HAving in the last Tractate of the former part , shewed the vnlawful dominion of certein of our church officers , ouer the whole church , and especially over their fellow Ministers : yt seemeth good , to ioyn this next therevnto . For thereby shal boeth better appear how vnsufferable this disorder is , which ouerspreadeth boeth church and common wealth : and the gouernment by the Eldership ( the tractate whereof shal follow immediatly ) in yt self iust , shal by comparison with this church lordship , be more iustified .

That the moste of the places quoted by the Admonit. Diuis● . pag. 749. are vsed of vuriters of that excellency , vuith vuhome the D. is not vuorthy to be named the same day : hath , and further wil appear . His exception , that by this , they are lifted vp aboue god himself : is vain . For , beside that it is a kinde of speach vsed of the best autors , to note a great inequalitie : he is les worth , then I prised him at , if he think that he is worthy to be named the same day that god him self is . For if he wil so seruilely cleau vnto wordes : yet the question is , whether he be vuorthy , to be named , not ( as he writeth ) whether he may be named .

The place of S. a a LuK. 9. 60. 61. Luke , is vnderstanded properly of the Diuis. 2. pag. 750. Ministers of the word : and not of al Christians , which is manifest , for that our Sauiour Christ biddeth him , that would haue goen bak for burial of his father , to preach the Kingdome of heauen , which he neuer commanded to al Christians : so that his meaning is of the calling vnto the ministery , and not of the calling to eternal life . That such ciuil offices as he alloweth in Ecelesiastical persons , are helpes for them to doe their duties , repeted a a 752. D. 4. 757. 761. D. 5. 762. D. 7. 765. D. 3. 773. D. 15. 783. seuen times : is a demaunding of that in question . For , where b b 757. Diuis. 3. pa. 751. after he saith , he hath declared yt : he saith vntruly , he hath onely nakedly affirmed yt : which how vntrw it is , shal after also appear .

My reply is that our Sauiour Christes vocation , vuas to be a Minister of the gospel , but he c c LuK. 12. 24. refused ciuil iudgment because of his vocation : therfore he refused it , because he vuas a Minister of the gospel . whervpon also followeth , that Bishops being Ministers of the gospel : owght not to receiue , any such power . See now how iustly he complaineth , that I answer not to that he said , that Christs refusal in the partition of the inheritans , perteyneth no more to Bishops then to Kinges : no mervail also , if it require further answer , it was so wel garded : seing his reason ys , because the doeinges of Christ be a patern for al Christians : then which , there can be nothing more absurd . For althowgh al his doeinges , be instruction to al Christians : yet that they are a patern to them al , draweth with it , that al may preach , that none may giue iudgment in civil causes , and a number more horrible confusions : yt being also a fals ground of popery , wherby they would establish the lenton fast , and other such corruptions .

Where also he would giue to vnderstand , that our Sa. Christ did refuse this , not as a Minister of the gospel , but as Redemer : he renteth a sunder thinges , which can not be separated . For one part of his redemership , standeth in that he was giuen of god vnto vs , for a teacher : so that , if he would haue answered any thing in this kinde , he must haue said , that he refused to iudg of ciuil causes , not as a Minister of the word , but as a Priest , or King , whereof also the last , he in part setteth down : saying he refused yt , to declare that his Kingdome was not earthly , but heauenly : as if it were not as necessary , for hym to refuse it in respect of his Doctorship , that he might declare likewise , that his doctrine was not of earthly thinges , but of heauenly : and consequently , as convenient in the same respect , for the Ministers to abstein from it . But the further confutation of this , the reader shal take from thence , d d Tra. 6. p. 404. where is shewed , that our Sa. Christ , by his own example , calleth the Apostels and , in them , al the Ministers of the word , from al pomp and dominion : and therfore from these ciuil offices , whervnto pomp and dominion are annexed .

Then he answereth , that no man giueth the Bishops autority to iudg in matters of inheritans : whereas our Sa. Christ , refused it not , because he was no Iudg of that cause , but simply because he was no ciuil Iudg : a a Ioh. 8. 1● refusing vpon the same ground , to giue sentence of the harlot . The Ministers ( for sooth ) may not medle with ciuil occupations , but with ciuil offices : and in ciuil offices , not with them of no countenance , as the Iailers office &c , but with those of estate : and amongest those of estate , not with matters of inheritance but with criminal causes . Thus , yow take your self licence , to say al thinges , and to shew none . But to leau the rest vnto an other place , let the D. shew some reason , why the Minister should rather sit in iudgment of criminal causes , then in pleas of inheritans : they boeth belong to the Magistrate alike , yf he owght to accept one , being committed vnto hym by the Magistrate , why not also the other : especially , when as by criminal causes , ( requiring more search and greater diligence then the other ) there must needes be greater hinderance from his ministery . As for that he saith , those are to be decided by law , and haue other Iudges appointed for them : the criminal causes are likewise . And if there were no other Iudges appointed for them : yet , whether there owght to be , is the question : so that the D. answer , is here an open demaund of the question . Where also owt of M. Caluin , he alledgeth Barnard , that the Ministers power is in crimes : it is a shameful abusing , of boeth Calvin and Barnard . for they speak there of rebuking and punishing syn , by ecclesiastical censures : which is manifest , in that they convey the title of this power , to the Minister , b b 4. li. Inst. 11. cap. 12. sect. by the Keies deliuered vnto S. Peter . now the very word of Keies , especially with this addition , giuen vnto S. Peter : telleth al men , that the power there spoken of , is spiritual , and not ciuil . And here the D. is directly against him self . For before , in this very diuision , saying that this iudgment in ciuil causes is not incident , but added to the ministery : here he pretendeth owt of Barnard , that ciuil iudgment in criminal causes , is of the power and iurisdiction of the Ministers .

And if it be trw that he saith after , the pastor must vse such discipline , as semeth good to the Magistrate : when the Magistrate ordeineth ciuil discipline onely , ether that discipline must be incident to the pastorship , or els in such a time , there shal be a Pastor of god , which hath no discipline incident into his office : seing the ecclesiastical discipline , which is taken ( by his iudgment ) from him laufully , is not incident : so that this idle distinction goeth flat to the ground . I cal it idle , be cause it maketh nothing to the question : which is not , whether a Minister may bear ciuil office , in that respect that he is a Minister , but whether he may bear it at al. And of this sort also is , that our Bishops break not violently into these offices , but receiue them of the Princes gift : whereas our question is , whether he may receiu these offices when they be giuen : yet hath he vsed this distinction , at the least , fiue tymes .

After is added , that it is committed to them by the Magistrate , for fuller satisfying of their dutie : yf so , why should not al the Ministers alike haue this power , to the end , that al might doe their duties the better . Again , in saying that it is necessary for this tyme : yow openly wrest this power , owt of the Magistrats hand . For thereby it followeth , that the Magistrate of dutie , owght to commit this vnto them : and if he doe not , he is giltie of gods wrath , in leauing vndoen , that which is necessary to be doen. yow doe also open iniury to the holy gost , which is thus supposed to haue left that in the liberty of the Magistrate , which is necessary for the accomplishing of the ministery : whereas , if it had bene necessary , there had bene also nothing more easy , then to haue giuen this general rule , that alwaies vnder a Christian Magistrate , the Minister should be armed with civil autority . But this succour which yow seek in the tyme , is Pigghius shift : as is also this whole cause , and the flower of your arguments . For he saith , As long as the church Pigg lib. 5. hierarh ca. 16. vuas in persecution , al vuere obedient vnto their Pastors , hovu simple or base so euer the Ministers vuere : but after that the church came to haue prosperity , then it vuas needful , that Bishops should be magnifical also , to the end they might be more apt , to gouern the magnifical Princes : and that otherwise his power and autority should not be sufficiently reuerenced . To whome , as vnto the D. it is easy to answer , that if Kinges and Princes , being yet in deadly hatred against the gospel , were browght by the ministery of the word , vnaccompanied with any such pomp or iurisdiction , to yeeld them selues vnto the gospel , and to giue due reuerence vnto the ministery : how much more now , being friendes , wil they be kept in dutie and convenient estimation thereof , withowt this disguising of the ministery .

That alledged out of Caluin , that euery man must respect his own vocation &c. beside that it is drawen clean from the minde of the autor , it is absurdly applied . For the application , affirmeth it meet for the vocatio of the Minister , that he should bear ciuil office : which is that in question . And where he saith , Caluin speaketh nothing against these civil offices in ecclesiastical persons , and after , that nether he nor any godly man , can disalow of yt : he giueth suspition that he hath sould him self to speak vntruth , withowt al chek of conscience . For Calvin sheweth , that albeit the godly Princes , giuing these offices to church men , had a good intent : yet , that they did euil provide thereby for the church , considering that by it was corrupted , or 4. lib. Inst. 11. cap. 10. sect. rather vtterly brovught to no vught , al true and auncient sincerity , and that , the Bishops if they had had a spark of grace , vuould vuhen they were offered such offices , haue ansuuered , that the armour of their vuarfare , is not carnal but spiritual . Here again also , he is owt with him self . For in the end of his book , albeit the shiftes he vseth are to rowgh hewed : yet , when he commeth to Caluin , in this matter void of al shift , he is constreined to reiect his autority . Yf he haue nothing against him , why doeth he make so smale account of him , as for nothing to cast him of : if he be against him , why doeth he here deny it . And as I haue alledged M. Caluin , and some others : so the learned know that a number moe might be browght , to the making vp of a book : but for him , beside the papistes ( as I am verely perswaded ) scarce one so bould an enemy of the truth , as to commit this to writing .

Against the plain meaning of the Apostle , opened in flat Diuis. 4. p. 752. wordes , verses 3. 4. 5. 6. 7. 8. of Rom. 12. here is nothing but your suerly , and certein : which I wil suffer to haue that credit , it can get , against so manifest light . Your argument , is the same which I haue said . The Bishop must gouern with discipline , therefore with ciuil discipline : your answer that he must vse discipline prescribed by the Magistrate , whether ciuil or ecclesiastical , is an asking of that in question .

The answer to the place of a a 2. Tim. c. 2. 4. Timothy , that it is spoken of al Diuis. 6. p. ●54 . Christians indifferently merely faced out with the name of Caluin : is b b Lib. 5. hie rarch . ca. 6. Pigghius answer , to the protestants . And it is confuted , in that S. Paul instructeth Timothy there , not as a simple Christian , but as a Minister of the gospel : in that also he borowed this speach of the law , which c c Num. 4. 3. & 8. 24. 25. calleth the ministery a souldiarfare : thirdly in that the same Apostle in other d d 1. Co. 9. 7 Phili. 2. 25. places giueth this title of souldiarship , and felow souldiarship , to those of the ministery . Beside that it flatly condemneth Cyprian , as an abuser of the place : who by vertw hereof , forbiddeth a Minister an Executorship , which , by the D. ether is not forbidden him , or els is forbidden to al Christians alike . And not onely Cyprian is condemned , but e e li. 1. officio cap. 38. Ambrose and f f vpon Sophon . 1. ca. Ierome which vse it , as the admonition : Beside g g Bucer vpon Eph. ca. 4. Bucer and other godly writers of our tyme , as appeareth by Pigghius answer . The reason whereby Pigghius and he , would shew it vnderstanded of al Christians alike , is this . Al Christians be spiritual souldiars : S. Paul speaketh of spiritual souldiars : therfore he speaketh of al Christians : concluding affirmatiuely in the second figure , which is to open a faut . where yow should vnderstand , that althowgh Christianity be a kinde of spiritual warfare : yet , it foloweth not , that every spiritual warfare , is Christianitie . Your answer to Cyprian , whereby yow would restrein his iudgment to the Executorship , and not suffer it to haue place in civil offices : is friuolous , and flatly against his wordes , which a a Cyp. lib. 1. epist. 9. saith that it vuas decreed in a Councel , that the Minister should onely serue the altar , and the sacrifices , and giue them selues to praier . Your reason is as fond , that the executorship is more troblesome then to bear ciuil office , because sometime temporal men ( as yow cal them ) do refuse it : as if therewere not , which refused other ciuil offices , for the same cause . The reply to the next diuision , the reader may take , owt of the b b pag. 409. l. 31. former part of my book .

The exception out of the Coloss. that wiues must obey their husbandes Diuis. 8. p. 755. in the lord : doeth not hinder , but that the place to the c c 1. Thess. 5. 12. Thessa. may put a difference betvuene the ciuil and ecclesiastical gouernment . For S. Paul ( as the Hebrews doe the preposition ● ) vseth the preposition ( In ) diuersly . where therefore he willeth the Thessalonians to acknovulegd those , vuhich vuere set ouer them in the lord , he meaneth , in thinges perteining vnto the lord : but when he willeth the vuiues , to obey their husbandes in the lord , he meaneth , that they should doe it , no further then is agreable vnto the wil of god : not that he would restrein their obedience , onely to such thinges as pertein to the kingdome of heauen , as the wordes be taken in the other place .

In saying , that althowgh the godly Magistrate ruleth in the lord ouer vs , yet that this title is giuen by excellency 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 〈◊〉 vnto the ecclesiastical officers : I doe not daly ; it is the distinction of the doly Gost him self . For , albeit they that handle common wealth matters , serue the lord , and doe thinges tending to his glory : yet the scripture comparing boeth these gouernments togither , giueth this title , as a note to discern the ecclesiastical officers from the ciuil , as appeareth in the d d 2. Chron. 19. 11. Chronicles from whence ( it is like ) the Apostle toke this maner of speach . The reason whereof is : for that ciuil gouernments are not so nighly , nor so immediately referred vnto the glory of god , as are the ecclesiastical . Beside that this reproch is against M. Caluin , and Beza : who vpon that place upon the 5. chap. of the Thessal . ground the same distinction . I graunt , there be some thinges common to boeth the gouernmentes , as be also to thinges diuers , yea contrary : but in confessing the ciuil gouernment distinguished from the ecclesiastical , and yet affirming certein ciuil offices common to boeth , yow speak wthout al sens . For , where that which should agree , owght to be a third thing from the ecclesiastical and ciuil power : yow make one of these two , to agree to them selues .

And althowgh he stil rubbeth vpon this , that ciuil offices , such as he meaneth , are not onely no hinderans , but a help for the Bishop to doe his office : yet he can neuer be browght to expres , what those offices be . For he feareth partly , that the confutation wil be a great deal easier : partly least , if he should prik high , he should draw his cause into the hatered of al , if he should fallow , he should not serue their appetite , to whom he would , peraduenture , offer vnto in this cause .

It is in deed a good reason , as the cours of this disputation Diuis. 9. pag. 755. doeth declare : they must exercise ecclesiastical discipline , therfore not ciuil : they must haue the spiritual sword of corrections alwaies in their hand , therfore not the ciuil : oneles they can hould , and beweld two swordes at once : and oneles the two handed sword of the word of god , occupiyng boeth their handes , they haue a third hand , for the ciuil .

To the next I answer , as vnto the seuenth diuis . As for Diuis. 10. pag. 756. the answer which he asketh to his vntrw surmise , of the Admonit. abbridging the Magistrates autority , seing it is so often , and of no not onely cause , but not so much as occasion , as a thing vnworthy once to loke bak for , I quietly pas by : albeit this vntruth hath , and shal ( god willing ) after generally appear .

To that I alledged , of the difficulty and multitude of duties , Cap. 2. Diuis. 1. p. 757 vuhich the ministery of the vuord doeth lay vpon the Bishop , of one side , and of the vueaknes of mans nature , of the other , therby to binde the Bishop from reaching owt his hand to other functions : he saith , that this had had likelihood , if he should exercise a function , contrary to the ecclesiastical . Of this sort , are also these profes alledged a a pag. 761. pag. 766. Diuis. 5. pag. 766. other where : that they may exercise boeth iurisdictions , because they tend boeth to one end , that is to the maintenance of religion , reformation of manners , and punishment of syn . where the reader may see , that the distinction which he churmeth after so painfully , wil not come . As if there were any lawful function , be it neuer so base , contrary to an other lawful function : seing that good can not be contrary to good : nether are there any , which pertein not to the maintenance of religion . And the iudgment of landes ( which notwithstanding he confesseth vnmeet for a Minister ) pertayneth to reformation of maners , and punishment of syn : whilest that which is his , being giuen to euery one , the wrong doers are punished . Likewise is also the Princis office : so that , if he may receiu al these callinges , he may ether exercise al the offices and occupations in the land , or at the least moe then him self dare avouch . But the prouerb shal then be ( as it is already ) trw in them : that he vuhich embraceth much , streyneth but a litle . After he excepteth , that by this reason a Christian man should be continually in spiritual meditation , and neuer medle with worldly affaires : which procedeth of a great want . for aswel ( althowgh not so principally ) perteyneth it to the dutie of euery Christian , to haue to doe with worldly affaires : as at times conuenient , to be occupied in spiritual meditation . And as the reason which I browght , hath not so much as the least seed of Anabaptism : so the D. answer , leadeth to plain monckery , whilest he placeth the whole duty of a Christian man in spiritual meditation . But , seing yow imagin the Bishops , to be men of so great burden , that beside their church ministery , they be able to cary the ciuil office : answer me , how cometh it to pas , that they commit part of their own and proper office , vnto Chauncelors , Archdeacons &c , except they haue more to doe then they can doe them selues ? what a confusion is it , to turn ouer to others , thinges which ( they say ) belong properly to their office : and to take offices , which they confes , are not incident to their calling .