarie ? As in the first Counsell of Nice neere thirteen hundred year agone almost in euery canon , namely in the 1. 3. 8. 17. 18. 19. the matter is handeled expresly . And before that again , Origen . hom. 7. in Herem . Origen proued the same distinction out of the wordes of Scriptures themselues ; and S. Epiphanius , S. Hierom & other Fathers , haue donn the same since . Heer then is much malice , Epiph. Episc. ad loan . Episcopum Hierosol . Hieron . Cō. in cap. 12. Hierem. ioyned with grosse ignorance , in our Knight of the woord . But let vs see his forged position , wherin we affirm ignorance to be the mother of deuotion .

If Catholiques did hold that ignorance were the mother of deuotion , then might they hope to see Sir Francis Hastings a deuout knight in time , for that he is ignorant as euer lightly tooke pen in hand to write . But we deny this maxime or infallible rule to be ours ( Sir Francis ) and do say that it is your calumniation only , and that among vs it is nether maxime nor minime . Maxime . And for you to proue it a maxime you must shew that all Catholiques or the most parte do hold it . And to proue it a minime Minime . at least you must shew that some one doth hold it : neither of which you can euer doe , and so you remaine disgraced . It may be you haue heard it obiected by some idle or ignorant minister there , that inuented it for sporte , and knew neither what science , or ignorance or deuotion meaneth . And it seeming a pretie ies● vnto you , you thought best to put it in your note booke , against this occasion of writing your wach-worde ; wherby you awaken men to discouer your owne folly and ignorance , and the malitious peeuishnesse of your sect , that hath nothing to found it self on , but vpon faigned calumniations against Catholique doctrine .

And this were sufficient to refute you with shame , and to put you to the proof , seeing you haue written and printed , that we hold this position . But I will goe further with you , and deale more liberally , and send you to one who will tell you perspicuously what all Catholiques do hold in this behalf about deuotion , and her mother and● daughter also , that is both of her cause and effect . And this is the famous vniuersall Doctor , D. Thom. 2. 2. quaest. 82. ●r. 20. S. Thomas of Aquin , who aboue three hundred years agone set down the Catholique doctrine in this point . And what he holdeth we all hold ; which were a hard thing to finde amongst you , that all agreed in one for a far shorter space of time . And if you will haue also a more auncient author , read S. Augustin lib. de Spiritu & anima , ca. 50.

But let vs see what S. Thomas sayth , first he sheweth how deuotion is a spetiall act of religion , What deuotion is , & whence it proceedeth . importing nothing els , but a deuowing of a mannes hart to the prompt seruice of almightie God . And secondly he sheweth that the intrinsecal immediate cause of deuotion in vs , is contemplation and meditation of Gods benefits , and of our owne defects , according to the saying of the Prophet , Psal. 38. in meditatione mea exardescet ignis . the fier of deuotion waxeth hot in me by meditation . And thirdly he declareth by diuers arguments that the proper effect of deuotion is gladnes and hilaritie of mynde . So that heer ignorance entereth neither for mother , nor daughter , nor grandmother , nor sister of deuotion but rather the contrarie , deuotion proceedeth of knowledge gotten by meditation , both of Gods perfections and of our imperfections , as hath bin sayd : and S Augustin in the place before alleaged , saieth in confirmation of this , Meditatio parit scientiam , scientia compunctionem , compunctio deu●tionem , deuotio perficit orationem . Meditation bringeth foorth knowledge , knowledge compunction , compunction deuotion , deuotion maketh perfect our praier● where is heer then mother ignorance alleadged by Sir Francis ?

And further to make more euident the wilfull malice of these good fellow●s , that deuise matter to play vpon , S. Thomas maketh this obiection to himself . Why the best learned are not alwayes most deuout● If contemplation which breedeth knowledge be the cause and mother of deuotion , how hapneth it , that the greatest wits , and moste learned men , and moste apt to high contemplations , be not euer the moste deuout , but often times the simpler sort , as women and the lyke , do f●el more deuotion then they ? To which he answereth , that those contemplations only serue to bring foorth deuotion , that are fit to engender in vs the loue of God , and compunction of our sinnes , as S. Augustin also noteth . In which cogitations simpler people doe exercise themselues often tymes with more dilligence and affection then the greater learned men , who are distracted with other speculations , apperteyning rather to speculation then motion of mynde , and in this sence saied moste truly S. Paul , 1. Cor. ● . scientia inflat , charit as edificat , knowledge doth puff vp with pryde oftentimes , but the loue of God and our neighbour , is that which maketh vp the building , and deuout Iohn Gerson , mallem sentire in me compunctionem , quam scire eius definitionem . I had rather feel in my self compunction for my sinnes , then know his definition .

Thus then you see , Sir Francis , that we hold not ignorance for mother , nor daughter , nor kinswoman of deuotion ; but rather to the contrary , we hold that deuotion is founded and proceedeth of knowledge , wherof Catholiques haue bin euer and in all ages , The Catholiques more authors of knowledge then Protestants . more studious and greater enimyes to ignorance , then protestants can with any reason presume , for demonstration wherof , I would aske you Sir Francis ( if you be a man of any discours ) who haue left more monuments of science or knowledge to the christian worlde , your men or ours ? who haue builded our schooles and vniuersities in England ? who haue founded our colledges ? who haue instituted the degrees of Doctors , Licenciates , Maisters , and Bachelers , and apointed preferments for them , you or we ? And to speake of positiue Diuinitie only and Scriptures , wherof you will seeme to bragg , who haue conserued and published the Bible in the learned tongues of Hebrue , Greek , and Latin , euen in our dayes ? Were not the Biblia Complutensia , in all three tongues printed and set foorth by the expences of a fransiscan frier Cardinall Ximenes Arch-bishop of Toledo , within these three or fourscore yeares ? And were not the last Biblia Regia set foorth in foure or fiue tongues by Catholique men , by the authority and charges of his Catholique Maiestie of Spayn ? And are not the Comentaries written vpon the Scriptures by Catholique men euen at this day , aboue twenty for one , more then those of Protestants ? why then do heretiques , lyke apes bragg , and prate in presence of lions , that in euery kinde o● learning do bear them downe ? But now to the second position .

When they had thus setled this blinde cours ( saieth our knight ) to keepe the people from knowledge , &c. Then they offer an other position , The second faigned position . that it was not for lay men to medle with matters of religion , that belonged only and wholy as 〈◊〉 priueledge to Priests ; thereby making them secure and careless of God and a● godlinesse .

In setting downe of this forged position , there is some subtlety ioined with impudencie . For first in the former parte , where he sayth we hold , that it is not for lay men to medle with religion , he subtely leaueth doubtful this worde ( medle ) either to signifie that lay men must not determine or defyne matters of religion , or els not to medle or care for them at all . In the former sence we graunt , that in Synods and Counsels , where controuersies of fayth are to be treated , Priests and Clergy-men haue only authority to define and determine : Act. 20. for that S. Paule sayth that they are apointed by the holy Ghoste to gouern the church , though before they come to determine , they do help themselues also by the learning of lay men , and take their iudgement when they may giue light , as in all Counsels is seen . But in the second sence it is moste impudent that he inferreth , that hereby we would make lay men secure & carele● of God , & all godlinesse . For how doth it follow ? The Queen of England doth refer , the determination of all good lawes , orders , & vertuous proceedings within the realm , vnto the voices of her priuie counsell , or of the parlament , ergo heerby she maketh free , secure and careles , all the rest of her realm , from obseruation of good orders , law , and honest behaueour . Or in the self same matter of religion , I may argue thus , the determination of matters of fayth is remitted only at this day in England , to Bishops & ministers , and not to their wiues ; ergo heerby those ●ood wiues are made secure and careles of God & all godlinesse : there 〈◊〉 no difference in the consequence at all .

Wherfore as malice here lost her eyes , so doth she also her wits in ●hat which followeth ; for presently he leapeth to raile vpon the ●aints of heauen , and namely vpon S. Thomas of Canterbury ( though ●mpertinent to his purpose ) for he was treating of lay men as you ●aue hearde , whome he sayth we make careles of God and all godlinesse , ●or that we refer the determination of controuersies in religion , not ●nto them , but vnto Priests only , and now let euery one consider how ●his consequence holdeth ( which enseweth ) and it is enough ( sayth he ) ●f one of these fellowes come diligently and deuoutly to hear masse , & goe to confes●ion once a year , to be as religious a man ( secundum vsum Sarum ) as could be wi●hed ; and though he were to be tainted and to be taxed with the grossest sinnes , ●et Rome by the authority from their vicar generall , had at rik to hale them into the ●able of their Saints , and so to canonize them ; as we haue example of Thomas Becket in Henry the thirds tyme , whose treasons to the prince were apparent and manifest , &c.

But before I answere in the cause of S. Thomas , About S. Thomas of Canterbury . I will aduise this ●alumniator , first that his skoff of a religious man , secundum vsum Sa●um , is ridiculous on his side , if we compare him to his holy ministers that follow the vse of the tauern at chaering crosse , & do neither heare masse nor go to confession once in seuen yeares , nor meane to amend or ●●ake satisfaction ; and then it is a great lye , that we require nothing els ●ut going once a year , and a far greater that men of the grossest sinnes ●re made Saints among vs : and finally nothing els is heer but iests and lyes .

Secondly I put Sir knight in mynde , that talking of lay men , S. Thomas example ( that was a Priest and head of Priests ) was not to his purpose . Thirdly moste grosly and ignorantly he erreth in the tymes ; for that S. Thomas his death and canonization was in King Henry the second and not the thirds , as fondly he affirmeth : but aboue thirty years before king Henry the third was borne . Fourthly that this poore man maketh an vnequal match to fight with Saints , and will rest in the end with a broken head .

And finally that he sayth S. Thomas his treasons to his prince were apparent & manifest , is a manifest slaunder . For there is nothing in all the whole discourse of his controuersie with King Henrie the second , that sauoureth of treason , or that impugned any one law of the realm then in vre . For that the recourse he made to Rome , was lawfull at that day , as it is now in any other Catholique country . The controuersie was only about the liberty of the English Church , which the king sought to abridge , and the other as primate to defend Nor did the king or his officers chardge him with treasons , nor could they by any shew of Iustice . For if in euery contention or dissention that a spiritual subiect , or Ecclesiastical Prelate may haue with his temporall prince , the subiect shal be condemned of treason ( according to this seruile censure of Protestantes , that to flatter princes make them absolute lordes both of body and sowl ) then Iohn Baptist also must be accompted a traytour , that dealt so peremptorily with his king Herod , that was his liege Lorde in temporal affayres . Or if you will haue examples of Christian princes , S. Ambrose must be a traytor , first for resisting openly his Lord and king Valentinian the yonger , & then for handling so hardly the elder Theodosius Emperour , Theodor. lib. 4. c 6. & lib. 5. c. 17. & deinceps . in Millan , as he shut him out of the church , and made him goe home agayne with shame and do penance . S. Hilarius also , & S Athanasius shal be traitors , Zozom. lib. 8 fere per totum . for their contentions with Constantius their lawull Emperour and temporall Lord , who b●nished them from their Bishoprikes . And the former of the two wrote two vehement bookes & inuectiues , agaynst the sayd Emperour , and yet no man euer accompted him a traytor for the same , but rather a great Saint , for his Christian libertie and constancie . S. Chrysostome in lyke manner shal be condemned for a great traytor , Socrat. lib. 6. c. 16. who had greater contentions with his temporal Lordes , Zozom. lib. 8. c. 17. Arcadius , and Honorius , Christian Emperours , and with their wyues , Theodosia , and Eudoxia , then euer S. Thomas had with king Henry the second . Niceph. l. 14 c. 43. For he pr●ached agaynst them publiquely , with great vehemencie , and thundred out excomunication agaynst them , and was twyce banished and driuen out of his Bishoprike by their disfauor , and died in exile . And yet was he neuer called or accompted a traytor , but a singuler holy man ; and Theodosius the yonger son of Arcadius , brought his body , with great solemnitie , honour , and reuerence , into Constantinople , and wept most bitterly for the sinnes of his parentes in persecuting so blessed a man . And as the story sayth , Math. Paris . made prayer to him now dead for pardon of his fathers sinnes . As did also often our king Henry the sonne , for the offence of his father in being some cause of the death of this iust man , his pastor and spiritual father .

Wel then to conclude this matter , treason there was none , nor could be in this contention of S. Thomas agaynst king Henry ; for it was donn with all due respect of the Archbil hopes parte , and according to the lawes ecclesiastical , both of churche & realm . And as for the mannes behaueour and actions in the rest of his lyf , if we beleeue three or foure historiographers together , Vide apud Lippoman , & Surium Mense Decemb. of greate credit and sanctitie , that liued at the same tyme and conuersed with him , they were admirable in all kynd of vertue . His death was by wilfull murder , without iustice or commaundment of king or any magistrate , as all the world knoweth . His canonization was presently vpon his death by diligent inquiry of all factes and circumstances , and by vniuersal applause of all christendom . King Henry the second excused himself of the murder , admitted his canonization , builded his shryne and sepulcher , adorned the same with greate giftes , came thither in person , and not only denyed ( as I haue sayed ) that his intention euer extended to his murder , but also tooke seuere punishement and pennance of himself for the vniust wrath that by incitation of others he had conceyued agaynst so holy a man : Edoard in vita D. Thom● , cap. 26. K. H. his voluntarie penance . of which penance of the kings , one that liued at the same tyme and saw it , wryteth that he opened his naked shoulders at the sepulcher , and receyued first fyue ierkes at fyue Bishops handes , and fourescore and three at so many monks ●andes , and after lay on the bare ground , and other such circumstances , as in the author you may read .

All those that had byn enemies to the blessed man , or had had parte in his death , came after to greate miserie by Gods iust iudgmentes . And fynally , all the Christian world for these foure hundred yeares haue holden him for a glorious martir , and builded many a churche to God in his memorie , in other countries : many great mo●arches haue come to England of purpose to visit his sepulcher , and others haue sent great presentes and donaries . Many miracles haue ●yn recorded by graue authors and publique testimony of the whole ● land , to haue byn wrought by God at his sepulcher , in witnes of his ●anctitie . All these testimonies then being extant in the world for so many hundred yeares together , let any man iudge whether they ought ●ot to be of more weight with a wyse and pious Christian , then this ●raynles calumniation of a mad hasty hoat spurr , that knoweth ●ot what he sayth , and much lesse careth or indeuoureth how to proue it .

But let vs see now his third position that he feigneth to be among ●s , as a ground of religion . These two irreligious & prophane groundes ( saith he ) ●eing layd , though you haue seen that the knight hath layd them as fi●ions of his own & grownds of ours , they proceed to a third , The third feigned position . & set it down ●r a Popish ground also , that it was a dangerous and deadly sinne for any man 〈◊〉 disobey the Pope and his cleargie , in any of their orders inioyned and commanded : in such reuerence and regard must he and his cleargie be had , that the meanest● masse Priest comming with authority from him , Impudent calumniation . must be obeyed vnder payn of damnation , though he commaund that which is blasphemous before God in Christians , and disloyal to men in subiects .

This is his narration , from which if ye separate a manifest lye o● two with some fond exagerations ( for without this kynde of leui● the poore knight can make no batch ) as for example , that the Pope an● his Cleargie must be obeyed though they commaund blasphemies against God , and disloyalty against princes , which is a shameles slander , and that the disobedience ( if he speake of omission ) in any one order inioyned by Pope and Cleargie is a deadly sinn , and the lyke : if you separat● ( I say ) these ouer lauishings of the hastie knight ; all the rest he obiecteth is rather commendation of Catholique religion , then any reproche at all , for in that he saith wee obey the meanest preest as the highest , if he come with authoritie of the highest , he sheweth therby that we haue among vs true obedience and subordination , and tha● for conscience sake . Not respecting so much the person that commandeth , as him for whome , and in whose name and authoritie h● commandeth ; and therin we fulfill , the precept of S. Paule . Obedite pra●positis vestris & subiacete eis , Heb. 13. ipsi enim peruigilant , quasi rationem pro animabu● restris reddituri . Obey your Prelates and humble your selues vnto them ( he distinguisheth not betwene high and lowe ) for they keep diligent watche ouer your soules , as men that must render account thero● to God . And in other places he sayth , that this obedience must b● with such reuerence , humilitie , and inward affection , as vnto Chry●● himself , Ephes. 6. whose substitutes our spiritual superiours be , though neuer so mean or contemptible in mannes sight .

And again , S. Paul sayth , this obedience must be , non solum propte● iram , sed etiam propter conscientiam , Rom. 13. not only for feare of punishment , but also for conscience , that is vnder pain of deadly sinne , or of damnation , though this wise knight do iest at the phrase , which yet is the proper phrase of S. Paul himself in the same place , saying , qui autem resistu● damnationem sibi acquirunt , those that resist to obey , procure damnation to themselues . And this is answere sufficient for so ydle an obiection● that we obey the meanest masse Priest comming with authority of the highest , in which matter I could teach Sir Francis a spirituall poin● of doctrine , if he were capable of it , and most true , to witt , that the meaner the substitute is , that is obeyed in the name and place of any potent prince or superior , the greater honor is donn to the sayd prince or superior , and the greater vertue is argued therby to be in him that obeyeth , for that he is not induced by any talent or commendation of the sayd substitute to obey him , but only for loue , respect , and reuerence , of the partie whose authoritie he hath and in whose name he cometh , and by this way a catholique man that obeyeth a mean Priest comming in the Popes authoritie , or a mean qualified Pope comming with the authoritie of Christe , leeseth nothing , whatsoeuer the pride of heretiques do prattle to the contrary , and so much of this .

There remaineth then only the fourth grownd or position The fourth faigned position . to be examined ( for he would needs haue a whole mess of them ) and this he setteth down in these wordes following .

And hauing thus made an open passage without stop to the mark and matter they aimed at , & so hemmed men in , as they could not see which way to escape danger , but by them that layed the snare for them , they propound vnto them a mean of deliuerie from all dangers ( euen when they sinned immeditly against God ) which is a pardon from his holiness , Shameles lyinge . and absolution from his holy Priests . But if the decrees or ordinances of their Romish sinagogue were transgressed , hardly any mercy was to be had .

Thus writeh our knight if you will beleeue him , but hauing taken him trip , in so many falshoods , forgeries , and calumniations before , I presume that the discree● reader will giue credit to him and his assertions heerafter , by weight and measure , looking to his fingers as well as to his lips , as men vse to do when they deal with egyptians . Now then let vs examin what truth there is in this tale of his .

First and formost , who seeth not , how egregious a cauil it is , to say , Many cauiles and falshoodes . that Catholiques by teaching men to obey their superiors simply and ●or conscience sake , and vnder paine of sinne as you heard also S. Paul to teach , that thereby they do bring men into snares , Rom. 13. or hem them in as this mannes phrase is . By which argument he may prooue also , that God himself when he gaue the law to the Iewes , did hem them in to ●nares of sinne ; which yet the Apostle so vehemently confuteth in the ● . and 8. chapters of his epistle to the Romans . Secondly , it is a noto●ious vntruth to say , that the means we prescribe of deliuery from ●ll dangers of sinne , is the Popes pardon : and a far greater and more ●mpudent lye it is , when he addeth by a parenthesis ( euen when they sinn ●mmediatly against God ) for that the Catholique doctrine is cleer in this ●oint , that the Popes and Churches indulgences , Vide quest. 26 & 27. addit . 6. auayle not to remoue mortal sinnes , Tho. ad 3. p. & caet . tract. 9. opustul . de indulgentijs . but only are giuen where all such sinne , is already ●ardoned , by contrition and confession , and vertue of the Sacrament , ●nd that there remaineth only some temporall punishment in this or ●he next life to be remitted . Neither can the Pope pardon the guilt of sinne it self by any other way then by the means of the Sacrament of confession , and absolution ( which Sacrament hath his force of the blood of Christe ) as euerie ordinarie Priest authorised to heare confessions , may do the like .

And so thirdly , it is great ignorance in our knight if not malice , to ioine tog●ther ( as he doth ) the Popes pardon and the absolution of his holy Priests , which haue great difference in this matter ; for that the pardon stretcheth not to remit sinne it self ( as hath bin said ) but only the temporal paines depending of sinne , after it is remitted : but priests absolution in the Sacrament of confession is sufficient to remitt any sinne , Ioan. 20. if the penitent be contrite , according to comission giuen by Christe , quorum remiseritis peccata remittuntur eis , & quorum retinueritis retenta sunt , whose sinnes ye forgiue shal be forgiuen , and whose sinnes you shall retaine shal be reteined . So then absolution is a different matter from indulgence & pardon .

Fourthly , that the transgressions against the decrees and ordinance● of the Catholique church ( which wickedly he nameth the Romish Synagogue ) be more hardly forgiuen among vs , then greater sinnes and those namely that be immediatly comitted against God himself is a shameles slaunder , and neuer taught by any Catholique man i● the world , and so vnworthy to be further refuted .

Now then he hauing set down these four absurd grounds of religion in our name , feigned by himself , and accompanied with so many o●ther lies and falshoods , as you haue heard : you shall see how he maketh his conclusion , A fonde conclusion . and triumpheth as though he had donn somwhat of importance : these are his woords .

Thus haue you the blind cours they sought to hreed vs in , by debarring vs the cleer light of the holy written woord of God ; & the carelesnes they sought to settle in vs of all religion , by making it a thing impertinent to vs , as though we had no soule● to care for , &c.

This conclusion to him that hath red the former foolish positions with their confutations , may serue for some disporte● and recreation to behold how his seelie knight bestirreth himself vpon castles builded in the aire by himself , fals imaginations , & sotish apprehensions o● his owne , especially in a long ridiculous discours that he maketh immediately vpon these woords in his booke ; where imagining that al● goeth by pardons with vs , and that pardons may be had for mony , he inferreth that all rich men may easily be saued in our religion , without any difficulty : and yet sayth he , Christe taught vs , that it was a●●asy for a camel to pas thorogh a needles eye , as for a rich man to go● to heauen : & so he marueileth how these thinges can stand together .

To which I might answer , that it seemeth as easy to teach a beare to play vpon a taber , as to learn Sir Francis to be a good deuine , and that I would more easily take vpon me to make a camel to goe thorough any needles eye ( in the sence that Christe spake it ) or any rich man in the world to enter into heuen ( if he would follow my counsel ) then to frame Sir Francis old head to vnderstand the depth of Catholique doctrine . And therefore amiddest his doubts , I leaue him to his ministers , except he will resolue to be a catholique and goe to confession , for then his ghostly father , by the penance he may chaunce to en●oine vnto him , will let him see and feele that all goeth not by pardons , nor yet by money among vs . And that there is another more streight needles eye for him to enter ( seeing he is rich ) then the buying of pardons , if he will goe to heauen after the catholique manner ; to witt , by contrition , confession , and satisfaction , which God graunt him to do , for otherwise he will neuer come there , seeing that the open and easie cart way of only fayth , is far different from the needles eye and narow path that Christe speaketh of .

THE THIRD INCOVNTER , ABOVT GREAT PERILS SVPPOSED TO be wrought to her Maiestie by Catholiques , both in the tyme of Queen Marie and since . With the cleering of diuers particuler men that are slandered therin .

AS the principal marke that parasites do comonly shoot at with great Princes , is not only to handle pleasant and delightfull matter , to gain grace to themselues , but to mingle also biting stuff now and then , wherby to pinch and draw blood of their neighbours : so this gentle knight , hauing heaped many things together by ●atterie and forging , in the beginning of his booke , to claw thereby ●he present state & prince , as in the former two conferences you haue ●een : he entereth now vpon a more odious argument , to exasperate ●oth the one & the other against Catholiques , The malignitie of Sir Francis . whome he would gladly ●aue destroied , if the strength of his hornes , were according to the measure of his hatred . But he being but a barking beagle among the ●owndes of Huntington , though neuer so cruel and bloody mouthed I hope so to rebate his choller before I make an end , or at least-wise his force , as albeit he barke still yet shall he not much byte , nor doe any other effect of moment , then discouer the worme of heresie , that lyeth vnder his poisoned tongue , inciting him to furie and woodnes against Catholiques .

First then touching perils past by her Maiestie , during the reign of Qu. Marie , this gentleman writeth thus in recital of the same .

I hasten to put you in minde of our most blessed and happie delliuerance out of this spirituall pit and thraldom of popery and superstition , by ladie Queen Elizabeth , as the instrument : whose perill and danger before she came to that abilitie to performe this holy woorke among vs , I may not pass ouer ; for by Gods goodnesse only and wholy she was preserued , her life being malitiously and with great cunning shot at , by the Romish clergie , then in place of credit . For Gardener that most prowd and bloody monster , left no corner of his wit vnsought ( being wise enough to woorke mischief ) but set all his skil and cunning awoorke to shorten her dayes , and to preuent her by bloody slaughter of her sacred person , from euer being our Queen : and no reach of man can yeeld me a reason of her doliuerance , but the mighty God of power , &c.

In which woords you may see how our poet to make the succes of his feigned comedy more wonderfull and plausible , frameth strange mister●es and miracles of mil-wheeles , deuising mtghtie dangers and mayn perils auoyded without any means humane at all ; neither is there any reason able to be rendred to him of his riddle as himself affirmeth , but I shall indeuoure to solue both the one and the other and that without any miracle , by humane reason only if Sir Francis can vnderstand it , and now I begin .

That the state of lady Elizabeth now our Souereign Queen , The estate of Lady Elizabeth in Q. Maries tyme . was subiect to diuers suspitions and dangers during the reign of her sister Queen Marie , no man of discretion in matter of state will deny , or can greatly merueil at ; for she being the next heir to the crown , and her sister hauing no issue , nor any great probability euer to haue : and furthermore being presumed by many , to be inclined to a different religion , though she shewed it not , & that all the discontented of that state depended of her , and made their recours vnto her as to their rising sun & future hope ; no marueil though she was bad in ielousie , especially seeing the often and perilous attemptes of Wyate , Courtney , the Carews , Cobham , Throgmorton and the like , did seem to leane also that way ( for I will enter no further to discus those affaires ) and so did hold both the Queen and state in suspence and care . Which circumstances what daungers they are wont to bring to future pretenders , diuers examples vnder our former kings , and lastly that of the Queen of Scots in our days , may easily teach vs .

But that the life and blood of her grace at that day , should be so earnestly & malitiously sought after , by so many & so potent men and means , as this knight heer and in other places of his booke , doth affirm , and would haue beleeued , to witt , by Bishop Gardener then Chancelor , by B. Bonner , D. Story , and al the Catholique clergy by name : and furthermore by the King of Spayne himself & by all Spanyards ; by the Queen also then in gouernment , & consequently by her counsel and nobility with her , and by all catholiques together , who had power at that day to doe as they thought best , and no impediment either at home or from abroad ( that I know ) to let them in their ●●esignments , and yet all this notwithstanding , that nothing in this affaire so much desired should be effectuated ; this passeth indeed ( if it were true ) all rule of reason , and might set Cicero to schoole again , who teacheth in his thetoriques , for an euident for me of argument , that , qui potuit facere & voluit , fecit . he that both would and could doe a thing must needs be presumed to haue donn it . Which yet , in this our case holdeth not , as it seemeth , for that our knight affirming that the parties aforenamed would haue made away the Lady Elizabeth , and I assuring that they could ; yet is it euident that she was not , and ●herefore either I am deceiued in their power , or he in their willes , or some other secret cause must be sought out , which he will needs haue to be miracle , but I think it not necessary , and so shall indeuour to re●ell the mistery by way of reason if it may be .

First then , I doe not deny , but that the preseruation of Lady Elizabeths life in Queen Maries time , may be referred to the prouidence of ●lmightie God , as the first and principal cause , who aboue our reach ●or reasons to himself best knowne , doth dispose of all matters , but ●specialy of princes liues and states : yet deny I that no secondary or ●mmediate humane causes can be found to haue concurred also with ●his prouidence of God , as this our miracle-maker affirmeth : for I can ●ecount him diuers causes and those pregnant also , and potent , which ●id concur in those days to the preseruation of her grace , which being most euident and true , Causes of securitie to Lady Elizabeth in Q. Maries tyme . doe deliuer the case from all such necessity of miracle as this poore knight would perswade vnto vs .

And first of all was the age and yong years , bewty , felicity , meek●es , and other good graces and talents of the princesse her self , which ●rought much with all sortes of men , but especially with the Span●ardes , and other strangers , and aboue all with the yong king himself , as often his neerest about him at that day haue reported since . And namely the Duke of Feria while he was aliue , who being then but Count and sent Embassador from the king ( then lying in Flanders ) to visit Queen Marie , had such earnest and spetiall charge to visit and comfort the L. Princesse Elizabeth immediatly after his Embassage to the Queen , that all of the court of England merueiled at it and some perhaps did not greatly like of it , and in very deed the yong lady was so extraordinarily fauored , and affected by his Catholique Maiestie , and all his nobility present with him in England , as it is most base & barberous ingratitude in this sicophant to deny it now , and monstrous inciuility to accuse them of cruelty in this behalf , their affections being so notoriously known to the contrary in those times , and this was one cause and perhaps not the least of her graces safety .

Secondly , was the generall hope that moste men had of her graces being a Catholique , as then she bore herself both in woorde & deed , hearing two Masses among other things euery day , one for the quick , and the other for the dead , and receiuing no seruant lightly into her hows or seruice , nor retaining any towards her , but with this expres● condition , and many other signes and arguments that way .

Thirdly , was there a great reason of state , that stood mightely also for her graces safety at that tyme , in that if she had fayled , the next potent pretender seemed the Queen of Scots , them maried to the Dolphin and heir of France ; who by this means might haue come to be king of France , England , and Scotland together , which thing many English-men but more Spanish , could not abyde to hear of .

Now then , let our miracle-maker tel me , whether these be no reasons , and whether no reach of man can yeeld him any reason of her graces deliuerance . If his reach and insight in matters of state be no greater then this , it is no merueil though he be not of her Maiesties counsell , though he flatter neuer so deeply for it , and thus much may be said of her graces dangers in Queen Maries tyme . Let vs see now what hath happened since . This notable calumniator beginneth thus .

But when this our Soueraigne Lady Q. Elizabeth was fully possessed of this her princelie place , Wicked calumniations . and had the roiall diadem and crown , with the applause and liking of all true harted English-men , both nobles , clergie , and comons , as a due by right belonging vnto her ; then began Satan to rage , and his ministers to fret and chafe .

I would aske of this Sir knight , by whome was Queen Elizabeth put in possession of this her princely place , & by whose hands & helps receiued she this royal diadem ? was it by hands of protestants onely or principally , or of Catholiques ? he cannot say of protestants , for he nameth also heer the clergie ; whereof none of the principall ( that is of the Bishops that had hand in this worke ) was then a protestant ; and very few of the nobility , & far the less parte of the commonalty : now then could these men that were Catholiques , fret and chafe so soone , to see her Maiesty placed in the crown , wherin themselues had willingly and freely placed her , aduaunced her , crowned her , and a●ointed her , taken her othe of preseruing the lawes and priuileges , of ●he realm , and sworne fidelity to her agayn ? These calumniations of this carping knight are but tales of a tub , to intertain fools & igorant ●eople , that know not how matters passed at that day . But let vs ex●mine notwithstanding , some particulers of the hostilities which he ●lleageth : aduising first the reader by the way that if it be honorable ●o her Maiesty now ( as it is ) to be named sacred and anoynted , as the ●anderer himself seemeth also to take it , for that often he vseth the ●ermes , this also she hath only and wholy from the Catholiques , for ●hat protestants do not vse but rather do iest at the ceremony , calling ●t greazing , Leu. 4. & ● . Num. 35. 1. Reg. 19. 15. 16. 17. espetially in Priests , to whome yet first of al and principal●y this sacring and anointing by Gods ordenance was vsed , and afterwards to kings and princes by imitation only of Priestly dignity in ●his behalf : and these are the benifits her Maiestie hath receiued of Ca●holiques ; now to the hurts and perils obiected by this calumniator .

In the first place he bringeth in D. Story , About Doctor Storie . whome he titleth by the ●ame of a blood-sucker , as he called before B● Gardener , bloody monster ( for ●ou must note as he is light witted so is he foule mouthed also ) & he ●lleageth against D. Story , that he should say in the first parlament when he saw how matters were like to go in religion ) that if his counsell ●ad bin followed in Queen Maries tyme , they had stricken at the roote meaning ●ereby ( sayth this man ) the bereauing of our deer Souereign of her life : a bloody ●each of a bloody traitor , who afterward was brought by a good chance from be●nd the seas , indited , araigned , found guiltie , and condemned of treason , & recea●ed his iudgment at the seat of iustice , and was executed accordingly , as he was ●ell worthy at Tiburn : and so may all speed that wish to Queen El●zabeth as he ●d . Thus far the accuser .

In which narration , three things may be considered : first Doctor ●ories woords ; then the interpretation therof by this accuser ; and ●irdly the punishment which he suffered for them . And in all three ●u shall see more passion then truthe , and more rigor then reason , ● I be not deceaued , wherof let the reader be iudge with in●fferency .

For the woords themselues , they had neuer yet any other proof th● they were spoken , to my knowledge , but only that his enimies affirmed them ( to make him therby more odious ) when they had him in their power , and desired his destruction For I neuer heard that him●self confessed them , either in liberty , captiuitie , at the bar , or at his death , and that he should not speak them ( though he had though● them ) when Queen Elizabeth was now setled in her crown , as this K● affirmeth ( he being knowen to be wise and no fool ) all reason may induce vs to think and beleeue , seeing they could not serue to any purpose but to his own ruine .

But let vs suppose secondly , that he should speak them & say , th● he was sory they had not stricken at the roote of heresie it self in Queen Maries dayes ; why is it necessarie we should admit the bloody commentarie and heauy exposition only of his enemies ? and namely o● this his malignant accuser , who will needs haue him mean by those woords the bereauing of our dear Souereigns life ? was lady Elizabeth ( I pray you ) taken to be this roote of heresie in Queen Maries time being holden by most Catholiques to be no protestant at all , as befor● I haue shewed ? why might not D. Storie meane rather ( if he had spoken those woords ) of some Bacon , some Cecill , some Cook , som● Knoles , some Throgmorton , some Russel , & many other like , that were knowen protestants in Q. Maries time , supporters of others , and p●●ctitioners against the present state , and yet suffered , yea borne out by knowen Catholiques , whyle other poor coblers , clothiers , cariers , ● such like were punished ? at which manner of dealing I do confesse , tha● D. Storie being a man of zeal in his religion , Doctor Stories z●le and complaynt . misliked exceedingly a●● stormed also publiquely one day , before the Bishops & priuie Councell , in a publique consistory ( for that Councellors also for honours sake , and to protect their frends and kinred , would needs be inquisitors in that gouernment ) complaining grieuously of this abuse , in somuch as he would needs haue giuen ouer publiquely his office 〈◊〉 Commission in presence of all the rest of the inquisitors and Councellors together , for that some of the sayd Councell had opposed themselues against him about the apprehension of a certain gentleman heretique , which he took very vnkindly , and then indeed he● foretold them freely what would insew of this their partial manne● of proceeding . Wherby also it is much more probable that his complaint of the root of heresie remaining and not touched , was meant rather of the infected nobility and gentry , within the land ( in which number perhaps your brother the Earle and your self also ●id enter ) then of lady Elizabeth at that day , for that in deed she was not the root then , nor did the change of religion spring of her principally afterwards , but of those other inferior roots which I haue men●ioned .

But yet let vs graunt further , for arguments sake , that he did speak those woords as a Counseller , in those dayes , and that they might be wrested by probability also against the lady Elizabeth in Queen Maries time , A Counselour may speake freely . yet do I aske why should they be made treason or punished for such , in this Queens raign ? was not her Maiestie as subiect then , and the D. as a Counseller , and therby bound to speak freely that which ●he thought surest for his prince , and realme at that day ? it might argue perhaps some lack of tender affection to the lady ( and yet perhaps not that neither , seing the father in such a case , doth speak often times against his only sonne or daughter ) but treason in no rigor right or reason can it make no more then for a Counsellor in this Gouerment of her Maiestie that now is , to speak what he thinketh freely , about any person that may pretent to the crowne heerafter . Wherefore , though all this were true which this man aleadgeth ( as many arguments proue them to be fals ) yet D. Storie leauing afterward his coun●rie , & going ouer the seas either with licence or without ( when there was no statute to the contrary ) and being brought home again by force ●nd trechery of a shipman , that alured him into his ship , and so caried him away ; all this I say maketh neither treason , nor any other trespas of moment , in the sight of indiferent men , and consequently neither his hasty araignment , condemnation and execution vpon his return ●wherof this cruel harted knight triumpheth ) doth so much proue that he was guilty of great crymes , as that he had potent & passionate enemies ( as Christe had before Pilate , that by shoots & clamors sought his blood by any means whatsoeuer ) for that he had bin a more zelous catholique then some other of his coat and degree , in Queen Maries ●aign , fo● which catholique men think , that he is to receiue a great ●rown of glory and fame also eternall vpon earth . And so the trial of this matter lyeth stil in the darke to be examined by that great iudge when he cometh to look ouer the iudgments of mortall men and re●eal that which is amiss . And so much for this matter .

Next after D. stories affair , About the Bul. of Pius Quintus . commeth in the roaring Bull of Pius Quintus , with the excomunication of her Maiesty , which serueth for a ●ommon bugg against all catholiques euery where , as well at barres benches , and places of iustice , where other particuler and personal accusations do want , as also in pulpits , schooles , sermons , books , and declamations , for making vp the complet furniture of those places ; & still it is so vrged , as though all english catholiques must needs be guilty of this fact of the Pope , and so be participant also of the offence giuen therby against her Maiestie , if any way they beleeue or admit his Ecclesiastical Iurisdiction and authoritie ; which consequence notwithstanding is so apparently fals and cauillous in it self ( for that all catholiques were not priuie to Pius Quintus his reasons and informations in that behalf ) and it hath bin so euidently refuted heretofore , by diuers most cleer and manifest reasons and treatises , that I mean not to stand at this present vpon that point , especially with so silly a concurrent as this gentleman is , in matter of dispute : whose ridiculous proposition in this place , that no mortall child of man hath power to dispose of kingdoms , or to depose princes , or to dispence with subiects for not obeying &c. A ridiculous proposition . semeth to proceed not only of deep ignorance both in reason and storie , but of so base a brest also and seruile a cogitation , as if temporal kingdoms were matters of Godhead and immortality .

And no doubt , but if such a knight had liued in Nero or Caligula his time ( that would needs be Gods ) he had bin a fit fellow to fal down and adore them ; and tell the people most religiously , with both hand● held vp to heauen ( as he doth heer ) that no mortal childe of man had power to iudge of their doings ( being great and high princes ) or to deny them obedience in any matter hauing once sworne obedience in temporal affairs , for this is our case heer , whether a prince once admitted and established , may be towched afterwards or disobeied in any matter , or for any cause either of religion or otherwise , and that by any mortall childe of man , and our tender conscienced knight resolueth the case that he cannot , and consequently that the romanes did euill in disobeying such Emperors as would be Gods , and other mortal children of men for displacing of their princes once receiued , for what cause soeuer , for all this enseweth of his fond and heathenish position .

But let this Prince-idolater that professth to be a great Bible-clark , read ouer the four books of kinges , and he shal see how many kingdoms were disposed of and princes deposed by mortal children of men , and the same alowed also by God himself . And in our kingdom of England since it was a monarchie , both before and since the conquest , he 〈◊〉 ha● finde very many examples of mutations in like manner made by mortal children of men ( seing they are now dead that made them ) which yet he must approue for good and lawful , except he will impugne the succession of her Maiestie that now is , which is not likely , seeing the poore man flattreth so seriously with all the arte and power he can . And therfore leauing this matter as ouer long an argument for me to ●andle in this place , I shall only consider briefly of three points vpon this his speach , that may yeeld sufficient light to the matter in hand .

The first is , Three things considerable in this knights accusation . that wheras this accuser affirmeth the Catholiques of England to haue begun to fret and chafe against her Maiestie , as soon as she was in full possession of her crown , and consequently to practis treasons by the Pope of Rome , let it be noted out of our own chronicles , what year this Bull of Pius Qinutus came foorth , Anno Domini 1570. regni 13. and therby they shall see , how many years ( which were a dozen at the least ) passed after her Ma●esties coronation , befo●e any such thing was attempted by any of the Popes of Rome , so as this was not like to proceed of their maligning her Maiesties state and diadem , as this parasite pratleth , but vpon ●ome other cause giuen rather from England , as himself after page 57. of his libel confesseth in these woords : The king of Spain and Popes malice ( saith he ) to the Queen , is not for that she is daughter to king Henry the eight , and sister to Queen Marie , but because she hath banished the Pope that Antechriste of Rome ; &c. ergo the Q. began with the Pope , and the Pope not with her .

But secondly let it be considered , in what maner this banishment of the Pope was contriued , Incitation of Popes by the English Protestantes . & that in this time of peace between Rome and England , after the Queens entrance , what was donn at home by vs against the Pope , to stir him to this act of hostilitie . First , not only the whole body of religion was changed , that had indured aboue a thowsand years and this contrarie to expectation and promes , but diuers peculier statutes were made also , against the Bishop of Rome by ●ame , with the most spiteful and opprobrius woords & termes , that any malice of man could deuise : all the whole Catholique body of England enforced to sweare against him , and his authoritie by name , or els to incur most greeuous and capital damages : the like detestable othe was offered and repeated again and again to all such and as often as they were to take any degree of preferment within the land . All the clergie was deposed and depriued of liuings & libertie , only for adhering to the Popes religion , & the Bishops & other principal prelates of our land , committed to prisons , holds , and restraints , for the same cause , and there continued vnto their dying day , for that they refused to subscribe to so violent a statute . Then such as would leaue the realme or fle were inhibited , those that staied at home were inforced to participate , not only of these other , but also eating new deuised Sacrament b●ead against their consciences , condemned also and anathemazed by the lutherans , first founders of this new religion The Pope euery where was cried out of & reuiled , made a matter of scorne & infamy , not only in all sermons pulpits and conuenticles , but also in comedies pl●ies and interludes , by euery base and contemptible companion .

In the schooles of vniuersities most ridiculous propositions were set vp as paradoxes , Contemptuous proceeding . to be defended , that the Pope ( forsooth ) was Antechriste , the man of sinne talked of by S. Paule , and other like toyes . And that which moued perhaps more then all the rest , was that these things were not only practised & alowed of in England and Ireland subiect to her Maiestie ; but were begun to be introduced also by ou● meanes , that is , by the turbulent attempts and practises of protestants ( her Maiestie perhaps knowing litle therof ) in all the realmes and regions round about vs ; and namely in France , Flanders , and Scotland , where the warres , tumults , rebellions , deuisions , sects , heresies , and other outrages came to be so many and excessiue great , as the lawful● and naturàll princes of those contries , seeing themselues so far indomaged and highly endaungered therby , were inforced , first of all to complain vnto the Pope , as chief pastor and common father of all to vse such spirituall redresse , as he might for his party , in respect o● his ecclesiasticall souereigntie , whilest they prepared also to defend● themselues , and their troobled countries by force of armes .

Not malignitie then of the Pope and his adherents agaynst he● Maiesties crown and diadem ( wherunto willingly they had concur●● and assisted ) moued this first breach and bickering as this malignan● barking-whelp would beat into mens eares , but necessities of great●● violence inforced the same . And if perhaps we in England after the change made in religion , had taken that course which Protestants did in Germany , to follow our new opinions without gawling of others none of these open hostilities had euer insued . And let this stand fo● the second notandum , wherby is ouerthrown all this slanderous ca●lumniation of the kinght .

The third note may be to consider with indifferency what this ac● of the Popes excomunication is in it self , or how far it may in reason and iustice ( without malice and calumniation ) be streched against th● Catholique subiects of England .

In it self it was an act of iurisdiction between two superiours , The excomunication agaynst the Queene . th● one Ecclesiastical , the other temporal , wherin the subiects sentenc● or consent was neuer asked nor admitted .

Secondly , it was no new thing , for that we see and read that th● like hath happened often and vpon many occasions , between th● Bishops of Rome and diuers other great princes , common-wealthes Emperours , Kings , and monarchs , and sometymes also with kings of England , and of late with the king of France , as all the world knoweth . And yet the subiect is neither afflicted nor accused for it , nor ●nforced to change their old receaued beleef about the Popes autho●itie in such matters , though in that particuler fact for reuerence of ●heir naturall Prince , and dew respect in lyke manner to the other , ●hey will not medle , nor yet discuss the question whether the Pope ●ad iust reason or sufficient information whervpon to proceed , but with dutifull loue and honour to the one , and to the other , they chuse ●ather to commend the matter to almightie God , which is the only ●hing that resteth for a pious and dutiful subiect to perform in such ●ases , when two superiours shall disagree , vntill God by his goodnes ●hall determine the controuersy and bring all to some happie end , as ●e hath donn of late in France , where after the foresaied excomuni●ation by the see Apostolique , the same king hath receyued exceeding great fauours and benefytes from the same sea ; and Bishop , which almightie God graunt we may once see also in our countrie , to the con●entment of all parties , and therby all such hastie hoate-spurres as this ●s , who still would kindle more fier , and bring all to desperation may ●e reiected and put to silence .

And with this I might end the matter of her Maiesties perils , Other hostile actions obiected . were 〈◊〉 not that this playntiffe proceedeth on with a long rehersal of other ●ostile actions , committed ( as he sayth ) by English Catholiques also ●gaynst her Maiestie . As the rising of the two earles in the north , ●orthumberland and Westmerland ; the rebellion of diuers of the ●obilitie in Irland ; Doctor Sanders going thither , Mayster Francis ●hrogmortons practises in England , M. Charles Pagets going ●orth of the land , the other two earles , of Arundell , & Northumber●ands commitment , and the like . All which are ouer long to examine more in particuler , and all put together do weigh so litle in the matter we haue in hand , as by that which followeth shal appeare .

None of all these actions brake out to any hostilitie , sauing only ●he two earles rysing , and gathering their tenantes together in the ●orth , where yet there followed neither battayle nor bloodshed , and ●hey were no sooner almost together nor heard of at the courte , ●ut they were seuered agayn and retyred into Scotland & Flanders . And this is all the actual rysing , that hath byn among Catholiques within England during the raigne of fourtie yeares ; notwithstanding ●ll the pressures , vexations , dishonours , rapines , slaughters , impri●onments , and deaths which they haue suffered in this space , at the hands of Protestantes , Puritans , and Atheists for their religion . Which afflictions layd together haue byn more then euer subiecte● since England was a monarchie , suffered at home in this kynde .

Now then mark that which followeth . If we looke one our own chronicles , Of the patience of Catholiques . we shall scars finde any one Princes raigne ( though o● far fewer yeares then this ) euen when the people were all of one reli●gion , and none of these afflictions and pressures layd vpon them , bu● that many more commotions , troobles , and rebellions happened , then in this long tyme , and among so infinite exasperations haue insued . And if we looke vpon the short raignes of king Edward & Queen Mary , and the parte of king Henryes tyme after alteration in religion , there is no comparison . And whence cometh all this ( trow● you ) but of the singuler vertue and vnspeakeable patience of the Catholique subiectes of our tyme vnder her Maiestie , that haue liued and suffered all this with gronning only , and secret teares , without further breach to defend themselues , or reuenge ther iniuries .

And truly when forayn nations do both see and read the bloody list of lawes made against Catholiques and Catholique religion in England , within these forrtie yeares ; and do heare of the rigorous execution of thesame , together with the incredible molestations that therby are layed vpon so great and potent numbers of people , that lack no●●corage also to aduenture euen to death it self in fauor of their said religion , they rest astonished , and do wonder how either the countri●● can remayn voyd of continual tumults , or the prince free from infinit● dayly perils ; seing that desperation in such matters is the next dore to all extremities , especially the persecution beinge so rigorous and violent , so vniuersal and exorbitant , as infinite people are interessed and touched therby , either inmediatly by themselues , or in their children , seruantes , kinsfolkes , or frendes , whereupon fynallie they do greatly admire ( as I haue said ) the modestie , patience , and longanimitie of the English Catholiques . And so much the more , for that the Protestant when he is vnder and dis●auored , hath no patience at all , but breaketh out continually to most violent tumultes and rebellions .

If we do consider the deportement of the protestantes in Queen Maries tyme , The patience of Protestantes . and how euery moneth almost they had either rebellious or new turbulent practises against the state and Queen ( not being ashamed at length also by publique bookes to make all weomen incapable of royal gouernement ) a man would think this fellow very shameles , Goodmans booke . not to blush to make this discourse agaynst Catholiques , so soon after those broiles of his owne people . And yet these differences are to be noted in the cause , first that Q. Maryes gouernement dured but ●tle more then foure yeares , and this of her Maiestie hath donne fourty : ●en were the principal protestantes not touched nor pressed , but now ●o Catholiques at all is spared : they were restreyned only , from brining in of nouelties , these are forced to renounce their old religion , that ●om the first conuersion of the land they and their fathers haue profes●ed , and vowed to keep : they had few or no forrayn princes of their ●eligion round , about to geue them courage or assist●nce , these haue ●e most and strongest in Christendome , and yet are quiet : and this for England .

But if we passe our eye beyonde this litle Iland also , and consider ●hat reuel these frends of Sir Francis , though not of Saynt Francis , The reuels of forayne heretiques . ●aue made in other countries , since the beginning of their innoua●ions to witt in Germanie , France , Flandres , Poland , Swethland , Demnarke and Scotland , agaynst their true and lawful princes ; what ●rmies , campes , battayles , and insurrections , what desolation of coun●ries , cities , townes , and linages , they haue caused ; and what slaughter ●nd hauok of Christian blood they haue procured ; more impudent and ●idiculous will this clamor and exaggeration of our crowching knight ●eem to be , about two earles only , Northumb. Westmerl . that vpon feare of force gathered ●heir seruants , neighbours , and tenants together , and presently fled , ●nd of two or three other gentlemen , wherof the one was put to death ●or hauing a description of certaynes portes and hauens only found in ●is chamber , Fr. Throg . Char. Pag. and for that he had some intelligence with the Queene of Scottes and with Don Bernardin de Mendoza Embassador for the King of Spayne resident in England ( though nothings els could be proued against him ) the other went beyond the seas for that he could ●ot lyue with his conscience at home , and neuer hurted them since . And of two earles more committed , the one vpon suspition , and nothing proued against him , that was known before his piteous death , which God only knoweth how he came vnto : the other for flying first for his conscience , Northumb. Arundel . out of the realme ( he beeing taken on the sea and brought back again ) and after diuers yeares of imprisonment without any further matter layd to his charge was after condemned , principally if not onely for a Masse heard or caused to be said in the tower of London , which was such a treason as all his noble ancestors would haue byn glad to haue ben condemned for , & his posteritie may glori that he was : for that neuer Earle in England synce it was Christian was euer brought to the bar for such and so glorious and so holy a treason .

And to conclude all these accusations in deed layd together against English Catholiques are but very tryfles and triuial things , that dayly happen in moste quiet & peaceable commonwealthes , where no man is afflicted by the state at all . But that infinite greater and more haynous stirres and breaches haue not bin raysed within the space of fourtie yeares , where so deadly differences in religion , and so continual persecution against so great a body haue bin in vre ; this I say ( as I sayd before ) that to men of iudgement and indifferencie , and of experience in gouernment , is a maruelous wonder , and a moste famous canonization of the patience , magnanimitie , and fidelity of English Catholiques ; and her Maiestie and the realme are happy that they haue such subiects . And if they will not beleue me , let them but turn the leaf a litle against protestants , puritans , and other new sectaries , and restrain them from their desires , and pinch them with persecution , but a quarter of that they haue donn to Catholiques , and they shall se and feele by experience which kynde of people is more apte to obey , or to woork turmoiles and perils to their weal-publique and gouernours . And therby also will appear the vanitie and malice of this impertinent and spitefull slanderer , who endeth his inuectiue with these woords .

There is no end ( saith he ) with this people , their practises are pestilent , their perswasions perilous , their platforms traiterous , and to serue their turn they want not cunning to execute all : so violent they are in their vilanies and treasons , and so shameles they are in their falshoods and dissimulations . And again : by this taste you shal see the brutish vilanyes of our bastard countrimen , and vnderstand what iust cause there is to detest both the traitors and their treasons , &c.

To all which I answere , that a railing tongue vntied , is a wilde beast without a bridle , and to ruun after him with a cudgell , though at certain turnings many blowes and bastinadoes may be giuen him ( as in parte there hath bin I suppose to this man , by conuincing his falshoods , raylings and calnmniations ) yet is it a wearisom exercise euen to the giuer himself , and therefore I will let him runn , vntil wearied by his own furye , he become more calme , and enter into som more temperate cogitations , if not of truth and charity yet of christian honor and honestie , and with this I end our third incounter .

HASTINGES WACH-WORDE . THE FOVRTH INCOVNTER , ABOVT BISHOP GARDENER AND Cardinall Allen , by name , and of their vnwort●ie and slanderous vsage by this wachwoord-geuer .

THough against all Catholique people that come in his way , the tonge of this knight be very lauish & approbrious ( which neither proceedeth of chiualry nor yet of nobility ) yet two principal persons aboue others he seeketh chiefly to disgrace and wound in his discours , which are D. Gardener Bishop of winchester , and high Chauncellor of England in Queen Maries dayes , and Doctor Allen late Cardenall of Rome . Two such eminent subiects for Ecclesiasticall men , as setting a side the onlie difference of religion which made them vngrateful to the present state , our land hath not had lightly ●heir equales in many ages before . Both of them of high wits , The Comparison between Bishop Gardener , & Cardinall Allen . exqui●ite learning , and singuler good natures , both of rare vertues , the one ● chief Counseller to two great princes of our realme , the father and ●aughter , and the other fit to be Counsellor to any prince liuing , and was of councel to the highest consistorie in Christendom , Bishop Gardener was caried through great varietie of prosperous and aduerse ●ortune , and euer shewed himself superiour to them both , except once ●nly in his youth & prosperitie , when he went a litle astray by feare , ●ut sore repented it soon after . Cardinal Allen that neuer was in properitie at home , but trayned vp for the most parte of his dayes in ba●ishment , and in the disgrace and frowning countenance of his coun●rie , for religions sake , bare the same with incredible constancy and ●lacritie , and towards the end of his life was highly aduanced to ho●or for his vertue by forain potentates , as the world knoweth . B. Gardener was a maister and common tutor to English yong nobility ●n his dayes , and his hows a famous schoole of great mennes children ●n England . C. Allen was a publique father to all sortes of that age●nd to all degrees that left their country for religion , and he procured ●hem both howses and schooles in forain nations . The Bishop was ●beral and had much to giue of his owne while he was suffered to ●ossesse it ; the Cardinall though meaner in temporal wealth yet mu●ificent of mynd , and so much respected and credited by others that were richer then himself , that he gaue more perhaps in his dayes then the other was able of his own , according to that of the Apostle , qua● egentes , multos autem locupletantes , 2. Cor. 6. as poore , and yet inriching many others . And to be short , a peerlesse payre of prelates they were whyl● they liued , and full vnworthie to be thus bayted by the wyld tongu● of this slanderous backbyter , but let vs hear in particular what he● sayth of them .

Of Bishop Gardener you haue heard before his encomion or commendation , Of Bishop Gardener . where he saied . Gardener that most prowd and bloody monster left no corner of his witt vnsought , to shorten her Maiesties dayes , and preuent he● by the bloody slaughter of her sacred person , from being our Queen . And afterward agayn making his inuectiue against the Catholiques , that fo● conscience refuse to go to Church , he sayth thus .

The recusants of our age cannot professe nor make greater shew of loyalty and loue to our dread Souereign , neither can serue her outwardly with greater apparence of faithfulnes , nor can protest more deeply by woords and othes , their true and good meaning to her , then did Gardener , Bonner , and Tonstal , to her noble father and brother , which they did confirm by printed bookes . For Gardener did writ● his booke de vera obedientia , and Bonner added his epistle to it . And Tonst● published a flat treatise against the Pope . But when these two noble Princes wer● called to their last and euerlasting home and kingdom in heauen , and Queen Marie possessed the gouernment of this kingdom vpon earth , then Gardener did tear o● his glorious visour , and shewed himself in his right colours and shape ; for he an● his complices neuer rested till they had brought in the Spainard , and had matche● him in mariage with the Queen , by which they betrayed God , her , and the whol● realm .

This bloody intention by this linck thus strengthened , then cometh Gardener ou● publiquely in pulpit with this sentence , Rom. 13. hora est iam nos de somno surgere peruerting the sacred scripture most prophanely and blasphemously to his bl●ody purpose , &c. this far goeth the accusation .

And first here you see there is nothing but blood and bloodines , when he talketh of Bishop Gardener ; wherof I could greatly marueyl if this poor man followed either ryme or reason in any discourse that he maketh , for verely I beleeue , that if a man should aske any good natured Protestant that liued in Queen Maries tyme , and hath both wit to iudge , and indifferency to speake the truth without passion , he wil confesse that no one great man in that gouernment , was further of from blood and bloodines , or from crueltie and reuenge , then Bishop Gardener , Bishop Gardener his gentle nature . who was known to be a most ●ēder-harted and myld man in that behalf ; in so much that it was some tymes , and by some great personages obiected to him for no smale fault , to be euerfull o● ●●●●●●on in the office and charge that he then bare : yea to him especially it ●as imputed , that none of the greatest and most knowen Protestan●s in Queen Maries raigne ( and some of their names I haue men●●oned before ) were euer called to accompt , or put to trooble for ●ligion : which also was noted in diuers criminal great causes , and ●amely that of the lady Smith burned for killing her husband , the ●rd Sturton executed about Harguile , and the Duke of Nor●umberland beheaded for publique rebellion . All which three ( to ●aue others ) it is knowen that Bishop Gardener laboured earnestly ●r to saue their lyues , and this only vpon compassion , and he passed ● far in this behalf as he wauted not some rebuke for the same , espe●ally about the last , to wit the Duke , for whome he sued importun● , notwithstanding he had byn extremely misused and iniured by ●he sayd Duke in K. Edwards tyme ( or at least permitted by him to be ●iured by others ) as namely to be depriued of his dignitie & Bishop●ke , & held in the tower all the tyme of that gouernment , wherin the ●uke ruled all , but yet the duke being condemned to death , & knowing ●e gentle nature of the Bishop , & that he was nothing vindicatiue , he ●esolued to rely vpon him of all other men , & so made petition ( after sen●ce of death geuen agaynst him ) that he might speake only with the Bi●hop before his death , as well about matters concerning his soule ●nd conscience , as also for disposing of his other affaires . Which pe●tion being graunted , though somewhat hardly , by the Queen and ●ouncel , for that it had byn hindred by the Dukes aduersaries that ●new and feared in this case the Bishops tendernes of hart ; at last he ●as sent to the tower in the company of an other Councelor to be ●resent at their talke , who afterward recounted ( and I haue heard it ●om his own mouth ) the hartie teares that the said Bishop shed at ●e sight and conference with the Duke , who after much speech said ●o the Bishop towards the end with great affliction of mynd : My ●ood lord B. And is there no hope at all for me to liue , The Dukes speaches to Bishop Gardener . and to do ●ome pennance in the rest of my dayes for my sinnes past ? alas let me ●ue a litle longer , though it were but in a mous-hole . To which the Bishop answered , o my lord , I would God that any thing could haue ●ontented your grace but a kingdom , when you were at libertie and ●n prosperitier : and now also , I would it lay in my power to geue you ●his mous-hole , for I would allow you the best pallace I haue in the world to be your mous-hole , and I do offer to do for you what I can ●o●sibly . But yet for that your offence is great , & sentence is past a●aynst you , and your aduersaries are many , it shal be best for you to prouyde for the woorst , and especialie that you stand well with God in matters of conscience and religion , for to speake playnlie , it is mos● lykely that you must dye .

To that the Duke answered , that he would dispose him self , and desired he might haue a learned preest sent him for his confession , The Duke of North. religion . and spiritual confort . And as for religion ( sayd he ) you know ( my Lord B. ) that I can be of no other but of yours , which is the Catholique : for ● neuer was of any other in deed , nor euer so foolish as to beleeue any of that which we haue set vp in King Edwardes dayes , but only to vse the same to my owne purpose of ambition , for which God forgeue me , and so I meane to testifie publiquely at my death , for it is the truth , & so he did , and his confession was put forth in print , as the world knoweth , and at this day much of it extant in Stowes chronicle● B. Gardener went away with an afflicted hart for the Duke , & shed many a teare for him on the way as he returned , Stow . ●n . 1. Reg. Man●e . and presently went to the Queen and intreated so earnestly for him as he had ha● gayned her consent for his lyf , which so much terrified the Dukes aduersaries , as presently they got the Emperour Charles ( that was i● Flanders ) to wryte to the Queen a verie resolute and ernest letter that it was not safe for her nor the state , to pardon his lyf , and with that he was executed .

All which story I haue byn inforced to repeate a litle the more larger , therby to check the malignant speech of this our sicophan● knight , against so worthie a man , whome he will needes make ● bloody and cruel monster , and to haue sought malitiously the death of her Maiestie when she was Lady Elizabeth . Which was so fa● of from his condition and nature ( espetially she being at that tyme an obiect rather of loue and compassion then of enuy and hatred ) a● I dare say he doth him apparent and wilful wrong . Yet it may be , that he hath heard somewhat about the discouery of a certayn● bracelet , imputed to the Chancelor in examination of Sir Thomas Wiattes affayres and his complices . In which bracelet it was said that all the secretie of that conspiracie lay hidden , A mysterious bracelet . and that the Chancelor did pearse the matter further then others , which may be als● true , that point belonging then to his office and obligation , but that he euer vsed or vrged the knowledge gotten therof to the ladies peril , this Hastinges neither in hast nor by leasure will euer be able to proue . And so much of this poynt touching her Maiesties person .

Let vs examine the rest that he writeth of B. Gardener , some ● the woords were repeated before , but heer they are necessary again●● by reason of the commixion with that which followeth .

The recusants ( sayth he ) cannot professe more loyalty and loue to the Queen that now is , then did Gardener to her father and brother , writing a booke de vera obedientia , &c. But when these two noble princes were dead , and Queen Marie in the kingdom , then he did tear of his glorious vizard , for he and his compli●ces , neuer rested vntil they had brought in the Spanyard , and matched him with Queen Marie , by which they betrayed God , her , and the whole realme .

It seemeth that this poore seely man is either very ignorant in matters of our own realm , Of Bishop Gardeners fall . or very badly bent to tel manifest vntruthes . For who knoweth not , that albeit Bishop Gardener at the beginning of king Henryes defection from the church of Rome , being born away with the stream of the tyme , and with some feare of the kings violent proceeding , and not very full instructed perhaps in that controuersie of the Supremacie ( for that it was at the very first entrance to his Bishoprik after the fall of Cardinal Wolsey ) shaken also with the frailty of humane infirmity , he shronk with S. Peter , and stepped somwhat asyde in that booke of his , de vera obedientia , &c. But yet how soon he did recall himself agayn , and condemned his owne doing therin , and how much also he preuailed in secret with the king himself in that poynt of doctrine , you shall hear afterward by his own testimony . And as for king Edwards raigne , it is a flat fable and fiction which our knight telleth vs , of Bishop Gardeners following the sway also of that time : for it is well knowen , that he being one of the cheifest among those sixteen counsellors that were apoynted by king Henries testament , and earnest charge of mouth at his last hower , to gouern his sonne and realme , during the minoritie of the yong king , with expresse commaundement also of the dead king , that neither protector should be chosen , nor yet any poynt of Luthers , Zwinglius , or Caluins religion brought in , Bishop Gardener as a faithful counsellor striued what he could at the very first entrance , to haue both these orders of king Henry obserued . But ambition ouerbearing all , first a Protector within 40. howers after the kings death , and then soone after an innouation also of religion , was thrust vpon the realme , by violence of some that packed together for their gaines , more then for deuotion : which Bishop Gardener seeing and not able to resist , he spake his minde plainly touching religion , in a sermon before the yong king and councell vpon Saint Peters day ( which was but fiue moneths after king Edwards raign ) for which sermon , he was sent to the tower the morning after , and lay there prisoner all king Edwards time , and came not out , vntill Queen Marie at her first entrance into the tower of london when she was Queen , deliuered him and other catholique prisoners together , Sto anno 1. ●d 6. and how then doth our steel-brow-knight , write , that Bishop Gardener Hattered both father and sonne , and neuer shewed himself in religion vntil both of them were called to their last home , and Queen Marie entred the crown : let some frend blush for him if he haue not shame to do it himself .

Againe , it is as great an vntruth and as grosse ignorance besydes , to say , About bringing in the Spaniard in Q. Maries dayes . as this man doth , that Bishop Gardener and his complices brought in the Spaniard , and mached him in mariage with Queen Marie . For that euery childe acquaynted with that state knoweth or may learne , that Bishop Gardener was of the contrarie part or faction that fauored yong Edward Courtney the Earle of deuonshire , and would haue had him to Marie the Queen , whome Bishop Gardener had held for his spiritual childe in the tower all king Edwardes tyme . And now the matter was so far forward as the mariage was held for certayne , but that the contrarie syde and especially the Lord Paget , partly by the acquaintance and credit he had gotten with Charles the Emperor in Flanders during king Edwards tyme , and partely for the ielosie he had ( perhappes ) of B. Gardeners great affection to the Duke of Northumberland , his greatest enemie , who in king Edwards reigne had indeuored vtterly to disgrace him , they procured ( I say ) the said Emperors most earnest and effectual letters to the Queen , about her mariage with the Prince of Spayne , which they did so vrge to the sayd Queen , and with so many argumentes against Courtney ( espetially that he was neither sound in body nor religion ) as they got her consent , and subscription to the sayd letters of the Emperor . And then there was no further dealing to the contrary ; for that Queen Mary bore such exceeding loue and reuerence to the Emperor Charles her Cosin , as she would not fayl in her word geuen to him for all the world . Wherby we may imagin what a mortification Bishop Gardener and all the rest of his side that fauored Courtney did receaue by this change of the Queens will and purpose , and therby also perceyue the folly and temerite of this rashe accuser , who layeth to there charge the bringing in the Spaniard , which yet if they had donne , or had byn cause of that greatest and most honorable mariage , that for many ages hath byn in Christendom , and of greatest consequence , if issue had followed therof ; if this ( I saie ) bad byn so ( as it was not ) why did they betray therin both God , the Queen , and there countrie as this wise Censurer affirmeth , what grownds , what reason may there be aleaged of this triple treason ? God receiued by this mariage the strengthening of his true religon , the Queen got the greatest noblest , and richest husband that was extant in Europe , our countrie got many a thowsaud of Spanish treasure , without losse of any as heerafter shal be shewed . And wherin then stood this great offence ?

But let vs passe ouer these follies of our knight in matters of state for that perhaps his prayse and skyll is only in armes ; yet one point more must I examine , wherin he condemneth B. Gardener , and this is for his sermon made at S. Paules crosse , vpon the wordes of the Apostle to the Romanes , h●ra est iam nos de somno surgere . It is now high tyme for vs to ryse out of sleep , Rom. 13. the night hath gone before , the day is come , &c. and the rest that followeth there . All which sacred scripture this learned religious knight sayth very peremptorily , that it was most prophanely and blasphemously peruerted by the said Bishop , and that to bloody purposes , which we shal now à litle discusse .

This famous sermon was preached , as I sayd before , at Paules crosse , The Sermon of Bishop Gardener at Pauls Crosse. after the mariage was celebrated between the King and the Queen , who both were present at this speech of the Bishop nowe also hygh Chancelor , and there prsent in like maner both Cardinal Poole legate of the sea Apostolique , as also the Embassadors of the Emperor , french King , and other Princes , and a marueylous great learned and noble auditorie besydes , as euer perhaps was at any sermon in England before or after . The Chancelors discourse was , how long they had runne astray , and byn in darknes of diuision and stryfe among themselues , since first king Henry lefte the old troden path of his ancestors , kinges and Queenes of England in matters of religion , and brake from the vnion of the church of Rome , and of other catholique kingdomes round about him , and that now it was time to arise out of this sleep , and to looke about them .

And in this discours and sermon , the Chancellor vttered two principal thinges among other , that greatly moued the whole auditory .

The first was the hartie and humble accusation of himself for his ●all , and consenting to King Henryes will in that booke de vera obedien●tia , which he did vtter with so great vehemencie of spirit and abundance of teàres , as he could not goe forward , and was forced diuers tymes to make some pawses ; which in such an audience ( especially of strangers , also he being the cheefest person of the realme after the prince , we may imagin what a temporal shame and confusion it was vnto him , and how greatly it would moue the hearers and lookers on to see him make such an accusation of himself willingly , of his owne accord , without compulsion and with such earnestnes as he did . And that there was no fiction or dissimulation in this act of his , the end declared ; for when he fell sick afterward , and drew neer vnto his death , he desired that the passion of our Sauiour might be redde vnto him ; and when they came to the denial of Saynt Peter , and how after Christe had looked back vpon him , he went out and wepte bitterly ; the Bishop cried out and bid them stay there , Bishop Gardener his repeutance at his death . and see whether his sweet Sauiour wold vouchsafe also to looke back vpon him , and geue him some part of Saynt Peters teares , for ( sayth he ) negaui cum Petro , extui cum Petro sed nondum fleui amare cum Petro , I haue denied Christe with Peter ( meaning that subscription to the supremacie of king Henrie , I haue gone out with Peter ( meaning the participation of that schisme , but yet I haue not wepte bitterly with Peter ; so bitterly as I should do , and by often repetition of those woordes , and asking God sorgeuenes with cryes and syghes he intertayned himself vntill great floodes of teares came downe vpon him , and so gaue vp the ghost .

The second notable poynt which the Bishop vttered in this sermon , was concerning king Henrie the eight his lord and mayster , which moued the auditorie no lesse then the other . And this was that the sayd king a litle before his death , had dealt with him verie secretly and seriously , K. Henrie the 8. inclination to reconcile himselfe . to haue sent him to a certayne dyat in Germanie , vnder pretence to treat other matters , but in deed the cheef poynt should be , to seeke out some honorable way and meanes ( as from himself , and not from the king ) either by the Emperor , legat , popes Nuntio , or other fit instrument , to reconcyle him agayne to the church of Rome . And this the Bishop affirmed to be most true vpon his oath and fidelitie to God and the world , and to the memorie of the sayd king his master dead , whome he shewed to loue so tenderly and dearly , as he wepte most bitterly also in that place , for that this holie motion had not taken the effect he desired , attributing the let therof to Gods seuere iudgmentes , and to the great difficulties which the sayd king found of making that reconciliation with his honour and reputation , which temporal honour he lamented much that it was more regarded by the king and some that counselled him , then in so weightie a woork of eternall saluation ought to haue bin .

Thus then was the substance , and these were the circumstances of that sermon . Let vs now consider whether the theam he tooke , iam , hora est nos de somno surgere , were fit and to his purpose or no : or whether it were prophanely & blasphemously peruerted , as this wise gentleman affirmeth , who taketh vpon him to censure the matter .

First let it be considered , that if euer any man of our realm might take vpon him to talk of a sleep or dream in matters of our common-wealth , as a Counsellor , and of his own knowledge , Bishop Gardener might do it , which had seen such alterations both of religion and temporalityes within our land , such chopping and chaunging , such pulling down and setting vp , as he might fitly call the tyme a time of sleep or dream . For as in a sleep things are represented to a man confusedly , and out of hand they passe away , and contrarie representations come in their place , so had Bishop Gardener seen in the publique affaires of the realme , no lesse alterations of comicall and tragical acts , after he came to be a councellor .

For first he had seen his own king and maister , king Henry the eight , so earnest in the defence of the catholique faith , The sleepe and dreame noted by B. Gardener in England . & of the sea of Rome in perticuler , as he wrote a booke in defence therof , though he were disswaded by some of his counsell to do it , for reason of state . And after that again being to send this very man , Gardener ( then his secretarie ) to Rome for his Embassador , about soliciting of the diuorce between himself and Queen Catherine , he commanded him to tel the Pope and Colledge of Cardinales , that whatsoeuer they determined in that matter , he would accept it with all indifferencie , and euer be a most obedient childe of the Romane churche . And this commission he gaue him in the presence of Cardinal Wolsey , and yet soone after he saw the same king so chaunged , for the affection he bare to an other partie , as he brake with the Pope and churche of Rome , and pulled down the sayd Cardinal , and put to death two of the men that he esteemed most for vertue and learning of all his realme , or of any other forrain kingdome of Christendom , and whom he had loued before exceedingly , to wit , Doctor Fisher Bishop of Rochester , and Sir Thomas More Chancelor .

Again , Gardener had seen the same king wax weary soone after of the party , for whose loue he had first begun to make all those stirres , and to put her to death openly , and yet to continew his former breaches , and to run from one difficulty to an other , and from one inconuenience to an other , & neuer to stop the fountain from whence all this vnquietnes came . He had seen him also passe from on wife to another , to the number of six , dismissing some and putting others to death , according to the affection or disaffection which he bare to each of them for the time . He had seen him make diuers and different actes of parlament , Seem . Henr . 25. cap. 22. & ann. 28. cap. 7. & 17. in preiudice or preferment of his own children , now for their legitimation and inheritance , now for the contrarie , as by the statutes themselues yet extant in print , is euident to the world . And from the liking or disliking of his said wiues , he passed also to the liking or suspition of his own kinred , subiects , and familier fr●nds : of which he pulled downe so many , as by the stories may be seen . And Bishop Gardener was wont to say of him ( that knew him ful well ) that after he once left to loue that person , which by Gods law and mannes he was bound to loue aboue all others ( to wit , his first wife and Queen ) he neuer loued any person har●ely and constantly afterwards .

Moreouer , he had seen the poore king so combered , and troobled about matters of religion , K. Henries perplexitie about religion . as was pitiful to behold . For that on the one side the point of his spiritual Supremacy taken vp in his chole● against the Pope , seemed to touch his honor so neare , as he might not shew to yeeld any one iote therin : and consequently he was fain to put to death all such Catholiques as denyed the same , though otherwise he both loued and highly esteemed them● and on the other side , his iudgement and conscience in matters of the Catholique truthe against the protestants and all new sectaries , conuinced his conscience and vnderstanding , as he cleerly vttered in the statute of six articles which iudgement also enforced him to burne as many of that fide ● were conuicted .

And finally being wearied towards his later end , with these combats of conscience and honor , iudgement and passion , he conferre● with Bishop Gardener as you haue heard , about the mayn remedy and only sure redresse of all , which was his returning to the vnion of the Romane churche , and the rest of Christendome .

And besides all this , Bishop Gardener had seen the same afflicted king , brought to such streights and doubts in his later howers of life , about the weightiest affaires that he had in this world , as he could not tell what to determine ordayne or establish , for the securitie of his owne children , espe●ially of his only sonne prince Edward , tha● had but nyne yeares yet of age and for that cause was the father● hart more pe●siue about him . For first he was afeard to leaue any protector vnto him , remembring the euent of king Edward the four●● his children vnder their vncle protector the Duke of Glocester . And secondly , he was as greatly afeard and afflicted also to think , least after his death the perilous waues and fluddes of heresies should enter vpon him , by the very same gate that hymself had opened .

Whetfore both these poyntes he forbad expresly , and appoynted for execution therof sixteen gouernours , as I haue sayd , with equal authoritie , all in his opinion ( or the far greater parte ) very catholique . But he was no sooner dead , but all these orders of his were ouerthrowen , and a protector made , the third day after the kinges death , and sone after religion changed , and the law of six articles abrogated , and as litle regard had to king Henries will and ordinances , as if he had neuer byn king of this realme , or mayster to the breakers . And among other these changes , was displaced Gardener himself , one of the cheef of those sixteen appoynted for gouernours by king Henry , and not only thrust from all authoritie , but sent also to the tower of London prisoner , as before I haue shewed ; and other Catholique Lordes remoued in lyke manner from the Councel , for lyke endes and purposes .

Then began a new world of making new Lordes , The stirres in king Edwardes dayes . new Earles , new Marqueses , & new Dukes , & in deuiding great states offices & dignites in good felowship amonge themselues , & all in the name of the childe king ( though he were not yet crowned , nor three weekes past synce his fathers death ) New men also were called out of Germany , to wit ( Peter Martir and Martin Bucer two apostated friars with their wenches ) that had been Nunnes who must come to teache a new religion in England ; but with expresse condition to be indifferent to reache that sect & opinion , either of Luther , Swinglius , or Caluin , or other that should be determined and agreed vpon by the Parlament then in gathering together ; and so they were contented , and with that condition they were sent the one to Oxford , and the other to Cambrige . Then was the new English forme of seruice drawen out in hast by certayne of the Protectors chaplayns in Somerset place in London , not fully agreeing to any of the Captaynes doctrine aforesaid , but somewhat mingled of them all and much also of the Catholique ryte and forme , all which was approued soone after for apostolical and established by the lay part of the Parlament , ( for the cleargie reclaymed ) and all men inforced to sweate vnto it , and so for the old religion receaued by the vniuersal church , and continued in England for aboue a thousand years , and confirmed by so many miracles at the beginning , as S. Bede and other ancient authors do affirme , and allowed by the consent of all our learned English for so many ages , now was there a new religion deuised in corners & set vp by certayne obscure and hungrie fellowes in hast , within the space of two monethes , and authorized by a parlament of vnlearned lay men to be the rule of our saluation .

But in the meane space the Duke of Somerset now head of this church ( for that the childe king was at play & could think nothing of it ) attended principally to his temporall aduancement & to purchase good old land , and caused his seruantes to set forward the new religion , without troobling him therin , saying that all should be examined and approued afterward by the authoritie of the yong king , as trew head of the Church , and so it was .

Then followed great tumultes and rebellious in the realme , as also iarring and falling out of the great protestant Councellors among themselues . The protector first cut of the head of his brother the Admiral , and then the Earle of Warwicke cut of the head of the Protector , and diuers of his frendes , and made himself duke of Northumberland , and then plotted with the duke of Suffolke to cut of all king Henries children , and to bring in Suffolkes daughter and Northumberlandes sonne , as they did . For which soone after both their heades were cut of also by Queen Marie , and Catholique religion was restored agayne to the state wherin first it was , when king Henry her father began this tragedie , and first put all out of ioynt .

Thus passed the matter briefly , and all this Bishop Gardener had seen and passed through , and had plaied his parte in diuers actes , and pageantes , to wit , as an actor in the beginnyng and as a patient after , as hath byn shewed . And being now restored to his old estate agayne , and more ouer made Chancelour of the realme , and looking back vpon the dream past , had he not ( trow you ) iust cause to preache , hora iam est nos de somno surgere , it is tyme to aryse from sleep , wherin we haue slumbered these twenty yeares and more , in suche varietie of tossinges , and to walk with more light and stead fastenes for the tyme to come ? let it be left I say to the iudgment of euerie discreet reader , whether this theame & parable were fitly chosen and wel applied by B. Gardener or no , or rather blasphemously peruerted , as our Hunting deuyne Sir Francis wil needs haue it , and so much for this tyme of Bishop Gardener .

About C. Allen , Of Cardinal Allen . for that I haue byn ouer large in B. Gardeners affaires , I meane to be verie breef , & so much the breefer for that the matters obiected agaynst him by this accuser are very cauils , if we consider the substance of the thing it self ; for he sayth , that this English traytor , though he were a Cardinal at Rome and sworn to the Popes pantable hath sent from thence many slanderous and seditious pamphlets , and in one ( which was the treatise against the English execution of iustice ) he seemeth to wish that doctor Sanders and doctor Bristow , had spared to speak so much in defence of Pius Quintus Bul , agaynst her Maiestie , and yet he doubteth not to affirme , that these two learned men of ●reat zele and excellencie , had their special reasons to do so ; which he will neither desend nor reproue , &c.

And further he proceedeth ( sayth this man ) to excuse all the preestes and studentes beyond the seas , and all such as haue come ouer , and saith , that all of them ●ince that censure of his holinesse ( to vse ( sayth he ) his owne wordes ) did vse all ●euerence and respect to her Maiestie , vttering in no preaching , speach , or booke , ●o not at the houre of their death and martyrdome , nor euer before in any their confessions to the magistrate , any disloyal word agaynst her Maiestie .

These woordes recyteth Hastinges out of the discourse against their English iustice , as wordes of moderation , or rather blushing as he ●ermeth them , for that which was done before , and yet he sayth that ●n an other treatise of defence of Sir William Stanlies act in geuing ●uer Deuentrie to the king of Spayne , the Cardinal cometh to ●tter himself as far as either Sanders or Bristow , or any other , in approbation of the sayd excomunication ; which thing albeit this kinght ●o greatly condemne , yet cannot I any thing marueyle thereat ; considering that the Cardinals opinion ( being as he was ) could be no other in substance touching matters of controuersie , then was that of doctor Sanders , doctor Bristow , and the rest . And though for peace , ●●oderation , and edification , he liked wel in others , and specially ●n the yonger sorte of preestes , that they should auoyd all occasion of ●ateful speach in this odious controuersie , yet might he speake his mynd playnly ( being in the place and dignitie he was ) when occasion should be offered , which I shall indeuour to expresse more cleerly ●y the example following .

In a great and noble house , where there are many children of the ●elf same parentes , Why Doct. Allen . D Sande●s and other lyke might vtten their myndes more playnly . if those parentes do come to breach and to fall out ●etween them selues , what can the children do but besorowfull and ●ent , and sigh at such contentions , without taking willingly any ●arte , for that they loue , feare , and reuerence both the parties that ●●e fallen at debate for which respect also they dare not so much as to ●terpose ther iugdmentes and censures in the controuersie except they ●●e forced , and especially they onger sorte of children , who be fitter to ●eepe and morne such contentions , then to determine them with ●heir verdict : yet it is not so altogether with the elder brethren , that ●eing come to mannes estate , learned and wise , & seing the breach to grow greater daylie between their sayd parentes and superious , haue authoritie and right to speake more freely then the rest . And not only to intreat for peace , but to interpose also their iudgmentes ( though euer with due reuerence to both partes ) as wel in the question de iure as de facto ; that is to saie , not only to iudge and discerne where the greater authoritie or higher preeminence of commanding lyeth by right , either in the one parent or other , in the father or in the mother , but also in the particular fact about which they fell out , to wit , who had more reason then the other , or who was most in fault : which second point is much more hard & hatefull , & subiect to offence , then the first , & yet may discreet & louing children say their opinion also in that behalf , when need requireth , without breach of dew respect & dutie .

Euen so then standeth the case in this our controuersie . Her Maiestie being our Queene is therby also a mother , How the Q is ou● mother , and he Pope our father . and norisheth vs her subiectes as a carefull parent : the Bishop of Rome to al catholique men of the world is their spiritual father , that hath principal care of their soules by Gods commission ; and for such hath he euer byn taken , and is at this day in all the catholique states and kingdomes of Spayne● France● Italy● Germanie , Pooland and other prouinces , that hold the ancient beleef of Christendome . And so hath he byn held also by all our ancesters , kinges and Queenes , cleargie and temporaltie of England , for aboue a thousand yeares together But now our sayd two parente● are fallen at debate , for which all their Catholique subiectes , who are children to them both , are hartelie sorie , and do lament the case : all sortes of people commonly both lay men & preestes within England , do hold their peace and sobbe at the matter as yonger children , and do only attend to praie to God for their good attonement , and so do the rest also that are abroad in other nations . But yet if doctor Sanders , doctor Bristow , doctor Stapleton , doctor Allen , and such lyke , that are men of greater learning , antiquitie , and iudgment , and elder brethre● among the rest , if these men ( I say ) do put in their iudgmentes concerning this controuersie of their parentes , as wel de iure , as de facto● that is , do tell first what authoritie and iurisdicton either temporal o● spiritual each one of these two parentes and superiors haue , & wherin they are or ought to be subordinate the one to the other : and secondly de facto ipso if the falling out it selfe do insinuate where and by whome the cause of this breach and discord was first or principally offered , and which parte hath most fault in this contention and disagreement ; if they do this ( I saie ) as any subiect may do in any other Catholique kingdome of the world , without offence in lyke controuersies , between his prince and the Pope , why should this acte be made so haynous a cryme by this our skolding knight , as to call so worthy a man ( as our late Cardinal was ) an archtraytor , a tugling compagnion , a shameles dissembling lyer , that villanously stuffeth his booke with blasphemous slanders , diuelish persuati ns , and impudent lyes agaynst her Maiestie ? Let all men iudge of this mannes immodestie .

THE FIFTH INCOVNTER , ABOVT IESVITES AND FATHER Persons in particuler , whether they seeke the Queens blood , as Sir Francis affirmeth .

FOR the grownd and foundation of all that is to be examined and discussed in this conference and incounter , I shal first set down the accusation of Sir Francis , in his own woords , which are these that insew .

I do not heare ( sayth he ) that the Popes holinesse is so purged from ambition , or so reconciled to religion , as he meaneth not to continew his clayme for the Supremacie , or will cease to setle the dre●ges of his poyson and superstitious doctrine among vs . I cannot perceiue that the thirst of Parsons , and his pew fellowes , is yet quenched , for seeking the blood of our deare Souereigne , and in her the destruction of vs all , the cause remayning still for which heertofore they haue sought it , &c.

This is the knightes narration or rather calumniation , fraught ( as you see ) with his ordinarie tearmes of dregges , poyson , and bloodshed , with which his accustomed knightly speach is wont to be ●awfed . Wherin so much as concerneth the Popes holinsse , sbalbe considered of more amply afterward , in a perticuler conference that we are to haue about his holinesse actions , authority , and iurisdiction .

Now only is to be noted the fond and ridiculous manner of Sir Francis fantastical writing , Sir Francis ridiculous . telling vs very grauely that he doth not yet hear ( for belyke the poore man doth much hearken after it ) that the Popes holinesse is so purged yet of ambition , or so reconciled to protestants religion , as he meaneth to leaue of his old clayme of spiritual Supremacie ouer England , or his indeuoring to setle Romish doctrine among vs ( for I omit willingly the tearmes of dregges and poyson , as more fit and proper to Sir Francis dish , who feedeth vpon so many old heresies , condemned for poysoned dregges , by Gods Catholique churche for so many ages past ) and this tale of Sir Francis , is no lesse ridicul●●● and childish , then if he should say to any temporal prince , or to the Queen of England her self , that he seeth not her Maiestie so purged yet from ambition , as to leaue of her claym of commaundry ouer all her tealm , or of setling iustice in her name throughout her dominions , for that no lesse proper and essential to the Popes office and state , is Ecclesiastical Supremacie ouer all christian nations in Ecclesiastical matters ( as after more particulerly shal be proued ) then to her Maiestie the commaundrie ouer England , in temporal affaires . And as to her Maiestie by vertue of her royal authoritie it apperteineth and incumbeth , to setle and mainteyn iustice throughout her realmes , so to the Popes pastoral and Apostolical authoritie is annexed the obligation of preaching , and setling his doctrine ( by himself or others ) throughout all Christian states and kingdomes or that may be christian , which obligation groweth by that great and high commission giuen to Saynt Peter , in special manner aboue all other Apostles ( as after shal be demonstred ) by Christe him self ouer all christian soules , in these wordes thryce repeated : pasce oues meas , pasce agnos meos , Ioan. v●t . feed my sheep , and feed my lambes . Which feeding he could not performe , nor can his s●ccessors , but by doctrine to all , and gouerment ouer all .

And therefore whensoeuer Sir Francis ( sitting in his wache ) shall discouer or heare , that the Popes holines leaueth of this clayme of Ecclesiastical Supremacie , or is so purged as he becommeth a Protestant ( which none euer yet was , nor wil be by all liklyhood ) let Sir Francis know , that he leaueth also to be Pope ; and whensoeuer he ceaseth to indeuor the establishing of his Roman , vniuersal , & catholique doctrine in England , or any other countrie els , where sheep or lambes of Christ are , or may be had , there he ceaseth also to performe the dutie , for which the Popedome or principal See was ordayned by our Saueour . And consequently a very impertinent and childish discourse was this of Sir Francis , about his holines purgation , and reconciliation to Protestantes religion . Let vs see ( if you please ) the rest concerning father Persons and his pewfellowes ( as he scornfully calleth them ) whome albeit he slandereth falsly in the imputations layd agaynst them , about seeking the Queens blood , yet doth he much honour them all , in ioyning them in slander and calumniation with the Pope himself .

First of all then , for that it seemeth that by father persons pewfellowes , this pleasant gentleman vnderstandeth those of his order & societie , knowen commonly by the name of Iesuites I shall first treate somewhat of them , About Iesuites in general and their contradictors . and their estate and doinges in general , and afterward descend to father Persons more in particuler , though moderatly of them both , in regard of the frendship that for many yeares I haue held with them , and least any man should attribute the thinges I am to say , rather to affection , then iudgement in this behalf .

Notorious it is to them that haue experience in the affayres of our dayes , and much more that trauayle through diuers countries , and do weigh with iudgement what passeth in the world , that these kynd of men ( I meane the Iesuites ) as they are greatly loued and esteemed by most catholiques , so haue they many aduersaries and maligners also , & those not only such as in matters of fayth and opinion do dissent from them , both Heathen , Turke , Heretique , Atheist , Infidel , and other lyke ( that all ioyntely do band agaynst them ) but diuers others also of catholique profession , for other causes ; so as it seemeth , that to them may be applied not vnfitly , that saying of the Roman Iewes to Saynt Paule , when they spake of Christian religion newly begun de secta hac notum est nobis quia vbique ei contradicitur . Act. 28. This only we know of this new sect of Christians , that euerie where there is contradiction made agaynst it , to wit , by Iewes , gentils , philosophers , astronomers , necromantes , heretiques , vitious and deuyded Christians , and other the lyke , and to say the truth , it was no euil signe ( though vttered by enemies ) of the excellencie of the thing it self , for so do diuers ancient fathers gather in their apologie for the Christian cause , agaynst the heathens , that obiected this matter ; they gather , I say ( and namely Saynt Iustine Martyr , Iustin. apol. 2. ad Anton. Pium. Tert. apol. aduersus gentes . and Tertullian ) the great perfection of true Christian and catholique doctrine , by this general contradiction made of all handes agaynst it , and this partly for that truthe is one , and errors many , and that excellent thinges haue euer many difficulties , and that Christe foretold this , & finally , for that the trial of gold by many and strong fyers , sheweth it to be pure , if it abyde and beare them all ; in which sence the holie ghost sayd of the iust man Certamen forte dedit ille Deus , vt vinceret , Sap. 10. God hath geuen him a strong battell , to the end he might win , and therby his victorie to be the greater . And king Dauid speaking in the same sence of himself , and other seruantes of God , Psalm. 79. 7. complayneth sweetly : Posuisti nos in contradictionem vicinis nostris , thou hast put vs in contradiction euen to our owne neighbours , that is , to them that make the same profession also of thy seruice with vs : and finally of Christ himself it was foretold : Eccepositus est in signum cui contradicetur , Luc. ● . Isai. 8. behold he is put for a signe agaynst the which great contradiction shall be made ; which in his passion was cheefly seen , whereof Saynt Paule speaking to the Hebrue Christians , Heb. 12. sayd : Thinke of him which did suffer with patience so greate a contradiction of sinners agaynst himself , and he not wearie , nor faynt harted in lyke occasions . Causes of tribulations to Gods seruantes . This then perhaps may be some cause of so manyfold contradictions , by sondry sortes of men at this day , agaynst the Iesuits , if as they beare the name so also they draw neare to the lyfe & steppes of Iesus their mayster , whose particuler badge and liuery seemeth to haue byn euer that his nearest followers and dearest frendes should haue most contradiction in this lyfe , for so the lyfe of all his Sayntes do testifie , which is nothing els , but a rehersal of their contradictions and difficulties , and himself discusseth the matter very largely in Saynt Iohns Gospel , where hauing shewed extreme loue to his Apostles and disciples , and sayd , that now they were no more seruantes to him , but rather frendes , for that he had imparted with them all his secrets , he telleth them this secret also for the vpshot of all , about contradiction and opposition of the world : Ioan. 18. If the world hate you ( sayth he ) know ye that it hated me before you , if you were of the world , the world would loue that which is his owne , but for that you are not of the world , and I haue chosen you out of the world , therfore the world hateth you , remember the saying which I was wont to vse vnto you , that the seruant is not greater then his mayster . Thus Christ in familiar and confident speech to his best beloued : in which sence also he sayd after his resurrection to Ananias , about Saynt Paule , when he had chosen him to be his fauoryte : vas electionis est mihi , Act. 9. &c. ego ille ostendam , quanta oporteat eum pati , pro nomine meo . He is a chosen vessel vnto me , and I will shew him how great matters he must suffer for my name , and so he did afterward , laying so many contradictions and tribulations vpon him , from all handes , as the poore man could not tell which way to turne him : vt taederet etiam viuere , 2. Cor. 1. that he was wearie euen of his lyf : for that on one syde the Iew , of another the Gentill pursued him , of an other false brethren betrayed him , of an other heretiques made diuisions , of an other seditious Christians raysed factions agaynst him , and added pressures to his chaynes , of an other syde wordly Christians waxed wearie and forsook him as himself complayneth .

And for that our age also wanteth not of the same qualitie of men for exercise of such as professe the same occupation of seeking soules that S. Paule did , Dyuers sortes of contradictors of Iesuits . it is no maruayle though the Iesuites do fynde the same effects ; for albeit Iewes and Gentils do not trouble them so much now as they did S. Paule ( though also they want not their contradictions and persecutions also in diuers places of the world where they bestow their labours ) yet all the rest of the good fellowes before mentioned our age hath them in aboundance , for as for those that make diuision , saying : 1. Cor. 1. Ego sum Pauli , ego Apollo , ego Cephae . I am of Luther , I am of Calu● , 1. Timoth. 1● as also others qui circa fidem naufragau●runt ( as S. Paule sayth ) that haue made shipwrak in matters of their fayth , we haue greater store and varietie of them and much more cunning , diligent , and spitefull they are , agaynst such earnest Catholiques as Iesuites be , then were those heretiques of S. Paules tyme , though they were troublesome enough .

Furthermore for falsi fratres false brethren wherof he complayned , 2. Cor. 11. to wit , false harted catholiques which either of cowardnes , coldnes , lak of zeale , of constancie or confidence , do betray the cause , and the best frends therof , the store is also great . Moreouer there want not many a Diotrephes , 1. Ioan. 2. qui principatum in Ecclesia amantes , verbis malignis garriunt , as Saint Iohn complayneth , such , as to be of more authority themselues , they talke malignantly of others . Many also of that generation who of malice endeuour , Philip. 1. suscitare pressuram fratrum vinculis , to stir vp pressure and more acerbitie to the tribulation of their owne brethren , 1. Timoth. 1. sondry like Hymenaeus and Alexander repellentes bonam conscientiam , that cast of all care of a good and godly conscience , falling to vice , wickednes and dissolution of life , and these also presently become enemyes of Iesuites , as the other were of Saint Paule , for that their manner of life is contrary . Many a Demas in like manner is found , 2. Timoth. 4. qui diligunt saeculum , who loue the world , and for this loue , not only do break from good men , as Demas did from Saynt Paule , but also do slaunder , calumniate , and speak euil of them , least it might seem that without iust cause they broke from them , and left their frendship . And finally many causes there be , which do procure hatred and emulation at this day vnto Iesuites , which may be vnderstood in part by this which hath bin said , but yet for more perspecuity I will reduce all to three general heads , which are , their rule and profession , their learning and doctrine , their life and conuersation .

The first , Profession of Iesuites . touching their rule , institute , and profession , is the same in substance which all other religions haue , to wit , three essential vowes , leading to perfection , by obedience , chastitie , and voluntarie pouertie , against our three sworne enemyes , the flesh , the world , and the deuil , 1. Ioan. ● . and against their three squadrons mentioned by Saint Iohn , the concupicence of the flesh , the concupicence of the eyes , and pryde of life . Some particularities also are added for more restraint , and for the necessities of these times , by their first founder Ignatius , as that they vow particulerly to go to all partes and places of the world in missions , for gayning of soules , where they shal be sent : that they can neither seek nor accept of any wordly preferments , or dignities whatsoeuer , vnles it be layd vpon them by such a superior as may force them to take it vnder payn of mortall sinne , which is only the Pope : that they must teach and preach freely , without taking any reward or recompence at all , that they may accept the charge of schooles , vniuersities , and colleges for the aduauncement of learning and pietie , of which poyntes , some may breed them emulation ( as you see ) of our own people , as the other , much hatred , feare , and contradiction of heretiques , besides a certayn malignant spirit that some haue naturally against religious life ( though otherwise catholiques in opinion ) thinking that cours and habit to condemn theirs of imperfection , wherof you may see more for auncient times , in those three books that Saint Chrisostom wrote in his dayes , Chrysost. Tom. 5. & hom. 2. de vit. monach. Basil. serm. de institut . monachi . Nazianz. ●rat . 1. in Iulian. Apostat . aduersus vitae monasticae vituperatores , against the reprehenders of monastical life : and Saint Basil and Saint Nazianzen , do often treat the same argument . And for later ages you may discouer the same spirit against the most excellent and holy religious orders of Saint Dominik and Saint Francis , when they first began , as is set down by Saynt Thomas of Aquin , in his treatise contra impugnantes religionem , against the impugners of religion , and by Saint Bonauenture of the same age , in his apologia pauperum , the apologie for poore men . And this very spirit dureth also in our dayes , in such as either haue not their passions sufficiently mortified ( whereby they are not greatly deuoted to pietie ) or otherwise do suffer themselues to be deceiued by heretiques or other enemyes .

The second poynt , Iesuits doctrine . concerning the learning and doctrine of Iesuit● ( which is knowen to be much and very catholique ) bringeth in also the lyke effects agaynst them , for that by the first , they incur easely emutation of their frendes , and by the second open hostilitie of their enemies , so as by experience they fynde the saying of the wiseman to be true , Eccles. 1. qui addit scientiam , addit laborem , he that multiplieth knowledge , multiplieth paynes , but yet these mennes rule & profession bynding them to this kynde of holy trade and exercyse , to instruct men to their saluation , they must not be wearied with any difficulties or contradictions , but rather hold out , and expect the reward set downe by God himself in the prophet Daniel : Dan. 12. Fulgebunt qua●● stella in perpetuas aternitates , qui erudiunt ad iustitiam multos : they shal shyn● as starres for euerlasting eternities , &c. that instruct many to iustice .

There resteth the third thing , which is the lyfe and conuersation of Iesuites , The name lisfe and conuersation of Iesuits . called into question in this place by Sir Francis , and by many other in other places , vpon preiudice only ( as it seemeth ) of their name made odious by their enemies , without particuler offences alleaged agaynst them , so as it is enough with these men to saye he is a Iesuit , to discredit him , though personal crime ther be none agaynst him , and the reason of this seemeth to be , for that heretiques and diuers other weake and passionate Christians ( or scandalous catholiques ) ioyning together in these out dayes , haue made a certayne league and conspiracie agaynst this name of Iesuites , as Saynt Iustine the martyr sayd to the enemies of the Christian name in his tyme : Iustin. apol. 2. ad Imp. Anton. In nobis ( sayth he ) nomen accipitis pro crimine , you punish in vs our name for trespasse , which iniurious dealing Tertullian refuteth very amply soone after Saynt Iustine , in the three first chapters of his apologetious : Tert. apol. si nominis odium est ( sayth he ) quis nominum reatus , quae accusatio vocabulorum , nisi aut barbarum quid sonent , aut infaustum , aut maledicum , aut impudicum ? If the hatred be agaynst the name , what guilt can be in woordes , what accusation agaynst names , except they sound some barbarous thing , or signifie some vnlucky slaunderous , or filthie matter ? which these wordes do not , but rather the contrarie .

Toplif the preest-tyrant of famous memorie in putting them to death , Top liffe the preestqueller . is accustomed diligently to put vp in his slaunders when he bringeth them to the gallowes ( to do it with the more solennitie , such a one traytor Iesuit , as though the fiction only of this name Iesūit were a sufficient condemnation of the partie , and cleering of the quest that condemned him , though often tymes it falleth out that neither is he Iesuit , nor euer was .

In France a yong man that sometymes had studied in the Iesuites schooles of Paris , Ihon Chattel in France an. 1594. offred to kil the king . was found afterward to offer violence to the kinges person that now is , he was examined vpon the torture , whether any Iesuit liuing , had geuen him councel , courage , or instruction in that acte , or was priuie to his intention , which constantly he denyed ; the lyke did his father who also was put to torture , and the same did Ioannes Garetius his mayster , vpon lyke torture , and so was deliuered , and by publique testimonie of the magistrate declared to be innocent . Yet another reader of the same order called Iohannes Ghineardus was put to death for that in his studdy was found the question discussed on both partes without resolution , Ioanes Ghineardus martyred . vtrum liceat aliquo in casu occidere tyrannum , whether in any case it be lawful to kil a tyrant , which question notwithstanding euerie where handled by all diuines in printed bookes , allowed by all learned men both heretiques and Catholiques , and red publiquely in all famous schooles , and Cicero in his booke of offices handled it , Cic. lib. 2. off . D. Tho. 2. sent. dist. 44. art. 2. & de Regim . principum cap. 6 Caet . in D. Thom. 2. secundae q. 64. art. 3. Sot . de iust . lib. 5. q. 1. art. 4. before Christian religion was begonne , and synce him among Christians Saynt Thomas , Caietan , Sorus , and all other scholastical deuines all which this innocent man said truly at his death might as iustely be pulled out of their graues and burned for the doctrin as he hanged for hauing the question handled in his studie , and yet was he made a way , and vpon this preiudice synce that tyme conceaued agaynst the name of Iesuites made odious by heretiques , and by such as adhere vnto them ( as though all were malefactors ) haue there diuers general decrees of persecution byn set downe against the whole order in that kingdome , without any other proof of particularitie agaynst them at all then I haue heere rehearsed , which manner of proceeding if Tertullian did so much mislyke in heathens , how much more would he condemne it in Christians agaynst Christians if now he were alyue agayne .

But to proceede in this matter of Iesuites lyues I might aske and vrge as the same Tertullian doth in lyke accusations , who accuseth ? what alleageth he ? Diuers enemies of Iesuites . what hath ener byn found agaynst them ? let it be vttered and layed open to the world ; hostes eorum ( sayth he ) tum extranei , tum domestici , their enemies be both forayne and domestical , they are wached , they are pried on , they are besette ; error , malice , enuy , hatred , emulation vice synne , dissolution of lyfe are soldiiars agaynst them and spies waching must diligently at their dores , what haue they found ? what haue they brought out ? if same only be persecuted agaynst them , fama mendax ( saith he ) quae ne tunc quoque cum aliquid veri affert sine mendacij vitio est detrahens , adijciens , demutans de veritate , Tertul. Apolog. cap. 8. fame of her nature is geuen to lying , and euen then when it telleth some truthe , it ● seth not to passe without some parte of lying , detracting , adding and changing somewhat of the synceritie of truthe it self . O quanta illius praesidis gloria esset , qui aliquem eruret , q●i centum iam infantes comedisset . Cap. 2. O what a glory would it be to any president or iudge that should bring forth a Christian that had eaten a hundreth iufantes , in his dayes for that Christians were commonly charged to eate infantes flesh in their meetinges & cōmuniōs , which yet of Caluins bare bread would neuer haue byn suspected : And as Tertulian said this of the callumniations agaynst Christians so may we of no lesse false and malitious agaynst Iesuites , but yet let vs see a litle further in this affaire .

Among all other aduersaries that Iesuites haue , one is so domestical , as they haue bin of their own body , for diuers yeares , I mean of their order and profession and for their defects are dismissed by a special priueledge which these religious men haue for their conseruation aboue other orders , and these men often times become the greatest opposites of all others , quia ex illis exierunt , & ex illis non erant , Apostatical Iesuites . Ioan. 3. they went from them and were not of them , nor had their true spirit and vnction , and some of them also goe so far as by litle and litle they become playn heritiques and apostataes , or dissolute of life , and of these also their want not perhaps some at this day among you , & of yours ( Sir Francis , for of such ragges you make the pillers of your new churche ) let them be examined what they can say in this behalfe , of life and manners against lesuites , what they haue seen , what they haue proued , what they haue felt , Deut. 32. & fiant enimici iudices , let their enemies be iudges .

The holy martir of Christe Saint Iustine , that liued before Tertullian , euen in the first feruor of persecution against good Christians , vseth an argument for their defence in life and manners ( notwithstanding their many slaunders raised against them ) which seemeth to me may be vsed also fitly in this defence of Iesuites : his words be these .

When I was a scholer ( sayth he ) in Plato his schoole , Iustinus Apolog. prima . and delighted with that doctrine , and heard that Christians were accused euerie where of euil lyfe , & yet saw otherwise that they went to dye willingly and liued poorly , and feared not those thinges which to other men are most horrible ; I began to think with my self , that is was impossible for those men to be vitious and geuen to pleasures of the world , for then would they be loth to dye , and to be depriued of their saied pleasures .

Thus argued he , and we may do the lyke of Iesuites now adayes , of whome we haue seen before , how they professe voluntarie pouertie , contempte of the world , incapacitie of earthlie promotions , great labors of studies and other such painful exercises , we read also in their peculier rules that their chastitie must imitate the puritie of Angels , Part. 6. Constant . cap. 1. both in mynde and body , and as for wordly comodities , that they must abhor ( those are the very woords of their rule and institute ) altogether and not in parte from all these thinges which the world doth loue and esteeme ( as honours , Exam. admitt . cap. 4. promotions , riches , pleasures and the lyke ) and embrace and desyre with all their forces the thinges which Iesus their mayster esteemed and loued for our examples , as contempt , pouertie , persecution and affliction , shewing by this liuerye of his that they are his true seruantes and followers . And furthermore we heare for confirmation of this , & partly also do see their voluntarie sufferinges tortures & martirdomes in the Indies , in Ethiopia , in Iapone , in England , Frace & other places for setting forward the seruice of their mayster , wherfore by Saynt Iustines reason , it is not lyke that these men are dilighted with vitious lyfe , which make so litle accompt of lyfe , and do handle so roughlie their lyfe in this world .

An other obiection also was accustomed to be brought against religious men in old time , Iesuites labors and indeuours for the publique . as also against all Christians generally of the primitiue churche , as Tertullian affirmeth , to wit , that they were vnprofitable men to the common-wealth , ydle , retired , siluestres , & filuicolae , Tertul. Apol. ●●p. 42. that is fitter for woods and wildernesse , then for the societie of man , this obiection ( I say ) is easily answered in the behalf of Iesuites , seeing their manifold labors extant in the world , to the help of all sortes of christian people , they begin with children as soone as they are able to speak , teaching them christian doctrine , and elements of other learing , afterward they read to them artes , tongues , sciences , and higher professions ; they frame their manners and affections as well as their iudgmentes and vnderstanding to al Christian knowledge and pietie , if they be poore and needie they labour to prouide for them also temporally what they can ; they doe set them forward and aduance them in learning and pietie , they preache to all , administer sacraments to all , they write bookes , they make peace between enemies , they visit prisons and hospitales for comfort of the poore and sick , they procure them fauor , get them almes , help them to dye in Gods fear that either by sicknes or Iustice are called thervnto , and finally taking a childe from his christian cradle , they carry him along and accompanie him with continual assistance , comfort , and help , in all fortunes , states , & conditions of life and death , vntill they deliuer him vp agayne into his creators handes , that sent him into the world ; and this without earthly reward or recompence , & often tymes with ingratitude and enmitie of the parties so benefited , and this is the lyfe vse and exercise of these men .

B●t ( say their aduersaries ) they are ambitious notwithstanding , Obiections against lesuites answered . they are prowd , they will haue no equals , they will haue all passe by their owne handes , they wil be maysters , formen of the quest , singular in all respectes ; to which I might answer that albeit these speeches do sauour rankely of enuie , which followeth euer at the footsteeps of vertue , and that they might in like manner be obiected against the Apostles themselues in respect of others , whome they exceeded in holines of life , yet will I examin them somwhat in this place . I ask therefore , Ambition . wherin consisteth this ambition , this singularitie obiected against Iesuites ? in seeking ( perhaps ) promotions or preferments , but we haue seen before that they can haue none , that they do voluntarily renounce and forsweare them all . In getting gouernment perchance , or iurisdiction ouer others ? but we see by experience and by their rule that they haue none at all , nor wil haue : wherin then consisteth this ambition , doth it consist in labouring , toyling , contending more then others in the cause and course they haue in hand ? a happie and holy ambition , 1. Cor. 1● . wherof Saynt Paule him self gloried muche when he saied , abundantius illis omnibus laboraui , I haue laboured more aboundantly then all the rest of my fellow Apostles . This obiection then is vayne , or worse then vayne , as proceeding not only of a deceyued iudgement , but of maligne interpretation also ; in that which is knowen to be excellent in it selfe , and worthie of all prayse , loue , and admiration .

There followeth the second obiection of professed enemies ( for the former wil seem in outward shew to be frendes ) that Iesuites are troublers of common wealthes , Whether Iesuites be seditions & trooblers of common walthes . Act. 24. seditious perturbers of states , peruerters of kingdomes , dangerous to princes , such as Saynt Paule was accused to be by Tertullus the orator , inuenimus hunc hominem pestiferum , & concitantem seditiones omnibus Iud●is , we haue found this man to be pestiferous , and to stirre vp sedition among all the Iewes , and agaynst Saynt Paules lord and maister Christ him selfe , the same accusation was layd and vrged with all asseueration , by many principal and graue men together : Luc. 23. Hunc inuenimus subuertentem gentem nostram , & prohibentem tributa dari Caesari , we haue found this man ( marke you how they speake of their owne knowlege , troblesome and to peruert our people , perswading them not to pay tribute to Caesar. And this is a very plausible accusation in the eares of worldly princes , espetially , suche as haue not leasure , nor meanes , nor will perhaps to examine matters in particuler , but alienated & caried away with the first apprehensions & impressions of such odious calumniations , leaue no place afterward for the accused to defend themselues or shew their innocencie .

Yet one kynde of sedition I do easely discouer in very truth to be in Iesuites , A holy kynde of sedition . which is that , wherin their mayster confessed also himself to be seditious , to wit , in separating fathers from children daughters from mothers , kinred from kinred , and in setting them of one and the self same houshould at contention and hatred and warre among themselues in Gods cause , and in matter of ther saluation , of which holy sedition Christ himself professeth ( as I haue sayd ) to be the author : do not thinke ( sayth he ) that I came to bring peace into the world , Luc. 12. for I came not to plant peace but the swoord , and to diuide a man agaynst his owne father● and the daughter agaynst her mother , and the daughter in law agaynst her mother in law , and to make emnitie betwixte them that are domestical . And in an other speech , Ignem veni mittere in terram , & quid volo nisi vt accendatur ? I came to bring fyre vpon earth , and what will I but that it be kindled ? S. Bonauent. stim . diuini ●●noris . O faelices incendiarij ( sayth one seruant of God ) o happie fierbrandes , or setters a fier of other mens houses wherby gold is seuered from earth and pure corne tryed from chaffe , and all dregges of wickednes are burnt and consumed , this is a holy , this is a happie sedition , and this is that in deed which is layd agaynst Iesuites at this day , for that by their zeale and industrie many a separation is made between good and bad , many a heat enkindled in Christian hartes , where deadly cold occupied the place before , many a batterie geuen to fortes possessed by Satan , many an heathen and heretique made Christian , many a frostie catholique made a hoat recusant , many a vitious lyuer made obseruant , many a a careles and earthly mynd stirred vp to apprehend and think of eternitie , many a groueling soule plucked from the ground and quickened with the warmth of true Christian spirit , and finally to many a worldling , Eccles. 41. pacem habenti in substantijs suis , whose dammable peace lay before in his earthly substance , to wit in his riches , ease , and commodities of this lyf , warre is made by meanes of Iesuites , and sedition is put into his house before he was aware ; his reason falleth out with his sense , and his conscience with his ease , and with all the residue of his former trade of lyf , and heer by both him self and all the countrie round about him is put in comotion , and Iesuites are accused of this offence for putting of fyre in this house , hew and cry is made after them , many complayne , others curse , that are either trobled or endamaged by this warre , and this is the true state of Iesuites at this day , and these are the causes for which they are made odious and termed seditous .

For as for the odde and ydle callumniation of the heretiques of our tyme , Whether Iesuites do seeke the deathes of princes . Ioan. 12. wherunto Sir Francis also as a deuoted child of theirs , doth set his hand in this place , that they do practise the deathes of princes , and procure their destruction ( except only he meane that practise wherin they ioyne with their mayster , vt princeps huîus mundi ●ijciatur foras , that the prince of this world may be cast forth ) and that in particuler they haue sought the blood of our Soueraigne of England , with such thirst as this man auoucheth , and that generally they be princequellers , king-killers , and the lyke , is an accusation no l●sse found , then false and malitious , and as easie to proue , as that Sir Francis is by occupation a iugler , for what men are Iesuites to attend to such attemptes ? or what profit or emolument can arise to them , more then to other men , by such murdering of princes albeit you would faign them to be so voyd of conscience , as you insinuate , or where , or when , or by whome was euer any such enterprise proued against them ? you will alleage perhaps the case of France , mentioned before to be attempted by Iohn Chattel , a youth of nineteen years of age , The fact of Iohn Chattel in france the 27. of Decemb. 1594. that had once bin their scholler ( for he was not actually , when he attempted that fact ) and if he had bin , who seeth not the vanitie of this accusation , that the offence of one particuler scholer , should be atributed to all his maisters , or be punished vpon them , who had aboue a thowsand scholers more in that place , at that time , and diuers thowsands in other places of France , at which the diuel enuyed not a little . Furthermore , the acquitall and free deliuery of father Iohn Gueretius , particuler maister that had bin , of the sayd Chattel , by the publique magistrate , without any punishment at all , & after he had bin held in prison and tortured , and most rigorous trial made vpon him , doth euidently shew as wel his innocencie , as that of all his fellowes ; for that so rann the humors of their conspiring enimies against them at that day in Paris ( where the tryal was made ) that if any least shew of probable offence , could haue bin found and fastened on them , they had all smarted for it , as since hath appeared . This fact then of France is their ful clearing , and no way their condemnation .

Their followeth another attempt of later time in Holland , set foorth by the kinges rebelles of those prouinces , An other deuyse against Iesuites in Holland . since Sir Francis wrote his booke , for if it had bin published first , he would haue taken ( no dout ) a large argument therof , to haue discoursed theron , and rayled more at randome , the fact is set out in print , vnder the name of a sentence of death giuen by the magistrates of Leyden , the two and twentith day of Iune last past of this yeare 98. agaynst one Peter Panne natiue of Ypers in Flanders , for that he tooke , vpon him , at the persuation of the Prouincial of the Iesuites , together with the Rector and prefect of studdies of their college of Doway , to kill ( as they say ) Conte Mauris , Gouernour of Holland , and in the end of their narration ( which they auow to be Peter Panne his owne confession ) they do adde , that this iustice is done vpon him to terrifie men from fauoring the bloodie and murderous sect of Iesuites , which ( as is notoriously knowen to the world ) do in●ent daylie , a thowsand most execrable practises and trayterous entrepryses , and do seeke to put them in execution , for killing and murdering kinges , princes , and principal personages , especially such , as will not admit them , nor approue their papistical superstition , called by them , the catholique Roman Religion , &c.

These are the wordes of those magistrates , in their printed sentence , whereby is manifestly seen , the end that moued them to publish so lying a pamphlet , as also to faigne the whole narration , for defaming of Iesuites , and making them odious ( if all were faigned ) or at least to induce Peter Panne to confesse it , or to accept and publish so manifest false a confession , without further examination of the truth and circunstances therof .

For that since , vpon further tryal of the matter , before other magistrates of other places , Refutal of the fable . to wit , of Ypers itself , where the partie dwelt , and of Doway , wbere the couenant was forged to be treated and concluded , and of other places in Flanders , it is found that all was a mere fiction , so far forth as it toucheth the Iesuites , and so is it testified by an answere printed by authoritie of the saied magistrates , the fyue and twentith of August , next insuing of the same yeare 98. and by diuers other bookes and declarations afterward set abrode , for iustifying of the truth , and in one of them , there are obserued aboue threescore manifest lyes , layd downe agaynst the Iesuites in that shameful confession : as for example , among other poyntes it is shewed and verefied , that Peter Panne was no catholique at all , nor euer had doing with the Iesuites ; that he was a vagrant cooper giuen to drunkenes and running vp and downe the country lyke a mad man , for which faultes , and for his debtes , he was often put into prison , and sometymes being deliuered , he put in himself agayne of madnes ; that his frendes wold haue bound him in chaynes in his owne house , that he was extremely well affected to Counte Mauris , and consequently no fit man for Iesuites to deale withal to kill him , if they had had any such intention , as their was no cause why they should haue , seing they were to gayne nothing by his death .

Moreouer that Peter Panne neuer prouyded the Iesuites college in Doway of butter in his lyfe , as is affirmed in the sentence , nor euer was seen in that college by any , nor that there was euer any such seruant of the college named Melchior de val , feigned to haue byn the messenger to sollicit this matter with Peter Panne , neither was euer there any treatie with Peter Pannes wyfe in Ypers , to this effect , or other , as is affirmed in the confession , nor had she euer any acquayntance or dealing in her lyfe with Iesuites , as in the faigned narration is set downe , that all the tale of Peter Pannes coming to Doway in the rogation weeke last past , and his dyning and treating with the Prouincial , Rector , & Prefect after dinner , and their exhorting him to the enterpryse , with making him many offers temporal , and assuring him for his soule , that if he died in the enterpryse , he should go to heauen presently , both in body and soule , and many other such circumstances set dow●e in the printed narration , all I say , are shewed manifestly to be false and forged , vpon examination and attestation of catholique magistrates of the places aforenamed , and of the persons themselues , mentioned in the fable , and among other poyntes it is proued by many witnesses , that the Prouincial of the Iesuites in the rogation weeke , which they do name , was in Bruxeles , to wit , aboue threscore myles of , and had departed from Doway in the moneth of Ianuarie before , and of Peter Panne also it is proued , that he was not in Doway at that tyme , nor could be , for that he was working in his maysters shop at Ypers .

So as by these and many other most euident demonstrations , there to be seen , it is made cleer , that this is but an heretical fiction to defame Iesuites , for their zeal in Gods true religion , in which respect , as they are more dear to almighty God , so ought they to be also to all good men , that behold these diuelish deuises of Sathan and his instruments agaynst them .

But let vs returne to England , Whether Iesuites seeke her maiest . blood . where Sir Francis beateth also vpon the same nayl , as you haue heard , at the beginning of this incounter , saying , that he cannot perceiue the thirst that Persons and his pew-fellowes haue of seeking her Maiesties blood , to be yet quenched : but how doth the poore man proue , that they haue had that thirst ? no way . how doth he proue that it is not yet quenched ? for that he perceiueth it not , nor yet how it may be , the causes still remayning , why they sought it before ; o sillie disputer , how he flieth still from the point he should proue ? I requier that he should proue that Iesuites haue sought the Queenes Maiesties blood , and he giueth a reason why they haue not left to seek it ; and what is this reason ? for that the same causes of seeking it , do remayn stil , that were before . What are these causes ? he nameth them not , but it seemeth they can be no other , then the difference of religion , and the persecution made vpon them for the same . Wel then , all the substance of this argument is brought to this issue , that for so much , as Sir Faancis old head cannot perceiue , how Iesuites persecuted for religion by the Queen , can loue her or pray for her , or cease to hate her , and not seek her blood , therfore it is so , and must be thought so .

But to this argument answereth Saint Paule , 1. Cor. 2. when he saith , animalis homo non percipit ea quae spiritus Dei sunt , a fleshly and sensual man perceyueth not the thinges that are of Gods spirit , such for example ) as are the louing of a mannes enemies , & praying for them , and rendring good for euil , which yet spiritual men ( such as Iesuites are taken to be ) may perhaps both perceyue and practise , and so I perswade myself they do , and I haue heard in particular by such as come from English Seminaries beyond the seas , where Iesuites and especially father persons here accused , hath a hand , that there is a custome and precept , not only for all in general , to remember her Maiestie in their ordinarie praiers , but also in the particular deuotions assigned to euerie particuler person , at the beginning of euerie moneth . The Queen of England hath her particuler place of recommendation among other princes , and before them also , in the number of them that are assigned to pray for her , so as this practise of praying for persecutors , so much praysed by Christ though it enter not into Sir Francis worldly spirit , and fleshly vnderstanding , yet may it , and doth it ( as it seemeth ) into Iesuites .

And this might serue now as well for defence of all Iesuites in general , as of father Persons in particuler , seeing no seueral matter is layd agaynst either of them ; but yet I may not let passe by law of common frendship , to adde some few lynes also in the fathers case by name , seing that by name he is accused of so odious a cryme , as is to haue a thirst of shedding the blood of our Soueraigne lady and Queen . Defence of F. persons in particuler . About which accusation I would aske this accuser , how this appeareth ? and how it cometh to passe , that in so many yeares , so many others hauing byn suspected , some apprehended , other indicted , condemned , and executed , for imputation of lyke heynous crymes , none euer ( that is knowen ) accused father Persons by name , to haue induced or perswaded them to the lyke enterpryse ? though if they had , it had byn no condemnation , but much lesse probabilitie , when not so much as an accusation is extant . Let the examinations and arraynementes of Parry , Sauage , Ballard , Babington with all his fellowes , that were condemned with him , Polewheel also , Daniel , Hesket , and such others be vewed ouer , and see whether any of them do accuse father Persons to haue byn partaker o● priuie to their councels , actions , or attemptes , in this behalf , let the recordes be sought out of all the preestes declarations that haue byn put to death , within these twentie yeares ( which are more then a hundreth ) and consider whether any haue confessed fathers Person● euer to haue proposed any such matter vnto them , and yet the most part of them were acquaynted with him , & many also sent into England by his direction , and if he had felt such a deadly thirst of blood , and of her Maiesties blood , as this accuser sayth , the readiest way for quenching therof , had byn to persuade some of these men ( that come of purpose to aduenture their lyues for religion , and feare not the leesing of any thing in this world ) to haue taken the enterpryse vpon them , for the common good , and for setting the vse of their religion at libertie ther by .

But there is no such matter , and these are but fictions and deuyses of enemies , An euident demonstration . to make men odious ; no preest hitherto nor Iesuite ( that I haue hearde of ) hath euer confessed of himself , or others of that vocation , any such attempt or meaning at all . It seemeth they are gouerned by an other spirit and rule , to wit , by that of holy Dauid , who made this vow , 1. Reg. 2● . touching his enemie and persecutor Saul : Viuit Dominus , quia nisi Dominus percusserit eum , aut dies eius venerit , vt moriatur , aut in praelium descendens perierit , propitius sit mihi Dominus , ne extendam manum meam in Christum Domini . As the Lord liueth ( sayth he ) except God stryk him , or that his day come of natural death , or that he going into the field to fight , do perish there , God be merciful vnto me , that I lay not my handes vpon his anoynted .

So then father Parsons protesteth ( as I am credibly informed ) that he was neuer consenting , witting , willing , inducing , yeelding , nor priuie to any such personal attempt against her Maiestie in his life . Moreouer he auoucheth , that he hath dissuaded , hindered , and diuerted some that might perhaps haue had such inclination , and namely one Gentleman , some yeares past beyond the seas ( he sayeth not of what nation he was ) that hauing resolued vpon the only zeale of religion , and for deliuering of catholique people from persecution to leese his own life , or to take away that of her Maiestie ; he was entered some hundreth miles and more into his iorney toward England , for that purpose , hauing made himself ready to dye , by discharging his minde of all worldly cares and cogitatons , neither had he doubt of the effect , for that he pretended not to escape aliue : all which notwithstanding , vpon father Parsons earnest dissuasion , that met him on the way , he was content at length to retyre , and giue ouer the enterprise , principally vpon this reason ( for others he persuaded himself to haue examined sufficiently before ) that English catholiques themselues desired not to be deliuered from their miseries by any such attempt ; and this to be most true , he affirmeth vpon his conscience .

By this then it may seem to appeer , that this father is not so thirstie of her Maiesties death and des●r●ction , nor of so bloody a disposition , as Sir Francis would make him , which I haue heard also confirmed by many protestants themselues , who meeting with him in catholique kingdomes , where he might haue donn them hurt , hath alway donn them good , and I could name some , if I thought it would be no hurt or disgrace vnto them , let those fourscore and fifteen , whom at one time he deliuered out of the chaynes of galleys of Spayn , in the year 90. ( whereof diuers are gentlemen now dwelling in England , and those thirtie and fower which this present year of 98. he deliuered from like miserie in the galleys of Naples , and many other particuler men benifited by him besides , speak for him in this case , for that these woorkes are of more weight with wise men , then Sir Francis bare woordes to the contrarie . And so with this I end also this encounter .

THE SIXTH INCOVNTER , ABOVT THE CATHOLIQVE RECVsantes that refuse for conscience sake , to goe to the Protestantes churches , and to be present at their seruice in England .

AS in many other poyntes this hastie hotespur playeth the Herodian , shewing himself without conscience at all , and ready to pawne his soule for pleasing the prince & state where he liueth , so in no one thing doth he more discouer this diuelish and detestable disposition , then in his cruel and malitious calumniation agaynst the better and more religious sorte of English Catholiques ; who refusing to dissemble , do vtter their consciences plainly in matter of religion . And according to their obligation in this behalf do abstain from going to the churches , preachings , and seruices of them that be of a different religion . And albeit he cannot but confesse , that many of them do geue good example of lyf in their behaueour , or ( to vse his owne wordes ) do shew a good outward ciuil cariage in ciuil matters ( which I dout whether all his neighbours will testifie the lyke of him , and of those of his profession ) yet ( sayth he ) let not that possesse you with too great a regard of them , and to deliuer you from the danger of such deceytfull baytes , I must assure you , that this is a true position , that without the true feare of God , there can be no true religion . And vnlesse the religion be found , the face and shew of ciuil honestie ( seem it neuer so glorious in the eies of flesh and blood ) is but a deceitfull visour vpon a crabtree face , couering the most vyle and cankred partes , of a deceitfull hart , and so I come to shew their dissimulation .

Thus far Sir Francis ; to whome I will not answer by examining faces and visours , whether that of his be crabtree , plumtree , pear-tree , or figtree , let other men iudge that know it . Neither yet by discussing how many sortes of cankers there be , where with Sir Francis himself may be touched , 2. Timot. 2. especially if heresie be one , as Saynt Paule doth signifie , and all holie fathers haue held after him . But to the matter it self I answer , that wheras Sir Francis maketh so light of good lyf in Catholiques , About good lyf . calling it a deceytfull bayte , Christe teacheth vs to make a far different collection , when in his first sermon on the mountayne , he gaue this aduertisement : Beware of false Prophetes , &c. by their frutes you shall know them , for as men do not gather grapes of thornes , nor figges of brambles , Math. 7. so doth euerie good tree bringe foorth good frutes , and euerie euil tree bringeth forth euil frutes , ? Neither can a good tree bringe foorth euil frutes , nor euil tree , good . Saynt Iames sayd in lyke case , thou hast fayth and I haue workes , shew thou to me thy fayth without workes , and I will shew thee my fayth by my workes . Iacob . 2. If then here be workes and good lyf in these Catholiques , it must be presumed to come of good fayth according to Saynt Iames. And if there be figges , and grapes , and such other good frutes found in their behaueour , then must the tree be iudged good also , if Christes rule be not false . And for that our Sauiour gaue this rule to discerne true and false prophetes by , it is not euil that Sir Francis and his men do fly from it so openly in the playne feeld , leauinge good workes to Catholiques , and reseruinge only threed-bare fayth to themselues , for therby they discocouer what prophetes they be .

And of all this I do not greatly marueyle in Sir Francis , for he seeth ( poore man ) how bare a haruest he hath in hand , when he talketh of workes amonge those of his sect , and how the hare goeth clearly away on our syde , if he hunt after good life in his new prophetes . But much I marueyle of his lack of shame , that talking agaynst these recusant Catholiques , he maketh mention so often of deceyt and dissimulation ; seing that of all other people of the realme , these men dissemble least , but rather do publish themselues , euen to the face and vewe of the magistrate , yea they are punished expresly for that they will not dissemble , as many others do , and go to your churches with a repyning and repugnant conscience ; for if they would do so , then were they no more recusants , and consequently f●ee from al your clawes , penalties and vexations though neuer the more yours therby in mynde , then now they be .

But to the end this matter ma●e be better discussed , let vs heare Sir Francis triple accusation agaynst them , his wordes are these .

I do note ( sayth he ) three thinges in this kynde of people , worthie to be knowen and obscrued , first the hurt thy continually do , secondly ihe hurt they would do , and thirdly their deep dissimulation . Here are three heades you see of a greeuous accusation set downe , let vs see the particulers .

For the first ( sayth he ) it would aske a long discourse to discouer all the hurtes done by them , The first charge agaynst Catholiques . they are so many , and manifould . This is nothing but wordes & rhetorical exageration hitherto , let vs see some substance .

My owne experience telleth me ( sayth he ) that when the gentleman and man of wealth refuseth to come to the churche , and is in any sort borne with all , there the meaner sort receyue infection , and draw backe from obedience also , for Aboue maiori discit arare minor . Of the elder oxe , the yonger steer doth learne .

This is Sir Francis first charge , which as it is graue and weightie in it self , so is it as substantially proued , with a poetical verse taken from his plow and stawle of oxen and from his steeres . Let vs see what this iustice of peace hath more to saye of his owne experience , for be-lyke he speaketh of his practise in that office agaynst Recusantes it followeth then in his booke .

If the man come to thurche and the wyf refuse ( which is a cunnning trick much practised of late yeares ) then is the houshold both seruantes and children in danger wholly to be corrupted . And sure it is , that the wyues of the meaner sorte are infected greatly by them , and the nightcrowes persuation preuayleth much , and in myn owne knowledge , within these three yeares , many of the meaner sort are fallen away , and do fall away daylie , for that , impunitatis spes magna peccantium in illecebra , the hope of impunitie is a greate bayte to offend .

Heer is all now that our knight can alleage in particuler concerning the hurts ( so many and so manyfold ) which before he sayd the recusantes do woork in England , which in effect cometh to be no more ( as you see ) but that if the goodman refuse to go to churche ( though the good wife go ) then those of the meaner sorte begin to refuse also ; and if the goodwife refuse ( though the goodman go ) then are the seruantes and children in danger to do the like . And then generally he setteh downe this doctrinal assertion , that the night crowes perswasion preuayleth much , and this knoweth he of his owne knowledge partely ( perhaps ) by experience of his own night crow , and partely by tampering in these affaires : who ( as is probable ) hath bin some principal actor in the long persecutions vpon Catholiques , either by playing the parte of Iudas to betray and take them , or of Caiphas or Pilate , to condemne and afflict them . And so by this experience he hath found out ( as he saith ) that many goodwiues of the meaner sorte are fallen of late , and many other by their example do fall away dayly : a grieuous accusation , and fit for a carpet knight .

But Sir , you that are such an enemie of night-crowes , and haue such knowledge of the afayres of all the goodwiues of your countrie , tel me , whereunto do these wiues , or children , or seruantes , or tenants , or husbands fall , when you say they fall away ? is it perhaps , to any enormitie of sinne or to wickednes of life ? no , but to haue a scruple to go to the protestants churches . And why ? for that they are of a different religion . They are Catholiques , and do think your religion and seruice naught . Wel then , religion and conscience is cause of this refusal , and not euil wil or rebellion , as you malitiously interprete and consequently the way of true remedy is , not to beat , and bynde , and driue them to your churches by force and punishment , as you do perswade the Magistrate to do ( Sir consciencelesse knight ) but first you must make them of your religion , that they may go of deuotion and conscience : for if they go otherwise it is a dooble sinne , both to them that go , and to you that make them go , albeit the act otherwise in it self were neuer so good and lawful : as all men of learning and conscience do wel know , that an erronious conscience also bindeth : though your ignorance be so grosse in all christian learning , as you seme to be both ignorant and careles of so manifest a truthe .

I say , it is a manifest truthe , that a mannes conscience An erroneconscience also byndeth . is to be followed , though it did erre , and much more when it erreth not , and the reason of the former is , that forasmuch as our conscience is nothing els but the voice and determination of our reason and iudgement , about matters to be donn or not to be donne , it followeth that we are bound to obey that direction ( be it right or wrong ) so long as we haue no other light to guyde vs . For that according to this we shal be iudged at the last day , to wit , according as each mannes conscience ( sa●th Saynt Paule ) shal accuse or defend him : Rom. 2. and not according to the nature or qualitie of the thing it self that he doth : which point , schoolemen ( if I be not deceiued ) do expresse in these wordes , that the goodnesse or malice of a mannes will , is to be measured by the obiect that moueth the will , and not by the thing it self that is donne . As for example , if I apprehend a thing to be euil and yet do it , I do sinne , albeit the thinge in it self that I do , were not euil : for that in my apprehension and iudgment it was euil : & so I did it vnder the conceit and formality of euil , and consequently my wil and intention was naught , in doing it , though the thing in it self were lawfull . As for example , if in the night time seeing a beast in a bush and thinking it to be myn enemy I should kill it , though the thing it self be no sinne , yet should I commit manslaughter therin before God , for that , my apprehension was of myn enemy , and consequently , myn action should be iudged according to the obiect I conceiued , and not according to the thing in it self .

This very case determineth S. Paule himself particulerly , Idolothita . through out the whole foureteenth chapter of his epistle to the Romanes , about eating the meates that had bin offered vp to Idols . And the same matter he handeleth again throughout the eight chapter of his first epistle to the Corinthians . And in both places he determineth that to him that either eateth simply without enquiring whether it were offered to Idols or not , or hath so much true christian knowledge as he vnderstandeth thereby that an Idol is nothing , and that all creatures are lawful to be eaten by a christian man ( so it be donn without scandal of others , & with other due circumstances ) albeit I say to such a man it be lawful to eat of those meates that had bin offered to Idols , yet to him that had a contrarie conscience and iudgement it should be a greiuous sinne to eate thereof , for that he did it against his own iudgement and beleefe , though it were erroneous . I do know and trust in Iesus Christe ( Saith Saint Paule ) that no meat is vnclean or vnlawful now , but onely to such as think it vnlawful . So as onely to think it vnlawful , maketh it vnlawful , according to Saint Paules rule . And again the same Apostle , qui discernit , si manducauerit , damnatus est , quia non ex fide , he that discerneth or iudgeth , the said meat to haue bin offered to Idols , Roman. 14. and that it is therby made vnfit to be eaten & yet eateth the same , he is condemned : for that he doth not according to his own iudgment and beleef . And after all , he concludeth his speach with this general proposition omne autem quod non est ex fide , peccatum est , all that is not according to a mannes beleef and conscience , is sinne , for so expound this sentence , Origen , Saint Ambros , Saint Chrisostom , and other fathers , and not to signifie , that all the woorkes of Infidels , donne without faith , should be sinne , though Saint Augustin apply it also to that sense sometimes : Aug. lib. 4. but the other sense is the literal and most true , as appeareth manifestly by the whole discours of Saint Paule . contra Iuda cap. 3. Of all which insueth that no man may do against his conscience though it were awry . An erroneous conscience doth euer excuse . Not for that a wrong conscience excuseth in all cases ( for that is a different question ) but for that a wrong conscience , byndeth euermore , and some tymes excuseth also , when it proceedeth of inuincible ignorance . But howsoeuer it cometh by right or wrong information , no man may go agaynst it without sin so long as he cannot perswade it to change , and if this be so , how much more are the recusant Catholiques of England bound to follow their consciences in the poynt they stand in , for not going to churche , being founded vpon so sure and euident growndes as any demonstration in the world can lay downe , for proof of any manifest truth what so euer , as for example , first , that the religion they professe is true , and the only truth that among Christians is to be found , and secondly that they being of that religion , maie not dissemble or seem to professe any other , by going to their seruice sermons , or churches , and hereby also appeareth how great impietie and folly it is for any man to inforce them thereunto , as our barbarous knight would haue the English magistrate to do : I saie it is impietie to inforce any Christian to do an acte agaynst his conscience and beleef , for that it is to inforce him to his damnation , as Saynt Paul before hath taught vs , Roman. 1● . I saie also it is folly , for that by drawing mens bodies to church by violence ( their myndes being repugnant ) nothing is gayned at all , but more internal hatred and rancor rather enkindled , and the infotcers are made pertakers of the others sinnes and damnation .

And further the Protestantes do greatly hereby discredit their owne doctrin which they were wont to teach , Protestantes discredit . that no man should be forced in matters of his conscience . And more ouer they do shew hereby vnto the world that they seeke not the inward man , but the vtter shew & body , with what great repugnance soeuer it be of the soule , which is quyt contrarie to all pietie , and a most base manner of proceeding in respect of the Catholique vsage , which albeit it punisheth such as do wilfully and obstinatly leaue the vniuersal ancient faith of Christendome , which once they haue receyued and sworne vnto , yet as long as they are euill perswaded of the same , they are not only not forced to Catholique churches ; or to hearing of masses participation of Sacramentes or to other lyke exercyses of contrarie religion , but are barred also though they would come , if they be supposed to come with repugnance , or that there be any least suspition that they go f●ynedly or agaynst their willes , for that their soule and mynde is sought in Catholique religion and not the body only .

And this maie be sufficient for repelling Sir Francis first charge against English recusantes concerning the present hurt ( he saieth ) they do in England , by geuing others example to follow their consciences and not to dissemble . And by giuing , them example of good life of modest behaueor , of patience in aduersitie , of corage in Gods cause , of contempe of earthly prosperitie , of care of their saluation of feare of Gods iudgementes , of fidelitie in following the direction of their consciences , of magnanimitie in not yelding to betraye their owne cause and beleefe : all which is conteyned in the most excellent and heroical act of the refusing to go to churches and seruice of a different Religion . In which poynt of refusal also the Puritanes were wont to concurre with Catholiques for defence of their profession , but it may be they haue thought it best now to alter that course , for that as they haue no other grownd of their religion but their owne iudgment , so it byndeth them no further then they list , and that it standeth with their comoditie , and it may be , that in this poynt now they haue thought it best to follow those whome Christ sayth , Matti . 13. temporales sunt , & in tempore tentationis recedunt , they are according as the tyme serueth , Marc. 14. Luc. 8. & do retyre in tyme of tryal or persecution .

I come then to the second charge , which our knight geueth vpon our recusantes about the hurtes About the hurtes that recusantes would do . that he will needes haue men beleeue they would do if they could , of which he writeth thus .

Touching the hurt they would do , who doubteth but they would haue vp their masse agayne , and bannish the syncere worship of God , their whole Catholique gouernment and religion I am sure they long for . And yet to pronounce these men to carye holow hartes to Queen Elizabeth is thought to be an vncharitable sentence .

Do you see how wyse a charge this is , and how learnedly proued ? Yf a man should reason thus agaynst him , & his brother the Earle , that died not longe agone in Yorke , you both are puritanes in religion , as you are taken , and consequently no man can dout but that you would haue vp your geneuian disciplinarie for me of gouernment , whereby all the Bishops in England must be pulled downe , and other Ecclesiastical dignities discomposed , the Queenes Supremacie also must be taken away , and other like pointes of the English churche ouerthrowen , whereby a man may pronounce that you cary but holow hartes to the present state , and to the Queen Elizabeth , notwithstanding all your flatterie .

And this is an argument ( Sir Francis ) which logicians call , Argumentum ad hominem . ad hominem , in which kinde I could vrge you yet further , and make you scratche your head , towching wishes and bearing hollow hartes towardes Queen Elizabeth and her gouernment , if I would follow presumptions , as you do against recusantes , for that besides your religion , if a man consider whence you descend , and what pretences be or may be about succession , it is not hard to ghesse what your wishes may be to haue Queen Elizabeth , or some other person to sit in her place , and yet to pronounce you to carry a hollow harte to Queen Elizabeth , as you say in iest , that it is thought to be an vncharitable sentence , and I say it in earnest quia charitas non cogitat malum , 1. Cor. 14. sayth Saint Paule , charity iudgeth not the worst of things , and so I wil not iudge what wishes you haue or may haue : only I wil tel you that if you haue any in this later kinde , they are more perilous and preiudicial to Queen Elizabeth , then those which you presume catholiques to haue , for that the thinges , which you imagin catholiques do wish ( as restoring of masse and catholique gouernment and the like ) may stand with her Maiesties life , raigne , securitie , and prosperitie ( if it would please almightie God to inspire her to admit them ) euen as they haue stood with the honor and prosperitie , of all her noble ancestors , Kings and Queenes of our realme before her : but your wishes cannot preuaile but with her ruine , if they be such as may be presumed .

But as I sayd , I wil not vrge you in this behalf what you would wish , nor is there any well gouerned common wealth in the world , in my opinion , that vrgeth men vpon suche vayne poyntes of inward wishes and secret cogitations or desyres . No subiectes to be vrged vpon inward desyres . The Turke doth it not vpon the Christians that are vnder him , nor Christian Princes vpon Iewes that dwell in their states , nor the king of Spayne vpon the Moriscos that liue in his kingdomes , nor the Emperour , king of France , king of Polonia , or other Catholique monarches vpon the Lutherans , Swinglians , Caluinistes or other sectes , that are tolerated in their states . Only this barbarous knight of ours , contrarie to all reason and humanitie , would haue it vrged vpon catholiques in England , what they wish and what they desire : where notwitstanding if the same should be inforced against all persons , that any way be discontented in court or countrie , & in their hartes would wish perhaps some alteration , who seeth not , but that as in other common-wealthes , so especially and aboue others in ours , where so many diuisions and dissentions do raigne , as wel by reason of religion as otherwise , many thowsand ●nward sores and vlcers would be discouered , that now lye hidden , and is expedient that so they should remayn , notwithstanding the ridiculous folly , or rather furie of this frantik man in persuading contrarie .

Let vs see now his third chardge against recusantes , The third charge against recusantes . touching their dissimulation as he calleth it , his woords are these in most odious manner set down , These ciuil honest men ( sayth he ) that vnder pretence of conscience rebel agaynst God in religion , and refuse to yeeld a loyal obedience to their liege Lady and Soueraigne , seem to carry a most lamentable resolution lurking in their bosomes , against Queen , countrie , and vs all : when they wil seek the life of their and our Queen , the thraldom of their and our countrie , and the ruine of vs all that professe the ghospell , to haue their popish Priesthood , and Massing sacrifice vp again . And if this be conscience , I know not what conscience meaneth , and yet this conscience they fetch from Rome . &c.

To answere first to that which is heer last , if we should graunt this great absurditie , Sir Francis Hastinges conscience . that Sir Francis Hastinges knoweth not what conscience meaneth , either in nature and definiton , or in practise and feeling , what great inconuenience would follow therof trow you , for as for the definition of conscience it were easie ( I suppose ) to pose Sir Francis , seeing that his bringing vp hath bin rather in court and hawking , then in schooles and studying . And for practise or feeling of conscience , how little sence he hath , there needeth no other argument but onely this slanderous libel , stuffed with such monstrous lyes and calumniations , as no man of any conscience would euer haue set downe , were he neuer so different in matters of religion . Nay truly it may be doubted ; whether easily there might haue bin found any so careles or conscienceles an atheist about London , that so resolutely for any bribe would haue accused so many worshipfull honest ciuil men , as himself confesseth the recusant catholiques of England to be ( which is so much as any ciuill common-wealth can requier of their citizens ) as this man doth , and that of most hainous crimes , of trecherous falshood , disloyal dealing , and wicked treasons to their prince , & of lamentable lurking resolutions in their bosomes , agaynst Queen and countrie , and of seeking the life of the one , and thraldom of the other : and all this vpon so vayn and light suppositions as you haue hearde , before which yet he would haue so constantly to be beleeued of all men , as that the said recusantes ( notwithstanding his owne former testimonie of their ciuil good life ) must be condemned for the catalines of the land , and out castes of the comon-wealth , for to Cataline and his compagnions , he compareth them in the end of his inuectiue , in these wordes .

We maie well say of them as Tullie sayd of Cataline the conspiratour in one of his orations , Notorious rayling and calumniation agaynst recusaut Catholiques . that in all or most of these happie yeares of her Maiesties most prosperous and peacable gouernment , there hath byn no trayterous practise agaynst her person or our countrie , but it came alwaies from them , and by them : whome neither shame of their villanies , nor feare of punishement , nor any sound reason out of Gods booke , nor yet the rule of true Christian policie , could withold from pursuing their trayterous purposes and pract●ses . And to see or heare that the royal person of our Souerayne lady was in danger was pleasing to them . As contrarywise the newes of her happie escape was irk some . So that , where there is only the bare sense of a true English ha●t , these popish recusantes cannot bewitche or deceyue with their hypocritical holinesse , or ciuil honestie , and so I leaue them .

Though you wil leaue them ( Sir hoatespur ) in this your choler , yet mean I not to leaue either them or you , vntil this matter be better examined . And first in this inuectiue , if we take away railing speach without proof , there is nothing added to that you haue scolded before , against the recusantes . And if in the rest we consider how you stammer stil at the good opinion of Catholiques , fained holinesse , and ciuil honest lyf ( a hard bone as it seemeth for you to disgest ) there is much to their praise and commendation in this your accusation . But yet to shift off this matter , and to bring in contempt the persuasion of their good life , and to induce men not to make account thereof , and much lesse to be bewitched ( as your phrase is ) by the same , you require the sense only of a true bare English hart to resist this witchcraft of perswading by good woorkes , A bare English hart what it is . and what you mean by a bare english hart to serue you in this conflict , I know not , except it be som hard heathenish hart , as strong as flint , to resist the knockes of all Gods motions , and as bare of all piety , remorse , and conscience , as yours seemeth to be , to which also if you do adde the English cutte ( as hartes go there for the most parte among protestantes at this day ) and furthermore if it be so truely and barely English , as it hath seen no other countries , , nor knowen other paradice then English earth , nor thought of other blisse then with you is comonly treated , and that it be as seruilly tyed to oxen , and steeres , and other temporal base comodities , as your soule sheweth it self to be . And that for a further perfection , it be seasoned also with a dram or two of your English sole faith & bare beleef , to the contempt and hatred of all good woorkes : this hart ( I say ) and the onely bare sence thereof , which you repuire , is sufficient not onely to resist the bewitching of recusants good life , but of all other Saintes besides , and of Christe himself : and to condemn their scrupulous standing in defence of their consciences , for folly or hipocrisie , as heer you do the scrupulosity of English recusantes , for refusing to go to churche , but we do measure the matter by an other ballance , then by the sense of so bare an English hart , and so no merueil though we agree not in the weight and poyz of that which is weighed .

And thus I might leaue ( Sir Francis ) now with some disaduantage perhaps of his side , as he before in haste would leaue the recusantes , were it not that I desire to see some proofe also of his skil and learning , as we haue seen ouer much of his lauishing tongue , and rayling . Let vs examin then how substantially he doth prooue , that Catholique recusautes ought to make no more bones at the matter , but go to the Protestantes churches without staggering or scruple .

I hold it ( saith he ) for a sound ground and not to be controlled , that euery christian ought to striue to keep these three thinges sound within his brest : his conscience before God , his loyaltie to his prince , and his loue to his countrie . All which three ( for my parte ) I account so nearly conioyned each to other , as they cannot iustly be seuered .

Heer I will pose Sir Francis in this his position and grownd , which he saith is so vniuersally true , as it may not be controlled , and therby you shal see both the knightes diuinity and conscience together .

Can a mannes conscience to God neuer be iustly seuered from the external obedience of his prince , An absurd position of Sir Francis . and naturall loue of his country ? Gen. 12. & 19. How then was Abraham commanded by God to abandon his country , and Lot the same ? How were the ten tribes of Israel incited by God ( as himself testifyeth after ) to leaue their obedience to their lawful and natural king Roboam , and the loue they had to their ancient common-wealth , 3. Reg. 12. and to set vp Ieroboam , a stranger , against the one and the other ? 4. Reg. 3. How did Elizeus the Prophet send one of his disciples to persuade Iehu a subiect , to rise and rebel against his lawful and natural king and maister Ioram , and to slay both him and his mother the Queen together , as he did , and turned vpside down that whole common-wealth ? How did the Prophet Ieremie perswade the inhabitantes of Hierusalem to deliuer vp that cittie and common-wealth , Hier. 38. 39. 40. &c. agaynst the kinges will , into the handes of the enemie Nabuchodonasor and his captaynes , which seemed great treason both to king and countrie ; and yet was allowed or rather commanded by God himself .

And to come neer home to Christian Princes , how did that famous holy Athanasius so often abandon his countrie of Egipt and Alexandria , and resist the commandmentes of diuers Emperours his temporal liege lordes ( though infected with heresie . How did Eusebius Vercellensis , Ruff. lib. 1. cap. 18. Hilarius of france , and others , do the same , resisting both Prince and countrie for religions sake , as most notoriously is knowen ? Zozom. lib. 3. cap. 12. And can there no cause then fall out which maie iustly seuer a mans conscience from the temporal obeying of his Princes wil and commandement , Socrat. lib. 3. cap. 4. or the lawes of his countrie ? What A●heist would euer say so ? or what fond man would euer put a position for absolute and vncontrolable , that may be checked with so many instances to the contrarie ? for except he wil say a prince cannot erre , nor command a thing dissonant to Gods law , or to right , reason , or good conscience , or that a mannes countrie cannot go wrong , or runn astray , or that we are bound to conforme our consciences to whatsoeuer the prince or countrie apointeth , be it right or wrong in matters of religion , there is no way to defend this fond principle and heathenish position .

The wisdom of God saieth to a deuout soule , Psal. 44. Au●i filia & vide &c. Hearken daughter and consider , and bend thy eare , and forget thy owne people , and thy fathers house &c. Christe also alloweth greatly of them that dispise father and mother , and countrie , and kinred , yea they are willed to hate them , Math. 17. Luc. 12. and to make war against them , for his sake , and consequently also the like is willed against princes in the same cause , for that the obligation to obey fathers is greater then to princes , and so we see that there may happen occasions , wherin conscience to God may be iustly seuered from obedience to princes , and from worldly loue to our earthly countrie .

But for that this animalis homo ( as before hath bin noted ) doth not perceiue , 1. Cor. 2. nor feel the things that be of the spirit of God , I wil reason no further in spiritual conceiptes with him , but wil pose him with more palpable argumentes about his own protestantes . Let him tel me then , what did the protestantes that fled to Geneua in Queen Maries time , Domestical examples . or rebelled at home ? those that rose in Scotland against their true lawful Queenes , the mother and daughter ? Those that haue made warres so many yeares in Flanders and France , against their natural true kinges , went all those three thinges together in them , to wit , conscience to God , obedience to their princes , and loue to the present state of their countries ? Speak heer Sir knight , and defend your sound ground and vncontrollable position : you see how vayne and false a proposition it is ; but yet the refuge of this peoples defence in all their fancies and follies , is , their shew of some wordes of Scripture to proue the same , wherin also our knight will needes proue himself a Rabbyne . Let vs examin briefly how substantially he performeth the matter .

Our conscience ( saith he ) cannot but tell vs , that all obedience is dew to the soueraigne Magistrate , for we are taught it out of the booke of conscience , the holie scriptures , which teach vs that we must subiect our selues to all manner of ordinance of man for the Lords sake , 1. Pet. 2. whether it be vnto the king , as vnto the superior , &c.

Thus far Sir Francis . And heerby you shal discern , how wholesome a thing Scripture is , About obedience to temporal Princes . in the hand of an ignorant or sensual mynded man , euen as pretious stones before hogges , as Scripture it self doth àffirm . For in these few wordes , as Sir Francis alleageth them , may be founded the perfect sect of the Herodians , that made Herods pleasure , the rule and platforme of their conscience and actions . Our conscience ( sayth he ) must needes tel vs that all obedience is due to the soueraigne Magistrate . Yea , all obedience ? what conscience the knight teleth vs , of the conscience of an atheist , or of a seruile minde , proiected to the beck and pleasure of earthly princes ? Sure I am , that the conscience of Saint Peter and his fellow Apostles , taught them not so , when they answered the lawfull magistrates of Hierusalem , that commanded them to speak no more of the afaires of Christe , ●at they would rather obey God then their commandement , Acts. ● . ergo , these mennes consciences , had not yet told them , that all obedience without exception , was due to the ciuil Magistrate . S. Paules conscience also told him not so , when he refused to obey the commandement of Nero , and died for the same , and so did many other Martyrs , for resisting both him and other princes and lawful magistrates , in Gods cause . And it is a special praise giuen to Martyrs by the churche in their feasts , contempserunt iussa principum , they contemned the commandementes of princes , for Christes sake . How then saith this Herodian knight that all obedience must be yeelded to them in all matters without exception ? let vs see how he proueth it .

We are taught it ( saith he ) out of the booke of conscience ; by the wordes now alleaged of Saint Peter , False taanslation . Submit your selues to all manner of ordinance of man .

But first I would aske him with what conscience , doth he corrupt and falsly alleage this booke of conscience , for the wordes of Saint Peter are , 1. Pet. 2. Subiecti estote omni humanae creaturae propter Deum , siue Regi quasi praecellenti , siue ducibus ab eo missis . Be subiect to euery humane creature for Gods sake ( meaning thereby the ciuil magistrate elected by the comon-wealth ) whether it be to the king , as more eminent then the rest , or vnto captaines and vnder magistrates sent from him : why doth Sir Francis translate omni humanae craturae ( which is the very same also in Greek ) all manner of ordinance of man ? but that it serued more to his purpose , and they can make their booke of conscience to say what they will haue sayd without scruple of conscience : why doth Sir Francis translate , siue Regi quasi praecellenti , whether it be to the king as superior &c. and why doth he cunningly leaue out the wordes that follow immediatly , or to the Captaynes ( or vnder Magistrates ) sent by him , &c. but that he would make Saynt Peter to say , that the king is absolute superior , and that all obedience is due vnto him , as to the Soueraigne magistrate as this sely man hath taken vpon him to teach vs , though Saynt Peter doth name also the inferior magistrates in lyke manner , and sayth only , that the king is to be obeyed as the more eminent among them , but yet putteth him not for absolute , or that all obedience is due to him , as our man would haue men now beleeue , for that it maketh to his purpose , and therby euacuateth the precept of Saynt Paule , who appoynteth to Christians an other obedience also , far different from that of kinges and temporal Princes in matters , belonging to their soules , when he sayth , Hebrae . 13. Obedite praepositis vestris & subiacete eis , ipse enim peruigilant , quasi rationem pro animabus vestris reddituri . Obey your Prelates , and ly vnder them , for that they do keep diligent wach ouer you , as men that must render account of your soules .

And who those Prelates be , Spiritual go uernours . the same Apostle expoundeth in an other place , when he speaking to them selues , sayth , Attend to your selues and the whole flocke , Acts. 20. ouer which the holie Ghost hath placed you for Bishops to gouern the churche of God , which he hath purchased with his owne blood . Which wordes of tender loue and prerogatiue ( to be placed in their dignities by the hand of the holie ghost himself , ouer the chosen people that God had bought with his owne pretious blood ) we shal neuer read to haue bin spoken to temporal kings and princes , and consequently all obedience is not so absolutely due to them , as this prophane diuine holdeth , but much is also to be reserued for the others , and in matters of highest moment .

First then we see , most manifest falshood and trecherie vsed heer , by this our Bible-clerk-knight in corrupting and translating wrongfully for his purpose this litle peece of Scripture alleaged by him , what would he do think you if he had to alleage many places , seing he handleth so pittifully this one only ? Secondly , we may see the egregious absurditie and impietie of the sense which he would pick out thereof , to wit , that all obedience absolutely , and in all matters and causes , is to be yeilded to the soueraygn temporal magistrate without restraint : and consequently also , Most absurd doctrine . that all manner of their ordinances and lawes are to be obeyed without exception . Which doctrine if it be true , then were the Apostles bound to go to the Infidels temples and sacrifiise also , when they were commanded : for that no man wil deny , but that this precept of obedience set downe heer by Saint Peter , was ment expresly and particulerly for obeying the seculer magistrates and princes of that time : all which were Infidels commonly , and Idolaters . So as if there were no exception of causes , then did Saint Peter himself ( that giueth the precept ) verie euil , in not obeying the magistrates of Iurie first , and after in refusing to obey Nero the Emperor , when he willed him to consorme himself in matters of religion .

And if there be any exception of causes or matters , wherin by Gods law , princes may be disobeyed , then impiously and fondly is it set downe heer by Sir Francis so resolutely , as out of Scripture , that all obedience is due to the soueraygne magistrate , and that also ( as his words be ) in all manner of ordinances without exception , which heath enis●h doctrin includeth a thowsand denyals of God himself . And further I say , that the same is fondly affirmed , for that the Protestantes greatest contention hath byn hitherto agaynst Catholiques , to the end , that they should not obey the preceptes of men , though they were set downe by the whole Churche , and now cometh in this guylt spurre-Doctor with a quy●e contrarie ground , that we must submit our selues to all manner of ordinance of man . Which is as far to the other extreme of base seruilitie , as the former was to the contrarie , of pryde , to obey no ordinance of man at all , they prouing the same then by that text of our Sauiour , Mat. 15. 1. Pet. 2. In vayne do they worship me teaching the doctrine and preceptes of men . And now the contrarie by Saint Peter , that we must obey all manner of mennes ordinance , which yet Saint Peter sayeth not , but Sir Francis falsly alleageth him .

And by this you see how these poor people do range vp & downe without rule , limit , or certayne ground at all but only their own will and present fancie . Moreouer I saie that this text of Saynt Peter of obeying ciuil magistrates ( though it were so as he alleageth it ) yet is it verie impertinently alleaged agaynst Catholiques in our controuersie about their not going to protestantes churches , for that they do offer all due obedience in temporal and ciuil actions vnto their temporal magistrate . How recusantes do obey , and how they may not . And do stand only in matters of religion , that concerne their soules and consciences , and consequently this text is nothing to the purpose agaynst them in that behalf . And with this I will leaue also Sir Francis as simple a soule as I founde him , but yet somewhat more shufled out of his cloutes , and discouered for a conscienceles corrupter of his booke of conscience .

To Catholique recusantes whome he impugneth I can say no more , but that they are happie men to haue such an aduersarie , A speech to catholique recusantes . and that the course which they haue hitherto held is most honorable and pious before God and man , I meane in shewing first their dutie towardes God , by standing constantly and suffering for their conscience : and secondly in offering all loyal obedience in temporal causes to their liege prince . And lastly in edifying their neighbours by their good lyfe and behaueour . Which is the exhortation of Saynt Peter in this verie place alleaged . Hauing your conuersation good ( sayth he ) among these people , in such sorte , as they considering your good woorkes , 1. Pet. 2. in that they go about to slander you as wicked men , God may be glorified therby in the day of his visitation . And agayne , the will of God is , that you by your good lyf , do stop the mouthes of foolish and ignorant men , that talke agaynst you , &c. And yet further , this is a great grace if any man suffer sorow for his conscience towardes God , being afflicted vniustly , for if you suffer for sinne ( ●or euil lyf ) it is no glorie but if while you liue well , you do suffer patiently , it is a great grace with God ●for in this is your vocation , and to this you are called , for that Christ suffered so for vs , and left you example to follow his steppes , &c.

And as for obedience , you are to yeeld it simply ( my deare brethren ) and playnly ( as I haue sayed ) with a true loyal harte and good will , as vnto Christe himself , vnto all kynde of magistrates whatsoeuer , temporal or spiritual , though yet with that distinction which Christe him self appoynted , quae sunt Caesaris , Caesari , quae sunt Dei Deo , geuing vnto Caesar , those thinges that are Caesars , and reseruing to God those thinges that are Gods . Math. 22. Which distinction Saynt Paul to the Romans expoundeth more particularly , Marc. 12. when hauing commanded all superior powers to be obeyed euen for conscience sake , as the ministers of God , though they were Gentils , he setteth downe this conclusion Geue therefore to all sortes of men those thinges that are due vnto them , Rom. 13. tribute , to whome tribute , tole , to whome ●●le , feare , to whome feare honor to whome honor belongeth .

Vnto our temporal prince and head of our earthly common-wealth , Temporal . Magistrate . whereof we are citizens , we owe all temporal obedience in ciuil matters , according to the law of God , nature , and nations , and according to the particular ordinances of the countrie wherin we dwel ; and so we are to serue him with our bodies , goodes , life , and whatsoeuer other earthly meanes or comoditie we haue besides , 1. Pet. 2. Rom. 13. in all iust causes . And this with all honor , fidelitie , redines , alacritie , and promptnes of minde , as to the minister of God , ordayned ( as both the forenamed Apostles say ) for punishing of the wicked , and comforting the good . And this obedience was due also vnto heathen magistrates in Christes time : Note this point . for in this temporal go●ernment , Christ altered nothing at all , but left it as he found it . And for that some Christians after Christes ascention , partly by the comon opinion of the Iewes , who held that the Messias should make them free from all temporal subiection , and partly vpon those woordes of Christe himself in Saint Iohns Ghospel , Ioan. 8. si ergo vos filias liberauerit , verè liberi eritis , if the sonne of God once deliuer you , you shal be truely free ( which was meant of spirituall freedom ) yet for that some Christians imagined that they were now free from obedience also of temporal magistrates , the foresayd two chief Apostles , Saint Peter and Saint Paule , Rom. 13. 1. Pet. 2. took vpon them most earnestly to remoue this error , in the places alleaged , and to persuade all due temporal obedience also , in all ciuil afaires , to the ciuil magistrate , of what life or religion soeuer he were .

I say in temporal and ciuil afaires , for as for matters of religion and the soule , no man of sence or iudgment , will imagin that the said Apostles would bynd christians to obey those ciuil magistrates , that were not yet christians in the Apostles dayes , nor euer ment to be , but rather persecutors .

And heerof also insueth , that their must needes be some other distinct superioritie and gouernment for matters of the soule , Spiritual magistrate . whereof I shewed the commandement before out of Saint Paule , and it is that which we commonly call Ecclesiasticall or Spiritual gouernment , concerning afaires of religion and conscience . And this gouernment ouer soules , Christe himself came properly downe from heauen to found and erect vpon earth , and to make himself head thereof : being a gouernment far different from the other , whereof he would take no parte at all , and so he fled when the people would haue made him a king : and to Pilate he denyed that his kingdom was of this world : Ioan. 6. and being called vpon to deuide the inheritance between two brethren ( which was an act aperteining to the temporall magistrate ) he answered , Luc. 12. who hath apointed me a Iudge or a deuider ouer you ? But yet when he talked of the o●her superioritie that aperteineth to teaching , instructing , and gouerning of soules , be acknowleged his authoritie . Ioan. 13. You call me maister and Lord ( sayth he in one place to his disciples ) and you say wel for I am so . Math. 23. And again in an other place your only maister is Christe , &c.

This superioritie therfore and tribunal ouer soules , for instructing , directing , chastising , bynding and loosing of sinnes , and the lyke , Christ did peculierly erect and setle at his being here , making himself the head , and leauing his Apostles and their successours for his substitutes , to guyd the same vnder him vnto the worldes end . Neither did Christe at his departure commit this authoritie , or any parte therof , vnto Caesar , or vnto any other temporal prince , but to his Apostles , geuing them that supreme dignitie in ioynt commission with his owne person , when he saied , who heareth you , heareth me , and who contemneth you , contemneth me . Luc. 10. Nor did Saynt Paule when he talked of matters of the soule , subiect Christians vnto Caesar , or vnto temporal princes as he did in temporal affaires , but vnto their prelates , as before hath byn alleaged , Heb. 13. and addeth this reason , for that they wach for vs and are to yeild account of our soules to almightie God , as a matter of their peculiar charge .

And to the end it should appeare how distinct and different these two gouernments and iurisdictions are , Temporal and spiritual iurisdiction . Christ prouided that this spiritual gouernment of his Churche should stand in the world for three hundred yeares together ; without any temporal gouernment at all in the hand of Christian Princes , to wit , vntil the tyme of Constantyne the greate , and then and after , when any temporal kinges and princes were conuerted and made Christians ( as our Ethelbertus king of kent , king Clodoueus of France , and others ) all entered and submitted them selues vnder this spiritual gouernment of the Christian Churche and prelates therof , as subiectes and not as superiours , as sheep and not as pastors , and as children vnder their fathers and prelates , and not as commanders in that behalf . And so they continued still for many ages together , contented with their princely authoritie in ciuil matters , and with their subiection in Ecclesiastical , vntill certayn libertyne heretiques of our tyme , to put themselues out of the burthen of obedience to their Ecclesiastical superiours , haue sought to trooble and confound this holy distinction , appoynted by our Sauiour , and to cast both gouernmentes and iurisdictions into the handes of the temporal magistrate , therby to make a confusion , Occham to the Emperour . and to be free themselues from correction , due vnto their wickednes and dissolution , and crying to temporal princes ( as one did in the lyke case ) defend you vs with the sword , & we shall honor and defend you with the word . And this is the true state of matters in this behalf : whereby the godly proceeding of our English recusantes is most cleerly iustified , and the prophane flaterie of their aduersaries discouered And with this I end the sixth incounter with S. Francis .

THE SEVENTH INCOVNTER , ABOVT FORRAYNE PRINCFS AND NAtions : And first concerning the Pope of Rome .

IF the immodestie of Sir Francis railing speeches and calumniations , had conteined it self within the compas of home-born subiects , and had not ouerlauished also to the open iniurie and slander of forrain potentates and nations ; the matter might more easily haue bin passed ouer and dissembled ; for that he sitting at home , vnder the fauour of the state and present time , hath more libertie therby to raile at his pleasure , and to tiranize with his tongue ouer such as are their kept downe , and dare not answere him or reply . But when with the same audacitie ( or impudencie rather ) he will presume to vse the like approbrious speaches against the sacred honors of anointed princes , and the greatest monarches of Christendome , contrarie to the law both of nature and nations ; he is to be restrained and checked euen for the very honor of England it self , and our nation , and so I mean to do in this seuenth incounter .

And to begin with his raging at the Bishop of Rome , calling him the proud Priest and arche-prelate of Rome , bloody monster , Antechriste , the man of sinne , Opprobtiousspeaches the sonne of perdition , and other like vnseemly tearmes , and wicked maledictions : the answere were quickly made , if I would be as cholerique and immodest as he , and say , that these are but rauings of a lunatique brain , and belkings of a burthened stomake , with the surfet of heresie : and other such like tearmes , but I wil not incounter in this kinde with him , but rather will endeuour to ouerrule him by reason , and conuince him by argument , if he be capable of the one or the other .

First then , that the Popes of Rome be Antechristes or the man of sinne , Whether the Popes of Rome be Antichris●●● whereof Daniel , our Sauiour Christe , and his Apostles do speake , and that Rome is Babilon ( in the sense that these goodfellowes do mean , that is , Rome Christened ) it is a meer iest ; and inuented by a scoffing Apostata fryar or two , and mayntained by men of like humor and qualities And in deed the iest is fitter to entertain some pleasant crew at a tauern or alebench , then to moue any learned auditory or discreet reader , though it be frequent matter in English pulpits at this day , for that as the true Christe was one singuler man , so shall the true Antechriste be a particuler man also , Antich . one man . and not any succession of men , one after another , as the Popes of Rome are ; and this is euidently gathered by the ancient fathers , out of the wordes of diuers holy Scriptures , as namely Daniel . 7. & 11. Ioan. 5. 2. Thess. 2. 1. Ioan. 2. Apoc. 13. & , 17.

Moreouer the Iewes shal receiue the true Antechriste for their Messias , as they refused to receiue Christe , and so Christe sayeth plainly Ioan. 5. vers. 43. I came in the name of my father , Antichrist declared by the Iewes . and you receiue me not , if an other come in his own name him you shall receiue &c. but it is not likely that the Iewes wil receiue the Pope of Rome for their Messias , and much lesse so many Popes as are already dead .

The Gospel and doctrine of Christe must be first preached to all nations before the true Antechriste come , Antichrist when . Math. 24. & , 2. Thess. 2. and so the consent of old Doctors vpon these places do agree , which thing is not yet fulfilled , as Saint Augustin in his time did largely declare , Epist. 80. and we may also shew in ours much more , by the vaste infidel countries daily discouered .

The proper Antechriste by all reason and likelyhood , must be a Iew borne , and circumsized , and will professe ( at least for a whyle ) to keep the Iewes Saboth , and the other ceremonies of the old law , Antichrist a Iew . to draw them after him . And they shal accept of him for their Messias , as before hath bin shewed out of Christes owne woords , which they would neuer do , except he were a Iew both by generation and profession . Of which two things neither can be verified of the Popes of Rome , to wit , that they are either Iewes by birth , or do professe the Iewish doctrine , and therefore they can not be Antichriste .

Antechriste when he cometh shal pitch his kingdome in the citie of Hierusalem , Antichrist in Hierusalem . and go about to restore the temple of Salomon , as is plainly gathered out of Saint Iohns woords in the Apoc. cap. 11. where he saith , that the bodies of Hen●ch and Helias that shal be slain by him , shal lye vnburied in the streetes of that great Citie , where their lord was crucified . And the same is deduced out of the same booke . cap. 17. and out of Saint Paules woords 2. Thess. 2. and by many ancient writers . And how then can the Popes of Rome be sayd to be Antechriste ?

Three principal heades of Antechristes diuelish doctrine when he cometh , Antichrists doctrine . are gathered plainly out of holy Scriptures . The first , that he shal deny Iesus to be christe , 1. Ioan. 2. vers. 22. and consequently shal deny Baptisme , and all other Sacraments and doctrine brought in by Christe . The second that he shal teach , himself to be true Christe , and the Iewes shall beleeue him . Ioan. 5. The third , that he shall affirm himself to be God , and so requier to be adored for God , 2. Thess 2. v. 4. but the Popes of Rome do not teach these pointes of doctrine hitherto and therfore cannot be Antechriste .

Agayne scriptures do teach vs , that Antichriste when he commeth shal woorke many wonderful miracles in the sight of men , Antichrists miracles . Math. 24. & 2. Thess. 2. and some of those miracles are specified Apoc. 13. to wit that he shall make fyer descend from heauen , and the image of a beast to speake , and fayne himself to dye and rise agayne , but these miracles no Popes hitherto haue wrought , or do woorke , ergo &c.

Anthichrist shall raigne but three yeares and a half , when he commeth , Antichrists tyme of raigne . as is gathered by ancient wryters , out of the Prophet Daniel , chapter 7. and 12. and out of the 12. chapter of the Apocalips where it is sayd that he shall reigne a tyme , & tymes , & half a tyme , for so S. Iohn himself interpreteth the matter c. 11. & 13. saying it shal be for 42. monethes , which make iust three yeares & a half , but the Popes of Rome haue raigned for more ages then these are yeares , and consequently cannot be Antichrist .

Beside this , the Scripture teacheth vs plainly , that before Antechrist come , Henoch & Helias . Henoch and Helias shall returne againe , to oppose themselues against him , and in the end shall conuert the Iewes , Malach. 4. Ecclesi . 48. Math. 17. Apoc. 11. but we see not yet this poynt fulfilled , to proue the Pope to be Antechriste , ergo , &c.

Lastly , ( for I will be no longer in this matter ) streight after the end of Antechristes kingdome ( which shall endure but three years and a half , Day of iugdment . as before hath bin shewed ) shal ensew the day of iudgment and consummation of the world , as the Prophet Daniel foretelleth cap. 7. and Saint Iohn in the Apoc. cap. 20. and the same is gathered out of Christes own wordes also , Math. 24. and the foresaid Prophet Daniel speaking againe of this matter in the 12. chapter , saith , that the kingdome of Antechriste shall endure a thowsand , two hundreth , and ninetie dayes , which maketh the former number of three years and a half . And then he addeth these woordes , happy is he that expecteth and ariueth vnto a thowsand three hundreth and thirtie and fiue dayes ( which is fourtie and fiue dayes after the death of Antechriste ) for that then Christe comming to iudgment , shall bring the crownes of iustice for those that are victors &c. And seeing that the Popes of Rome haue endured now so long , & yet the end of world hath not ensued , it is manifest as wel by this reason , as by all the other before alleaged , that these Popes cannot be properly Antechriste , as our new malignant raylers do affirm .

But it may be some wil say ( seeing the absurditie of the former false position ) that the Pope of Rome is not properly , How there are many Antichristes that Antechriste which is foretold by the scriptures , but only a forerunner of his , and such as disposeth the way to his comming , at the end of the world , in which sense Saint Iohn hauing sayd , Children this is the last houre , 1. Loan . 2. and as you haue heard Antechriste commeth , or is to come ( for so the greek verb signifieth plainly , being of the present tense , and not of the time past , 〈◊〉〈◊〉〈◊〉〈◊〉〈◊〉 venit . where the latin is doubtful , and may be taken both wayes ) Saint Iohn ( I say ) hauing foretold in his epistle that Antechrist was to come in this last houre or age of the world after the appearing of the true Christe , he addeth immediatly these wordes . And euen now many Antechristes are made , and therby we know that this is the last houre &c. Which is , as if he had sayd , that forasmuch as we do see many become Antechristes ( that is to say do become opposite to Christe both in spirit and operation ) and doo begin to worke the misterie of iniq●itie ( as Saint paule calleth it ) agaynst true Antechristes comming , heerby we know that this is the laste age from Christe to Antechriste , 2. Thessal. 2. and so to the worldes end , which immediatly is to ensew after Antechristes ariual .

If I say our knight and his compagnions will confesse this , that the Pope of Rome is not that proper Antechriste foretold heer by Saint Iohn , to come in the end of the world but only that he is one of those other forerunning Antechristes , already made and appearing in S. Iohns dayes to prepare the way ( which yet no heretique nor Sir Francis himself though neuer so shameles , will da●e to auow of the Bishops of Rome of the primitiue churche , when Saint Iohn wrote those wordes , that they were Antechristes , they being known to be Saintes and holy martirs for some ages together ) if this I say be graunted ; then it followeth , that all these mennes ianglings in bookes and pulpits , against the Popes of Rome to proue them Antechristes , faleth to the ground , and is made ridiculous , for that in this sense all euil men whatsoeuer , may be called Antechristes ( that is contrarie to Christe ) who do woorke iniquitie and cooperate to the kingdome of sinne , which Christe came to ouerthrow ; and so all Turkes , Moores , Tyrants , Persecutors and other wicked people are Antechristes in this sense , as forerunners of true Antechriste and contrarie to Christe , neither is there any thing peculier to the Popes of Rome , though we should confesse them to be neuer so wicked in life , but the very truthe is , that principally and aboue others in this sense the name of Antechriste is proper to heretiques and sectaries who vnder the name of Christe , do impugne Christe , and leauing the common receiued vnion of fayth , do finde out contrarie pathes by themselues . And against such men did Saint Iohn especially speake those wordes , that many Antechristes were already made , to wit , the Ebionites , Cer●●thians , and Nicholaites then newly sprong vp . And for this cause also doth he say , Antichristi facti sunt , they are made Antichristes , and not borne so , for that by their owne malice they made themselues such , in departing from vnion . And now whether Popes or the Protestants do participate more of this qualitie of heretical Antichriste , by breaking vnion in faith and religion from the whole bodie of Christendome , I leaue to the discreet reader to ponder . And thus much may serue about calling the Pope Antichriste .

As for Rome , How Rome is Babylon . whether it be Babilon or no , litle importeth it to the matter we haue in hand , so we agree in the sense : for not only Saint Iohn in his Apocalips , but Saint Peeter also in his epistle , doth call Rome Babilon , and we deny it not , for it was in respect of the great confusion of iniquitie , Idolatrie , and persecution , that the infidel Emperours vsed , and were to vse against Gods Saints . But that either Saint Iohn , or Saint Peeter , did call is Babilon in respect of the Christians that were in it at that tyme , I think Sir Francis himself will blush to say , and consequently the name of Babilon giuen to Rome when it was impious and pagan , aperteineth nothing to Rome now after it is Christian ; nor hath this fond obiection need of any further answere .

For the rest of the rayling and contumelious speach , wherby the Pope is termed the proud Priest & Archeprelat of Rome , touching the words Priest and Prelat , they are names of his dignitie , as they were in Christe and the Apostles themselues , About the Popes external honor . who were both Priests and Prelates , & Arche-prelates also , in that they were more principal then others . As for prowd , that dependeth of the Popes inward disposition , which our knight ought to haue knowen in all law of good christianitie , how it standeth , before he auowch it outwardly . For if he iudge only by the external shew , and outward honor of his estate , he may as wel condemn of pride , all other princes and great men in the world , for admitting honor according to their degrees , and among others , our present Bishops of England may be called in question ( as they are by the puritanes ) for being termed lords , and for the lord-lyk honor donn vnto them in outward demeanure . To the Lords also of her Maiesties counsel may be obiected the like , for causing men to kneel vnto them at the counsel table , and such other like external honor admitted .

As for bloody monster , it is a monstrous slander , and a great monstruositie of inciuilitie in a gentlemans mouth , so to speake : for it is wel knowen that the Bishop of Rome that now is , and many of his predecessors in our dayes and eyes , haue vsed and do vse dayly , great curtesies to infinite protestantes , that passe through their states . And as for blood , I think verely , that there hath bin more shed in onely London for religion in one year , within these last twenty that haue passed , then in all the whole twentie , within all the townes , citties , and states of the Bishop of Rome , and this is easie to be verefied .

Well then ( Sir knight ) you rayl at randon , and litle do you seem to think or consider what peril of Godes iustice may hang ouer you for the same . The peril of Sir Francis rayling . Exod. 22. Leuit. 20. You may remember it is written , principi populi tui non maledices : and agayne , qui patri suo maledixerit , morte moriatur . The Bishop of Rome hath euer byn held for our spiritual prince and parent in England , vntill with in these few yeares , and so is he still holden by all Catholique kingdomes round about vs , and in ours also by such as follow the old vniuersal fayth , which if it be true , then are you in danger of damnation by this your fury . And you remember that Saynt Paule was so respectiue of this danger , that hauing spoken a hastie worde agaynst Ananias , calling him whyted walle , for an open iniurie donn vnto him in publique iudgement agaynst the law , Act. 23. yet when he vnderstood he was high priest ( notwithstanding S Paule wel knew that his priesthood now was nothing worth , the old law being abrogated by the death of Christe , he did openly recall his word agayne , and shewed to be sorowfull for hauing spoken it agaynst one that bore that tytle . But Sir Francis hath no such feeling or remorse of conscience in him , for that he is not gouerned by the same spirit of humilitie and pietie that Saynt Paule was , wherunto notwithstanding I would gladly persuade him if I might , and for that respect do mean to alleage vnto him the considerations insuing , about the Bishop of Rome .

First , himself in the 31. page of this his libel hath these wordes , The Lord from heauen commandeth to all men vpon earth , Rom. 13. that euery soule should be subiect to the higher powers , for there is no power but of God , and euerie power is ordayned of God . How power is to be respected . Which wordes if they be true , then must the Popes power also be of God , seing it hath byn an acknowledged power by all Christendome for so many yeares and ages , & not only for a lawful power but also for a holy and supreme spiritual power , and then let men iudge in what cause Sir Francis standeth that not only resisteth , but reuileth also this sacred power , notwithstanding that the illation which Saynt Paule inferreth immediatly after the former wordes , is this , wherfore he that resisteth power , resisteth Gods ordination , & those that resist Gods ordination , do purchase damnation vnto themselues .

More ouer , that saying of Christ vnto the Apostles , he that heareth you , Luc. 10. heareth me , was not spoken only for them selues , but for all their successors also , that by succession should gouern the churche vnto the worlds end , as all men wil confesse . And conseqently the other parte also of the same sentence , he that contemneth you , contemneth me , must needes in like manner belong vnto the same man . And that the Bishops of Rome be successors in the Apostle Saint Peeters seat , is no lesse manifest to all men of vnderstanding and learning . And albeit Sir Francis will say presently , that they follow not Saint Peeters steps ( and wil proue it at leisure ) yet if that were true , the princes authority is not taken away by his euil life or deportement , for then should we haue few true princes in the world . But aboue all others it pleased Christe himself to take away this obiection touching Popes and Ecclesiasticall princes , when he sayd , that vpon the chaire of Moyses should sit both Scribes and Pharisees , Math. 23. and that we should notwithstanding obserue and do whatsoeuer they sayd , but not according to their woorkes . So as stil there remaineth the obligation to obey them , though their liues and hehaueour were not correspondent , but much more the obligation not to slander , contemn , and reuile them , as our harebrain and headlong knight doth .

I say it is harebrain and headlong dealing , Harebrayne and hed longe dealings of Sir Francis . to runne so furiously in so dangerous a path as this is . For besides that maledicus , a railing tongued man , is placed by Saint Paule among them , that shall neuer attaine the kingdome of heauen : it is much more grieuous sinne to vse this vice agaynst Magistrates , 1. Cor. 5. & 6. that represent the power of almightie God , and far yet greater agaynst spiritual magistrates , that haue this authoritie in a far higher degree then temporal magistrates , but most of all agaynst him that representeth immediately the person of Christe Iesus vpon earth , which is the Bishop of Rome as presently more particulerly shal be shewed .

Furthermore if all the holy and learned men of Christendom haue not bin deceiued for so many ages together , as they haue confessed this general doctrine , of the Pope of Rome his prerogatiue , without doubt or contradiction : then is Sir Francis out of his way , then is he in the open path of perdition , then is he furious , frantik and besides himself , in rayling as he doth . And that this only vniform consent of such and so many holy learned men gon before vs , were a sufficient argument to make any man ( that were discreet and fearing God ) to enter into doubt ( at least of his doing in this behalf ) cannot in reason be denied : and so without doubt would Sir Francis also do , if his temporal life lay on the bargain as his eternal doth .

For let me aske Sir Francis , if an herb should be presented to him to eat , A demonstration agaynst Sir Francis madnes . that all learned phisitians for a thowsand yeares together haue held for strong poyson , and onely som one or two of later yeares haue begonne to teache the contrarie without actual experience whether it be so or no , but only by discourse and new argumentes of their owne , would he abstayne to eat it ( think you ) or no ? Or if an action should be offered him in England , which by all old lawyers iudgment of former tymes hath byn taken for high treason ipso facto , and losse of lyfe & landes though some ●iewer lawyers were of contrarie opinion that now it is not , I persuade my self S. Francis would looke twyce er he lept once in committing that action , for the loue he beareth to his temporally f●nd state : but in this other case though all ancient diuynes and doctors for aboue a thowsand yeares together haue taught that it is blasphemie to rayle at the Bishop of Rome appoynted by Christ to gouerne in his place , and damnation not to acknowledge his authoritie , and only Martin Luther a loose Apostata fryer , and Sir Iohn Caluin a sear-backt priest for sodomie , Luther . Caluin . haue begonne in our dayes to teache the contrarie for feare to be punished by him for their wickednes , yet Sir Francis rusheth on and casteth at all , and will hazarde hell and all eternitie of tormentes theron depending , rather then not to satisfie his passion in this poynt and please the state , wherin he liueth , by shewing himself a forward man . And who will deny , this to be headlong and hare brayne dealing .

And yet further though this vniuersall consent of Christendome , agaynst two or three so contemptible authors of nouelties be more then sufficient to induce any man of reason to looke about him , and to consider what he doth , and whether he may adventure his soule vpon such inequalitie of testimonies as this is , between two or three nouellants and twentie millions of holy and graue ancients ( which difference of witnesses I suppose would preuayle in Westminster-hall , with any equal and discreet iudge or iurie ) yet for further light to such as wilfullie will not shut their eares and eyes , I will set downe heer some other considerations also to the same effect , besides the prescription of tyme and antiquitie before mentioned , and besides the weight and number of so many holy and learned mennes iudgmentes of former ages , whom yet in reason we cannot presume to be inferior to ours , if we be not ouer fond and passionate in our owne cause .

First then , it cannot be imagined , Diuers reasons for the Bishop of of R●ome his preheminence . but that Christe our Sauiour instituted a churche to continew , and to be gouerned , not only for that first age after himself , but euen vntil the worlds end , and so himself sheweth Math. vltimo .

This gouernment was to be vnder Bishops and Prelates , ordained by the holy Ghost , by imposition of handes of the Apostles , whose successors they were , as Saint Paule sheweth playnly act. 20. 1. Tim. 3. 3. Tit. 1. And this succession was to endure to the worlds end also , by continual new ordination and imposition of hands , so as none could enter by stealth or violence into this rank , but such as lawfully should be admitted .

That among these Prelates and spiritual gouernours of his churche and kyngdome Christe would haue some subordination of the one to other for auoyding strife , schisme , and confusion , and one ouer all the rest is verie lykely and probable euen by reason it self , if no other proof were . Plato in polit. Arist. lib. 3. polit. cap. 5. For so he forshewed by light of nature to all Philosophers , who held without controuersie that the monarchie or gouernment of one head in highest degree was the best among all other manner of regimentes , and consequently it is lyke that Christe tooke not the wurst for the regiment of his churche and spiritual common wealth .

God practised this kynd of gouernment in the creation of Angels , geuing them one vniuersal superior vnder himself which was Lucifer before his fall , as is gathered out of Iob. 40. and Isay 14. by ancient fathers that expound those places . Agust . lib. 11. ciuit . Dei . cap. 15. And afterward when Lucifer fell he remayned still head of the wicked spitites , and Michael of the good , as is signified playnlie Apoc. 12.

God practised the same kynd of monarchial gouernment for spiritual affayres in erecting the churche & common wealth of the Iewes that was to be the figure of our churche to come , 1. Cor. 10. geuing them one high preest to gouerne direct and hold in vnion and obedience all the other preestes , which were almost infinite in all their synagogues throughout the world .

He practised the same in lyke manner in al other thinges lightly of this world , appoynting subordination and reducing all to one , as all the vnder heauens to the gouernment of one supreme , the branches of different brookes and riuers to one fountayne , the infinite armes and branches of one tree to one body and roote . And all creatures fynally to the subordination of himself . But yet more spetially was this needfull in the erection of his churche vpon earth as hath byn sayd , for preseruation of conformitie and auoyding of diuision and confusion .

For if there were many gouernours therof ioyntly vnder himself , ●●●h equal authoritie , & they disagreed , who should attone them ? If any of them would be obstinate or wilfull , who should correct them ?

And fynally , this churche is compared to an armye that needs must haue some knowen general , and not only to an armie simply but to , Cant. 4. acies castrorum ordinata , a wel ordered armie , that hath all other officers also in good order vnder the Captayne general . And it is compared in lyke manner to a house , to a sheepfold , to a ship , to the Arke of Noe , and the lyke , all which thinges haue one head gouernour , as the world knoweth .

And that his priuilege was geuen by our Sauiour to Saynt , Peter among all the Apostles , if no play ne commission were extant ( as there Saynt Peter cheefe of the church vnder Christ is ) yet Christes proceeding with him far different from any of the rest of the Apostles sufficiently declareth his intention in this matter .

That he reuey led vnto him first of all the rest the hidden mysterie of his incarnation and of the blessed Trimitie , Math. 16. That he sayd only to him , rogaui pro te ne deficiat fides tua , I haue asked for thee that thy fayth shall neuer fayle ( hauing sayd first that the diuel was to sift them all ) Luc. 22. That he promised only to him that the gates of hell should neuer preuayle agaynst his seat , Math. 16. That he paied tribute only for Peter and for himself , Math. 17. That he changed his name from Simon to Cephas or Peter that signifieth a rock or stone , Ioan 11. ( which is the name of Christ himself attributed to him by the prophets as is to be seen , Isa. 8. & 28. Daniel 2. Psal. 117. That Christ called only Peter to walk with him vpon the water , Math. 14. That he preached and wrought two such notable miracles in the only ●hip of Peter as appeareth , Luc. 5. & Ioan. 21. That he foretold only to Peter the kynde of death he should dye ( allotting him the same that himself was to suffer vpon the crosse ) Ioan 21. And that he being to go toward the same death he washed Peters feet before all the rest , Ioan. 3. & August in hunc locum . Luc. 24. And that after his resurrection he appeared first of all the Apostles to Saynt Peter , and besydes this that his angel willed the woman to tell Peter by name of Christes resurrection , Marc. 16. &c.

All these things ( I saie ) and manie other do shewe the preheminence of this holie Apostle aboue his fellowes , by Christes owne declaration , which were overlong to set downe how many ancient fathers do deduce and inlarge vpon these places of scriptures and factes of our Sauiour alredie rehearsed .

And agayne after the ascension of Christ to heauen that Saynt Peter first of all called the Councel of Apostles together , Act. 1. and caused Saint Mathias to be chosen in place of Iudas . That he first of all the rest did publish and promulgate the ghospel after the coming of the holie ghost , and conuerted fyue thousand at one se●mon . That Act. 2. he wrought the first miracle in healing the lame man at the temple gate called , Act. 3. Speciosa : That he first of all as high iudge gaue sentence and condemned to death Ananias and Saphira for their hypocrisie : That he first of al presumed to preache the ghospel of Christ to Gentils as he had don before to the Iewes . Act. 5. That to him alone was Act. 10. shewed the vision wherby Christ declared that the tyme was now come to admit Gentils to Christianitie . Ibidem . That of him only is written , dum transiret vniuersos , Act. 9. Chrysost. Ibidem . Gal. 1. Chrysost. homil. 87. in Ioan. ( that is as S. Chrisostome sayth ) whyles he as a general of an armie walketh vp and down to see what is in order & what is not . That of him only among all the Apostles S. Paule writeth , after three yeares I went vp to Hierusalem to see Peter , the reason wherof Saynt Chrysostome affirmeth to be , quia os erat , & princeps Apostolorum , for that he was the mouth and prince of the Apostles . And fynally that by Christes particulir order ( as is to be supposed ) he left the bishoprike of Antioche , and went and tooke vpon him that of Rome , that was head ci●tie of the world .

All these thinges put together do wel argue that Saint Peter well knew the dignitie and prerogatiue he had aboue the rest , both for himself and for his successours : wherunto if we ad the playne commission geuen by Christ in two distinct places of scripture that are recorded , besides other perhaps that are not written , the matter wil be more euident .

The first is , Commission of Saynt Peter . where after that glorious confession made by S Peter of the God head of Christ recorded in S. Mathew his ghospel our Saueour sayth to him agayne , Math. 16. Thou arte Peter or a rock ( for to this end Christe before had geuen him that name that signifieth a rock ) and vpon this rock will I build my churche , and I will geue to thee the keyes of the kingdome of heauen , &c. By which wordes is promised to Peter the principalitie in gouernment of the churche , as the wordes themselues do shew , and the consent of ancient fathers both Greek and Latin do expound .

The second place is in Saynt Ihons ghospel , where Christe after his resurrection gaue to Saynt Peter that preheminence which before he had promised , Ioan. 21. for being in the companie of diuers other principal Apostles he asked Peter alone , three seueral tymes whether he loued him more then the rest or no ( which holy fathers say was don in respect of the three tymes that Peter had denied him before ) and the other answering that he loued , &c. Christ three tymes sayth to him , pasce agnos meos pasce oues meas , feed my lambes and feed my sheep , making him pastor general of all his flock , and committing the whole churche to his pastoral charge , by those wordes , as both the wordes themselues do import ( being vttered to Peter alone and with particuler emphasie for him to feed Christes flock aboue the rest of the Apostles , as he had thryce byn asked , whether he loued more then they ) and as all antiquitie with one consent haue euer taken the sense to be , quia solus profitetur ex omnibus , omnibus antefertur , sayth Saynt Ambrose , Ambrose in cap. vltim●̄ Luc. for that Saynt Peter only did professe to loue so extraordinarily aboue the rest , he was preferred in charge before all the rest . And Saynt Augustine vpon this place oues ipsas pascendas , id est , docendas regendasꝙ committit . August . in Ioan. 21. Chrisost in Ioan 21. Christ committed here his sheep to be fed by Saynt Peter , that is to say , to be taught and gouerned : And Saint Chrisostome vpon the same wordes , alijs omissis Petrum duntaxat affatur , & fratrum ei curam committit . Christ leauing the other Apostles there present , speaketh only to Saynt Peter , and committeth the charge of his brethren to him . And a litle after agayne , Cum magna dominus Petro communicasset , & orbis terrarum curam demandasset , when our lord had imparted great matters to Peter and had geuen him the charge of the whole world , &c. And Saynt Epiphanius , Hic est qui audiuit pasce oues meas , cui concreditum est ouile , Epiphan● in ancor . This is he to whome it was sayd , feed my sheep , to whome the whole flock of Christ was geuen in charge , &c.

I haue thought good to ad this litle taste of ancient fathers interpretation , How Saint Peters charge is imparted also to others . leaving out infinite others to the same sense , to preuent heretical shiftes in this behalf , who first would make this commission of pasce oues meas , to be onely to feed by preaching , and not to gouern with superioritie : and secondly to be a common and indifferent commission giuen to all the Apostles equally , and not to Saynt Peeter aboue the rest , which is aparently false . For albeit we gra●nt that this commission pasce oues meas , in a general sense may be and is vnderstood and spoken not only to Saint Peter but also to all the rest of the Apostles , and not only to them but to all other inferior pastors besides : yet in preheminence and highest degree of special authoritie oueral , it is spoken in this place to S. Peter alone , as hath bin shewed , and consequently also to his successors : and by the same consequence it followeth in lyke manner , that if Sir Francis Hastinges and his people be either lambes or sheep of Christe , or do any way apertain to his flock and fold , they apertain also to the gouernment and iurisdiction of this vniuersal pastor Saint Peters successor ; agaynst whome he rayleth and rageth so pitifully as in his booke appeareth .

And for that all the Christian world hath made euer this most certayne and infallible deduction , Saint Peters successors Popes of Rome . that Christ gaue not to Saint Peter these eminent prerogatiues of authoritie and superioritie for himself alone , but for his posteritie and successours also that should ensue him in his seate and charge ouer the church of Christ vnto the worldes end , for this cause they haue reuerenced and respected so much the Bishops of Rome , as by all general Councels , fathers , and Ecclesiastical stories doth appeare : and only certayn broken heretiques both in old tymes and ours , as guiltie people fearing their iudges , haue set themselues agaynst them , but euer to ther owne perdition : among which rable not withstanding if Sir francis Hastinges will needs be one still ( hauing red what here hath byn alleaged ) I can say no more , but leaue him to Gods iudgementes ; & cum apparuerit princeps pastorum , 1 Pet. 5. when Christ the prince of pastors shall appeare , to take account of the obedience or rebellion vsed to his vnder pastors , then will these reckoninges be cleered , and euerie man shall receyue according to his merits .

And if all Christian nations haue and ought to bear such reuerence and respect to the sea of Rome , The Particuler obligation of English towardes the Bishop of Rome . then much more our litle Iland of England ( as this man calleth it ) for that it hath receiued more singuler benifits from thence then any one nation in the world besides , to wit , it hath bin twice conuerted from paganisme to Christian religion , by the especial diligence , labour , and industrie of the same sea ; once in the time of the Britans , about a hundreth and ninetie years after Christe : at what time Elutherius that holy Pope and Martyr conuerted king Lucius and his subiects by the preaching of Saint Damianus and his fellowes , sent from Rome to that effect : and the second time , about fiue hundreth years after , when our predecessors the English Saxons were conuerted , by Saint Augustine and his fellow preachers , sent by Saint Gregorye the great , then Bishop of Rome , to the same end . And if it be most certayn , and cannot be denyed , that these two benifits rightly considered are the greatest that vnder heauen our land could receiue from any mortal men , and that the obligation of this dooble spiritual birth of ours is so much greater then the band we owe to our carnal parents , by how much more weightie and important is our eternal saluation then our temporal life : let all men consider the barbarous ingratitude of this man , that barketh with such spite against the sea of Rome , the mother of our Christianitie : and against her Bishops , the woorkers of so high a blessing vnto vs . And with this consideration I leaue the modest & discreet readers , to iudge of the matter as reason and religion shal induce them , and with this cease to passe any further in this matter .

THE EIGHTH INCOVNTER , TOVCHING SPANIARDES , ASwell the whole nation , as their present King .

HAuing made the warde which you haue seen , in the former incounter , both to Rome and her Bishoppes , agaynst the peeuish wranglinges , and spitefull calumniations , of this wach-worde-geuer , there remayneth yet an other bickering about the Spanish king and nation , which I haue reserued to this last place , as the subiect wherein our cockish knight presumeth principally to crowe and triumph without modestie , and to lauish out lies without number or measure , imagining that all is both lawfull and gratefull which he sayth in that kynde , and that no man will aduenture to check him therin , in respect of the present warres and hostilitie that are betwixt our realme and them . But he is deceaued , for that the wiser sorte of our nation , haue learned euen by the lawes of moral ciuilitie , that a man must speake moderatly also of his enemy , and the more religious sort do know by the principles of Christianitie , that not only of our temporal aduersarie ( which may be afterward our frend ) we must notly or fayne reproches , but neither of the Deuil himself , though he be our spiritual & immortal enemy , and Gods also : so detestable are lying lips and calumnious tongues in the sight both of God and man , where either reason or religion beareth rule , as neither of them seemeth to do , with the enraged and distracted spirit of Sir francis Hastinges .

Which poynt that we may better consider of , Raging agaynst the Spanish nation . I shall first beginne with that which he vttereth in diuers partes of his libel , agaynst the whole nation of Spaniards in general , terming them by the names of proud , ambitions , bloody , tyrannical , rauening Spaniards , a nation cursed by God , for that the Pope that cursed man of sinne hath blessed them , &c. And in one place he descrybeth them in these wordes : I must remember vnto you , that it is recorded of the Spaniard , that in dissimulation he surpasseth all nations , till he haue attayned to his purpose , and when he can once preuayle , he goeth beyond them all in oppression and tyrannie : also that he disdayneth all other nations , and that in pryde and carnal voluptuosnes , no nation cometh neer him , and these be his qualities .

This our gentlemans censure , gathered out of recordes ( as he sayth ) but I would gladly he had cited the author where he found this record , as he ought to haue donne for discharging his fayth and honestie in so greeuous an accusation as this is , and that toucheth so many , if he had regard or respect therof . And hardly do I beleeue that he hath euer found , or shall fynd , any writer of credit be he of what nation soeuer ) that will shew himself so fond and passionate , as to set downe by wryting so preiudicial a censure , and so general a reproche as this is agaynst any nation : Why Spaniards are maligned . notwithstanding I know , that the Spaniardes at this day , haue many emulators and aduersaries , partely for hatred of Catholique religion ( which is their greatest glorie ) and partely by reason of their large dominions , which is not strange , for so had the Romanes also before them , and the Graecians , & Assyrians before them agayne , when their Monarchies were potent , quia virtutis comes inuidia , as the common prouerb sayth , enuy followeth vertue and valour : and in this sense our English prouerb is also most true , it is better to be enuied then pitied . And when the Roman monarchie was fallen , and the french also , that was set vp by Charls the great , our English nation had the greatest of any one of Christendome , for some ages together , when we possessed our ample olde states and dominions in france , during which tyme , he that will see the inuectiues made agaynst our English manners , Speeches of English , when they were potent . and agaynst our proud and tyrannical kynde of proceeding ( as then it was termed ) let him but reade ouer the recordes of the french chronicles , extant at this day : and yet no reason that these recordes should condemn or disgrace our whole nation now , nor then neither , when they were written , being set downe by our aduersaries and emulators , and by those that were either vnder vs , or feared vs , and consequently were nothing equally affected vnto vs , as many are not at this day agaynst Spaniards .

Moreouer if some Spaniardes should be found in deed to haue some of those vices or defectes which here by their calumniator Sir francis are named , ( as among other nations no man can deny , but the lyke are also to be found ) what reason or equitie is there ( to omit conscience and christianitie , with which this man seemeth to haue litle to do ) what reason is there ( I say ) that these defectes should be attributed vniuersally to the whole Spanish nation , wherin there are to be found thowsandes that haue no part nor fault , as on the other syde , if some English-men as they passe ouer other countries , by sea and land at this daye should behaue themselues scandalously , by gluttonie and drunkennes , ( as diuers haue byn sayd to do ) is it a lawfull consequence to say or think , that all English are such at home , and that these are the qualities of the English nation , as Sir Francis sayth here of the Spaniardes ? or to take a comparison from himself , if one English knight of a noble familie , haue byn so madheaded , as to make a fantastical booke , stuffed with ignorances , lyes , and calumniations , is it reason that foraine nations should iudge hereby , that all our knightes and nobilitie of England are so fond and frantik , and haue so litle respect to their honours and credit as he ? I trow no.

Wherfore as concerning the Spanish nation in general , Of the spanish nation no such preiudice or slanderous rule can be geuen , as this malignant spirit setteth downe , for that they are in this poynt as other nations be , where all sortes of people may be found , some bad and many good : and if comparisons may be made without offence ( for that comparisons are odious in such affayres between nations ) no nation in Europe hath more cause to glorie , and geue God thankes for his giftes , abundantly powred vpon them , both natural , moral , and Diuyne , temporal and spiritual , for tymes past and present , then the Spanish , 1. Mach. 8. who haue a countrie both rich , ample , fertile , and potent , and praysed in scripture it self , a people able and apt in respect both of wit and body to attayne to any thing they take in hand , as in old tymes appeared by the most excellent Emperours , Rare Spaniards . Traian , Theodosius the great and some other of that nation that surpassed all the rest , as also by their famous learned men , in ancient tymes Seneca , Lucan , Martial , and others , when they were yet heathens ; Osius , Damasus , Leander , Isidorus , Orotius and such lyke old renowmed Christians , both for learning & sanctitie : by their most famous martyrs in lyke manner , Saynt Laurence , Saynt Vincent , and many others : and in our age , he that will consider after their valiant deliuering of themselues out of the handes and captiuitie of the mores , that inuaded and oppressed their countrie what Christian Zelous Princes , Kinges , Emperours , Captaynes , Knightes , & famous soldiers they haue yeelded to the world , and do yeeld daylie , and what store of singular learned writers do appeare from thence from tyme to tyme , what countries they haue conquered by the sword , and how many millions of soules they haue gayned to Christ by preaching his word in diuers and most remote partes of the world : all these thinges ( I say ) put together do make ridiculous and contemptible this malignant description set downe by Sir Francis , whose spetial hatred agaynst them is founded in that which of all other commendations is their greatest , to wit , their constancie and zeale in defence of the catholique religion , for which probablie God hath so greatly exalted them alredy , aboue other nations of Europe , & will do more daylie , if they continue that feruour in defending his cause , notwithstanding any other humane infirmitie or defect in lyfe that as to men ( of what nation soeuer ) may happen , which our merciful lord in regard & recompence of the other rare vertues of zeale iustice constancie and feruor in his cause , will pardon ( no doubt ) and geue grace of true amendement and rising agayne , whyle the prating heretique that scornfully sitteth downe to score vp other mens synnes , shall walk for his owne to his eternal habitation , prepared in hel , for that his one malitious and obstinate sinne of heresie ( if it may be called one ) prepondereth with Gods iustice more greeuously then all other infirmities and sinnes put to gither which catholique men do or may commit of humane frayltie .

And thus much of this poynt , Particular obligations of Spaniards may suffice , for if I should ad to this the ancient loue and amitie of the Spanish nation towardes vs in tymes past , the large leagues that England hath held with them heretofore , the great wealth and gaynes we vsed to gather and reape by their trafique , the noble and bountefull Queens of that linage maried into England , which aboue all others taken from forayne countries haue byn most gratefull and beneficial to our land and people ; the exceeding charitie of the present king and of his whole nation shewed to our English catholiques abrode , in this long tyme of bitter banishment , & persecution for their faith ; these thinges ( I say ) if I should repeat or set out at large , would perhaps help nothing to the argument we haue in hand but rather geue offence ( tymes standing as they do ) and therfore I recount them not in particular , but leaue them to be considered with pietie & gratitude by such as are indifferent in these dayes , and to be recorded in the honorable monumentes of our posteritie .

And so hauing answered thus much about the iniurie offered to the Spanish nation ( by Sir Francis ) in general , The defence of the King of Spayne in particuler I will passe to the approbrious speaches vsed personally agaynst their present famous and noble king ( once also ours ) with such indignitie of vnciuil and most reprochfull termes as is not sufferable . And if any of the sayd kinges subiectes were to answere our knight in this demand , he would cast him his gauntlet , and geue him the lye , and chalenge him to the defence of so notorious calumniations , and therby proue him either a lying or cowardly knight , or both .

His ordinarie termes of the most excellent & most Catholique king Philip are these , the ambytious king of Spayne , the vsurping tyrant , the proud popish champion , trecherous , cursed , cruel , and the lyke , all which vyces the world knoweth ( ●nny herself being witnes ) that his Catholique Maiestie is most free of , and is indewed abundantly with the opposite vertues , wherof no nation hath had better proof then England , by the experience we had of his sweet nature & condition , both in princely behaueour & pious gouernment , during the few yeares he liued amongst vs & ruled ouer vs , which tyme notwithstanding of his being in England this malitious sycophant will needes calumniate , & draw into suspition of great mysteries of iniquitie meant by him ( as he sayth ) agaynst England & English people by meanes of that ioyfull mariage & gouernment which there he had .

If you will geue me leaue ( sayth he ) to call to your remembrance the manner and meaning of his coming into England , when he came not as an inuader to conquer but as a frend to fasten a strong league of amitie by a mariage , I doubt not but to discouer the trecherous crueltie of his hart . This is Sir Francis promisse and you shall see after you haue gyuen him leaue , how wisely he will performe the same , and how substantially , he will declare vnto vs the kinges intention , or at least his own inuention .

But before I set downe his discouerie vnder his owne hand , I shall declare a litle the state of thinges whyles the Spaniards were in Queen Maries dayes in England , and how the king did actually beare himself , by testimonie of all those that knew him , conuersed with him , or lyued vnder him . And then shall Sir Francis tell his tale of that he imagineth or faigneth the king would haue don in tyme , and before we both haue ended , I beleeue that in steed of this discouerie promised of the trecherous crueltie of the kinges hart , we shall discouer both trecherous cogging and shameles forgerie in the hart and hand of this counterfayt knight . Thus then I begin the declaration .

The conditions of that most famous and royal mariage between the two greatest Monarches of Christendome , The condition of the mariage with the Spanish King . king Philip and Queen Marie , and the conuentions agreed vpon between both nations , and between the princes themselues , Queen Marie , the Emperour Charles , ( then resyding in Flanders ) and king Philip , and eche of their Councels and Parlaments , are yet extant , and for the most part in print : wherby it may be seen that all those poyntes that this sely fellow cometh in withall now after the market ended , about the succession of our realme , the priuie Councel , of what nation they should be , the condition of our nobilitie , the Parlament , the lawes of the realme , the portes , castles and garrisons , the officers of the courte and household , and other lyke circumstances were particulerly treated , agreed vpon and prouyded for before hand , by all partes . Neither was there euer any complaynt that the king or his nation brake any one of them whyle they were among vs , but added rather diuers benefytes and courtesies of their owne accord aboue that which they had promised and were bound vnto .

As for the expences , and for the furniture of the mariage ( so much I meane as came from abrode ) as also for the two Spanish and English nauies that accompanied the king when he came into England were at his cost and charges vntill they arryued at Portesmouth , and the whole trayne from thence to winchester , where he met with the Queen , and the mariage was celebrated , at the charges of the same King of Spayne .

All the Spanish nobles and gentlemen that came with the king , came so furnished with all necessaries and brought such store of money with them , as within two or three monethes after their arryual , all England was full of Spanish coyne . King Philips vsage to made the English . The priuie councel of England was wholie and intirely as it was before , neither was any Spaniard euer put into it , the officers of the Queens household were altogether English , the king for his owne affayres , and his other kingdomes , had a particuler Councel , which interrupted not ours , the nobilitie of our land was exceedingly honoured by him , and many of them had particuler great pensions also yearly from him , the captaynes and soldiers that he vsed of our nation as namely at the warre of Saynt Quintins , he honoured highly , and made them equall in all poyntes of seruice and honor with Spaniardes , and payd them himself without further charges to England saue only geuing them their vpper cassockes with the crosse , according to the custome . The marchantes commonly he made free to enioy and vse all priuileges and preferments throughout all his kingdomes , countries and prouinces : and in England he had such care to yeeld our nation contentment , as he gaue expresse order that if any English man and a Spaniard fell out , the English should be fauored and the Spaniard punished , which he caused to be executed with such rigor as it cost diuers Spaniardes their lyues , when the English were much more in fault : and I haue heard it spoken by some of the Councel at that tyme , that Queen Marie was so afflicted diuers tymes with this partialitie of the kinges towardes the English agaynst his owne nation ; as it cost her many a bitter teare for verie compassion & shame .

And so much the more was she moued therewith for that she saw many English , partly vpon this indulgence of the kinges , The vsage of English towards Span. in Q. Mariestyme and partly for that being secretly heretiques , they had auersion and hatred to the Spanish nation , to abuse themselues intollerably in offering most inhumane and barbarous iniuries vnto them : No Spaniard could walke by night ( nor scars by day alone ) but he should be eyther wounded , or thrust between two or three swashbucklers , that attended particulerly to those exercyses , and so put in danger of his lyf . Villanous wordes were ordinarie salutations to them in the streetes , as also often tymes in churches , but no remedy was to be had , nor would any man beare Witnes lightly in behalf of the Spaniard agaynst the English though the iniurie were neuer so manifest . If any thing were to be bought in the market , the Spaniard must paie dooble for it , and for that most Spaniardes drunk water , they must buy it also dearly in many places , if they would drink it , and often could not haue it for mony , and diuers wells were sayd to be poysoned of malice therby to destroy the Spaniardes . Many deuises were vsed to draw Spaniardes into priuate houses , and familiaritie was offered them to that end , and if any entred to talke with the wyf , daughter or seruant ( as they were thought propense in that kynde ) then rushed forth the husband father brother or master , that lay in wayte with other catchpoles of thesame conspiracie to apprehend them , and to threaten death or imprisonment except they redeemed themselues with good store of money . And I haue heard from the mouth of a greate noble man a Spaniard that was in England at that tyme and now is a Vyceroy vnder the king that some English would send their wyues & daughters of purpose into the fieldes where Spaniards walked , to allure them to talke with them , and therby to intrap them and get money from them .

I omit to name more violent meanes of taking purses and playne roberies and other lyke artes to get the Spaniards money from them by force , which yet were many and some most barbarous and shamefull to our nation , and the mention and memorie therof maketh vs blush when in other countries we are told of them , as namely this that followeth which my self haue heard recounted from a nobleman himself that is yet alyue , to wit , The Count of frētsalida robbed pretily in England . the old Count de Fuensalida cheef steward at this day of the kinges houshold , who being in England with the king made a great supper one night to diuers noble men of his nation , and to some others , and being at the table mery and fearing nothing ( as in a peaceable and ciuil commonwealth , it seemed he had no cause ) there came rushing in , some twentie or thirtie maskared good fellowes with their swordes drawen , and commanded that no man should stirre vnder payne of death , and so kept them all at the table , and their seruantes shut vp into diuers houses of offices where they were found , vntill the theeues had ransaked the whole house , and packed vp the siluer plate that was in store , and so departed .

And these are the heroical actes and honorable histories which these noblemen and other strangers do recount of the ciuilitie and courtesie of our countriemen towardes Spaniards in those dayes which being obiected vnto vs in all forayne nations where we trauayle ( the french also recounting as bad or worse donne to them , to whome at that tyme we were open enemies ) it cannot but make modest Englishmen ashamed , and their eares to burne in respect of the dishonour of our countrie , as also to consider what fyne frutes , First frutes of new ghospellers . our new ghospel then freshly planted , and yet in the bud began to bring forth : for that all this hatred and barbarous vsage towardes Spaniards and other Catholique forayners , rose principally vpon the difference of religion lately begonne within our realme , and these lads as the first professed proselites therof vpon heate and zeale committed these holy actions , as the first frutes of so heauenly a seed . But since that tyme we haue had much larger experience therof , and I presume that most mennes myndes in England are sufficiently cleared in this case , and if not , let them behold the behaueour of Sir Francis in this libel , who is an ancient branche of that plantation .

And so hauing seen the state of matters how they stood at that tyme , and in particuler what king Philip had promised to do , and what he was bound to do , and then what in deed he performed really whyle he was among vs ( which was more in deed then either he promised or had obligation to performe , as hath byn shewed ) let vs heare now what Sir Francis sayth he would haue donne if he could , or if his abode had byn longer in England . The tale shall go in his owne wordes for better declaring his spirit . Thus then he writeth .

This mariage was sought for and intended also in shew only to strengthen the hand of the Queen of England , A discourse of Sir Francis , of King Philip secret meaning . to bring in the Romish religion and gouernment into this land , and to establish it with continuance , with purpose and meaning to ad strength to all the corners of Christendome to continue Poperie where it was , and to bring it in , where it was not , that so the Arche-prelate of Rome might hold the scepters and power of all princes and potentates of Christendome in his hand , to dispose a● his pleasure : but the plottes and practises layd and pursued by the Spanish king , had made a wofull proof to England of a further mark shot at ( which was discouered in a letter to some of our nobles , from a true harted English-man in Spayne ) had not God almightie in his rich mercy preuented their purposes , and defeated them in their determinations , as it shall appeare hereafter , &c.

This is the preface and entrance which Sir Francis maketh to the discouerie he promiseth of great hydden mysteries , about plottes and practises not only layd , but also pursued by king Philip whyle he was in England , which neuer came to light vntill this day , though at that tyme they were discouered ( as he sayth ) in a letter to some of our nobles , from a true harted English-man in Spayne . But for the credyt of so new and weightie , and incredible a secret , it had byn good he had named the parties and particularities therof , as wel who wrote as also who receyued that letter . For first the English-man in Spayne though he were true harted to the faction of S. Francis syde ( to wit , to the Protestantes ) yet might he perhaps not be so true handed or true tongued at that tyme , or so truly informed of thinges , or of that authoritie , that this his letter or report may beare credyt in so great a busines agaynst so great men , it being taken vp perhaps at tauerns or porte townes and market places by some merchantes seruant or factor , or other lyke wandring compaignon , as well tipled with Spanish seck as with English heresie , who might wryt these news from Spayne of K. Philip as Iohn Nicols the minister brought and printed from Rome , and Italy , in our dayes , of the Pope and Cardinals .

And that this discouery ( if any such were , and that the tale be not wholly forged by Sir Francis himself ) could haue no better ground then that I haue sayd , The letter out of Spayn discredited . to wit , the reporte of some vulgar people , or the coniecture of some particuler discoursiue head , as is euident in it self , for that this being a most secret designement and drift of the king himself , and of his priuie Councel , who were all at that day remayning in England , and had this proiect within their owne brestes only ; how could it be discouered by an English-man from Spaynerthink you .

Agayne the nobles in England to whome he sayth the letter was written , might be such , as probably it may be iudged to haue byn written of purpose to feed their humors , or to comfort them in those dayes , or that themselues did procure it to be written and sent for their credit , or that themselues deuysed it in England , to make therby the Spaniards more odious and their doinges more suspected ; L. Courtenay and to draw by this meanes more English after themselues to impugne the present state and gouernment : as when the lord Courtenay Earle of Deuonshyre for missing the mariage of Queen Marie , beganne to practise , and to think of leauing the land vpon discontentment , and when the Carewes and other of that crew fled the realme for conspiracies , to the same effect , The Carewes . such a letter was much to their purpose . But I shall not need to call in reasons and circumstances for shewing the vanitie of this letter , for that the manifest and shameles falshoodes which it relateth , will easely discouer the forgerie , as also the forge it self , from which it proceedeth : I will follow then the continuation of Sir Francis narration , in his own wordes .

Now to proceed ( sayth he ) to lay open the right mark that in deed this king shot at , A malitious forgerie agaynst King Phil. though when he made way to ioyne in mariage with Queen Marie , he made semblance of great conscience to Catholique religion , and great care to bring the whole land into the obedience therof , and seemed to glorie much when it was brought to passe , as his letter to his holy father at Rome written out of England doth make shew , wherin he expresseth what a worthie woorke he had donne , when he had drawen the nobles & commons of the land to submit themselues to his holinesse as their cheef ( those are his wordes ) yet litle did the nobles and commons know what was intended towardes them by this catholique childe of Rome , for vnder this colorable name of catholique religion , was hidden the ambitious humor of a most proud vsurping tyrant , whose resolution was vpon mature deliberation and consultation with his machiuilian counsellors to seek by al the possible kinde means he could , to win the principal of our Nobles to affect him , and in their affection to possesse him of the crown , and so to establish him in an absolute power ouer poor England , and to bring this to passe , he decreed to spare neither cost nor kindenes , &c.

Hetherto is the asseueration of Sir Francis concerning king Philips intention to gain our crowne , but neuer a syllable more of proofe then you haue heard before , to wit , his owne woord and bare assertion : which he taking to be sufficient , passeth ouer presently to explicate & exaggerate the dangerous effectes that would haue ensued vpon vs when the king should haue gotten his pretence .

But I must pul him by the sleeue & request him to stay , & prooue a litle better , that the king had this intention to get the kingdome as he sayth , for if it were a mature deliberation and consulted also with his counsel in England ( as this discouerer sayth ) then some act and monument belike is extant to testifie the same , or at leastwise some witnes , or other firm argument fit to prouè it , or if not , how could the true harted English-man know it in Spayn , and write it to the Nobles of England ? Or with what face can our rash and falstongued English knight professe to know it now , and to wryte it so confidently ? Shall so great , so greeuous , so haynous a slander , against so mightie , so munificent , so bountiful a Monarch , passe out to the world , vpon a bare assertion and malignant interpretation of one English hastie-hote-spurre , that sheweth malice in euery syllable , and turneth euen the kings loue and fauours to our nation , & his expences and benifits towards our people , vnto a deceitful meaning ? And vpon that , without other act of hostilitie on his parte appearing , shall he be called ambitious and proud vsurping tyrant ? Who seeth no● that this fellow in steed of discouering the kings malice bewrayeth his owne , and in place of prouing the king an vsurping tyrant , doth shew himself a shameles sicophant .

But let vs see what effects he sayth , had like to haue ensued , vpon this deuised designment of the king .

If once ( sayth he ) this king had obtayned the crown , then as in the letter of discouerie is layd open ) the council table must be filled with his Councelors , Faigned effects of an imagined vsurpation . the hauen townes must be possessed with gouernours of his appointing , fortifications must be made by his direction , soldiars of his owne must be placed in garrison at places most fit to strength him self , then must the common lawes of this land be altered , by which iustice is truly taught to all sortes , his vnholy and bloody inquisition would be not haue fayled also to bring in , with all other his Spaynish lawes and ordinances , sutable to the same , their intolerable taxes we must haue byn pestered withall , a taste wherof I will here geue you , &c.

These are the seuen deadly sinnes which Sir Francis inforceth out of his Spanish letter as certayne to haue insued , if the king had gotten the crowne , which yet whyles he had the crowne did not insue , as the world knoweth , for that they were prouyded for before hand by the councel , nobilitie , and parlement of England , and by all lykelihood would haue byn foreseen and prouided for also by the same prouidence of the realme , if euer motion or cogitation had bin among them to passe the crowne to the king of Spayn , seing Sir Francis confesseth that this matter was ment to be wrought not by force but by sweet meanes and benifites , and by allurement of the nobilitie by his Maiestie . Most fond therfore or forged is this letter from the true harted man in Spain , who suggested feares already preuented : but much more ridiculous is he in setting down certain monstrous bugges of taxes to be imposed vpon the English nation , which yet by all probability were neuer though vpon , nor past by mannes imagination , though most childishly he avowcheth , that they are payed also in Spain . For thus he writeth .

A taste wherof ( of these intolerable taxes ) I will giue you ( sayth Sir Francis ) as that for every chimney and other place to make , fier in , as ouens , fornaces , Smiths forges , and such others , a frinch crown was yearly paid to him . He had also powling pence for all manner of corn , bread , beef , mutton , capons , pigges , geese , hennes , ducks , chicken , butter , cheese , egges , aples , peares , nuttes , beere , wine , and all other things whatsoeuer he feed●th vpon : yea no farmer , yeo-man , or husband-man durst eat a capon in his house if his frend came to him , for if he did it must cost him six shillinges eight pence , though the capon was not worth twelue pence ; and so toties quoties : and these be the benifits and blessings that this catholique king sought to bring in hether by his absolute authoritie sought for .

If a man did not see these things written and printed with Sir Francis Hastinges name vnto them , he would neuer imagin a man of his name , About taxes paied to the King of Spayne . howse , and calling , would publish such childish toyes and manifest vntruthes to the world . For who is there that hath trauailed Spain ( as many English-men haue donne in these our dayes ) which knoweth it not to be an open shameles lye , that for euery place to make fyer in , as ouen , fornace , and the like , a french crown is to be payed ? In the kingdoms of Castil and Andaluzia there is no such paiments at all , in Aragon and Catalonia , there is some like tribute instituted by old kinges , before these states were vnited to the crowne of Castile : but neither is it so much as this wise man setteth downe , nor do they pay for euery place of making fyer , but one onely fyer is accounted to one howshold , though the people haue twenty fyers within it .

Touching his powling pence vpon thinges that are solde , there is in the foresayd kingdomes of Castile an old rent of the crowne , instituted by ancient kinges called Alcaualla , The tribu● of Alcaualla . conteyning a certayne tribute vpon thinges that are solde and bought , but this tribute is not payd in all Spaine , and namely not in Biscay , Nauar , Portugal , Aragon , Catalonia , nor in the kingdom of Valencia : and much lesse in forayne kingdomes and states vnder the Spaniardes , as Naples , Sicilia , Sardinia or M●llan . Nor in Castillia it self is it exacted with the rigor that this fellow forgeth , but euerie towne and cittie agreeth in great for this tribute by the yeare , nor doth it descend to such minute thinges as he recounteth vp , and much lesse to beere wherof there is litle vse in Spayne , & the simple fellow would needes faine his account after the English manner , but among other toyes the lye of six shillinges eight pence forfeyture for eating a capon toties quoties , is so notorious , as it may winne the whetstone : and the verie phrase it self discouereth the forgerie , for that the Spaniardes haue no coyne answering to our noble or six shillinges eight pence , consequently it is not probable that they would appoynt such a penaltie as they can hardly in whole money make vp , the account . But let vs see somewhat more of this kynde of cosinage .

My author ( sayth he ) doth further vnfold this kinges trecherous purpose towardes this land , A shamles tale . by discouering vpon his owne knowledge and hearing , his intention to be , by litle and litle to roote out the nobilitie , and to keep the commons in beggerie , and not to suffer one to lyue here , that was borne in twentie yeares before , but either to destroy them , or to make them slaues among the Moores , the colour wherof was because they were borne out of the Catholique churche of Rome . And to make vp the measure of all impietie , and the faster to set his crowne vpon his head from remouing ( if he had gotten it ) he layd his plot to destroy our deare Soueraigne ladie Queen Elizabeth , hauing decreed with himself , that neither she nor any of that cursed nation ( so he termed it and yet the Popes holines had absolued it ) should gouern England any more . But blessed be God who hath blessed vs with the lyfe and raigne of our blessed Queen , who I trust shall liue to geue him such a deadly blow as neither his cursed self nor any of his cursed nation ( iustly so to be called , because the Pope that cursed man of sinne hath blessed them ( shall euer see the day to rule in England .

And thus you see that vnder the colour of this mariage saluation of soules seemed to be sought for , but in deed destruction both of our bodies and soules was pursued , &c. for without regard of sex , age , or degree , all were destined to slauerie and bondage at the least , howsoeuer they escaped with lyfe .

This is your sottish and impudent narration Sir Francis , for what can be more sottish then to say that your wyse author before named , discouereth vpon his owne knowledge and hearing , that the kinges intention was to roote out the nobilitie , The improbabilitie of the calumniation . to oppresse the commonaltie , to slea or send to Barbarie for slaues all that were born within twentie yeares before ? If your author knew this of his owne knowledge , how say you also by hearing ? and if he heard it of others , how could he know it of his owne knowledge ? But whatsoeuer you say , how could he in Spayne discouer so great a secret that lay in the kinges brest in England ? Besydes this , how incredible are the thinges in themselues that he recounteth ? namely that dreame or old wyues tale of making all slaues within twenty yeares old ? of which number and within which age he had taken diuers already into his se●uice in England and vsed singular curtesie vnto them and one of his Grandes in Spayne , ( to wit , the Count after Duke of Feria ) had maried an English ladie , Duchesse of Feria . that as I ghesse was within the compasse of that age , or not much aboue it at that day , and should all these haue byn sent think you to Barbarie together ? Impudencie then it is in this fond knight to alleage such improbable and palpable lyes out of an author without name , and much more lack of shame is it to auouch them himself for truthes , and to adde other fables that are yet more monstrous , as of the kinges destining to slauerie & bondage not only those before mentioned that were borne within the space of twentie yeares , but of all other English also ( as this man sayth ) without regard of sex , age , or degree , and that he vsed to call our nation cursed , euen then when the Popes holines had absolued it , who will geue eare or credit to such absurd inuentions ?

And further , King Phil. sought not Queen 〈◊〉 destruction . to fill vp ( sayth he ) the full measure of his impietie , he had layd his plot to destroy and make away the lady Elizabeth now Queen , wheras all the world notwithstanding knoweth the king to haue byn at that day her cheefest stay and defence , as before I haue shewed at large in the third incounter , as also that verie litle plotting of the kinges behalf would haue serued at that tyme to haue wrought his will , if he had wished her destruction , for the manifold reasons that there I haue alleaged , he fynding her in disgrace and in prison at Woodstock when he came into England , and hardly pressed about wyats insurrection , from the peril wherof and other lyke assaultes he espetially deluiered her , and procured her return to the courte agayne : and consequently I sayd there , and heer I repeat it agayne , that it is most barbarous ingratitude in this vnciuil knight to pay the carefull protection of her person , which his Maiestie yealded to her grace in those dayes of her distresse , with these intolerable slanders , and outragious false criminations now , and that no modest man can cease to wonder how so infamous a libel could be suffered by supreme authoritie to passe to the print , espetially conteyning diuers other personal , reprochefull , contempteous , and villanous calumniations agaynst so great and potent a prince , as the king catholique of Spayne is .

And namely that where this good fellow hauing told a story how one Fabritius the Roman Captayne refusing the poysoning of his enemie Pirrhus ) that was offered to him for money , by his physitian , he sent the sayd physitian bound to Pirrhus himself , and then he addeth this illation .

But the king of Spain delt not so with the Queen our mistris when her poysonable portugall phisitian Lopus would haue poysoned her , for from such hopes he taketh hart , &c.

By which wordes he would haue men to imagin that his catholique Maiestie had either hired Lopus to do that fact ( if any such matter was indeed intended ) or at least that he was priuie & consenting to it , About lopus the Physitian for how otherwise could he haue warned the Q. of the danger intended ? and yet it is manifest that no such matter was euer or could probably be knowen to the king of Spain . Neither did euer Lopus giue any such signification or suspition , at his death , or before , of the king of Spaines priuitie : nor was he a man to haue correspondence in Spayn , being knowen to be a Iew in religion & fled from those parts , and was enimy to the king in all respects as wel touching religion as the afaires of Portugal , and onely England is the receptacle of such people at this day : nor had his catholique Maiestie any Embassador or other agent or correspondence in England , to plot such treaties : nor euer was it heard , that he would hearken to such base wayes of reuenge vpon his enimyes . And therefore all this put together doth make it more then Turkish impietie to put in print such infamous stuffe agaynst the Maiestie of so high a prince by name , without any proof at all , as though there were no God , no conscience , no iudgement , to make account vnto : nor any respect in earth to be held to such as are in lawful authoritie , which yet our dreaming knight himself alitle before will needes proue out of S● Peeter and S. Paul , to be due to such princes as he liketh to assigne it , In the 6. Encounter . euen in spiritual and ecclesiastical matters belonging to the soule , and consequently also to an other tribunal , so vnconstant and mutable are these good fellowes , not only in their sayinges and doctrines , but also in their actions , as led wholy by passion and interest , and referring all to times , persons , and occasions , seruing their turnes and commodities .

And thus much haue I thought conuenient to be answered to the malitious calumniations of this slanderous wach-word-giuer , against the noble and renowned nation of Spanyardes , and their most Catholique , pious , wise , and potent king , whose excellent vertues are greater then by my pen can be expressed , and his loue and fauors to our nation such and so many ( especially in this extreme affliction and banishment of catholiques ) as no gratitude of ours can equal , nor make due recompence , in the state we stand in , and therefore must leaue it to our posteritie .

And albeit for the present there be warres and hostilitie between our nation and our prince and theirs , The conclusio● . and that especially in respect of religion , yet our trust is , & our prayers are continually to our euerlasting God of peace that he will once finish well that controuersie , to all our comfortes and benefites .

And in the mean space I do presume so much of the good natures and ciuilitie of most protestants in England , that they alow not of such bitter and barbarous proceeding , as Sir Francis Hastinges hath vsed to his owne discredit , and dishonor of our nation in these malignant calumniations against so modest a prince . In which respect also , I haue bin somwhat the bolder to giue him his check , with more freedom and feruor . I pray God it may do him the good I wish , or at least keep others from being deceiued by him .

THE REMISSION OF THE WHOLE ANSWER TO THE IVDGEMENT and arbitrement of the Lords of her Maiesties most honorable Councel , with the answerers opinion and petition for the ending of these dissentions and controuersies .

ANd now ( right honorable ) hauing brought to an end so much as I thought expedient to be answered at this tyme to Sir Francis Hastinges iniurious libel , none occurred more fit vnto me to haue the first sight , and view and iudgement of the whole , then your Lordshippes : who though in the controuersie it self between him and his and vs and ours , I cannot expect to haue you equall iudges nor indifferent arbiters ( you professing the religion you do ) yet in the manner of prosecution thereof , I presume so much of the good partes that God hath indued your Lordshippes withall , as I dare remit the arbitrement to your selues , to whome if this rayling wachword had byn first presented before it was punished ( as in right it ought to haue byn , you being by office the wachmen of that commonwealth , and not Sir Francis who intrudeth himself ) I think verely that either it had byn wholy stopped and repressed , or at least wise so moderated , as it should not haue geuen the offence that it hath and will do , for vnto graue men such troblesome sticklers as these are euer commonly ( and ought to be ) vngratefull and suspected , and vnto wise Councelours and honorable persons such rayling and slanderous tongues , are contemptible & odious , and to all good natures and ciuill conditioned men ( be they of what estate or profession soeuer ) such base detractions and contumelious fictions ( as heer you haue heard ) are insufferable , and rather seuerely to be punished , then any way to be permitted .

But yet so much the more in this case of ours , where the iniurie is not offered only to your owne home-born subiects ( whome yet in all rightful quarrel your place requireth that you protect and defend ) but also to great and potent anoynted princes , with whome you haue had , and may haue again most honorable freindship heerafter , and negotiation in important and weightie afaires , & whose honors you ought not to permit iniuriously to be violated , by the passion and rage of any particuler man , which cannot after make recompence , with any humane abilitie that he hath ( though his life also should go therin ) for the hurt ensewing therof .

Diuers authors do note that the cheef flame of that furious hatred which grew to be implacable afterwardes betwixt Marius and Sylla , Effectes of yuel tongues . Pompey and Caesar in the Roman commonwealth was inkindled first by certayne opprobrious speaches vttered by some followers of those Princes , which yet the parties iniured , interpreted to come from their patrons that bare them out , and therof followed such warres , murthers , and other lamentable tragedies , as all the world can wel remember . And our English chronicles do also make mention that some reprochfull wordes cast out by King Harold agaynst Duke William of Normandy and his daughter ( whome he had promised to take to wyf ) stirred him cheefly to make that fatal armie , by which he conquered England , and brought all the English nation in to his subiection . As also an other scof vttered by king Phillip of France against the same William now king , touching his fat belly , cost France full dear , and many thowsand men their lyues of both sides : so impacient are princes comonly of contumelyes , and do easier remit and forget any other kinde of iniurie then reprocheful speaches .

Wherfore my first petition to your Lordships wisedome and moderation should be , to restraine such turbulent spirits as those are , which more of a mad and malitious kinde of wantonnes , then of wit , do loose their tongues with ouer much libertie against the honors of mightie Catholique princes abrode : and thereby do put in aduenture to trooble the waters of common-wealthes more deeply , then either themselues or others can easily calm again afterwards .

My next desire and humble supplication should be in the same matter , A supplication to the Councel for moderation . but of far more moment , that your Lordships by this occasion , and by some fit concurrance of times and busines which at this present , may seeme to offer themselues , would voutsafe to enter more seriously into the consideration of matters depending between your Lordships and the Catholique parte of her Maiesties subiects , who for many yeares haue had a hard conceyt and heauie hand born ouer them , and are brought to tearmes of extreme affliction : and that your Lordships as fathers of your common-wealth , would resolue at length to be mediators vnto her Maiestie ( contemning the dangerous and seditious eggings of vnquiet spirits to further extremitie ) for some more gentle , milde , & merciful course to be taken with them . Vnto which resolution me thinketh , that many circumstances might iustly moue your Lordships wisdomes , which though by the same wisdome you wil better consider of then I , yet for that it may be I desire it more then you , and consequently haue more thought thereon ( albeit more for your good also and the publique , then for any particuler interest of myn owne ) I shal with your good leaue represent some before you in this place .

And first of all , the time it self doth seeme to inuite greatly to som such cogitation , Reasons for moderation when great princes and monarchies round about vs , that had greater differences and difficulties then these are , haue not only treated but concluded also a most honorable peace and frendship : and the great most Christian King of France , shewing himself worthie of that name , hath remedied the very roote of al calamities springing to his noble realme before , by returning to the vnion of the Apostolique sea of Rome , which sea ( as commonly it falleth out ) hath byn the principal meanes of this so great and general a good to all those nations that are included within that peace and league , which are many and great as by the articles thereof doth appeer . And no lesse curteously and honorably is her Maiestie inuited also to the same , and all that desire the true good both of her person , state , and crowne , do wish and hope that it may take effect . And truly neuer could this weightie afaire be treated ( as it seemeth ) with more honor or facilitie then at this present instant , times and matters standing as they do : and so fit a meanes and mediator , as is the mightie king of France occurring for the purpose , potent and grateful with all the extremes . For with England and her Maiestie , he cannot but be so , in respect of matters and frendships past : with Spain he is also to be presumed now , by meanes and vertue of this new peace and great league concluded , with his holinesse of Rome , all christendome knoweth him to be , as well in respect of his being a catholique , as also for many particuler and extraordinary tokens of loue , which his holinesse hath shewed towards his person .

The persons also and qualities of the parties with whome this atonement is or were to be treated , Qualities of the princes to be dealt withall . are such as do greatly facilitate the enterprise , and confirme the hope , that all men haue of good successe .

For if for many ages God haue placed in the seat of Saynt Peeter , Pope Clement viij . a meek , milde , sweet , and holy man , this Pope Clement the eight is one , knowen to be a man without gawle , enmitie wrath or reuenge , of singuler pietie & zele in Gods cause , and most tender harted towards them that are out of the way , especially in heresy , of whome he suffereth diuers with his owne particuler licence to come to Rome , and to his owne presence , and vseth them with all manner of curtesie and fatherly tendernes , dismissing them again with much kindenes , and diuers benefits , as by experience we haue seene .

As for the king Catholique of Spain , who knoweth him not to be Salomon pacificus , K. Phillip . that peaceable and wise Salomon of this our age ? who not only hath bin peaceable in himself during the time of his so long a gouernment , offering molestation and warre to none ( except prouoked in his owne defence ) but also hath kept diuers other states round about him in peace likewise , as by those of Italy hath bin manifestly seen vpon diuers occasions : and as for his facility to make peace , where any reasonable conditions are offered , it hath bin sufficiently seen in this , lastly made with France , with restoring of so many important townes and states which he possessed of that crown and for his constancie in keeping peace once made , all former times of his raigne haue giuen testimony , and so will this ( I doubt not ) and the future time also in preseruing inuiolably this peace now knit vp with the king most christian , and his alyes and dependants .

So as with neither of these princes is there any cause of dout either of great difficultie , or of fraud or of breache , if this treatie might be concluded : and much lesse of the dutifull behaueour of English Catholiques both at home and abrode , if it please her Maiestie and your Lordships to come to some moderation and peaceable manner of proceding with them . The Catholiques of England their cheef desyre In which poynt their first and highest desire should be , that almightie God would inspire her Maiestie and your Lordships to think vpon the honorable , godly , and prudent course which the most Christian king of France hath taken of late ; to wit , by re●●iting himself and his kingdome agayne with the sea Apostolique of Rome , mother of all true vnion among Christians , for that by this act only all difficulties and ielousies , both domestical and forrayn depending of religion were ended & taken away . But if for our sinnes this cannot be , or not so soone as is desired , then their humble petition will be that at least they may haue the same libertie and fauour in England for their consciences , as Protestantes haue in France and in other states of the Empire at this day vnder catholique kinges and Emperours ; which petition seemeth so reasonable , so easie , and so profitable to the realme it self , and so honorable to her Maiestie , and to your Lordships ( who are desired to be mediators therin ) as they verely trust , that by this good occasion you will not deny to lend them your helping hands , for so publique and pretious a benefyte in all respectes .

And though I do not doubt but that diuers of S. Francis Hastings hote humor will step vp agaynst this proposition , The furie of purita●ical spirits . and cry rather fyre and sword and blood agaynst Catholiques , then any toleration or relaxation ; yet other mennes hope is , that your Lordships and others of the wiser and grauer sort of the realme will consider and suggest to her Maiestie what reason and humanitie requireth , and not what the furious passion of those men demandeth ; who cease not to exclame with the mercilesse Iewes , Crucifige , Crucifige , and further also would be content for satisfying their malice , so they might obtayne lyke sentence of iniustice agaynst Catholiques , as the Iewes did agaynst our Saueour ( espetially if they found a fit Pilate to grant it ) to cry with them , Sanguis eorum super nos , & super Filios nostros , let their blood fall vpon vs and our children ; and so it fell in most heauy measure vpon them , and the lyke will do vpon these when tyme of payment commeth appoynted by almightie God , if they change not their affection .

But your Lordships I presume be of a far different mynde and condition ; and that you will rather leaue peace , loue , and good will of all men to your children and posteritie , then the inheritance of these enmities , exasperations , and deadly feudes , for that blood enough ( and ouer much if Gods will were ) hath there byn spent already in our realme , within these twenty yeares last past about this controuersie of religion : and by this long experience your wisdomes haue seen what hath byn the euent , and what is lyke to be , if lyke proceeding be continued still .

Saynt Cyprians sentence hath byn manifestly verefied , Cyprian ●p. 93. sanguis martyrum Ecclesiae semen , The effects of dying for religion in England . by the blood of martirs the church increaseth . Aboue a hundreth and thirtie English priestes of the only seminaries beyond the seas ( as most men accounte ) haue lost their lyues in this quarrel within the foresayd tyme ; all men of peace , patient , and humble , learned , vertuous and meeke ; yong in age for the most part , but old in godlines , & in sapientia sanctorum , in the wisdome of Sayntes for the lyf to come : a great parte of them verie worshipfully borne , and tenderly brought vp by their parentes , and might haue liued many yeares in great delightes and pleasures of this world , if the loue of eternitie had not made this vale of vanitie contemptible vnto them . And albeit their death was reprehensible in the sight of some vulgar or passionate people , that consider nothing but the present spectacle and popular voyce , that they died for treasons ; yet to themselues who remembred the false accusations made agaynst their mayster for troobling the people , Math. 21. and for dehorting the payment of tribute vnto Caesar , and other such calumniations ; and that his innocency could not deliuer him , but that at last he was preferred to dy in the midle of two theeues vpon a crosse ; to them ( I say ) that remembred and did meditate these thinges , to them this circumstance of treason in their araygnments was sweet and comfortable , their consciences clearing them before their sayd mayster , from all such act , meaning or intention of treasons , as falsly was layd agaynst them ; and so much the more willingly they went to the ladder : and their example with the same reasons and meditations haue put the same desyre in foure tymes as many , of their owne coate , as they were : & in thowsandes of others within the land , which would neuer haue thought of this perfection of dying for religion , if God had not taught it then by this persecution & example of others .

A●d Sir Francis himself complayneth also ( as before you haue heard ) that within these three yeares vpon his knowledge many haue fallen away and do fall away daylie , from his religion to ours , by example the one of the other , for that ( as he saith ) Of the elder oxe the yonger steere doth learne .

So as by this may be gathered what will be the successe of this pursuite on the catholique syde , if the rigor be continued . But on the other hand , what it may come vnto , God only forseeth , whose cause if the catholiques do defend , and if his spirit be with them ( as to most men it is euident ) then must they winne in the end , and his wrath will appeare at length agaynst the other parte that iniustly afflicteth them , howsoeuer it be delayed and borne of for a tyme . Nor is the argument good that some do vse to make , we haue indured thus long and prospered , &c. For the holy ghost himself answereth , Ne dixeris : p●ccaui , & quid mihi accidit triste ? Eccles. ● . altissimus enim est patiens redditor . Say not : I haue donne amisse , and no hurt hath happened vnto me , for that God is a patient paymayster , and in the end payeth for all . The wise Solon told rich Craesus in his prosperitie that the measure of his felicitie could not be taken but at the end of his lyfe , Iustin. lib. 3. which in deed fell out to be most miserable : and in England king Henry the sixth concluded a long raigne of fortie yeares with a troblesome and pittiful perturbation of the same . And yet was there no such violent vexation of subiectes in those dayes as now is , and hath byn for many yeares , wherin truly if we set asyde all respect of religion and of Gods intermedling in the case , and consider only reason itself , and the opinion of wise wordly men and Philosophers , no man is ignorant but that they agree all , that : nullum violentum est durabile . And agayne , that : malus di●turnitatis custos , Cicero off . lib. 2. est metus . And Christe our Sauiour much more fully : Luc. 11. Omne regnum in se diuisum desolabitur . All which groundes and principles , cannot , but lay before your Lordships wisdomes the importance of some mitigation and mollification of matters for preuenting further inconueniences , The dangers after her Maisties death . if not for the present , yet at least for the tyme to come , espetially if God in his iustice and anger should take from vs her maiestie , all men may forsee in what termes we shal be quickly ; when to the differences of religion shal be added the other also about the succession , intangled perhaps principally by these respects of religion . And then when exasperated myndes shall come to haue more commoditie of working their willes , and wreaking their wrathes , great extremities may be feared , except the way be made before hand by some temperature of mitigation : for that English natures are vehement ( as all men know ) in whatsoeuer they take in hand , but espetially in these kynde of differences , as former tymes haue made lamentable experience , and the future I feare will declare the same much more , if preuention be not made ; seing that neuer in tymes past concurred so many circumstances of sharp contention both from at home and abrode , as now are lyke to be : no forayn prince being neer about vs but wil be desirous to haue an oare in the guyding of this bark if once it be aflote , either for their owne pretenses or for their frend , or agaynst their opposite : besydes the different reasons of state that may moue diuers parties at that day , as France , Flandres , & Demmark , that our future king be not ouerstrong , Spayne , France , & Flanders , that he concur with them in religion : England generally that he subiect vs not to an other crowne ; England in part that he be homeborne ; and England in three partes to the fauor or disfauour of three distinct religions , Protestant , Puritan , and Catholique , euery parte for his owne .

And as these things are manifest in themselues , so is it also no lesse euident , that the only or principal meane to preuent these dangers , were to mittigate somwhat these acerbities now , to the end that men of different religions dealing more freindly together , might in time either come to be all of one opinion , or at leastwise to agree in some good temperature for this publique afaire of the common-wealth , which is impossible to do while matters of religion are pursued with such hostilitie , as for many years they haue bin .

To which consideration there commeth also an other of no lesse moment in myn opinion , which is , that her Maiestie hauing raigned now a goodly number of years ( being neer the one and fourtie of her scepter ) as she followeth fast on the rate of Octauianus Augustus yeares of Empire , The example of Aug. and other kings . so would she imitate his sweetnes and felicitie also in disposing his later yeares ( euen from the number of fourtie that her Maiestie is now at ) to the exhilerating of all her people generally as he did , and therby came to be so deare , & so intirely beloued of all , as the publique teares of all did testifie at his death , all crying and wishing , that either he had neuer bin borne , or neuer dyed , neuer bin their Emperor , or neuer left to be , referring the former parte of their wish vnto the beginning of his gouernment , which had bin preiudicial to their common wealth , and the second to his latter end , which was most grateful to all .

And this particuler point of Augustus his proceeding , Kings of England . diuers noble , kings also of her Maiesties progenitors haue indeuored to imitate by special dissignement , & namely the two famous Henryes the fourth and seuenth , and Edward also the fourth , who albeit they entered by dint of sword , and had many sharp bickerings for diuers yeares , with their oposite factions , yet all three of them so disposed themselues to clemencie towards their later dayes , as they were most dear euen to them that had bin their enimies , and oposit at their first entrance to the crown .

Which circumstance notwithstanding of difficultie , doth not occur to her Maiestie in the matter proposed for fauour of the Catholiques , for that she neither entered the crowne by force of armes , nor had she the catholiques of her realme against her therin , In the 6. incounter . but rather they were the people that principally & with most harty affection assisted her Maiestie to the quiet and peaceable possession of the same , as in another place more at large hath bin declared . And euer since they haue liued with that dutifull obedience to her Maiestie in all temporal matters , which to any of her catholique ancestors hath ●uer bin exhibited by their dearest people .

Wherfore seeing there is no difficultie nor demerit on the behalf of the catholiques why this benifit should not be granted to them , who were in possession of it at the entrance of her Maiestie to the crown , and had expresse promises to haue it continued stil : and on the other side , there be many and most weightie reasons to moue her Maiestie to haue compassion of them , and to aleuiate their grieuous pressures and vexations after so many years of sufferance , your Lordships haue the most honorable , iust , and pious cause in the world , wherin to be mediators to her Maiestie for so principal a parte of your common-wealth , as your catholiques be .

And for so much as this cause hath not only these three partes specified of pietie , iustice , and honor , to moue your Lordships withall ( which yet I presume would to such men be sufficient ) but also includeth so many other like perswasiue motiues , as either prudence or christian reason of state can comprehend ( as namely security , continuance , strength , vnion , peace , defence , vtilitie , comfort , ease , ornament , alacritie , facility , and the like ) great hope is conceiued that your Lordships wil not refuse to imbrace the same .

And surely ( my lordes ) the same reasons and many more might iustly moue her Maiestie and your Lordships also to take in hand the perfection of that greatest woorke , The example of King Henrie the eight , and the King of France . so earnestly thought vpon by her Maiesties noble father King Henry the eight in his later dayes , as before you haue heard , by the publique protestation and other of Bishop Gardener , his neerest and dearest Councelor in those dayes . And you haue in the same matter the present example and president of the great king and kingdome of France , In the 3. incounter . which most wisely and happely hath followed the same resolution , and hath found infinite ease , honour , and benefyte therby , both before God and man : and it is and wil be of great consequence in Christianitie , and ought no doubt to moue her Maiestie and your Lordships much . Yet for that the hartes of Princes are in the handes of God to be moued , when to his diuine wisdome , mercy , and iustice shal be thought best , and for that the sinnes of our countries are great & manifold , which haue brought forth so greeuous afflictions vpon our selues by our selues : if the multitude of these our demerits be such as do hinder so great & vniuersal a blessing as would be for vs to see her Maiestie and the realme re●nited agayne to that spiritual fountayne of the sea● Apostolique by which all perfect vnion● must insue , yet in a secondarie degree of comfort is desired , that at least the persecution for religion may cease agaynst Catholiques , and they be suffered to lyue in the religion wherin her Maiesties noble ancestors , and your Lordships forefathers liued and dyed most christianly , and honorably , from the first conuersion of our land from paganisme to christan religion euen vnto these our dayes . An important consideration . The memory of which your progenitors now dead , and of their soules yet liuing and what sense and feeling they haue of these things , and what they would say to you and do in this behalf , if they were heer again to see men afflicted and pursued for that faith and religion which they so much esteemed and sought to aduance , and by which we cannot but piously presume and hope , that they be now saued and made partakers of Christes euerlasting glory , with whome we can neuer haue parte nor fellowship again , if we follow not their steps in the same religion , this cogitation ( I say ought greatly to moue your Lordships to do somwhat in this so weightie and important sute of the afflicted catholiques .

And further I appeale to your Lordships wise consideration what a comfort it might be to her Maiestie , now in her elder age , and later part of her gouernment , and to your Lordships also to see once all sortes of people merry , contented , louing , and confident within the realme , A ioyful state . al to laugh and sing together , all to pray to God most hartely for her Maiesties health , wealth , and prosperous long continuance ; al to be vnited in defence of the realme ; all made frends and familiar together , as in Germanie and other places men be , notwithstanding the differences of religion , which more easely perhaps would be taken away and vnion brought in ; when freely and confidently men might confer , and eche man shew his reason without feare , and heare another mans argument without suspition of fraud or violence to be vsed .

This was the first proposition that Protestantes made vnto the world at their first appearance , which they accompanied with many scriptures & reasons both diuine and humane that fayth ought not to be forced . The first proposition of Protestantes in the world . They haue obtayned in sundrye countries their petition , and therfore cannot in reason and honor be agaynst the same petition now made by Catholiques to her Maiestie and to your lordships in England : and that with so much more equitie and iustice , by how much longer Catholiques haue byn in possession of their Religion , then Protestantes of theirs , especially within England .

Your Lordships haue had many yeares experience now of the present maner of proceeding by affliction of Catholiques , where one part of the land hath wept , whyle the other hath laughed ; the one sort sighed , whyle the other singed , the one triumphed , whyle many others haue mourned , complayned , and exclaymed : let some proof be made of the other way also , wherby contentme●t is geuen to all , let it be tried once in her Maiesties dayes how matters will go when all emnitie and hostillitie is taken out of the bowels of our commonwealth , when the catholique man and woman in England may deale with their neighbour in loue and confidence ; when our noble and worshipful gentlemen abrode may returne home , & shew their loyal duties to their Soueraigne without offence or peril , or force offred to their conscience for matters of religion ; when our English merchantes may traffique freely throughout the world without peril of piracie or confiscations , when our home gentlemen may trauel with lyke libertie where it seemeth them best for increase of their experience to serue their country , when our English students may visit forrayne vniuersityes without restraint , and strangers come to ours and speake , confer , dispute , and reason with modestie without danger of intrapping .

Let this ( my good Lords ) be proued for a time , and let your honors as principal members of this afflicted body of our deuided realme , be suters vnto her Maiestie , as to the head , for this sweet and holesome medicine by peace and composition within it self .

Whereby there is no doubt but much honor & m●●it wil grow vnto your Lordships , much comfort , ease , & securitie , to her Maiestie , much ioy & vtilitie vnto all her subiects , much edification vnto our neighbours about vs , much care and solicitude be taken away from all sortes of English , much trooble and charges of warres excused , much strength added to the common-wealth , many perils diuerted , both for the present , and the time to come , many benefits and benedictions insew euery way , if I be not deceiued : which yet I leaue to the high and most holy inscrutable prouidence of almightie God , to determine at his pleasure , and to your Lordships wisdomes to consider with due maturitie .

And so most humbly I take my leaue . This first of September 1598.

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