The copies of certaine discourses, which were extorted from diuers, as their friends desired them, or their aduersaries driue them to purge themselues of the most greeuous crimes of schisme, sedition, rebellion, faction, and such like, most vniustly laid against them for not subscribing to the late authoritie at the first sending thereof into England in which discourses are also many things discouered concerning the proceedings in this matter abroad.

THE Copies of certaine discourses , which were extorted from diuers , as their friends desired them , or their aduersaries driue them to purge themselues of the most greeuous crimes of schisme , sedition , rebellion , faction , and such like , most vniustly laid against them for not subscribing to the late authoritie at the first sending thereof into England : In which discourses are also many things discouered concerning the proceedings in this matter abroad .

Dicit piger Leo est in via .

Prouerb . 26.

The slothfull excuse themselues , saying . There is a Lyon in the way .

Imprinted at Roane , by the heires of Ia. Walker . 1601.

The Preface to the Reader .

THe differences and disagreements are such , which in these fewe yeares last past haue bred , and daily grow to more and more perfection in that kind , to so great a disgust of all sincere Catholickes , not onely here in England but also in the principall , if not in all the parts of Christendome , whither the worthie fame of their memorable acts for the restoring of their natiue Country vnto the Catholicke faith hath come , that it is high time to giue them some taste of these matters , who are so disgusted , by laying before them the true cause , and grounds of this lamentable dissention , and to discouer how colourably the common enemie of God , and his Church , hath proceeded to the disturbance first of Gods Priests , then to the mutual dislike of Catholickes among themselues , and of such Priests as against whom by wrong informations they are violently led , and let not to vse both tongue and penne in most vngratefull manner .

Some , being asked by others what might be the cause of so great a strife among the Priestes , haue simply answered that the cause is , for that the Priests being but secular men will not humble themselues , or be directed or gouerned by the Iesuites , who are religious ; but what truth soeuer is in this cause , of all other it must not be giuen , for such a subiection , euen in the eares of those who desire it , soundeth so absurdly , that they endeuour rather to haue it , then to heare of it , and both M. Blackwell in his Letters to the Cardi. Caietan dated the 10. of Ianuary 1596. and F. Parsons in his Letters against M. Doctor Bish: and M. Ch: dated the 9. of October 1599. labour to put this conceit out of mens minds , how euidently soeuer the practise in Wisbitch to make Fa. Weston the Iesuite superiour ouer the secular Priests ( who then were in durance for the Catholicke faith : pursued both by the knowne , and couert Iesuites , and all other their fauourites doth proue it , as also a Libell giuen abroad by the Authour thereof himselfe , to admonish others to beware of such Priests ( and by no meanes to haue any dealing with them in spirituall matters , euen to the disturbing of them out of their places of residence ) as vnfit guides for soules , who had not a dependance of the Iesuites . And not long since another of their fauourites letted not to say , that those Priests who are not vnder the Iesuites gouernment are no better then the Ministers ; Many more proofes may be made hereof out of the speeches of many other their fauourites , who giue counsell to all that are afflicted in these turmoyles to submit themselues to the Iesuites .

Other some , ( who perceiue well , that , if this should be maintained to be the true cause of so scandalous a schisme in Gods church , it would redound to the eternall disgrace , & infamie of such , as , by whom they hauing conceiued some foolish hope of preferment , they had rather that they should indeed beare the sway , & haue the gouernment of the Cleargie ( although it were vnderhand ) then be said either to seeke it , or to haue it ) giue out that the cause of this diuision among the Priests is , for that some Priests mooued either with ambition , or desire of contradiction , will not subiect themselues vnto their lawfull superiour appointed by his holinesse , and confirmed in authoritie ouer them by his Breue sent into England for that purpose : and these haue from time to time both written , and maintained in most iniurious manner ( to possesse the more perfectly such as are too readie to thinke no calumniation too greeuous euen against those who haue best deserued of them ) that these Priests are schismatickes , seditious , rebellious , &c. euen to the diuiding for this cause of parents and their children , men and their wiues , brothers and sisters , and whole housholds , while the one retaining that reuerend respect of their long knowne , and tried ghostly fathers , for learning , wisedome , and vertue , is assailed by the other with these most wicked suggestions , and false calumniations , and forced either to liue a discontented life , or to break friendship ; and ( against their owne consciences ) make semblance at the least that they conceiue hardly of such as they very well perswade themselues wil not commit so great offence against God , and his Church , in whose defence they haue spent many yeares , and remaine still resolute to shead their dearest bloud .

That therefore no errour be hereafter in any man , who will not too much affect ignorance in such things as concerne not onely his particular good but the Common cause of God , & his Church ( which whiles the Cleargie liueth at some variance in an euill affected Countrey , cannot doubtlesse but be very greatly preiudiced therby ) it is thought expedient , yea necessarie , that the cause of this dissention be with truth , and sinceritie declared , & made knowne to the world , that our actions and the reasons thereof being weighed with equall ballances , truth may take place , the offerers of the wrong may be discouered , the vniustly afflicted may be relieued , and that ease ( at the least by these meanes ) may be procured , which would not come of so long sufferance .

The strife , and dissention at this day too great , and scandalous in England , is maintained by the Arch-priest , the Iesuites , & their adherents , against those Priests who did forbeare to subiect themselues vnto the Arch-priest constituted in authoritie ouer all the Seminary Priests in England and Scotland by a Cardinall , who was Protector of the English Colledge at Rome , and afterwards honoured with the title of Protector of England , for the which forbearing to subiect themselues at the first making knowne of this authoritie , the Priests were accused of schisme , sedition , faction , rebellion , &c. All which calumniations were forgiuen by the Priests so grieuously iniuried , and a peace made to the great comfort of all Catholiques , when his holinesse Breue was presented vnto them , but this peace was soone after broken by the meanes of the Iesuites , who reuiued the same calumniations against the Priests , and by the Arch-priest , who did not onely auerre the assertions of the Iesuites , but published also that he had receiued a resolution from the mother Citie ( to vse his tearmes ) which avowed that the refusers of the authoritie ( noting by this phrase the Priests who did forbeare for a time vpon causes seeming iust to them to accept thereof ) were Schismatickes . So that the cause of this diuision now in England , is not for any resistance in the Priests against the superioritie , as many forward and euill taught people perswade themselues , & cry out against the priests , that they are disobedient . But the cause of this diuision is , for that the Priests will not acknowledge that in the time of their forbearance to subscribe to the authoritie ( which was no longer then vntill they sawe the Breue ) they were factious , seditious , rebellious , Schismatickes , enormiously disobedient , in continuall mortall sinne , practising their function in irregularitie , and pretending to absolue from sinne without faculties , or iurisdiction meete therevnto , worse then South-sayers and Idolaters , &c. If therefore sufficient reasons may be giuen why the Priests did forbeare to subiect themselues before they sawe any Letters from his holinesse concerning this authoritie , it will both appeare how greatly they haue bene iniuried both by the Archpriest , Iesuites , and their euill nurtured children , and how necessarie this course of publishing in this sort , is for the purging of the other Priests from those slaunderous speeches ; and here by the way do we aske of those pious Catholiques , ( for so they must be tearmed howsoeuer they deserue it , ) when they charge , and perswade themselues that they choake the Priests with disobedience , what it is , that they meane by this disobedience , if they meane therby that the Priests do not acknowledge M. Black . for their Arch-priest and superiour , they may if it so please them correct this their vnderstanding , and from henceforth either beleeue that euery man dooth acknowledge him , or else name who doth not , and let him in particular be called in question for it : for this generall prattle that they are disobedient is so vnsauourie a shift , vnlesse they could discend to particulars , that a man with litle honestie would quickly perceiue how it doth taint his breath :

If by disobedience in the Priests they do meane the not yeelding or conforming their vnderstanding to the Arch-priest his vnderstanding , they exact this obedience to the Arch-priest either because that he is learned , or because that he is a superiour , but neither of these respects conuince any such matter , as that the refusing to be so conformable should bring with it schisme , sedition , faction , rebellion , &c. Not the first , which is in regard of his learning . For although that many in England for modestie sake onely make no comparisons with him for his learning , yet without offence we may say that there are many beyond the seas farre his betters , and much more learned , who haue decided this question for vs against him , so that the conceit only of being an Arch-priest , or in authoritie , is left for them to iustifie these most iniurions calumniations against vs . If then they exact this obedience in Priests to the Arch-priest , in respect that he is a superiour , and because that he is a superiour they imagine that euerie man who will not thinke as he thinketh , and do what he commaundeth is a Schismaticke , a rebell , factious , seditious , &c. These who are so ignorant must be taught , and such as are contented at this time to make shewe of so grosse ignorance , must be put in mind that authoritie is not an infallible rule of truth in all who haue authoritie , and consequently that no man is bound in all things to beleeue or execute what euerie man in authoritie ouer him shall put vpon him . In how many things not onely Arch priests but their superiours also the Archdeacons , and other of higher degree haue done amisse , and swarued from the truth ? and who vpon earth is warranted from erring but one , and not he in all things ? how absurdly then should this point be vrged that the Priests are Schismatickes , rebellious , &c. for not conforming themselues in their vnderstanding to an Archpriest ? And if the simpler sort of Catholiques cannot vnderstand this reason sufficiently grounded vpon too many examples recorded in all Ecclesiasticall Histories , we would demaund of them , when they are commaunded to doo that by such as are in authoritie vpon their alleageance , which in conscience they cannot doo , whether they be rebellious , factious , seditious , &c. in not obeying this commaundement ? or by what reason they may in not obeying resolue their consciences , that they are not rebellious , & c ?

Doubtlesse either they must confesse that they are rebellious , &c. in not obeying the commaundment of those who are in authoritie , or else that it is not a sufficient proofe of rebellion that men do not in all things as others in authoritie commaund them , and to runne for refuge to cases , and particulars , is to flie touch for ( hauing before spoken of this particular case which is in question among vs ) we presse now onely this point , that authoritie is not so infallible a rule of truth in all to whom it is most it stly deriued , as those must be condemned as factious , rebellious , sediticus , schismatickes , &c. who will not conferme their vnderstandings to their conceits , who are in authoritie because they are in authoritie .

These points , and those which hereafter will be touched , wee doo not set downe as men that would make sheepe iudges of their pastours , but as men desirous that their bretheren , and children , would not be so violently carried as they are , both against dutie , and charitie , but suspend their iudgements in these matters , and so beare themselues towards all , as they may hereafter make a good answere for their behauiour towards them , who haue after so deare a rate sought to saue their soules , and now request that their long sufferance be no preiudice vnto them , nor warrant to loosse tongues to enlarge themselues with contumelious speeches against them whose cause the discourses following wil both conuince all , who are desirous not to be misled in a matter of so great consequence , that it is iust , and that they haue also iust cause to publish the same for the better instruction of such as with whom they may not be suffered or admitted to conferre about it , yet without touch of any more then the matter it selfe , and occasions ministred doo most necessarily require .

Yours in all true hartie affection .

Certaine Considerations , to satisfie such as either are , or may be , by any sinister informations or ill conceipts incensed against vs , or alienated from vs , because we haue not yeelded our selues to the designments & wills of others , in subscribing to this late authoritie .

FIrst we desire all good Catholickes to consider indifferently , what we be , that deferre our subscription to this authoritie ; that we be Priests , & therfore in reason should know , to what we were bound in this case . Againe , that our present vocation , which is to labour euen vnto death in sauing of souls , and therefore not like to be altogether carelesse in matter of so great weight as this authoritie is pretended : of our own good , being so carefull of the good of others .

Further , that for many yeares we haue bestowed our selues in this haruest , and therefore in all likelyhood , should somewhat knowe what thinges were most conuenient for our selues and Country . Then that many of vs beeing in durance , haue for many yeares endured , and as we hope without reprehension , the bitter stormes of restraint and persecution , and therfore in iustice should deserue at the least , an easie & indifferent censure , of such as either cannot , or do not , heare vs answer for our selues . And that also some of our brethren as forward in dislike and disclaiming from such proceedings as we be ( if not more forward ) haue ended their peregrination and troubles , with most glorious martyrdome , giuing a great testimony thereby of their sincere intentions in such matters they tooke in hand , and leauing behinde them also , a good motiue vnto you , to censure and iudge no lesse of the intentions of others , whose cases are the same with theirs , that they deale sincerely and according to conscience . And because you cannot perhaps enter into a iust iudgement of these matters , not seeing into the depth , drift , and circumstances thereof , wee desire no more at your hands , but that you will as yet suspend your iudgements of vs , and not vncharitably condemne vs , vntill you see the conclusion and period of this businesse , which will manifest the truth of all our actions .

Secondly , we desire you to consider our present estate in this businesse how we stand , that we haue and do vowe all obedience vnto Gods Church , and do acknowledge & embrace all authoritie lawfully proceeding from the See Apostolicke , and are most readie to shewe all obedience therevnto , when we shall see and know by iust and ordinary Canonicall notice , what it is that the authoritie of that See exacteth at our hands , which no Christian Catholicke can deny to be sufficient , and as much as can in right and reason be desired at our hands . And if we beleeue not euery Letter , Messenger , or report , onely deliuered vs by such who are parties in this cause , and maister actors in erecting of this vnpleasing and obtruded authoritie , doo not blame vs ; for we haue reason not to beleeue them in all things , much lesse in matters of such weight and so daungerous , whom by experience we haue found difficient in many things , and whom we knowe to intend further matters hereby , then are seene or imagined of many . And yet in this , stand we but vpon our owne right , in not yeelding : because we expect but ordinary authenticall proofe of so extraordinary iurisdiction , neuer denied in matters of farre lesse moment and weight then this .

Thirdly , consider what reason we haue to yeeld vnto this authoritie , not onely gotten by wrong and falce information and instance of the aduerse part onely against our willes , without our knowledge ; contrary to all equitie and iustice ; but also established in such sort by them , that the superiour must needes remaine a punie , and inferiour to them , and by that meane be an instrument to execute what they shall thinke good or fit to be done ; so that our superiour being subiect vnto them , consequently all we must be their apprentizies , and stand at their commaund , which is to peruert all true order in Gods Church . For oftentimes , and by the late generall Councell of Trident , it is decreed , that the secular Cleargie shall haue power ouer the Religious , as to visite them , reforme and correct them , &c. as the Bishop dooth , but seldome or neuer hath the Religious Cleargie any iurisdiction ouer the secular Cleargie , to visite , commaund , correct , or reforme any Bishop in his See , or Pastour in his parish , &c. For why ? they haue vowed obedience , and therefore should not seeke for command . And that these men haue sought for superioritie ouer vs their poore brethren , it is most euident by their seueral enterprises to that end made amongst the prisoners of Wisbiche : & that now also they seeke the same againe , and more generally by this new authoritie of the Arch-priest , is no lesse euident than the former , to them that will see any thing ; else , why should they so earnestly busie themselues in a thing no whit at all concerning them , and much vnpleasing to others , as to prouide and place a Superiour ouer vs , who pertaine not to their charge , and that against our wills , and without our knowledge or consent thereunto , not so much as demaunding our opinions thereof before hande . And when they haue done that , by fauours , perswasions , and increasing of faculties , intyce and allure men to ratifie by subscription , what they cunningly haue wrought vnderhand ; & to such as refuse to subscribe , to threaten Excommunication , suspension , taking away of faculties , and denounce them schismatikes , irregular , &c: and by Letters disgrace them in places where they come , and giue warning of them as of schismatikes , & Excommunicate persons . And more , to shewe their intentions in this matter , what interest they seeke and chalenge in this authoritie , though indeed nothing concerning them , because a distinct societie and bodie from vs ; one of them in a Letter hee wrote vnto F. Garnet . one that would not subscribe , confesseth & acknowledgeth , that whatsoeuer is opposite to the Reuerend Arch-priest , must of force , be consequently , opposite & against them , which thing must of necessitie import an extraordinary tye betweene the authoritie of the Arch-priest & them : either of the subordination of them vnto the Arch-priest , which they disclaime from & deny , or contrariwise of the Archpriest to them , else how must it of necessitie follow , that he which is opposite vnto the Arch-priests authoritie , must of force be opposite to them , as though a man might not resist the Superiour of an order , but hee must needs therby oppose himself against the whole body of an other order ? Furthermore , if their interest were not great in this authoritie , why should they be so vnwilling to procure , or suffer to be procured , some Bull or Breue , for the confirmation therof , that it might be an absolute and independent authoritie ? but that hanging at the will and order of the Lorde Cardinall Protector only , they bearing a great sway with him as we know they doo , may keep the Archpriest in awe , that hee shall dare to doo nothing that may displease them , for feare they should informe against him to the Cardinall , and so thrust him out of office : which they could not doo , were his authoritie confirmed once by any Apostolicall writte : and this onely is the cause they loue not to heare of Bull or Brieue in this authoritie , if otherwise they can choose ; for by this meanes the Arch-priest standing in awe of them , we must stand also at the reuersion of their courtesies in any matter of question or controuersie that may arise amongst vs .

Fourthly consider , that by yeelding vnto this present authoritie erected and directed by them , we shall be drawne within the compasse and perill of all plottes and actions whatsoeuer , in matters of state practised by them , or any of them , or hereafter shall be practised at any time by them , and so not we onely , but also such with whom we shall conuerse , and those which shall concurre with vs in this action , shal be brought into more danger of the extremitie & rigour of the lawes , then otherwise we should , in that the authoritie is alreadie thought by the Counsell to be of purpose erected for the better effecting of such designements ; and so shall we , being brought within the compasse of other mens actions , be hanged for kingdomes and matters of state , and the glory of our cause therby diminished , if not cleane extinguished , to satisfie other mens pleasures & serue their turnes . Besides al this , by the opinions of diuers men of iudgment in the lawes of our Country , this our case may and will be drawne within the compasse of an olde law enacted , aswel by our Catholick Bishops & Prelates , as by the Prince , aboue 300. yeares agoe , vz. the lawe of Premunire ; because it is an externall iurisdiction brought into this realme , against the will & notice of the Prince & Country , which made the late reuerend Bishop of Lincolne , Doctor Watson , to refuse all externall iurisdiction offered him ouer his fellow prisoners , although once he had lawfull Episcopall iurisdiction within the Realme , and was vnlawfully depriued thereof .

Fitfthly consider we beseech you , for the satisfying of your consciences in this most vniust & slaunderous report made against vs of schisme , that there can be no schisme , where there is a resigned will of obedience . We protest and vow all obedience due vnto Gods Church , and all her lawfull authoritie , and therefore can be made no schismatikes possibly . If they vrge against vs that we obey not this authoritie : let them shewe vs that it is a lawfull act of the Church and we obey . If they tell vs of Letters from the Cardinal , we answer them , that no man is bound to beleeue the Cardinall himselfe without Bull or Breue , in matters of so large consequence concerning the Church . What reason then is there that his graces bare Letters , the contents wherof drew on so general & extreme persecution vpon our necks , should be allowed of by vs , as a sufficient proofe of the delegation ? If they say that the Cardinall is a person of singular credit , and not to be distrusted , we answere them , that we impeach not his credit , standing onely vpon our owne right and iustice for our full satisfaction from his holines , of his absolute will & pleasure herein , whose least commaund shall euer binde vs , though with hazard or losse of our liues . To thinke that his holinesse accounteth vs so base and abiect a Cleargy , or so vnworthy members of Gods church , that we deserue not his ordinary notice in matters of so great moment , which is but a common processe in matters of farre lesse weight proceeding from that See , were both in it self ridiculous , & iniurious also to his holines . We could also vrge , that his hol . as yet hath had no information at all from vs , ( our messengers being preuented of audience , & clapped in close prison by Father Persons procurement ) but onely from them , who are but one and the aduerse part in this controuersie , which you know is against all right and equitie ; and in which case , being but a matter of fact , his Holi . for want of due & sufficient information , may proceed with error , to the preiudice of the innocent part , although vnwillingly , and by him not intended : in which case Appellations alwaies are permitted for further information in matters thus in question . Consider now sincerely deare Catholickes , these reasons propounded , and enter not too too rashly into condemnation of vs your spirituall Pastours , who haue alreadie in part , and are stil readie , to spend our bloud for your sakes : but haue patience with vs a little , vntil you see the end of these matters , and the iudgements of his Holinesse herein , which we hope you shall shortly see , and perhappes in the ende , you shall finde that we , whom by sinister informations and suggestions , you are now ready altogether to condemne , haue bene , and are your greatest friends in withstanding suche proceedings , as haply may concern your selues as neare , if not more neare , then vs , although you perceiue not , nor see so much . And in the meane season , as we labour for your good , so pray you for vs , and the common good .

Farewell , from them that thirst your good .

Other reasons to the same purpose by another , vnder the forme of a Letter .

SYr , your priuate occasions which you recommend to my care , I haue so tendered , that euery thing is as forward as any diligence of mine can set it , and in my last haue explaned to the full , the course I tooke , which I trust is conformable to the directions you sent mee , and will I hope haue the successe that both you and I desire . The progresse of the matter you shall vnderstand as occasion serueth . In the end of your Letter , you make mention of a diuision lately growne amongst vs , who should be examples of loue and vnion , and laments the bitter fruites sprung thereof , as pernicious to many a Christian soule . Whereof diuers friends of mine by name are charged to be some cause , for that they were not ready at first to yeeld to the late authoritie of Maister Blackwell , nor as yet can be brought to acknowledge the same . Truly Syr , for that you are my friend , and I throughly acquainted with the origine & processe of the difference , I thought it my part , for your better information , & discharge of my blamelesse friends , briefly to set downe what is done in this matter , and vpon what ground , and then to leaue the censure of it to your prudent consideration .

To build sure , I lay this foundation ; that it is neither pietie nor true obedience , at the first sight to admit any authoritie but such as is orderly procured , and lawfully promulgated , in such sort that subiects may remaine morally sure , that it proceedeth from the true fountaine of superioritie truly enformed , which of it selfe is so manifest that it needeth no proofe ; for the contrary were to open the way to all forgeries and intrusions : and in fine , the ouerthrow of all Canonicall proceedings . Here hence followeth ; that which true prudence and vertue doo dictate : that when any new and extraordinary authoritie is published , they whom it concerneth ; before that by acceptance they approue it , should of dutie looke and examine whether it be accompanied with the conditions aboue mentioned , and so admit or reiect it , as discretion & conscience shall require . To the purpose , in both these conditions of lawfull authoritie , this we speake of is feared to hault , and not without great presumption . And for that to handle both at large would exceed the limits of a Letter ; and a defect in either , doth sufficiently warrant their proceedings , I wil leaue the first , ( for that must needs touch particular persons and their actions : which without further occasion and very iust , I am loath to do ) and shew briefly how the manner of promulgation is in no way sufficient , but rather full of suspition , and giueth iust occasion of distrust .

And first the credit of this promulgation , dooth wholly hang vpon their credits , who taketh authoritie vpon them , who for that they are parties in this action , may iustly be suspected as partiall in their owne cause , which cannot choose but leaue the matter doubtfull in any indifferent mind : or such at least as no man is in conscience bounde to beleeue . Againe , put case they were lawfulll promulgators , yet they bring nothing sufficient to ordaine such authoritie or iurisdiction : to erect such an authoritie , cannot be lesse then an expresse commaundent of his Holinesse : and giuen for this particular purpose . And the same also authentically notified of al which the aduerse part sheweth nothing , for neither do they challenge any such expresse decree from his Holinesse : but onely order giuen to the Cardinal Protector , to take vp our controuersies and iarres here , which is nothing to build such an extraordinary superioritie vpon : or if they did , we are not to giue full credit to the Cardinall his bare word , in a matter of so great weight : seeing that in such businesse he hath heretofore bene founde ouermuch affected to the one part , who haue their finger and hand in these affaires , and for this reason hath bene excepted against as vnfit to iudge in such causes , that so neare concern those parties as these things do , therefore these men demaund but right , if they require an authenticall instrument from his holines to specifie his will herein , and in the meane while determine nothing , but rest ready to imbrace whatsoeuer his holines shal appoint .

Furthermore , there are now 8. or 9. moneths past , sith first the authoritie was diuulged , & sithence the lawfulnes therof , for the reasons aboue mentioned and diuers others was doubted of , as not proceeding from his holines : yet the maintainers notwithstanding the hotte , eager , & earnest course that they take in defence of it , would neuer obtaine the least ticket , or testimony vnder his holinesse hand , or directly from him , in confirmation of it : nor yet to notefie that euer any suche matter was appointed by him ; knowing that such a note woulde haue ended the whole controuersie . And this maketh men in their mindes to question with themselues in this sort : doo not these men by ordinary course , monethly or oftner receiue Letters from Rome ? hath not Cardinall Caietan weekely , yea daily accesse to his holinesse as other Cardinalls haue ? doo they want fauour with him who is wholly theirs ; or his forwardnes to further that himselfe hath either begunne or followed ; and for the credit whereof , hee hath graunted what Letters themselues would request , and as effectuall as themselues could drawe them ? or would his holinesse refuse to testifie that he is the appointer of this authoritie if it had proceeded from him ? No , no , there is cunning some where , which when matters are discouered will quickly appeare . And this is confirmed with another presumption of no lesse moment then the former . For when these friends of mine by vniforme consent of many of their owne brethren , wise and learned , & the auncientest , had resolued peaceably and quietly to send ouer to knowe the Popes pleasure in this matter , they sent to the contrary part , to intreat them to haue so much patience as to expect what answere these messengers did receiue from his holinesse : and if matters proued to be so as they said they were , then without further resistance , euery body was ready to ioyne with them , & to resist whosoeuer should resist them : and so the whole matter might haue bene very briefly and quietly ended between themselues in loue and charitie , without scandall or hurt to any .

But this so reasonable a request could not be heard , but as if they had feared some present daunger now after sending , they posted about more earnestly then euer before , send abroad papers , threaten excommunications , promise fauours , abuse the laitie with infamous reports of their brethren , sending into all quarters of the countrey to begge hands and subscriptions : and where any for what iust cause soeuer did refuse , their meanes open or secret were deuised to supplant and disgrace them , and accusations forged to withdraw their lay friends , and consequently their maintenance from them . Which must needes constraine the wronged to defend and cleare themselues euen with the same lay-friends ; & so the matter grew to a contention , & became publikely knowne among the Laitie , that women & children do tattle and descant euery where , and passe their censure therof . And what followeth of this , euery body may see , and it is too lamentable to speake or write , what hurt our cause hath sustained hereby .

But what good I pray you did these men pretend by so hurtfull a course ? Was the Pope so desirous of thankes that it must be procured with such broyles ? I cannot thinke it . Certes it maketh men iustly to mistrust , that there is a further matter intended then in shewe they pretend : and that these hands & subscriptions by such meanes and so carefully procured to be sent ouer in such haste , must serue to salue and heale somewhat that is not sound there : happily to draw the Pope to consent to that which perchance he neuer heard or allowed of , and so heereby constraine men to put too their hands , saying it is his holinesse will they should doo so , and there perswade the Pope to allow of it , for that it is the Priests voluntary request & sute here . By which meanes no doubt but that they may easily procure the Popes confirmation ; who is and hath bene ready to referre the choosing of the superiour to the Priests of England , as Father Persons himselfe can witnesse : which was the cause that at the beginning when such a matter was proposed to his holinesse : he would not proceed in it without they agreed & consented also , as there is great reason for him . For whose aduise , consent , and allowance , are required to the choosing of a superiour , if not theirs that are to obey and liue vnder the said superiour , when he is chosen ? do not the fellowes in euery house in Oxenford ( and according to the statutes and foundation ) choose and elect their head and Rector ? Do not likewise all the religious companies choose their superiour ? Nay do not the Dist. 63. cap. 12. & Dist. 61. cap. 13. Canons of holy Churh decree that Priestes should haue the election of their Bishop ? and this late authority is for the amplenesse , in punishing more then Bishoplike . Yea the Canons allowe further , that the Cleargy may , and should ( if they finde themselues wronged by hauing a Bishop put on them against their consent and liking ) resist and withstand the intrusion or iniury ; And not only Popes haue decreed that their Cleargy should choose their Bishops , but Emperours haue constituted the same : as appeareth by the ordinary glosse vpon 63. Distinction , cap. 34. All which , maketh our friends refusal much more iustifiable .

And last of all , M. Blackwell himselfe reported , that he had authoritie to excommunicate and command to the Court of Rome ; which now belike , vpon better scanning of his authoritie , hee goes from . Againe shewing his instruction , said , that they were made at Rome , and by the Contents being conuinced that they were made in England , could not deny it ; which sure cannot choose but make men more doubtfull of what he affirmeth in his owne affaires . Now good Sir , these reasons well weighed , cannot but leaue any indifferent minde doubtfull whether this proceede from supreme authoritie or not ; which doubt , cannot more quietly , clearely , and orderly be resolued , then by sending men of conscience and iudgement , to know his holinesse wil , if he haue not decreed and appointed it , to let him vnderstand the abuse , & take order for the reforming of it . If he haue , then to signifie wherein perchance he might be misinformed , that therby he may the better redresse what is amisse ; or if after due information , his wisedome shall think the course taken , to be for the benefite of our cause and countrey , then they carry a mind prostrate both How then could their delay be schisme , they being alike ready to obey . for themselues , and in the name of the rest that ioyned with them in this action , to accept and obey whatsoeuer the Apostolicall sea shall herein decree . This course I know not what reason any man may haue to condemne , as either rash , or vncharitable , much lesse why these men should be termed for their iust proceeding , factious , seditious , schismaticall , or the like . Heereby also you may perceiue , where the roote and true cause of the scandalous reports which daily come to your eares doth remaine ; notwithstanding the libertie of speech , clamours , and vniust exclamations of some who would haue it to be elsewhere . I pray God that these men doo build vpon God almighty , and not vpon their owne wittes and deuises . Heere I say nothing of the iust exceptions that many make against the manner of procuring this authoritie , which are neither fewe , nor yet of small moment , but these wil be deliuered in an other place by them that shall informe his holinesse : and if occasion shall require , and we be pressed therevnto , you shall vnderstand them in an other Letter . In the meane while , take and peruse this with indifferencie , and iudge as reason and conscience shall dictate .

Fareyewell .

Maister Champneyes Letter of the same argument , to a Reuerend friend of his .

VEry Reuerend Syr , As from my very cradle I acknowledge my self many wayes beholding vnto you , for your manifold courtesies , both towards me and other of my dearest friends ; so haue I had alwaies a speciall desire , to yeeld such correspondence in my demeanour , as I might neither giue you , nor any other of my friends , iust occasion to withdraw from me their friendly affection . Neuerthelesse I gather by some speeches that passed not long since , betweene you and a friend of yours and mine , that you haue conceiued a worse opinion of mee , then wittingly I haue deserued , or willingly would deserue . The sinister reports of some , whose endeuours are different from their profession , hauing caused in you , not onely a surmise , but as it seemeth , a strong and firme opinion , that I am disobedient to the See Apostolicke , and enemy to the Fathers of the societie , and a contemner of the late authoritie of our Arch-priest . These be the crymes wherewith I suppose , both my selfe and diuers others are taxed , ( or truer ) most iniuriously slaundered . Being therefore very vnwilling to permit you to remaine in that opinion grounded vpon mere fictions and falsities , I determined to make mine Apologie with you , and to yeeld you reason for all my proceedings in these matters : which being weighed in the equal ballance of your indifferent iudgement , I nothing doubt but it will yeeld you full satisfaction , and giue you some light to see how you haue hitherto beene abused by false informers . I know it to be a difficult thing so to take away and remoue , out of a mature minde , a conceit , which hath long without contradiction possessed it , so to take it away I say , as there remaine no scruple nor doubt thereof . Yet when I doo consider on the one side , your graue and sincere iudgement , voyd ( as I verily thinke ) of all partialitie : and on the other side , the clearenesse and manifest truth of the matter I am to speake of ; I cannot almost doubt but so to satisfie these obiected crimes , as that you will easily see , both my selfe and others , to haue suffered mightie wrong by the raisers thereof .

Let me therefore good sir , craue onely this of you , that you will not measure that which I shall say , according to the preiudiciall opinion which you haue already framed of my person ; for so shall you easily preiudice the equitie of my Plea : but let your iudgement proceed of the thing it selfe , without respect either to my person or any other , and so being voyd of affection , shall it bee more free from errour . If I say any thing that may leane vppon humaine creditte as matters of narration or fact , I desire to bee beleeued no further , then I can manifestly proue . If I vtter matters of opinion or iudgement , as arguments , or reasons for any fact , I desire no more , then that they be measured according to the weight and truth they do containe . This is so indifferent a demaund , that if I should doubt the graunting thereof , I should in mine opinion , offer you no small wrong . I will therefore Sir , deteine you no longer with vnprofitable circuits of wordes , but I will come to the matter : and whatsoeuer I shall say in mine owne behalfe in this affaire , you may vnderstand it of others that bee of the same opinion with mee therein .

The former accusations , to weete , that I am disobedient to the see Apostolicke , an aduersary to the Fathers , and an impugner of our Arch-priests authoritie , are all grounded vpon one and the selfe-same foundation ; which I thinke , I shall easily shewe to be both friuolous and false , and consequently ouerthrowe whatsoeuer is built therevpon : howsoeuer some men do labour to fortifie the same , not by the probabilitie of any reason , or equall debating the matter , but by confidence , or rather impudent infaming of such as labour to defend the truth .

All these accusations therfore are forged vpon this one principle , because forsoothe I did not acknowledge M. Blackwells authoritie vpon the receit onely of Cardinall Caietaines Letters : wherein he affirmed that the Pope had giuen vnto him , authoritie to appoint a gouernment ouer the Seminary Priests in England . For this cause I am saide to resist the Popes authoritie : and because the Iesuites were the procurers of this delegation , therfore am I counted their aduersary , because I did not accept of the thing and meanes to establish it , which they thought good of : And lastly , because I did not acknowledge M. Blackwell for my Ecclesiasticall superiour , vpon the forementioned testimonie , I am said to be an impugner of his authoritie .

Loe Syr , here is the whole ground of all the former accusations , neither doo I thinke they laie any thing else to my charge : If they doo , when I may know it , I will either satisfie their obiections , or acknowledge my fault and errour . In the mean while , I would to God that they who do accuse me of these or whatsoeuer crimes , would stand to the arbitrement of any indifferent Iudge : such a Iudge I meane as hath interest neither in them , nor in me : that his sentence might be voide of all partialitie ; most willingly would I binde my selfe to the iudgement of such a one , and if I were conuicted , I would make such satisfaction , as the same Iudge should prescribe . But I know it is not the guise of mine aduersaries to admit any such tryall ; for vnlesse they may be accusers , informers , and Iudges too , they will stand to no arbitrement . Wherefore to omit this indifferent demaund , because I am in dispaire to obtaine the grant thereof , I will by shewing mine owne innocencie , make plaine what open iniurie and apparant wrong is offered me .

The first accusation wherevpon the other do depend , and therefore that answered , the other must needs also be satisfied , hath so small proofe or probabilitie in it , as I cannot but wonder how any man of indifferent iudgement , vnderstanding the state of the matter , should be induced to conforme his opinion thervnto . For to disobey , is to resist , contemne , or impugne the knowne commaund of a superiour . To be a schismatique , is wilfully to deuide himselfe from the vnitie of the head as head ; or from the members of the bodie , as subordinate to the head of gods Church . These propositions are of themselues euident : but if any doubt of them , let him looke . S. Thomas touching the first . 22. q. 104. ar. 1. & q. 105. per tōtum . Touching the second , 22. q. 39. ar. 1. and Caietane , ibidem . These principles being admitted , I maruell that any scholler , though but meanely learned , should perswade himselfe , that I did either disobey the Popes holinesse , or incurre any schismaticall rebellion , by not admitting M. Blackwells authoritie , vpon the onely testimonie of Cardinall Caietanes Letters . But I perceiue there is no paradox so improbable , that will not finde some approuers . I say therefore , that his holinesse will , was not sufficiently notified by those Letters , to make the refusall of the ordinances conteined therein , either disobedience or schisme , which I prooue by manifold examples . Put the case therefore , that some one of our Nobilitie here in England , should addresse his Letters into Ireland , or some place of England furthest distant from the Princes abode , in which Letters he should signifie , that he had receiued authoritie from her Maiestie , to ordaine and establish in that Country , what gouernment he thinketh best , and together , specifieth such a gouernment , as was neuer heard of in that Countrey , or any other , and this without any other testimony or proofe of his authority , besides his own Letters .

This case being thus put most like vnto ours ( sauing onely that some circumstances are omitted for breuities sake , that make more for our aduantage ) I would demaund of these that accuse me and my bretheren of schisme , what these subiects ought to doo in this case . If they say that they ought to obey the Noble mans writ , and to admit such a Magistrate as hee dooth appoint them , how discommodious soeuer it seemeth to their Common wealth , and how disagreeing soeuer it bee from the forme of gouernment of their knowne Prince : they will binde them to so many and imminent inconueniences , that in truth I thinke they wil not auouch such an improbability . For first this would be to enforce them to incurre euident daunger of rebellion towards their knowne Prince , by admitting an vsurper : for it may be , notwithstanding his owne word , that he hath no such authoritie : yea though the Prince should truly giue vnto him that authority , yet the subiects hauing no other notice of it but only his own Letters and testimony , they should be so farre from rebelling against their Prince by deferring to admit his ordinances , till they had more perfect intelligence of theyr Princes will ; that they should be accounted both prudent and loyall for so dooing : and for the contrary , they should worthily be condemned of foolish leuitie , if not of open conspiracie .

For if they should bee called to account , and bee demaunded by whose authoritie or commaundement they changed their gouernment , wil any man thinke it shoulde bee a sufficient warrant , to say by such a Lords Letters , specifying no other testimony of his authoritie , but his owne ? I cannot thinke that any woulde beleeue that aunswere sufficient to excuse them , at least from suspition of disloyaltie , seeing in this case , they should be no more excuseable , though he had true authoritie , then if he had none at all .

An other inconuenience which these subiects should infallibly run into is , that hereby they should open the way to euery ambitious or seditious person to chalenge the same priuiledge , to haue his owne testimony admitted , whensoeuer he should say , hee hath authoritie from the Prince , to ordaine what he list . Which who seeth not what a heape of inconueniences it bringeth with it ; and these not following chance or accident ; but out of the very nature of the thing it selfe , supposing the corruption of humaine frailtie , which no man can take away : which mischiefs also do necessarily follow vpon the admission of such a pretended authoritie for the time onely , vntil better certainty may be procured , either for the establishing or reiecting of the same .

But if they say , that these subiects ought to reiect this obtruded and vncertaine authoritie , as a thing voyd of all lawful and customary proceeding in such affaires , & not without great probability of fraud and euident suspition of surreption , they shal speak more conformably to reason , common sence , & practice , both in ciuill and ecclesiasticall gouernment . But if they will auoid both these extreames ( wherof the latter without all comparison is more secure , and doubtlesse of it selfe most lawfull ) and say that these subiects ought at least not absolutely to deny the admitting of his authoritie , but to delaie till more perfit notice be giuen . If , I say , they affirme this , we will yeeld it vnto them ; yea , and that the saide subiects , which is much more , are bound of their owne cost and labours , to seeke the further knowledge of their Princes will : and then I demaund of them what of all this , I & my brethren haue offended , whereby we shuld deserue the note of schismatiques , rebels , seditious persons , or the like Epithetons , which they most prodigally bestow vpon vs . But if they can neither proue nor yet shew any disparitie in the case , which of it selfe seemeth to be too too cleare , I cannot tell how they will auoide the fowle note of slaunderers and detractours , who haue by word and writing , in England , Flaunders , Italy ; & where else they come , accused vs of schisme , rebellion , sedition , and the like .

Two disparities , peraduenture , they will alledge in the case : First , that I put the case in ciuill gouernment , whereas it ought to be in Ecclesiasticall . The second , that I put the case in one that is not knowne to haue any ordinary authoritie in these affaires , whereas it is contrary in our case , the Cardinall being Protector of our Nation . But both these are verie seely shifts , not worthie of any answere . For first the inconueniences that do follow in the case before proposed , doo follow by so much more euidently in Ecclesiasticall gouernment , by howe much more large the precincts of the Popes iurisdiction are , and further from the place of his abode , them the gouernment of any one temporal Prince , and by how much lesse sensible ordinarily , and more spirituall Ecclesiasticall punishment is , then is the temporall , for such vsurpers . The second is as friuolous ; for albeit Cardinall Caietaine was our Protectour , and also Chamberlaine of the Church of Rome , yet is it euident , that by neither of these offices , hee had any ordinary Ecclesiasticall iurisdiction ouer our Cleargie , especially to erect any new gouernment : and therefore if hee had any authoritie in this matter , it must needs be deligate and extraordinary : and consequently , was as well to notifie vnto vs the same , by some sufficient testimonie besides his owne word , as the Chauncellour of England is to shewe his warrant , if he intend to take vpon him the office of the high Martiall , or any other not perteining to the Chauncellourship .

But they wil further obiect , that to deny or doubt of that which the Cardinall affirmeth , is to call his credit into question , whose authoritie ought to be sufficient testimonie for whatsoeuer hee saith : this is their maine obiection , and as it were their Achilles , whereby they would prooue vs all scismatiques . But first this argument concludeth not . For suppose that we did offend in not admitting nor beleeuing his testimony for the instituting of this new authoritie , yet it followeth not that we should therfore be schismatiques , but at the most , that we sinned against humaine credit , which cannot be schisme , as by it selfe is verie euident . But that we neither offend in this manner , it shall appeare by the two last answeres to this obiection ; and that we committed not any act of disobedience , by denying to obey the Cardinalls ordinances , it is verie cleare : for it is a farre different thing for any one to deny obedience to him whom he knoweth or beleeueth to be his superiour , and to deny it to him whom he probably thinketh is not his superiour , especially if he do it therefore onely , because he thinketh him not to bee his superiour ; of which two , onely the first is properly disobedience : the second is neither disobedience nor any other sin , if it proceed of an opinion as probable , or more probable then the contrary , much lesse when it proceedeth of certaine truth as in our case .

Secondly I say , that they must also answere this obiection , if they admit the case put before : for if we were bounde to obey Cardinall Caietaines ordinances vpon his owne Letters onely , then should the subiects before mentioned , be bound to do the same in that case , and so should follow all the inconueniences mentioned .

Thirdly I say , that it is not any offence to denie that vnto any one , that is not due vnto him ; but it cannot be due vnto any man thogh in neuer so great honour , to haue his owne testimony admitted for the acknowledging of that authoritie which he hath not of himselfe but from an other , for otherwise euery one in honour might chalenge the same , and so bring confusion in all gouernments .

Fourthly I say , that the authoritie whereby an act of publicke office is practised in any Common-wealth , either ciuil or Ecclesiasticall , requireth a formall or iuridicall proofe , to make it authenticall . Which kind of proofe or testimonie , is not required in any other humaine action ; for we see that the testimonie of an ordinarie person may be sufficient for the Iudge , with helpe of other strong coniectures , to pronounce a partie guiltie or vnguiltie : and yet the Iudge himselfe must shewe other warrant for his authoritie then his owne word , or else his sentence cannot binde , thorow default of the vncertaintie of his iurisdiction , though he be otherwise of neuer so great honour : neither is this any disparagement to his credit , the nature and state of the thing requiring it . The like is in all other actions of publique authoritie , as it is manifest by all experience . For albeit , to conuince a man of treason or fellonie , is a greater matter in it selfe , then it is for one to prooue that hee hath the authoritie of a Iudge , or of any other publicke officer , yet the testimonie of priuate persons , though otherwise of small estimation , serueth for that , and the Princes seale onely sufficeth for the other . Which is not to be imputed to the credit of the parties testifying , but to the condition of the thing testified ; for which cause it is verie absurd , to say that the testimonie of any man though of neuer so great honour , is sufficient in his owne cause to make proofe of the authoritie he claimeth , without concurrance of any other testimonie ; for it is but his owne word , albeit his word would be abundantly sufficient for the proofe of any other humaine matter , as one witnesse . For seeing that no man of himselfe , I meane of his own person , hath anie iurisdiction ouer an other : if anie man chalenge it , he must either shewe how he hath it , or else the other is not bound to beleeue him . As for example , Peter is no more bound to beleeue , that Iohn is his superiour , then Iohn is to beleeue , that Peter is his ; vnlesse the one can shew it by some sufficient proofe besides his owne testimonie , for in that they are not much different , although they differ in wealth or honour : which things authoritie , dooth not consequently follow . And to conclude this point , I say , if the Cardinall had giuen his word or Letters in testimonie of anie truth , not involuing the vse of authoritie , his testimonie would haue bene admitted without all exception ; wherby it appeareth euidently , that it was not want of due credit that hindred the admitting of his testimonie in our businesse , but because the nature of the thing it self required other proofe : neither can our aduersaries be ignorant of this , but that they are disposed to contend without matter : for those that will not denie the Sunne to be vp at noone day , cannot denie or doubt of this .

And thus reuerend Sir , you see , that conteining our speech within the compasse that the verie state and condition of the thing requireth , how farre affection hath ledde them beyond all sence & reason , that haue condemned their bretheren of horrible schisme , where there is not so much , as any litle shew or probabilitie thereof ; though we do consider the matter in all rigour , abstracting from all circumstances , which being verie many and euident for our aduantage , make the thing more plaine and cleare . As first , that this authoritie did beare euident suspition ( I might say euident proofe ) of manifest surreption . Secondly , it was procured contrary to the Canons Dist. 63. s● plebibus . of holy Church , which prescribe that Priests should haue the election of their Arch-priest . Thirdly , it is against the very light of naturall reason , that a man who is of a distinct gouernment or body , should bee the chiefe : yea , the onely elector and appoynter of the head and gouernour of an other body without the consent thereof . As for a Benedictine Monke , to elect or appoint ( for example ) the head and generall of the Fathers of the societie , and to thrust him vpon them against their wills and consents . Who euer heard of such an absurditie ? Which in our case is by so much more apparant , by how many moe bad circumstances concurre . Fourthly , the thing it selfe carrieth euident remonstrance of an intollerable burden without any commoditie at all , and not without manifest suspition of a plaine plot or stratageme , to confound and take away all Ecclesiasticall Hierarchie and auncient approoued gouernment in our Church .

These reasons , wherevnto I might adde many moe , if they be not so apparant to you , being thus wrapped vp as it were in a bundle , I shall if you giue me occasion vnfold them , and make them as cleare as the noone-day . Which if they be but indifferently pondered , will not onely cleare vs from all schisme and sinne , but also conuince our accusers of manifest badde dealing : who without all shewe of reason or iust cause , began the quarell , to the open scandall of the world ; and yet do labour tooth and nayle to cast the slaunder and ignomie thereof vppon such as were onely defendants , and endeuoured to deliuer themselues from manifest iniury .

Notwithstanding these reasons , and many moe which we had , not onely to deferre , but also vtterly to reiect this disorderly procured gouernment : you shall now heare how peaceably and orderly we proceeded in the matter ; and contrariwise , how turbulently , and without all shewe of equitie , our aduersaries dealt with vs . Which because it requireth onely a narration of these things that haue actually passed betweene vs ; I shall not need to alleadge any reason by way of argument to conuince that which I shall say , but onely if any thing be denied , to call the world for a witnesse of the truth . Neuerthelesse I do not intend to rippe vp the matter from the beginning , for so I should weary you with too long a speech : but omitting the maner of proceeding vsed in the first procuring of this late ordeined gouernment , which was very exorbitant , and altogether dissonant to reason , and the accustomed practise of Gods Church in such affaires . I will begin with the first receiuing of Cardinall Caietaines Letters , whereby we had first notice of this authoritie , and so chiefly relate some chiefe occurrents that haue actually happened among vs since that time , whereby you shall easily see , whether we haue offered or suffered wrong .

Vpon the first receit therefore of the Protectors Letters , after due consideration of the tenour thereof , because they conteined an ordinance vnheard of before in the Church of God , and that without any authoritie from his holinesse , contrary to the continuall custome and practise of that See . Wherevpon grew many doubts whether that proceeded from his holinesse commaund or no ; but that which most of all moued , was because there appeared no probabilitie that it proceeded from him truly informed of the state and condition of our Countrey and Cleargy ; neither the thing it selfe , nor the maner of procuring it , yeelding any probabilitie of such information : wherevpon we thought it altogether repugnant to Ecclesiasticall discipline and gouernment , to admit any such ordinances intangled with so many doubts . For which cause , we determined before we did admit this institution , to procure more certaine knowledge and notice of his holinesse his will and pleasure in this matter , with most firme and constant resolution and purpose , to admit whatsoeuer we should certainely knowe to be his will , the state of our Countrey first vnderstood . For this cause we sent to Rome two reuerend Priests , earnestly requesting M. Blackwell and the Fathers , the procurers of this authoritie , to be quiet in the meane while vntill the returne of our messengers , or some other sufficient certitude came from Rome , that hee was constituted our superiour : without full notice whereof , it was not possible to take away all doubts & scruples , which would be the occasions of great contentions and strifes . But they vtterly refused to admit the offer , saying , that it was disobedience and rebellion to the See Apostolicke , to seeke any further certificate of the matter . Because ( as the thing it selfe beareth For this case ●●e Bullam ●●aenae Excom. ●0 . & 11. & Nauar. ●●idem . euident shewe ) they suspected their owne inordinate proceedings , and thought that if his holinesse should be truly informed , he would reuerse this order , and so frustrate all their deuised plot . For which cause they proclaimed vs here in England Schismatickes at the least , & preuented with their Letters , the comming of the two Priests to Rome : where at their arriuall , they were taken by father Parsons the Architect of all these troubles , spoiled of their Letters and writings , cast into close prison , seperate one from the other , and all to hinder their accesse to his holinesse . And after a whole winters imprisonment , they were sent from Rome , seperate likewise , and confined into two seueral places , Fraunce and Loraine , without any allowance for their maintenance , where they should remaine in banishment , to the end they might not returning into England , report how religiously Father Parsons had entertained them . Who could haue shewed more vnequall dealing in any proceeding ? At last , Father Parsons hauing stopped all other informations from the Popes holinesse but his owne , procured his holinesse Breue for the confirmation of this authoritie ; which being receiued , euery one admitted M. Blackwell for his superiour , and obeyed . Who then is so voyd of reason , yea of commonsence , as to say that we are Schismatikes , rebells , or disobedient to the See Apostolick ? who least we should do any thing against the ordinances thereof , made all possible meanes to knowe the will and disposition of his holinesse , with full purpose and protestation after due knowledge ; to admit , imbrace , obey , & obserue it , yea and defacto , did imbrace it ? And who would not rather condemne them of worse then bad dealing , who left no meanes vntried to hinder vs from the due knowledge of his will ? Who vnlesse they intended to crosse the accustomed proceedings of Gods Church approued by all antiquitie , and established by all holie authoritie of the Pastors and gouernours of the same , would neuer haue condemned vs of schisme & rebellion against Gods Church , for appealing to the See Apostolick , & seeking to know the will of the Pastors therof in a matter of such moment , and so euidently belonging to his authoritie to determine . But this improbable and senselesse Paradoxe , they haue raised to cloake their manifold iniuries and wrongs practised against vs their innocent brethren , which if euer it be laid open to the view of the world , as peraduenture it may be , I thinke they will not passe without great admiration .

Good Sir , heere I might make an ende , and thinke this sufficient to discouer the falsitie of such grounds , as haue bene and are still with some , the foundations of such slaunderous reports and opinions of detestable schisme vniustly raised , and vnconscionably mainteined against mee and others of my bretheren : and that it might also suffice for our defence against such vntrue & vnchristian detractions , yet seeing I haue begunne , I will goe a litle further in declaring our innocency in this matter .

Our Arch-priests authoritie being now of euery one admitted vpon the receit of his holinesse Breue , and thereby all argument or shewe of schisme , disobedience , or rebellion , quite taken away ( howsoeuer before matter was fained to vpholde so vncredible a fable ) euery one of vs for peace and concords sake , readie to remit the iniuries done vnto vs by publike slaunder of schisme , published to the world in written pamphlets : and our Arch-priest writing his Letters , willing , and by his authoritie commaunding , that no more speech should be made of matters past , but that euery one should compose himselfe to peace and vnitie with his brethren ; the Fathers ( who are not subiect to his authoritie , albeit they were the procurers thereof , for they loue to impose great burdens vpon other mens shoulders , which they themselues will not touch with one finger ) perceiuing belike , that by this peaceable composition , there was like to ensue a continuall agreement amongst the secular Priests , which they feared would be the baine of all their designements , they quickly deuised a way to breake this vnitie . For it is a principle with those that seek dominion , to keep diuision alwaies among such as they intend to bring vnder their regiment . To this purpose they renewed , as it should seeme , the slaunder of schisme , in more intollerable manner then before : for now they said , that we were not only schismatikes , but that whosoeuer should dogmatizando , say the contrary , should incurre the censures of holy church . And M. Blackwell himselfe , notwithstanding his former prohibition ( by their suggestion , as it is more then probable ) writ , that they had receiued a resolution from the mother Citie , that we were schismatikes , and that in his opinion , we were not to be admitted to the Sacraments , without satisfaction done for the same . Will any man now say , that these men desire and seeke the peace & tranquillitie of our afflicted Chuch ? Can any one bee so shamelesse as to avowe it ? No , no. When therefore we perceiued our late composed peace , contrary to all expectation to be thus quickly broken , and that our good names began to bleed afresh , the old gaules beeing not yet firmly cured : we requested of our Arch-priest that we might haue a parley or conference vpon the matters in controuersie , with these conditions .

First , that M. Garnet , M. Lister , and whom , and how many soeuer of the societie they should thinke good to choose vnto them , to be reasoners , debators , or disputers , on the one side , and of the other , three such Priests of our company , as wee should nominate .

Secondly , that the groundes , reasons , arguments , answeres , and reioynders , on both sides , after full discussion & agreement , should be set downe in writing .

Thirdly , that the Vmperes or Arbitrators , to heare or determine of the weight , truth , and coherence of all that should be said or alledged by either side , should be 2. or 3. of the seniour Assistants , and M. Doleman , and that it should be in the choise of our Arch-priest , to admit such of the Laitie to be hearers of the dispute , as to his wisedome for the qualitie of the conference , should seeme meete .

Fourthly , that each of the Arbitrators , should faithfully promise in the word of a Priest , to proceed to the giuing of sentence vpon the proofe or disproofe of either side , according to the dictamen of their conscience , and inward perswasion , without delay , colour , mittigation , or partialitie .

Fiftly , that if the said Arbitrators , should iudge that our case was schisme , and our selues schismatikes , then we most humbly should aske pardon on our knees of our Arch-priest and the societie , for hitherto defending the contrary against the veritie of their affirmances . If of the other side , they should censure or deeme that we were no schismatikes ; then the societie , especially the penner and the approuers of the Pamphlet of schisme , should acknowledge their errour , reuerse the tract , and make vs some ratable satisfaction to the heape of iniuries & infamies sustained .

Sixtly , that it should be lawfull without offence or prohibition , for either side after sentence giuen and fulfilling of the premisses , to seeke , if it should so please , a resolution in the difference , from the Vniuersities beyond the seas , vpon shewe & euidence of the said dispute , grounds , reasons , proofes , & arguments subscribed , with the hands of the Vmperes & disputants of both sides , to the end it might manifestly appeare to be the same , and no place left to the other side to suspect any indirect dealing , either by adding , changing , or subtracting ought , too or from the originall ; and that none of the foresaid Arbitrators or disputants , refuse or deferre to put too his name , being requested therevnto .

Could you , good sir , deuise more equall conditions then these ? Or if these men did not intend to maintaine continuall brawles and strifes , would they not haue admitted them ? there being no more indifferent meanes to end all controuersies . Notwithstanding , this so reasonable and indifferent an offer ; they tearmed it a tumultuous or rebellious demand , and commaunded that none vnder paine of suspension , should either by word or writing , defend himselfe from being a schismaticke , wherby we were debarred from defending our own good name vniustly taken away .

Finding therfore our selues in these miseries , that we must either loose our good names , or by aduenturing to defend them , incurre some high displeasure , we set downe the state of the controuersie , and sent it to the Doctours of the famous Vniuersitie of Paris , requesting their opinion and censure therevpon . For although wee knew our selues altogether cleare from all contagion of schisme , yet because we would not be our owne Iudges , least peraduenture wee might bee suspected of partialitie in our owne cause , we sent to haue their opinions , who are free from suspition of all partialitie . The Doctors returned vs answere as followeth .

Anno Domini , Millesimo sexcentessimo , die 3. Maij , propositum fuit facultati Theologiae Parisiensi , quod literis cuiusdam Illmi : Cardinalis , quidam superior Ecclesiasticus in regno quodam constitutus est , cum titulo & dignitate Archipresbyteri , vt haberet authoritatem & iurisdictionem super omnes alios Presbyteros in eodem regno commorantes . Cardinalis etiam in illis suis literis declarauit , se id fecisse iuxta voluntatem & beneplacitum summi Pontificis .

Multi autem ex illis Presbiteris recusarunt subsignare authoritati eiusdem Archipresbyteri priusquam ipse obtinuisset Literas Apostolicas confirmationis suae tenorem continentes , tum quia nouum omnino erat , & in Ecclesia Catholica hactenus inauditum , illud genus regiminis , vt Archipresbyter vniuerso regno preesset , & talem iurisdictionem haberet in singulos eius regni sacerdotes , tum etiam quia ex quibusdam verbis illarum literarum Illmi : Cardinalis , visi sunt sibi videre , talem Archipresbyterum & authoritatem eius , ex falsa informatione , a summo Pontifice fuisse concessam : tum denique quia in electione illius Archipresbyteri , & consiliariorum eius , magnam aduerterunt extitisse personarum acceptionem . Propter quas & alias non nullas rationes , Sacerdotes illi miserunt ad summum Pontificem nuncios , qui has suas difficultates ei apperirent , vnaque significarent se paratissimos esse in toto hoc negotio , alijsque omnibus , suae sanctitati semper obedire .

Archipresbyter vero , & qui ab eius parte stant , alios sacerdotes schismatis accusant , quod literis Cardinalis , quas etiam ex summi Pontificis voluntate exaratas dicit , parere detrectauerint .

Questio igitur est , an illi Sacerdotes sint schismatici ? Et si non sint , an grauiter saltem peccauerint ?

Viri principes facultatis Theologiae Parisiensis , selecti a tota facultate , congregati in domo maioris Apparitoris sui , anno & die suprascripto , re maturè considerata ; ita censuerunt .

Primo , illos Sacerdotes quidistulerūt obedire ob dictas causas ; non esse schismaticos .

Secundo censuerunt illos , eo facto in se spectato , non peccasse prorsus .

De mandato dominorum Decani , & Magistrorum nostrorum , deputatorum & selectorum sacratissime facultatis Theologiae Parisiensis . DELACOVRT .

The English .

In the yeare of our Lord , 1600. vpon the third day of May , it was proposed to the facultie of the Diuines of the Vniuersitie of Paris , that by the Letters of a most Illustrious Cardinall , an Ecclesiasticall Superiour was constituted in a certaine Kingdome , with the tytle and dignitie of an Arch-priest , to haue authoritie and iurisdiction ouer all other Priests residing in that Kingdome . This Cardinall did also declare in those his Letters , that he did it according to the will and good liking of the Pope . Notwithstanding many of these Priests refused to subscribe to the authoritie of the said Arch-priest , before he had obtained Letters from the See Apostolicke conteining the tenour of his confirmation , as well because that kind of gouernment was altogether new in Gods Church , and hetherto neuer heard of , that an Arch-Priest should haue charge of a whole kingdome , and such iurisdiction ouer euery Priest in that Realme : then also for that it seemed to them by certain words of the Cardinalls Letters , that the Arch-priest and his authoritie was graunted by false information ; then lastly because they noted great partialitie in the choise of the Arch-priest and of his counsellors . Vpon which and some other reasons , these Priests sent Messengers to the Pope , for laying open vnto him these their difficulties , and therewithall to signifie their greatest readinesse , as in this matter , so euermore in all other , to obey his holinesse .

The Arch-priest and those who are of his side , accuse the other Priests of schisme , in that they deferred to obey the Cardinalls Letters , which moreouer he said were written according to his holinesse minde and pleasure .

The question then is , whether these Priests be Schismatickes , and if not , whether they did commit at the least some grieuous sinne ?

The head and chiefe men of the facultie of diuinitie in Paris , chosen out of the whole company , assembled together in the house of the Senior Beedle , in the yeare and day aboue written , after full and maturest consideration had of the matter , gaue this censure .

First , that those Priests who vpon the aboue named causes deferred to obey , were no schismatickes .

Secondly , that they committed no sinne at all in that fact in it selfe considered .

By commaundement of our Deane and Maisters , deputed and selected by the whole facultie of Diuinitie in Paris . DELACOVRT .

This we shewed to our Arch-priest , who , that he might leaue no way vnattempted to iniurie vs , prohibited all Priests vnder paine of suspension from the Altar , and losse of all their faculties , and Laie-men , vnder paine of being interdicted ipsefacto , to defend directly , or indirectly , the censure & opinion of the Doctors of Paris , whether it were giuen by true information or otherwise : which was not onely an intollerable iniurie vnto vs , prohibiting against the law of nature from defending our good names , but also an absurd indignitie against so famous an Vniuersitie . I doo not knowe how any man could haue vsed more vnequall dealing . If our matter had bene sufficiently heard , and we condemned of a competent Iudge , these proceedings might haue some shewe of Iustice : but to proceede in this sort with innocent men , for moderately defending their good names vniustly taken from them , they being altogether vnheard in the matter wherof they are accused : I think the like was neuer heard of amongst Christians , and much lesse among Priests and Religious men .

By these and the like violent dealings , both in these matters and others , wherof , beside my selfe , diuers haue tasted abundantly ; they haue giuen too too pregnant proofes of their further designements , if so that they can effect their purpose . For if notwithstanding the manifold troubles of these times , they haue attempted & put in practise such violent couries , trusting to their owne power , and not to any equille : what will they not attempt , or what may we not expect , if future times and other opportunities be answerable to their desires ? Which desires , if they be to Gods greater glory , & more to the good of his Church , with my whole heart I wish they may take effect , & that they may consummate what they haue begunne . But verily their proceedings haue hitherto bene farre different , not onely from theirs who haue planted and watered the vineyard of Gods Church from the beginning , but also from theirs to whom before all other men , we ought most to attribute that hope we haue of the recouery of our poore Country to the Catholicke faith ; namely Cardinall Allane , of most holie and happie memorie , whose life if it had pleased God to haue lent vs till this day , we should haue had , if not in some sort , a flourishing Church , yet a Church at least without such enormous dissention , strife , and debate ; a Church full of true simplicitie , religious zeale , and fraternall charitie ; for such a one ( God concurring to his holy endeuours ) hee planted , and vntill his dying day , kept & conserued . Notwithstanding those who do now so greeuously perturbe our peace , did attempt the same euen in his dayes , but their endeuours being preuented by his prudence , tooke small effect so long as he liued . But alas , since his too timely death and departure , what miserie hath found vs , and what trouble hath fallen vpon vs ? God pardon the causers thereof , and grant vs perfect peace and brotherly charitie : Vt omnes cognoscant quòd discipuli Christi simus . That all men may know vs to be the disciples of Christ .

Thus good Syr , haue I laid downe vnto you the whole grounds of the crimes , wherof both my selfe and diuers others of our brethren are accused . I rereferre the matter to your iudgement , to discerne whether we be guiltie of them or no. If you doubt of the truth of my relation , I desire none other triall then the testimonie of mine accusers ; who if they denie any one word that I haue vttered by way of narration , I can easily procure such proofe thereof , as they shall not denie , vnlesse they will denie themselues . If my deductions , arguments , or suppositions , vsed in yeelding reason for our not admitting M. Blackwells authoritie vpon the onely receit of Cardinall Caietaines Letters , and that for so doing , we incurred no note either of schisme , or disobedience to his holinesse ; if they I say need any proofe , I will vndertake to make them most euident .

Wherefore according to these grounds , I humbly beseech you to passe your opinion , and yeeld your iudgement of our cause . And if the grounds prooue true , your iudgement conformable therevnto , may remaine firme : but if they prooue otherwise , your iudgement notwithstanding shall not be faultie ; for he that iudgeth according to his euidence , is not culpable of any errour . This good Sir , I request , because I desire to know your opinion of our cause , which if you giue according to these grounds , I shal easily vnderstand whether you wil condemne or cleare mee & my brethren of the crimes obiected ; for I am sure I haue not erred in declaring the state of the matter .

If this which I haue said be not sufficient for your full satisfaction ; I hope it wil suffice at least to suspend your iudgement of vs , vntill further triall be had of our cause ; which being had in any indifferent manner , and if we being conuicted , do not acknowledge our fault , and make competent satisfaction , then do not spare to account of vs as Heathens & Publicans . But our aduersaries purpose not to put the matter to any indifferent tryall , or to ende it by any equall meanes , but to decide it by strong hand , might , and violence ; by perpetuall oppressing vs with infamous slaunders of schisme , faction , and the like ; thereby to depriue , if it can be , our brethren abroad , of all conuenient entertainment , and to debarre vs in prison of necessary reliefe , to the ende that necessitie may compell vs to yeeld to their desires : the inequalitie of which proceedings , I beseech you with indifferency to consider . Sometime it is seen , that a partie wilfully bent to contend , is iustly compelled to admit an equall compremise , and to stand to the arbitrement of an indifferent Iudge : but it was neuer seene where iustice and conscience ruled ; and muche lesse amongst such as ought to be the rule of other mens consciences , that the partie willing to stand to anie indifferent tryall , should bee compelled by violence , to agree vnto the desire of his aduersary , how iust or vniust soeuer it be , and that without any further sentence , but onely because his aduersary must haue his will .

Good Sir , we are heere in this place , diuers in great want , in so much , that besides our debts to the keeper , we haue not to defend vs from the iniury of the winter weather : whereof that you may haue some special taste , I doo you to vnderstand , that since Trinitie Terme , wee haue receiued no more from London , from whence the chiefest part of our reliefe commeth , then will suffice for three weekes charges with him that can husband his matters best . And this shal be sufficient to insinuate vnto you our wants , hoping that as opportunitie serueth , you will concurre to the relieuing thereof ; confidently hoping withal , that God for whose cause we suffer , not onely of the common aduersary , but also of those who ought to be our friends , wil giue vs patience whatsoeuer crosses befal vs , to beare them to the end . For mine owne part , they may by their violent proceedings , make me yeeld my breath and life , which by Gods grace , I shall if need require , willingly sacrifice for the defence of iustice , equitie , and mine owne innocencie : but my consent to these vniust dealings , by Gods assistance , they shall neuer extort out of me .

If any one to whom you shall thinke good to impart this ( as I am not against the imparting it to any , so that you keepe the originall your selfe ) shall vndertake to improue me of any vntruth : I will either satisfie his obiections euen to your own iudgement , or else I will acknowledge mine errour .

Take this , good Sir , for a taste of our internall and domesticall troubles , wherewith I imagine you are not much acquainted , and therefore are you worse affected to our cause : and as you shall giue me hereafter occasion , you shall vnderstand more ; for this is but a small thing in respect of that which this matter affordeth . But I feare I haue bene too tedious in this so disgustfull a discourse ; but let , I pray you , the hard tearmes my good name is brought into , plead my pardon for my tediousnesse , and the equitie of my Plea , procure me your fauour , and so in all humble sort I take my leaue .

Yours euer in all true Christian affection , Anthony Champney .

SIr , if you do not consider diligently the haynous Post scriptum . enormitie of schisme imposed vpon me , you will peraduenture condemne me of too much precisenesse , if not of contention , for labouring to defend my selfe from the note thereof ; and will thinke that I ought rather to suffer some small infamie , then by opposing my selfe so earnestly , to repell the same , to procure a further breach between mine accusers and my selfe , to both our harmes , and to the offence of others . But if you consider first , to admit the infamy of this slaunder , ( though it were of it selfe but small ) were in some sort to giue occasion to mine accusers , to heape vpon my head greater wrongs hereafter , ( for he that will offer wrong in one thing , will do the like in an other if occasion serue ) you shall finde it to be neither wisedome nor pietie , to giue place to such beginnings . Secondly , the condition of mine estate requiring a most entire fame , I should both wrong my selfe , and slaunder my function , if I should admit any blemish or blotte therein , which I may by mine owne endeuour wipe away : and therefore to purchase peace at such a price , I hold it not lawfull : for Non est faciendum malum vt eremat bonum . Euill is not to be done that good may ensue . And as S. Augustine saith : Qui famam suam negligit , crudelis est . Hee that neglecteth his good name is cruell . But if thirdly you consider the intrinsical enormitie of this crime , you will easily excuse mine endeuour in clearing my self therof , from all note of contention . For amongst all other sinnes against our neighbour , schisme is the greatest : and the pennalties which the Church hath alwaies inflicted on such as haue bene guiltie therof , proue the same ; to weet , excommunication and seperation from all vse of Sacraments , as appeareth by diuers auncient Canons , & also in Bulla caenae : which being graunted , necessarily followeth heynous sacriledge , committed by the ministration of Sacraments , and the frustrating of all confessions made to all such as they do terme schismatikes . For my fuller acquittance of which schisme , in one word I say , that if I be a schismaticke , Clemens the eight is a schismaticke ; for his wil is my wil , both in this and all other things pertaining to Ecclesiasticall gouernment , and for mine obedience and subiection to him in the same , as hetherto by Gods grace I haue not , so God assisting me hereafter , I will not refuse to yeeld my life , if at any time it be exacted .

Peraduenture Sir you will maruell , how I dare attempt to say thus much in mine own and my bretherens defence , our Arch-priest hauing vnder paine of suspension , commanded the contrary . But you may vnderstand , that this commandement cannot bee of force ( and therefore not to be respected ) for diuers causes . And chiefly , for that the law of nature graunteth absolute freedome to euery one to defend himselfe and his goods either of fame or fortune , and to labour by lawfull meanes , to recouer them being vniustly taken from him . For which cause it is an intollerable errour , annullating any iuridicall sentence to forbid a man to defend himselfe . Siluester verb. Excom. 2. num. 1. & 16. Our Arch-priests prohibitory censures therefore in this case , are euen by the law of nature made void . And if he say that we haue suffred no wrong by the losse of our good names , but that we haue iustly deserued the infamy of schisme , it wil not serue his turn , for he being in this case , a party subiect to triall , and therfore no Iudge to discerne whether we haue suffered wrong or no , his sentence or opinion herein can be of no more force , then his ought to be , who hauing taken away an other mans goods , saith that he hath not wronged him , and therfore forbiddeth him to prosecute the case against him , vnder paine of a greater displeasure : for this is iust our case . I might say much more in this matter , but I haue bin too long already , and I hope this will suffice for this point : and so once againe I take my leaue .

THE COPIE OF A LETTER written by F. Rob. Parsons the Iesuite , 9. Octob . 1599. to M. D. Bish: and M. Ch. two banished and configned Priests , the one in Fraunce , the other in Lorraine , by the suggestions of F. Parsons , for presuming to goe to Rome in the affaires of the Catholicke Church . Paris . To my very louing friend M. W. Bish , Priest : giue these .

¶ MAister Bish , it being now diuers moneths since you departed from hence , and no one Letter appearing yet from you : or from your friend M. Ch. it made vs maruaile , considering your promises at your departures ; and some began to suspect ( that which I feare me will proue too true ) that you were fallen into that temptation which each man did easily foresee heere before you went hence ; and I many times foretold you also , to wit , that you hauing receiued euil successe here in your iourney by your owne defaults , and going among men that would & must of courtesie bemone the same ( for who will to your faces seeme to like of it , or say you haue deserued it ) you would be in daunger thereby to chaunge your good mindes that here you shewed , of acknowledging your owne errours : and for excuse thereof , would laie the fault where it is not , and so make posteriora peiora prioribus .

¶ And albeit at that time you saide you would neuer fal into this pitte , yet I doubt me you haue not performed it ; for by a stale Letter which I receiued this weeke from you , written soone after your arriuall at Paris ( to wit , the 11. of Iune ) I perceiue you were slidden much forward , seeing you say , you cannot but tell me of the great dislike which ordinarily all sorts of men haue of your imprisonment and hard vsage heere in Rome . And moreouer , you say that euerie one crieth out against it , although you vse all the modifications which in truth and equitie you may . And then further , you wish me to preuent in time the odious name of a rigorous & sterne gouernour , and not by colourable words , but by effectual deeds ; and that it is a corosiue vnto you , that those goodly giftes ( so you write ) which God hath bestowed vpon me , should by the alienations of our Country-mens affections from mee , be made lesse able to do our Country that good which all desire .

¶ All which words , and some other in the same Letter , ( though these are the principall ) doo shewe a great chaunge in you , from that you shewed here at your departure : which thing notwithstanding moueth not me so much for your owne persons ( considering the roote from whence it groweth , and that griefe must haue some vtterance ) as that which is written hither diuers waies , and by diuers persons of credit , of other mens speeches ( vpon your reports and complaints by all likelyhood ) touching your superiours also ; for by this same Poste , and with your Letter came another , of our friend M. D. C. which you do also mention , and he saith that your friends ( though he commend your owne moderation ) do crie out and complaine of singular iniustice done vnto you : and that you could not be heard iuridicè , nor haue your Proctors , or proceed in your processe as Iewes & Turkes and common malefactors are permitted .

¶ But another friend yet writeth more largely from Flaunders , by the Ordinary of this weeke , that passing of late by those partes where M. Ch. resideth ( though he talked not with himselfe ) yet he reporteth that others crie out in like manner , being stirred vp as hee saith ( for I will relate his owne words ) by the grieuous complaints of M. Ch. who threateneth to set downe in Print the whole storie of your vsage here ; to make it knowne thereby , as he writeth , both in England and else-where , how Priests be receiued by his holinesse , that come from Catholiques to disclose their griefes vnto him ; and that hee doth not beare himselfe as a common Father , but as partiall for Iesuits , preuented by them , to the ruine of poore Priests ; and that in Turkie they should haue bin vsed no worse : and that he and you , seeing how matters passed , determined neuer vnto this day , to open vnto his holinesse , nor vnto the Protector , the true causes of your sending , nor what errand you had , which should haue bene deliuered to his holinesse onely . Moreouer hee saith , they lament bitterly the poore estate of Catholiques , who at home are persecuted , and abroad cannot be heard when they send to open their griefes to him that ought to giue eare to all as a common Father , and that the Colledge at Rome is brought into a Spanish and Italian gouernment , F. Parsons bearing himselfe not as a Country-man , but Italianated ; that men will labour in Englande that none do send ouer their sonnes to be brought vp in it , for that it is not fit for English natures ; that it will neuer be well in England vntill Iesuites be recalled : Saltem tempore persecutionis , &c.

¶ These , and many more points like vnto these , our foresaid friend writeth , which for breuitie I doo omit , and these I would pretermit also without any answere at all , for so much as toucheth my selfe and our societie ( whose deeds doo speake of themselues against all calumniation of wordes ) but that those thinges which touch our superiours ( his holinesse especially , & our two Cardinall Protectors that had your matter in hearing by his holinesse Commission ) may not be let passe , to run with so false and iniurious reports , against all truth and equitie .

¶ Wherefore I must needes recount with you the storie briefly againe , for recalling you to better memorie if you forget , or conuenting your consciences , if you or your fellow vpon passion doo ouerlash ; or at least wise for satisfying in part our foresaid two friends that haue written to mee of these complaints , by whose hands I meane that this Letter shal goe open for them to read , and after to send or deliuer vnto you : and I pray you also , that M. Ch. may haue a sight or copie of the same , when you haue vewed it ; together with some good temperate counsell from you : and he is thought to haue more need of it by his hotte nature knowne , and by the reports that come daily from his parts of like speeches to these before specified : which if once they come to the eares of them whom most they concerne , they may chance to bee called by them to further examination , which I would gladly were preuented if it may bee .

¶ First then touching the matter it selfe , you cannot but remember that at your arriuall at Rome , vpon the 11. of December , 1598. ( if I mistake not ) after friendly offer to entertaine you in this Colledge for the dayes of Hospitalitie accustomed ( though the cause of your comming to Rome , was knowne to bee farre other then the rule appointeth for such as are so to be entertained ) I tolde you at large how all matters stood , and how his holinesse then in Ferrara , hauing beene enformed by his Nuntios in Fraunce and Flaunders of your comming , was much offended therewith , and meant to put you in prison if you had commen to Ferrara , as appeared by a Letter of F. Bellarmino , now Cardinall , which I had sent presently to Flaunders to meet you there , if you had passed that way from Fraunce , as it was thought you would : and by that Letter appeareth also that I had not enformed against you , seeing that his holinesse willed the Father to write to Rome , to know my opinion of you , as by the original Letter yet here extant is manifest ; and the cause of his holinesse offence against you was , that hauing bin vexed for more then three yeares together immediately before , with such a sedition of Englishmen heere in Rome and in Flaunders , as had vtterly wearied him & this whole Court , and had scandalized all Christendome , and highly discredited our English Nation and Catholique cause ; and hauing after all waies of examination and trials , both by visitations , commissions , memorials , and the like , found no other ground of all these stirs , clamours , & tempests , but only enuie , emulation , and dissolute humours , of loose behauiour in some , and no one point proued , nor able to be proued of the manifold slaunders which were exhibited in these tumults , against most innocent men of the Societie , who had bene the best friends of the troublesome : his holinesse resolued to make an end at last , and so did in this Colledge , by punishing the principall ; and how much the finger of Almightie God assisted him in this action , the blessed fruites that haue ensued since , of peace , vnion , modestie , spirit , learning , and deuotion in these youthes , haue euidently declared : whereby they haue regained againe a great part of that estimation and good opinion , which the former had lost by their contrary vices .

¶ Moreouer , his holinesse perceiuing that the tayle of this matter had passed also into England , and began to worke the same effects there , vpon the same grounds of emulation & seditious spirits , he thought no better way to cut off the said emulation , then to appoint a subordination among Priests themselues ; which Iesuites especially among other Catholiques their friends , haue demaunded for many yeares together , thereby to deliuer themselues from all shewe of that calumniation vsed to bee laide against them , that they would gouerne the Priests against their wils ; and hereof proceed the long deliberation of his holinesse : together with the Cardinals , not onely Protectors , but also of the Inquisition , whether it were best to appoint at the beginning , a Bishop or Arch-priest : which deliberation endured aboue a yeare together ; and in the meane space his holinesse tooke information also sufficient , about the person most fit for the office , and that from Priests of England , though not perhappes from you , as it was not necessary ; and in the ende , resolued vppon the dignitie and man that you knowe . Which beeing admitted and appointed most willingly by al the body , both of Priests and other Catholiques in England , and abroad also , you only , and very fewe others ioyned with you ( as heere was proued by your account ) opposed your selues , and not expecting to bring any matter of substance against his gouernment that was appointed for your superiour , you substracted your selues from his obedience , and gaue occasion for others to do the like : and consequently , to cause a most perillous schisme and sedition amongst Catholicques in our Countrey ; which his holinesse foreseeing , meant to restraine you at your comming : but yet to heare and examine all that you brought , as afterwards he did , and you do greatly wrong him , if you report the contrary .

¶ Well , all this and much more I tolde you at your comming hither , and that not in colourable , but in plaine and friendly words : offering you further , to be a meane notwithstanding , to end all quietly , and with your credits , if you would . For said I , heere bee now the immediate superiours of both Priests and Iesuites : to wit , the Protector of our Nation , and the Generall of the Societie , let vs deale with them to end all matters , and to send you backe againe with your honour ; and with Letters both to the Arch-priest and superiour of the Fathers , to giue you any satisfaction reasonable , and remedie any thing that is amisse , concerning any persons of each of those bodies . This point I dealt with you most effectually many times , both in seuerall , and iointly , while you remained in this Colledge , & after whiles you laie in the Citie before your restraint , but could neuer obtaine anie inclination in you to the same , but that you would needs impugne both the authoritie and man by his holinesse appointed ; wherein I euer told you plainly , that both I and all others that loued vnion , and respected with due obedience our superiours ordination , must needs be against you . And the same told you also , M. D. Haddock , M. Martin Array , and Priests of your owne coate that laie here , and are your auncients , both in your owne order , and their trauells in England ; and the verie same we made you to see to be the iudgements of the grauest of our Nation , in Flaunders , and other places , and especially in England : from whence I assure my selfe I shewed you first and last neare two hundreth names of Priests writing & subscribing against you : & you afterwards vpon your oathes could not name a dozen to be for you , as yet appeareth in the Register .

¶ Thus then standing your case and obstinacie , and hauing bin exhorted both by the Cardinall Caietane Protector , and by Cardinall Burghese Vice-Protector , to desist from your enterprise of contradiction , without foundation at all ( as after appeared , and then was suspected ) his holinesse after seuenteene daies of your persisting or thereabout , willed you to be retyred to some place of custodie , in respect of your offence , and there your allegations to be examined , whether they were worth the handling or no ; which comming to my knowledge , I entreated rather that your retirement might be with secrecie in this Colledge , then with more infamie in anie other place , though I easilie foresawe what thankes I was like to haue for my labour ; but I did it for him by whom I cannot leese , as I did also the rest ; to wit , in giuing you of the best chambers in the house , in cherishing you gratis , in visiting you often , and making each of you good new gownes for the winter ; in giuing you a Father to be your Notarie gratis , & procuring your Iudge to come to the Colledge and lie here to examine you : with commoditie , which otherwise would haue cost you much money , and manie painfull iournies about the streets , and other incommodities , which now you litle consider .

¶ Well , your examination and retirement , endured three moneths or more ; you had time & commoditie to say or write what you woulde , yea you were willed vpon your oaths to say what you could , and all that you said is written , and you did sweare you had no more to say of moment in all matters handled , as appeareth by the Records : and all that you said was considered of maturelie , as wel by your Iudge that was a Lawier , as also by the two Cardinalls , the one a Diuine , the other a Lawier ; who to the ende they might be sure to heare all , and satisfie both you and themselues , did come in person one day to the Colledge to examine you , and to heare redde in your presence , all that you had said and deposed , or could say : and after this , yet staied they diuers weekes to enforme his holinesse , before they gaue sentence in your cause .

¶ And how then can it be said with anie colour that you had wrong , and that you had lesse iustice here , then is permitted to Turkes and Iewes ? How can his holinesse and the Cardinalls be accused of partiall dealing ? seeing they heard all you could say , and would haue had you saie more , and were ashamed to finde you to haue comen so long a iourney with so little to saie , finding you also not to haue brought with you , so much as anie one Letter of credence from anie communitie or priuate person , in such forme as might giue credit , for that those little open scrowles that you brought without substance or forme of anie Commission , were ashame to looke vpon ? Your secret memorialls also that you had set downe here in M. Ch. owne hand , to exhibit to his holinesse , of your most secret businesse , are here to be seene ; and the Iudge , Cardinalls , and perhappes his holi . also , haue had the view of them , & haue found them of no more weight then the rest ; and how then is it said that you kept your chiefe message to your selues and disclosed it not ? what message could this be ? or from whom ? for of the Iesuites and of the Archipresbyter you said your fill , and were willed vpon your oaths to saie more , if you had anie to saie , in that or in any other points . And as for those priests that sent you , they were verie fewe as appeared ; and I shewed you well neere twentie times as manie names of the same order against you : who testifie also for all Catholiques which deale with them , to be of the same opinion , and to haue misliked your iournie and cause , and detested the schisme that thereof insued .

¶ And how then doo men vpon this little part or faction of yours vse those praises , that the Catholiques are intollerablie afflicted , being persecuted at home , and cannot be heard abroad ? Who are these Catholiques ? or what audience is denied to them ? If we compare the persecution of those Priestes at home , by the heretiques that hold with you , or with the Arch-priest and Iesuites , it is easily seene who are most persecuted and hated by the Councell of England ; and if anie complaine that your side hath not bene heard by his holinesse , let his holi . patience for three or foure whole yeares together , in dooing nothing else but hearing & examining of their impertinent clamours in this Citie , deliuer him from that vniust calumniation . And so much of our Superiours .

¶ As touching my selfe , my defence shall be much shorter ; you aduise me to preuent the odious name of a sterne and rigorous Gouernour , and that not by colourable words , but by effectual deeds , and I embrace the aduice most willinglie , for indeed I finde great aversion in my nature of all these points you name ; I meane , of sterne , rigorous , colourable , and no lesse perhaps from Couernour , which euer I haue fled and avoided , vntill now , that perforce I am constrained to haue the gouernment of this house ; wherein yet I suppose , that I may haue as many witnesses as here be inhabitants , that my proceeding , is neither sterne , rigorous , nor colourable with them , & with you I am sure I neuer vsed it , as may appeare by that which before hath bene saide , of my plaine , reall , & friendlie dealing in your affaire ; and I would aske but one example to be alleadged and proued to the contrarie , as I could alledge manie in my behalf , and one somewhat notorious since your departure , of one M. Shawe a Priest , who hauing fallen fowly in England , & railed afterwards egregiously against the Societie ( as hee had done also here in Rome first before his going into England , and commonly these matters goe together ) yet comming hither of late , and being in great miserie , both spiritually and temporally , and in daunger to dispaire , and to lie God knoweth how long in the Inquisition , I haue comforted and assisted him in this Colledge , as if he had bene mine owne brother , and this for manie daies together , procuring him also a good and fauourable dispatch , and afterwards to bee placed in a good Church vnder religious men in Naples , where he liueth with great contentment to himselfe , and edification hitherto of others .

¶ Sir I must needs say here with the Apostle : Factus sum insipiens , sed vos me coegistis : to shewe my selfe to be neither sterne , nor rigorous , nor colourable , I am forced to speake of that I would not . It may bee you doo mislike in me my firme standing against the troublesome of this house first , and against you , and your companion afterward , that came in defence of the former troubles : if it be so , you and I do differ in iudgements , for I do thinke that vigour and fortitude to bee so necessary and commendable , which is required to stand in confractione , as the scripture tearmeth it , against vnquiet striuing spirits , as without it , no good in any gouernment can be expected ; and albeit in some it cause alienations of affections , as you signifie , yet in others it worketh the contrarie ; and that which most importeth , it vpholdeth truth , vertue , and Gods cause . And I would aske you now againe ( as sometimes here in presence I did ) in what case do you thinke our common cause of England had beene at this daie if no man had resisted the designements of the troublesome in this place , or if your endeauours after them had taken place ?

¶ Let vs example but one example ; you talked before your restraint heere , with the Commissary of the Inquisition , and you gaue him such a relation of English matters , as afterward when M. Doctor Haddock , and M. Martin Array had talked with him also , and informed him as they thought of the very truth of matters , he told an honourable man of Rome , and a great friende of mine , that foure English Priestes hauing talked with him , they had taken from him all list to beleeue any Englishmen , or matters more , they told him so different tales , and yet all of them would seeme to be men of zeale : well then , if you had bin let alone by his holinesse to deale with all the Cardinalls , and great men of Rome in like sort , would you not haue brought our common cause in a pretie plight trowe you , and your selues also ?

¶ Moreouer , it appeareth by your papers and depositions yet extant , that you tooke the way first to discredit so much as in you lay , M. Blackwell , the first , man of all your order that euer was yet in authoritie , and of those parts and merittes that all English men know ; yea in the very matter of his faith , for that an heriticall proposition was laid to his charge . Secondly were to be discredited such English Priests as stood with him , who are the principall of your coat ; and with them , all Iesuites , but chieflie those that are known to haue laboured most in the common cause , and by whose intercession Catholique Princes haue bene most mooued to assist hetherto the same : and what would haue followed of this ? Further , the Protector himselfe must haue bin changed , if all designments in your papers had taken place ; the Seminaries must haue beene taken from the gouernment of Iesuites , & the whole societie called out of England : and albeit you proposed not in words al these points together when you came , & how matters stood : yet were they mentioned as is to bee seene in your papers from your partners in England ; and you see that now they begin to be giuen abroad againe , in places where you or M. Ch. are or haue beene , and vttered discontentment .

¶ And if all these points had bene brought to passe by you , or at least that other point wherevpon you stood so much heere , to haue two Arch-priests in England , not subordinate the one to the other , but each one absolute with his traine of subiects vnder him , opposite the one against the other , would not all our cause haue comen quicklie to ruine ? and shall those then that haue stood against these ruines , be accounted sterne and rigorous , or rather constant & pious , yea friendly towards your selues ? for that with the ruine of the common cause , yours also and all other Priests should be inuolued ; and now God be thanked , by the good order which his holinesse hath setled , all is well ended and remedied , if men can be contented ; and now Priests haue their head and subordination , and Iesuites also theirs , and both are happilie vnited together , and all strife is ended in England , to Gods great glorie and our common good I hope ; and his holy name be euer blessed for the same .

¶ And as for the gouernment of this Colledge here in Rome , whether it be Spanish or Italian , I know not ; but sure I am , it tendeth all to vnion , peace , loue , vertue , and learning ; & that do the schollers finde by the effects , hauing receiued more confort , quiet , true mirth , and gaine of learning , in one moneh sithence the reformation , then in some yeares before ; & as for youthes to come vnto it , let no man haue care : for would to God we had so much maintenance , as we could haue choise of schollers to enioy it ; and no wise Catholique is there in England or else-where , that hearing of this chaunge and reformation , wil refuse to send his children hither ( if he loue them , and may be in hope to haue them placed ) for the words or writings of any such to the contrarie , as M. Ch. threatneth , who shal bemonethe lack of liberty . And if M. Ch. or anie other should attempt to put any thing in print of matters passed heere ( as our friend writeth is threatned , but I cannot beleeue that any such intent can be ) the matter would easily be answered , for that here remaine authenticall registers , of all that passed by publique authoritie .

¶ Well good Sir , I will end then , and pray you to be a mean ( as I know your nature to be more moderate , and you promsed it here also ) that things may rest as they were , and are well ended , without renewing of further griefes , as both in wisedome and conscience , and vnder your oathes also , and vpon paine of censures both of you are bound : and surely if these things should be true , which before I haue alleadged to be written hither by credible relators , whose Letters are here extant , I cannot see how either of you that should bee cause of so false and dissentious reports , can be safe in conscience for very great sinne , and grieuous censures also ; but I hope they will not proue true .

¶ And as for the request you make in your Letter to mee , to deliuer you from the false report written hence to Flaunders , and thence to your partes againe , that you should confesse heere to haue beene moued onlie by ambition , to take your last action in hand , I will deliuer you most willingly from anie thing that I haue written , or willed others to write ; for as you saie , I did euer attribute your attempt , rather to errour and lack of consideration , then to ambition ; wherein you may see I was not rigorous ; but yet seeing your matter passed by diuers mens hands and knowledge , I cannot let them to thinke , speake , or write , what they iudge best ; yet do I suppose verilie , that none would saie or write that you confessed so much here , tho I haue heard diuers speake and suspect so much , vpon the sight of your papers ; for that seeing in diuers papers and scrolles of your fellowes , which you brought open with you , you were proposed for Bishops , and in a long discourse of a friend of yours sent out of Englande after your departure , you two by name were appointed to bee Arch-bishops & Primates ; and that besides this , a principall man of your side , writing to you certain notes about your message , vseth the phrase of your LL. with his owne hand yet here to be seene ; it was much to be suspected what motion moued you .

¶ But ( as I said ) now all is ended , and this and all the rest will easilie die and be forgotten , ( as alreadie I trust all is forgotten on all hands ) if you and M. Ch. do beare your selues well and prudentlie , and do staie and not stirre vp such as do seeme to fauour or bemone your cause , which though you terme by the phrase , of all sorts of people , in your Letter , yet must you not deceiue your selues , for that finallie all those sorts must be reduced to a verie small number , in respect of others that do condemne your action .

¶ Heere in Rome you prooued how the grauest sort of people , both straungers and others , iudged of your cause , after they had heard and examined the same ; I shewed you also the Letters and subscriptions of manie of the chiefest and most principall of our Nation , in Flaunders and England ; and since that time I haue receiued manie more , and manie complaining of the ouermuch lenitie vsed in ending of the cause ; how then do all sorts of men crie out of the rigour or iniustice vsed towards you ? but in truth it is a verie vncertaine thing to depend vpon the speeches of men ; diuers speake faire , and will bemone a man to his face , when their harts are farre otherwise ; and some being discontent or in passion themselues vpon other groundes , are glad to take such occasions as this of yours is , to disburthen their stomackes of their owne griefes ; others euill enformed at the beginning vpon pittie doo bemone you ; which afterwards vpon knowledge of the truth wil change their mindes , and crie crucifige .

¶ The onelie way is , to depend of God , and of a good conscience , and to wish well to all , and speake euill of fewe , and to doo the good a man may for all sorts , without respect what they will saie or do again ; and finally , to haue patience with whatsoeuer falleth out ; and this rule I do counsel to you , and do meane by Gods assistance to follow it my selfe , wishing no worse to you and yours then to my owne soule , as he is witnesse who is maister of vs both : to whose holie protection I do most affectually commend you : and my selfe to your holie praiers and sacrifices . From Rome , this 9. of October . 1599.

Yours euer most readie to serue you : Robert Parsons .

This Letter of F. Parsons , did the Arch-priest send abroad by his Agent , with an Iniunction to those to whom it was carried , that they must beleeue all that was contained therin , assuring them that it was most true , notwithstanding hee had made a seuere Edict not long before against all such as should diuuldge anie thing set out for the space of two yeares before , wherein the credit of anie Ecclesiasticall person of the English Nation , should particularly & by name be touched . How many faultes were in this action of the Arch-priest , it is not for me to discypher : but it is verie manifest , that in this Letter of F. Parsons , the credit of two English Priests by name , are very much wounded , and as it should seeme by the censure following , the Letter deserueth litle commendation for truth therein contained .

A censure vpon the Letter which F. Parsons writ the 9. of October . 1599. to M. D. Bish. and M. Ch. two banished & confined Priests , the one in France , the other in Lorraine , by the suggestions of F. Parsons , for presuming to goe to Rome , in the affaires of the Church . Giuen by M. I. B.

IN the first Paragraffe , F. Parsons followeth a suspisition conceiued against M. Bish. and M. Ch. because they did not write vnto him , and yet confesseth in the second Paragraffe , that the same weeke he had receiued a stale Letter from M. Bish. so that hee might haue left out of the first Paragraffe this manifest vngrounded suspition , and also this absurd vntruth , soone after controlled euen by himself , that no letter appeared as yet from M. Bish. And M. Ch. beeing confined to a place , where neither any ordinary Poste was for Rome , or vsually passed ( as F. Parsons well knew ) he might with more credit haue pretended some other cause of so vniust a suspition , as that the two Priests had forsaken their good minds , fallen into knowne and acknowledged errours , and broken promises made at their departure . If Letters might miscarry in so long a way as was between Rome and them , what ground was , the not receiuing of Letters from them of those conceits ? If they will say that they must needs receiue all Letters which come to Rome directed to them , & so soone as they do come to them , daily practise will conuince the contrarie , howsoeuer he shuffleth off this contradiction , that as yet no Letter appeared from M. Bish. ( as F. Parsons affirmeth in the first Paragraffe ) and that he had that weeke receiued a stale Letter from him ( as hee confesseth in the second Paragraffe ) but it appeareth both in this former part of F. Parsons Letter , and also in all which followeth in the same , that F. Parsons thought it a great sinne for himselfe , not to deserue blame . What errours were acknowledged at Rome , I know not , but it is very likely that they would haue bene specified vpon so good an occasion as was offered to F. Parsons by M. Bish. and is by F. Parsons touched in the 21. Paragraffe : and if they should haue acknowledged themselues to haue erred in want of consideration , doubtlesse I should ( as now it falleth out ) beleeue as much , because they did willingly ouerslip an opportunitie of hauing a fit meane ( maugre their aduersaries ) to haue bene heard before they should haue bin committed to prison : which infamy as F. Parsons confesseth , they were in the 10. Paragraffe .

In the second Paragraffe , F. Parsons boldly without blushing saith , that hee receiued a stale Letter from M. Bish: from whom in the first Paragraffe he saith , as yet no Letter appeared , and both by that Letter , which was receiued , and by that none at all as yet appeared , it is gathered that M. Bish. was fallen againe into a pit , out of which as yet he neuer came , since his first fall into it . Those commendations of himselfe , which F. Parsons tooke no great disgust to repeate , ( meaning that these Letters should passe farre and neare , as appeareth in the 6. Paragraffe ) were vsed by M. Bish. perchance to trie if by fitting so well F. Parsons humour , he might draw him to that which as it should seeme by M. Bishops reply , was not in him . What M. Doctor Cic. did write of others complaints I know not ; but so farre as without offence I may , I thinke that it was a most lamentable case , that two Priests comming as it became Priests , towards Rome , to deale with his holinesse about such things as belonged to the Church , and were said to be done by his order , not confirmed by any Letters from the See Apostolique , or any other sufficient witnesse , should be iudged to be laide in prison with infamy ( as is before shewed out of F. Parsons Letters ) after many yeares spent by the same two Priests in their Countrey , many daungers of losse of libertie , and life ouerpassed in defence of the Catholique Church , and particularly of the dignitie of the See Apostolique , and a glorious confession of the one in prison , and banishment of the same .

To omit the rest of their entertainment at Rome , I cannot but maruel that there should be so grieuous a sentence of banishment , and confinement giuen against them , who offered at their arraignement before the two Cardinalls ( the sentence deserueth that tearme ) to answere to what was obiected , and they who put vp the Libell ( that is a bill of complaints and accusation ) against them ( when they perceiued how readie they were to make their answere ) requested on their knees of the Iudges , that the Libell might not be deliuered vnto them , but rather that all things should be peaceably ended ; to which the Iudges enclined , and therevpon deliuered not the Libel to the two Priests , who had demaunded it , to make their answere vnto it .

All things at that time passed in such sort , as they should haue bin presently set at liberty , had not there bin a deliberation to staie them for two or three dayes ( as was then pretended by their aduersaries ) in regard that M. Bish. behaued himself with more confidence and boldnesse in this cause , then was to some of their likings . Which I note the more at large , in regard of an vngodly Letter penned by F. Parsons , or at the least by his instructions , as it is most plaine by some of the particulars ; at the handling wherof , M. Martin Array was not present , although it goeth masked vnder M. Martin Array his name to his friend , bearing date the 20. of Februarie , 1599. Wherein he vndertaketh as a Proctor in the Arch-priests case against these two Priests , to relate the storie of that which passed vpon the seuenteenth of the same moneth , at their triall : and among many most shamelesse vntruthes , affirmeth , that the two Priests ( whom in scorne he calleth Embassadors ) were able to say litle to that which he and M. Doctor Haddock had libelled against them ; and were willing to say lesse , but onely excused their owne intentions , and asked pardon , if they had giuen scandall by their manner of proceeding , more then euer they meant . Whereas the onely pretence that was made , why they were not at the same time set at libertie , was more courage then was well liked of in pleading for themselues , & confident demaunding for the Libell to answere vnto it . Before or after which time , they neuer were brought before the Iudges , & yet a sentence of banishment , and confinement , without any prouision made for them , was giuen against them : and what coniectures was made of this by such as heard thereof , I know not ; neither hath F. Parsons as it should seeme by these his Letters , any further knowledge what M. Bish. and M. Ch. report , but a hearesay from a hearesay , a slender ground to publish in such sort as he doth against them , although not in print , yet with so many Copies , as they are common inough , and are carried about to such as are thought will not bestowe the paines to write out Father Parsons follies , or the cost otherwise to haue them : and thus much for the 3. and 4. Paragraffe .

In the 5. Paragraffe , F. Parsons professeth how that he would pretermit these and other points without any answere at al , for so much as they touch himselfe , and the societie , because his and their deeds do speake of themselues , against all calumniation of words . To what purpose this is here brought I know not , vnlesse for company he would drawe his whole societie into obloquie : without daunger of which , his deeds will not be iustified by them , vnlesse they vse to speake better for themselues , then he speaketh in these Letters of his , notwithstanding all the gloses , which he maketh to cast off all the blame of the hard measure which was meated to the two Priests , and the shuffling of the same from himselfe , vpon the Pope , in the 7. 8. and 10. Paragraffe , although in this 5. Paragraffe hee would most holilie perswade , that , had not these things touched his holinesse , especially by false and iniurious reports , against all truth and equitie , hee could and would haue dispensed with whatsoeuer touched himselfe . And that hee might cleare his holinesse especially , and the two Cardinalls Protectors , in the 6. Paragraffe hee conuenteth the consciences of the two Priests , which if they doo not discharge with more truth then hee hath done in these Letters , they are most worthily to be blamed .

F. Parsons neither made anie friendly offer to entertaine the two Priests in the Colledge for the daies of hospitallitie accustomed , as hee affirmeth in the 7. Paragraffe , nor suffered them to remaine there , but when they demanded it , he denied it , vpon the cause which here he alledgeth : to which , reply was made , that , what other businesse soeuer they had , they had also that cause of comming to Rome , that they might lawfully demaund such entertainment . And after foure or fiue daies , that they had wroong themselues in , he found a meanes to thrust them out againe , before the accustomed daies of hospitallitie were ended , charging them , that they did by murmuring against the Pope , giue euil edification , which for lacke of better proofe , F. Owen a Iesuite , and F. Parsons instrument in that businesse , would demonstrate vnto them , because that one of them being demaunded whether that they had seene such a man in England , answered , that he had seene him , but not talked with him , yet vnderstood that he was hardly dealt withall , because such as were accustomed to entertain Priests at their first comming , were perswaded by some , that they should not giue him any entertainment , and that his nearest of kinne were told , that in conscience they could not receiue him . If F. Parsons charitie and his fellowes toward the two Priestes , or the third of whom they spake , had bene answerable to their profession , this would neuer haue bene so iudged of by them , and so vehemently maintained to haue bene a murmure against the Pope , vnlesse for the Popes farther honour , they will as vnaduisedly laie this to his charge , that it was his wil the Priest should be thus vsed , as in this same 7. Paragraffe F. Parsons ( forgetting that his motiue to write this Letter , was to deliuer the Pope from false and iniurious reports ) boldly affirmeth , that his holinesse hauing bene enformed by his Nuntios in Fraunce & Flaunders , of the comming of the two Priests , was so much offended therewith , that he ment to put them in prison . What truth there is in this report I cannot say , or what falshood ; sure I am , that it soundeth like a verie iniurious report against the Pope , if he had such a meaning ; and much more , if he had it not , as in reason we should thinke he had not ; for who can in reason thinke , that his holinesse onely vpon newes of the comming of two Priests to him with so great aduenture , and daunger of life , about matters of the Church , would determine to put them in prison before hee heard them what they had to say , or sawe them ? But to auoide his holinesse of blame , we wil supply in this place for F. Parsons , that if the Nuntios did signifie any such matter vnto his holinesse , as most likely they did not , they did sende suche informations against the two Priestes , as the Pope might purpose to cast them in prison so soone as they came to Ferrara , and then let vs demaund where these Informers had their instructions and of whom ? of themselues they could not , being farre asunder each from other , and both out of England , whence the two Priests came . If of any other , who were they ? or were they such parties ( although religious of the societie , who onely can be imagined to haue correspondence with them , although it be vnlikely , especially with him in France ) that vpon their bare accusations the Nuntios would write to such purpose to his holinesse , as hee should determine vpon this relation of the Nuntios , to imprison them so soone as they shuld come to Ferrara , without knowing , or hauing any further proofe of the accusations made against them by their aduersaries ? Yet is not this report more iniurious against the Pope , whom he vndertaketh in the 5. Paragraffe to deliuer from al false , and iniurious reports , against all truth & equitie , then his proofe is insufficient which here he maketh in defence of himselfe ; for which in the 5. Paragraffe he seemed that he would wholly relie vpon his knowne deeds , not vpon his writing , his proofe is , that F. Bellarmino now Cardinall was willed by his Holi . to write to Rome , to know F. Parsons opinion of the two Priests , therefore F. Parsons had not enformed against them . Did F. Parsons imagine that mens wits were so short , that , when they saw this Letter of his , they would forget that F. Bellarmino his Letter , was an answere to a Letter , which F. Parsons writ to him concerning these two Priests ; the effect whereof alghough we do not know , yet we may probably coniecture what it was by F. Bellarmino his Letter , which was to enforme F. Parsons that the two Priests were not as yet come , and that when they did come , there should be such order taken for them , as hee should not need to come from Rome to Ferrara . What order this was F. Parsons himselfe confesseth , and cyteth F. Bellarmino his Letter , forsooth they must first be laide in prison , and then if there could be any cause found why , this infamous iniury should be iustified . Doth the Popes commaundement to F. Bellarmino to write to F. Parsons to know his opinion of the two Priests , proue , that F. Parsons had not sent information against them ? Or if it be true , that the Pope did giue this commaundement to F. Bellarmino , doth it conuince that what perswasions F. Bellarmino vsed to the Pope , or some other ( if hee would not be seene in it ) did not proceed from F. Parsons , who , had hee not benestaied by this Letter of F. Bellarmino , would haue come to Ferrara himselfe , as it should seeme by the same Letter ? If the informations giuen to the Pope against these two Priests , by reason whereof they were to be imprisoned ( for no man but F. Parsons as I thinke , would say , that without any informations against them , his holines vpon a bare hearesay that they were comming to him to deale in matters of the Church , would resolue to put them in prison ) must of necessitie bee giuen as comming from F. Parsons . How is it true , that his holinesse resolued to put them in prison , before he had F. Parsons opinion of them ? If the same informations were not of necessitie to be giuen as comming from F. Parsons , what proofe is this that F. Parsons had not enformed against them that his holinesse willed the Father to write to Rome , to know his opinion of them ? But these things seeme to proceed from the same vaine , from which that which followeth doth proceed : where F. Parsons to make the matter more odious , doth labour to confound the businesse about which the two Priestes went to Rome with that , which was at Rome betweene the Iesuites , and the English Students : and to that effect , in the 8. 13. and 15. Paragraffes maketh the stirres which were in England , an appendix of those , which were at Rome .

In the 8. Paragraffe I woonder howe Father Parsons can say , that the Iesuites especially had demanded for many yeares , that there should be a subordination among the Priests , to deliuer themselues from all shewe of that calumniation vsed to be laid against them , that they would gouerne the Priests against their wills ; when as by credible report , F. Parsons ( without whom no English Iesuite durst do any thing ) laboured mightily against it , vntil he saw that the secular Priests went seriously about it : and it is so euident , that no man may without ouermuch impudencie denie it ; that all the strife , which was openly in England betweene the Iesuites , and the Priests , began vpon occasion of a gouernment , which the Iesuites sought , & would haue had ouer the Priests , who were in durance at Wisbitch against many their wills ; and for the better effecting of that , to which most inordinately they aspired , they did not onely endeuour to disgrace them , as men that were desirous of libertie , but were the occasion also that many Catholiques did send them no reliefe .

The second vntruth in this 8. Paragraffe is , that the man or authoritie was admitted , and appointed most willingly by all the body , both of Priests , and other Catholiques in England , and abroad also . For F. Parsons confessed himselfe at Rome to the Priests , ( who were sent thither ) that he himselfe appointed the man , least some such other should haue bin chosen by the generall , and free suffrages of the Priests , as would not runne along with the Iesuites : and as for the authoritie , I thinke I may boldly say , that neither Priest , nor Clarke in England , euer dreamed of the authoritie of an Arch-priest ; whose office is cleane out of vse now in England , except the complaining part thereof ; neither can it be said that euer it was willingly approued by the Priests : who for the most part , had their consents wroong from them by the Iesuites , & the Archpriest himself ; & if there were no other proofe of the priests not free approouing therof ( as they are many ) the qualitie of his authoritie , as it was first graunted ( at what time the Priests were sent to Rome ) will shewe it manifestly , or iustly condemne those , who approued it of great haste , for without any authoritie to do them the least good , or repaire the least harme he might do to them , he had a bare office of a lawlesse executioner , of which the Priests in England stood in no need .

The 3. vntruth in this Paragraffe is , that it was proued at Rome by the account of the two Priests , that very few opposed themselues , for they brought with them sufficient testimony , that many opposed themselues : that is , were very much discontented with it , and thought what would come of it , although the two Priests who went to Rome , had parsonally talked but with fewe , and therfore could not iustifie vpon their oathes for many .

The fourth vntruth in this Paragraffe is , that they brought no matter of substance against his gouernment : whereas F. Parsons could not but know very well , that the strife being betweene the Iesuites , and the Priests , he who should be at the Iesuites deuotion , could be no fit gouernour ouer the Priests , and when F. Parsons writ these Letters of his , he could not bee ignorant both that the Arch-priest had instructions to be in some sort ordered by them , and he professed it openly , that no secular Priest must be of his counsell in this his gouernment of secular Priests , who should dislike any thing in the Iesuites ; which was deposed , and in particular iustified at Rome : beside this , if F. Parsons say true in the 17. Paragraffe , the Arch-priest was touched in the very matter of his faith ; for that an hereticall proposition was laid to his charge , as appeared by their papers , and depositions yet extant . Lastly , if it should be proued that the Arch-priest consulted about the suspending of some , with certaine Iesuites onely and some women , this gouernment of the secular Priests would proue little commendable .

The 5. vntruth is , that they caused a most perillous schisme , & sedition among Catholiques , by this their substracting themselues from this obedience . Is it to cause a schisme , not to obey him , whom vnder their oathes ( if it be true which F. Parsons saith in the 17. Paragraffe ) they touched in the very matter of his faith ? but whether this were so or no , I am not here to discourse . Could they be accused of schisme , which formerly includeth a voluntary , actuall , or vertuall diuision from the heade , with like contempt of the head ; who sent directly to the head to vnderstand whether that did come from the head , which was pretended to come from him , and chalenged without any his Letters , or any testimonie sufficient to binde them ? or were the English Priests , who haue so well deserued of Gods Church , to be so seuerely censured for doing that which is lawfull in all places ; that is , to oppose against any preferred , especially without their knowledge and consent , by their aduersaries , before that he be confirmed in his authoritie ? promising in the meane time as they did , to discharge themselues as became them , and to obeye in what they might knowe themselues bound .

The 6. vntruth is , that the Pope foresawe all that which F. Parsons rehearseth in this 8. Paragraffe ; which being false , might vpon wrong information be beleeued , but not be foreseene .

The 7. vntruth is , that the Pope did heare all that the two Priests brought ; of whom did his holinesse heare it ? they were neuer suffered to be heard by his holinesse , as F. Parsons himselfe confesseth in the 13. Paragraffe .

In the 9. Paragraffe F. Parsons sheweth how hee dealt with the two Priests to return againe with their credites , by ending forsooth all matters at the discretion of the Generall of the Iesuites , and the Protector ( who was allied to him ) both vnequall Arbiters in a difficultie raised by the Iesuits against the Priests ; yet , as it should appeare , they were not so backward to deale with the Protector concerning the new authoritie sent into England by him onely ( for anie thing that they knew , or could sufficiently learne ) for so soone as they vnderstood of his arriuall at Rome , and could come to him , which was vpon the 21. of December , they brake the matter vnto him , requesting him that he would listen to the iust petitions of many well deseruing of the Catholique Church , which if he should doo , they would not trouble his holinesse with this matter ; and hee willed them to bring in writing what they had to say , promising them , that he would consider thereon ; to which the two Priests accorded , and departed , intending to returne so soone as the holy-daies would license them to follow their businesse , and they might haue free accesse to the Cardinall : but vpon the 29. day , which was wont to be in great reuefence among all English Catholiques , that is to say , vpon the feast of S. Thomas of Canterbury , they were apprehended with infamie ; as Father Parsons confesseth in the 10. Paragraffe ( and sooner perchance should haue bene , had not Tiber by a straunge invndation kept their aduersaries asunder ) depriued of all their writings , perfect and vnperfect , and neuer after suffered to deale together concerning their businesse which they had in hand , vntill the 3. or 4. day after that F. Parsons had procured ( God knoweth out of what Office ) an Apostolical briefe , in conformation of the Arch-priest his authoritie ; yet all this must be cloaked with the loue of vnion , and respect with due obedience to the superiours ordination , & vnder this colour he , M. D. Haddocke , and M. Martin Array , must oppose themselues against the two Priests , and F. Parsons must also tell them , that these their aduersaries were their auncients , both in their order , and in their trauels in England . He might haue put downe this also for him selfe , for he was their auncient likewise in both ; but if all the time which they three spent in Englande were put together , it woulde hardly make out the time which hee that trauelled least in England of these two , had spent , for all three ranne away , and not all of them in so good sort , as some wished they had , being so hastie to be gone .

Concerning the last clause of the 9. Paragraffe , I knowe not how many names of Priests F. Parsons shewed them , or whether hee shewed them any or no , but I do verily thinke he might haue shewed the names of many more , then hee could iustifie their consents vnto it , their names being knowne heere in England to haue bene wroong from them by the Iesuites , and the Arch-priest in his owne behalfe , neither was it to be expected of the two Priests to name vnder their oathes any great company , not hauing specially spoken with many , yet they brought testimonie , that many disliked it , of which perchaunce some in particular , who had giuen them their names , had for feare afterward subscribed in the behalfe of the Arch-priest of which kind the more names were shewed , the lesse was the number of those who Fa. Parsons in the 8. Paragraffe saith , gaue their free consent .

In the 10. Paragraffe , F. Parsons beginneth to disgorge his choler against the two Priests for their obstinacie , because forsooth they would not desist from their purpose , and follow his humour . Secondly , he ioyneth an vntruth , if the Protector and they did agree in such order , as is set downe in the 9. paragraffe , or the Cardinall Burghese promised them all the furtherance hee could giue them in their matters , as I am credibly informed he did . Thirdly , it is not likely that the two Cardinalls ( not knowing what was to be saide ) would vpon a bare suspition charge them with an enterprise of contradiction without any foundation at all , vnlesse F. Parsons will say , that they had such a foresight , as hee attributeth to the Pope in the 8. paragraffe ; or that hee had plotted such a Common-wealth , as wherein could be no errour , or the least cause of exception either against the authoritie , or Officers , for how else ( before men were heard ) could there be such a iudgement in such as were esteemed wise men , and thought fit to be pillers of Gods Church ? What foundation there was for them to build vpon , I will leaue to a more Clearklike discourse , & for a fewe complements sake , briefly note some points of many , which I haue seene , to shewe how lightly F. Parsons laieth his foundation vpon he knew not what , for the iustifying of himselfe in that action , and what was done by his meanes .

The first for a foundation is noted , that the Cardinall did shewe in the selfe-same Letters wherein he made M. Black . an Arch-priest , and gaue him his authoritie , that the motiue hereof , was a most false , wicked , and ignominious suggestion made to the Pope against the Seminary Priests , and the Catholiques , and therefore the thing therevpon graunted meerly voide .

Secondly , the Cardinall affirmeth onely in the same Letters , that he had commaundement from his holinesse to vnite together these Priests , and Catholiques , which were at that false suggested variance , and therefore when that vnion was made he had discharged his office , and by this Commission had no more to do ; if then this vnitie wil be sufficiently proued to haue bene betweene the Priests , and the Catholiques , before this authoritie was giuen in England , this authoritie was voide .

Thirdly , the Cardinall being no Bishop at all , much lesse ouer all England ( and Scotland where was a Catholique Arch-bishop ) nor shewing any authoritie , by which he could make an Arch-priest ouer all the English Priests residing in England ( and Scotland ) had litle reason to looke that the appointment of this authoritie by him , should be taken without mouing any question .

Fourthly , it was so straunge a thing , that one Priest should haue so ample an authoritie ouer all the rest of his fellow Priests , as they might iustly aske how it came to passe , and shew what inconuenience they knew was likely to ensue thereon .

Fiftly , the Cardinall being deligated to make this peace , was not to vse al means that he could , or shuld seeme conuenient vnto him , or best for his purpose ; but onely such as without which such a peace could not be wrought ; as the chiefest and perchance all writers vpon this matter doo generally affirme , and so interpret that which is said of a delegatiue authoritie , that it is stricti Iuris .

Sixtly it is euident , that those who were said to haue dealt with his holinesse about this matter , were not of the secular Priests in England , but Iesuites either professed , or vowed , or at least such as had giuen their names to be Iesuites ; for in this action F. Parsons was the principall , and M. F. Iones stand the instrument , who being in a secular Priests habit , deluded the Pope , and pleaded as sent by the Priests in England , or with their consent ; of which afterward being chalenged for his audacious attempt , he confessed before many Priests , he did but presume .

Seuenthly , the authoritie was meerly an afflictiue authoritie , to punish the Priestes without any power to repaire the harme it might do to them , and to punish them extreamely , as by taking away their faculties , and suspending them from the Altar ; by which offices they liue , and not by any benifices , which remaine to Priests in other Countries after such proceedings , and in the hardest dealing they haue somewhat allowed them for their maintenance ; and now least that some being thus debarred from vse of their function , should in respect of their preaching receiue some charitie from Catholiques , they are forbidden by the Arch-priest to preach .

The suggestions being made ( as appeareth by the Cardinalls Letters ) that a strife was betweene priests , and Catholiques ; this authoritie ouer the one part , onely seemed a very friuolous thing , for in the Cardinalls Letter , there is no authoritie giuen but ouer the Priests .

Ninthly , the Arch-priest by this authoritie giuen vnto him , might vnder a colour of hauing more good done else-where , remoue any Priest out of any house soeuer , and thereby endanger both the Priests by driuing them to such new acquaintance , as should be readie vpon euery surmise of trouble , turne them going to goe seeke aduentures ; and also the Catholiques , by thrusting vpon them as often as he list such as he had desire to preferre ; or to compell them to keepe no Priests in their houses .

Whereas the Arch-priest was appointed by the Cardinalls Letter to choose his assistants among the auncientest of those who had their abiding neare vnto him , where at that time he was to aduise with them in his proceedings ; he contrary to this , made his choise of such as might serue him in place rather of Promooters , or Informers , what was done in farre parts , then in place of Councellors , & were sildome or neuer made priuie to his actions .

In the choosing also of these his Councellors to assist him in this his gouernment , I am not heere to touch his partiallitie , further then this , as he said himselfe , the dislike in any man of any matter in the Iesuites , was a sufficient let for him to be a Councellor , or an assistant .

The controuersies which were in England , being betweene the Iesuites and the Priests , the Archpriest in his instructions annected to his commission , was willed to aduise with the superiour of the Iesuites , and to followe his counsell in this his gouernment of the Priests .

The Arch-priest had no authoritie at all ouer the Iesuites , betwixt whom and the Priests were all the controuersies which were in England , and therefore his authoritie was no fit meane to make a peace in England , where really there was need .

When the Arch-priest proposed or made knowne to the Priests what authoritie was giuen vnto him , he vsed so litle truth therein , as should an other propose the faith of Christ in that sort , and should bee hanged for his labour , he would prooue but a foolish Martyr ; and howsoeuer the matter is now slubbered ouer , it was at that time so manifest , as there was no shift for it , but open confession to M. Col. and M. Ch.

Either the Arch-priest himself did knowe what his authoritie was , or he did not . If he did not , what should the Priests doo in that case ? If hee did , the Priests had the greater reason to suspect euil dealing , by his affirming at the first , that he had such and such authoritie , and not long after denied it , and small ( God wot ) is the satisfaction which is giuen for this , that forsoothe he might say , that he had such authoritie , because he could write to those who had it .

M. Black . being subdeligated by the Cardinall , as it appeareth by the Cardinalls Letters , to make a peace where there was no warre ; if there had bene any need , should haue sought such meanes onely , as were necessary therefore , and not haue chalenged of the Priests an obedience in all things , which neuer any Prelate presumed to do : neither did he when he was tolde of his large demaund , amend the matter so well , as some do weene , in limiting his former speeches to obedience in all things , which might tend to peace : for as it is said before , such a delegatiue authoritie , as was giuen vnto him by the Cardinalls Letters , will allow him no more , then what is necessarie to effect that for which hee is deligated .

If it should be true which F. Parsons saith in the 17. Paragraffe , that M. Black . was touched in the very matter of his faith , and offereth to proue it by certaine depositions yet extant at Rome , that an hereticall proposition was laid to his charge , I doubt their foundation for their going to Rome will hardly bee shaken .

Diuers Priests not long before comming from Rome , did testifie that his holinesse would not constitute any authoritie without the assent of the Priests in England ; and the Priests were well assured , that they had not sent any as then to deale with his holinesse in their names , but what was done , was rather done by the open , and couert Iesuites , and afterward salued by M. F. Iames Stand ; that hee supposed the Priests would consent to that , which he would doo without their knowledge .

If the Cardinall had written nothing in particular concerning this authoritie , but what he had testified had bin the Popes direct order , yet all who write what credit the testimonie of a Cardinall beareth in matters preiudiciall to a third , affirme that it is not sufficient .

Before any Apostolicall Breue appeared for the confirmation of this authoritie , it was suspected that it was not the Popes order , yea and afterward prooued , if the Popes Commissary imployed by his holinesse at Rome in this matter be an honest man , for he told the two Priests who were sent to Rome seuerally in their persons from the Popes owne mouth , that his holinesse did not appoint it , and gaue this reason from his holinesse , because he would not aduenture to haue his authoritie contemned in England by the Priests .

To conclude , if before the Breue was made the authoritie might without offence haue bene said not to haue bene of the Popes appointing ; what offence was it not to accept of it ? If it were saide to be from the Pope , where were his Letters to testifie it ? without which men are not only not bounde to admit a farre lesse Prelacie ouer them , than this , but are sharply to be punished if they do admit it , & subiect themselues vnto it , as it appeareth in that extrauagant of Pope Boniface the 8. Iniunctae nobis de electione . And thus much for the challendge of their enterprise to be of contradiction without any foundation at all .

Let vs now returne to F. Parsons , who ( forgetting himselfe what hee had promised in the 5. Paragraffe , that was , not to let any thing which touched the Pope , to tunne with false and iniurious reports , against all truth and equitie , although content to pretermit what concerned himselfe ) plaieth the Proctor altogether for himselfe , to the little honour of the Popes holinesse . For in this paragraffe it is set downe , that after 17. dayes of the two Priestes persisting in their obstinacie ( which was no other then is shewed in the 9. paragraffe ) his holinesse willed them to be retired to some place of custodie in respect of their offence , and their allegations to be there examined , whether they were worth the handling or no. Which comming to F. Parson his knowledge , hee intreated that their retirement might rather be with secrecie in the English Colledge , then with more infamie in any other place . So that F. Parsons heere laieth to the Popes charge , that hee caused the two Priests first to be imprisoned for their offence , and afterward to haue it tried , whether they had committed any offence ; for if it had so fallen out , that their allegations had bene worth the handling , what offence had they committed in comming to Rome to deale with his holinesse about them ? But the Pope foresawe perchance ( as F. Parsons saith ) in the 8. paragraffe , that they were not worth the handling . Then was this no cause of their imprisonment , which F. Parsons alledged . But perchance it was no certaine foresight , such as F. Parsons noteth in the 8. paragraffe ; but only a suspition as he affirmeth in the 10. paragraffe . Then was this no iust cause to vse two Priests with infamy , who had many yeares aduentured their liues in defence of the Popes honour , and dignitie of the Sea Apostolicke . But afterward perchance it so fell out , that their allegations were founde not to be woorth the handling . Let vs suppose that which was not , that they were permitted to deale together or with other , and could bring nothing worth the handling . What then ? shall we to saue the Pope from false and iniurious reports ( as F. Parsons pretendeth ) say , that the Pope was ignorant of this saying , hee who loueth daunger shall perish in it ; and like sychophants affirme , that his holinesse may do what he will before he see or know any cause why hee should doo it , and really defame them against whom he hath nothing , but an imagination , that it might be they deserued it ? had they bene imprisoned vpon colour of somewhat to be laide against them , somewhat in this kind might haue bin iustified ; but comming as plaintiffes , supplicants , or appellants , they were to be heard , or at least to be suffered to deale together in their businesse ; and for F. Parsons to pretend that two Priests comming to his Holinesse ( as in dutie they were bound to do in any difficulties of the Church ) were cast with infamy into prison , before they were heard what they had to say , & that they should haue bene cast in prison with more infamie ( had not F. Parsons intreated for them ) is not to pretermit that which concerneth himselfe , and to stop iniurious reports gainst the Pope ( as he pretendeth in the 5. paragraffe ) but to heape false and iniurious reports against the Pope , and to fall into most absurd praise of himselfe . And if F. Parsons did tell them , what benifites he bestowed vpon them , when they were with him , I dare presume that they would not be so vngratefull as not to giue him thankes for them , although perchance not so greatly from their hearts , as if he had let them alone . Before they departed out of England , or were knowne who they were that should goe , the speech was rife in some mens mouthes , that they should be cast in prison when they came to Rome ; so that F. Parsons wit was not so highly to be commended , in that he could foresee , what thankes he was like to haue . First for their imprisonment in the Colledge . Secondly , for giuing them the best Chambers in the house with such conditions . Thirdly , cherishing them gratis ( that is , at the charge of the Colledge ) . Fourthly , visiting them often ( especially at the first , for he must needs be the Commissioner to examine them ) . Fiftly , making them good new gownes for the winter , ( no doubt better then they had any , who had none at all ) and with as much speed as after long seeking for cloath for the purpose they could be made , and they were not ordinary good gownes for the winter , for as they were not too hotte for the sommer , so they were not too heauie for the winter : and as I make no question , but that he deserued thankes for his good will in this , so I doubt not , but that they gaue him thankes for them . Sixtly , giuing them a Father to be a Notary gratis ( for nought ) who at the Commissary his appointment ( that was F. Parsons ) might write what he would haue written , and blotte out what he would haue blotted , if it did not fadge to his minde . Seuenthly , procuring the Iudge to come to the Colledge , &c. Which , if F. Parsons did examine them himselfe , possibly was very sildome , and that only for a fashion . If F. Parsons 1. were apprehended by the means & assistants of his aduersaries , 2. caried to their owne house , 3. locked vp , and kept sure inough from speaking with any body but at their discretion , 4. examined by them , & his examination also taken as it should please them . A good new chamber , a good new sommer gowne for the winter , a gratis cherishing , the sauing of him from spending his money and taking many iournies about the streets , could not ( as I suppose ) so dull these his aduersaries wits , but that they might easily foresee , how many more thanks they were like to haue for their labour , after that they had once made a friendly parting . Perchance F. Parsons expected such an after applause as some Priests did make in England for their superiour , who had authoritie to chastise them onely , and at his pleasure , in most grieuous sort .

The 11. Paragraffe asketh a long discourse ; I will heere onely touch it as briefly as I can , and the matter will suffer me to passe it ouer .

First they were kept from Pen , and Inke , from the 29. of December , vntill the 17. of Februarie following , although they had often requested it . Secondly , they might haue said what they would at any time , as well as at their examination , for their tongus were at libertie inough , had time and place bene conuenient for it ; which F. Parsons was often told , when hee tooke vpon him to be a stickler in the matter , and would know what they could say ; and if that they were willed vpon their oathes to speake and answere to such questions as might be asked , it doth not therfore follow , that they did say all that they could , either because they were perchance released of their oath ( taken by the Commissary appointed by his holinesse ) vpon some consideration , for example , that they did accept of F. Parsons to be their examiner , who thrust himselfe into that office , and was suspected that he would abuse it , as in truth he did ; or else because they perceiued that all was not written which they said , nor that which was so written , so faithfully written , as they deliuered it , a Iesuite being the examiner ( who was a partie ) and giuing them an other Iesuit to be the Notarie , as F. Parsons confesseth in the 10. Paragraffe ; which being all the company which were present , might and did deale , as pleased them ; not onely with the two Priests , whose Iaylors they were , but with their examinations also , which they tooke . 3. They might also sweare that they had no more to say of moment in all matters handled ; not because they could say no more , but because they sawe that they might hurt themselues ( being at their aduersaries deuotions ) but were not likely to do any good in the cause which they had to handle . 4. They might sweare they had nothing to say , because neither of them had any commission , or was sent to deale in any thing seuerally , but ioyntly , and each with others helpe , which they could not doo ( beeing kept close prisoners , and so as one might not come to the other ) . If the Iudge of whom F. Parsons speaketh ( who was no other then the Fiscall or Commissarie afore mentioned ) and the two Cardinalls came to the Colledge one day to examine them , ( as F. Parsons heere saith ) to the end , that they might be sure of all , and satisfie both themselues and the two Priests , they might haue done well to haue examined them , which they did not , but onely heard first some part of M. Bish. his examination ; who presently after without any question asked him ( more then whether he would adde any thing to his examination ) was shut vp as before . Then M. Ch. was called for , and some part of his examination read , after which being licensed to speake , he vsed some words to the so great liking of the two Cardinalls , that had it not bene for company-sake , he had bene set at libertie the same day ( as both M. Bish. and hee were told by the Iesuites afterward ) for as they pretended , the Cardinalls did not take well M. Bish. his answere , that he had nothing to say , when he was licensed after his examination was read , and therefore commaunded him to close prison , and M. Ch. also for company ; and they thought that they did not M. Ch. any iniury by making him a close prisoner againe , because M. Bish. his silence displeased them once , and his earnestnesse at an other time . After that F. Parsons and F. Titch . a couple of Iesuites , the one the Examiner , the other the Notarie , & were all the company that was present at this arraignment with the two Cardinalls , except M. Acrysio ( who came thither as if he had before supplied the place of an Examiner ) had read what they thought good , and M. Ch. dismissed for a time into an outer-chamber , where the Cardinalls Retinew was , and some Iesuites was . F. Parsons called at the doore to F. Owin a Iesuite ( who during this time was vice-iaylor in F. Parsons place ) to bring forth M. Bish. and M. Ch. together , and the Proctors for the Arch-priest . F. Owin fetched M. Bish. to M. Ch. who had not met for the space of seuen weekes ( in which time they had bene kept close prisoners ) and after they had imbraced each other , they went in together before the Cardinalls , with M. Doctor Haddocke , & M. Martin Array . The two Proctors who ( after notice giuen vnto the Cardinalls by F. Parsons what they were , as though the Cardinalls had knowne neither the men , nor the office they then had ) at their Qu. ( as it should seeme ) deliuered vp in a dumbe shewe , a Libell or Bill of complaints and accusations , against M. Bish. and M. Ch. without any words ( whatsoeuer M. Martin Array saith , or F. Parsons vnder M. Martins name in his Letters , dated the 20. of February , 1599. ) stuffed too shamefully with vntruthes . Among which , rehearsall is made of many speeches , which are said to haue bene vttered by M. Martin and his fellow Proctor before they exhibited their libel , as ( to vse their own words ) being bidden to speak as Proctors , whereas in truth neither of them spake any one word good or bad , either of themselues , or as bidden by any other . The libel being read by F. Titch . the Iesuite , M. Bish. was very earnest to haue the Proctors put to their oathes , that no falshood was conteined in the Libell , to which the Cardinall Caietan made answere that they were not to sweare , but to prooue what should be denied ; then was the whole Libell denied , and a copie thereof demaunded , that answer might be made vnto it ; but when the Proctors sawe the resolution of the two Priests , they humbly desired with knee on ground , that no copie should be deliuered , but that all things should be shut vp in peace ; to which the Cardinal Caietan made answere , that it was peace , which the two Priests sought for , and presently the two Proctors hauing readily what , and against whom to obiect , wrangled a little with the two Priests , and particularly M. Martin Array vrged against M. Ch. that , and no other thing , namely that they intended to haue the Protector chaunged , which in the aforesaid Letter of the 20. of February , hee ( or F. Parsons rather vnder his name ) affirmeth , that because the Cardinall was present and satte as Iudge , they would not vrge for verie shame of their English ingratitude . After this litle wrangling conference the Proctors were dismissed , and the two Cardinalls calling M. Bish. and M. Ch. nearer vnto them , declared that they found no cause against them , only this they thought in their conscience , that these two Priests had vnaduisedly taken this iourney , because thereby they had scandalized many in England ; to which the Priests made this answere , that if they had giuen any scandall they were sorrie , & readie to giue satisfaction , which M. Martin in the aforesaid Letters doth confirme , but that he putteth it in a wrong place , for he putteth it , as if it had bene said by the Embassadors ( as he termeth them ) after they had heard his , and his fellowes falsly vaunted of obiections before they gaue vp the Libell , and the Libell it selfe , which was read against them , against which , saith M. Martin , or F. Parsons vnder his name , ( among other his most shamelesse vntruthes ) they were able to say litle , and willing to say lesse , but asked pardon if they had giuen scandall , &c. If these men could haue perswaded themselues that neither M. D. Bish. nor M. Ch. should euer haue seene these Letters , or haue come to controll these shamelesse vntruthes , and wicked detractious speeches , where they were so boldly spread abroad , yet had they remembred there had bene a God , they would haue had some feare , if no reuerence vnto him , but these be those of brasse , who put themselues forth as a wall for the house of the Lorde ( of a flie ) and would be accounted constant , and pious , yea and friendly ( as F. Parsons vrgeth in the 18. paragraffe ) towards these two Priests . Within lesse then a weeke after this arraignment , Maister Ch. was brought to M. D. Bish. his Chamber , where after they had imbraced each other , they were carried each betweene a couple of Iesuites among all the students , as a beginning of their libertie , ( no other cause being pretended of M. D. Bish. his longer imprisonment , then that he had to the Cardinalls discontentment vsed silence , when he was licensed to speake if he would after his examination was redde , and vsed more courage ( when he had heard the Libell redde ) then was thought conuenient by them ; and no other cause was giuen of M. Ch. his longer imprisonment , but that he should be punished for 3. or 4. dayes for companie , after which they should be both set at libertie and permitted to deale in their businesse ( for which they went to Rome . ) So that F. Parsons might haue deuised some other conceit for the auouching of the long stay before the sentence was giuen ( which came before it was looked for , and yet it was 9. weeks in comming ) then that the two Cardinalls should staie diuers weekes to enforme his holinesse , before they gaue sentence in their cause . For first they gaue sentence when they were present , in so much as both the two Priests , and the students also in the Colledge vpon the Iesuites their owne reports expected , that they should be verie shortly set at libertie . Secondly , it is vnlikely that the two Cardinalls should diuers weekes be debarred the Popes presence , or denied audience , or haue any great doubts in such a case , as when they heard what was to be said against the two Priests , they iudged , that they found no other cause in them then is aforesaid . And if the Cardinalls had bene so little gratious in the Popes sight , as in diuers weekes they could not haue audience , this matter being of no more importance then the Iudges ( the one a Diuine , the other a Lawier ) , after conference vpon the examinations read before them , and the offer made by the two Priests to answere to what was libelled against them , declared it to be , a more milde restraint then close imprisonment for other 7. weeks would haue bene no euil edification to such , as expected that no more rigor than needs must , should haue bene vsed at Rome , against a couple of Priests , who had many yeares aduentured their liues for the honour of the Church of Rome , and dignitie of the Sea Apostolicke .

Fa. Parsons hauing in the 11. paragraffe shewed to what end the Cardinalls did come to the Colledge , but not what was there done , nor what sentence was either then , or afterward giuen by them , expostulateth how with any colour it might be saide , that the two Priests had wrong , &c. Could hee forget that they were imprisoned with infamie before it was knowne whether they brought any thing worth the handling or no , which himselfe confessed in the 10. paragraffe ? Did not he as a most vigilent Iaylor , keep the keyes himselfe , that they should not come together , or vse any meanes to deale in the businesse , in which they were ioyntly imployed ? Can hee be ignorant that when the two Proctors libelled against them , they were so farre from being vnwilling to answere the Libell , as their exceeding forwardnesse in this was pretended a sufficient cause to keepe the one in close prison , at the least for a fewe dayes , and the other because he was his fellow in this action ? Was his memory so short , as he could not remember how that the Cardinall Caietan in his hearing ( at their arraignment ) cleared them from all things , except only , that they had offended some by this their iournie ; for satisfaction whereof , they were willed to write into England , which they performed to his present great liking , although afterward he wrangled with them about the same Letters ? Can F. Parsons say , that euer they were brought to any answere afterward , although many things were attempted , and obiected priuately by himselfe against them , and hee willed by them to take what course he would , when he pretended matters against them from England , whether the Cardinall Caietan had sent the 10. of Nouember before from Rome ( in the Popes name as he pretended , who was then at Ferrara ) for informations of their liues and behauiours , who did not accept they knew not of what authoritie , and how lawfully it was sent , and set ouer them , more then what he witnessed himselfe , a testimonie not binding any to giue credit in so waightie a matter , and to the preiudise of so many , as sufficient proofe will be made ? Or could F. Parsons pretending to be a religious man , and of the societie of Iesus ( that is , of a societie instituted in the honour of the name of Iesus ) make so sleight a matter of a sentence of banishment , and of the confinement of a couple of Catholique Priests , who had a long time laboured with perill of life , in defence of the Catholique Church , and one of them suffered imprisonment for the same , without any prouision made for them , or suffering them to be in one Region together , which had bene one point of humanitie for mutuall comfort in this extremitie , vnlesse perchance hee will say that hee is deuoted onely to the name of Iesus , and not to trouble himselfe to immitate any thing in the person ? If F. Parsons had not sent word into England , that the Priests should continue vnder this sentence for three yeares , which was more then the two Priests themselues knew , or was conteined in any sentence that euer they heard , he might haue excused himselfe in part , and not haue bene thought the sole plotter of this dealing : and if others hearing of these proceedings ( and many more which for breuitie are heere omitted ) haue said , that the two Priests had wrong , and had lesse Iustice in Rome then is permitted to Turkes and Iewes , they cannot let them to thinke , speake , or write what they iudge best .

Many things doth F. Parsons heape together in this 12. Paragraffe ; as first , that the Cardinalls were ashamed to finde the two Priests to haue come so long a iourney with so litle to say . Secondly , that they brought not so much as any one Letter of credence from any Communitie , or priuate person in such forme , as might giue credit . Thirdly , that euen the secret memorialls of their most secret businesse were seene , & found to haue bin of no more waight then the rest . Fourthly , that they should keepe their chiefe message to themselues . Fiftly , that they said their fill of the Arch-priest , and Iesuites , and were willed vpon their oathes to say more . Sixtly , that the Priests were fewe who sent them , and that F. Parsons had shewed them wel-neare 20. times as many of the same order against them .

To the first it is well knowne , they had many things to deale in of more importance then are as yet graunted , as the procuring of ordinary Pastors in Gods Church , or at the leastwise , authoritie for the administration of the Sacrament of confirmation ( most necessarie in time of persecution , or altogether vaine , and as a superfluous ceremonie in Gods Church ) 2. The procuring some meanes for the holy oyles , which vsed to come very late to their hands . 3. For the acquietting of such stirres as were then begunne , and were likely ( as the euent proueth ) to growe daily to the vndoing of our Countrey , and such like . And if F. Parsons had thought what would haue followed in the 17. Paragraffe , he would ( as I thinke , vnlesse he were exceedingly shamelesse ) haue had more regard what words he had vsed in this 12. Paragraffe ; for if that be true , which he there relateth to haue bene deposed at Rome , the Cardinall and hee had more reason to be ashamed of that which was brought against the Arch-priest , a creature of their owne , then that the two Priests had litle to say .

But if F. Parsons should be demaunded where this shame came vpon the two Cardinalls , or how they came to haue that conceit , that the two Priests had come so long a iourney with litle to say ; would he trowe you without blushing make an answere ? The first time that the two Priests sawe the Cardinall Burghese , and at his importunate request , imparted to him some part of their businesse , they found him so fauourable vnto them , that according to their humble sute , hee promised that he would procure them audience , before they should be iudged , and further them what he could . The first time likewise that they sawe the Cardinall Caietan , although he vsed them in very rough tearmes , hee willed them to bring in writing vnto him , what they had to say , and tolde them , that he would thereon consider . And at these meetings could neither of the Cardinals be ashamed of that , which the Priests had to say , for neither of them knew but in generall termes some part of their businesse , and appointed therevpon a farther conference . The second time that these two Priests sawe these two Cardinalls , was at their arraignment , where the Cardinals might perchance be ashamed of the insolencie of their aduersaries , but could not be ashamed that the two Priests had litle to say ; for when they were both together , and might haue dealt in their businesse ( although with this shamefull disaduantage , that they had all their writings taken from them seuen weekes before , and all that while kept close prisoners , that they might not speake either each with other , or any body else ( as they did both desire ) to aske some counsel being thus betraied ) they dealt as farre forth as was conuenient for them to deale , that is to say , for so much as they were at that time vrged to deale in , which was vpon occasion of a Libell put vp against them by M. Doctor Haddocke , and M. Martin Array , a couple of Proctors for the Arch-priest : for when this Libell was read , they offered to make their answere vnto it , and for that end they demaunded a copie thereof , which at Doctor Haddocks earnest request , ( who Proctorlike before had put it vp against them ) was not giuen vnto them ; so that at this time the Cardinals had more cause to be ashamed of the two Proctors then of the two Priests , who were arraigned , and by all likelihood were so , for they dismissed the two Proctors , and afterward acquiting the two Priests from all matters except one , that was , that by their going to Rome many Priests and Lay-men in England were scandalized , they dismissed them also in verie friendly manner , and no case was alledged of their farther imprisonment , but an ouer-great forwardnes in the one against the Libell , which is an argument that the two Priests had somewhat to say , which the Cardinalls not being ouer-forward to heare ( as it should seeme by their not deliuering the Libell to the two Priests when they called for it ) could not in reason be said to be ashamed that the Priests had litle to say . The third time , that these two Priestes did see the Cardinalls , was when they went ( as they were set at libertie ) first the one , then the other to take their leaues , and so to depart to the place of their confinement , at which time also the Cardinalls might perchance make some reflection , but not vpon a thing worthie of shame in the two Priests , who during the time that they might deale , alwaies offered themselues , and performed as much as laie in them , and when they could not deale therein ( being ioyned so as the one without the other had not to attempt any thing ) they patiently suffered first close imprisonment for 14. weekes with the appurtenances , afterward a moneths easier imprisonment , and lastly , a sending seuerally one after another into banishment , yea & to be confined each to one Country , & thereby to be banished not only out of England their natiue Countrey , but also out of all Countries in the world but one , vpon a supposall that they had maintained controuersies in one : and thus I leaue this point to any indifferent man to iudge , what cause the Cardinals had to be ashamed , ( if they were ashamed , as F. Parsons here noteth ) and whether F. Parsons ( who was present at the arraingment , and sawe the forwardnesse of the two Priests to make their answere to what was obiected against them ) were hee as he would be thought , could without shame insert this clause in his Letter to the two Priests , who were then arraigned . And howsoeuer he might forget any other matter , must needs remember , that they demaunded the Libell to make their answere to it , because the courage of the one in this very action was pretended by the Iesuites , to haue bin the cause why they were not the same night set at libertie , because forsooth this was an argument to the Cardinals that he was of a stirring spirit , and therefore they would for 2. or 3. dayes longer keepe them both in prison .

To the second , they brought many Letters , from many , as F. Parsons and the Proctors in their moodes will confesse , although not from any setled communitie vnder any head , for from this the Priests refrained vntill they had sent vnto his holinesse , which whilest they were effecting by common suffradge ( as became Priests ) a head was most fraudulently by the Iesuites procured to curbe them , and crosse them in their courses , which they had intended . And if F. Parsons had remembred , that not long after in the 21. paragraffe he telleth them , that they brought certain notes about their message from a principall man of theyr side of his owne hande writing , yet there to bee seene , whatsoeuer hee had written heere of a communitie , hee would not haue saide that they brought no letters of credence from any priuate person ; but F. Parsons would perchance giue men to vnderstand , that the petitions of Priests subscribed with their owne hands , were not of so great credence as a brazen face of a Iesuite ( who before his holines pretended that he was a secular Priest , and sent by them in their businesse ) beeing seconded with as false a friend to the Priests as F. Parsons himselfe a Iesuite in his owne likenesse .

To the third , if there were secret memorialls of most secret businesse , how was all saide by the two Priests that they could say ? How can these memorialls be termed by F. Parsons to be secret , if nothing were concealed which was contained in them ? and for their weight , if F. Parsons say true in the 17. paragraffe , they had no need to be of greater weight then the rest , for F. Parsons there confesseth that the Archpriest was touched , yea in the verie matter of his faith , for that an hereticall proposition was laide to his charge , as appeareth by their papers , and depositions yet extant , which would hardly be excused , if such a thing should be prooued against one , who to giue him what F. Parsons giueth him ( no doubt great commendations ) is a man of those parts , and merits , that all English men doo know , or at the least might imagine so long as he did not shew himselfe .

To the fourth , I know not what was their chiefe message , nor where they had any conuenient time or place to vtter it , or any other , being clapped vp close prisoners before they came to doo any thing , and neuer after suffered to be together at libertie in Rome .

To the fift , a reason is giuen before , why it was no wisedome for them to say their fill , either of the one , or the other , being in custodie of the one , who was the more carefull of his charge in respect of the other . Yet if F. Parsons be not ouer forgetfull , he may call to mind that about a moneth after their arraignment , vpon some occasion of speech betweene M. Ch. and him , M. Ch. told him of some matters , which F. Parsons pretended hee had not heard before , and seemed to be astonished at them , wherby at the least this may be gathered , that F. Parsons very rashly affirmeth that they had said their fill at any time .

To the sixt , ( to omit what meanes and threats the Iesuites , and the Arch-priest did vse himselfe to be accepted for their superiour ) they could not expect to carry many Priests handes in testimonie of their minds , ( who foresawe what would come of this authoritie procured by the Iesuites for their better oppressing of the Priestes ) least their staie should be threatned downe vppon his holinesse ( by such as would let slip no opportunitie ) to be a generall acceptance thereof . The authoritie being sent into England ( as the Priests were enformed ) to be first liked , before it should be confirmed vpon them .

In the 13. Paragraffe there is too much want shewed both of wit , and memorie , modestie , and honestie . Fa. Parsons would know first how it could be said vpon a litle part or faction ( as he termeth it ) that Catholiques are intollerably afflicted , beeing persecuted at home , & cannot be heard abroad . Secondly , he asketh who are those Catholiques . Thirdly , he boldly demaundeth , what audience is denied to them ; as who would say , no audience was denied to them . Fourthly , he would insinuate that the Priests , who hold with the Iesuits and Arch-priest , are more persecuted , and hated by the Councell of England , then the other Priests . Fiftly , he excuseth the Pope for not giuing audience to the two Priests .

To the first , it is answered , first that a litle part of Catholiques may be called Catholiques ; secondly , that all Catholiques are intollerably afflicted at home , and cannot be heard abroad , while they make sute as they are bound to doo for such things , as are most necessarie for Christians liuing in persecution , and are wanting , in England and cannot be obteined , as the Sacrament of confirmation , of which F. Parsons could not be ignorant , when he writ these Letters , nor long before hauing viewed , and reviewed the petitions of the Priests , which those two carried with them to Rome . Also the vnion of all Priests together ; which ( as it should seeme by that which hath followed Fa. Parsons courses ) was but slubbered ouer for a small time by him , and his fellowes , or adherents who quickly after both by writing , and tongue detraction began to refresh the former wound .

To his second demaund if he should be satisfied , and the Catholiques named , the satisfaction would be as foolishly giuen , as the question was asked : hee might with much lesse daunger to Catholiques say , who they were not ; for I do suppose , that either there are none so carelesse of their owne good , or their friends , but they desired what is before mentioned should haue bene demaunded , and is not graunted , or at the least none so shamelesse , as they would discouer so great a carelesnesse in themselues of matters of so great weight .

To the third , this answere may bee made , that doubtlesse he tooke a vizard when he writ it : what audience saith F. Parsons is there denied them ? were they not with infamie cast into prison before it was knowne , whether they brought any thing worth the handling , as is shewed out of the 10. Paragraffe ? And doth not F. Parsons in this same 13. Paragraffe confesse , that they were not heard by his holinesse , to whom they went for audience ? how could he within so fewe lines forget himselfe ?

To the fourth it may be truly answered , that among the Priests who haue bene put to death the least part ( if any at all ) haue bene for the Iesuites , or Arch-priest . And if any difference hath bene made in their persecutions , it hath bene in shewing extraordinary fauour to the Iesuites , and their adherents , as will be prooued by their vsage of F. Heywood , M. Martin Array , and such like . But if it could be proued , that the Iesuites , the Arch-priest , and such other Priests as are knowne to be guided by them were more persecuted , yea and hated by the Councell of England , then the other Priests , who are not guided by the Iesuites , perchance this reason might be giuen thereof , that the Councell haue found by the Iesuites Letters , which they haue often intercepted , as also by some bookes of theirs , that they came not so much into England to set forward Religion , as they would be thought to do , and as the other Priests only attend vnto , but to further a state faction , and to deale therein more then becommeth religious men to doo .

It is a world to see how he busieth himselfe in this kinde , if the Priests embrace his plottes for the forraigne inuasion or ciuil wars in our owne Countrie , they are subiect to most grieuous death due to traytors ; if they do not , the fauour which they may finde at their better enformed aduersaries hands , must bee their perpetuall ignominie . Yet doth F. Parsons encline rather to include all the Priests within the statutes of high treason , and to this end this ground is laid . All that do not like his proceedings or his treatises of matters of state , do meddle more in matters of state , then he or any other : and that this is no consequence made of any his words , or writings , but his very ground , his Letters written or dictated to M. Martin Array , of the 18. of Ianuary doth euidently prooue , where he followeth his owne conceit , in deducting one proposition from an other vntil a primo ad vltimum hee maketh this argument . The two Priests were to make a Petition , that all books should be forbidden , which did without need or profit exasperate the state of England , Ergo they medled in matters of state more , and offended now the present state , then by any other way that is yet knowne ; and that no man haue hereof any doubt , I haue set down the postscript , word for word as it is in the aforesaid Letter concerning this point .

I had almost omitted one particular , which shall not be euill for you to know , and that is that among other points of Commission deliuered in writing to these two Embassadors , one principall was noted in all their latter Letters , that no bookes should bee admitted that offended the present state of England in matters of state , or exasperate the aduersaries ; wherevpon they being examined what bookes or booke they meant in particular , said it was the booke of succession . And being demaunded farther whether any particular persecution had bene mooued hithervnto by that booke , or any man put to death for hauing it in this three or foure yeares since it was written , they said that they knew of none . Then was it asked them why there was more grudging then , and complaint against this booke that had mooued no persecution , then against D. Sanders Monarchia , and booke de Schismate , & D. Bristowes Motiues , for which diuers in particular haue bene put to death ; as also against D. Allen late Cardinall , his booke Contra iustitiam Britanicam , D. Stapleton his Dydimus , M. Reynolds against Whitakers , & such others , who are much more earnest against the present state , then this other booke of succession , which speaketh so mildely and indifferently as he can iustly offend no parte . And how our spirituall maisters being not able to answer , discouered themselues , and their fellowes vnder pretence of spirit , and religion , to be Scotists in faction , without any respect of religion at all there , but being to set vp a knowne hereticke , and therby also to meddle more in matters of state , and to offend now the present state , then by any other way that is yet knowen . So as in this they haue neither reason , religion , nor state with them , but only aemulation , follie , and faction , &c. Thus much verbatim out of the aforesaid Letter of the 18. of Ianuary . 1599.

Wit whither wilt thou ? Are not these fellows desirous of this kinde of sport , who rather then they wil faile of their designes , sticke not to accuse innocent men of medling in matters of state , and setting vp a King in England , the verie talke whereof is a thing most hatefull , and daungerous there , and to bring them into no lesse daunger , and hatred in Rome , they amplifie the matter with this Epitheton ; a knowne hereticke . And vpon what ground say they this ? forsooth because their spirituall maisters ( as they scoffingly tearme the two Priests ) being asked why the booke of succession was more disliked then any other named vnto them , were not able to answere . Ergo , conclude these fellowes , they discouered themselues and their fellowes to be Scotists in faction . How followeth this vpon the antecedent ? how would these simple Statists haue sported themselues , if any their discourses or traines could haue taken the least hold vpon either of the two Priests ? how much more to purpose might this conclusion be deduced out of this postscript , that F. Parsons dooth but cogge with the King of Scotland in his flattering Letters to some of his Nobilitie , or that there is litle constancie in him and his followers toward any , longer then they thinke it may make for their aduantage without any due regard to conscience , right , truth , reason , or religion in their dealings ? hauing chopped and chaunged the Crowne of England 8. or 9. seuerall times , to seuerall persons , as it pleased him and his to play with it , and as little boyes sport themselues with King by your leaue , now the great ones euery hand-while do crie , A new King , a new , such an one , as ( if F. Parsons his word be of any credit ) hee shall thinke to be the most likely to carry it from the rest , which might be thought to haue bene spoken in iest , had not some of his fellowes practised the same in France , who while the king who now is , was in daunger of being debarred that kingdome , were most earnest against him , and stood most stoutly for other who were likely to haue it , but when they sawe him brought into Paris , they were the first religious that went to congratulate him , although not long after there were such proofes against them , that one was publikely executed for treason against his Ma. person , & the rest banished those parts of France . And here also it appeareth howe greatly they wanted matter against the two Priests , that to prooue them to meddle more in matters of state , and to offend now the present state , then by any other way that was then knowne , they are driuen to so miserable a refuge , as to say that one principall point of Commission deliuered in writing to the two Embassadors ( as they terme them ) was , that no bookes should be admitted that offended the present state of England in matters of state , or exasperate the aduersaries , Ergo they medled in matters of state ; but to omit their not ouerwise illations , there is no truth in their relation . For when they were asked by F. Parsons what bookes were ment in particular , they said that they ment all such , as their petition did include , and being intreated by F. Parsons in particular to say whether the booke of succession were not ment for one , answere was made that it was one , which did much offend , and to the reply which was foolishly made , why that booke should offend more then other , which are named in this postscript ; they answered to F. Parsons , that they named this no more than any other , as appeared by their petition , although iust exception might be taken more against this , then any other , because it did conuince that thing to be true , which our aduersaries alwaies obiected against Priests , that was , that they dealt in state matters , and that the Councell being so well assured thereof , and able to giue so good a satisfaction for their proceedings , might afflict Catholickes more then euer they did , although they did not descend to this particular cause thereof , or proofe against them , the Spaniards hauing often attempted by warres to inuade our Country , to which this booke doth intitle them . In this I am somewhat longer then I entended , because I would note what libertie F. Parsons , and his followers do vse in their pennes , who being to this effect answered to those questions in the postscript , scornfully , and contrary to their own knowledge affirme , that their spiritual maisters ( so terming the 2. Priests ) were not able to make any answer to their profound questions , and conclude most absurdly therevpon , that the two Priests discouered themselues to deale more in matters of state , and offend the present state , then by any other way that was yet knowne .

If some Iesuites exhorting their hearers to abstaine from sinne , or more particularly from all sinful dissimulation , & falshood , as a thing hatefull to God , hurtfull to their soules , and a mortall enemie to all humane fellowship , should be asked whether they ment such a sinne , or such a dissimulation in particular , and after answere made , that they ment that and all the like , should be vrged why that more then the like , and were not able to giue a reason thereof ; how would it followe that these spirituall maisters were hipocrites , which is to vse dissimulation in the highest degree ? or to be the notablest dissembling companions that euer were knowne ? Could the Iesuites trow you admit this consequence as true , although they should know in their conscience that the consequent were most true ? Thus & no otherwise play these pious , and constant champions against the two Priests , and as the spirit moueth them , sometime the Embassadours , sometime their spirituall maisters being to make petition that no bookes should be admitted that offended the present state in matters of state , or exasperate the aduersaries , and not able to answer why this booke should be more blamed then any other ( as they say , although most falsely and impertinently to their petition ) prooue Statists ( Scotists in faction as they tearme them ) and readie to set vp a knowne Hereticke , and to meddle more in matters of state , then euer any was knowne to do . Would any Scotist or Sotist haue made such a reason ? it would best fit a Sottist that neither cared what Scotus said , or Sotus , but runne vpon omne vtile honestum , that which may make for our purpose , be it what it will be , that is pietie , that is constancie , that is state , and religion also . And thus much for the 4. point , touched in the 13. Paragraffe .

To the fift it may be answered , that the message of the two Priests being about other matters then the Iesuites quarels at Rome with the Students , F. Parsons might haue made some better excuse for the Pope his honor , which he vndertook in the fift Paragraffe to defend ; and also haue somewhat remembred , how boldly he had in this same Paragraffe demaunded what audience was denied them . But ouer shooes ouer bootes .

In the 14. Paragraffe he beginneth as he saith , to make his owne defence , in which he speaketh for himselfe , and in commendation of his owne good nature , and for proofe of his good carriage towards the two Priests , he referreth them to that , which before he had said ; which I know not whether it argue folly , or forgetfulnesse , or both . One good deed here he doth name , concerning a lapsed priest , which being penitent for his fault , went to Rome to the Inquisition , which you shall seldome heare by any Iesuite , when he hath forsaken the Catholique faith ; of which if a man might without offence make a coniecture , hee might thinke , that the Iesuites their fall ( without some speciall miracle ) is incurable , as many examples may be giuen of some in England , some in Geneua , some in other places , and they growe to be the most notorious companions that liue ; but for the Priests who are much talked of , if any of them do faile heere in England , for the most part , they haue had alwaies remorse of conscience after the first heat , and so haue liued vntil they could finde some opportunity to rise againe ; and some of them hauing failed perchance in respect of discontentment vpon the hard dealing of the Iesuites , or their adherents ( who vnder one pretence or other doo vse to trie whether the Priests be confirmed in grace ) haue spent their speeches against them , happily not without cause , which is no proofe for the Iesuites goodnesse more , then it were an argument for the goodnesse of the diuell , that many yea wicked people raile against him ; but for that man in particular , I thinke F. Parsons cannot charge him , that euer he did any harme to any Iesuite , but to the secular Priests he did very much , which could not stand with any good liking vnto them , and if herevpon a Parenthesis should be made as impertinently as F. Parsons maketh his ( that falling from God and dislike of the secular Priests , or rayling against them , commonly go together ) the Iesuites and their adherents would think that they were greatly iniuried , who for a shewe onely , & for the better effecting of that , which they intend , seeme to beare good will to such secular Priests , as will be guided by them , and by now and then shewing themselues friendly in some small matters to some , practise more boldly against the same parties , or other their fellowes .

In the 15. Paragraffe he confesseth his folly , hee might haue descended to somewhat more in particular then folly , for hee adioyneth a shamelesse vntruth , that the two Priests went to Rome in defence of the former troubles that were there . But it should seeme by F. Parsons in this , and in the 13. Paragraffe , that he would faine possesse people with this wrong information ; and for his question , which here he asketh , in what case our common cause of England had bene , if the endeuours of the two Priests had taken place , I may boldly make this answere , that doubtlesse it could not haue bin in a worse case then now it is .

In the 16. Paragraffe , I can say little more then aske these questions , what if the Commissarie of the Inquisition did not tell any honourable man of Rome a great friend of F. Parsons any such thing as he here relateth ? and what harme could the common cause haue taken among wise men , if the two Priests had bene let alone by his holinesse to deale with all the Cardinalls , and great men of Rome , being but a couple of Priests , and more easily borne downe , when it should haue bene euident , that they had nothing to say , as F. Parsons would haue all men beleeue ? Was the Commissarie of the Inquisition and all the Cardinalls , and great men of Rome so sottish in F. Parsons conceit , as they would haue embraced so slender a cause , as he would shewe this to be ?

In the 17. Paragraffe many things are touched : first , an haeretical proposition is said to haue bin deposed against M. Blackwell , which if it bee true , how is it said in the 8. Paragraffe , that the Pope foresaw that they did not expect any matter of substance against his gouernment . Of what substance against a mans gouernment in an heretical country such a deposition is , any Catholique will easily see , & ought to reflect the more vpon it , if it were in matters directly concerning his gouernment . And how in the 10. Paragraffe can F. Parsons say that they had made a contradiction without any foundation at all , which the Cardinalls should at first suspect , and after finde it to be true , and also be ashamed that the two Priests came so long a iourney with so litle to say , as he affirmeth in the 12. Paragraffe ? Secondly , F. Parsons affirmeth also , that the two Priestes would haue discredited such English Priests , as stood with the Arch-priest , and were the principall of their coat , but in what it is not said , perchance it is meant , in that these two and other in not accepting of an authoritie , pretended to come from the Pope without the Popes Letters , or other sufficient testimonie , might argue the other of an ouer-great forwardnesse , in that they did without more examining of the matter , yeeld vnto it ; but how the Iesuites are drawne hereby in discredit , I conceiue not , vnlesse perchance this authority being procured by the Iesuites , it might be thought a disgrace vnto them , that ( being aduersaries to the secular Priests ) they might not be trusted to choose a superiour for them , who should bee an Arbiter betwixt them ; which constuction I am induced to make , both vpon the manner of F. Parsons bringing in the Iesuites with those Priests , whom hee saith the two that went to Rome tooke the way to discredit , and also vpon that which followeth in this same 17. paragraffe . For I do not thinke , that F. Parsons will attribute that which followeth to any , but to himselfe , who ( if himselfe be of any credit ) made choise of the Arch-priest as one , that would runne with the Iesuites which were at variance with the secular Priests . Those other things which F. Parsons in this 17. paragraffe saith should haue bene proposed , would not haue bene proposed without some ground . For the first , the Protector was knowne to be allied to the contrary part , and said to be ruled altogether against those , whose Protector he pretended to be . For the second , the Seminaries were in perpetual garboyles , and as nurseries of strife and debate betweene the Iesuites , & the secular Priests . For the third , the Iesuites who were in England , aspired daily to that , which became them not . Which first was attempted by them at Wisbitch most manifestly , and afterward was gotten after a more secret manner , while one in the likenesse of a secular Priest beareth the name of a gouernour ouer the rest , and the Iesuites rule him , and them also .

Concerning the 18. paragraffe , that question of hauing two Arch-priests in England , was neuer proposed , nor any thing else at Rome , for the two Priests were not suffered to speak together about any thing , but Fa. Parsons ( examining by how many meanes peace might bee kept in England ) was answered among other , that were named , that this might be one , not that one should be opposite against the other , as F. Parsons would make the world belieue , but that the strife in Englande beeing betweene the secular Priests , and the Iesuites , and the Arch-priest guided by the Iesuites , it was fit that there should be a secular Priest who was not gouerned by the Iesuites in the like authoritie with the Archpriest , and that such lawes might be made , that neither part would be ouer-hastie to offend other ; at which disputation , Fa. Parsons ouershot himselfe fowly . First in arguing that it was neuer seene that there should bee in any one country two superiors , & the one of them not subordinate to the other ; for himself had procured the same in England by this new gouernment , as appeareth by that the Arch-priest is not , or must not be said to be subordinate to the superiour of the Iesuites , nor this to him , but this instance at his request was not vrged . Then vpon an other instance giuen him of the Bishops of Canterbury & Yorke , he went about to proue a subordination betweene these Arch-bishops , out of a foolish hardinesse of the Bishop of Yorke to take the vpper place of the Bishop of Canterbury at a Conuocation in the time of Henry the second : and the good Fa. would not in a long time vnderstand , that that strife prooued no more that there was , or is a subordination betweene these Arch-bishops , then the strife betweene the two Embassadors of France , and Spaine , for the higher place ( when they meete ) doth proue , that one of these Kings is subordinate to the other . But to conclude this paragraffe , if all things were so well ended in England , and all so happily vnited , as F. Parsons here confesseth , why were not M. B. and M. C. sent home , but kept still in banishment , & relegation without any prouision made for them to liue ? What constancy was in this I know not , in shewe there was but litle pietie , especially , if through their meanes this vnitie was wrought , as I haue bene credibly enformed it was vpon the sight of their Letters , and the Breue which was sent into Englande with their testimony to it .

What Historie that is of the Colledge , which F. Parsons rehearseth in the 19. paragraffe , to draw men to send their children thither , I know not . But if it be true , which I haue heard some Priests speake , that they haue bene exhorted at Rome by Fa. Parsons to thrust themselues into state practises , and encouraged thereto , because by being Priests they were alreadie condemned for traytors , and could suffer no greater indignities , or more cruell death for that , then for this ; and that also be true which likewise I haue heard other say , how he practised with the Students in Spaine to set to their hands to such like matters for the Infant , I do not see how any wise Catholique in England or elsewhere , should be ouer-hastie to send his children , either to the one place , or the other . Neither do I knowe what M. Ch. threatned : F. Parsons in modestie , and honestie , might haue vsed better termes , then that he should bemone the lacke of libertie ; for litle reason God-wot he had ( if it had bene in his power ) so to vse M. Ch. hauing no proofe ( as it should seeme ) of any thing concerning these matters ; but a heare-say from a heare-say , as he discouereth in the 4. Paragraffe : and if M. C. shall put those matters in print , which haue passed at Rome , as it should appeare both by that which is heere set downe , and that which M. D. Bish. in his answere to these Letters of F. Parsons dooth touch , I doubt it will be litle for F. Parsons credit , howsoeuer he vaunteth that the matter would be easily answered , vpon pretence of authenticall registers of all that passed by publicke authoritie , hauing himselfe confessed in the tenth Paragraffe , that matters were done priuately in the English Colledge , and the Notary of the cause , no other then a Iesuite of his owne appointing : and as I haue bene credibly enformed , himselfe the Examiner ( except what now and then the Commissary did for a fashion ) and of what credit these Registers may be , or how he may thrust in and out for his purpose as sometime he doth , I referre me to any honest man to iudge , this strife beeing principally betweene the Iesuites , and the secular Priests .

In the 20. Paragraffe I cannot say what sinne the two priests did commit in relating how they were vsed at Rome , for by this Letter of F. Parsons it is euident , that great sin may be committed in relating a matter ; but if it be true , which is said in the same Paragraffe , that al things were well ended , I do not see how they could be accused either of breach of oath , or incurring the censures , hauing once procured that peace , and vnitie , to which they were bound . And in the 22. Paragraffe it is againe repeated , that all was ended , and consequently the two Priests were discharged of their bonds , and might very well haue bene sent home againe , had not there bene an intention in some , that the peace should not long endure , which these two had procured .

In the 21. Paragraffe , F. Parsons sheweth himselfe most willing to deliuer the two Priestes from any thing which he had written against them , or willed others to write . I will not heere repeate that which is sufficiently before shewed , how willingly in this Letter he hath himselfe written , whatsoeuer he willed others to write . He acknowledgeth that he did euer attribute their attempt rather to error , and lacke of consideration , then to ambition , although in the first Paragraffe he seemeth to excuse their attempt also , and attributeth the euill successe thereof to their owne defaults , as if they had handled some good matter not in good sort , as once a most reuerend and graue Prelate seriously tolde them that some others had done in a matter betweene them and the Iesuites . If they should not acknowledge errour , and lacke of consideration in this their attempt , they might iustly be blamed , althought perchance that errour , and lack of consideration , grew vpon too good an opinion conceiued of some in Rome , and was confirmed by others lately come from thence , and therevpon they made not such prouision for theyr owne safetie , and their so free dealing in their affaires , as they might haue made , litle suspecting , that comming so farre to speake with his Holinesse in matters of the Church , which required conference not onely each with other , but with others also , they should not be suffered to speake one with the other , or any man else to aske counsell therein , vntill after some two or three dayes after the Breue was gotten , at what time they were licensed to come together , and were in scorne bidden to deale in their matters for which they were sent to Rome . But although F. Parsons did euer as he saith , attribute this their attempt , rather to errour , and lacke of consideration , then to ambition , yet least that birds of one feather should flie too farre asunder , hee giueth heere some reasons , why men might thinke that ambition did make the two Priests to take this action in hand , to giue men to vnderstand of his ready mind to hold vp his fellow F. Bald. in this vntruth , of which although M. Bish. in his answere to this Letter of F. Parsons doth sufficiently discourse , yet it will not be amisse to say somewhat here concerning F. Parsons proofes . For the first proofe I haue spoken with such as gathered the petitions , which the Priests did make , and they doo assure me , that M. C. was not proposed by any to be made a Bishop . M. B. was , but if M. C. did carrie those writings and kept those secret from M. B. wherein he was named , what proofe is this against M. B. ? To the second proofe , I may answere as once I heard an answere made for F. Parsons , when it was reported heere in England , that all the boyes at S. Omers had conspired to make him a Cardinall , and had written such effectuall Letters to the Pope for it , that ( as it was heere reported ) both he , and the generall of the Iesuites , yea and all the friends that they could make in the Court of Rome , were little inough to keepe him from being a Cardinall , which F. Parsons could not helpe ; for who can hinder Letters to be written by such as are many hundred miles distant from them ? But I maruell who should write this Letter , or whether F. Parsons did euer shewe it to these 2. Priests , so as they might see it & read it ? To the third proofe , M. B. saith , he could neuer obtain so much fauour of F. Parsons , as to see those notes , and as I am enformed , M. Ch. saith the same , although he were most importunate with them ( especially vpon their often promises ) euen vntil the last houre of his restraint or aboad at Rome , yea & chalenged it , that it was forged . I haue heard this coniecture made , how it was forged . M. C. being at the first to goe alone to Rome about the affaires of England , had certaine instructions sent vnto him from D. Ba. who alwaies vsed to call M. C. by a name of which the first letter was L. by which hee was called when they studied together at Rome , and accordingly sent certaine instructions to . L. which M. C. ( sometime called M. L. ) carried with him to Rome , when hee went in company with M. B. Now what little need of wit there was where there wanted honestie , I referre me to them who could to the one L. ioyne an other L. and either blot or scrape away as much as needed of the first stroake of the . in . and so leaue it L L. which perchance in that writing of M. D. Ba. they might doo with some facilitie , because as all men know , who euer receiued any Letters from him , he writeth that word Mr. in this sort . as easily & with litle help , it may bee made to stand for : and as it should seeme , when it was done , it did so please F. Parsons , that he told it often , and by often telling it , thought at last himselfe that it was true ; and was not ashamed to write it , and send it round about the Christian world against the two Priests ; to whom notwithstanding his often promise vpon their constant deniall thereof , hee was ashamed to shewe it when they earnestly demaunded to see it ; might not F. Parsons haue said somewhat else of himselfe when in the 15. Paragraffe he said he was become a foole ? And was it not great need that either there or somewhere else hee should commend himselfe in this action of his , concerning his dealing with the two Priests ?

In the 22. Paragraffe F. Parsons telleth the two Priests that now all is ended , and this and all the rest wil easily die & be forgotten , as alreadie he trusteth all is forgotten on all hands . Was the affliction so small , that euen while it was , it was not felt ? or if it were still felt , and could not but be so thought of by men of best vnderstanding ( being a banishment out of their natiue Countrey , and all other Countries in the world but one , without any prouision made for them ) with what face doth F. Parsons tell them , that all is ended , and that he trusteth all is alreadie forgotten on all hands ? Could this , or any of the rest die , and be forgotten , so long as the two priests liued , and were not forgotten , but kept still in banishment for this , and the rest ? If all this had bene ended in all others , and bene forgotten by them , yet could it not possibly be forgotten by the two Priests , who euen to this day suffer persecution for it , and with such extremitie , as the one being driuen by necessitie to returne into his Countrey for necessarie reliefe to sustaine life ( notwithstanding he gaue notice of the cause of his returne to the Arch-priest , and how for more safetie he had made an appeale from the sentence , which not hauing inflicted any censure , nor being to inflict any but vpon such , and such condition was in the generall opinion of the learned so suspended by an appeale made before the euent of the condition , as after the euent of the same condition , it could take no force against the appellant ) he was vpon this notice giuen to the Arch-priest presently denounced ( although vntruly ) to be suspended , and without any other cause giuen , the Arch-priest at the same time abrogated , anullated , and tooke away all his faculties , when , or by whomsoeuer they were graunted , which doubtlesse , was beyond his Commission , which was , to direct , admonish , and punish as occasion of offence in breach of his peace should be offered , not whom , and when , and for what he listed ; much lesse for an entrance into the Countrey , which if it had bene without leaue , or not iustifiable otherwise , it did belong to others , and not to him to punish , & much lesse if it were true , which F. Parsons saith in this 21. Paragraffe , that now all was ended , and that hee trusted all was forgotten on all hands . But to returne to our 22. Paragraffe , what was that which was ended ? If the cause betweene the Archpriest and all the Priests were ended , how were the two Priests still kept in banishment ? but wee must heere learne a new trick , how to haue all things ended and forgotten . Those who are iniuried must say nothing : good counsell . So may the Potent oppresse whom they may by might , or fraud , and all is well , yea and all is forgotten , if those who are oppressed beare themselues well , and prudently , and do stay , and not stirre vp such as do seeme to fauour or bemone their case . But perchance these reports which came to F. Parsons eares from Flaunders , and Fraunce , may be said to haue bene the hinderance that all was not well on the two Priests sides ( for as it should seeme in the sixt Paragraffe , they were not come to the eares of them , whom they are said most to concerne ) but then before these reports came to the eares either of the one , or of the other , how was all well , and all forgotten , and yet the two Priests kept still in banishment ? there are Leters vnder Fa. Parsons hand to be seene , to testifie that all was well , and vnder F. Warfords hand likewise , and others doubtlesse enough to the same purpose , before these things were obiected against them , or this deuise wrought for the farther persecuting the two Priests , and delaying them still in banishment , and confinement , without any prouision made for them to liue , why were they not then dismissed ? Perchance F. Parsons did at that time diuine , that the two Priests might giue some cause , that notwithstanding all was well ended , and as he trusted on all hands forgotten , yet their particular cause might be exempted from that all , and not onely not be forgotten , but prosecuted still vnto the vttermost that the straungest moode could deuise . Vpon this therefore his diuination , and great foresight , notwithstanding that peremptorily , or positiuely hee said in the 18. Paragraffe , that all was well ended , and iterateth the same in this 22. Paragraffe , and trusteth that alreadie all is forgotten on all hands , yet he sauceth it with a condition , that is , if M. B. and M. C. do beare themselues well , and prudently , and do stay , and not stirre vp such as do seeme to fauour , or bemone their case . Now all good Catholiques in England do hartily grieue at the present stirres in England . M. B. and M. Ch. were farre inough off ; who hath begunne them ? All those who did seeme to fauour , or bemoane the case of M. Bish. and M. Ch. had made an attonement with their aduersaries , and forgiuen all those slaunders , and detractious proceedings which were practised against them : and neither of themselues , or stirred vp by M. Bish. and M. Ch. haue they reuiued all that which F. Parsons heere confesseth to haue bene dead , forgotten , or ended . Did not rather F. Rob. Ion. a Iesuite ( no great fauourer or bemoaner of M. Bish. and M. Ch. their case ) broach this diuision again , and renew the soare ( which was , if not cleane healed , yet forgotten , and the offendors forgiuen ) by publishing that the Priests ( who did forbeare to admit M. Black . for their superiour , vntill they sawe the Breue in his confirmation ) were Schismatikes , and that all those , who should not hold the same , were vnder the censures of the Church ? Did not M. Black . soone after , both approue the same paradox of F. Ion. the Iesuite , and furthermore publish a resolution sent ( as he said ) from Rome , eyther by Father Wasord or F. Titch . ( both Iesuites ) which avowed the same , with many Edicts , and prohibitions , vnder paine of incurring the censures , that the Priests should not defend them selues from this most absurd , & iniurious calumniation ? Was it so necessary that there should be tumults in England ( which must be said still , no doubt , to be betweene the secular Priests , and the Catholiques ) that the Iesuites must stil giue the onset , although for to auoyd blame in the opinion of such as will blinde themselues , their enterprises haue bene so prosecuted by couert Iesuites ( who were not knowne but as secular Priests ) & by the Arch-priest , as they are generally taken for quarrels among the secular Priests ? Can F. Parsons say , and not thinke to be laughed at , that these stirres are reviued by default of M. Bish. and M. Ch. their not prudent bearing themselues , or that the Iesuites , and the Arch-priest were stirred vp by them , as men who would seeme to fauour , or bemone their cause ? But had peace long continued in England , which was feared that it would , ( had it bin in their power who were so maruellously iniured ) some iudged that they should misse somewhat at which they aimed , and therefore they set all things worse then they were before . We hope we shal now shortly at the least see to what end they did it .

Concerning the 23. paragraffe , I cannot say what either straungers , or others , did iudge of the two Priests cause , they themselues must answere how they found such as with whom they talked ; yet if it be true , which F. Parsons relateth in the 16. Paragraffe , it is very likely , that they tolde some tale , which caried some weight with it , or else both the Commissarie of the Inquisition had litle reason to vse such words as F. Parsons there saith he did , and F. Parsons lesse cause to feare least their dealing with all the Cardinalls , and great men in Rome , would ( to vse his owne tearme ) bring the common cause in a pretie plight . He vaunteth here , but falsely and iniuriously against the principall of our Nation , eyther in Flaunders or England , who should complaine of the ouermuch lenitie vsed in ending of the cause , & that none but vpon passion or misinformation did bemone them . The iudgement of the two Cardinals Caietan , & Burghese , I saw in their letters of the 21. of April , 1599. to the Rector or vicerector of the english Colledge , and that was , that it was not expedient that the two Priestes should by and by returne vnto those parts , where they had maintained controuersies with other of their order . Wherefore they commaunded the two Priests , that for a time they should not presume to goe without license , into the Kingdomes of England , Scotland , and Ireland . I haue bene credibly enformed that neither of them were euer in Scotland or Ireland , and therefore could not maintaine any controuersies there in parsonall presence , but if they did maintaine any , it was by Letters , which they might doo ( notwithstanding this prouiso ) from other parts also , neither can I learne that euer they mainteined any such in England , but if they had , in my simple iudgement , it was no good reason why therefore they should be debarred Scotland and Ireland ; and although this were the iudgement which was specified by the aforesaid Letters , yet there was an other iudgement also , that they should not be both in one Region , as it should seeme ; for although in the Cardinall Burghese his Letters of the 15. of September , 1600. to M. C. it is insinuated , that they might choose their place of banishment and confinement , ( which is a confession ) that because they had controuersies in some one place , not certainely set downe where , ( if wee looke into the aforesaid mentioned Letters of the 21. of Aprill , 1599. ) or because by their returne into England , some controuersies might haue growne there ( as appeareth by Cardinall Burghese his Letters of the 15. of September , 1600. ) they must be banished out of all places in the world but one , where they must liue in relegation God knoweth how long ( for neither is there any certaine time set downe for this ) yet in the answere vnto it , written by M. C. the 4. of Noumber following , I read that he was not suffered to be in Fraunce , as he had made his choise ; and if this was not cause sufficient for honest men truly enformed of the ending of their cause to bemoane them sincerely , and from the heart , yet with this circumstance at the least it might be , that no prouision being made for them to sustaine life , they were banished out of all such places , where they might haue meanes to liue , vpon a supposed cause neuer proued against them , or a bare suspition of what might heereafter bee , vnlesse to goe to Rome to preuent great controuersies , be said to be to maintaine cotrouersies , or to giue a suspition that they would make controuersies , when as that thing by which probably they might assure themselues that controuersies would growe , came from Rome , and was no where to be remedied but at Rome . And it will appeare by those authenticall Registers in Rome , ( if any be kept ) that they sought with all submission to his holinesse , to knowe his will in a cause not made knowne by any Letters before from him , or by any sufficient testimony otherwise that it was his order .

In the 24. Paragraffe , F. Parsons would seeme to giue good counsell , although in all that goeth before he sheweth how litle he careth to follow any , but rather aduentureth to say or doo , what commeth into his minde , and seeketh afterward to perswade such as against whom he worketh to haue patience , and say nothing but be peaceable , not to finde fault , or blame any his proceedings , least that tumults arise thereon , as who did resolue rather to goe through with whatsoeuer he attempteth , then to recall , or reclaime himself at any time , when he hath done amisse ; for proofe whereof , he caused this Letter ( as it appeareth in the 6. Paragraffe ) to be communicated to others , beside those to whom it was written , who shuld also publish it further without any shame ( as it is to be feared ) of the follies , or conscience for the vntruthes conteined therein , and with as much breuitie as the matter would suffer declared in this Censure .

DOCTOR BYSHOPS AN swere to Fa. Parsons Letter , of the 9. of October . 1599.

YOur Letters ( Father ) of the 9. of Octob. came late vnto my hands , being by you sent about ( as it were in circuit ) open ; to be read & coppied out by diuers others before they should come vnto me . Meete it was surely , that so odde a storie might not runne the ordinarie course of vulgar Letters : but against the propertie of missiues , and contrary also to common ciuility , be communicated first to others , and last to him , vnto whom they principally belong . Yet truly when I heard of others , the purport and contents of them , I had no great delight to looke vpon them , but let them lie by me more then a moneth , ere I read them once ouer , so vnwilling haue I alwaies bene , and yet am , to giue my minde to such troublesome businesse , which is like to drawe me from a desired repose , into the lists of an vnpleasing dispute : and that with those who pretend to be ( as in equitie they should be ) my verie good friends . I had also long before often heard of many slaunderous rumors raised of me vniustly , and seene some flying Letters stuffed full of misconstruction of my actions : yet I remained silent , not without the offence of diuers honest and wise personages , for that I spared to write in defence of my owne innocencie , and to purge and cleare my selfe from iniurious calumny . But I knowing my poore credit to be a matter of small moment : and fearing least to treate of such a pittifull subiect , might be some hinderance vnto the Catholique cause : did preferre the common good before my priuate interest ; our blessed Lords honour before mine owne reputation ; leauing vnto his omnipotent diuine disposition , the successe and euent of the whole matter . And so putting vp patiently those iniuries , passed ouer the time in silence quietly , vntill that now ( Father ) you haue by addressing such Letters vnto mee , rowsed mee ( as it were ) out of my quiet Lodge , and doo presse mee , either to acknowledge for true , that which I take in many pointes to swarue much from the truth , or to declare and shewe what I knowe concerning those matters . Wherefore being verie sure that the honour of God his cause cannot be stained by a true defence of my selfe his poore seruant from dishonour , and that it needeth not ( as the Prophet saith ) our lying , but is rather by truth and equitie vpholden & maintained . I will set downe the veritie of that affaire ( as before almightie God my iust Iudge ) most sincerely , and withall , so temperately , as that no vpright and in different Reader shall haue reason to be offended with me . Yet to speake ( after my manner ) plainly , I cannot ( Father ) but mistrust , least you will not take it well , for you haue alreadie shewed your selfe to haue bene mooued with my former Letters , which only had friendly requests and admonitions : how much the more are these likely to trouble you , which carry in them also , free , yet friendly reprehensions ; which vnto a high and hotte stomacke are of much harder digestion ? But to mittigate the matter , consider I pray you , how vnwillingly , and as it were enforced by your selfe , I come at length to set penne to paper : and what liberties by God and all good men are allowed vnto all sorts of persons , speaking in their own defence : and then remembring how you haue taken in accusing of vs a rethoricall license , you cannot in equitie and reason , but approue and like in vs defendants , a modest , Christian libertie of speech . And so desiring you to prepare your selfe vnto some small patience , I come now to the answere of your Letters .

In the beginning whereof you write , that no one Letter appeared as then from mee to you , accusing my long silence , and within ten lines after , you say , that that weeke you receiued a Letter from me of an old date , to the which you answere . What Riddle I pray you may this be ? No Letter appeared from me to you when you began to write : and yet that week you had receiued a Letter from mee , what ? was the Letter you receiued inuisible , that it appeared not in his likenesse when you receiued it ? Yet it appeareth by your particular replie vnto the parts thereof , that you had throughly seene and perused it . To say that after you began your Letter you were a weeke ere you came vnto the tenth line of it , & that mine came in the meane season , were ridiculous . What then remaineth , but that in the first period of your Letter , there is either some egregious equiuocation , or euident vntruth , which fell out ( by God his prouidence as I take it ) verie fitly , to forewarne your Readers what credit they may giue vnto much of that which followeth . For , if in the verie first lines they find such apparant vanitie , voluntarily vttered without anie iust cause ; let them iudge what conclusion and dubling is like to be deuised , when it will serue for an aduantage . Correspondent vnto this ouersight is that bad construction which you make of my former letters ; but that it sauoureth a litle more of an vncharitable minde . In them I gaue you to vnderstand , that they by whom I passed ( not all sorts of people as you report ) misliked much of your rigorous dealing : and therefore desired you for the loue of our generall cause to vse more mildnesse . You hereof inferre that I am fallen into temptation , and much changed from that I was . In this your collection I find two faults , the one , in that you insinuate that then I spake placentia , but that now I writ acerba : There indeed I often refrained franckly to speake what I thought , because it was like to do you small good , and more then like to do me much harme , yet I manie times to your selfe , and to those who would tel you all , greeuously complained of your seuere and rigorous kind of carriage towards your countrimen of all sortes , much vnseeming ( as me thought ) your priuate person , more dissonant from your holy profession , and very ill suting , both with the times we liue in , and the parties you haue to deale withall .

The other fault more fowle in my opinion , is that of a friendlie admonition you gather a falling out : & because I went about to perswade you , to be more milde , kinde , and curteous , towards your own countrymen , who otherwise endure sorrow inough : you iudge me fallen from your friendship into a daungerous temptation , and to haue incurred many ( I know not what ) greeuous sinnes and censures , but I am not greatly dismaid at these your bigge words and terrifying consequents ; when as I finde them to be ( as this is ) erronious in the light of nature , and condemned euen by the Heathen Philosophers , who like well , approue , and commend as verie dutifull among deare friends , not onlie exhortations which I then vsed for the loue I bare you , but also reprehensions , which I now come after withall , being therevnto by you compelled . I am sorry to see you who haue so long liued among so many good religious Fathers , so farre from that pitch of humilitie , & mortification , which maketh a man to contemne himselfe and the honors of this world , & to desire to be euil thought & spoken of : that you may not abide to heare tell of any fault of yours , but by & by , you fall out with your friend , for that he in faire tearmes intreateth you , to looke vnto such an euil humor , as partly by naturall inclination , partly by long custome of harkening vnto flatterers , you may be subiect vnto . And albeit in another passage of yours , you would seeme not to mislike them , who aduertise you of that they think amisse : yet this your euil taking of such aduertisements when they come , doth euidently proue the contrarie : and this fault is taken to be too common in some of your Societie ; and I my selfe once before , found the like demeanour in one of your principall Agents in England : These Letters were th● cause why h● lost an Assistantship , by M. Black . ● owne repor● whom I friendlie certified of some odde dealings which were reported of the Societie , assuring him that I beleeued them not , but desired to heare from him the veritie of those affaires , for my further satisfaction . I was so farre off from receiuing a good answere ( due at least in courtesie for that I desired it ) that my Letters were read openly and shewed vnto others , and sinister construction made of them , to procure me euill will and discredit . What kinde of religion , ciuilitie , or humanitie may be in such maner of dealing , I can hardly perceiue , and list not heere to discusse , hoping that when you shall see other men scanne , examine , and confute your Letters , as you were woont to do theirs ; you will be hereafter more mannerly & milde interpreters , least you otherwise hap to meete with the same measure that you meat to others . Well , let vs goe on .

You pretend , that you expected to receiue from me louing Letters and much good seruice . A great presumption surely of my no small mortification , if you speake vnfainedly . For it were no vulgar vertue for manifolde and manifest slaunders , calumniarions , imprisonment , and exile , which I receiued there among you : to returne and render commendations , congratulations , all sorts of sweetnesse and courtesies ; which neuerthelesse , you would haue the world weene that you attended at my hands . But to speake without glosing , your owne guiltie conscience , tolde you euen before our departure as you signifie , that you were not like to receiue from mee ( whom you knowe to be plaine and round : ) any other then ordinarie curtesie ; such as the loue of God and lawe of charitie bindeth me vnto : the which for those good parts it hath pleased God to endowe you with , I will alwaies afforde you in a high degree , and more too , when I shall perceiue that you esteeme more of it , and to goe about not in emptie words , but by sound deedes better to deserue it .

But not to wander vp and downe after all the particularities of such a long tedious Letter : I will reduce my whole answere vnto two points . The former shall shewe what reasons mooued my bretheren to send vnto Rome , and vs to goe thither at their request . In the latter shall be declared how we were vsed there ; in the one or the other I will answere to whatsoeuer in your Letter touching me , and hope by both to giue ful satisfaction vnto all honest , equal , and vpright consciences , of that which they haue heard obiected against me , concerning that negotiation .

The most holy and blessed course , of the peaceable reduction of our Countrey vnto the auncient Catholique faith in Apostolique manner , being before somewhat hindered by a dispute about gouernment in Wisbitch : and afterwards much more troubled by emulation , growing betweene some English of the Societie , and certaine other Priests : who tooke themselues much impeached in their credit by them : it did not a litle grieue me ( who had imployed a great part of my best yeares in that our good Lords haruest : and had nothing on earth in so singular recommendation , as to see that heauenly work prosper ) to consider what impediment and let of it was like to follow , if those sparkes of dissention were not speedily quenched . Wherefore , with many others of the auncientest sort , and of better marke , merit and affection towards our Countrey , I trauelled about a soueraigne medicine , for the present maladie ( as it seemed vnto vs ) and a notable preseruatiue against any other that might ensue afterwardes ; which was to vnite and knit our selues together , in some louing , sweete , and easie association and brotherhood , that so by mutuall intelligence , counsell and ayd , we might either prudently preuent , or speedily meete with all inconueniences that might happen to arise among vs : being now many in number , and euery one left vnto his owne gouernment and discretion . This matter of vnion was communicated vnto all , and euerie man almost requested to ioyne in it : a draught of rules were drawne , which were fewe , easie , reasonable , and much profitable : which were also shewed vnto whosoeuer would see them , that if they misliked any thing therein , it might be amended , and so made agreeable vnto all honest desires . What could in reason be more demaunded ? Yet , because this proceeded not , as it is thought from the Societie , nor had any dependance vpon them ; although at first they seemed to approoue it much , as that which was in itselfe , honest , iust , and necessarie : yet afterward seeing it likely to goe forward , and to growe into such a body as theirs is , they openly opposed themselues against it , and stirred vp their fellowes to contradict and crosse it , as much as they could : and in the meane season coyned a new forme of gouernment or subordination ( as they call it ) neuer heard of in the Church of God since the the beginning of the world , vntill our dayes ; and by Cardinall Caietanes authoritie , caused the same to be cast vpon vs , at vnawares ; our consents or likings neuer demaunded , vntill it was ( as they said ) established . This cunning and audacious enterprise with the prepostorous vnaduised proceeding in it : mooued farre greater discontentment among vs then was before , and was the principall cause of sending vnto Rome , ( the soueraigne Court of Ecclesiasticall controuersie ) that from whence the fountaine of our griefe did seeme to spring , from thence in like maner we might deriue and drawe the streames of consolation . That we had many waightie , vrgent , and lawful motiues to sue vnto that Court , a wise , vpright , and well practised man in Ecclesiasticall affaires , shall ( I doubt not ) willingly graunt mee after he hath well weighed and pondered these reasons following ; which are taken of the order it selfe , of the obtaining , sending , publishing , and executing of it .

First , touching this subordination , it being no such as our sauiour Christ Iesus deliuered to his Apostles , or that hath bene seene practised in anie part of Christendome these 1600. yeares : no maruaile though simple witted men , who desire not to straie from the holie steps of our forefathers , were at the first not a little amazed at it , and could not be so verie easilie induced to approue it . This also , besides the noueltie of it , being much more odious and intollerable ( as it was then proposed ) then anie other gouernment that our predecessors had euer liued vnder . For hauing full and absolute power to punish rigorously , and that ( as it were ) at pleasure and discretion : it had no facultie ioyned with it , or abilitie to benefit or do anie good at all : no not so much , as vpon amendment of the partie punished , to restore vnto him againe that hee had taken away from him before . If now he haue more ample authoritie , he may thanke our complaints , which were no smal cause of it . And herevnto his Iniunctions ( whereof more in an other place ) that Priestes should not meete together priuilie in our countrie ; that they should not secretlie send vnto their friends ouer the sea : whereas openlie they can doo no such thing , as all the world knoweth ; and tell vs ( I pray you ) when and where euer you heard of such an Ecclesiastical gouernment in anie Christian countrie before : that sacred Priests , the free children of God his familie so greatlie priuiledged by all good Christian Princes , should be ( I know not by whom ) in such a seruile sort yoaked ?

Againe , this punishing authoritie cannot be wel practised in England during this heate of persecution , and therefore seemed to be frustrate and giuen in vaine : for by the Canon lawe ( which is the common rule of spirituall causes ) as by all other lawes ; no punishment ought by sentence of Iudge to be inflicted vpon the offender ( not confessing the action ) before he be by order of lawe conuicted . Confession of the fault is sildome in that Court or neuer to be expected : wherefore lawfull defence is to be graunted vnto anie person accused before he be condemned . But no processe according vnto order of lawe can be framed & followed , so long as we haue hotte persecutors , laying waite euerie where to apprehend vs . For to omit all other difficulties ( which in practise will be founde to be verie manie ) where can a safe place be found to assemble the parties , their witnesses & Proctors together ; and there to hold as it were an Assize , for the determination of their controuersies , which to be necessarie , Lancelot a man singularly seene in both lawes and authour of the institutes of the Canon law setteth downe ( which he taketh out of the Canon lawe , Extra de appell. cap : ex parte tua : see also the glosse there : which both require a secure place , both for the parties , Proctors , and witnesses , or else holdeth them for excused if they appeare not ) Institu . L. 3. Tit. s. § Locus in these words , Tunc enim ius dicenti impune non paretur si locus citatione designatus pestilens sit aut alias pro citato male tutus . Then may a man freely not obey him that ministreth iustice , when the place in the citation assigned is infected with the plague , or otherwise not safe for the partie cited . Now euerie Catholicke knoweth , that there is no place in our Country , free from daunger for Priests to assemble together : such diligent watch and ward being laide in euerie shire to apprehend them . And who will be so simple , as to allow them a hall in his house for their pleadings , whereby he ( that cannot start ) doth cast himselfe into a hundreth perills , of loosing not onely all his goods and libertie , but his life also and inheritance ? A place of assurance then cannot in these times be appointed for the appearance : hee therefore is warranted by lawe not to appeare , although he be cyted by his lawful magistrate . And so no action can be commenced , much lesse determined by this authoritie of the Arch-priest : and consequently , such penall power is to small purpose in our Country . This subordination then being extrauagant without example of antiquitie , hatefull , as hauing power to punish , but not to pleasure ; and scarcely possible to be now practised in our Countrie , had we not great reason to certifie his holinesse of the inconueniences of it , and in humble sort to sue vnto him for remedie and redresse , before hee put to his hand vnto the confirmation of it ?

And this you must needs much more easily grant , if you consider how this subordination was procured and gotten : for it seemeth to haue bene by false information , which alone is sufficient to ouerthrow the whole authoritie . My proofe shal be pregnant , taken out of the verie letters Patents of the Archpriest , where are these words , Rationes pro illa subordinatione ab ipsis Sacerdotibus Anglis redditae S.mo D. N. probatae fuerunt . The reasons by the English Priests themselues exhibited for that subordination vnto his holinesse were well liked . Marke I pray you how this subordination was obtained at the suite and perswasion of the Priests in England . Now I appeale vnto the consciences of my louing bretheren the Priests then in England , whether euer they had heard of anie such stratagem or straunge subordination before they felt it ( as it were ) clapped on their shoulder , sure I am for the most part of them , howsoeuer they were M. Iames ●tand : who had giuen his name to be a ●esuite ( and was the man who by Fa. Parsons sub●rnation im●loyed himselfe in this action ) confessed before diuers priests ●t his return , ●hat he had ●n interpre●atiue consent of the Priests in England . drawne afterwards to accept of it by flatterie , fraude , or threats , that they neuer dreamed of it , before they sawe it , so farre off were they from deuising and tentering perswasions vnto his holinesse , for the admitting of it . I will not deny , but that some one Priest , who had bene in England , being then idle in Rome , might by euill counsaile and subornation take vpon him to be sent of the whole bodie , and so contrary vnto conscience and good order , speake in their names , that neuer sent him . But what was graunted vpon such vntrue suggestion , euery man knoweth to be of no force and validitie ; and that we in England had iust cause to certifie his holinesse , by trustie messengers , how we were greatly abused , by them who vsed our names , to obtain that exorbitant deuise , which we neither desired nor liked , but rather , that it would please his holinesse , to establish among vs , that sound Ecclesiastical Hierarchy which was instituted by the wisdome of God , & had bin euer sithence in time of persecution , as wel as in peace , obserued in all Christian Nations : that he would ( I mean ) giue vs Bishops the successors of the Apostles , and onely ordinary Pastours of God his Church , who might confirme , consecrate oyles , and bring many other of God his blessings among vs . But not to digresse from my purpose .

The third cause why this subordination did mislike vs , was for that it came not authentically from his holinesse , by Bull , Breue , or any other lawfull instrument , but was framed by you Father ( as it is thought ) liked by Cardinall Caietane , ( a great patron of your plots ) and by vertue of his Letters authorised and sent in amongst vs . If his L. had beene so prouident as he was aduenterous , hee should haue certified vs before , how he came by any such soueraigne commaundement ouer our Countrey : for that was vtterly vnknowne vnto the most of vs . We had heard that he was Protector of our Colledge , and of our Nation in the Citie of Rome : but it litle followeth thereof , that he might erect a spirituall Monarchy in England . For there be in Rome many other Protectors of Nations , but yet no one besides him , that taketh vpon him any such authoritie . But to purge himselfe from this staine of vsurpation , hee writeth that his holinesse willed him to take order amongst vs for peace and vnitie . Let vs do him the honour to beleeue him on his word ( although some report that hee hath little deserued it at our hands : ) was there no other meanes to be found for appeasing of all parties , then to cast vpon vs without our priuities and consents , contrary to the Canons of the Church , a platforme of gouernment , neuer before seene or heard of in the Church of God ? Would not a man maruell where his Lordships iudgement was , when he approued without any one president such nouelties ? Surely , their wits seeme to haue bene gone on wooll-gathering , that inuented this , as a way of peace and vnion ; it being most like , what for the straungenesse of it , as also for the disorderly obtaining and sending of it , to engender much more debate amongst vs then was before . For , according to the generall voyce of the wisest Common-weale men : there is no higher way to dissention and garboiles , then to bring in ( as it were perforce ) a new and straunge order of gouernment . But not to omit any thing for his Lordships excuse , he writeth in the same his Letters , that his holinesse liked well of the reasons exhibited vnto him for that subordination : so in the same sentence he saith , that we english priests presented many gentle perswasions vnto his holines , for the admitting of it , but in this his Lordship seemeth to haue bin deceiued : why then might he not so be in the other ? But admit that his holines liked of the reasons , & that there was no surreption : no more followeth , but that his holines would haue the Cardinall prooue how the priests in England would like of that subbordination , and according as he should heare of their acception , hee would after either approoue or disprooue it . This ( at the most ) to haue beene his holinesse minde , I heard of a principall Officer of his at Rome . Also , other honest and vertuous Priestes , affirme on their credits , and are ready to binde it with their oathes ; that they heard you Father , yea and the Pope his Holinesse himselfe say , that hee would not establish and set any certaine superioritie amongst vs in England ; before hee had heard from vs of our good wills and likings , which was fatherlike , louingly , and wisely spoken ; conformable vnto the auncient Canons : see dist. 61. can . nullus inuitis detur Eps. Let no Bishop bee giuen to men against ther wills : the reason he setteth down in the lawe : dist. 63. can . si forte : ne ciuitas ( inuita ) Episcopum non optatum aut contemnat aut oderit . Least hauing a Bishop giuen them against their wills , they do either contemne or hate him , whom they desired not . If such liking and consent be required by the Lawe for ordinarie Magistrates : how much more for extraordinary and such as they neuer heard of before ; and that especially at the first reducing of them to subiection , who before were free from that yoake : when after the glosse vpon the word Rogarunt : dist. 21. can . In nouo . non nisi volentibus dabitur Prelatus etiam a Papa . A Prelate is not to be giuen but to the willing , no not by the Pope : much lesse of a Cardinall . Heere we tooke these words of the Canon first cited dist. 61. to haue place . Sit facultas Clericis renitendi si se viderint pregrauari , & quos sibi ingeri ex transuerso agnouerint non timeant refutare . This passage falleth so fit to our purpose , that it seemeth to haue beene made for the like case . Wee were about a sweete brotherlike association , euerie man made priuie to it , euery ones aduise and counsell required and desired : in the meane season to crosse our good meaning and designement for vnitie and concord , a stately superioritie is intended vpon vs , whether we will or will not . Who can now condemne vs for taking the benefite of this lawe , which giueth vs as it were commission to resist such intrusion , and biddeth vs boldly to reiect and refute him that was so ouerthwartly thrust vpon vs ; especially by appeale and recourse vnto both our superiours , for the composing and quietting of all parties ? And truly to declare my opinion , who of many haue thought very well of M. Blackwell , and euen then wished him greater preferment : he surely , if he had harkened vnto his owne naturall disposition and accustomed modestie , and had not bene by some hastie hot-spurres pricked forward , would not vpon so slender a foundation as a Cardinalls Letter , haue taken vpon him so straunge a vocation , against the consents of so many his bretheren : some his auncients , some his equalls , many not much his inferiours , in standing , learning , good affection , and merit towards our Countrey : a man of his grauitie and pietie , that had no doubt many times pithily declaimed against ambition and desires of honours , should at least ( as mee seemeth ) ere he had vndertaken that dignitie , haue graunted so many graue learned men , leaue and respite , to informe themselues throughly of the whole matter , before they did binde themselues to that subiection .

But to proceed forward in my proofes , the publication and execution of this subordination much more yet increased our dislikes , and ministred new occasions to appeale from it . The publishing of it , by the Arch-priest his owne Letters , seemed vndecent . Where were your wisedomes ? Could not a Letter at least haue bene deuised from the Cardinall ( who was ready to assigne al that Father Parsons presented vnto him ) to the Priests , aduertising them of this his good pleasure , or some other mannerly inuention haue bene framed ; but that the good man himselfe must needs be made his owne Trumpeter and Crier : and be forced to offer that violence to his modestie , as to blow abroad & divulgate his late atchieued promotion , and to begge of his fellowes , or commaund them ( take of the two whether you thinke more ciuil ) to like well of his preferment , and therevnto in all haste , to set to their hands : they must not in anie case , staie to examine his authoritie , what it was , whence or how it came , but foorthwith put their neckes in the collar , be subiect and obay him . This vncomely & vntimely haste to bind our selues , I know not vnto what subiection , seemed verie raw , and of hard digestion : and nothing sutable with the grauitie and waight of the matter , which required much more mature deliberation .

Moreouer , when by word of mouth he broached the same his authoritie vnto certaine Priests , he to amend the matter withall , added thervnto somewhat of his owne : and being forthwith taken tardie , hee did presently confesse that he indeed put therto somewhat : as honest Priests on their oathes will testifie . This gaue a great presumption that the matter was contriued by their friends , and that they might adde or diminish at their pleasure . Which is more probable , if we call to mind and marke what instructions he gaue forth at the first as receiued from the Cardinall . Among others , were these , that Priests should not meet secretly together , that they should not send any priuie messages ouer the seas ; that they should take in good part whatsoeuer was either written or spoken against them , and such like which are not in the rowle of his instructions sent him from the Cardinall , as euerie bodie may see ; and I can by producing a true copie of them , when need shall be , euidently demonstrate : and besides are so voide of reason , so odious and intollerable in our Country , especially at this time , when Priests cannot meete together or do any thing , but in secret : that a babe might plainly feele them , neuer to haue proceeded from his holinesse , or from anie noble , free or compassionate heart , but to sauour of ( I know not what ) base minde too too much addicted to terror , crueltie , and seruitude . I will ( that I be not ouerlong ) omit diuers other pregnant & forcible reasons which we had of sending vnto Rome ; this onely I may not leaue behinde , which of it selfe were a sufficient cause to sue and speak for redresse in season : vz. that in the whole drift of this subordination , extreame partialitie was apparantly shewed , which as the world knoweth , was no good meanes to appease all parties & to ende their debates ; the onely cause pretended of this lately erected authoritie , & namely to accord the Priests and Iesuites , as the Letters Pattents specifie . Now that controuersies be wel decided , and all honest parties agreed , it was meete ( perdie ) to choose vpright and indifferent Iudges and Arbiters , who should without fauour , feare , loue , or hatred , waigh euerie mans cause vprightly , in the ballance of equitie , and without respect of persons , giue sentence according to iustice . This is a principall in iudgement so cleare , by the light of nature , that it is graunted of verie Pagans : yet in our cause very badly obserued : for both the Arch-priest and his counsellours , ( vnto whom the determination of our causes are to be referred ) were all chosen by the one partie , with a speciall prouiso , that no one be admitted vnto that number , who did not greatly fauour the same partie : howe contrary soeuer they were vnto the other partie , it imported not : yea perhaps the more earnestly bent against them , the rather elected . Had not trow you , the other poore partie iust cause to refuse such Vmpeeres and Iudges that were so alienated from them , and such fauourites of the aduerse partie : and to preuent the vniust sentences that were like to follow of this partialitie , to flie in time for refuge vnto their lawfull superiour ? And if in all pettie iudgements , euery priuate man is allowed by lawe an exception against a partiall Iudge , how much more is the same to be graunted vnto many auncient , graue worthie men , in a generall cause of a Country .

Two proper points of pollicy I obserue in this election , the one in choosing the Officers so plyant to their pleasures , that they may be the more readie to runne byaz when it will serue their turnes . And yet because men are mutable , to hold them in awe , their authorities might be taken from them , what time soeuer the Cardinall thought good , as in the points it is to be seene : but let this goe , because I touched it before ; the other peece of pollicy yet more fine , is , that the Arch-priest himselfe who is appointed to giue iustice vnto both parties , hath power only ouer the one partie ; & none at all ouer the other : so that the one he may by censures & seuere punishment , constraine to stand to his definitiue sentence : but the other needs not to care for him any further then that he may vse him , to plague his aduersarie . Vt sibi caueat loco . These hardy champions , hold it not sufficient to haue the fauour of the Court for them : but for feare of after claps , wil haue also their persons exempted from the principal magistrate , and reserue themselues onely , to their owne Fathers iudgement , which must be sought for also , farre inough off from Rome , and that in forme of supplication , if I mistake not much the Arch-priests instructions .

Here seemeth to be the place to answere to that sentence of yours ( Father ) , where you tel vs in good sadnesse , that many yeares you demaunded with your friends for this subordination . I beleeue you surely , considering that neither you would haue yours comprehended in it , and yet you would haue the appointing of all the Officers , and ordering almost of all matters belonging to it . But say you it was thereby to deliuer the Societie from that calumniation , vsed to be laid against them , that they would gouerne the Priests against theirs wills : and you had some reason so to say , if you had suffered the Priests to haue chosen their gouernours according to their owne wills & desires : but you putting in , and choosing such commaunders , as at your becke , should be readie to doo whatsoeuer you will , doo manifestly prooue that saying to be no calumniation , but a plaine demonstration of your incroaching , vpon the gouernments of priests , much further then your profession or vocation doth require . For by the ordinarie course of the Church , religious men are to be gouerned by some of the lay Cleargie , and not the Cleargie by them .

Well to drawe towards the end of my former part , this subordination being both straunge in the Church of God , hatefull of itself , and not to be exercised in our countrey in these times , it being also procured ( as it seemeth ) by false suggestion , authorized by him , that was not knowne to haue any such authoritie , and finally by partiall election of the gouernours , tending vnto the oppression of many notable personages , who had excellently well deserued of our countrey by their long and fruitfull trauells : yet remaineth euident and most manifest , that wee had sundry , iust , lawfull and great causes in humble sort to sue vnto our superiours for a mitigation or alteration of it , and for establishing of some better and more fit for our countrey . Whereof appeareth first , how vaine that vaunt of yours is , where you say , that we came and brought nothing with vs , and that you were ashamed to see that wee had taken so long a iourney and had so litle to say , when besides the causes before mentioned , we had many other points also of importance in our message . As to desire and sue for Bishops , or at least , that the facultie to confirme and to consecrate oyles ( whereof our countrey standeth in very great need ) might be giuen vnto some of our auncient Priests , with diuers such like , which were not vnknowne vnto you , wherefore I maruell with what conscience you can say , that wee brought no matter of substance , or worth our trauell . Secondly , out of the premisses followeth , that the loue of God his cause , the zeale and earnest desire of some good order for peace & vnitie , mooued mee ( at the earnest request and solicitations of many godly and graue Priests ) to forgoe the company of my deare friends , to contemne mine owne ease and commoditie , and to put my selfe vnto the paine , daunger , and part also of the cost of such a long perillous iourney : and not ambition , as many of your dependants , haue with euill conscience bruted abroad in diuers coasts , and one of the societie an especiall correspondent of yours , did not blush to write , that we in Rome had confessed , that nothing but ambition incited vs to this iourney , of which I certified you in my former Letters , and you writ that you cannot beleeue , that any body would giue out any such impudent reports , but I assure you that I haue seene it written , and can haue their Letters produced , when time shall serue to confront the shamelesse spreaders of such slaunderous rumours . And albeit you cleare me of that crime most willingly ( as you write ) yet as men that speake hollowly , and not from the heart , you giue forth some suspitions out of other mens speeches , and lay downe in their names , your reasons for confirmation of them . The first is , that in the papers we brought with vs , there were voyces for our promotion : I answere , that with those papers I was not much acquainted , as one that neither gathered them , nor carried them ; and full well I knowe and protest , that by accord among our selues , it was determined before I resolued to take that iourney , that they which were sent should not accept of any preferment willingly , although it were offered them , least they should giue their euill willers occasion to carpe at them , rather to seeke their owne particular , then their generall good . Their second reason is , for that in a foolish Letter de presidētijs incerto autore , a request is made , that wee should bee made not Bishops onely , but Arch-bishops ( forsoothe ) and such a ragmans rowle , there is in it , of which is the first dignitie after the Bishop , which is the second , and so ( as farre as I remember ) vnto aboue twentie , that any foole almost , may see that Letter to haue bin contriued to worke our disgrace ; and so as a fiction not worth the answering . Their last reason was , for that in an other Letter of I know not whose ( the phrase is ) of your L L : for your Lordships : but this Letter would neuer be shewed ( although it were most instantly desired ) because they said it to be from a very friend of ours , a general answer vnto these Letters is ; that it is easie , for those that list to deuise what Letters wil best serue for their turnes , and then make great matter out of them . But howsoeuer it were , yea admit that all were true , as they say : yet nothing else can be prooued out of them , then that many wished and desired our preferment : whereof whosoeuer would gather , that wee were ambitious and desirous of honour : I will boldly say that his wits begin to faile him , if they euer were good . For the humblest men in the world , and those that were farthest off from ambition , were euer thought most meete , and were most desired to take the charge and dignitie of the best seates . God make me as free from all vaine desire of worldly promotion , as were S. Barnard , S. Francis , S. Thomas of Aquine , and such like most learned and vertuous , and withall most meeke and humble personages : who neuerthelesse , were greatly desired , euen of the greatest , to take vpon them great and high dignities . In a word , it was no ambition in vs that others wished and desired our preferment . And as I afore said , their wits weare apace , and are neare the wane , that of so vaine and light surmises , iudged vs ambitious , and their consciences fowly cankered and corrupted , who of so weake and slender presumptions , went about by writing or speaking to impaire our credits , and to hurt our good names .

Heere I would finish this part , but that I take it very expedient and almost necessarie , to touch by the way ( vntill a fit confutation come , which will be shortly , if the Author supposed will auouch it : as one of the best of the societie thinketh he will not ) Fa. Maior . to touch I say in a word or two , a sawcie , rude , and vnlearned discourse , intituled Contra factiosos in Ecclesia , Listers Treatise . because the drift of it is , to proue that we were so farre off from hauing good cause to send to Rome about that matter , that we were all Schismatickes , who did not at the first sight of the Cardinalls Letters , receiue the Archpriest without anie more adoo , & to haue committed many other enormious crimes . I am sorie to see such a base peece of work , & so childishly handled , to proceed from one , who , if hee did not despise others ( that might haue sometimes bene his good masters ) as Dwarffes in diuinitie , ( Homunciones enim vocat ) & take himself to be some huge Giant were to bee esteemed to haue much better skill in schoole diuinitie , than he at his first comming to light amongst vs hath made shewe of . And trulie , I had rather thinke it to proceed from some other not so honest a man , and a meaner scholler , it is so void of learning , so full of arrogant & approbrious tearmes , and hath so many pergoes and properoes , odde interrogations and preposterous exclamations . All which are nothing vsuall among schoole-men . Well , whosoeuer it be , besides diuisions , the penalties that ensue of schisme , and much other impertinent stuffe , it hath but one bare ground of that badde assertion , which seemeth also to hang vpon gimballes ( as they speake in my Country ) : for it standeth vpon a proportion or similitude , this it is in forme . That is schisme in the Ecclesiasticall state , which is rebellion in a ciuil Common-weale ; but in a ciuil state , it is rebellion , not to receiue a temporall magistrate , chosen by the King , and recommended by his Letters , therfore it was schisme , not to receiue a spirituall magistrate , elected by the Pope , and by his Letters sent vnto vs . This is his argument , in substance , & framed in as good order as it can be : but it concludeth not , nor prooueth any thing at all : for to speake plainlie , all the propositions & parts of it be faultie , the Maior , or first proposition taken of a similitude is verie feeble , for Argumentum a simili ( as the learned hold ) Magis valet ad ornandum orationem quam ad aliquid probandum , it serueth more properly to trimme vp and florish out a matter that is well prooued , then to be the maine ground of a proofe . So that it was no small ouersight in a man of iudgement , to laie so foule a foundation of his whole discourse . The Minor or second proposition of that argument is apparantly false : for in what Countrie I pray you , or by what lawe is it rebellion not to receiue a magistrate appointed vnto vs by the King ? It may be disobedience , if they haue not great reason to refuse him : it may bee also contempt , if it be not done in dutifull sort , acknowledging their bounden dutie vnto their soueraigne , and making their recourse vnto no other but vnto himselfe for redresse and remedie ; but to teach it to be rebellion , where there are no armes borne against the Prince , nor no obstinate deniall of his princely power ; is to bring a new doctrine into the world , contrarie to both the signification of the word rebellion , and vnto the common acception and vse of it among the learned . Now the conclusion collected of a feeble Maior , & false Minor , must needs be nothing worth : & so notwithstanding that argument , it is no schisme not to haue receiued a magistrate nominated & chosen by the Popes holinesse Letters ; other arguments he bringeth none , but a certaine generall kinde of Maxime . Qui vos spernit me spernit , which was spoken vnto the Apostles , and may serue for such like , to proue no schisme , but a contempt : when without good reason , and after an vndutifull manner , we obstinately contemne our superiours . In the allegation also of that one Canon Nulli fas est Dist. 19 , wherevnto this trifler often referreth vs . There are 3. foule faults . First it is euil applied vnto a Cardinals Letter , being in the lawe set downe for confirmation of the Popes decretall Epistles , which as the learned know , are of farre greater authoritie , then his owne ordinary Letters : and doo without all comparison so farre surpasse a Cardinals Missiue , that to apply to the one , that which is proper to the other , is litle lesse then to doate . Secondly that decree is onely against Prelates that disobey the Popes commaundement , which to extend to all sorts of persons , is a foule fault in penall lawes , which passe not their case . Thirdly the decree plainly sheweth , that in Prelates it is only disobedience & presumption , not to obey the Popes decree , and not schisme : for these be the words ; Damnatus sua inobedientia & presumptione . If then in these his principall forces , he hath shewed himselfe so weake , iudge I pray you what worthie stuffe the rest is like to be . But because I heare my brethren endure the contumelie and approbrious name of Schismatikes , albeit that they vpon the first sight of his holinesse confirmation of the Arch-priests election , submitted themselues vnto him : I wil by the proper passion and inseperable qualitie of schisme , proue that our action to haue bene nothing schismaticall . All schisme ( as it is properly taken ) is ioyned with such a rebellion against the Church & chiefe Pastour of it , that it maketh his subiect obstinately to contemne his commaundement , and to refuse to stand vnto his iudgement and determination .

These are the words of the Angelicall Doctor , and most sure pillar of schoole Diuinitie , S. Thom. 2. 2. q. 39. ar. 2. Pertinaciter eius preceptum contemnere , & recusare eius iudicium subire . Marke the words . It is no schisme where there is not contempt of the superiors commaundement , and that obstinate and wilfull : which is not when a man vpon probable reason , doth not presently do that which his superior commaundeth , hoping that when his superior heareth his reasons , hee will not be displeased with him . This man ( as euery man seeth ) despiseth not his superiour , although he may by errour or ignorance perhaps offend him , and yet not onlie contempt of the superiours commaundement is required to make schisme , but also an obstinate resolution that he will not ( for examining his reasons , and finall dicision of the controuersie ) stand vnto his superiours iudgement . Vt cum recusat eius iudicium subire . And that you may know that this is not onely S. Thomas opinion , who alone might suffice , as being the Prince of schoole-men : I will ioyne with him that most reuerend , holy , and learned Bishop of Florence , S. Antoninus the ringleader of casuists , who in his Sum. P. 3. Tit. 22. c. 5. § 11. witnesseth the same in these words . Schismatici sunt omnes resistentes Papae non quocunque modo , sed per spontaneam intentionem , & manifestam rebellionem & eius iudicialis sententiae recusationem non recognoscendo ipsum vt caput Ecclesiae . All they are Schismatickes , not in what sort soeuer , but such as resist the Pope vpon wilfull intention , and by manifest rebellion , and by refusall of his iudiciall sentence , in not recognising him to bee head of the Church . Of the same opinion is Siluester Verb. Schisma . §. 1. to omit all late writers : we therefore that delaide to receiue our Archpriest , vpon many probable reasons , the which I haue before rehearsed , and referred our selues vnto his holinesse iudgement , and sent speedily to giue him to vnderstand of our difficulties , with humble submission vnto his finall conclusion : cannot possibly be prooued Schismatickes , or to haue come any thing neare that obstinate contempt , and vtter refusall of his holinesse sentence , which is alwaies accompanied with Schisme , and can neuer be seperated from it .

This argument necessarily deliuereth vs from the note of Schisme , although our Arch-priest had beene chosen by his holinesse , and by the Pope himselfe recommended vnto vs : but when hee was onely nominated by subdelegation from a Cardinall , who neuer made publickely knowne in England what authoritie he had ouer vs , it had bene great simplicitie , ( that I say not great folly ) to haue admitted of him , without further inquisition , considering all the circumstances , of the procuring , sending , & execution of it , as I haue at large alreadie discoursed . Wherefore to conclude this former part , it was neither rebellion or schisme , as where was not any obstinate contempt of his holinesse , or refusall of his finall sentence : or any disobedience , not to haue admitted of our Arch-priest before he had the Pope his holinesse Letters in confirmation of his authoritie , no man being bound to receiue him before ; both according to the practise of the Church in all countries , and conformably to the grounds of the Lawe recorded by that singular Canonist Lancelot . Lib. 11. Tit. 9. de confirmatione . § Petet qui confirmatus est ab Apostolica sede literas confirmationis suae tenorem continentes , illisque ostendet ad quos ea res pertinet , alioqui nulli eum absque dictarum literarum ostensione recipere tenebuntur , without shewing of Letters from the See Apostolicke conteining the tenor of his confirmation , no man is bound to receiue him . To say that a Cardinalls Letters are such , would deserue litle lesse then the Inquisition , if a man were in place where , and the censures also that fall vpon the falsifiers of the Apostolicall Letters : so that I say it was not so much as any disobedience vnto our superiours , much lesse did we incurre thereby any of those censures noted by this Libeller ; but contrariwise , the acts of all the Cardinall vertues were to be seene in this our fact . First of fortitude , in resisting them that went about wrongfully to oppresse vs , and take our priuiledges of electing our gouernours , graunted by the auncient Canons : then of iustice , both in suing for our right of choosing , as also in aduertising of his holinesse of the subreption and other inconueniences of that subordination . Of temperance , that in such a milde sort we sought for a moderation of it , by the way of intreatie and supplication , and consequently some part of prudence must needs haue bene obserued in the due exercise of the other vertues : yet as I am none of the wisest , so I willingly confesse now as I did then , with you Father ( not any errours as you write ) but that there was lacke of due consideration in my fact , as in some other circumstances , so especially that passing through Fraunce , where I might easily haue procured the Kings Letters , and thereby haue beene preserued from all sudden seasing , and secret shutting vs vp ; and so haue bene able to come vnto equall triall of our cause : I vpon other reasons omitted so to do . This my negligence grew in part , of the ouerweening , I had of their modestie , charitie and religion , with or against whom I had to deale : whom I found ( much contrarie vnto my expectation ) sharply bent vnto warre and hostilitie , and vtterly resolute to take aduise of no man ; but omnibus vijs & modis , as they say , determined whatsoeuer came of it , to do their owne willes . God graunt them therefore good wills and wayes ; and so to knit vp this part , all that I haue said concerning the Archpriest & the subordination , is not to discourage any of my brethren from it , beeing now confirmed by his holinesse ; and for that it is better to raunge our selues vnder whatsoeuer order , then to loose our times about contentions : but ( as I shewed before ) it is to purge and cleare vs from sundrie false accusations , being therevnto as it were by others enforced , and to shewe what reason wee had to doo that which we did .

Now I come to the latter part , wherein I promised to declare how we were vsed there : the which I will do as briefly as I may , because the matter is lamentable and scarce worth the hearing , and should for me haue beene buried in obliuion : had not you ( Father ) by misreport therof vrged me vnto the true narration of it . If in the relation of it , I differ somewhat from you , you must beare with me , for that you dissent much ( by your leaue be it spoken ) from the veritie of that matter , it may be , you remember not so well , what then was done , as we which felt it ; Pium est hoc credere , it is good so to thinke , although it be more like , that you being ashamed to heare what was reported of it , thought it good policie to colour and disguise the matter as much as you could , and much more then you should , to saue your credit , with those at least , which take all your words for Oracles ; and by the first setting of it foorth vnder your name , to forestall ( as it were ) and drawe vnto you other simple soules that are too credulous . Wherefore I am to request all indifferent readers , who hath seene yours , not to suffer themselues to be carried away with a smoothe tale cunningly tolde them , but they will keepe one eare for vs ; and then ( laying all affection and partialitie aside ) hauing heard both parties , iudge vprightly as before Almightie God , the soueraigne and most iust Iudge . To come then to the matter , I will first set downe how all things passed plainely , and afterwards examine most briefly the iustice of it , and some points of your narration .

We comming to Rome , about the time you write ( for where you tell truth I will agree with you ) not willing to acquaint that Courtanie further with the imperfections of our Country then must needs , and desiring rather in faire and friendly sort , to compose matters , then to contend with our brethren , we went the same day vnto the Colledge , to open vnto you our good meaning and purpose , requesting you to ioyne with vs , about the contriuing of some such louing , reasonable and indifferent order , as all honest parties might be contented , and so drawne vnto one sweete and sure band of peace & concord . The same our intention , we declared shortly after vnto both the Cardinalls , Protectors . Caietan who was ere we came thither greatly incensed against vs : ( God pardon his soule ) and Burghesio , whom we found more calme , and desirous that all our disputes might be well and quietly ended : you ( Father ) also seemed at the first not vnwilling to hearken vnto that our proposition for peace : hoping then ( belike ) to winne vs to whatsoeuer order you should deuise & frame : but finding in fewe daies conference that we were resolute not to condiscend to any thing , that was not equall , and good generally for one as well as for another : you sent vs word ( much before our daies of hospitalitie were accomplished ) to depart the Colledge presently , and to prouide for our selues where we could : which we did , keeping from you the knowledge of our lodging ; because then we be began to misdoubt some foule play , calling to minde , how rudely you had handled the Schollers & Priests also before ; and seeing that in the citie we were then feared euen of your friends as a shrewd bustling Beare . It fell out euill for vs , that his holinesse , as then was not there , who returned out of his iourney from Ferrara but three daies before Christmas , so that for the presse of great personages , who went to welcome him home , and the festiual daies following , we could haue no fit audience , till after Christmas : you in the mean season not sparing that high solemnitie of our Sauiours birth , contriued our apprehension , and hauing by the indiscretion of one of our friends learned out our lodging , came vpon S. Thomas our Patrons day ( to make your celebration of those feasts ) to visit vs as a good friend , and to aduertise vs , that you had heard that it was his holinesse pleasure , that we should be restrained , but for the loue you bare vs , you were come before in haste ( for you came puffing and blowing vp the staires ) : what ? to aduertise vs belike to looke to our selues , & to be gone betime least we should be taken ; nothing so : but much more like to giue vs a Iudas kisse . For you had the Comissarie with his ministers at your taile , & came ( for ought I can ghesse ) to leade them to the place , and to appoint them out the persons whom they should take , and leade warily , not vnto the prison , for there we were like to meete with ordinarie Officers , equall to all but vnto the Colledge , that there being shut vp from all helpe , we might lie whollie at their deuotions . I know ( Father ) that you came thither pretending to intreate for vs , that we were not sent vnto prison : but that was but for a colour , for that you might haue done as well absent as present . The Comissary being wholly yours , set on , lead , and lodged by you : in the Colledge we were locked vp apart in two litle close Chambers , much more like the worst then the best in the house , with poore schollers fare , and in smoaky coloured gownes , such as the seruants weare , farre otherwise ( Father ) then you bragge of : for the most part kept without fire , being verie cold , and for twentie daies , not suffered to goe out , not so much as to heare Masse vpon New-yeares day , or the Epiphany . Examined we were , by one Signior Acarisius , a trustie friend of yours Father Parsons , an humble seruant of Cardinall Caietane our potent aduersary . The examinations were , what is your name , how old , where remained you in England , how and which way came you ouer , what money brought you ouer with you , &c. and much such like impertinent stuffe to fil vp the papers , that when we came to the matter it selfe they might be briefe : taking barely what we came about , without the reasons & perswasions of it : yea obiecting against it , & peruerting it what they could .

And because Signior Acarisius seemed not sometimes sharpe enough ; Fa. Parsons himselfe would be an examiner also : when I heard that Cardinall Caietane should be our Iudge , I excepted against him , as being one principal partie : but I could not be heard ; I called also for a Proctor to assist vs with his counsel : it was denied . NO remedie , for there was no bodie to be spoken withall , but Fa. Parsons and whom hee appointed : we had not so much libertie , as one of vs to conferre with another ; all our instructions were taken from vs also , and neither pen or paper , or any booke allowed vs , wherewith we might helpe our selues in that our common cause , vntil the day of our hearing came , which was a little before Shrouetide in an afternoone , where the Cardinall Caietane and Burghesio being present , our examinations were read each mans apart , which spent most of the time ; after a long bill exhibited against vs , with some Letters also in the end of it : and so the time was spent vnprofitably , little examining and waighing the substantiall points we came about : we were after that kept two moneths close , attending their LL. sentence , which some ten daies after Easter was deliuered vnto vs : to this effect especially , that we should goe whither they sent vs , and not returne into England without expresse license . Propter controuersias quas cum sui ordinis hominibus exercuerunt , for maintaining of controuersies with mee of their owne order . This is I assure you on the word of a Priest , the very truth of the storie .

Now touching the equitie of it , let any prudent man , neuer so little voide of passion , iudge what iustice it was , first to haue all our instructions & proofes taken away from vs : after to seperate vs that we should not one help another ; then to keep from vs all learned counsell ; lastly to make our professed aduersaries our Lawiers , the relaters of our cause , and finally our Iudges . I would gladly see for the excuse of the matter ( but I should meruaile if any man were able to shew ) a president of such a forme of iustice , or iudgement . Indeed I must needs confesse that the Cardinall Burghesio alwaies seemed desirous to haue heard the matter better sifted and discussed ; but being punye and the other so exceedingly bent against vs , hee could doo nothing for vs . Now concerning the generall point of our restraint , I could neuer get them to tell me , some reasonable cause , why we Chatholique Priests , that had so long laboured with the perill of our liues , for the Catholique cause , and then suing in humble and dutifull sort vnto the Court ; should be cast in prison , before we were conuicted , or lawfully accused of any crime . I demaunded of the Confessor , that sometimes visited me , he could tell none , although he lacked not skill in cases of conscience , but referred me vnto the Comissarie . I asked him , hee would giue mee no other answere , then that it was his holinesse pleasure : you ( Father ) goe about to shewe the reason why his Holinesse would haue it so : but with such a circuite and confusion , that it is hard to picke out what you would say , that it was , because we opposed our selues , and not tarrying to bring any matter of substance against his gouernment , &c. What matter we had against that gouernment , hath bene before declared , and the reason why we stayed no longer , was that we might come to shewe our griefes before his holinesse had confirmed him . For it is to be vnderstood , that betweene the election of such a high Officer and confirmation , there is a certaine pawse made , to heare whether any thing will be obiected against the partie , or concerning that point of office ; that in season conuenient remedie be prouided , and the person elected if he do intermeddle in his charge , before he bee confirmed , is presently to be depriued of all that interest which was giuen him by the election ; which if our Arch-priest had looked into , hee would not haue bene so hastie , as to haue dealt in that charge , before he had receiued his Letters of confirmation ; but you say at last , that his holinesse cast vs in prison , because wee subtracted our selues from the obedience of the Arch-priest , and gaue other men occasion to do the like .

I denie now as I did vnto you then , that I subtracted my selfe from his obedience , either therefore set downe , wherein by word or deed , I with drew my selfe from his obedience , or else let the world take you for an egregious calumniatur . For I was with the Arch-priest before I went , and tolde him of my iourney , and gaue him the cause of it in writing vnder my hand , taking also a copie of it vnder his hand ; and he neuer commaunded me not to goe , neither in any other point did I transgresse any of his precepts . What an irreligious and damnable slaunder then was that inuented of purpose , to haue vs taken and shut vp before we were heard : that they might haue the deliuerie of our message , and be our Interpreters and Proctors , and so make vs say what they listed , and our matter to be such as they would haue it . But say you . Did you not come to Rome against him ? There was no disobedience in our going to Rome to sue vnto our superiour , for it was conformable vnto the Canons and practise of the Catholique Church , and was not , nor could not haue bene forbidden by him : See , Nauer . cap. 23. Num. 37. The subordination indeed did not like me , for the causes aboue mentioned : yet I carried my selfe so warily , that I did nothing against it , but sought orderly vnto my superiours , in time and place to haue it amended , which is very lawfull ; yea if he had bene an Arch-bishop , and must needs haue bin graunted by lawe , if we had had our Courts of lawe as in other Countries they haue : if any were scandalized at this our orderly repaire vnto our ordinarie superiours , let the wise iudge whether it were Scandalum datum or acceptum . I should now according to the order I proposed , examine and confute , sundrie false calumniations , which you let fall by the way ; as that we deposed we had nothing else to say , and that wee could not name a dozen Priests for vs , and as your followers amplifying , such flying tales reported , wee had not halfe a dozen that gaue vs their suffrages , when we had twentie nine in writing with vs , some of them speaking also for others , and yet neither sought for many , nor staide about that matter , but contenting our selues with some of the most auncientest , most learned and of best reputation in our Countrey : trusted to the waight of reason , which we had on our side , and to the equitie of the magistrates , before whom we went to present our selues . Againe , how ridiculous was it to expect of them that are to be so narrowly searched when they passe out of the Countrey , that they bring their testimonies with them in great sheetes of paper , as though the vertue of witnesses lay in the bignesse of the paper , and that we should haue brought some Princes Letters patents with a broad Seale at them ; whereas the magistrates are our enemies . These and many such like I will leape ouer , that I may at length come to an end ; and if my Letter seeme long , let the blame be imputed vnto yours , which , in answere to halfe a dozen lines , grew into two sheetes of paper and a halfe : if it be thought too sharp , let it be well waighed , whether men first hardly vsed in fact , and afterwards by wordes and Letters much damnified in their credits , haue not iust cause to write roundly : and if you like not to be so freely reprehended , be not so lauish of your penne , for vnlesse my foresight faile me , you are like hereafter to be no more spared of many then you spare others . Wherefore to drawe vnto a conclusion , apply to your selfe some part of the good counsell you gaue me in the latter end of yours , haue patience with whatsoeuer falleth out , and perswade your selfe that he which offendeth many , is sure to be offended by many : wherefore holding your selfe within the bounds of your religion , meddle with other mens matters as litle as you may ; and if for the common good of our countrey you please to be doing , take rather the way of mildenesse which winneth mens hearts , then of rigour which lightly offendeth all . Follow the noble , prudent , and admirable steps of that rare ornament of our countrey , and singular light of the Catholique Church , Cardinall Allen , who carried himselfe so courteously towards all men , so charitably and withall so wisely , that he was able to haue done with vs Priests what he would most easily ; and did hold the Laie Gentlemen in such a reuerend and louing awe , that albeit some of them were verie prone to contentions & quarels , yet his authoritie and counsaile so brideled and raigned all exorbitant humors , that in his time , to his perpetuall praise , no great flames of dissention burst out , especially amongst vs Priests , when you taking the contrary course of seuerity , haue made an open breach amongst vs alreadie , and God knoweth what may fall out heereafter , if you looke not vnto it in time , which because you are wise , I hope you wil do , and so shall you purchase vnto your selfe much more good will and quietnesse in this life , and better assurance ( if I be not farre deceiued ) of euerlasting repose , & ioy in the life to come , the which with all my heart I wish you ; and so humbly commending my selfe vnto you ,

I take my leaue the 10. of Aprill . Anno. 1600. Yours in his praiers , William Bishop .

A LETTER OF Mr. MV . TO Father Parsons .

WEll , well , Fa. Parsons , I pray God send you a more sincere and quiet spirit . I finde that true daily more and more , which often I haue heard good Cardinal Allein , Father Holt , and others of your owne coate , report of you , that you were a man of too violent and hard a nature . It were high time that you should permit your selfe & vs , to carrie our gray haires in peace to our graues . The trouble and scandall you haue wrought in our Church these late yeares by your polliticke courses , doo quite cancell all your former desert . Was our peace and vnion made at the comming of his holines Breue , and the most iniurious calumnie of schisme and enormious disobedience to the See Apostolicke , raised and continued most presumptuously against vs & our ghostly children by your societie here , to the greeuous scandall of our whole Nation : was it , I saie , put vp by vs , and for loue of peace and vnion forgiuen ; that presently after we had receiued the authoritie , and submitted our selues to it , you , and yours might more safely and liberally renew the infamie against vs , and by the Arch-priestes authoritie ( assured to you in whatsoeuer you listed to attempt against any ) at your pleasures persecute and oppresse vs ? You haue in the highest degree , dishonored & iniured Peters Chaire , whiles by your cunning you so enormiouslie abused our bretheren ( as good doubtlesse as your selfe ) appealing and comming in all humble & dutiful manner to the Apostolicke See ; defaming them , and auerting his Ho. minde from them , as from vile and badde persons , by your vntrue reports before they came ; and procuring ( a most impious and horrible thing to be recounted for perpetuall , yet hateful memorie , of your fact ) them to be imprisoned as notorious malefactors , before they had bene heard , stopping vp all meanes of accesse to his holines , and your selfe playing their Iaylour , a fit office doubtlesse for so well disposed a religious person , and finally procuring their hard banishment , to no lesse dishonour to the See Apostolicke , ( abused by your information ) then to your owne perpetuall ignominie . And whiles you haue done all this by abuse of the supreame authoritie , through your vnconscionable and vntrue informations : you giue all our Nation here cause enough , neuer to admire or hereafter to exclaime against the iniquitie of aduersaries , who may truly iustifie themselues in their hard proceedings against vs , by these vnconscionable courses of yours . A lamentable case , that now by the polliticke shifts of one person of religious profession , orderly appealing to S. Peters Chaire , must be thought a trespasse , and punished as a greeuous crime . Our statute of Premunire may well be repealed now : Father Parsons a Iesuite , hath laid a plot sufficient enough to hinder appellation or accesse to the See of Rome . Is it possible this iniquitie of yours should be kept secret from the world ? Is it possible his holinesse and the gratious Cardinalls you haue so notably abused , should neuer be brought to knowe the innocencie of vs whom you haue thus wronged and persecuted in our bretheren , and neuer can cease to afflict ? Will they neuer , thinke you , finde out your deceit , and by iust discussion of our cause , relieue our miseries , and repay you your deserts ? The clamours of innocent men , will in time no doubt , ascend vp to heauen , and wee cannot but hope that our Lord Iesu ( whose worke we haue in hand , and whose glorie wee seeke with innumerable vexations for his sake ) will once stirre vp and direct his Vicar , to iudge and discerne our cause , and to deliuer vs from your most violent and wrongfull oppressions . In the ende it will be found we were no Schismatickes , nor in the least point that may bee deuised by an vnconscionable head , disobedient to his holinesse , or any superiour he hath or shall appoint ouer vs . I am perswaded surely , that God will haue you and your adherents knowne ere it be long . For defame vs before wee come ; imprison vs at our arriuall ; keepe vs close from being seene or heard ; yet shall you not goe so away with your iniquitie ; we are resolued verily , that with our good names , you shal bereue vs also of our liues , before we sit downe with this vndeserued calumnie . Either will wee bee prooued no Schismatickes , or found no liuing men . We haue laboured what wee could , that the controuersie might be taken vp , and haue a quiet end among our selues before it were carried further . This would not be graunted by you and yours , but for our good endeuours , they take from vs our faculties ( I might haue said you take ) whereby we liue ; we wish rather you had at once taken from vs our liues , but we take it to be Gods prouidence , that enforced to come to buckle with you once againe before S. Peters Chaire , we may cleare our selues , and discypher what your selfe , M. Haddock , and others of you are : for better , or lesse euill it is , you suffer as you haue deserued , then eyther the See Apostolicke be abused and deluded by you , or our afflicted Church be thus exceedingly disturbed by men that are fledde from the worke and campe of Gods souldiers , and some of you , of no great edifying conuersation whiles they were among vs . Most glad we would be ( God is our witnesse ) if we might on all sides be at peace and sincere friendship one with an other : but if you will not permit this , Gods will be done : we must defend our good names , and our childrens , as deare vnto vs as our liues ; in which the most of vs I hope , finde no such sweetenesse ( how pleasantly soeuer you and yours liue ) among these innumerable aduersities , as we can desire or delight to keepe them , with the infamies you haue most vncharitably and vniustly laid vpon vs . We impute no fault nor blame to his holinesse , or his Cardinalls , in beleeuing your false informations against vs , till wee come to speake for our selues : for who , not knowing your conditions , but he may easily be enduced to beleeue what you say ? your age and gray hayres , requiring a true tongue , and your religious profession requiring also , a sincere , charitable , and quiet disposition , and not a turbulent , reuengefull , and craftie carriage in word or deed ? Iesu send vs all his grace , and deliuer me and all good men from your mischiefe . London 13. of Nouember . 1600.

Yours as you are to our Church , I. M. FINIS .

Errata .

Page . Line . 2. 1. not , heare not heare 3. 16. falce false 6. 7. Lincolne , Doctor Lincolne Doctor 15. 9. instruction instructions 23. 23. pretendad pretended 33. 11. Cods Gods 43. 1. timely vntimely 54. 24. regained repaired 59. 19. praises phrases 65. 24. your LL. LL. 69. 5. to them thither 24. prison : which prison with 70. 24. of for 73. 5. holines , especially holines especially 74. 9. receiue relieue 77. 4. parsons . How parsons , how 82. 11. Conformation confirmation 86. 14. part , onely part onely , 87. 23. sildome seldome 89. 12. persons prisons 93. 11. fildome seldome 96. 1. was 19. Array . The Array the 26. words ( whatsoeuer words : whatsoeuer 29. 1599. ) stuffed 1599 , stuffed 148. 12. tentering tendering 156. 14. of from of , from 157. 19. yet it 160. Marg. Fa. Maior . Fa. Maio. 163. 24. approbrious opprobrious 172 17. mee men 174 14 calumniatur calumniator