Judgment fixed upon the accuser of our brethren and the real Christian-Quaker vindicated from the persecuting outrage of apostate informers chiefly from W. Rogers, F. Bugg, T. Crisp, John Pennyman and Jeffery Bullock ... / by that contemned servant of Christ George Whitehead.

Iudgment fixed UPON THE Accuser of our Brethren , AND THE Real Christian-Quaker VINDICATED From the Persecuting OUTRAGE of Apostate Informers ; Chiefly from W. Rogers , F. Bugg , T. Crisp , John Pennyman and Jeffery Bullock , their Malicious , Confused and Unjust Opposition and Imputation of Apostacy , Imposition , Popery , &c. in their abusive Books and Pamphlets herein specified . Beginning with W. R's Seventh Part. By that Contemned Servant of Christ , George Whitehead .

Psal. 109.3 . They compassed me about with words of Hatred , &c. vers. 4. For my Love they are my Adversaries , but I give my self unto Prayer . Jude v. 13 . Raging Waves of the Sea , foaming out their own Shame , &c.

London , Printed and Sold by Andrew Sowle at the Crooked-Billet in Holloway-Lane , near Shoreditch , 1682.

An Introductory Epistle . To my beloved and tender-hearted Friends , called Quakers , who are lovers of Peace and Unity in our Lord Jesus Christ ; Greeting in the holy Spirit of Life .

IF I did not feel the Lord my God laying a real necessity upon me to be publickly concerned in this Controversie ( and that for the sake of simple Hearts and poor Lambs , to warn them against such grievous Wolves as seek to prey upon them , rend and tear them ; and that the weak of the Flock may not be hurt , scattered or perverted by those that speak perverse things , to draw Disciples after them ) I would chuse rather to sit down mute , and silently bear the Revilings , Outrage and fierce Despisings of crooked Spirits , than spend time in Controversie with them or against them . But the Lord has laied the necessity , and knows best my Conscientious concern , and for what end , and to what effect , and for whose sakes . And in discharging my Duty , I neither consult Events , nor fear Effects , but leave all to God ; for I feel his divine Power and Counsel ; In whose Name , and in the Patience , Forbearance , Long-suffering and Bowels of our Lord Jesus Christ , my Soul hath had a share in deep Travail and Exercise ( with many more of his faithful Servants , my Brethren ) for a quiet Composure of this Breach ; 1st , With Respect to Truth 's Reputation : 2dly , With respect to that Compassion that 's to be had on some , where a difference ought to be made for the regaining and delivering them who have been at unawares taken captive by the Enemy . I have no self-Interest nor end , but the Churches Peace and the Salvation of Souls , and Prosperity of the Lord's Work in the Earth . God doth bear me Record , I have not been awanting in Christian Endeavours , private and friendly , with divers principally concerned in this Opposite , Rending , Self-Separating Spirit . Christian Patience and Forbearance have not been awanting in the Exercise of my Spirit and Testimony . But when all our Christian Endeavours on these accounts have been rejected by some Conceited , Exalted , Pufft up Luciferian Spirits , Despisers and Mockers , that have of late time lusted to be Contentious , and at open War and Defiance against many of the faithful Ministers and Servants of our Lord Jesus Christ , who have kept their Garments and Stations in Truth and Uprightness , and whom they have most grosly abused in Print in their Books and Pamphlets : On this extream Occasion and Offence given against the Truth and Gods Heritage , I find my Spirit stirred and moved within me by and in the same Long-suffering tender Spirit and Power of Christ Jesus my Lord , ( saying , Why should God's Heritage lie under their publick Lyes and Defamations , without open Rebuke ? ) and to withstand , oppose , weaken and repel these their Wicked Attempts and Insolent Abuses , and to vindicate the peaceable Christian People called Quakers , in their blessed Society , Order and Church-Discipline , &c. from the cruel Envy , Scorn , Outrage , Madness and Confusions of certain Persons turned Apostate Informers , Treacherous Hypocrites , False Brethren , and Deceitful Workers , Betraying Judases , Devils Incarnate ( for Christ called Judas a Devil ) who having lost their First Love to Truth , and gone out from us , are become Degenerate , without Natural Affection , Dogs that are without , Wolves , and Raging Waves of the Sea , that foam out their own Shame ; whom the strength of Truth is turned against in Judgment , and God in ten Thousand of his Saints is coming to execute Jude 13 , 14. vers . Judgment upon them , as the Patience of Christ in his Saints comes to be fulfilled towards them , and their Iniquity ripened for open Discovery and Condemnation , as they have not spared publickly to defame the Innocent . [ But they that are at unawares betrayed , deceived or only mistaken , ( and not willful & contentious ) are to be had Compassion of , and distinguished from the other . ] And in Righteous Judgment will the great Judge of all decide the Controversie with all them who would be counted true Jews and are not , Christian-Quakers , and are not , but of the Synagogue of Satan and Antichrist ; whose Works the Day of Christ our Lord will yet more clearly declare and fully manifest , and the Day and Time hastens , blessed are they that watch , and keep their Garments , that their Nakedness appear not , Amen .

Ingenuous Reader , Note , that the Contents of the ensuing Treatise are mostly placed before each Chapter , respectively in several Sections , directing to the Passages therein . And also please to take notice , That William Rogers , ( who is first concerned in this Treatise ) is not ignorant what great Labour and Pains I have taken with him more privately , to inform his Vnderstanding and allay his Heat , by divers large Answers in Manuscript , ( unto his Gain-saying , Accusing and Reviling Letters and Papers ) amounting to much more than what 's herein contained in Answer to his seventh Part of his Christian-Quaker ; but instead of any fair ingenuous Reply , or acknowledgment of the Truth from him , he hath slighted me and my Christian-Labours and Endeavours , sometimes casting Dirt upon me , yet giving the GO-BY to the greater part of my Writings , seeming rather desirous to be some-body in Print against us , as one affecting Popularity ( though in a perverse Work ) the more publickly to manifest his Revengeful Spirit , in Abusing , Scandalizing and casting undeserved ODIUMS upon those whom his Spight and Malice is most bent against ; and I expect no better Treatment from him , and such exalted Spirits ; I expect the Hatred of Scorners for rebuking them , and for this my Christian Conscientious Labour . Howbeit , I doubt not but this shall have its Effect , for the clear Information and Advantage of many simple honest Hearts . And I can say , Surely my Judgment is with the Lord , and my Reward is with my God , Isa. 49.4 .

Several Testimonies and Answers are already extant in Print against William Rogers's wicked Books , as by Thomas Ellwood ( his ANTIDOTE ) and divers others . Surely it would be more reputable for him to desist and lay aside his daring Confidence and evil Attempts against the Servants of Christ , and ingenuously and humbly submit to the Truth ; for our God ( n● doubt ) will finally and signally rebuke that Rebellious , Exalted Spirit of Strife and Contention .

To him who is the Righteous Judge of all I freely commit my Cause ( with my Friends ) in this Concern , for 't is his own . And I do tenderly refer the spreading of this Treatise to the Discretion of faithful Friends , where they shall see a Necessity and Service for the Truth . I not designing nor desiring this may be otherwise or farther exposed to the view of the World , but where any of these Adversaries or their Party have given ( or do give ) occasion by spreading theirs ; as there are some busie Agents among them , that neither regard the Fear of God therein , nor the Reputation of his Truth or People , in spreading their defaming Books and Pamphlets : for which Treacherous Injurious Work , I am assured the Righteous Judge of all will Reckon with both the Authors and Spreaders thereof . To each of whom this Scripture appears justly applicable , viz. Jer. 2.19 . Thine own Wickedness shall Correct thee , and thy Back-sliding shall Reprove thee ; Know therefore and see that it is an Evil thing and bitter , that thou hast 6forsaken the Lord thy God , and that my fear is not in thee , saith the Lord God of Hosts . I wish they may yet find a place of Repentance and Forgiveness , before the Judgment be executed which hangs over their Heads .

G. W.

Judgment fixed upon the Accuser of our Brethren

CHAPTER I

§ . 1. W. R's Hue-and-C●y 〈…〉 emp●y Flourish . § . 2. His 〈…〉 § . 3. He i● proved guilty of 〈…〉 the People called Quakers 〈…〉 § . 4. His Concessions to Truth do 〈…〉 him conscientious in his writing , nor 〈…〉 man guilty of Blasphemy . § . 5. His slighting and insulting way of writing , his own abasement . § . 6. His writing in 's own Justification to clear himself from giving Judgment on Reports and Jealousies , call'd in question , and prov'd untrue by divers Instances . § . 7. His Reflection on G. F. A. P. and my self about the Barbadoes Subscription , ( which we had denyed ) proved Malicious and Vnjust . § . 8. His comparison between some of our Friends and Pope Leo the tenth ; shewing more favour to the Pope than to Friends , &c. § . 9. His rendring R. R. ( and the Pen-man ) like Papists , for quoting some of their Authors , brings great Reflection & Contradiction on himself . § . 10. He upbraids us often with the words [ Learn'd Friend ] yet useth the same word Learned to a Friend . § . 11. His false Suggestion and Jealousie of great Idolatry , touching G. F. and his sordid abuse of John Blaikling , and foul Vntruth and Infamy therein manifest . § . 12. His Charge against J. B. about ascribing eternal Honour , and Perversion of his Intention ; and against G. F. about Infallibility , distinguished . § . 13. His denying the sence of his and party 's own words for a select Company of Elders and Deacons , to order in Church Affairs . § . 14. His pretence for amicable Conference , Hypocritical : His charge of meer Hypocrisie and Deceit , and the Fruits of manifest Injustice , abusive and unjust .

§ . 1. AS concerning William Rogers's Hue-and-Cry after the Name of the Pen-man of a Treatise entituled , The Accuser of our Brethren cast down ; and that this Hue-and-Cry is in pursuance of his Name , because not subscribed thereunto , page 1.

How Insincerely and Fallaciously does he herein begin with a silly Boast , an empty Flourish and Vapour , containing also an unjust Reflection , compared with his false Scoff , ( pag. 21. ) i. e. That the Pen-man was ashamed that his Name should be publish'd with the great Bull , entituled , The Accuser , &c. Which is a falshood also . And why an Hue-and-Cry after his Name ? He is not fled into Obscurity , nor any Criminal , Treasonable or Fellonious Person in any sense , that an Hue-and-Cry need to be divulg'd in Print after his Name . Nor has he either deny'd or conceal'd his concern in that Book which W. R. falsly terms The great Bull , when modestly asked . But why is W. R. so very ignorant of his Name , that he must needs make the noise of an Hue-and-Cry after it ? when but in pag. 25. he pretends a Description of the Person , and of his Habit , to wit , As being one that hath forgotten his low and mean Estate , and arrived to a Beautiful City-dress , &c. And this is not all ; but in pag. 34. he queries about the Pen-man , as having been that no mean Person ( viz. of our Society ) that hath solicited the Powers under which we have peaceably lived , &c. Could he so positively describe the Pen-man's dress and condition , and yet not find out his Name without an Hue-and-Cry in Print after it ? What empty Flourishes does this Person dress himself in ? But what Beautiful City-Dress is that he reflects upon the Pen-man , that becomes not Humility , or his Call to the work of the Ministry , or his soliciting the Powers on behalf of suffering Friends ? And wherein is he condemnable of Excess in that case of his Habit or Dress ? And wherein does he exceed all W. R's Brethren , even them he has counted Honourable ? I would have him speak out plainly in this matter , and not to mutter and smite in the dark .

§ . 2. He says , He will not conclude the Pen-man to be a Vagrant , a Night-Bird , a Wanderer , &c. because his Name is not to his work , pag. 1. And what , if he 'l not thence conclude him such an one , what better Character does he give him , both by the Instance and comparing his or his Brethren's Actions to the ugly Vizzard of a Night-walker ? pag. 3. Thus he detracts and reviles .

§ . 3. He affirms it A notorious Vntruth , that his Book contains Reproach against the People called Quakers in general ; and that the Pen-man quotes not a word to shew it so , pag. 2. But his Affirmation we may rather justly conclude a notorious Untruth . For in his Preface , p 6. to the first part of his ( falsly stiled ) Christian-Quaker , he thus reflects upon the People called Quakers ( which was quoted by us ) viz. These kinds of Declarations frequently publisht amongst the aforesaid People , viz. Let 's exclude the Wisdom , and have an Eye to the Brethren , &c. I ▪ cannot but be full of Jealousie , that these things have a tendency to insinuate Submission without Conviction , and nurture up Ignorance instead of Wisdom , as much as ever was , where this Maxim , to wit , Ignorance is the Mother of Devotion , is , &c. By all which 't is apparent , that his Book contains unjust Reproach upon the People call'd Quakers in general , as being under such a Popish blind Ministry . For what means [ the aforesaid People ] but the People called Quakers in general ? See now , that which he calls a notorious Untruth , is proved apparently true from his own Reflection on the People called Quakers , and therefore he himself thereby proved in the notorious Untruth . Was it not a Reflection upon the Church of Thyatira to suffer the woman Jezabel to teach and seduce , & c ? And what better doth his Reflection on the said People render them ?

§ . 4. He says , He finds what 's cited out of his Book of above Eighty Sheets , is less than Two , and one considerable part thereof acknowledged to be Concessions to the Truth , so that the Light sometimes interposeth . But then he judges this Inconsistent with that sense , viz. That his way of writing is void of Conscience , Reason and Religion . From whence he infers upon the Pen-man ( as he calls him ) Is it not hence plain , that such a sense renders those very things acknowledged to be interposed from the Light it self , to be void of Conscience , Reason and Religion ? And then crys out at an hideous rate , as if he had wholly knock'd down his Respondent ; O notorious Blasphemy ! — The Pen-man acted in the Dark , shown himself unworthy of the name of a Man — May without abuse be numbred amongst such sort of Beasts at Ephesus — Vnreasonable men — I have already prov'd the Pen-man Vnreasonable and Blasphemous ; yet he may be termed a man , though a very Wicked one , &c. pag. 2 , 3. with more Aggravations . This is the Person that complains of a great Bull against him ; but observe his furious Bull here , and what a wild one ! and how outragiously mad and false in his Inference ! What 's the matter with him on which he is so furious ? It is that his way of writing is deemed void of Conscience , Reason , Religion , &c. because it has been confest , That the Light sometimes interposeth and makes him concede to Truth . But does it hence follow , that these very things interposed by the Light , are esteemed void of Reason or Religion in themselves ? No such matter : The major part of this work appears such , and he is measured by the major part thereof . A man may justly be adjudged a Wicked Person , when the greatest part of his life is such , though he may both speak and act some right things , when the Light comes over him , and convicts him , as Balaam did , and some of the wicked Kings of Israel , with many others : Yea , and the Devil himself , though a Lyar from the beginning , yet is made to grant and speak some Truths , when over-powered , though contrary to his Nature . Besides , we do not believe our Adversary to be Conscientious in what the Light interposeth through him , any more than that Balaam was a good man , when his heart was evil : Nor can the Devil 's confessing to Truth at any time render him a good Devil , nor of tender Conscience , his Nature being contrary to Truth and Goodness .

§ . 5. But there lies another great Reflection in the case upon W. R. in his charging the Pen-man ( suppose my self or any other of our second day's Meeting ) with Notorious Blasphemy , acting in the dark , being unworthy the name of a Man , numbering him among the Beasts at Ephesus , with whom Paul fought ; having already proved him Vnreasonable and Blasphemous , as boastingly and falsly he pretends ; comparing this also with what he saith of the said Treatise entituled , The Accuser of our Brethren cast down , viz. 'T is with me to take a little notice thereof ; I say again , a little notice , that so the Reader may not think me so Impertinent as to trouble the Press with so great a Volumn , as a full Answer to every Impertinency , &c. Thus W. R. p. 14. chap. 2.

See now , at what a Villifying and Insulting rate this man writes , and how Wicked and Despicable he has rendred the Pen-man , ( as his term is . ) Now [ W. R. ] supposing thou takest my self , or any other of my Brethren to be the Person thou chiefly smites at , how consistent art thou in thy work to spend so much Time , Labour and Cost in writing and printing against such a mean , inconsiderable and undeserving Person , in thy account , as unworthy the Name of a Man , but rather to be numbred among unreasonable Beasts ? One would think it should be far beneath a Person of thy Hight , Rank and Quality , as thy flourishing Vaunts bespeak thee , thus to abase thy self , as to spend so much time and cost upon such an Inferior , Irrational and Inconsiderable Person in thy high Thoughts . But art not thou a great Defamer and Opposer in thy said Charge of Notorious Blasphemy , and of being unworthy the Name of a Man , & c ? Is this thy Christianity ? Who will believe thee , thinkest thou , that are not of thy own Party ? And seeing thou art pleased to signifie what little notice 't is with thee to take of our Treatise , we cannot but take notice of thy lofty and slighty way of writing . However , we have no reason to take this thy little Notice for an Answer ; for thou hast collected and replied to so little of the matter , and hast so much given the GO-BY to the principal and greatest part of our said Treatise , as one that has found out the craft of Evasion , that 't is a little notice indeed thou hast taken , and thy work deserves but little notice to be taken of by others , unless to evince thy Envy and its Falshood , &c. Thy pretence of Vnreasonableness in thy Respondent , will not hide thy Loftiness and Contempt , nor excuse thy shifting Evasions from those things that are most material and weighty upon thee ; which every Ingenuous Reader may easily perceive , in comparing our said Treatise against the Accuser of the Brethren , and thy Seventh Part against ours together .

§ . 6. Thou writes much in thy own Justification , and to clear thy self of giving judgment on Reports and Jealousies , though frequent in thy great Book : Thou on thy own behalf sayst , I can in Truth declare , that I have not at any time positively asserted any thing , but what I either know , or have had sufficient proof , as may render my Pen blameless therein , pag. 3.

Upon which I would seriously ask thee , What sufficient proof hast thou that that was E. Burrough's Epistle , which thou hast cited for his Epistle , and positively asserted it two or three times to be E. B's Epistle in thy first part of the Christian-Quaker ( falsly so called ? ) which I and many more do not believe it to be E. B's for divers causes ; having seen John Parrots Name only to a Transcript of it in a Persons Hand , writing , i. e. J. Batho's , that was for a time an Admirer of J. P. How durst thou be so positive in asserting it to be E. B's ? I dare Challenge thee to produce it under E. B.'s own hand , to any of us that knew his hand , if thou tookest it not up upon an Implicit belief , trust and report . As we can prove , thou hast written many things from thy own Jealousies and Reports , only with this provision in some other things , If Reports be true , &c. to save thee from the censure of drawing a positive Conclusion ; and then what weight or credit does this add to much of thy Work ?

And I would know , what sufficient proof thou hast of thy Story , That a Friend of known credit did declare , that twelve pence was paid in London , on demand of so much for a Certificate , in order to the Accomplishment of his Marriage , which otherwise might have been obstructed , p. 5. I pray thee produce thy Author and Informer for this Story , and what Friend of known Credit did so declare ? for 't is not credited by many . However , thou art positive in it , by the following words , viz. This being done under the form of Government contended for , &c. Which I am sure is a positive Lye ; for we have no such Action under the form of Government contended for among us , as to obstruct any Marriage for Non-payment of twelve Pence for a Certificate . Such practice is so far from relating to Church Government among us , that 't was never own'd by us , as to obstruct any Marriage on that account .

And what positive Proof hast thou , That the Manuscript of the Primmer , subscribed by G. F. and E. H. was sold for thirty Pound ? Enquiry has been made about this Accusation , and 't is positively deny'd by the Person concerned ; though these Stories thou hast instanced as tokens of Apostacy and Innovation , p. 5.

And what if E. H. was a Clark for his yearly Salary , does that hinder his Credit in his signing our said Treatise on behalf of our Meeting ? Or was his yearly Salary to extend to pay for all the many Certificates relating to Marriages , and the Expences thereupon , who many times was known to be deprived of his natural Rest , in writing to serve Truth and Friends ? And was 't not lawful for him to have a Livelihood for his great pains in Truth 's service , who lost his place and livelihood for Truth , and ended his dayes in Peace ? One would think , that W. R. should be ashamed to asperce or cloud his Reputation after his Death .

§ . 7. His Reflection upon the Barbadoes Mee●ers ( as he calls them ) about a Subscription , and upon G. F. my self , ( and consequently on A. P. who also was concerned with us ) as seeming to sew Pillows under their Armholes , p. 4. appears Malicious , as well as Unjust , being a Subscription from the first exploded by us , and since seen in its defects , and condemned by themselves on our Christian Advice and real Dislike shewn them in our Epistle , which W. R. is so partial and unjust , as to omit the words containing our Judgment and Dislike of it . Hath not he and Francis Bugg and Tho. Crisp herein exactly resembled the Devil , the old Accuser of the Brethren , in accusing the Innocent , and charging Persons after Repentance , with that which they have repented of , which is Satan's unjust Prosecution ? And W. R. unjustly also lays hold of these friendly and tender Expressions , wherein we shewed regard to Friendship , and answered that which was tender and good in them : For instead of shewing himself impartial and just , he minces and clouds the matter on our parts , only telling the Reader , We seem to dislike the latter part thereof — And in other parts , seem to dislike the wording thereof , p. 4 , & 28. But is not so honest as to give the Reader a particular Citation and Notice of our real judgment in our own words in that case . As in dislike of their opposing the Judgment of the Spirit of God in the Meetings to any particular Measure . We plainly signified , That this would be the way to bring them all from the measure of the Spirit in their own parti●●lars — 〈…〉 all must be left to the universal Spirit in their own measures thereof — Now this would make the Belief , which is in the Light , and the measure of the Spirit in their own particulars , not one with the universal Spirit , &c. The universal Spirit of God has unity with the least measure now , as it was in the Apostles days , who kept every one to their own measure ; which was both the great Rule and Line of the New Creature in the Believers and Saints then .

And in dislike of their subscription , we signified , That all are to give up to the Universal Spirit of God in their own particulars , in which spirit they have unity and fellowship , without outward subscription — And further , Now as for your Subscription to an outward Tye , be above such things .

Now let the serious and impartial judge ; Is not here a manifest Dislike shown , and Judgment given ? And therefore the greater Injustice in our Adversary to cite the Paper from Barbadoes , either to prove us guilty of Aiming at Dominion and Lordship over Faith , Conscience and Property , pag. 4. or that the said Paper is one part of the fruits of the pretended establisht Government , as he most falsly saith , p. 27. And the Lordship over Estates and Consciences , he infers thence . He would deceitfully insinuate and charge upon us sewing Pillows under their Armholes , calling them dear Friends , with other tender Expressions ; which when he has cited , without the words containing our Judgment , as to Fact , he then says , THIS shews no dislike to the said Paper . Which is a very deceitful and unjust way of writing in Controversie : I would not deal thus by the worst Adversary in the World , to entitle him to that which he has disowned , and to leave out the words of Dislike and Judgment on the Mistake or Error so disown'd , and to pick and take up those other words which are tender , relating to the Persons , and not to the Fact ; and then to cry , This shews no dislike thereof , &c. What if THIS shews it not , when enough besides shews it ? But is it indeed a Crime to call any dear Friends , who do commit an Error or Mistake ? No sure , that will not hold . Did not Paul call the Corinthians , DEARLY BELOVED , 1 Cor 10.14 . ( see James 1.16 . compar'd with cap. 5. ) and yet some among them did Err , were in Divisions , &c. 1 Cor. 3. And did he not call the Galatians BRETHREN ? Gal. 6.18 . yet charges them with being Foolish . Were not the seven Churches of Asia commended in many things , when yet there were a few things against divers of them ? Rev 2 & 3 chapters . O Dis-ingenious Person , ( W.R. ) I am ashamed of thy Partial , Unconscionable & Unjust dealing ! Is this thy best way to prove us guilty of aiming at Dominion and Lordship over Faith , Estates and Consciences ? How miserably comest thou off in thy Evil Attempts !

§ . 8. That We have given occasion to be rendred in some things as bad as Papists ( or as having a Papistical Countenance , p. 5. ) is a notorious Slander : And that in some other things we have given occasion to be rendred MUCH WORSE in our Practices and Treatments , than the very Papists themselves , ( p. 6. ) is also a foul Reproach . And his excusing Pope Leo his Bull against Martin Luther , rather than our Friends , is no Proof , but rather shews himself more on the Popes side than on our Friends , having spoken more for Pope Leo the tenth than our Friends , † † A Pope reputed no better than an Atheist , a Prophaner of the holy Scriptures , a Person careless of Religion and Piety ; an Avaritious Corrupt Person , who made great advantage of his impious Indulgencies & Pardons , &c How unjust & impious therefore is our Adversary W R. to rake so many Instancies ( as he hath done ) out of the History of the Council of Trent , of Wicked Popes and their Agents , to compare , brand and scandalize Us or any of our Friends withal , who abhor Popery and all the Popes Corruptions . on the instance he gives , to wit , That in the Popes Bull forty two Articles of Doctrine , held by the said Martin , were mentioned , and declar'd Erronious ; by which the World was notified of the reputed Crimes laid to his Charge . But in the Papers subscribed by Charles Marshall & Sixty five more , against J. W. and J. S. nothing that may properly be termed particular matter of Fact , or Erronious Doctrine is therein laid down , unless their general words now following may be termed such , to wit , That they have Evil Designs , despise Heavenly Dignities , promote false Iealousies , set up a kind of a standard of Separation , pag. 6. And is not this matter of Fact , to set up a standard of Separation ? Where then is his Comparison between Pope Leo the tenth , and us ? And how were the Pope's proceedings in that respect , far more just than our Friends ? ( as he signifies ) p. 6. See what Favour and Charity he has for the Pope , more than for our Friends . The causing or making Divisions and Separations in the Apostles days was then such matter of Fact , as that they were to be marked and avoided that did so ; though our Adversary does not own this to be properly termed particular matter of Fact laid down , when plainly mentioned in writing .

Thus I have considered him on his own terms , and taken notice how he justifies the Pope's proceedings , as far more just than our Friends , whilst he would be reckoned against Popery .

§ . 9. That we would not be rendred like Papists , is true ; but that the Pen-man seems to marr it all again ( in refering the Reader to a short Tract , writ by our Friend R. Richardson ) is false : And though both Heathenish , Papistical and Protestant Authors of divers sorts ( as he saith ) are quoted in the said Tract ; 't is no reasonable Inference , that therefore R. R. is like a Papist , or like all those he quotes , unless W. R. would like it well to be so reflected upon ( Argumentum ad hominem ) as resembling a Papist in his quoting Pope Leo's Bull against Martin Luther , as having some more pretended ground whereon to place a Judgment , and as far more just in his proceedings than C. M. and sixty five Friends more . As also in his quoting the Parliament of Papists at Paris , p. 31. Does not this then by his own reflection , render him more like to a Papist than a strict Quaker ? Whilst he 'l needs have R. R. &c. like Papists for quoting Heathenish , Papistical or Protestant Authors ; yet he himself quoting Pope Leo's Bull against M. Luther , and the said Parliament of Papists against our Friends : Let him wind himself out from a Self-condemnation in this , and other points of like nature , if he can .

§ . 10. He seems much to upbraid us with the words , Learned Friend R. R. he throws them over and over upon the Pen-man : he often twits us with them , and yet but in his 8th page he tells us of the Memory of the Learned Samuell Fisher. See how the man makes work to his own Confutation . Though our words in the Copy were Learned in the Truth ; how the words [ in the Truth ] were left out , I know not . And yet a Person being Learned in any respect , it can be no sin to say , He is Learned ; whilst 't is not to admire outward Learning or Acquirement above its place ; which I am sure was not intended on our parts .

§ . 11. Of our saying , That it is at least suspected for a great Slander , viz. That some do look upon G. F. as that Prophet , whom the Lord by Moses prophesied , he would raise up : Aad that he is not ignorant , that such there are , &c. Our Adversary in his inference has perverted the words from [ at least suspected ] to [ only suspected , and bear suspicion ] when as [ at least suspected ] implies more than a bear Suspicion : And therefore his supposition thereupon ( and his Jealousie ) That the secret Reason was , that on Conference with G. F. he could not in Truth deny the same ; And that he will not deny it , p. 9 , 10. This is a Presumptious Imagination : for I affirm , G F. does deny the same , in reference to himself , as a particular Man or Person , whose days and years are limited ; only the Truth of the Immortal Seed , Christ in him , ( as he is in every true Believer , Male and Female ) he stands to maintain , against all Opposers , and persecuting Gain-sayers and Apostates . And therefore his Jealousie , That at length this Controversie , as mannaged , &c. will occasion the discovery of great Idolatry , pag. 10. shews , that he suggests false things still upon Jealousie , to render G. F. &c Odious and Obnoxious .

That the Pen-man offers not a word to prove him ●uilty of sordid and foul Abuse against John Blaikling , p. 10. is a sordid & foul Untruth ; see our Treatise against the Accuser of our Brethren , pag. 246. where we offer what he says against J. B. and others , Writing or Signing any thing , right or wrong , and comparing him to a Parasite , to an Earthly Prince : Here 's more than one word offered to prove W. R's foul Abuse against J. B. &c. who to add to his Abuse , now saith , J. B. has acted the part of a Sycophantizing Parasite in writing touching G. F. And what 's this but to render him a meer Tale-bearer and Flatterer , or an Informing Flatterer for his own Ends and Advantage ? This still appears sordid and abusive , thus infamously to brand any Friend or Person Conscientious towards God .

§ . 12. As for his ascribing Eternal Honour either to G. F's Life , or to him or his Soul , as joyned to the Spotless Life ; wherein J. B. can mean no other than the Life of Christ Jesus in him , I do not understand that this can prove him a Sycophantizing Parasite . For that Christ is our Life , the Life of every true Believer , is plain ; that Eternal Honour belongs to him , is not disputed . In the next place , He that Honours me , saith the Lord , him will I Honour . The Question is , Whether this Honour is not Eternal , ( a parte post ) that is , Everlasting to the Souls of the Righteous , whom God never forsakes ? Then how can any such ever loose that Honour that God gives ? And does our Adversary believe , that nothing may be said to be Eternal , that had a beginning , as to Man ? Had not Eternal Salvation and Eternal Redemption a beginning , as to the Creature , yet Eternal ? But W. R. notes in the Margent , That Eternal Honour is due to none but God , who alone , and not the words of Mortal Man , is able to nourish the Soul which is Immortal : And all this to confute John Blaikling . Wherein he greatly perverts J. B's Intention , and misrepresents his words ; for he spoke of the dropping of his tender words in the Lords Love ; and W. R. tells of the words of mortal man . When the Apostle said , Hitherto I have fed you with Milk , and not with strong Meat ; Was this a Soul's feeding or nourishing , yea or nay ? And was the Apostle's preaching the Gospel in a living Ministry only the words of mortal man ? No sure : For our Gospel came not unto you in word only , but in Spirit and in Power .

His charge against G.F. that he hath described himself one unto whom Infallible Judgment hath been committed in all things , is denyed by G. F. though he owns the Judgment committed to him of God in matters of Salvation and things Spiritual , to be Infallible .

§ . 13. His Marginal Note appears manifestly untrue , viz. That he has not written one word to shew that such a sense is his sense , to wit , That he and some others of his party seem to be only for a select company of Elders and Deacons to order in Church Affairs about the Poor , Marriages , &c. p. 11. What then means his exclaiming so much against our Meetings about Church Affairs , as being an uncertain number of uncertain qualified Persons ? and his Brethrens Paper of Separation in Westmerland , quoted by him , plainly limiting to Chosen men , Chosen , Imployed and Authorized by the Churches ? see our said Treatise , pag 119 , 120. Now if his sense was not for a select company , then he and his Brethren Subscribers of the said Paper , are of contrary senses . But then how does he consist therein with himself , in his charging us with Vsurpation , and upbraiding us , p. 19. with such a form of Church-Government , as hath admitted of no rightful Succession or Constitution by Election , & c ? What Foundation or Certainty can we find in this mans writing ? One while he is comparing us with the Pope , another while he charges us with Vsurpation , for want of rightful Succession or Constitution of any Supream Person or Persons , pag. 19. This is the man that would seem to oppose Popery so much , whilst he is bringing a Popish plea of Succession against us . But this is like much of his Work : I wish he were better composed .

§ . 14. He pretends greatly to be for an Amicable Conference , p. 12. whilst he is so far from Amity , that he has appeared an open Enemy , abusing and reviling us in Print

And what , if his Letter was not read publickly at our yearly Meeting , at the time of its being delivered ? What reason had Friends to interrupt their publick and weighty concerns of Truth with the then reading of an Adversary's letter ? especially seeing divers of us took care to answer him therein so soon as the Meeting was over ; and were not wanting afterward to give him a Meeting thereupon .

His charging us with a piece of meer Hypocrisie and Deceit for pretending to Amicable Conference , is a sordid Abuse to my knowledge : For many of us have not been awanting in that case , but have been ready to Amicable Conference , before W. R. and some of Party with him , turned open Adversaries , Gain-sayers and Enemies to us , whose Enmity has made them , ( especially him ) uncapable of Amicable Conference . And he may be ashamed of his pretended seasonable Hue and Cry after the Name of the Pen-man ; his Hue and Cry shews his own Complexion and Image not to be innocent .

And his Charge of the Fruits of manifest Injustice , that his Letter was not read in our yearly Assembly , being ( he says ) a Letter from a Friend , especially when not Excommunicated . This is unjust and untrue in the first place , and shews an imperious , Lordly , Exalted Spirit , thus to charge us with manifest Injustice : And why so ? but because we did not serve his turn , we did not observe his time and manner in reading his Letter , when and where he would have had us : We did not lay all the weighty Affairs of Friends and Truth aside presently to read William Rogers's Letter ; we did not gratifie his Irregular interposing ; and therefore we must now be censured in Print , charg'd with Irregularity , Answering without order of the Meeting , Lordship and slavish Submission , fruits of manifest Injustice , &c. He seems very hot on this occasion , and a Person very strict and zealous for Regularity and Order of the Meeting , when he thinks it may serve his own turn : But at other times he hugely exclaims against Outward Vniformity , Orders , outward Rules , Prescriptions , Directions , Imposition , &c. But now it seems , it is against such as are not of his own setting up or imposing . And yet he most highly justifies whatever he has written ; which we either pretend to answer , or to shew dissatisfaction in , as remaining undetected , and in no respect unbecoming a Christian Pen , p. 14. We have only his own Self-commendation for this ; wherein his Self-confidence and wilful Blindness is to be wondered at .

CHAP. II.

§ . 1. W. R. questions Ellis Hookes's Credit , and grosly abuseth our Meeting in London , for writing in behalf of our publick Meetings and People called Quakers . § . 2. Of the inward Government and spiritual Kingdom of Christ in his Church . How far his Ministers or Servants are concerned therein as Instruments in his hand : Not strictly Representatives thereof . Our Propositions therein unanswered by W. R. He evades and gives the GO-BY to them . § . 3. His late opposition to visible Persons being invested with Power from Christ to execute outward Laws , Orders , &c. in an outward form of Government , now Overthrown by himself , and the point gain'd upon his own Variation and Concession , and he farther questioned in the point . § . 4. His mistake in his Allusion against representing the Government of the King , and concerning his Prerogative , W. R. unskilful in the point . § . 5. Of the Cause espoused by us , no other than the Cause of Christ his Church and People . W. R. like a persecuting Informer , his work tending to bring more severe Persecution upon us ; his representing us as in seeming Vnion with the Papistical party , and comparing us with Popes , the Church of Rome , &c. Devilish , Malicious and Fallacious , yet most silly and impertinent , and his Resemblances full of Falshood , and his Similitudes abusive and shallow , bringing great Reflection upon himself , acting the part of a silly Sophister , yet proud and scornful . § . 6. W. R's Cry for Justice against G. F. and who must be the Judges , and what Judicature , qustioned . His malicious , dubious & proofless Reflections upon the Pen-man , Ministring Friends and yearly Meetings , and comparing them to the Popes General Councils ; and his Instance of the Bishop of Bitonto's Commendation of Pope Paul the third ( with his Blasphemous Doctrine about the Light ) prov'd unjust , and the Similitude impertinent and grosly false , &c. His accounts against Popes , &c. ( gathered out of the History of the Council of Trent ) he unjustly applies to our Friends ▪ § . 7. His Similitude of Disumon , with the Pope , to render us worse than he : And his Comparison between our Friends and the Popish Lords Inquisitors , and his uncharitable Censure about punishing his Body , and taking away his Estate , all unjust . Of our standing by our Treatise entituled , The Accuser , &c.

§ . 1. HIs questioning the Credit of Ellis Hookes , A Clark for his yearly Salary ( as he calls him ) and insinuating against the Meeting , for whom he was a witness , as not meriting the Name of Sober Conscientious Quakers ; and as being infatuated , &c. cap. 2. p. 15. And why so , but because they wrote in the Name of publick Meetings , & in the Name of the People call'd Quakers ? Does this prove them Infatuated , or unworthy the Name of Sober Conscientious Quakers ? 'T is a wonder he is not ashamed thus manifestly to scandalize and abuse so many Conscientious , Sober and Understanding Persons , when he knew not who they were in particular . Have we not often writ in the name and behalf of our Friends & People call'd Quakers , in their Vindication from the opposition and abuses of Opposers and Gain-sayers of Truth , in matters known to be universally own'd by them ; and this both with their tacit Consent and Approbation ? Must we seek for a Deputation from the People called Quakers throughout England , &c. in all Cases wherein there is a present necessity of their Vindication , when generally abused in Print by Adversaries of divers sorts ? For I tell W. R. he merits not so much as the Name of a Quaker , in abusing at least the major part of them in Print , as he has done , to render them Popish , Odious and Infamous , and rather justifying the Pope , and Lords of the Spanish Inquisition , p. 21. than many of them . And his disaffected Party are not so numerous as he would have us think , p. 23. far short ( to be sure ) of those he writes against and abuseth in Print ; for his smiting at the publick and faithful Ministers ( who are approved of most generally by the People called Quakers ) is a Reflection and Scandal upon that People .

§ . 2. Our observation on the 42d Disaffection shews , that our Objection lies not against the outward Government under which we live , nor yet against the inward Government of Christ ; for Christ's inward Government in his Church , and his spiritual Kingdom and extent thereof , as also our innocent Conversations towards the outward Government , we have plainly asserted in our Treatise against the Accuser , pag. 114 , 115 , 116 , & 118. Though W. R's words are cited at large , more fully to shew his sense and distinction upon the inward Government of Christ , where he adds , viz. Which is not represented by Persons visible by carnal Eyes , invested with Power from him to execute outward Laws , Prescriptions , Orders , Edicts or Decrees , in an outward form of Government visible . Wherein we reasonably took his Objection to lie as much against visible Persons being so invested with Power from Christ to execute outward Laws , Prescriptions , &c. and against an outward Form of Government , visible in his Church , as against Christ's Government being Represented by Persons visible . But now he pitches his Objection upon the word [ REPRESENTED ] questioning , Whether it is not a Contradiction in common sense , to conclude , That Persons visible can be the Representatives of the inward Government of Christ ? Which was not our Assertion ; nor did we conclude , that Persons visible are the Representatives of Christ's inward Government , in a strict sence , absolutely or solely as in Christ's stead : And therefore his Objection supposes that to be our position , which we never asserted . Yet not to loose nor lessen any part of Christs Government , we have plainly asserted , That 't is exercised by him both Immediately and Instrumentally in his Church : Immediately and principally by himself ; and Instrumentally ( in some measure ) by his Ministers and Servants , as well as he teaches and instructs both Immediately and Instrumentally ; as in our first and second unanswered Propositions about Church Government . And therefore as we prefer Christ's inward and immediate Government by himself as Principal , and his governing Instrumentally by his Servants : But in some Measure ( as our words are ) this shews , that we do not render them the absolute Representatives of his inward Government and spiritual Kingdom ; though we may truly and tenderly assert , They do by the inward Assistance of the Power and Spirit of Christ , in some measure livingly represent or signifie , declare and shew forth the inward and spiritual Government of Christ , as being his faithful Servants and Ambassadours ; yea , some are called Ambassadours in Christ's stead , in and through whom Christ ministers , instructs , commands , orders and rules . And the holy Ghost made some Overseers , and appointed Helps and Governments in the Church ( as we have laid down in our third Proposition ) Especially for the sake of the younger and weaker Members , Children and such as are of under Age , as to Truth and experience in the work of the Lord . Our Adversary answers not this Proposition , which is so plain , tender and submissive to Christ , in his behalf and preference : And therefore W. R's inferring and charging the fruit of a confused Anarchical Principle on us ( in reference to our said Disaffection ) follows not in Truth , but rather shews it to be the fruit of his own Prejudice and Enmity . From whence also his scornful Question proceeds , viz. Whether the Pen-man hath known , and hath in pivate a Catalogue of the Names of such visible Persons , whom he may esteem the Representatives of Christ's inward Government ? pag. 16 , 17. He fallaciously obtrudes and imposes his word REPRESENTATIVES still in this case upon us , extending it beyond our Intention , and what our words will bear ; craftily evading and giving the GO-BY to our Propositions in the Case , where we signifie , That IN SOME MEASURE Christ governs Instrumentally , &c. see our five Propositions in our said Treatise against the Accuser of the Brethren , p. 114 , 115 , 116.

§ . 3. Whereas we took his opposition to be against visible Persons being concerned in an outward form of Government , and order in the Church of Christ . Hereupon he shews himself very angry , and exclaims against the weight of the Pen-man's Iniquity , charges him with Prevarication , insinuating , as if according to my Principle ( says he ) there were not visible order and form of Government under Christs Dominion , nor any visible Persons exercised in any outward Order under his Government , p. 43. Whereby he has now plainly granted , that according to his Principle , there is both visible Order , and a form of Government under Christs dominion , and Visible Persons exercised in an outward order under his Government ( for in the two contraries , his disowning the one , owns the other ; his opposing the Negative grants the Affirmative herein . ) But he then should have writ more distinctively , consistently and plain , in telling us , What visible and outward form of Government and Order ▪ he would set up ? And what has he so much exclaim'd against , and not to have appeared so general in his opposition to outward Orders , Forms , Rules , Prescriptions , Decrees , &c. as he has done in divers passages of his Book ; and particularly , that in his first part of his Christian-Quaker , p. 73. in his opposing the Establishment , or giving forth of outward Orders , Prescriptions , Sentences or Decrees , as a Bond on the Consciences of Believers , rendring this more like the Old than the New Covenant . And his opposing Visible Persons being invested with Power from Christ to execute outward Laws , Prescriptions , Orders , Edicts or Decrees in an outward form of Government visible ; as 't is plain in the Title-page of his third part . The frequent Reiteration of these and such like passages and Words , shew his Objection was against Visible Persons being impowered by Christ to execute ( or minister ) † † By [ Execute ] I understand minister or put in Practice , and not in the common Law sence of inflicting corporal or pecuniary Punishments ; for that 's not consistent with the Government of a Christian Church . outward Laws , Orders , &c. in a visible and outward form of Government ; else what needed he write so slightily & frequently against outward and visible form of Government , outward Laws , Edicts , Prescriptions , Orders , Decrees , & c ? What 's all his Noise come to on this account ? Now he would not be thought , that his Principle is against visible Order and Form of Government under Christ's Dominion ; Nor against some visible Persons being exercised in some outward Order under his Government : Thus far the point is granted and gain'd upon him , and his Concession thereto the farther confirm'd , in deeming our rendring his great Book to be against Church-Government , outward Methods , Orders and Rules , &c. A false Assertion ; Though we cannot reckon that Book of his to look with a better Face in the mian purport and Series of it , especially considering his Third part , from what 's mentioned in the Title , and against R. Barclay's Book for Church-Government , and in many other places and passages of that Book , and in his Epistle in this his 7th part he is smiting at Establishing an outward Vniformity , outward Things , outward Directory , &c. But now we must take his meaning and principle to be not against visible Order and visible Form of Government under Christ's dominion , nor against visible Persons being exercised therin ; How then shall we understand his meaning and principle ? Why did he not then more plainly distinguish it first , and brought the Controversie into a more narrow compass , and not have writ thus confusedly and shatteredly , one while against , another while for visible outward Order and Form of Government under Christs Dominion in his Church . [ As in this Treatise the matter is further Evinced against him hereafter . ]

But wherein lies his Charge of Prevarication ? He gives us to know , it is in twining the Word REPRESENTED into CONCERNED , pag. 43. We are yet to seek and study , how to find this Prevarication pretended , considering the purport , tenure and conexion of his Words . For though now he owns visible Persons to be exercised or concerned in an outward Form of Government and Order under Christ's Dominion ; yet not that his inward Government is represented by them ; yet his Distinction before excluding visible Persons not only from representing Christ's inward Government , but also from being invested with Power to execute ( i. e. to minister , give forth , or put in practice ) outward Laws , Edicts , &c. in an outward Form of Government Visible , appears to bespeak his sense than to exclude them from being concerned in an outward Form of Government and Order in the Church of Christ under his Dominion . For if they do in no sense or degree represent Christ's Government , how are they concern'd in it ? And if they have no power to execute ( minister , or put in practice ) outward Order and Form of Government visible : How are they either exercised or concerned in an outward form or order of Government under Christ's dominion ? But this is now granted us in the Affirmative So then , wherein must we understand W. R's opposition to lie against outward Order , outward Form of Church-Government , outward Laws , Edicts , Rules , Prescriptions , & c ? I presume , not against any of his own making , but against such as he calls G. Fox's , &c. as he has told us of a slighting G. F 's Rules , Methods and Orders , with respect to Church-Government ; see the Accuser , &c. pag. 83. But then I would know , whether it is against all , or some , that G. F. has writ or given out ? If he says , not against all , but some ; then I intreat him to let 's know , what SOME they are particularly ? What Instructions , Rules or Methods they are he Condemns , and that he deems condemnable , as evil or unlawful in themselves ? We have divers times prest for a Catalogue of them , that the Controversie might be more plainly distinguishable , and brought into a narrow compass , which now lies not only prolix and tedious in W. R's Books , but also scattered , confused and ambiguous in his Writings , wanting in many places the supplement of his latter Thoughts and Meanings : So that when he has write one Book , it wants another to declare its meaning ; he has taken a great compass to write a very little matter in .

§ . 4. For his distinction between the words Represented and Concerned , he says , That many thousands are exercised in an outward Order , under the Government of the King , who if they should thence declare , that they are the Representatives of his Government , 't would be deem'd a Mood of Speech , tending to the annihillating of the King's Prerogative : And concludes the like in relation to Christ's Prerogative , p. 43. But herein the man is under a Mistake ; in this Allusion , his skill in the Law , and the King's Prerogative and Government has fail'd him in this point . For the King's Government is represented in all Courts of Judicature , legally acting in his Name and by his Power , whereby the King is look't upon to be present in all his Courts : Yea , every legal Minister and Conservator of the King's Peace , even from the Justice to the Sheriff & Constable or Peace-Officer does in his place and legal Office in some degree represent the Kings Government , in the doing Justice and Conservation of his Peace : And this no ways lessens , but promotes the King 's legal Prerogative . For the King in the Eye of the Law is Justitiarius Capitalis , the Head or chief Justice , and hath his subordinate Ministers and Justices under him , legally impowered by him , according to his just and legal Prerogative . Now seeing W. R. is so much out , and has lost his aim in his Comparison , these things are mentioned to rectifie his Judgment ; And the Comparison , as now stated , may be better applied to Christ's Kingdom and Government , who though he be the chief Overseer and Shepherd , the great Apostle and Minister , the great Ruler and Governour , &c. he has his Overseers , his Apostles , his Ministers and Servants and Helps in Government , which is none other than Christ's Government in his Church and Kingdom , and under his Dominion ; which I hope our Opposer dare not deny , however he differ with us in the Application .

§ . 5. As concerning an Angry Waspish Pen , wherewith thou twice over chargest the Pen-man , adding , That the more he stirs therewith , the more will the Cause , which he espouseth , stink , pag. 17 , & 44. I must tell thee , first , I never met with a more Angry Waspish Pen than thy own ; though thy Malice and Wickedness hath been ( in divers parts of our Book ) deservedly reprehended , thou hast in much thereof been mildly treated . 2dly , I know no cause espoused by us therein , than the Cause of Christ his Church and People , which will live and remain sweet and pretious to all the upright in Heart , when thy malicious Work and corrupt Cause will more and more appear naucious , loathsom , and stink above ground , till swept into the Pit from whence it came , and which thou art very near , and without Repentance canst not escape it . 3dly , What occasion have we ( or any of us ) given thee to rage and roar against us , and like a persecuting Informer , to go about to expose us in Print , tending to disgust Authority ▪ and to bring more severe Persecution upon us , as seeming to be at Vnion with the Papistical party ? pretending to discover Principles and Practices relating to George Fox and hi● Party ( as thou callest them ) that run parale● with the Church of Rome . And then to excuse this thy persecuting Cain-like and Judas-like work against us , thou falsly placest it on the Will of the Lord , saying ▪ The Will of the Lord be done , p. 17. ( whils● thou art doing the Will of the Devil , thy Master and Father of Lyes and Lyars ) adding , That 't is but just that Deceit and Idolatry should be discovered in whomsoever , &c. p. 18. But come on ; That thou dost , do quickly . Let 's see what exact Similitudes and eminent Discoveries thou hast shewn and made of our seeming Vnion and Paralel with the Church of Rome . Thus thou attempts it , viz.

1st , 'T is affirmed of the Pope , that he is Christ's Vicar on Earth — Accounts himself invested with Power to execute outward Laws , Edicts and Decrees : Herein ( sayst thou ) I place not much difference between the Pope , on the one part , and the Pen-man and some of his the Brethren on the other . And why so ? The Pen-man and his Brethren ( sayst thou ) account themselves the Representatives of Christ's inward Government over the Conscience , p. 18. That 's an Untruth by the way , and none of our words , but a scornful Pervertion : Where did we so account our selves ? 'T is improper and unsound to say , That visible Men or finite Creatures are the Representatives of Christs inward spiritual Government over the Conscience ; which is endless , and where Christ himself reigns . Where did we ever assume a Government in Christ's stead over the Conscience ? But only as his Servants and Witnesses , by his Spirit do commend our selves to every mans Conscience in the sight of God , and thereby only represent or shew forth by sound Doctrine and good Conversation , That Christ must rule and be obey'd as the Head of his Church ; which vastly differs from the Pope's false sence of his being Christ's Vicar or Representative on Earth . Thou addest , viz. And that they are invested with Power to execute outward Laws , Edicts and Decrees . And what follows on thy discovery and similitude ? Therefore the Pope and G. F. and his Party seem to be in Vnion , and run Paralel with the Church of Rome : That 's false . The true Apostles and primitive Christians had outward Laws , Commands , Decrees , &c. which they practised : So hath the Pope and the Church of Rome ( though not the same . ) What follows ? Did they therefore seem to be in Union ? Thy Similitude and Inference are fallacious . We differ in the Power and Manner of Execution ; and our Laws and Decrees , which Christ hath given us , differ from the Popes . The Popes Power is Carnal and Coercive : Ours , Spiritual and Perswasive . The Popes Ecclesiastical Laws , Edicts , Canons and Decrees are to promote a false Church , Idolatrous Worship and Superstition : Our Laws and Decrees , &c. are first written in our Hearts , and taught us by Christ Jesus , enjoyning us to eye , believe and follow him , as our Rock , our Way and Leader in Holiness and Purity of Life and Conversation . Therefore thy Comparison is silly and abusive here , as well as Malicious : The Pope claims a succession from Peter and Peter's Primacy , * * See Rh● . Annotat. fol. 572. ( as their term is ) as the Rock and Foundation of the Church : So do not we , but deny that Doctrine as false , believing and owning Christ to be the Rock and Foundation ; nor yet do we assume or pretend any Priviledge , Power or Authority over Christ's Church from an outward succession , but only being Christ's Witnesses , Ministers , Servants and Ambassadours , are assisted by his immediate Presence , Power and Wisdom with us , to assist , order and govern us in his service , and the service of one another in love .

Again , thou proceedest in thy Similitudes , viz. 2dly , The Pope likewise affirms , that the Church of Rome is the true Church , and — in the true Faith : The Romish Clergy teach , that we must believe as the Church believes . Herein I cannot justly place much difference between the Popish Clergy and Pen-man , if he approved this Doctrine ; viz. The true Church is in the true Faith that is in God ; and we must either believe thus as the true Church believes , or else it were but both a Folly and Hypocrisie to profess our selves Members thereof , pag. 18.

Thus thou wouldst make me ( whom I presume thou intendest ) to resemble the Pope and his Clergy , and to seem to be in union with them : But dost thou not own the Doctrine to be true in it self , viz. 1st , That the true Church is in the true Faith that is in God ; And darest thou deny this ? What sayest thou to it ? Speak out man , and be plain to the Point . 2dly , That we must either believe THUS ( i. e in God ) as the true Church believes , or else 't were Hypocrisie to profess our selves Members thereof . If thou canst not deny the Doctrine in it self , why hast thou made this an Instance of our seeming to be in union with the Popish party ? For thou knowest in thy Conscience ; first , That it was not spoken of the Church of Rome , but in general of the true Church , whose Faith is IN GOD , which we neither believe of the Church of Rome , nor does the Church of Rome believe so of us . Where 's then our seeming Union ? secondly , To believe in God as the true Church doth , herein the true Church is made an instance and example of Faith in God , not to make the Church's believing this or that , the sole Reason and Cause of my ( or our ) believing the same , this were Implicit ; 't is as , not because ; for Christ , who is God , is the original & efficient cause both of the Church's and my Faith , which is in him , which is the one , living , substantial Faith , wherein is Unity . Whilst thou canst not confute the said Doctrine , behold thy Similitude , what an empty FALSE SHEW it is : What real Protestants in Europe could escape thy Censure of Resembling the Pope and his party ( nay , how canst thou escape thy self ) upon such Fallacious Similitudes as thou hast invented against us ? The Pope and his party believe there there is a God , a Christ , a Heaven , a Hell , Immortality , future states : So do all true Protestants . What follows according to thy Similitude ? Ergo , all true Protestants seem to be at union with the Pope and his party . The Pope and his party believe there is one true ●●iversal Church , and one true Faith : So do the Protestants , but not so of each other , they are not in Union ; no more are we with the Pope or his party , but with the best Reformed Protestants , wherein they differ'd from , and oppos'd the Church of Rome . The Pope believes he is a true Christian , and no Apostate : So dost thou ( W. R. ) believe thou art a true Christian , &c. What follows ? Ergo , thou dost Resemble the Pope , and seemest to be at Union with the Papistical party : Is not this ( argumentum ad hominem ) like thy Similitudes ? and more resembling them , than thou hast resembled G. F. and his party to the Pope and Church of Rome . How like a silly Sophister hast thou argued ? Mayest thou not blush and be ashamed of such silly Impertinent , yet abusive Scri●ling , vain Shews , fallacious and abusive Similitudes ? But Truth has defaced thy Pictures and Images , and discovered thy empty Shews and Legerdemain Tricks , thy Pride and Scorn against the Innocent .

Thou proceedest in thy Similitudes , viz. 3dly , The Popish Clergy think it not fit that the Laity should undertake to treat on points of Divinity , or concern their heads with that , otherwise than to receive those things in the sence the Clergy teacheth . This bespeaks little of any difference at all between the Pen-man and the Popish Clergy ( ●nd why so ? ) The Pen-man on the occasion of my writing some-what touching Doctine , thus saith , viz. This man who is thus discomposed in his work , should not have medled so much with points of Divinity , which he appears so little skilful in , p. 18.

What was thy design in this Instance , but to render the Pen-man and our second days Meeting so far at unity with the Popish Clergy , as not to allow the Laity to treat on points of Divinity ? Thou mightst as well have said , that we think not fit that any Lay-men should preach among us , which were notoriously false , and against our selves and Practice , and contrary to our constant Testimony , who are no Clergy-men , but Lay-men * * But I suppose he hath a reserved and other sence for his Distinction between Clergy and Laity here , than the common sence ●nd distinction : 'T is some reflecting reserve no doubt . He may tell his mean-in his next Book . ( so called ) Besides , our saying , Thou shouldst not have medled so much with points of Divinity , was not because thou art one of the Laity , and not a Clergy-man , but because of thy discomposedness in thy work , and thy appearing so little skilful in some points of Divinity thou didst medle in . See now how perverting and fallacious still thou art in thy similitudes .

But to proceed on thy Fallacies , viz. 4thly , Some have esteemed the Authority of the Pope above the Authority of an Oecumenical or General Council , but some others the contrary ; yet both have agreed , that the Authority accompanying the one of them , hath been the highest in the Church , from whence no appeal on Earth In this I cannot of knowledge place much difference between my Adversaries and the Romish Church , because I know not but that G. F. may be by some declared to be invested with a greater Authority than the General Meeting ; neither can I deny , but that the General Meeting may be by others esteemed to be invested with greater Authority than he , p. 19.

See now , what amounts thy Similitude unto here ? Thou canst not of knowledge place much difference , &c. because thou knowest not but that G. F. MAY BE by some so declared , &c. Instead of shewing Resemblance or a Similitude and seeming Union between us and the Romish Church , now thy proof is come to [ I KNOW NOT BVT , &c. ] and to a [ G. F. MAY BE , &c. ] And then again , thou canst not deny but that the General Meeting may be by others esteemed , &c. as before . So thy May-be's are thy Discoveries before pretended : See thy impertinent trifling . But thou knowest , that the Authority and Power of our Meetings has been frequently declared to be the Power of God , which is the same in all Meetings of his faithful People : We place not the Authority upon any Meeting or Number of Persons , meerly as a Meeting , but upon the Presence and Power of Christ in that Meeting ; for he is our great and wonderful Counsellor .

§. 6. 5thly , What Cry for Justice is it thou complainest hath not been hearkned unto in London , when relating to G. F ? Was it a Cry for thee to be heard against G. F. in his presence or absence ? or was it Justice for thee to be heard read the Papers or Indictments against him , when he was many Miles distant ? It seems thou art for Judgment against G. F. but who must be the Judges , and where the Judicature ? Not thy self and Party , for ye are a party extream against him ; not those thou hast judged Apostates and of party with G. F. for they are incompetent ( in thy own account ) for thee to appeal to ; not the World , for they are unmeet to judge of spiritual differences ; for the Saints shall judge the World . If thou sayst , 'T is the Church of Christ thou wouldst appeal to for Justice against G. F. this grants the Church a Power of Judgment and Determination in matters relating to Conscience , contrary to thy own Principle and Doctrine . And then , where is that Church of Christ thou wouldst appeal unto , that is neither of thy party , nor of G. F's ? Now consider where thou art run . And why dost thou go on with thy jealous Reflections upon the Pen-man , when thou canst neither write positively , nor hast proof against him , saying , It is well if the endeavours of the Pen-man ( who peradventure may expect advance by Vsurpation in the Government contended for ) be not as great to keep off the stroke of Justice , when as relating to G. F. as Cardinal Scomberges were to keep off the Reformation from the Court of Rome , &c. p. 19.

What proof is all this against the Pen-man , but to expose thy Malice and dubious ( as well as proofless ) Reflections to open censure ? Instead of Proof , thou presents us with thy [ If ] and with thy [ Peradventure ] Whereas the Pen-man can appeal to the righteous Judge of all and Heart-searcher , against thy Defaming and false Insinuation of expecting advancement by Vsurpation in Government , keeping off the stroke of Justice ; both which my Soul loaths . As an humble Subject under Christ's Government , I only oppose the stroke of the envious revengeful Spirit in thee and other Apostates , &c. as I really judge it my Duty .

5thly , And what if it be reputed , That G. F. originally called Ministring Friends to General Meetings Yearly ? ( or was Instrumental therein ) as thou sayest , p. 20. Doth this seem to have union with the Popes calling General Councils consisting of the Clergy ? Did not the Primitive Apostles and Elders sometimes assemble , and that long before there were Popes or their Councils ? Were they therefore to be compared to the Popes and their General Councils ? Our placing the Ground of the Controversie on an opposite dark Spirit on thy and thy Abettors part , is true ; and so it is also , that thy opposition to many Faithful Servants of Christ , was the Fruit of Darkness , and no just comparison with the Bishop of Bitonto's commendation of Pope Paul the third , nor with his exhorting all to submit to that Council , which if they do not , it will be justly said , the Popes Light is come into the World , and men love Darkness better than Light , ( as thou cites him in this blasphemous Doctrine ) and to add to this Unjust and Impertinent Instance or Similitude , thou insinuatest by Query , Whether that Expression may be a proper Looking-glass for the Pen-man and G. Fox , to see their Faces in , when they conclude it the Fruit of Darkness not to submit to their Councils and outward Directories ? I shall leave to the consideration of the unprejudiced understanding Reader . [ Thus far thou ] p. 20.

What expression a Proper Looking-Glass ? The Bishop's saying , The Popes Light is come into the World , and men love Darkness better than Light ? Is this thy proper Looking-Glass to see our Faces in ? 'T is but a dull one . Where did we ever in all our Councils , Expressions or outward Directories ( as thou callest them ) so much as resemble such false Doctrine and Blasphemy ? No , we abhor it . What a false Looking-Glass hast thou presented here ? It serves only to shew how Evil and False thy Eye is , and how bad thy Sight is ; how Impertinently and Sordidly hast thou cast upon many Servants of Christ those accounts against Popes , &c. which thou hast gathered out of the History of the Council of Trent ? And how easie is it to make Books at that rate ? Thou hast known better things of the Ministers of Christ's Light among us , than thus to represent them with thy false Similitudes ; and mayest remember , that our frequent Testimony has been ( as still it is ) to excite People to Christ's Light within , as being that true Light which is come into the World , and to his Counsel that proceeds from his Light ; and not to the Pope nor any of his Councils . And thy pretended Godly Jealousie , That G. F. hath been endeavouring to exhalt his own Imaginations instead of Christ's Light , appears Ungodly and False , as many more of thy Jealousies ( which are no Proofs ) do .

§ . 7. And now thy Similitudes of Disunion or difference between the Pope and G. F. and his Friends , p. 21 , 22. to render him and them worse than the Pope , are as scornful and wicked as thy former ; as for instance , to thy saying , The Pope publisheth his Bull or Decree in his Name ; and doth not usually say , 't is not for want of freeness in Spirit that I desire my Name should be hid : But it appears to me that the Pen-man was ASHAMED that his Name should be publisht with the great Bull , entituled , The Accuser of the Brethren cast down . [ Thus thou ] wherein thou hast told a gross Perversion and Untruth ; for the Pen-man neither said , I desire my Name should be hid , nor yet was he ASHAMED that his Name should be publisht with that Book thou falsly and scornfully callest , The Great Bull ; nor doth he or any others concern'd therein , find any Cause to be ashamed thereof , but to stand by it against thy Malice and Abuses in thy Great Bull , as it may be rather term'd , for thy attempting therein to Unchristian and Unchurch a great number of faithful Servants of Christ .

Again , the Reason thou givest , why thy Adversaries ( as thou callest us ) have not punisht thy Body , nor taken away any of thy Estate , is , But blessed be the Lord , they have no Power so to do . Herein thou accountest is some little difference between them ( thou smites at ) and the Lords Inquisitors of the Popish Inquisition , p. 21. I must tell thee , I think this a very Uncharitable censure and smiting , implying that they would both punish thy Body , and take away thy Estate , and so be as bad as the Lords of the Spanish Inquisition , if they had but Power so to do . Which bespeaks great Prejudice and Darkness to have entred thee . And then , to aggravate the matter , thou turnest it about again , That they ( i. e. thy Adversaries ) have not suffered thee to see the Faces or know the Names of thy Judges : In that respect ( sayst thou ) the Lords of the Spanish Inquisition have been ore just , p. 21.

How odiously and grosly hast thou here represented thy Opposers , who have not divulg'd their Names against thee , of whom I take the Pen-man ( and thee to mean my self ) to be one ; And if so , I must tell thee , thou hast insinuated a gross Slander , to render the Lords of the Spanish Inquisition more just ; and by a Lye justifiest the Papists , who clap men up in Prison all their dayes , never letting them know their Accusers ; ( see the History of the Inquisition ) for though the name of the Writer was not divulged with that Treatise entituled , The Accuser , &c. Many others have given their Names in the same judgment concerning thee and thy work of Discord and Enmity , and many more also do own and stand by that Judgment and Treatise : And I must farther tell thee in the sight of God , I see no cause to retract , but to stand by that Treatise , and own my share in it , notwithstanding thy opposition to the contrary , picking , and nibbling , and quarrelling here and there , but giving the GO-BY to the most material parts thereof , wherein the Controversie is most fully opened and distinguished .

Of those Popes with whom W. R. compares our Friends .

§ . 8. Seeing W.R. esteems the Popes , ( yea , even the worst of them ) good enough to bring us in comparison with , and to cite and make them as Instances against us . As ,

Pope Leo the Tenth , p. 6 , & 22.

Pope Paul the Third , p. 19 , & 28.

Pope Julius the Third , p. 31.

It may not be amiss to give some description of these Popes , according to a late History or Abstract of the Lives of the Popes , printed Anno 1679.

Among the Atheists

Leo the Tenth is ranked , who hearing Cardinal Bembo speaking to a point concerning the joyful Message of our Lord , answered most dissolutely , It is well known to the World , through all Ages , in how great stead that Fable of Christ hath profitted us and our Associates . This man neither believed Heaven nor Hell after our departure out of this Life . And such were Alexander the 10th , Sylvester the 2d , PAVL the 3d , Benedict the 19th , John the 13th , Clement the 7th and Gregory the 7th .

Among the Magicians & Conjurers

Paul the Third is ranked , as having obtained the Garland in Astrology , and in that kind of Speculation which is assisted by the Ministry of Devils . He altogether kept familiar Acquaintance with Negromancers , and such like Imposters , &c.

Among Warriours & Blood-succors .

Paul the Third was also accounted , viz. A great Persecutor of the Saints of God , raised and fomented the German War , which proved the Destruction of many thousand Families .

Among Paricides & Impoysoners .

Paul the Third also impoisoned his Mother and Niece , that the whole Inheritance of the Farniesian Family might accrew to himself . His other Sister also , whom be carnally knew upon fancying her freeness to others , he slew by Poyson . And so he is recorded among Incestuous Persons also .

Among the Favourites of Whores .

It s said , That Paul the Third kept a Roll of forty five Thousand Whores , who paid him a Monethly Tribute .

Among Sodomites .

Julius the Third used one Innocent as his Minion , and created him Cardinal . Of whom this account is also given ( in Dr. Gilb. Burnet's History of Reformation , Book 2. Abridgment , pag. 121. ) viz. That Pope Julius the Third ( when Cardinal Pool was rejected for his being too good ) was chosen for his Badness , who gave his place of Cardinal to his man that kept his Munkey , saying , He saw as much in his Man to make him Cardinal , as the Cardinals saw in him to make him Pope .

Query , What worse Persons upon Earth could our Adversary have compared G. F. and Friends unto , or brought in Comparison against them in Church Proceedings or Spiritual Censures ? Behold his horrid Injustice and Envy !

CHAP. III.

§ . 1. W. R's Accusation of endavouring to take away his Credit : Next , to depriving him of his Estate , examined ; and the justness of our dealing with him , vindicated . What sore Reflection he has brought upon himself by his Complaint , and his acting the part of a Persecuting Informer , to render his antient Friends call'd Quakers , Obnoxious in the Eye of the Law and Authority . § . 2. His bitterly Inveighing against C. Marshall and many other Brethren . His unjust Instance of Pope Leo's Bull again . His and F. Bugg's Contradiction about W. Penn. Schism condemned in and by the Church of Christ , as well as Heretical Doctrine and Scandalous Living . The decrease of W. R's Number , and the increase and gathering of many faithful to Christ and us his followers , foretold . § . 3. The Pen-man's writing in behalf and in the name of the peaceable People called Quakers , vindicated from W. R's severe and seditious Inferences . § . 4. W.R. called in question upon his own Principle , for writing in the name and behalf of ( and representing ) divers Persons , who never chose nor gave him Power , nor allowed him so to do ( and his abuse of E. Burroughs and I. Pennington ) whereupon his severe Charge and Inference is all returned upon his own head . § . 5. W. R. and F. Bugg , their Reflections upon the Meeting in the Isle of Ely , no proof of Friends Apostacy , but of their own Partiality and Injustice in their Representation of the matter . § . 6. W. R's again recited Lye about the Paper from Barbadoes , as being one part of the fruits of the pretended establisht Government , with other unjust Aggravations thereupon , farther detected .

§ . 1. TO prove that thy Adversaries would cause thee to suffer in Body and Estate , if they had Power ; thou sayst , They have endeavoured , as much as in them lies , to take away thy Credit , which is next to depriving thee of thy Estate . And wherein to take away thy Credit ? Thou sayest , The Pen-man hath given thee this sort of Treatment , either in relation to thy self or thy Book , viz. Hellish Iealousies , Fiery Agent & Incendiary , his Heart is filled with Pride and Envy . As for William Rogers's Book against Church Government , 't is outragiously Wicked , Clamorous and Abusive . I cannot suppose , ( sayst thou ) what he means by these his very words [ He is here treated far more mildly than his work deserves ] unless he believes that my work deserves corporal Punishment , or Confiscation of Estate . I cannot but again say , Blessed be the Lord , that the Rigid Vncharitable Pen-man hath not Power so to do . [ Thus far thou ] p. 21 , 22.

To all which I say , and that in the sight of the Righteous God , who is Judge of all , that I know no Treatment given thee , in these and the like Passages in our Book , than what thou and thine justly deserve , though in much else of ours thou art treated far more mildly , yea , more kindly than thy work deserves . And dost thou indeed judge , that we have endeavoured to take away thy Credit by such kind of Treatment ? And that 't is next to taking away thy Estate ? What hast THOU then done against us ; yea , against many of the peaceable People called Quakers ? Hast not rendred us Vnchristian , in notorious Blasphemy , Apostates , Innovators , Imposers of blind Obedience , Popish , Papistical Track , in Vnion with the Pope and his Party , more unjust than the Lords of the Spanish Inquisition ( Yea , and at such a time as this , when I presume thou canst not be ignorant , how that many of our Innocent Friends are under severe prosecution and suffering , both in their Persons and Estates ) in the reign of Q. Elizabeth and K. James ? How Uncharitable and Unjust ? How persecuting Informer-like ( all circumstances considered ) is thy Treatment ? And how Inhumane , tending to add to these our Afflictions ? And yet complainest of our Endeavours to take away thy Credit , and consequently thy Estate , when thou art but justly reprehended , and no other Characters placed on thy Work and Envious Spirit , than what are just , and naturally belong thereunto . Hath it not been our practice from the beginning , to testifie against our Persecutors , and to reprove their Envy and Cruelty ? Did we therein go about to bring corporal Punishment and Confiscation of Estate upon them ? No sure . Canst thou take liberty to abuse and villifie so many Servants of Christ in Print , and think they must all be mute under thy Abuses , and none to reprehend thee ? No such matter . They that have but the least spark of holy Zeal , or but any Life or Soul for God , must needs be kindled in some measure against thy abominable Abuses and Injurious persecuting Work . It seems , thou valuest thy own Credit and Estate at a high rate above others : Thou seemest little to value the Credit , Liberty or Estates of many others , ( even of thy antient Friends , called Quakers ) to brand and stigmatize them , as thou hast done , with as Infamous Characters , yea , and as Obnoxious in the Eye of Law and Authority , as thou easily canst , and yet complainest of Endeavours to destroy thy Credit and Estate , when thou hast given the first occasion of the Reprehension and Judgment given upon thee and thy work of Malice . Thou hast begun the Fray publickly , and broke the Peace ; now complainest of Vncharitable Treatment . First thou art Barking , Snapping and Biting , then art Complaining and Whyning , when a little Whipt for thy Folly , thy Pievish and Ugly Behaviour . Oh! Injurious and Partial Man ! Hast thou done as thou wouldst be done by ? For shame give over thy malicious and fruitless Attempts .

§ . 2. Again , 't is observable how bitterly thou still inveighs against Charles Marshall and the Sixty five Persons more , about the Paper touching J. W. and J. S. as judging it In some respect to be much like the Bull given forth by Pope Leo the Tenth , against Martin Luther , Anno 1520. But yet in one main Point greatly differs ; for ( sayest thou ) in the Bull there are Forty two Articles of Doctrine condemned , and the Bull ordered to be read in every place , that the matters for which he was prosecuted as an Heretick might be known . But in the aforesaid Paper , subscribed by Charles Marshall , &c. There is no mention of any perticular Doctrine , or Vitiousness of Life , for which they are persecuted by their Brethren , p. 22. [ Thus far thou . ]

Whence three things are to be observed , 1st , That the said Paper is compared to the Pope's Bull , as much like it in some respect : 2dly , That it s deem'd worse than the Pope's Bull , in not mentioning any particular Doctrine or Vitious Life against J. W. and J. S. 3dly , That they who subscribed the said Paper , were persecutors of their Brethren . Whereof thou knowest William Penn was one : How foully hast thou asperst and represented C. M. and W. P. &c. in these things ? And how do these Comparisons against him , and thy rendring him a Persecutor of his Brethren , agree with his being Dear W. P. This Noble man , & c ? as thy Brother F. Bugg , and consequently thy self , have rendred him , being in thy Book , pag. 73.74 .

As for their not mentioning any particular Doctrine or Vitious Life , that others might know the matters alledged against them ; what , wouldst infer that therefore the Pope's Bull against M. Luther was more reasonable or just ? That 's a mistake , for thou confessest a Judgment to be given against that jealous , rending and separate Spirit from which thou hast not cleared them ( but rendred them the more Guilty , if thou beest their Representatives , as impowered by them to write in their Vindication , according to thy own reflection on us . ) And was that no Reason then to give others notice and warning against such a Spirit ? Is Schism no Sin , or not reproveable ? But how Unjust is thy Comparison ? I ask thee , if thou darest say , that Pope Leo ( that Atheist ) was in the same Sense , Religion , Gravity and tender Exercise toward M. Luther , that in thy own Narrative thou hast rendred these Friends in , that were concern'd in dealing with J. S. and J. W. at Drawell ? And I ask thee further , If ever thou readst any such Acknowledgment , Submission or Condemnation made by Martin Luther to the Church of Rome , as the said J. S. and J. W. with thy own assistance , made as satisfaction to their Brethren , and the Church of God in general ? Though afterward thou comparedst it to a Rattle to please Children . And hath a Christian Society no Power to reprove and judge a dividing , self-separating Spirit , ( in whomsoever it be ) that makes Rents and Schisms , as well as Heretical Doctrine , and Vitious or Scandalous living ? Mark them that cause Divisions and Offences , and avoid them , &c. If thou grantest the Principle , and such power in a Christian Society or Church , what will thy attempts to Unchristian and Unchurch us avail , unless thou canst prove us guilty of Vitious Lives and Heretical Doctrine ? Which if thou canst not , then hast thou and thy party assumed a Power to judge of Spirits , wherein you fairly give away your Cause , and overthrow much of your own opposition to the Churches Power and Determination in such cases ? And your Judgment to Unchristian us or our Spirits , being but your Imposition , we shall as little value ; and the day will yet farther discover whose Spirits are Unchristian , and whose Spirits are Christian. And 't is not thy boasting either of the Numerousness or Scores ( of thy party ) p. 23. that will decide the Controversie ; nor wouldst thou accept of such a Plea on our parts , but doubtless esteem it no Christian Proof or Argument , but an Imposition , and begging the Question : But seeing thou layest so much stress on thy Numbers and Scores , I must tell thee , that if they amounted to as many as the third part of the Stars ( which yet they are far short of ) that followed thee , or owned thy Work of opposition & strife , they would be but wandring Stars , and have lost their Habitations and Glory , and are darkned , whom the Dragon's Tayl has drawn and cast down to the Earth . But blessed be the Lord our God , the greater part of the Stars , among us his People called Quakers , have kept their Station and Splendor in the Firmament of his Power , and in living Union , Concord and Love , wherein they live above that Spirit of Enmity and Discord which thou and thy party are in , and which the Lord will yet farther discover and deliver those who are at unawares betrayed thereby , yet have some secret Breathings unto him , and that they may come into clearness of Judgment , so as on the Restoration and increase of the number of the Faithful and Upright : And by the spreading of the Gospel day , thy Numbers shall decrease ; and many will come to see thee more and more in thy dark and mischievous attempts , and how insuccesful and disappointed thou wilt be therein . And those that come to be recovered , and many Thousands that shall be gathered to the Lord and us his People , shall be found better , and more worthy , than thy self , and those that go out and separate from us .

§ . 3. W. R. is pleased to make a Charge , and draw severe and seditious Inferences upon our Advertisement , and conclusion of our Introduction , especially against the Pen-man , for vindicating the People called Quakers in their Church-Order and Discipline , and writing in the Name of the People called Quakers , when vindicated from his Scandals . But he has very unfairly and dis-ingenuously left out the distinguishing expressions in the first , as [ Peaceable , Christian , Conscientiously , Christian Society , p. 23. ] in the passage of ours , viz. We the peaceable Christian People called Quakers are Conscientiously vindicated and cleared in our Christian Society . Where 's then his exception against our vindication and writing in the Plural , in the Name of the peaceable People called Quakers ? But that , 1. We could not write in the Name of such as encouraged the publication of his Treatise entituled , The Christian-Quaker , in five parts , who yet are a part of the People called Quakers . ( saith he ) 2. Nor in the Names of such as are disaffected with laying Marriages before Womens Meetings ; And these are numerous , and called Quakers ( quoth he ) To the first ; Answer , No : How should we write in their Names , who encouraged the Publication of his said Treatise against us ( if any such were , for they keep very obscure , as not willing to be known in such encouragement . ) It is a Book of Envy , Strife and Discord , and they no Peaceable Quakers who encouraged it . 'T was the Peaceable People called Quakers that were concerned in our Vindication : And therefore W. R. saith true , as 't happens ; The Pen-man could not write in the Name of such as encouraged the Publication of his Book . Whence it follows , they were not of that Peaceable sort which he vindicated , nor W. R's Book a work of Peace , or in the least tending thereto , but a great Abuse and Scandal to , and against the very peaceable People called Quakers . Secondly ; Nor are they who oppose our Godly Women's Meetings , and laying Marriages before them , so peaceable and clear in their minds ( in that point ) as we could wish they were , and they should be better informed , and hear Instruction : However , they also are concluded by W. R.'s words , not to be of that Peaceable People called Quakers intended in our Vindication , in that he saith , The Pen-man cannot be understood to write in their Names ; when 't is most evident he did write in the Name of The Peaceable Christian People called Quakers . Though W. R. as one in some wise Conscious , leaves out the word [ Peaceable ] that he might with the greater colour draw his Charge and severe Inferences upon the Pen-man , &c. But such kind of slighty mean shifts will stand him in no stead , when we strictly look into his Fallacious dealing .

And granting him that we cannot represent ( nor be understood to write in the Name of ) such Quakers ( so called ) as encouraged the publication of his persecuting Books and Pamphlets against us , nor of such as either oppose our Womens Meetings , or laying Marriages before them , or are disaffected there-with , nor in the Names of the several Scores he tells of , who gave Testimony in Writing against Charles Marshall and Sixty five more . ( The greatest part whereof being known to be Faithful men of Sincerity and service in the Lord's work ) Nor in the Names of such as he saith appear Neutral in the present Controversie , and yet own the same Principles which he and his party do . Where is then their Neutrallity ? is it in having no concern of Conscience outwarly to appear on either party , as W. R. saith ? Then they are only Neutrals in appearance , but secretly of his party and Principles , some whereof are very perverse and unpeaceable , as well as unsound . Now I say , we grant that we of the Second day's Meeting did not represent such kind of Quakers as those of W. R. his party ; nor could they impower us in our writing for , and representing the peaceable People called Quakers , or that peaceable sort of Quakers , who are for Unity , Love , Concord and Peace in the Church of Christ among us , nor was it our intention to represent , personate or vindicate such pretended Quakers , as are in a Spirit of discord and strife , causing and making Divisions , Rents and Schismes in the Church ( first disturbing and troubling , then reproaching the Society they sometime owned ) but only those of a peaceable Mind and Spirit ; and therefore his not knowing that we can represent any under that Name , more than our own Second day's Meeting , is a false insinuation ; for there are many Thousands of the People called Quakers , yea , of the most sincere and peaceable minded , besides our said Meeting , whose real sense and judgment ( in the matters treated on in our Book , against W. R's great Book ) we have represented , and who really do and will own the same . Where now hath W. R. shown the Pen-man guilty of great Impudence , in writing in behalf of the peaceable People called Quakers ? The word Peaceable in our Advertisement , left out by him , doth really distinguish it , with respect only to the peaceable sort , which are they that live in Love and Unity , who may properly be termed The PEOPLE called Quakers , as united in one Society , and become one People , and not dividing separate Spirits , who are gone out from us . And though in our Introduction , we say the terms We and Vs are used , sometimes in the Name of the People called Quakers , when vindicated from his Scandals . I say so still . And this intends no other than the Peaceable People , ( as before explain'd in our Advertisement ) and not any such pretended Quakers , as W. R. his party and Abettors , who are unpeaceable and turbulent to the Society and People among whom they sometime walked . And therefore his roaring and clamouring out great Impudence , Pride , and height of such towring lofty spirited Persons as the Pen-man , &c. are but empty Clamours and Abuses , as is also his Jealousie , That the Pen-man counts himself one of the Representatives of Christ's inward Government , who alone is Lord over the Conscience . Whereas the Pen-man never so accounted of himself , nor ever assumed to himself any such Government or Lordship over the Conscience , as is peculiar to Christ alone ; but only accounts himself a Servant of Christ , and a Subject under his spiritual Government : And therefore W. R's still proceeding in his roaring and bitter Exclamation against him , as That he would represent in Print , as if the People called Quakers , without r●●triction ( a Lye still ) were Persons impowering such an imperious Map of Pride and Drollery , as the Pen-man shews himself to write in their Names . The matter is answered before ; but yet I may further add , as the Envy and Malice of this Adversary appears swelling high , so his confidently repeated Falshoods and Abuses are numerous ; for we would neither so represent in Print , nor yet did the Pen-man so much as pretend to be impowered to write by the People in general , or without restriction ; and yet both in Charity and Christian duty , might vindicate all them as the peaceable People ca●●ed Quakers , who are really peaceable in their Spirits and Conversations : And though there be some called Quakers , who are unpeaceable in both such as W.R. and his party ; yet that cannot unpeople the other , who are truly peaceable , but rather unpeople themselves , who are unpeaceable , from being of that People : Such our vindication of a peaceable People from the unpeaceable , proves none of us Impudent , nor any imperious Map of Pride and Drollery , notorious Falshood , &c. as most unjustly rendred by an imperious proud Adversary . For hath it not been frequent with us , to vindicate the People called Quakers ? intending all those that might properly be counted a People in Peace and Unity , and that from the general Aspersions and Calumnies , both of open and secret Enemies : And in this Controversie we vindicate them as that peaceable People , who are sincere and faithful to God , lovers of Peace , Unity and good Order , and whom W. R. and his party , in their dividing and perverse gain-sayings , are not able to unpeople , nor justly to render themselves that People . As for him and those of his party , who promote his malicious , persecuting , defaming Books , &c. We cannot look upon them worthy to bear so much as the Name Quakers , muchless to be deemed that People under the Title of Christian-Quakers , whilst in their Unchristian spirit of strife and discord : And they will yet more manifest themselves to be further remote from that peaceable People called Quakers , if they Repent not ; and the peaceable and faithful , who love unity and peace in our Lord Jesus Christ , shall remain a people , and live when all such spirits as lust to envy and contention , shall be confounded , scattered , wither , be driven back and come to naught in their evil Designs and wicked Attempts ; the Breath of the Lord shall scatter them ; for no Weapon formed against his Heritage shall prosper .

But alas ! our Adversary is still in a great fude and fret for our writing in behalf , or in the name of the People called Quakers , ( reiterating his Falshood again ) without Restriction , p. 24 , 25. he should have said , Peaceable People called Quakers . But he goes on at an outragious rate on this subject , confessing , He wants words to represent the Action in as ugly a dress as it deserves . And therefore when he hath as falsly asperst the Pen-man , and set him out in as Vgly a Dress as he can ( so that the Devil and William Rogers have done their worst hitherto ) he supposeth a Comparison in the case against him , but very unjustly in these words , viz.

Suppose a company of men , never chosen according to Law , should meet at Westminster , and call themselves the Representatives of the People of England , and accordingly in the Name of the People of England proceed to act as such : Wouldst thou not abhor and detest the Action ? And how canst thou think that we can do less than detest thy insolent Spirit , by offering to write in the Name of the People called Quakers , without Restriction , when they gave neither thee nor any of thy Brethren such Authority ? Had the fear of God been before thine Eyes , thou couldst not have attempted to have done so Wickedly , p. 25.

Here it is probable he thinks , he hath given the Pen-man a deadly Blow ; but when the Devil and William Rogers have done their worst , it comes to little Execution , but to manifest his Envy and Folly . He only shews his Teeth , but cannot bite nor fasten ; for there is no just paralel in the case ; there is no such kind of Treasonable proceeding justly chargeable upon the Pen-man , as is inferred in the Comparison : The Pen-man did not call himself the Representative , nor write in the Name of the People ( or of all those ) called Quakers , without Restriction , as he falsly saith , nor pretend an Election or Authority from them so to do ; the matter is distinguished and answered before , and yet the Pen-man might lawfully represent the Innocency of all true peaceable Quakers , both as to Principle and Practice , when abused and calumniated , either as Vnchristian or Popish Imposers , &c. without Conviction ( like as this Adversary hath frequently misrepresented them ) And this may be done charitably , freely and voluntarily in their Name and Vindication , and in true Unity , from a right knowledge of their Innocency , declared Sense and Principles ; And hath not this been the Practice of many faithful Servants of Christ among us , ever since we were a People , to write both in the name & vindication of the People of God called Quakers , or of the Innocent People called Quakers , &c. as the Lord hath laid a necessity upon them , and yet not to include those who are unfaithful or scandalous to Truth , or any who are turned into Envy and Strife , though they go under that Name ? Nor yet have they sought or needed to seek Commission from the whole People , to write in their behalf , being required of the Lord to write . And did not many of the best reformed Protestants and Martyrs write in the name and behalf of the Protestant Church and Religion , as the Book of Martyrs and other Histories , and their own Writings shew ; of which numerous Instances might be given . And did not the the Apostles of Christ often write in the Plural , both in the name and behalf of themselves and the rest of true Believers and Fellow-members , under the terms , We , and Vs , and Our , &c. especially in that of 1 John 2.19 . They went out from Us , but they were not of Us ; for if they had been of Us , they would no doubt have continued with Us ; see chap. 3.14 . and 4.6 . Here John wrote in the Name of his Brethren and Fellow-members , and distinguished themselves from those that went out from them , as we have our selves , as a peaceable People , from you that are gone out from us , into a Spirit of Enmity , Discord and Self-separation .

§ . 4. But ( W. R. ) since thou countest it such a horrid Crime , such great Impudence , Pride , ugly Action , Insolence , &c. to write in the name or on the behalf of People or Persons , or in their Vindication , without being impowered , authorized and chosen by the same Persons or People . Now observe well upon thy own principle and way of arguing , what a Reckoning I have with thee : Let us seriously enquire of thee , Have all those Persons in whose behalf and Name thou hast written in the Plural ( under the Terms We , Vs , &c ) given thee Authority , or chosen thee to write in their Name and behalf ? Did John Story , John Wilkinson , and now the person in Cambridgshire ( whom thou and Francis Bugg contend for , against the Record about his Marriage ) all give thee Authority ( or chuse thee ) to write on their behalf , and to expose their Names in Print , as thou hast done in thy state of the Controversie on their behalf ? Did they give thee Authority to write in their names and behalf , as those Other Friends in Truth thou tellest of and representest ? Either they did , or they did not ; if they did , then they may be entituled to , and are justly chargeable with thy work , how perverse and abusive soever it be ; If they did not chuse nor authorize thee to write in their behalf and name , then thy own Judgment returns upon thy own head , as one guilty of great Impudence , Pride , towring lofty Spirit , notorious Falshood , ugly Dress , &c. to write in the name and vindication of Persons , and to represent them who never gave thee Power , nor chose thee to thy work . Didst not thou pretend to write on behalf of thy self , and other Friends in Truth concerned , as in the Title-page of thy great Book ? and now to use the words Vs , We or Our , with respect to such as encouraged the giving forth thereof , as in thy Advertisement to thy seventh part ? When now divers noted Persons , who have appeared of thy party , refuse to stand by thy Books ; and we know none of them that dare say , they gave thee any such Authority , or chose thee to be their Representative to write in their name and behalf , as thou hast done ( against many faithful Friends , whom the Lord is with and will stand by , against thy crooked Spirit and Opposition ) but rather , those thy Friends in Truth pretended ( on enquiry , if they own and will stand by thy Books ) as it has been often asked them , particularly at Devonshire-house , in 1681. have answered , That William Rogers must answer for himself , if he hath done more than he can answer , or wronged any : They will not stand by him ; 'T is his own Act , he must look to it , &c. Thus upon a pinch they leave him in the lurch to shift for himself ; they 'l not stand by him openly however ; they own him not for their Representative , though he hath represented them , and written as in their Name , Person and Vindication ; as also represented them as Encouragers of the giving forth of his great Book , falsly stiled , The Christian-Quaker , &c.

But to deal more closely and positively with thee in this matter , how camest thou to expose Edward Burroughs Name in Print , and to represent him as a Person of thy Principle and Judgment , by a confused , unsound whimsical Paper , which thou hast printed in thy great Book , with Edward Burrough's Name put to it , and represented it as his Testimony , and even in thy Title-page sayst , it was given forth in the year 1661. by Edw. Burroughs , and since the same is reprinted over and over by thy busie informing Agent Thomas Crisp , as E. B's Vision ; but I am perswaded thou and he have grosly abused and mis-represented that Servant of the Lord E. B. by rendring him the Author of such Absurdities as are contained in that same Paper about the Shepherd and his Dogs , &c. particularly in that passage of the Shepherd's gathering the Sheep with the many Goats , that did push , trouble and hurt the Sheep with their Horns , and putting them into the Fold ; and that he made fast the door , and would not separate them until he had the other Sheep also , that did not come with the Flock . See what Doctrine this is , as applyed to Christ , the good Shepherd , rendring him so severe to his Sheep , as to gather , shut up and keep so many Goats , so long among them in his Fold , to trouble , bruise and hurt his poor Sheep with their Horns . And also , that Warning and Precept given in the said Paper to Friends , for all to forbear judging any man any more , upon any pretence whatsoever : Can any that knew E. B. and the soundness of judgment & understanding that he was attain'd to in the year 1661. believe that he was the Author of such Doctrine to all Friends , as to judge no man under any pretence whatsoever ? A man well known severely to judge deceitful Workers and rebellious Ones , as ( yea , he testified plainly against John Perrot's spirit of Division ) is fully evinced in his Books and Writings . And I dare presume E.B. never gave thee authority , nor chose thee or Tho. Crisp to represent him in print ( so many years after his decease ) as the Author of the said Paper or warning to all friends , To judge no man under any pretence whatsoever : And yet thou art severely judging and reproaching others that are not of thy party as Apostates , Innovators , &c. contrary to such an express precept & doctrine espoused by thee , as E. B's Testimony . Besides the express contradiction to thy self in thus representing E. B. in print , without his leave , authority or consent , what great abuse hast thou done to him , his Memory , Name and Testimony , in exposing him in Print , as Author of that which doth not so much as look like him or his Testimony , or any Vision of his , but in the said Doctrines both contrary to his Judgment and Practice ? I say , what a horrid Abuse hast thou done to the Name and Memory of the dead in Christ , and that by promoting a forged Subscription , if thou canst not give sufficient demonstration and proof , that Edw. Burroughs was the Author of the same Paper aforesaid , which thou hast exposed in his name in Print ? If thou sayst , it was delivered to thee with Edw. Burrough 's name to it : I say , that 's no proof of its being his ; for both I and divers others have seen a Copy of the same only with J. Perrots name to it ; and this more probably true , that he was the Author , for divers reasons , than thy rendring E. B. the Author .

Again , thou hast also exposed that honest and innocent Person Isaac Pennington in Print , to serve thy own turn and thy parties , as a Confirmation of thy work , and that after his decease also , for which I dare presume he gave thee no authority , nor chose thee so to represent him in Print , or to pick out of the middle , diminish or curtalize his Writings or Testimony , by leaving out the most material and explanatory precedent and subsequent Passages thereof , to the great injury and abuse of his Intention ; for which his Son John Pennington was stirred up to vindicate his deceased Father , and to detect thy abuse and Prevarication . And am satisfied , that neither Edward Burroughs nor John Crook gave thee Authority to quote or cite them , or either of them in opposition to G. F. as thou hast John Crook especially , in thy Epistle , pag. 3. nor to tell the World in Print , That his Testimony is agreeable to thy sence : I do not believe J. C. will in the least own thee in thy work of Opposition , and strife against many faithful Servants of Christ .

Also , thou and Francis Bugg have represented William Penn in Print , on some passages pickt out of his Address to Protestants , as in thy 66 and 73 pages , which he never gave you power to do , much less to represent him ( as if he were one in Judgment with you against his Brethren ) nor did he give thee or F. Bugg leave to discant upon and turn his words to serve your own turns , nor to apply them against such his Friends in the Isle of Ely or else-where , who are for Womens Meetings , and laying Marriages twice before the Mens and Womens Meetings ; it is not to be supposed , that he intended [ Fly Rome at Home ] as proper Admonition to them , as thy Brother F. Bugg applies them , as in the Authority and genuine sence of Dear W. P. p. 78. calling William Penn , Dear Friend , p. 65. This Noble Man , &c. p. 73. Which is to render W. P. exactly one of your own party ; and all this without his authority leave or consent .

But how comes he now to be Dear William Penn , Dear Friend , and This Noble man ? Hast not thou numbred him among the Persecutors of J. S. and J. W. as thou esteemest Charles Marshall and Sixty Five more ( as thy phrase is ) who signed the Paper thou art so much offended at ? p. 22 , 27. Was not William Penn one of those sixty six Subscribers ? And dost not thou on this very occasion retort his words [ Let us fly Rome at Home ? ] What! must he therefore be a Persecutor of his Brethren , and yet a Dear Friend , Dear William Penn , This Noble man , &c. in thy Book ? What Self-contradiction and manifest Flattery art thou and thy Brother Bugg ( like Parasites ) guilty of ? Pray lift up your Eyes and see your selves , if not judicially given over to blindness and hardness of heart .

Take another Instance or two of thy Self-contradictory dealing ; Didst not thou expose a Certificate or Testimony ( as thou esteemedst it ) of Nathaniel Crips in Print against G. F. without any Authority from Nathaniel for so doing ? I am sure he confest as much to me and John Bouldron the 6th Moneth , 1679. against thy publishing it in Manuscript , as that thou didst it without his advice , knowledge or order ; see our Book , Accuser , &c. p. 172

And likewise , that pretended Certificate or Testimony of Edw. Perkins , which thou printedst against G. F. Edward confessed to me at sundry times and before divers Persons , that he did not give any advice or consent to thy printing it ; for 't was printed without his knowledge . And so , we may question or suppose thou hast done the like in the rest , or most of the pretended Testimonies against G. F. &c. from those Women and others of Bristol , &c.

Now may not I rationally take leave to reflect and argue , ad hominem , upon thee , and according to thy own Terms thus , Oh! thou Imperious Map of Pride , towring lofty and Lordly Spirit , insolent and conceited , proud Vsurper ! how durst thou either write in the name or behalf of so many , whom thou countest Friends in Truth , and numerous too ? or expose the names of so many deceased Servants of Christ in thy Quarrel , as if they were all on thy side and party , when thy gave thee no power , nor deputed thee so to do ? And thou must answer for thy misrepresenting them , and abusing their Names , Memories and Testimonies , when the chieftains of thy own party dare not stand by thy work , nor own thee for their Representative , but leave thee to stand by it thy self , as thy own . What an unjust and false Representative hast thou shewn thy self , by thy own rule and manner of Reflection upon others ? though I am apt to think that some few have privately encouraged thee in thy travail , who now are afraid publickly to stand by thy deform'd , inform unshapely and monstrous Birth , begotten and brought forth by the old Accuser of the Brethren ; though some are not ashamed to promote and expose it to Sale , but it will turn to their own shame , and be their burden at length .

§. 5 Again , to prove thy false charge of Apostacy and Innovation against us ( p. 26. ) thou insistest on a Record in the Quarterly Meeting Book at Hadenham in the Isle of Ely about * * I tenderly forbear exposing the Person 's name at present , believing that 't was not by his order or consent that W.R. & F B. have made him such a subject of printed controversie ; as also hoping that he has more charity & tenderness in him than to allow of their malicious Books . a Marriage , shewing Friends dislike of the manner of proceeding and disunion there-with . The Question is , Whether the person concern'd gave thee Authority to expose this in Print to make him a subject of the Controversie , and proof of our Apostacy ? If not , as I presume he did not , but rather F. B. from whom , thou sayst , thou receivedst it ; then hast thou shewn thy self no Friend to the Person concerned , in exposing his name in Print , in a matter that tends to his disrepute and disgrace , and that in plain contradiction to thy own Principle and Judgment against us ; and yet the ground of Friends dissatisfaction in that case , thou dost not demonstrate , ( wherein thou hast done partially and unjustly , which necessitates this discovery ) but sayst , It is for not proceeding exactly in that outward new formed Method : Whereas 't was an Innovation or new Method that Friends were offended at , viz. propounding the Marriage but once to the Meeting , and that in the Womans absence ( with whom he intended Marriage ) which is both a new Method and Imposition on Friends , upon his bear word and credit , without the Woman's Testimony from her own Mouth , which should have been allowed Friends , and that at two sundry Meetings , from both the Persons concerned ; which is no new formed Method , but that which has been many years among us , and is a necessary and commendable Method , both for enquiry into the Persons clearness from other Engagements , and tending to a general satisfaction of Friends in Truth . And this Method doth neither invalidate nor derogate from that antient Advice of Friends , cited in thy 4th Chapter concerning Marriage , pag 66. viz.

Let it be made known to the Children of Light , especially to those of the Meeting , to which the parties are Members , that all in the Light may witness it to be of God , and that no Scandal may rest upon the Truth , nor any thing done in secret , but all things brought to the Light , &c. This is general , and was wholsom advice . And there is no particular Method used among us , but it tends to the same good end , ( viz. for the satisfaction and Testimony of all in the Light ) and doth not in the least contradict or lessen it ▪ Where 's then the Antichristian Imposition , Apostacy and Innovation , thou chargest in the Contents of thy fourth Chapter ? Is it in proposing Marriages twice ( or at two sundry times ) to the Meetings the parties b●long to ? and that by both the parties concerned , to prevent Scandal and Clandestine proceedings , and that Friends in the Light may witness it to be of God , which is our Method ; and in which the Person aforesaid did not proceed , in his proposing his intention of Marriage but once , and that in the Womans absence ( as Friends have given account ) and for which cause Friends expressed they had not Vnion with him in so doing : But it seems thou hast , in being so officious an Advocate for him against Friends for their Conscientious dislike recorded against such an Example or President ; and scoffing at our Women Friends in the Isle of Ely , as ( thou sayest ) may be accounted of the QVORVM , p. 24. Is this thy proof of Antichristian Imposition , Apostacy and Innovation against us ? Where 's thy Christianity , Conscience , Religion and Order pretended ? Oh! be ashamed of thy Scornful , Unchristian and Infamous Attempts . And also it was no Friendly part in thee , to endeavour to expose the Quarterly Meeting of the Isle of Ely in Print to publick censure , on the bare Information of Francis Bugg , thy Informer , ( who has shewn himself , a Party and open Adversary against that Meeting ) rendring it no better than an Imposing Church , a False Church , p. 74. against whom thou hast joyned in Judgment with him , without hearing that Meeting 's own defence and answer to Francis Bugg in the case : is this thy judicial and equal proceedings ? Oh for shame , give over thy partial and impertinent Scribling ! And what if the said Quarterly Meeting , would not once hear F. Bugg's Letter , nor suffer it to be read ? It appears he has not behaved himself so well and obligingly to that Meeting , as to engage Friends there to lay by their other concerns , to hear his Letter against their proceeding : They were not ignorant of F. B's turbulent Spirit ; witness his troublesom work , his ignoble , base and crafty dealing against Samuel Cater about the Fine , &c. a particular account whereof is expected from G. Smith and Friends of the Isle of Ely , who know the transaction in the Circumstances of the subtil Intreague , which possibly may be a Rebuke to Francis Bugg his Immorality in the ●ase , & corrupt Conscience , as well as to his Pride and Insolence , as an Ensample to Posterity , which I really think he deserves , if he 'l not study to be quiet towards Friends his peaceable Neighbours .

In his said Letter to the Quarterly Meeting at H●denham in the Isle of Ely ( and which is printed in thy Book , part 7. p. 72. ) though he flatteringly begins with Dear Friends , he accuseth them about the Record against J. A. as excluding him out of the Vnity of Friends , and with Excommunication , &c. Wherein he has dealt prevaricatingly and falsly , as appears by his and thy own account of the Meeting 's Record , which is , That they have no Vnion with him in THIS HIS SO DOING : Which relates to that particular Act , and not wholly to exclude the Person out of the Vnity in all other things as one Excommunicate , &c. Yet he proceeds Reflectingly , telling them of Stigmatizing , laying stress where God hath laid none — Excommunicating about such things which are at best but mens Traditions , and Impositions — Imposing false Church . Applying William Penn's words , This noble Man's words ( as he flatteringly stiles him ) [ Fly Rome at Home ] to the said Quarterly-Meeting , which were never so intended by W. P. Thus thou and F. B. have abused W. P. in Print , shamefully perverting his words and intention , who never could intend to bid a Quarterly-Meeting Fly Rome at Home , either for testifying against such Irregularity as proposing a Marriage but once to a Meeting , and that in the absence of the Woman concerned ; nor yet for justifying upon the Method of proposing the Marriage twice before consumated . Is this that Rome at home which Thou and F. B. would have Friends to Fly ? ( for I take thee and F. B. to be in great Union now in your work , seeing you appear so joyntly together in Print , and to charge Friends with Imposition , Immorality , Pag. 27. &c. as thou hast done . ) But he deals partially , as thou hast done , in not manifesting the occasion of Friends dissatisfaction , he charging them with Excluding the aforesaid Person , what in them lies , out of the Vnity , Excommunicating , &c. In which he placeth the Controversie but about manifesting his intention to Marry ; P. 72. and then crys , Behold the Crime ! But shews not what it is in the manner of circumstances of it . Thus partial and covered you are in stating matters .

But the said Meeting would not hear his Letter : What great Crime was that ? To this thou sayst , viz. Should the Supream Power in this Nation have treated our Friends so as not to hear our Addresses , P. 26. many Goals might at this day have remained full of honest Friends , who have been discharged from their sore Imprisonments . There 's no parallel in the case between Friends tender Addresses to Authority for Relief of Friends in Distresses , Goals , &c and F. Bugg's ●●●lecting abusive Letter to Friends , in vindication of an Irregular Practice , unwarrantable , and tending to a corrupt fleshly Liberty , as that of Proposing the Marriage but once to the Meeting , &c. Howbeit , 't is a marvel thou wilt grant us so much Truth , as that our Addresses have at any time had so good effect with Authority , as to obtain the enlargement of so many honest Friends out of their sore Imprisonments . This is more than some of thy Party have owned . However , considering thy Concession herein , 't is the worse requital in thee to villifie and abuse such in Print as have been most industrious with the supream Power in the Sufferers behalf , as to my knowledge thou hast very evilly requited and treated some such , rather like a revengeful Persecutor , than a Helper of the oppressed .

So thy Charge of Immorality on the Quarterly Meeting in the Isle of Ely , for not hearing F. B's Letter , and instancing the Parliaments admitting us to represent our Agrievance , P. 27. &c. are still both unjust and no ways parallel . For if we had given the like occasion against the Parliament , that thou and F. B. have against us , they might very well have rejected our Applications , as Persons insolent to , and contemning of Government ; should we have rendred them no more rightly in Government than you have our Meetings for a Church of Christ , how should they have accepted our Addresses ? As if we should have told them , they were a false , usurping , imposing , apostate Parliament , they might justly have rejected our Addresses .

§ . 6. Moreover , 't is a shameful Lye and Abuse for thee again to recite the Paper from Barbadoes , As one part of the fruits of the pretended establisht Government , p. 27. since that Paper was so far from being own'd as any part of the fruits of that Government establisht ( which was by Christ , we affirm ) among us , that we have both plainly manifested our dislike thereof ; and the Persons concern'd in it in Barbadoes have themselves retracted it , as is since publickly evinced in Print ; yet thou art so unconscionable as to render both G. Fox , my self , &c. as shewing no dislike to the said Paper , p. 28. Oh shameless Prevaricater and Abuser ! Thou canst not but otherwise understand divers Passages in our Letter about it to Barbadoes , which clearly bespeaks our real dislike of it , as thou confessest G.F. &c. would seem to discourse a little of something amiss , &c. 'T is evident G. F. &c. dislike some part of the said Paper , &c. p. 29. Seem to dislike the latter part thereof , p. 4. But little indeed thou makest of that part of our discourse , but art rather willing to expose us unjustly to publick Censure , on those words of ours which appear most friendly , tender and obliging , and falsly to represent us , as shewing no dislike to the said Paper . Adding also another gross Untruth and self-contradiction in the case , viz. That the Pen-man is espousing a cause contrary to antient Testimonies , &c. p. 30. And further sayst , G. W. smoothed up the Barbadoes Meeters with this Expression , We know you aim at the best things , p. 82. What smoothing was this , when we had plainly shewed them their Mistake ? We are sure then 't was not to smooth them up therein : And may not some aim at good ( yea , the best ) things , and yet be mistaken in some cases ? What Absurdity then have I committed , in telling them ( whom I believed had a good meaning , though otherwise mistaken ) they aim'd at the best things . Thou hast put my Name with G. F's at length , with an &c. instead of A. Parker's , to two or three ●ines thou hast cited in the conclusion of our Letter to Barbadoes , as an instance wherein we shew no dislike to their Paper , because we call our selves Their dear Friends , &c. Is this thy [ More anon ] to shew that I would now be as a Lord over my Brethrens Consciences and Estates ? p. 25. For I presume 't is me thou intendest ; and if so , 't is false and abusive . [ O righteous Judge of all , and Heart-searcher ! plead thou my Innocency , and rebuke this Spirit of Envy , Falshood and Slanders that 's risen upon against thy faithful Servants . ]

Whereas our charitable , tender and friendly Treatment of them in Barbadoes rather shews , that we were not willing to reject , exclude or unfriend Persons for one or two Mistakes , than to seek Lordship over them or theirs , who otherwise were so well meaning , as that we had cause to believe , that God would rectifie their Judgments , and set them to rights in all their Undertakings . So that 't was enough for us to shew our dislike or disunion with them in that particular thing wherein they were mistaken or erred .

CHAP. IV.

§ . 1. The great ends of Christian Religion and Society being eyed , a more easie condescention and concurrence follow in lesser matters . Things necessary for good order , not doubtfully recommended . Our consistency in the condescention proposed , and how ; explain'd and clear'd from W. R's mistaken Objections . § . 2. W. R's judging and censuring a Person ( and that falsly ) whilst unheard in defence of himself , condemned by himself as a grand Mark of Apostacy , and he proved guilty thereof in fact . § . 3. W. R's Charge of false Suggestion , Prevarication and Forgery ( reflecting on himself ) proved notoriously false by divers Instances recited out of his own Book , shewing his general Opposition to outward orders , form and discipline , &c. relating to Church-Government : And then unsaying that opposition again by his finally granting both outward Order , Methods , Forms and Discipline under Christ's Government : How far binding on the Conscience of others , enquired into . And he must grant Liberty of Conscience in preaching and exhorting to things just , honest and needful , or else he interfers with himself in his plea for R's Confutation to himself apparent , in confessing , That God hath afforded those helps & governments in the Church , which are not to be despised , in a Paper signed by him among Friends at London , 1673. His instance of W. P against the Penman groundless . We clear'd from imposing a b●ind Obedience , and W. Penn's own words farther cited to clear his intention for liberty of Conscience , and from what . § . 5. W. R's unfair dealing and mistaken opposition against R. Barclay's propositions concerning the Power , positive Sentence and Judgment of the Church of Christ , as being binding in SOME CASES of consequence upon Believers , the Spirit of Christ being the only proper Judge , &c. The point at length granted by William Rogers himself . § . 6. Wherein W. Rogers's discourse tends to Libertism , blind Opposition , Confusion and Ranterism . A blind Refusal of Submission to what the Lord in his Servants requires , condemned , as well as blind obedience . A Medium between both proposed , to prevent a blind Refusal and blind Obedience . Of W R's wrong Measures , false Judgment and Suppositions , Envy and Scorn , Laughter , hypocritical Lamentation , Praying , Cain's Sacrifice , his lofty conceited and contemning way of writing .

§ . 1. IT is true , and I am still of the same mind , that having the great ends of true Religion and Christian Society in our Eye , viz. An unspotted Life , Love and good Works , &c. as the very intent of our care and proceedings in the Church of Christ , we can the more easily concur and accord as to Circumstances and outward Methods , and in the Wisdom of God so condescend one to another , and accomodate matters as not to divide about them , &c. And I do not find that our Opposer produceth any seeming Contradiction to this Citation out of our Book , as he endeavours upon our following words , viz. We would be understood that those things commended among us as necessary for good Order and Holiness of Conversation are not recommended doubtfully , or upon meer Supposition , nor as matters of indifferency to be practised or rejected , but in faith & full assurance , as answering Gods Witness and Truth in the Consciences ; and that such will meet with a tender Reception , and not Opposition in all tender and upright hearts . Where 's now the seeming Contradiction in this to the precedent Passage ? See what observation our Opposer makes upon them . He observes , That the Penman seems thereby to look three ways at once , p. 36. [ though his sight and observation has greatly fail'd him herein ] as first , In commending things necessary for good Order and Holiness of Conversation , NOT as matters of Indifferency . To this W. R. thus saith , viz. Wherein I take the truest sense of his mind to be ( and that the first citation importing his readiness to condescend ) was to cover himself and others from the guilt of Apostacy and Innovation .

He is mistaken in his observation here ; there was no such intent nor necessity for the Pen-man to cover himself or others from that guilt , for to commend things necessary for good Order and Holiness of Conversation , not as Indifferent , but Essential to such Order , &c. and a Condescention in circumstances , and accomodating matters , so as not to divide , &c. may very well stand together , especially where there 's unity of spirit and affection ; for if there be true love and unity in the greater matters , essential to good Order , &c. 't is more easie for such as are tender and upright-hearted to find out accomodation and concurrence in lesser circumstances . So that still 't is to be understood , they must settle in an union and concurrence at last ; otherwise , how should they joyntly do business or service for the Truth or each other ? There 's no concurrence nor joynt-service where there 's confusion and contradiction .

But W. R. proceeds in his observation against the Pen-men , viz. 2dly , By his readiness to condescend to his Brethren ( which doubtless in that place he intends such as are upright hearted , and mean well for 't is not fit to condescend to others ) and therein the indifferency before excluded is implyed .

He 's mistaken again in 's observation ; for there may be a tender and Christian condescention of the upright hearted among themselves , in two respects :

1st , In the stronger bearing with , and helping the weak , bearing the burden of the weak , and not laying more upon the weak than what they are able to bear .

2dly , In the wisdom of God finding out such accomodation , in some lesser matters & circumstances not so essential and indispensible ; so that there may be a general concurrence , ease and peace of spirit in such lesser circumstances , implying or including that indifferency before which is excluded the greater , more weighty and necessary things relating to good Order , holiness of Life , &c. For there may be such an indifferency in some circumstances , wherein we may condescend to weak Brethren so far as the spirit of Christ will admit ; they being such as may not alter the property from being good and lawful , nor disturbing to our Christian-society . Yet there are other material things and circumstances relating our Christian society , good order and holy living , that cannot be made Indifferent . And we plead not at all for empty Ceremonies in Church order or discipline , but such as have a real service and good end in them ; nor are we for a Church whose ornaments are superstitious , but for a Church which is gravely and purely adorned with Righteousness , the fruits and services of pure Religion .

I confess W. R. has writ one remarkable Truth , i. e. That 't is not fit to condescend to others , viz. That are not upright hearted , that do not mean well : Very true . And we have cause to keep to that Doctrine , in reference to such as are turbulent and contentious Troublers of and scandalous to our society and profession .

See his third Observation on the same subject before , as shallow as the rest , viz.

3dly , By the Pen-man's last cited Lines , 't is plain , that in his sence things recommended for good Order will have a reception with all upright Hearts : Which compared with his readiness to condescend , &c. ( as before ) shews , as if his condescention was intended to Brethren that were not upright hearted .

Here his sight fails him , and he 's greatly mistaken again , perverting the Pen-mans sense ; for though I affirm , that those things recommended among us by Divine * * As our words are , Accuser , p. 136. Authority and Evidence ( either as duty to God or Man , or as necessary for good Order and Holiness of Conversation ) will have reception with all upright Hearts . Yet it follows not , that the condescention was intended to Brethren that were Not upright hearted , or false . For first , Here 's not a limitation of time when all things necessary ( as before ) will have reception with all upright hearts : So that there is a time and cause for condescention to them of low degree , in regard of their weakness ( not insincerity . ) Secondly , Many upright ones do not presently or immediatly see every thing that is recommended in the wisdom of God to be practised , but must have time to weigh and consider matters before the Lord first , in order to receive a clear understanding and judgment from him , before they act therein . So that in the mean time there must be a tender condescention , patience and forbearance on all hands towards such , not to look upon or judge their want of present clearness ( and their present fear to act because thereof ) an act of Refusal or Rebellion on their parts : No , no , far be it from us ; knowing that such upright hearted ones , even when but in a poor low and weak state , will not oppose , refuse or gain-say any thing they at present see not that 's either in it self good and honest , or necessary for good order and society , their uprightness , tenderness , honesty and fear towards God , preserves them from contention and blind opposition in such cases , whilst given up tenderly to wait till God reveal that unto them ( whether immediately or instrumentally ) which for a time they have not clearness in : And be sure , he will not be awanting in his divine counsel and openings to such .

§ . 2. To his charging the Pen-man with a groundness Complaint of Printing against G. F. without first proceeding judicially , or hearing of matters face to face , p. 39.

[ Groundless Complaint ] is an untruth ; there was manifest ground for that complaint on W. R's own confession and principle , viz. his enveighing against judging any man without hearing him : Judging the merit of the cause without hearing the same : Judging and Censuring a Person unheard in the defence of himself , as being a grand Mark of Apostacy , as in his Preface to his Christian-Quaker . That W. R. has so ( ipso facto ) judged and condemned G. F. and others in divers things unheard in their own defence , we have produced divers sufficient and unanswered Instances in our Treatise entituled , The Accuser of our Brethren cast down ; and particularly his false construction on G. F's words , viz. [ Do not make Bargains with that which is out of the Truth ] On which W. R. concludes a design of Imposition , and so far as in G. F. lies to obstruct Friends from bargaining with such whom he condemns , as having no right to bargain , buy or sell , until they answer by Condemnation ; or else , that his meaning was , that G. F. would not have Friends discourse with such , nor yet to agree about any orderly Conference , in order to a Reconciliation or Hearing of Differences , &c. concluding it must be one of these two meanings , because a third he could not think of , as the matter is fully treated on in our said Treatise , Accuser , p. 146 , 147 , 148 , 149 , 150 , &c. in which W. R's judgment , and both his supposed Meanings are proved untrue . But still , to aggravate the matter against G. F. he saith , He has used the utmost of his endeavours to obtain a Meeting with him for such an end ( that is , for a hearing of matters face to face ) at several times since his last being in Bristol in the year 1677. and it will not be condescended to , ( saith he ) p. 39 , 40. This still the more confirms the Complaint against him , viz. his Printing against G. F. ( yea , judging and condemning him without hearing the matters face to face , for which he is condemned ; which is an extradicial and injurious proceedure , and grand Mark of Apostacy so to do , according to W. R's own judgment . And his pretence , That such a Meeting will not be condescended to , will not excuse the fact , that is , his judging and censuring a Person unheard in his own defence , &c. as a grand Mark of Apostacy . He might have had patience , and rather waited an opportunity for meeting with G. F. than have condemned him in Print in divers things , unheard in his own defence , and that on his own false Suggestions , Meanings and Constructions ) contrary to his own Doctrine , which is become his own Self-condemnation .

§ . 3. Now wherein doth the Pen-man's false Suggestion and Vnchristian-like Treatment consist , to prove him an Impious Prevaricator , or down-right Forger , as W. R. terms him ? p. 41. See how he attempts proof , in these words , viz.

I shall at present cite only a few Instances thereof in his own words , ( quoth he ) viz. p. 73. His main work is still to invalidate the Authority and Sentence of the true Church . Pag. 87. Which answers and confutes W. R. in opposing outward Directions , Methods and Forms relating to Church Government . Pag. 88. His principal Objection against outward Orders , Prescriptions , Sentences , Decrees , Form of Church Government , Discipline , &c. P. 91. His gain-saying and general Objections against us in relation to Church Government and Order amongst us the People called Quakers . P. 261. Which answers his general opposition to outward Order , Form and Discipline . [ Thus hath W. R. cited our words by pieces . ]

Now if it be made appear , that these things are justly laid to W. R's charge from his own words and sence thereof , I hope he 'l see cause to be ashamed of his clamour of false Suggestion , impious Prevaricator , &c. In order to which I thus directly proceed :

First , That his work has been to invalidate the authority and sentence of the true Church : On Mat. 5. and chap. 6. he saith , Wherein there 's not the least tittle to countenance this sentence , That the positive Sentence or Decision of the Church in matters of Conscience , may be obligatory on Believers , as in the third part of his Christian-Quaker , p. 64. And his contest against those , who ( he saith ) have approved a Plea for such a Church Government as claims a power of deciding matters relating to Conscience and outward things , on occasion of Differences about worldly Estate ; and that others ought to obey such Decisions , which says he ) in its natural consequence hath ( as we take it ) no less tendency than to claim Power over our Properties as well as Consciences , as in the first part of his Christian-Quaker .

[ Note ; A sad , but fallacious consequence , detected in our Treatise , Accuser , from pag. 53 , to p. 76. ]

Is it not plain , that W. R. has here endeavoured to invalidate the authority and sentence of the true Church ( by us pleaded ) if neither obligatory on Believers in matters of Conscience , nor in outward things ? Or if the Church may not be allowed a Power of making decisions in matters of difference , either relating to Conscience or outward Estate , according to Mat. 18.17 . and 1 Cor. 6. of what validity is the authority , sentence or power of the Church with W. R ? What 's more plain against him than his own words before recited ?

Secondly , That he has opposed and objected against outward Orders , Forms , Discipline , Prescriptions , Sentences , Decrees , his Gain-saying and general Objections and Opposition to outward Order , Form and Discipline relating to Church Government , &c. see how he argues the case against outward Orders , Prescriptions , Sentences , Decrees , &c. under the new Covenant , viz. because the Apostle's labour was to draw the outward Jew off from the observation of their outward Ordinances , to the Word and Law in the heart ; and because the new Covenant was not to be like unto the old ; he therefore appeals To every Ingenious and Impartial Reader , whether it can consist with the tenor of the new Covenant for ANY to attempt the establishment or giving forth of outward Orders , Prescriptions , Sentences or Decrees , to be a Bond upon the Consciences of those who have believed in the Everlasting Light , especially those of the Gentiles stock , his Chr. Qua. part 1. p. 73. How now William ? Is not here general Opposition , &c. detected and answered in our said Treatise , Accuser , & c ? p. 88 , 89.

Another Instance is where W. R. saith , viz. We have no ground either from the Word of the Lord , the appearance of Christ , or from the Scriptures of Truth , since Christ's appearance in the flesh , to expect that any should be invested with Power from on high to establish such things relating to the Conscience ( i. e. outward Orders , Prescriptions , Sentences , Decrees , as before ) much less that the Children of Light under the new Covenant should be led by the eternal Spirit and Word in the heart unto such Conformity ; his Chr. Quaker , part 1. pag. 75.

What sayst thou yet William to these plain Instances out of thy own great Book ? Surely hadst thou but taken a more strict and serious notice of them , as plainly cited in our Treatise , thou wouldst not have charged any of us with false Suggestion or Forgery , in representing as if thou hadst wrote against outward Orders , Forms , Discipline . This is no Forgery nor Prevarication ( William ) ▪ Peruse thy great Book a little better , with our Observations upon it in our said Treatise : Consider in calmness , if thou mayst not be ashamed thus to evade and deny thy own words ? and of thy clamour , and saying , That not a word is cited , nor yet can be , out of any thing thou hast written , that may carry such an import , viz. as if thou hadst wrote against outward Orders , Forms , Discipline , &c. in a general way , p. 41. Thou writest That in one Book which thou denyest the plain import of ( as well as the matter ) in another , saying and unsaying . Be ashamed therefore , and also of thy roaring and belching out such Slanders and Falshood also , as The impious prevaricating Pen-man — doth not quote any sentence of mine confuted , &c. p. 42. What hast thou done less than wrote against outward Orders , Forms , Discipline , & c ? What means thy saying before , That we have NO GROUND either from the Word of God , Christ or Scriptures , to expect that ANY should be invested with Power from on high to establish such things ( as before ? ) Is not here general Opposition , both to such things and to such a Conformity ?

Please to review another instance or two of thy Opposition , as before , viz.

1st , Where in the Title-page of the 3d part of thy Christian-Quaker , where to the inward Government of Christ thou opposest visible persons being invested with power from Christ to execute outward Laws , Prescriptions , Orders , Edicts or Decrees in an outward Form of Government visible , &c. See now how general thy opposition is , and detected in our Treatise , Accuser , p. 117 , 118 , 119 , to p. 137.

2dly , The comparison before-cited between the Pope , who is a visible man , in accounting himself invested with Power to execute outward Laws , Edicts and Decrees , on the one part , and the Pen-man and some of his Brethren on the other part ; herein , thou sayst , thou placest not much difference between them , &c. p. 18. of thy 7th part . Who can here reasonably understand thee otherwise , than that thou opposest the Doctrine or Principle it self , as well as the Pope , viz. That any visible man is invested with Power from Christ to execute outward Laws , Edicts and Decrees under Christ's Government , lest thou shouldst resemble the Pope . For we may rationally take it for granted in those things , doctrines or principles wherein thou comparest the Pope & any of us , thou wouldst be lookt upon as of a contrary mind and judgment , that thou mightst not be thought like the Pope in any thing whereof thou condemnest others , as either like him , or as not much differing from him , otherwise thy comparisons or similitudes do condemn thy self as well as others , whom thou smitest at . And so , if thou countest it Popery or resembling the Pope , to say , That a visible man or men are invested with power from Christ to execute ( or put in practice ) any outward Laws , Edicts or Decrees under Christ's Government , then we must take thee as saying ( and as we have understood thee ) That no visible man or men are so invested with Power from Christ to execute outward Laws , &c. Which still shews thy oppositions and objections before rehearsed , and clears thy opponent from the foul Imputations of Impious Prevaricator , down right Forger , Impious Prevaricating Pen-man , &c. and thy self a notorious Slanderer therein , as well as shews thy inadvertency and overly shuffling , and foully slubbering over matters under debate and controversie , and with what blunt and dull tools and weapons thou art toiling and fighting .

Howbeit , we may hear W. R. a little further , in his attempts to clear himself , and prove his charge of false Suggestion , Impious Prevaricator , &c. he alledges chiefly two things , viz.

1st , That he owns the Government of Christ in his Church , knowing that 't is his right to govern his Church ; which W. R. also confesseth , The Pen-man signifies he understands by Church-Government .

Observe by the way ; this is general , and not an Answer sufficient to clear him ; 't will not do his business . Against whom did he alledge this , when we never questioned Christ's Government in his Church ? But the Pen-man and his Friends ( viz. the peaceable People call'd Quakers ) own Christs Government , both in the inward and in the outward parts of it , both as he governs and rules immediately by his Spirit , and instrumentally by his faithful Servants invested with power and wisdom from him , as before explained ; which I find not that W. R. hath owned with any consistency or clearness , but has appeared very inconsistent , opposit and frequently contradictory both to us and to himself in the matter , saying and unsaying ( first in one Book , then in another ) as is fully evinced in our Treatise , entituled , The Accuser , &c. ( as from p. 83 , to p. 91. and from p. 204 , to p. 227. ) and also in this .

2dly , He alledges , that he has testified , That the Apostles labours were to establish the Churches in the Faith and in the Power , leaving them so established , to be in the practice of THAT FORM which the Power either had or should lead them into . Moreover , ( saith W. R. ) My proceedings in the Marriage of two Daughters within three years last past , and frequent concern amongst Friends in taking care that no proceedings in Marriages may be permitted in any such private Methods as may be scandalous to Truth , shews my practice and principle to be otherwise — And indeed I can in Truth say , That I never had a thought entred in my Breast , that OUTWARD ORDER , Methods , Forms and Discipline were not to be exercised , and proceeded in * * Who must so exercise and proceed in them if no visible man or men be invested with Power from Christ to execute them , or put them in practice ? under the Government of Christ , according as the Spirit of the Lord should direct and guide , p. 42. [ Thus far W. R ]

Observe ; He has here given a very fair and ample concession to Truth in words , viz.

1st , To the Apostles labours for the Churches establishment in the Faith and in the Power .

2dly , To the practice of that Form which the Power should lead them into .

3dly , To his care in the Marriage of his two Daughters , and others , that NO Proceedings in Marriages may be permitted in any such private Methods as may be scandalous to Truth .

4thly , To outward Order , Methods , Forms and Discipline , that they are to be exercised and proceeded in under Christ's Government , according as his spirit directs and guides .

Are they so ? A fair confession ! Had he alwayes kept to this method and language , and so been consistent with himself , the Controversie had been in a narrow compass . But though he seems seriously to say , That he never had a thought entred his breast , that outward Order , Methods , Form and Discipline were not to be exercised and proceeded in under the Government of Christ , I query , ( on his contradiction ) how they should be exercised and proceeded in under Christs Government in his Church , if so be it cannot consist with the tenor of the new Covenant for any to give forth outward Orders , Sentences , Decrees , & c ? Or if Christ doth invest none with Power from on high to establish such things relating to Conscience ( as outward Order , Methods , Forms , Discipline , & c ? ) Or if no visible Persons be invested with power from Christ to execute outward Laws , Prescriptions , Order , & c ? How then are outward Order , Methods , Forms and Discipline to be exercised and proceeded in under Christ's Government ? And who are to exercise and proceed in them , if not visible Persons ? May not they declare and practise outwardly what they have received from Christ inwardly ? How then shall the Law go forth of Sion , and the Word from Jerusalem ? But if he grants that some persons are made instrumental under Christs Government , to give forth good outward Methods , Forms , Order , Discipline , &c. but not to be a bond on the Consciences of others who have believed in the everlasting Light : This appears contradictory again : ( William , was thy proceedings in the Marriage of two Daughters , and thy care that Truth might not be scandalized , no bond upon thine or their Consciences ? ) How are outward Methods , Forms , Order and Discipline then to be practised and proceeded in under Christ's Government ? Must they be so practised , exercised and proceeded in by Believers , without Conscience , or without Obligation , or being binding upon their Consciences ? Strange Doctrine , loose and confused , and not consistent with any Religious tender Conscience towards God or Christ , which requires all to be done in his name , and to his glory .

But after all our Opposers variations , inconsistencies and whirlings , he is fled to this Refuge , or rather Subterfuge , viz. That his writing shews dislike to Man's Pretence to establish outward Orders , relating to matters of Conscience , as the Order of the Gospel , or to take upon him the giving forth of any outward Rules , Pag. 41. &c. relating to Faith and Discipline in the Church , with intent that they should become a Bond upon others to submit thereto , further than from a Recommendation unto the Conscience , a service may be seen therein , according to the measure of Light given , &c. pag. 41.

Observe , 1st , This censures only MAN's PRETENCE to establish outward Orders relating to Conscience , &c.

2dly , Man's taking upon him to give forth any outward Rules in Faith or Discipline in the Church , with intent they should become a Bond upon others , to submit further than ( from a Recommendation to the Conscience ) a service MAY be seen therein , according to the measure of Light given , &c.

Whereupon 't is to be noted , first , That this does not oppose the Spirit of Christ , making use of man or men , as instrumental to establish or give forth outward Orders , Rules , &c. relating to Conscience , Faith or Discipline in the Church , to be submitted unto .

2dly , Nor such outward Orders , Rules , &c. as a service may be seen in , according to the measure of the true Light given . But only a dislike to MAN's PRETENCE & TAKING VPON HIM therein . Which I understand is intended , as without the true Spirits Guidance . Which appears still to be an Abatement and Extinuation of his more general reiterated Opposition and Noise against ANY giving forth outward Orders , Prescriptions , &c. or being invested with Power from Christ to execute outward Laws , Orders , &c. under Christs inward Government , because the new Covenant and its Law is inward . For now he only opposeth Man's Pretence and Taking upon him in these cases ; and who must be Judge that he is but a Pretendor , and an Actor in his own will , if the Rules , Directions or Laws he declares or gives out be in themselves Honest , Lawful and Just , yea Convenient and Needful , not of Man , nor by the Will of Man ? Were not this to judge of Spirits without outward evidence or proof against them ? But if our Opposer would place the Controversie against some Rules , Orders , &c. among us , as being in themselves either unjust , unlawful or dishonest , and could make sufficient proof thereof , that would both greatly narrow and soon determine the Controversie : For that can be no good nor true Spirit that gives forth bad or unjust Laws , otherwise we have no reason to give credit to him in his bitterly smiting with words of hatred against any Men or Persons among us , whilst speaking , ministring or acting things just , lawful or honest , and needful , as bound in Conscience to declare and advise others to practise , ( and which he must grant them Liberty both to speak and act , or else hee 'l miserably interfer with his pretended Liberty of Conscience ) Seeing whatsoever things are honest , just and of good report , are to be thought on and practised .

That W. R's great Book aforesaid ( as it is against R. B's Book for Church-Government ) is against Church-Government , so far as it relates to an outward Form of Church-Government , outward Order , Rules , Methods , &c. And this is no Prevarication , as now he renders it , as is evident from divers passages before recited , pag. 42. and by himself frequently contradicted .

§ . 4. Also , 't is a manifest falshood , where W. R. saith , That the Prevaricating Pen-man doth not quote any Sentence of his , confuted by his asserting , ( in a Paper dated London , 26th of the 3d Moneth , 1673. ) That God hath in his Wisdom afforded those Helps and Governments in the Churches , which are not to be despised , being in subjection to Christ the one Head and Law-giver , &c. [ This was signed by W. R. among other Friends ] pag. 42. If no visible Persons be invested with Power from Christ to execute outward Laws , Orders , &c. in an outward Form of Church-Government ; Or if it be Popery , or like the Pope , or inconsistent with the New Covenant so to do , ( as he has insinuated ) what and where are those Helps and Governments , which God in his Wisdom hath afforded in his Churches , in subjection to Christ ? Are no visible Persons instrumental therein by the Power of Christ ? Or are they Helps and Governments , or helpers in Government without visible Persons ? Were Apostles , Prophets , Teachers , Elders , Overseers , &c. in the Christian Churches no visible Persons , or not so indued with Power from Christ to be helpers in the Government ? See 1 Cor. 12 28.

I confess I know not how to reconcile our Opposer to himself in these matters , no more than I can find Reason or Proof for his black Charges of Impious Prevaricating Pen-man ; Oh Impious Prevaricator ! perverse and hard Heart ; qualified like a proud Prelate ; The Pen-man's Iniquity ; angry Waspish Pen , &c. [ Thus he . ] I must needs say , he 's far more loud in his Censures than in 's Proofs .

If our Opposer did impartially consider and compare William Penn's Address to Protestants , quoted by him , he would see there 's no Lash to the Pen-man ( as he falsly affirms ) seeing W. P. grants , that the one Shepherd may have many Servants , p. 44. And on 2 Cor. 4.1 , 2. He further saith , Here is the utmost Imposition the Apostle makes use of ; He requires not men to receive him without Evidence , &c. p. 44. No more do we , whom Christ hath called forth in his Service and Ministry , in this his day , who by the manifestation of Truth , commend our selves to every mans Conscience in the sight of God , having renounced the hidden things of Dishonesty , &c. Here 's no cause to complain for want of Evidence , or of Imposition without Evidence , in plainly discovering or shewing the hidden things of dishonesty . Truth in its manifestation , both in the Ministry and in the Hearers Conscience , is Evidence , both against what 's Dishonest , and for what 's Honest : God would not have Men blind in their Duty , their own Negligence and Prejudice is cause of blindness . Nor hath this Person convicted us of pleading for or setting up Imposition without Evidence in the Conscience , or of Imposing a blind Obedience , or putting any Persons thereupon ; No , my very Soul is against that . And though W. P. also has writ against Imposition without Conviction ; the Pen-man seems to have no other sence , nor doth it follow that he is either against Church Discipline , outward Order or Form of Church-Government ( but for these ) in the Church of Christ and Christian Societies ; he being Principl'd for the true Church , having Power from Christ to give Judgment , spiritual Censures and Sentences against all dark Spirits that sow Discord and make Division , and against all ungodly , loose , disorderly and scandalous walking and walkers under profession of Truth . I 'le adventure to quote William Penn's Address to Protestants , to shew his Principle and Sence in these matters : In page 214. he saith , No Scripture-Church-Discipline is hereby oppugned or weakned : Let not the Sentence end in Violence upon the Conscience unconvinced . Let whoso will expound or determine , so it be according to true Church-Discipline , which can be exercised on them only , who have willingly joyn'd themselves in that Covenant of Union , &c. P. 215. Let us observe what sort of Church-Government the Apostle recommends ; Avoid foolish Questions and Contentions , &c. A man that is an Heretick after the first and second Admonition , reject , &c. And on Phil. 3.15 . He did not say , You shall be Fined , Pillaged , Excommunicated , and flung into Prison , if ye be not of our mind . P. 216. on 2 Tim. 2.22 , 23 , 24 , 25. Here is both Faith and Government , Religion and Duty , all that becomes us towards God , our Brethren , our Neighbours , yea , our Opposers and Enemies . And W. P. in his Brief Examination and State of Liberty Spiritual , he doth more particularly explain and clear the Point , to Friends , first in his Epistle , saying , Christ's Liberty is obtained through his Cross ; they that would be his Free-men must be his Bonds-men , and wear his blessed Yoke : His Liberty is from Sin , not to Sin ; to do his will , not our own . And secondly , he speaks farther to it in the said Examination .

Observe ; Here W. P. pleads not for a Liberty of Conscience , in opposition to true Church-Government , Discipline or Order , but to those outward Penalties , Persecutions and Punishments , corporal and pecuniary , mentioned and opposed by him and the rest of us , which is no Liberty to make Division or Discord in the Church of Christ or Society of Believers ,

§ . 5. To the Question , Whether the Church of Christ hath Power in any cases , that are matters of Conscience , to give a positive Sentence and Decision , which may be obligatory upon Believers ? To this R. B. answers affirmatively , SHE HATH , Anarch . p. 48. And ,

Whereas R. B. pleaded for the Church of Christ having Power in SOME CASES of Conscience to give a positive Sentence or Decision , which may be obligatory upon Believers . ( To this W. R. saith ) Which clearly shews to us R. B 's meaning to be , That in some cases the Consciences of Believers ought to be bound by the positive Sentences of others . ( To which he adds ) Without leaving any Liberty for a Believer to refuse to submit on the account of not seeing it his duty to submit . This meaning and Government ( saith W. R. ) over Believers , we take to be contrary to the Principle of Truth and Liberty we have in Christ Jesus , &c. p. 44.

Herein he appears both unfair in his citation , and mistaken in his construction : For 1st , The [ some cases ] intended , ( wherein a positive Judgment or Sentence from some Members or Believers is binding upon others ) are such Cases , Wherein only the Truth , the Spirit of God doth give the Judgment through some or other in the Church of Christ . The only proper Judge of Controversies in the Church , is the Spirit of God , and the power of deciding solely lies in it ( saith R. B. ) Anarch . pag. 66. As also , That God hath ordinarily in communicating his Will under his Gospel , employed such whom he made use of in gathering his Church , and in feeding & watching over them , though not excluding others . Thus R. B's Anarchy of the Ranters , p. 67 , 68. Observe here , that he placeth the Judgment or Sentence ( as binding , and to be submitted unto by others ) professing the same Faith ) on the Truth , the Spirit of God , the Will of God .

2dly , And therefore the Judgment is not placed upon any Imposition of Government over Believers , contrary to the Principle of Truth or Liberty that 's in Christ Jesus ; for the Judgment of Truth , or of the holy Spirit , which unites in one Mind and Judgment , cannot be contrary to that Principle , nor without evidence in the Conscience for conviction to oblige , and the Conscience thus obliged is not without true sight , sence or knowledge of duty therein , because 't is Conscience obliged , not a blind affection . So 't is not to impose a blind Submission , though some's want of perswasion may probably proceed from their being hardened ( through Rebellion ) as R. B. intimates , Anarch . p. 67. And their contradiction in that case will not excuse them from being guilty of disobeying God , because it is from his Spirit the sentence proceeds ; and 't is their duty both to see , receive & submit to what 's justly required . The intent of the Spirit of God in giving forth Judgment or Sentences through his Servants ( to end Controversie , &c. ) doth not bespeak or intend any design of such Imposition , as to enforce any upon a blind Submission or Obedience , in such a hardened Condition ; for the Spirit of Christ strives with them to open their Eyes , and enlighten their Understandings , that they may see and know in their own Consciences first , their Duty , and then submit in what is according to the will of God , being the judgment of his Spirit , which makes its way with its own evidence to the Consciences and Hearts of Persons , if not wholly harden'd through Rebellion against God's Spirit in themselves : For the Testimony of the Lord is sure , making Wise the Simple . The Commandment of the Lord is pure , ENLIGHTNING the Eyes , Psal. 19.

3dly , Then what power or freedom can any Minister or Servant of Christ have , to leave any liberty for a believer to refuse submission to the judgment of the Spirit of Christ in his servants or believers where Christ leaves none ? or to grant that he may not see it his duty to submit , and thereupon to refuse when the spirit of Christ ( who knows the Creatures capacity ) gives the Judgment , and requires Submission ? There 's no just ground nor pretence for such Indulgence , which tends to Rebellion and Ranterism , but rather for the Servants of Christ to be faithful and stedfast in their Testimony and Judgment , which they know is both in it self Just , and proceeding from his Spirit . Whether it be by others received or rejected : He that hath an Ear to hear , let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the Churches ; which doth many times speak through Instruments as formerly .

And further , 't is neither a false sence , nor wicked construction , to say , That our Opposer being for a Liberty for Believers to refuse to submit on account of not seeing it their duty : Therefore , that Believers ( who are members of Christ's Church ) may refuse submission to their Brethren in things that are in themselves Just and Reasonable , according to the Law of Truth in the Conscience , on pretence of not seeing it their duty , &c. I do sincerely profess , I do not find a more natural construction that our Opposers own Words ( being without distinction ) will bear , all material and precedent Causes and Circumstances of this very point in Controversie considered .

For first ; The Submission pleaded for by R. B. among Believers , and in the Church , was to the Judgment and positive Sentence proceeding from the Spirit of God or Christ in his Church and Servants .

Secondly ; Our Adv●rsary's opposing the Church of Christ's having Power in any cases of Conscience , to give positive Sentence or Decision , which may be obligatory on Believers , rendring this a Government over Believers , contrary to the Principle of Truth and Liberty in Christ Jesus : See Accuser , &c. from p. 62 , to 81. When no other Submission is pleaded for , nor any other intended by us , than to such Judgment or Sentence as originally proceeds from the Spirit of Truth , which is agreeable to the will and mind of God . Now , doth not our Adversary's opposition tend to divide Believers and the Church of Christ , as well as from a true sight and performance of their Duty , in cases wherein the Spirit of Christ gives the Judgment ( which must needs be just and reasonable . ) For to the Question , Whether the Church of Christ hath Power in ANY CASES of Conscience , to give positive sentence , which may be obligatory upon Believers ? R. B. Answers affirmatively , SHE HATH , Anarch . p. 48. To which W. R. replyes , This Government over Believers is contrary to the Principle of Truth and Liberty in Christ Jesus . Doth not this plainly imply , that in NO CASES of Conscience a Believer is bound to submit to the positive sentence of the Church of Christ , or other Members thereof , but that a Believer may refuse Submission , On the account of not seeing it his Duty to submit . ( This is W. R's great pretence and supposition ) and this [ in ANY CASES of Conscience ] without distinction . ( The terms of the Question and Opposition before cited being general : ) Which supposed Blindness and Discord in Believers I cannot grant him against any true or sincere Believers , who are faithful to Christ in their measures of Grace received ; such will neither want a sight of those Dutyes , or things the Spirit of Christ teacheth and requireth of them ; nor submission one to another therein , but in humbleness of mind submit themselves one to another in the fear of God , Rom 2 8. 1 Cor. 16.16 . 1 Thes 5 12 , 13 , 14. Heb. 13 17. 2 Pet. 3.2 . Ephes. 5.1.21 . Here the Younger submits to the Elder , and all one to another , being clothed with Humility ; for God resisteth the Proud , but giveth Grace to the Humble , 1 Pet. 5.5 . This Humility and Submission was among the Primitive Christians , and was very commendable among them ; and none but the Proud oppose it . And farther , the Sentence , Judgment and Determination proceeding from the Spirit of Christ in the midst of his Church , is Binding in Heaven and Earth ; and he that will not hear the Church ( where Christ is in the midst ) is to be accounted as an Heathen Man . More-ever , our Lord Jesus Christ knows how much or how little a burthen to proportion and lay upon his sincere and true Followers , from the greatest to the least of them , suitable to their Capacities : He knows our Weaknesses , and is touched with the feeling of our Infirmities , and hath raised up a Spiritual fellow-feeling of one anothers states and conditions , that we might bear each others Burthens , the strong to bear with and help the weak , and so fulfill the Law of Christ .

But seeing our Opposer at length ( to acquit himself ) gives us this Concession , pag. 45. viz. I do say , a Believer in Christ ought to submit to any reasonable just Judgment ( answering the Truth in the Conscience ) when it relates to him , let it spring from whom it will , I shall say the less in this point . But ( William ) hast thou been always of this mind ? If thou hast , thou art very inconsistent in thy writing , and greatly wrongest thy self by Self-contradictions ; and then what signifies all thy opposing R. B. for pleading a consciencious Submission in Believers to the positive judgment or sentence , which ( as he saith ) proceeds from the Spirit of God in some or other of their Brethren in the Church of Christ ? What amounts all thy work of Opposition and Gain-saying unto ? Now a Believer in Christ ought to submit to any Reasonable just judgment , let it spring from whom it will . And sure , all judgment proceeding from the Spirit of God ( in any of his Servants ) is just and reasonable ; for whatsoever is unjust , is not of God , but to be rejected : The Controversie is not there .

§ . 6. Again ( William ) upon our words , viz. [ God preserve his people from this Libertine Spirit ] thou falsly notest , That ( by the Pen-man's discourse ) a Believer's refual to submit to the Church , on account of not seeing it his Duty to submit , is the fruit of a Libertine Spirit , &c. p. 45.

[ A Believer's refusal to submit to the Church ] is a begging the Question , and fallacy ; for I do not own that any true Believer will REFVSE to submit to the Church of Christ in any thing that Christ , commands , or is in it self his just duty towards God or his Neighbour [ on the account of not seeing it his duty ] is again a begging the Question . If it be his Duty and required of him by the Spirit of God in his servants , the same spirit ( if he minds it ) quickly makes an immediate discovery of it to ( and impression on ) his Conscience , it being his duty both to see and submit to what Truth and Justice require of him ; so as the sincere and tender-hearted , though but weak in the Faith for a time , are preserved on the one hand from Rebellion , and from Refusing that submission which the Lord requires , and on the other hand from running into a blind Obedience . For put case there be a little space of time , that one weak in the faith sees not presently every thing that may be required by the Lord in his People , as duty , he does not therefore REFVSE Submission , but waits patiently on the Lord , to clear up his way , and reveal his duty therein ; and though whilst thus waiting for satisfaction and clearness , he 's neither refusing nor opposing that which he has not a clearness of judgment in . Want of sight , or clearness in such cases of Conscience , is no just ground for Refusal , Rejection or Opposition , no more than for any to act in a blind Obedience or ignorant Devotion , without satisfaction in Faith or Conscience . Let but blind Opposition and Refusal as well as blind Obedience be laid aside , and we shall have quietness ; for though neither be good , yet blind Opposition is the worst of the two . For there 's yet a Medium between Refusal and Active Submission , viz. A WAITING passively and patiently until God reveal his will in this or that particular thing required by him as duty .

Again , thou dost both scornfully and fallaciously proceed against the Pen-man in these words , viz. 'T is plain to me , that he ( reputing himself a Church-Governour ) is thirsting after such a sort of Subjects that may be willing to follow his Track , though they know not whether it be right or wrong , p 45.

I presume thou meanest my self , as that Pen-man that so affects being a Governour , or so reputeth , as thou hast before twitted the Pen-man with having forgotten his low and mean Estate ( telling him how the very conceit of being a Governour in an outward Government , is very apt to puff up Persons of some sort of Qualifications , pag. 25. ) If thou intendest me herein , thou hast taken wrong measures , and hast given me Scurrillous and Abusive Characters ; and then thou art grosly mistaken in thy judgment , That I thirst after such ignorant Subjects , as thou importest . The Lord hath raised me up to open peoples Eyes , and to turn them from Darkness to Light ; and God , the Righteous Judge , who knows my heart , and whom I serve with my spirit in the Gospel of his Son , he knows 't is my delight in Humility , to serve him therein , and to see People turned from Darkness to the true Light , and from their Ignorance and Error to the knowledge of the Truth in the spirit and power of it in themselves , that they may walk in the Path of Life , and be saved ; and no otherwise to follow me , than as they may see me walk therein . So knowing my Integrity and Humility in the sight and presence of God , who hath thorowly searched and tryed me , that I affect neither Popularity nor Greatness , I do the less value thy Reproaches , and all the bitter Invectives that thou canst bring forth against me . My innocent Life reigns over thy hatred , and shall out-live thy envy and scorn .

And as thou hast laid a false foundation against the Pen-man , as judging him a Person thirsting after such sort of ignorant Subjects , as before related ; so thy Superstructure raised by supposition is impertinent , trifling and fallacious . For ,

1st , Where have any of us ( whom thou smitest at ) either from a Meeting yearly , or else-where , in giving forth ( as thou callest them ) certain Sentences , Decrees and Orders ( directed to the rest of the People called Quakers ) therewith signified to them , 'T is your Duty to submit , whether you see it your Duty or no ? p. 45. I am sure , this is forreign to my ( and my Brethrens ) Language and Intention . If it intends an active Obedience before men see their real duty , which none can acceptably perform , nor is it my Principle to urge them upon practice until their Eyes be opened to see their duty therein , yet peoples present Ignorance of their Duty ( when proposed or told them in the spirit of our Lord Jesus Christ ) is no warrant for them to oppose , refuse , resist or reject it , but rather tenderly and quietly to weigh & consider of it before the Lord , and wait in his Light till he reveal it , resolve the doubts and remove the scruples .

2dly , Moreover , that which hath a tendency to Confusion , Rebellion and Ranterism , was thy undervaluing the Authority of the Church of Christ in such a Judgment or Decision given thereby as proceeds from the Spirit of God , pag. 45. ( for 't was no other that R. B. argued for in the case ) by thy pleading ( in opposition ) for leaving a liberty therein for a Believer to refuse to submit on the account of not seeing it his duty to submit , with other circumstances of Looseness and Confusion , proceeding from thy opposite , loose confused Spirit of Prejudice and Division : This has a tendency to Confusion , Rebellion and Ranterism , which we placed not meerly on a Non-submission or Forbearance of Practice , for want of seeing it their duty to act therein . For 't is possible some Members may want a present sight in some things required by the Church of Christ and his Spirit , and yet they not thence allow themselves a liberty to Refuse submission , but rather to wait in their measures till God reveal his mind therein , in which cases there 's a tender sence and forbearance one to another ▪ and this does not tend to Confusion , Rebellion or Ranterism ; but thy plea for the leaving a liberty for Believers to refuse to submit to the judgment and decision of the Church of Christ , and for the same insisting on their not seeing it their Duty to submit , when the judgment of the Church of Christ , pleaded for on our parts , is no other than what proceeds from his Spirit , or Christ himself as being present in his Church . This thy Libertine plea tends to divide the Church of Christ , and to leave Believers , ( who are Members thereof ) in a liberty both of denying submission , and in an ignorance or blindness concerning what the spirit of Christ in his Church may require of them , which I cannot grant thee that any sincere Believer is either so to be left in such a liberty of REFVSAL , nor yet remains in such Ignorance ; for he that will not hear the Church ( where Christ is in the midst ) is to be accounted as an Heathen man . Therefore thy Plea tending to divide and make Believers Heathen , is contrary to our Principle and Testimony received from the beginning , which is , That Life answers Life : The Spirit of Truth receives its own in men ; every living true Member in some degree feels what proceeds from its Life in other Members , though all Christ's Members are not come to the same measure and degree of growth , strength and understanding , yet there 's so much inward sence and nearness in his Life and Faith , as preserves them from Confusion , Rebellion and Opposition to one another , or to any thing the Spirit of Christ saith unto the Churches by any of them .

Thy putting and supposing Cases against us that are not , thy arguing from Generals to Particulars , from Principles to Persons , from a Plea for the Church of Christ ( and its obliging Judgment proceeding from his Spirit ) to reflect upon particular Persons ( as the Pen-man and his Brethren , John and George and Stephen , pag. 45. &c. p 45. ) are empty , trifling and impertinent , and as vain and silly is the Laughter and Scorn which thereupon thou supposest , and wouldst stir up against the Pen-man , and his Brethren , all grounded upon a false bottom , namely , thy uncharitable and false sence and censure against the Pen-man , viz. That he is thirsting after such a sort of Subjects that may be willing to follow his Track , though they know not whether it be right or wrong : Which is so utterly false ( if thou intendest me ) that such a desire never entred into my Heart ; my Soul abominates such a Principle as to lead People on in such blindness . Again , I do not make the reason of my Discourse depend on a meer supposition , nor yet on a bear affirmation , that I and my Brethren are the Church , & thou and thine not ; we are now on the defensive part , and thou art not able to unchurch us ; we may give testimony of our Faith , and to our sence of the presence of Christ with us and among us , & of our continuance in Love & Unity in him , and against thine and others Apostacy , and thou not able to confute us . The reason of our Discourse ( in the present Controversie ) depends not on Persons , but on undeniable Principles and Practices , agreeable both to divine Testimony , Revelation & undeniable Evidence amongst men . And wherein any of us have been moved of the Lord in his holy zeal to give positive Judgment , either concerning Spirits , Persons or Practices , that appear not yet so evident to some as to us , the day will make further discovery and declare it , and the Lord will appear witness and evidence in the case . And thou shalt then find , that thy Scorn , and the Laughter and Scorn thou hast supposed ( and sought to stir up ) against us , will be turn'd into sorrow on thy part ; and thou mayst be ashamed of thy scorn and laughter , and of comparing our Treatment with the Papistical Parties towards the Protestants , and telling of following the Pen-mans Papistical Track , p. 46. All grounded on thy false sence before-cited , though to me all thy Scorn , Laughter , false Comparisons and Rattles ( thou knowest what I mean ) are all but like the Crackling of Thorns under a Pot. It 's observable , that in thy Epistle to the Reader , &c. thou art for taking up a Lamentation for the Apostacy of your Brethren , as thy pretence is : Now thou art for Scorn and Laughter against them thou so censurest ; yea , to the Presbyterians Laughter and Scorn thou art exposing R. R. and for those Instances he gives for Deconesses in the Gospel-times , p. 33. though this be a Truth , which many Protestant Authors have confirmed , besides Paul's own commendation of their Sister Phebe , whom he called , 〈◊〉〈◊〉〈◊〉〈◊〉〈◊〉 , Ministra , A Servant of the Church at Cenchrea , Rom. 16.1 , 2. There were Women-Deacons , who in their places did service in the Churches , with respect to the Sick and Impotent , &c. But to return , one while thou pretendest to pray for the Pen-man , That the Lord would mollifie his hard heart , p. 42. another while art for causing Scorn and Laughter against him [ Thus but in pag. 46. ]

Thus thy hypocritical Lamenting , Praying and thy Scorning do much resemble thy confused Work .

And what such things are they thou insinuatest against the Pen-man and his Brethren ? Of which thou sayst , Thou couldst soon lay a new Foundation to prove him and his Brethren guilty of such things , as by his Rule would tend to Confusion , Rebellion and Ranterism , and what not ? p. 46. What things are those ? We expect no mercy nor favour from thee ; thou hast rendred us as obnoxious , I think , as of thy self thou canst . And this thy general and dark way of smiting ( with what things thou couldst prove the Pen-man and his Brethren guilty of , as tending to Rebellion and Ranterism , without mentioning what things , is very unfairly to raise great suspicion against us , and to render us highly Criminal , Odious and Obnoxious , some-what like the Treatment we had in those Abusive , Scurrillous , Atheistical and Slanderous Pamphlets , stil'd , The Quakers Qu●bbles .

How now William ! Is this thy Conscience , thy Charity , thy Christianity , thy Love pretended ? and the end of thy feigned Lamentation and Praying for us , thus to abuse us , and cast dirt upon us , after this general implicit and suspicious manner ? Is not such deceitful , injurious and contradictory Dealing rather contrary to common Morality and Civility amongst men ?

Thy Prayer , conclusive of thy second Chapter , pag. 46. is mixt with as much Falshood and Envy ( as the other stuff is with Scorn ) in these words , viz.

The Lord preserve us all from following the Pen-man's uncharitable Papistical Track , lest thereby we should not only merit the Indignation of God , but justly be accused by men of understanding , of so much Delusion , Weakness or Wickedness , as ( considering our antient professed Principles , and Practices ) might render us unworthy the favour of a true Protestant , a derision to the Heathen , and a scorn to Fools themselves .

I am sure this Prayer appears not without Wrath and doubting ; 't is not offered in Charity , nor with Holy Hands ; 't is more like a Cain's Sacrifice ; 't is to slay the Christian and Protestant Reputation of him ( and those ) thou writest against , to render him not only one that has merited the Indignation of God , but one in a Papistical Track , unworthy the favour of a true Protestant , and so obnoxious to the outward Penal Laws , seeing ( by thy Words ) If you should follow his Track ▪ you should SO merit , be SO justly accused and rendred , as thy Prayer intimates . Herein thou dost not only assume the place of a Judge over us ( contrary to thy own Principle , especially that in the Paper which thou hast exposed as E. B's to Judge no man under any Pretence whatsoever ) But also thou hast set the Heathen to judge and deride such among us as ( in thy account ) go from their antient Principles and Practices , and such also to be a scorn to Fools . But must the Heathen and Fools be such absolute Judges in Church-Affairs , as over Apostates , & c ? Why dost thou then so much contend against and oppose R ▪ B. for pleading the authority of the Church of Christ , as having power in some cases of Conscience to give positive Sentence or Decision obligatory upon Believers ? Or why hast pleaded a Liberty for a Believer's refusing submission thereunto , on account of not seeing it his duty to submit ? Must the Heathen be allowed a greater Power and Clearness in positive Judgment than the Church of Christ or Believers ? But if the said Pen-man hath rendred himself so deluded , so weak or wicked , so unworthy the favour of a true Protestant , such a derision to the Heathen and scorn to Fools , as thou dost import . Then it must needs be a great undervaluing to such a great and popular Person of Knowledge and Parts ( as thou wouldst seem to be ) so much to trouble thy Head , and to spend so much time , toyle , labour and charge ( as thou hast done ) against su●h an inconsiderable , weak , mean , contemptible Person ( as thou dost represent the Pen-man ) yet one whose writing doth not shew him a meer Fool , ( thou sayest ) P. 45. It seems hee 's one who is but a little wiser or better ( in thy esteem ) than a meer Fool. How lofty and high art thou ? How conceited and wise in thy own Eyes ? God will abase thee , I am perswaded .

CHAP. V.

§ . 1. W. R's Trifling against the Pen-man about his own Concessions to Truth . His abuse of the People called Quakers , as having such kinds of Declarations , frequently publisht among them as are unsound ( and of a Popish tendence ) about shutting out the Wisdom of all kinds , without distinction , and his now mincing the matter reflecting about proving Negatives , and his shufling and shifting , on his not mentioning Time , Place or Persons . § . 2. About his mis-expressing himself , how it might be excusable . W. R. can never come off clearly by those Instances he gave in his Postscript , to prove his proceeding to Print , Righteous . But his Fallacy still remains upon him , in that his chief Instance of the printed Epistle of two Sheets , by Anne Whitehead and Mary Elson , not Writ nor Printed till long after he had proceeded to Print ; His Fallacy therein made more and more notorious § . 3. About the R's late Doctrine rendring it good for Food ; but now denying that he has written any thing to shew his own sence either way . His saying and unsaying , Fallacy and Impertinency apparent in this point . § . 4. Of his straining G. F's Words ( about setting up outward things ) besides his Intention ; His gross and reproachful Construction ; His dark smiting and suggestion against Preachers among the Quakers , to render them exalted and imperious Imposers , WITHOUT GIVING A REASON WHY , &c. § . 5. His Story of Jealousies being entred Thousands against our travelling Brethren , and what Jealousies incredible and unreasonable . § . 6. About the Tree of Knowledge again , Whether W. R. esteem it good for Food or not : He still shifts and writes manifest untruth , in denying his own Words , to shew either opposition or assent to such Doctrine ( i. e. that 't is good for Food . ) His fallacious Evasion and Impertinency return'd more home and closely upon him . § . 7 ▪ Concerning Tythes . W. R's late Objection and loose Answer farther examined , and the tendency thereof ( and of what he now further saith ) for the Payment of TYTHES FREELY to the National Ministry , and now to any use whatsoever , without regard to humane Institution or claim of divine Right . His Apostacy and evading our antient Testimony in this point ; and his fallacious Insinuations and Reflections made obvious . § . 8. W. R. cannot clear himself of his Erronious Doctrine of Circumcision being a Christian Liberty , or in a Christian Liberty , &c. which was a legal Bondage and Yoke , observed for a time in submission to Moses's Law , and not to Christ's Doctrine , wherein was a Christian forbearance , not Christian Liberty in the Practice . W. R's scorn and falshood about the LAITY , to render us Popish , &c.

§ . 1. TO thy occasion taken on the title Disaffection in the Contents of our Treatise [ viz. That if the Writer's words may be taken , to shew the meaning of his mind , then he is disaffected with thy very Concession to Truth , &c. ] pag. 46. cap. 3. This is meer trifling and idle ▪ Those Concessions of thine to the Truth are so excepted , by being distinctly noted both in the Contents and Book , as being Concessions to the Truth ( in Confutation to thy self and much of thy Book ) which being thus plainly exprest by the Writer , thou canst not justly construe his Words , as shewing his meaning to be that he is disaffected with such Concession to Truth . This is an abuse to be sure .

Because that in our observation on the 5th Disaffection , we utterly denyed and judged as a falshood and abuse to the People called Quakers , thy saying , That these kinds of Declarations frequently published amongst the aforesaid People , viz. Let us exclude the Reasoning , the Wisdom and the Iealousie , and let us have an Eye to the Brethren ; yea , to shut out the Wisdom and Reason of All kinds , without Distinction , [ according as thou relatest in thy Christian-Quaker , part 1. Pref. p. 6. and p. 18 , & 27. ]

On our denying and judging this as a Falshood , and horrid Abuse and Scandalous , thou art pleased to reflect upon the Pen-man as very ignorant , void of sound Argument , and Obnoxious to the censure of ingenious Readers , as being in his own sence capable to prove any sort of Negatives whatsoever , p. 47.

That 's a falshood William , the Pen-man hath no such sence : But by the way observe how unfairly thou art shifting here instead of proving thy Charge , That these kinds of Declarations are frequently publisht amongst the aforesaid People called Quakers . Now in thy last citation , where thou sayest , viz. I intimate as if this Doctrine had been publisht amongst us , &c. p. 47. Here thou mincest the matter , and leavest out the Words frequently , and the said People , which do render the Fact more notorious and general , and the more rational for us to deny it , and to judge it as thy gross abuse against the said People , which is not to prove any sort of Negatives whatsoever ; We first give our Negative to thy Charge in the terms of it , then our Judgment : It concern'd thee to make it good then , and not to put us off with Flams and Jeers ; and now tell us , Thou didst not mention either Time , Place or Person : At that rate it may be a hard matter to prove Negatives against thee indeed . — Though thy charge be never so false , so long as thou canst prevaricate , and also vary the matter from a popular and publication , to a particular Person , Time and Place , ( and neither tell us who , when or where ) — as FROM these kind of Declarations frequently publisht among the People called Quakers . TO this Doctrine had been publisht amongst us : Yet I did not mention either Time , Place or Person , p. 47. Like as to say , You must take all the matter upon my Credit : You must pin your Faith upon my Sleeve : If you deny and judge what I say as an abuse , I have a cunning way to shift it , instead of making probation . I can tell you , I did not mention , Time , Place or Person : 'T is void of sound Argument for you to go about to prove any sort of Negatives , &c. But William , this kind of shifting , and then retorting and scorning , will not gain thee Credit nor Reputation , in thy mean and feeble attempts to prove the People called Quakers frequently under such a kind of Ministry as is in it self Popish , and tending to Introduce Popery it self ( according to thy own Inference ) that is , Ignorance instead of Wisdom , Bondage instead of Freedom in Christ , Ignorance as the Mother of Devotion , &c. Answered in our Treatise , ACCVSER , &c. p. 6 , 7 , 8 , 9. And not only so , but that some blind Zealots are Principled to have an Eye to the Brethren instead of the Light in himself ; as in thy Postscript to thy Christian-Quaker . But we can as well and truly deny that such Declarations ( as afore ) are frequently published among the People called Quakers , and judge it a horrid abuse and reflection on the said People , as we can deny that Jesuits frequently Preach among them , which is also an Abuse of some , and which thy Charge resembles . And 't is no absurdity to prove Negatives in some cases , either in Popular or Personal actions , if Testimonies of Eye and Ear witness may be of any Credit . As for Instance :

The Question was put to a Meeting here in London ( the greatest part being antient grave Friends ) Where ever they heard such Doctrine preacht among the People called Quakers , as , To exclude or shut out Wisdom & Reason of all kinds , without Distinction , and to have an Eye to the Brethren , instead of the Light in themselves ? And they never heard such Preaching , nor any such Doctrine preached among the People called Quakers at all , either in City or Country , much less frequently . And their ( with many others ) negative Testimony , may be of credit in this case , else how should we answer those that falsly accuse us with Jesuits frequently preaching among us , but by our negative Testimony from our certain knowledge of those that do preach among us , that they are no such ? Put case any of our peaceable Meetings should by our Persecutors be charg'd with committing a Riot at such a time ▪ and place ; We deny the Charge and declare it to be utterly false , and produce evidence and proof sufficient and credible , ( in contradiction to it ) that our Meeting at such a time and place was in a peaceable posture , and nothing of violence or hurt done , offered or threatned , &c. Here ▪ we prove a Negative , that our Meeting was no Riot , by proving the Affirmative , that it was Peaceable . And what 's frequently preached among us in our publick Meetings is as publick as they . And set case a Person be falsly accused for committing Burglary at such a time and place , and he produces sufficient Evidence , that he lodged at an Inn twenty or thirty or forty Miles off at that very same time when the fact was done . Here he proves a Negative , i. e. that he did not commit the fact .

§ . 2. To thy saying , viz. If in his sence I mis-express my self , then my meaning shall not be taken to excuse the defect , p. 47. That 's not true ; for wouldst thou be so low in thy Mind , and so ingenious as either to confess such mis-expressing or defect , where we meet it , and clogg thee with it in thy writings , and not be tenacious therein , it would the more excuse thee , and shorten the Debate .

I do not at all find , that thou canst come clearly off , as either a just or righteous man in thy Allegations and Instances in thy Postscript , for thy proceeding to print and publish thy great Book , by thy principal instance of the printed Epistle of two Sheets by Anne Whitehead and Mary Elson , which thine ( when nigh printed ) did occasion ; for that could not be the occasion of thine , when 't was not in being till thine was almost finished in the Press . Thou producest no Plea to clear thy self , but what 's presupposed , anticipated and way-laid in our said Treatise , pag. 26 , 27. However , by thee impertinently slighted as Impertinent . That the said Epistle was thy principal Instance for thy so proceeding , is no false Assertion , as thou wouldst make it , is evident from thy own account , on which 't is grounded : The matter is fully evinced in our said Treatise , under the tenth Disaffection , from page 19 , to pag. 37.

Thy alledging , Thou only assertedst Promulgation of the said Epistle , to shew that they were the first Publishers in Print , but not the first Printers . Of what ? That there are Divisions , & c ? This will not clear thee , nor evince thy Righteousness in proceeding to print and publish thy Book , on thy Instance of the said Epistle of two Sheets , which on this occasion was chiefly thy concern to evidence and mention , and that in pursuance of thy own Justification , to prove thy Righteousness in proceeding to Print , which the other Instances given by thee ( about the publication of Divisions by Declaration by Manuscript ) do not answer nor seem to parallel , but that chief one of Printing . And what ? the said printed Epistle of two Sheets , though the greatest part of thy great Book was printed before that was writ ? To thy now confessing , That they ( i. e. Mary Elson and Anne Whitehead , &c. ) were the first Publishers in Print , but not the first Printers . Then their Publication could be no just plea nor instance for thy proceeding to Print , as thou didst . Thy not being the first Publisher , but they , does neither excuse thy intention as Righteous , nor thy act of first Printing : 'T was the bulkiness of thy Book that prevented its first Publication , and the smallness of theirs ( though not writ till after a great part of thine was printed ) that did expedite its publication .

Thy saying , Thou only assertedst Promulgation of the said Epistle , is an evasion : 'T was in pursuance of thy pretence of Righteousness in thy proceeding to Print , as well as to promulgate or publish thy Book of Divisions , that thou gavest that instance of the said Epistle being printed . And as a supplement in thy Postscript , to what thou hadst writ in thy Preface and Introduction ( which thou judgedst might give sufficient satisfaction to every Impartial Reader ) but lest the Ignorance of any should be so great , as not from thence to perceive the Righteousness of thy proceeding to Print , they might by these Instances in thy Postscript , which therefore relate to the same proceeding that the Preface and Introduction do : See , the case is plain , 't is no evading it . Therefore thou appearest not ingenious in thy Allegation , viz. He represents not the state of the case aright ; for my own words were these , viz. My Present proceeding to Print ( the word [ Present ] they leave out ) which could not relate to any thing more than the Postscript , because the very Postscript informs the Reader , that All the Treatise , excepting the Postscript , Index and Errata , was then printed , p. 49.

This will not render thee either a sincere or just man in thy proceeding ( William ) we do not leave out the word Present in the citation of thy words ; for 't is incerted in our citation of thy own words , relating both to thy Preface , Introduction and Postscript , all alledged for thy present proceeding to Print , and to evince the Righteousness thereof ; And thou knowest in thy own Conscience , that either thy Word [ PRESENT ] must relate to more than thy Postscript , or else thou wast very Impertinent and defective . If when in a Postscript , by additional and supplemental Plea or Reasons to all that precedes in thy Preface , thou art going about to make out the Righteousness ( pretended ) of thy present proceeding to Print and publish Divisions ; we must thereby understand it not to relate to any thing more than thy Postscript . Then we must take thy meaning to be , as if thou must have more plain and convincing Reasons for thy proceeding to Print thy Postscript of but four Sheets , than for all the rest of thy Book of near four score Sheets : And yet the plea in thy Postscript appears to supply what thou hast said in thy Preface , in Vindication of thy publishing in Print thy Historical Relation , or great Book of Divisions . I cannot perceive that thou hast herein writ either Ingeniously , Conscientiously or Consistently . And thou mightest have seen how thou wast aforehand obviated , which might have prevented thy present impertinent Excuses and vain Allegations , if thou hadst but taken serious notice of the following recited passage in our Treatise , viz.

And further , If to evade the charge of Fallacy and Injustice , Deceit and False cover laid on W. R. in this matter , Accuser , &c. p. 26 , 27. he flies to his Grammatical sence of his Words , and pleads his Intention , &c. as thinking himself safe in both .

1st , We say , His present proceeding to Print cannot in reason be confined to his Postscript , wherein the Words are , nor answer the SOME of the People called Quakers he tells of , that have judged him wicked , as for intending to Print against Friends , Post. p. 25. ( whom he undertakes to answer in that case ) nor vindicate him as to his Historical Relation , ( mentioned in the same page ) which includes his Book , which therefore cannot be confined to , nor included in his Postscript .

2dly , The Reasons he gives in his Postscript , to prove himself Righteous in his proceeding to Print , cannot relate only to that his Postscript , but to his whole Book , because they are added for a supplement to his Preface to the Reader , and his Introduction to the first and fourth parts of his Treatise ; which Preface and Introduction concern his whole Book or Historical Relation ( as he calls it . ) And which Preface and Introduction he thinks may give sufficient satisfaction to every impartial & unprejudiced Reader : But lest the Ignorance or Blindness of any should be so great , as not from thence to perceive the Righteousness of his present proceeding to Print , &c. he gives his additional Reasons and Instances in his Postscript ; the chief whereof is that relating to the two printed Sheets , which came to his Hands the 8th of November , 1680. as aforesaid , wherein the supplemental Reason given , was more clearly to evince the pretended Justness of his proceeding to Print , than he had done before in his said Preface or Introduction , as that it was even to prevent such great Ignorance and Partiality as would hinder any from perceiving his Righteousness in proceeding to Print . [ which therefore must needs relate to more than his Postscript . ]

And William , I find no Contradiction , as thou accusest , between our signifying , That the two Sheets aforesaid was the Principal Instance for thy proceeding to print and publish thy Book , ( that is , to prove thy Righteousness pretended therein , as 't was made appear from thy own Words ) AND signifying that thou declaredst a far higher necessity , i. e. a great concern of Conscience , &c. That the Epistle of two Sheets , aforesaid , was thy principal Instance , Reason or Allegation , to prove the Righteousness ( pretended ) of thy proceeding , is no down-right falshood ( as thou falsly renderest it ) but true ; for 't was CHIEFLY thy concern to give that Instance of the said Epistle after other Instances of less concern , and less to the purpose of Printing , &c. And that thou also placedst a higher necessity on thy proceeding , than the said two Sheets , is also true : The first was produced as a principal instance or cause , to evince the Righteousness of thy proceeding to print an Historical Relation , &c. The second was thy own Assertion for the necessity of thy proceeding , pretending it for the clearing of thy Conscience , &c. Such necessity ( pretended ) of proceeding was higher than thy said Instance or Reason for it , as between an Immediate necessity of doing a thing , and an outward Reason or Instance for doing it . Where 's now the Contradiction ? If there be any , it must be thy own , in placing such occasion on the said two Sheets , as to be so chiefly concern'd at them , and yet a more immediate necessity of Conscience , &c. before that . The Premises of this point considered , in reference to thy being so chiefly concerned , to instance the said Epistle of two Sheets , thy Charge that a down-right Vntruth is the Subject occasioning his Words , p. 49. ( which thou callest Drollery ) falleth to the Ground as a down-right Falshood . That which thou callest Drollery ( in conclusion of that Detection we made of thy unrighteous and fallacious Vindication of thy proceeding to Print , &c. ) I am perswaded it hit thee , and touched thee , as in a way of answering a Fool ( that is , such a one as is highly conceited , and wise in his own Eyes ) according to his Folly . And how natural and suitable that passage ( thou callest Drollery ) is to the subject and occasion given on thy part , unto which it relates , I leave to the impartial and ingenious Reader to consider and judge , upon perusal of the whole matter concerning that point , as 't is handled in our said Treatise , entituled , The Accuser of our Brethren cast down , under the 10 th Disaffection ; from p. 19. to p. 37.

Unto all which ( William ) thou hast but given an Impertinent Fling , and the slie GO-BY to the substance , even the most part thereof .

§ . 3. Whereas upon thy Confusion and Contradiction to many Friends about the Tree of Knowledge , that God forbad Man to eat of : The Question was put concerning thy self , thus , viz. What kind of Preacher would he make , if he should tell People , The Tree of Knowledge is good for Food ; the Tree of Knowledge is not good for Food ? This Question thou takest to be grounded on a down-right Falshood ; for sayest thou , I never asserted that the Tree of Knowledge was good for Food , and that it was not good for Food ; neither have I written any thing to shew my own sence either way , p. 50.

No! That 's strange ; and a gross and manifest Untruth and Shuffle , I am sure : And I may ask thee , if thou hast not belyed thy own Conscience in these Words ? How darest thou now utter in Print , that thou hast not written any thing to shew thy own sence either way , i. e. Whether the Tree of Knowledge be good for Food , or not good for Food ? Hast thou not ( in the first place ) written to shew thy own sence , That it is good for Food , by thy plainly opposing the contrary Doctrine , as preached by divers among us : ( viz. That the Tree of Knowledge was not good for Food . ) Hast not thou plainly objected against this Doctrine ? Instancing , That a Father may command his Child not to eat an Apple ; his Rebellious eating no Argument to prove the Apple in it self not good for Food : And we know not on what Foot of Truth any one can assert that the Tree of Knowledge is not good for Food . And to prove the Tree of Knowledge in it self good for Food , thou also didst cite John 17. This is Life Eternal to know thee the only true God , and Jesus Christ whom thou hast sent . Thence infering , so that Knowledge is the way to Life . But did God forbid the knowledge of himself , and of his Son , to Man in Innocency , when he forbad him to eat of the Tree of Knowledge ? Didst thou not here plainly enough shew thy sence , That the Tree of Knowledge was good for Food ? And doth not this imply that the Serpent was more kind to Man in moving to eat of it , than his Maker was in forbidding him ? There 's no need of thy adding [ as in it self ] for the Tree is it self . With what Conscience then durst thou adventure not only to say , Thou never assertedst that the Tree of Knowledge was good for Food , but also , that thou hast not written any thing , to shew thy own sence either way . Oh , wonderful ! I somewhat admire at such a manifest gross Untruth , that thou shouldst undertake in several Pages , with several Objections , to oppose a Doctrine , as thou didst that of the Tree of Knowledge not being good for Food : And now to flam us off , with telling us , That thou hast not written any thing to shew thy own sence either way ? Hast thou not here play'd Legerdemain , to write so plainly in opposition to another's Position , and yet tell us , Neither hast thou written any thing to shew thy own sence either way ? For shame leave off such Impertinent Scribling , and spend thy time better in the Creation . But yet what reason for the Question , viz. What kind of Preacher wouldst thou make , if thou shouldst tell People , the Tree of Knowledge is good for Food , the Tree of Knowledge is not good for Food ? For the first , thou hast shewn thy sence plainly , however thou wouldst now smother it : The latter appears deducible from thy finding out a Salvo , or Plea , for some that may declare , That the Tree of Knowledge is not good for Food ; for thou wouldst not be understood to reflect on all that have used that Expression , because thou questionest not but many have so express'd themselves — to shew that if we should feed upon , or admire any excellent Qualification or Endowment , and not have the Eye of our mind Chiefly unto the Giver , we might then come to a loss ; See the Second Part of thy Christian-Quaker , p. 28 , 29. Thus hast thou excused the Doctrine before opposed by thee , viz. That the Tree of Knowledge is not good for Food .

§ . 4. As for G. F's Epistle against the envious Spirits , and Persecutors of those who could not observe their outward Things , Traditions , &c. thou dost much insist on these Words , viz. They that do so , viz. set up outward things , gather People to themselves , not unto God , &c. If these be truly cited , G F. best knows his own Intention , and in point of Justice ought rather to have been enquired of , as to have been his own Interpreter , than to have been brought forth in Print under the disguise of a prejudicial Interpretation and straining his Words , and turning his sence besides whatever was intended in them , or by him . And what hast thou got by the said Citation , thou hast so much insisted on ? If thou strainest the Litteral sense thus , That no outward things are to be set up , nor outward Order practised in the Church of Christ . Thou wilt therein farther interfer with thy self , having already granted outward Form and Order , &c. to be in the Church of Christ , yea , even the case of Marriage ; as what care thou tookest about the marrying thy two Daughters , &c.

But G. F's intention and sence in the words of his said Epistle , is by another hand fully spoken to , and therefore I forbear enlarging on them . However thy construction , That out of G. F 's Mouth he and his Brethren may justly be compared to Cain for persecuting their Brethren , for no other cause than for not submitting to outward things , &c. p. 50.

This Construction I look upon to be very gross and reproachful , and that it proceeded from a persecuting spirit , that is , a false and unjust Judge .

And as false and malicious ( William ) is thy dark smiting , in telling of such sort of Preachers , ( i. e. among the People called Quakers ) whose Pride and Insolency might prompt them at this day to say , — Though you are our Witnesses , that we have often declared that our Commission from God was to turn People from the Power of Satan to God , that so they might all come to be ordered and governed by the appearance of the Power in themselves ; yet we did NOT mean , but that when we had gathered any into the Truth , we should be those who ought to have the RULE over them , and that such should observe our Traditions , or follow us , Without giving a Reason why ; and though they might in Truth be submitting themselves one to another in the Lord ( according to the Apostles Counsel ) yet all of them must submit to us , and reverence , honour and obey us , &c. pag. 50 , 51. Thus far thou ( William . )

But that any Preachers among the said People called Quakers have so said or preached after this exalted , imperious and inconsistent manner , I must take leave to deny , till I have better proof from thee , than thy quoting thy self , or thy saying ( that in the 48 & 49 pages of the 3d part of thy Treatise entituled , The Christian-Quaker ) 'T is so written , which is thy own Book , making thy self thy own Authority proof for thy self ; and then thy saying , 'T is as naturally deduced from R. B 's discourse in his Book of Government ; and then quotest thy self again for Proof , bidding us see pages 41 to 49. in thy said 3 d Part. But still , we deny thy Credit in the case , thou art no sufficient Proof for thy self against us ; 't is a meer begging of the Question . The Pride and Insolency thou wouldst now fix upon R.B. he utterly denyes , as also , That those whom we have gathered to the Truth , should observe our Traditions , Without giving a Reason why . He also denys , that this is either naturally deduced or justly deducible from any discourse of his in his said Book . And I must tell thee ( William ) this looks like one of Tho. Hicks's Abuses and gross Forgeries in his Dialogues ; seeing it has always been our Principle to give convincing Reason , where scruples or doubts are , first to remove them , and clear Peoples understandings ( so far as the Lord enables us ) before they proceed to act in any Religious Performances ; and we being the Servants of our Lord Jesus Christ , we utterly abhor and detest setting up our selves as Lords over God's Heritage ▪ or seeking to have the Rule and Dominion over them or their Faith ; and we may each of us conclude , and say with his Servant Gideon , I will not Rule over you , the Lord shall Rule over you , Judges 8.22 , 23. 'T is not Man , but the Lord we must exalt .

§ . 5. Thou ( W. R. ) still proceedest falsly and perversly in saying , viz. That Jealousies have entred the breasts of thousands , that though these our travelling Brethren exalted the Spirit of God in man , as the only sufficient Rule for man , and declared , that the Scriptures were not a sufficient Rule to man ; yet instead of leaving us to the Rule which they have declared to be sufficient , they strain that which they have declared not sufficient , to make it ( as much as in them lies ) a Rule for them to rule over their Brethren , p. 51.

To all which I say , 1st , We have no cause to believe thy story , that such Jealousies have entred thousands . 2dly , All travelling Brethren , approved among us , exalt the Spirit of God in man as much as ever . 3dly , Such do not make the holy Scriptures ( however truly own'd in their place ) any such Rule as for them to rule over their Brethren , such being called to feed the flock , and not be as Lords over Gods Heritage , nor as seeking Dominion over their Brethrens Faith , but to walk in the Humility of Jesus Christ , as Ensamples to the flock . Thy thoughts therefore to the contrary concerning those who gave forth our Treatise , entituled , The Accuser , &c. are utterly wrong ; and thy quoting thy self in thy said third Part , is as feeble and impertinent as before in thy Forgery against R. B. &c.

§ . 6. About the Tree of Knowledge again , thou ( W. R. ) again proceedest thus , viz. p. 51. The Pen-man thus saith , By all this opposition to the Doctrine , That the Tree of Knowledge is not good for Food , William Rogers seems to account it good for Food . Nothing said by me , or cited as my words by themselves shews either opposition or assent to such Doctrine , p. 51.

That 's a manifest untruth again , and before detected : Many of thy own words cited in our said Treatise , do plainly shew thy assent to such Doctrine , and that thou accountedst the Tree of Knowledge good for Food , especially in thy opposing the contrary Doctrine . Review the Passage in thy own Christian-Quaker , part 2. p. 27 , 28 , 29. with our Answer , Accuser , &c. pag. 109 , 110 , 111 , 112 , 113 , 114. and pag. 222 , 223 , 224. If nothing said by thee , or cited as thy words , shew either opposition or assent to the said Doctrine ; and that thou hast not written any thing to shew thy sence either way , as thou hast declared , how hast thou pursued thy charge of Apostacy and Innovation ? Didst thou not bring in that Doctrine ( That the Tree of Knowledge was not good for Food ) among other things to prove thy charge of Apostacy and Innovation against us , and this as to Doctrine opposed by thee ? But now wilt not own either opposition or assent in any thing said or written by thee , to shew thy own sence either way . Oh William ! where 's thy Conscience , in writing not only thus insignificantly , but thus evasively and prevaricatingly ? And how hast thou by such Impertinency distinguished or proved thy self and party The Christian-Quaker , and those against whom thou writest The Apostate and Innovator , either in Doctrine or Practice , when thou hast attempted it in Doctrine ? Thy attempts and opposition signifie nothing ; thou hast not written any thing to shew thy sence either way . Then thou hast produced nothing to prove nothing .

To thy saying , viz. If we had learned from the Scriptures , that the Serpent had said , 'T was good for food , yet it would not have shewn me erronious in my Assertion , unless the words [ as in it self ] had been added , which are not , pag. 51.

Thy Assertion ! What Assertion hast thou made in the case , when thou hast not written any thing to shew thy sence either way , either of opposition or assent to such Doctrine , if therein we may believe thee ? But how inconsistent with thy self art thou , as between shewing no sence , and thy Assertion in the same case ? And what if the word [ as in it self ] are not added , for the Tree of Knowledge being good for Food , as in it self , as thou hast plainly enough implyed ? What would that have added to the verity of thy Assertion , or to the weight of the Doctrine , whilst the Controversie relates to the Tree of Knowledge , whether or no it be good for food , it relates to it self , and not to another ; for that Tree is it self . However , thou mayst intend , [ as in it self ] to be in its own Nature , without respect to the Command .

The matter in Question is not Whether the Tree of Knowledge be good in it self , but whether it be good for such an end and purpose , as for Food , i. e. for the Soul of man , either before the Fall , or in the Restoration ? Both God's Prohibition and Experience teach the contrary , viz. That 't is not good for Food ; though otherwise , Knowledge ( rightly so called ) be good as in its own Nature . But the Knowledge of Good and Evil is a mixt Knowledge , not Food for an innocent Soul ; 't is the pure unmixt Knowledge of the good only which springs from divine Life that is its Food . The words [ Tree of Knowledge ] are an allusion , and is Mysteriously to be understood only in the Light of Christ .

To thy saying , 'T is hard to know with what sort of Spirit the Pen-man , most immediately concerned in the Accuser , &c. is at unity with ; For 't is evident he doth not give the Devil his due , neither doth he give God or good Men their due , pag. 52.

Is it hard to know ? How camest thou then so severely to censure and judge him and his Spirit , as Impious , Wicked , & c ?

But in humility and fear of the Lord , he is at Unity ( and daily converseth ) with the Spirit of our Lord Jesus Christ , which is a Spirit of true Understanding and Judgment , whereby he clearly discerns , and hath Power to judge thy dark , confused Spirit of Enmity , and its unfruitful Works of Darkness and Division against Christ and his true followers .

§ . 7. Concerning Tythes , thou pretendest to except against the Payment of them , P. 52. That they are ( as at this day paid under pretence of being Due , JVRE DIVINO ) — Antichristian , and also against the Humane Institution and constraint to pay them . [ And thus far we do not oppose thee , nor have shewn disaffection . ] But thou hast found out another and more easie way to pay them : Thus , viz. Yet if any Person will FREELY of himself give a Tenth part of his Estate , or of the Increase thereof TO ANY VSE WHATSOEVER ; having no regard to any Humane Institution or Claim by vertue of any pretended Divine Law , it can no more be called Antichristian then , &c. p. 52.

No! not as given to any use whatsoever ? That 's large and loose , and as strange ! Suppose some do freely pay Tythes to maintain an Antichristian Ministry , without regard to the plea of Jure Divino , or humane Institution or Constraint , but voluntarily and freely , which needs no constraint nor coertion : Were not this Antichristian ? And did not the Christian-Quaker bear Testimony from the beginning against the Antichristian Ministry and Tythes paid to maintain them , whether by some paid freely or not ; the labour was to bring People from them to Christ , the great Shepherd , and end of the first Priesthood , Tythes and the Law that upheld them .

Art not thou now evading and shifting from our first Testimony , that was absolute against the payment of Tythes in these Gospel dayes ? And doth not these thy evasive Apostatizing shifts tend to draw others into Looseness and Apostacy , to decline the Cross , and cast off the Yoke of our Lord Jesus Christ ?

Again , thou givest a recital of thy Answer to the Objection or Question of thy own framing , in the case of Tythes ; but now craftily leavest out thy Objection , which concern'd Tythes , as given to the National Ministry , thus , viz. But what if it please the Supream Power to bestow on the National Ministry Tythes ? How prove you from Scripture , that those who freely pay it , do ill ? or that 't is not lawful for them , to receive it from such ? These are thy own Words , ( William ) to which thou madest the following Answer , mentioned in our 40 th Disaffection , and recited in these words , viz.

We are so far from condemning those who freely pay them , ( i. e. Tythes ) and not as by Constraint , that we look upon it to be the Duty of all , Page 52. professing Christianity , to contribute towards the outward Maintenance of such whom they usually hear , and account to be the true Ministers of Christ , though not obliged thereto by Law , in case they have need , p. 52.

We remain still Disaffected with thy Doctrine it this point , ( William ) so far as it relates to the paying of Tythes : Thy granting an uncondemned Liberty therein , for them who can freely pay them to those they account the true Ministers of Christ ( though they be the National Ministry ) I am sure is contrary to the antient Testimony of the true Christian-Quaker , and all faithful travelling Brethren in the Gospel and Work of Christ , To contribute towards the outward Maintenance , &c. is not the matter under debate . But the Question immediately relating to the Payment of Tythes , as 't is included in thy own Objection in the case , which thou hast craftily forborn to recite , and only recitest the Words of thy Answer ; both being compared together , do more clearly evince thy Unchristian Liberty and Apostacy , in justifying Mens freely paying Tythes to those they count Ministers of Christ , &c. yea , though it be to the National Ministry , by thy Objection and Answer before . Thy varying the Terms from [ FREELY PAYING them ] i. e. Tythes , TO a CONTRIBVTING towards their outward Maintenance , appears but a Prevaricating shift , and evading the terms of thy own Objection and Question : Review the Point in thy own 2d Part , Christian-Quaker , in granting a Liberty of freely paying Tythes to the National Ministry , without condemnation ( as before . ) Thou hast contradicted J. W. and J. Story 's Testimony , viz. As to Tythes , we can in truth say , 't was never so much as in our Hearts to strengthen any in the Payment thereof , nor yet to weaken the Faith of any , having a Testimony in our Hearts that Tythes , as at this day paid , are Antichristian . Mark , [ as at this day paid ] is to the National Ministry ; by some freely , and by others by constraint . As also thou shewest thy fallacious Insinuation and Prevarication , from the terms under debate , in concluding , That the Pen-man would exclude such sort of Charity to any ministring Professor of Christianity , besides such as he may account of his own Brotherhood , whereby their outward Man might receive Sustenance ; else if they accounted it not Christian-like , to give on a Charitable score , TYTHES , without Compulsion ; yet he might have shewn his assent that their Conscientious Hearers might ( without Condemnation ) have administred in another Method , p. 53. How falsly hast thou insinuated against the Pen-man , and daubed with the Professors , as if now thou wouldst ingratiate thy self , to come into favour with the Professors , who are against the Quakers , and as if thou wouldst please them , by telling of giving on a Charitable score , Tythes . But William , I am sorry thou shouldst thus wrong thy own Conscience , ( by such false Insinuations ) for therein thou knowest the matter in question ; and our Observation was not about ( nor for ) excluding such sort of Charity , as that of freely relieving or contributing towards the Sustenance of the outward Man of any of them , in case of need ; for that Humanity allows , much more Christianity : But the matter in question , was singly about the freely paying of Tythes , and that to the National Ministry , ( as thy Words were ) against which our 40 th Disaffection was directed . And thy insinuating expressions about giving on a Charitable score Tythes , will not excuse thee , nor clear thee in this matter ; as also on this occasion thou fallaciously insinuatest in thy Prayer , viz. The Lord preserve me and all true Christians from that Censorious Spirit , as may conclude , that there are no other Sheep than of the Pen-man's Fold , p. 53.

Whom dost thou herein accuse ? We deny any such Censorious Spirit , with thy terms [ Pen-man's Fold ] for 't is Christ's Fold we own . Thou art an uncharitable censorious Spirit . We know there are other Sheep , as Christ declared , which he will fetch home into his Fold : But thou appearest none of Christ's Sheep , either in his Fold , or out of his Fold , whilst in such an Envious , Wolfish and Scornful Spirit .

§ . 8. Whereas to our 44 th Disaffection , about Circumcision being a Christian-Liberty , according to thy own Words ; thou sayest , viz. Suppose I had in any part of my Writings laid down , that the practice of Circumcision , by one that was a Jew , and a believer in Christ , was in that day a Christian-Liberty : I only Query , ( not intending to quarrel with my Adversary about a Mode of Speech , when our Meanings are the same ) How can this be termed an Erronious manner of expression ? — Why might not the Practice of such a Christian , be without offence termed Christian-Liberty ? p. 54.

I Answer ; Because Circumcision in the Flesh , was not only a Type under the Law , but by Christians counted a Yoke of Bondage , not to be born by the Disciples under the Gospel , being also among other Types abolisht by Christ in his Sufferings and Death : Though some weak Believers , as those of the Jews did for a time practise it ; yet they did it in obedience to the Law of Moses , and the Old Covenant ; and not in obedience to Christ and his Apostles in the New Covenant : And there was a Christian-forbearance and patience towards them , in suffering Circumcision for a time to those of the Jews , when the Vail was not wholly done away , nor they come clearly to see to the end of those things that were abolished by Christ . ( and yet no liberty nor way was given for them to draw others into it . ) Whence it follows , not that Circumcision it self was Christian-Liberty , or practised in a Christian-Liberty in that day , but with respect to Moses's Law ; but the forbearance towards them was Christian and tender . I am not willing to make much ado about this thy Mode of Speech ; though I look on 't to be an unsound and unscriptural Mode . To thy saying , Thou dost not say , that Circumcision practised as aforesaid , is a Christian-Liberty ; 't is the Pen-man's consequence , &c. What hast thou said less ? Thou hast told us of these Differing Exercises IN A CHRISTIAN-LIBERTY ; When speaking of practising Circumcision , keeping a day , abstaining from eating Flesh amongst the Primitive Believers ; That Christian-Liberty , &c. See thy own Recitation , p. 53. 7 th Part. Circumcision then was one of those differing Exercises , which thou placest in a Christian Liberty , and which in thy next page thou termest Christian-Liberty , as before : And thou sayest , If the mode of Speech be not pertinent to express the matter in hand — 'T is our own approved Language . I think thou mistakest here , ( William ) and the passage thou citest out of R. B's Book of Government , p. 63 , 64. proves it not from these Words cited , viz. There is a certain Liberty and Forbearance also , &c. whereof we have the Example of the Primitive Church — viz. In suffering Circumcision to the Jews . [ Did he here term Circumcision Christian-Liberty ? No sure , 't was only permitted or suffered to them , as was the Observation of certain Dayes , and abstaining from Meats , which were not holden universally ; but when laid upon others , then preacht down and reproved by the Apostle , Gal. 5.

Is there not a plain difference between a certain Liberty in suffering Circumcision to the Jews , and terming it Christian-Liberty ? Is this the very same Language approved by the Second day's Meeting ( as thou sayest ? ) p. 55. Sure thou art much out here , ( William ) to our saying , That this man , who is thus discomposed in his Work , should not have medled so much with Points of Divinity , This passage W. R. hath Printed divers times over in his Book against himself . which he appears so little skilful in : He dreams so much of Liberty that he is greatly bewildred in the management of it . Thou answerest , 'T is Language more like the proudest of Prelates , adorned with a pair of Lawn Sleeves , than an humble Quaker , p. 53. To this adding also in p. 55. Will not the impartial Reader hence be apt to suppose , that the Pen-man's design is to ingross discourses of Divinity to himself and his Brethren , that so the Laity may believe nothing but what proceeds from their Mouthes and Pens : p. 55. If they shall complain , that this renders them guilty of gross Popery ; my counsel is , Let them for the future cease giving occasion , p. 55.

This Question contains both scorn and falshood , suggested against us , to render us guilty of Popery , as before is discovered : We have no such design of engrosement , nor Popish distinction among us , as between Clergy and Laity ; the Spirit of Christ , and true knowledge of Divinity , are not limitted nor engrossed in the will of man , to Persons ; neither doth our reprehending a discomposed Person for medling in things beyond his skill , prove us Guilty in these cases .

Again , William , thou proceedest abusively and falsly in these Words , viz. For 't is well known , that G. Fox his party have been so Contentious , as that nothing would content them but the introducing new Practices , P. 55. under the Notion of Gospel-Discipline , in a Spirit of Strife and Contention , concluding all to be dark that saw not with their Eyes , p. 55.

I shall say little to these Reproachful Censures . But the Lord rebuke this false , malicious , censorious , judging , exalted , conceited Spirit : And he will manifestly rebuke it , I doubt not .

CHAP. VI.

§ . 1. Of our Catalogue of some of W. R's manifest Falshoods , notorious Slanders , scandalous Abuses , &c. ( which are numerous ) to clear himself , and prove the Pen-man to have play'd the Forger : He gives only three Instances , whereby W. R. cannot clear himself . § . 2. W. R. again opposing the Credit of the Pen-man's method about proving Negatives : The supposed Absurdity and Immorality removed . § . 3. Concerning his Contradictions : His attempts only to reconcile the first Instance , proved invalid , as between his placing the Disunion in Principles , Doctrine and Life of Christianity , and placing it not in Principles of Truth , nor in Christ's Doctrine , but in Ceremonies , the Shell , &c. § . 4. His own Affirmation to clear himself of Contradiction , no valid Plea or Argument . His own dishonesty and injustice in accusing the Pen-man , for not informing the Reader what is right and what is wrong in the matter of Contradiction . His notorious Falshood and Contradictions farther pursued ( in judgment against himself , on his own Censure ) about the Apostacy entring the generality . Christ's words , Mat. 18.15 , 16 , 17. Circumcision : The R's Postscript a slight and scornful Put-off to our Friends of Bristol , their Book entituled , An Exalted Diotrephes Reprehended ; his miserable Evasion , manifest Fallacy , Falshood , Abuse and Scorn against them , detected . § . 6. Of his Proposition to our Meeting in London . His Insincerity , unrighteous Judgment and Conclusion against our Meeting .

§ . 1. BUt let 's see how thou ( W. R. ) proceedest to prove the Pen-man to have play'd the Forger in giving a Catalogue ( term'd ) of some of W. R. his manifest Falshoods , notorious Slanders , scandalous Abuses , Perversions , Rayling , Scoffing , Flattering and Reviling , in the 4 th and 5 th Parts of his Book against G. F. and others , in his own words and terms ; which may be seen at large in our said Treatise , Accuser , &c. from page 230 , to pag. 255 , &c. how not only some of his manifest Falshoods , Slanders , scandalous Abuses , &c. are collected and stated in his own words and terms , but even all of them there collected , are so far from varying his own sence , that his words or terms are scarce varyed in two of them . I find not his sence or meaning in them varied or altered at all , so far as I can understand or gather .

Now ( W. R. ) in pursuance of thy charge before , thou engagest in these words , viz. I shall now proceed to cite only three Instances in one Leaf of their Catalogue , next to the Title , viz. One of their Forgery , another of their cript Citations , and a third of their cript and non-sensical Representations of my sound words , &c. p. 56.

Observe by the way , That seeing the Instances are so few , as only Three ( and though he calls them only a taste , &c. p. 58 ) the Reader may presuppose them to be ( in his thoughts ) knocking ones , or the most likely for his purpose , and the most advantagious for his turn that he could find or pick out , and such palpable Forgery , &c. as nothing to be said for it . But see if it prove so ; see if he knocks us in the Head or down with it : Now observe his great and chief Instance , viz.

They thus represent me to say in the Christian-Quaker , Part 4. pag. 4. That they are persecuting Opposers who oppose John Wilkinson and John Story : My own words are , Vnless the Lord shall be pleased to change the hearts of the persecuting Opposers of John Wilkinson and John Story . This Forgery — to me appears to render me a Persecutor ; for , saith he , would William Rogers be counted a Persecutor for his opposing others more vehemently ? I abhor Persecution , and in this Controversie do act the part of a Defendant against ( and in discovery of ) a Company of PERSECVTORS , p. 56.

Now let the Ingenious Reader observe , what great difference is there in thus representing him ? what variation of his sence ? as between his saying , The persecuting Opposers of J. S. and J. W. and saying , That they are persecuting Opposers who oppose them ? I must confess , I am not so critical as to understand a variation of his sence , or much of his words , in this small Transposition , though he now makes his exception , That there may be Opposition to each other , from difference in Religion , yet not attended with Persecution . He should have told us , that exception was included in his discourse before in this point , viz. That only some of the Opposers of J. W. and J. S. were persecuting Opposers , but not all of them : Some of their Opposers are not Persecutors : But we must commonly be troubled with his colateral Meanings to supply his precedent Defects . But then , what Company of Persecutors are those he now tells of , against whom he acts the part of a Defendant ? Are they not all he has written against in this Controversie , both named and unnamed ? And are not these the Opposers of J. W. and J. S ? Are they not those whom he calls G. F. and his Party , G. F. and his Brethren ? And has he not counted them Persecutors , yea , a Company of Persecutors ? Who then are opposers of J. W. and J. S. that are not of party with G. F. ( in W. R's account ) and consequently no Persecutors ? For W. R. saith , G. F. and his Brethren ( out of G. F 's mouth ) may be justy compared to Cain for persecuting their Brethren , p. 50. And as plainly W. R. shews his meaning , and the intent of his words ( before cited ) where in page 22. in his comparison between the Paper signed by Charles Marshall , &c. and Pope Leo the tenth his Bull against Martin Luther ( Anno 1520. ) W. R. saith , But in the aforesaid Paper there is no mention of any particular Doctrine or Viciousness of Life , for which they ( i. e. J.S. and J.W. ) are persecuted by their Brethren .

Now wherein ( I pray ) is his meaning or sence of his words ( about persecuting Opposers ) altered , or the intent of his Mind clouded , ( as he complains ) in what we have represented ? W. R ▪ represents himself in this Controversie as one acting the part of a Defendant , only against a Company of Persecutors . But I am sure he greatly acts the part of an Offendor and bitter Persecutor , with his bitter words of hatred , to scandalize many innocent Friends , approved Servants and Ministers of Christ among the People called Quakers with Popery , tending greatly to render that People obnoxious . Whilst he is complaining of Persecution , he 's acting the part of a most bitter Persecuting Informer and Incendiary . Apostate Judas's are the worst of Informers .

As for his Complaint of cript Citation and nonsensical Representation of words ; I must say , and that according to my understanding , his words are so largely cited , as that the drift and scope of his Intention and Sence may be understood , though some of his long Parenthesis and super-abundant Expressions are left out . I would not desire to be more largely cited by himself , or any Adversary whatsoever , than he is in his words . And for my own part , I sometime think that I am apt to cite my Adversary's words too largely , but it is , that both his sence may the more plainly appear , and what occasion he gives , either for a judgment or inference naturally to be deduced . And I find not the Passage non-sensically represented , which he recites , pag. 57. But in that he calls the cript Citation ( in the 6th line of the same page , I find his recital wrong , viz. words for fruits ) But how can it be cript , when the page is quoted , where 't is to be found at large ?

Upon the serious perusal of our Adversary's reiterated black Charges of Palpable Forgery and Prevarications , pag. 57 , 58. together with his attempts to prove them . I do solemnly profess in the sight of God , I do not find my self conscious , nor justly chargeable therein ; for I really am for giving the Devil his due , and not to overcharge nor mischarge him in any case ( how bad soever he be in himself ) much less to overcharge my fellow-Creatures , how much prejudiced soever any of them be against me . Yet though I know my own Innocence , both as to Intention and Principle , I impose not my bare sence and credit upon the Readers judgment , but leave him therein free , to the light of Truth in himself , to take impartial and just measures in what he reads in this Controversie , relating either to Persons or Principles ; and let the Light of Truth in all judge , for to that I appeal .

§ . 2. To what W. R. saith of the Pen-man's Method , If it should become of Credit , 't were then easie to undertake a Proof of any sort of Negative , &c. pag. 58.

'T is a Mistake ; for when I see a Person fearing God abused , scandalized , defamed and mis-represented , contrary to his known Principle and Practice ( as I am really sensible and satisfied in my judgment , thou W. R. hast frequently dealt by G. F. and others ) I may give my positive Testimony and Judgment against such abusive and malicious Treatment , and yet not undertake a Proof of any sort of Negative ; and then it concerns thee W. R. to make Proof of thy Charges and Accusations , when they are either denyed , or a negative Testimony given against them ; otherwise not to think thy self secure by quarrelling with Negative Testimonies , which in many cases are lawful and of credit , and not Unchristian , nor Immoral , as thou seemest to render them . Neither needed the Pen-man therein to believe G. F. to be God or Christ that never erred , as thou falsly ( by way of supposition ) arguest , pag. 59. to render us odious . For if the Pen-man did but believe ( as he doth ) G. F. to be a Servant of Christ , or a real Christian , or a man fearing God , he might reasonably shew an utter dislike of thy scornful Abuses , Reproaches and Scandals cast upon him , to render him as odious and obnoxious as thou canst readily do in thy Books .

§ . 3. Then as concerning the Contradictions , collected in our Treatise aforesaid , from pag. 204 , to p. 227. thou citest only the first Instance , and givest us thy bare Affirmation , That the rest are as groundless , pag. 59.

The first Instance mentioned by thee is , BETWEEN thy telling of so great a concern of Conscience on many to encourage the Publication of thy Book , lest it should be reputed , That the Doctrine and Life of Christianity were wholly extinct among the aforesaid People .

AND John Wilkinson's writing , That of late dayes the Concord we once had seems much to be broken , &c. And the cause God hath manifested to me , That it is NOT IN PRINCIPLES OF TRUTH , NOR IN CHRIST's DOCTRINE , nor in any Practice which Truth , in the Members of the heavenly Body leadeth into ; but about Prescriptions — through the blind zeal of the weak , &c.

Observe ; Hath not the one plainly here placed the Apostacy ( charged ) to be from the Doctrine and Life of Christianity ; And the other not in Principles of Truth , nor in Christ's Doctrine ? W. R. as the great Asserter thereof , on behalf of himself and his party , and those whom he writes against to be Apostates and Innovators ; and not only so , but hath he not ( in divers things ) contradicted them both in matter of Doctrine and Practice in his Books ?

Hath not the other ( i. e. J. W. ) placed the cause of the breach of the Concord , and of the Jarr , as not being in Principles of Truth , nor in Christ's Doctrine , nor in any Practice which Truth leads into ? What 's more plain than Affirmative in the one , and Negative in the other , on the same subject ? Is not here a manifest contradiction between presupposing such occasion of repute , as if the Doctrine and Life of Christianity were wholly extinct ; And , The breach NOT in Principles of Truth , nor in Christ's Doctrine , &c. The second contradiction does also make it more plain , BETWEEN W. R. his placing the dis-union in Principles , Doctrines and Practices , and his placing it in Ceremonies , the Shell , not in Principles of Truth , nor in Christ's Doctrine ; See Accuser , p. 206 , 207. As also Between the words [ wholly extinct among the AFORESAID PEOPLE ] and [ Through the blind Zeal of THE WEAK ; ] for the weak among them , includes not the said People .

But W. R. to save himself from a contradiction to J. W. in this case , pleads the different dates of their Words , viz. that J. W's were written in the Year 1676. and W. R's in the Year 1680. — and that when Differences in the Church begin , they usually ascend higher and higher , and fresh and new occasions , are often administred , p. 60.

Here he seems hard put to it , yet this will not save him , nor excuse him ; for he knows that the same Practices and Doctrines , for which he has rendred many of the said People Apostate , were in being among them before the Year 1676. as with respect to Womens Meetings , Marriages , Tythes , Tree of Knowledge , &c. As for Priest and Professor reputing or supposing the Doctrine and Life of Christianity extinct or suffering Shipwrack among the said People , p. 60. W. R's rendring many , or the greatest part of them Apostate , was not the way to prevent such Thoughts or Supposition in them , who were of the same mind against the Quakers , long before he writ , as being no Christians , according as he has rendred many of them : Nor will the rudeness of some in the publick Meeting at Bristol ( whether of his own party , or any others ) prove a just occasion of such Repute against the said People called Quakers , as his words suppose , without exception .

§ . 4. Of the Catalogue of his Contradictions , W. R. again gives us his own Affirmation , That not one Instance mentioned therein , as contradiction , will bear that term ; and then cryes out of fallacious Prevaricating Insinuations , &c. p. 61. But would not W. R. have exclaim'd against this method of Writing in another ( if against himself ) as Imposition , begging the Question , undertaking to prove any sort of Negatives , and not to be credited ?

And now William , as for any of us challenging a Meeting with thee , and thy proffering it in the City of Bristol ; and thy instance of an incitement to a Friendly discourse , p 61.

Thy Friendship being turn'd into Enmity , and thy Love into apparent Hatred against us ( thy antient Friends ) we have no ground to expect any Friendly discourse from thee ; thou hast been sufficiently tryed in that way : And 't is not thy endeavouring to flourish , vaunt and boast it off that will either regain thy Repute among God's People , or restore that Friendship thou hast extinguisht on thy part , by thy ungodly hard Speeches and Writings , words of Hatred , Scorn and Pride , which thou appearest puft up withal .

One passage I may not omit , touching W. R's contradictions , p. 62. in these Words , viz. 'T is well worthy the Readers observation , that though the Pen-man adds in the Title these Words , viz. [ with Questions , Notes and Remarks thereon ] yet none of the Notes or Remarks do inform the Reader what is right or what is wrong , in the pretended matter of contradiction ( more than in pag. 228. in these words , A plain Concession to Truth . Now he speaks like some Ambassadour of Christ ) For the aforesaid omission I do not commend either the Honesty or Justice of the Pen-man to me , or his care over the Flock .

To all which I Answer ; 1st , This charge contains a notorious falshood : 2dly , A self-contradiction and judgment against himself . For First , our sence of what is right and what is wrong in his Contradictions , were not only declared in our Treatise in many things , before the Contradictions were ranked together , but also the Questions , Notes and Remarks upon them , do inform the Reader what is right , and what is most agreeing to our sence as right , and what not . What we oppose , commonly is first set down in the first Column , and the better part in the second , for confutation of himself , as the nature of the Questions , &c. do evince plain enough to the Intelligent : As for instance , where W. R. is set against W. R. in his Contradictions ; as BETWEEN his saying , This Doctrine frequently publisht among us [ That the Apostacy shall never enter the generality more ] doth give us just occasion to be Jealous , &c. Part 1. p. 14. AND , his saying , I would NOT be understood to say , That the Apostacy shall never enter the generality again , Part 3. p. 74. Our Question on this contradiction is , Q. Then why does he so often quarrel with the Doctrine frequently published , as he saith , viz. That the Apostacy shall never enter the generality more ? Which plainly shews , we own his assent to this Doctrine to be right , and not his Jealous opposition to it .

Again , to his Contradiction , in saying , WE REASONABLY conclude , that the Words of Christ and the Apostle ( in Mat. 18.15 , 16 , 17. and 1 Cor. 6.1 , 2 , 4. ) ONLY hinted at Personal Offences or Differences , touching worldly matters , Part 1. p. 47. And confessing ( on Mat. 18.15 , 16 , 17. ) that EVERY CASE , wherein one Brother may trespass against another , may in RIGHT REASON be comprehended in it , Part 3. p. 36. Our Question on this contradiction is , Q. Whether EVERY CASE be to be limited only to WORLDLY MATTERS , and not extend to any Cases of a Spiritual nature ? Which implyeth our accepting his assent to the latter , viz. Every such case , &c. and not his limiting it only to worldly Matters .

Again , his placing CIRCVMCISION as exercised in a CHRISTIAN-LIBERTY ; ( and calling it that Christian-Liberty ) saying , This did not at that time condemn that Christian Liberty , in such as made Conscience of Circumcision , ( which were some believing Jews ) Part 3. p. 82. and Part 5. p. 74 , 75. AND his contrary confession , That the Labour of the Apostles of Christ in the Primitive dayes , was to DRAW the outward Jew FROM OFF the observation of these Ordinances , which were really establisht by the appointment of God himself , Part 1 ▪ p. 73.

Our Question on this Contradiction , is , Q. How can it be good Doctrine to account Circumcision a CHRISTIAN-LIBERTY , and an Exercise not condemnable in Believers , when the labour of the Apostles were to draw the outward Jew from off the observation of these Ordinances ?

This plainly evinceth , that we do not own his Doctrine to be right , that Circumcision was a Christian-Liberty ; though there was for some time a Christian-forbearance towards them that observ'd it , in obedience to Moses's Law in the Old Covenant .

Again , BETWEEN W. R's opposing that Doctrine , That the Tree of Knowledge was not good for Food , as not knowing on what Foot of Truth any one can SO assert . And his saying , I would not be under●●ood to reflect on ALL , that have used that Expression , viz. The Tree of Knowledge is not good for Food , Part 2. p. 27 , 29. Our Question on this contradiction , is , Q. 1. If he counts the Doctrine erronious , or not of the Truth , to say , that the Tree of Knowledge is not good for Food ; does not this reflect on all that have used that Expression ? And 2dly , In commendation of the Tree of Knowledge as good for Food , as in it self , he instanced John 17.3 . This is Life eternal , that they might know thee the only true God , and Jesus Christ whom thou hast sent ; adding that 'T is evident that Knowledge is the Way to Life , Part 2. p. 28. Hereupon we put the Question ; Q. 3. Did God forbid the Knowledge of himself ? the Knowledge which is Life eternal ? that Knowledge which is the Way to Life , to man in the state of Innocency in the beginning ? Let this be considered . And , Q 4. Can it be good Doctrine to say , That the Serpent perswaded Eve to that Knowledge which is the way to Life , or to the Knowledge of the true God and Jesus Christ , which is Life eternal ? Could THAT be the Knowledge that God forbad Man eat of ? Were not this very absurd , to render the Serpent more kind to Man than his Maker was ?

Is it not here apparent , that we have informed the Reader , that 't is not right to esteem the Tree of Knowledge good for Food ? As also on his contradiction in pleading one while For them who Freely pay Tythes without constraint ( i. e. to the National Ministry . ) Another while for J. W. and J. S. Their Testimony against Tythes , as being ( as at this day paid ) Antichristian , Part 2. p. 43. and Part 4. p. 39. On which we observe and question , Whether the Liberty W. R. has here granted for the free payment of Tythes , be not an Innovation , tending to beget into a Looseness and Apostacy from our antient Christian Testimony against Tythes ? And whether it be not contradictory to J. W. and J. S. their Testimony cited by himself ? Accuser , &c. p. 224 , 225.

What 's more plain , than that his Liberty or Freedom granted for the payment of Tythes , is wrong and inconsistent with our antient Christian Testimony ?

2dly , That W. R's Charge before recited , contains Self-contradiction and Judgment against himself ( though in it self untrue against the Pen-man ) is evident in his judging , that his Notes and Remarks do not inform the Reader what is right , or what is wrong , in the matter of Contradiction charg'd against him ; and for which Omission he does not commend either the Honesty or Justice of the Pen-man , &c. or his care over the Flock .

Now though the Injustice and Falshood of this Charge is already fully detected , observe how obviously W. R. hath hereby brought Judgment upon himself , concerning the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil , to his being told , That he seems to account it good for Food . To this he answers , viz. Nothing said by me , or cited as my Words by themselves , shews either opposition or assent to such Doctrine , p. 51. Neither have I written any thing to shew my own sence either way ( viz. whether the Tree of Knowledge was or was not good for Food . ) p. 50. This is all one , as for W. R. to tell us , That he doth not inform the Reader what is Right or what is Wrong , in this matter of Controversie ; that is , Whether it be Right or Wrong to say , the Tree of Knowledge is good for Food ?

If nothing writ or said by him , doth shew his own sence either way , he would be angry if I should make a Similitude Between him and the Jesuits , in his reserve in this point ; When they contend against the Opinions of others , but reserve and hide their own : And if then it be both Dishonesty and Injustice , not to inform the Reader what 's right , or what 's wrong , in things contrary as before intimated ) then where's W. R's Honesty or Justice in this matter ? How evidently is he here self-condemned and judged ? How manifold and numerous are his Contradictions ! Now , William , consider what Labyrinths of Confusion thou runnest into .

§ . 5. And William , I cannot well but take notice of thy Postscript , of somewhat above a Page , what a slighty Answer and scornful PUT-OFF it is . To the Book given forth by four of our Friends of the City of Bristol , entituled , An Exalted Diotrephes Reprehended , against thy Christian-Quaker , &c. in five parts . Instead of a solid Answer , or sober Vindication of thy self , from their Charge against thee , as being of an abusive lavish Tongue , of a rude , insolent and imperious Behaviour in Men's Meetings , and speaking prophanely of the Power of God : To these things thou sayst , viz. All which I return as Dirt , unworthily cast on me — Such their Calumniations are meerly because of my zealous opposing them and others , &c. And then further sayest , There are few men so weak as ( on serious consideration ) to believe GENERAL CALVMNIATIONS against a man once well esteemed by the Calumniators : Let this be minded , and their Answer duely weighed , and then 't will appear that nothing of weight in the said Book is written against me , p. 79. [ Thus far thou . ]

Oh miserable Evasion , Fallacy and Falshood ! with what Conscience couldst thou thus write , ( William ) as if their said Book and Answer consisted but of General Calumniations against thee , ( What reason is there to credit thy general denyal ? ) which I am sure is a shameful and notorious Untruth . Take one instance out of many more , wherein they charge thee with particular matter of Fact , and that is about the Paper of Condemnation , or Submission , which was exhibited and owned by J.S. and J. W. at the Meeting at Drawell in Yorkshire , Anno 1676. when afterward they were minded to extenuate ( or take off ) the weight of it , not owning it according to the common acceptation of A Condemnation , &c. as the said Friends of Bristol relate : Hereupon they do particularly charge thee ( William ) about the same Paper , in these Words , viz. And William Rogers , ( who confessed he drew it for J. S. and J. W. ) reported , There was nothing in it , and that the most Innocent man amongst us might own it , and never hurt himself , and that it was not better than a RATTLE to please Children ; See their said Book , entituled , An Exalted Diotrephes Repre . p. 13. And not only in this , but in divers other particular matters they also charge thee home in their Book ; and also signifie , that they do not think it necessary at present , to particularize thy prophane speaking concerning the Power of God , no more than they have already done concerning thy horrible unsincere dealing with the Brethren at Drawell , &c. Exalt . Diotreph . p. 17.

Now ( William ) didst not thou render thy self horribly unsincere , in declaring the said Paper , ( which thy self drew up ) no better than a Rattle to please Children ? after thou knewst that J. S. & J. W. had tendered it as satisfaction to their Brethren , and the Church of God in general ( as their own and thy Words are in it . ) Didst thou think to please those Brethren , and the Church of God in general , with a Rattle for Children ? Oh , William ! was not this particular matter of Fact , and that very gross and absurd ? How didst thou resemble the Ranters therein , and bewray great and horrid Deceit to have entred thee ? I cannot in Charity think that the Devil had got so much hold of thee at that instant , when thou drewst up that said Paper at Drawell , as to intend it only as a Rattle to please Children ; for thy own Narrative bespeaks better , and more serious things of Friends and Brethren , in their proceedings there towards J. S. and J. W. Surely then thou wast in a better and more serious and sincere mind at that time : But I rather think the Devil prevailed with thee afterward , after thou hadst eaten the Sop among the Disciples , and in the time of thy ( and parties ) discontented and murmuring Consultations , Satan entred thee , to devise that deceitful and Ranter-like cover and evasion of the said Paper , being but As a Rattle to please Children ; Though at first tendred as Satisfaction to the Church of God in general .

Thus thy Fallacy , ( in particular matter of fact ) is detected , also in slighting and huffing off the said Friends Book , but as General Calumniations , and therefore nothing of weight in it ; when there 's such particular matter of notorious Fact charg'd upon thee in it , as thou canst not get over , nor acquit thy self of .

And what men are so weak ( on serious consideration ) as to believe thy general Calumniations against either Persons , People or Society , once well esteemed , by thee a Calumniator ? Or to esteem thee and thy Abettors The Christian-Quaker , and all whom thou calumniatest to be Apostates and Innovators , according to thy Judgment ? How wilt thou clear thy self from a meer begging the Question in both ? which is never likely to be granted to thee as the case stands , according to thy own terms , and supposition cast upon us for our owning our selves to be the Church of Christ , p. 45 , 61. thou having been once in society with us , and didst well esteem of us , but now not only gone out from us , but turn'd bitter Enemy against us , whilst no probation made on thy part , either of our violating or disserting our first Principles of our Christian Union and Society , which thy Brother F. Bugg hath most sillily , yet maliciously attempted to prove against William Penn , Stephen Crisp , John Burnyeat , Alexander Parker , Thomas Salthouse and My Self , from a Paper signed by us from a yearly Meeting , Anno 1675. wherein the sence and tender advice of the said Meeting is propounded in several matters of moment , all which , ( in conclusion ) are recommended to the Evidence of Gods holy Witness in the Hearts of his People . Where 's now the Imposition , Antichristian Apostacy or Violence done to our first Principles of Union , charged on us by Francis Bugg , from this very Paper aforesaid , in his Book , De Christiana Libertate ? W. R. dost thou allow of the said Paper thus recommended as a sufficient proof of the Subscribers Apostacy and Imposition ? I am sure thou hast exprest the contrary . Now W. R. and F. B. clear your selves from begging the Question , if you can , by plain Evidence of your own Christianity and our Apostacy .

William , thou farther calumniatest and abusest our said Bristol Friends in thy Postscript , saying , R. V. is known to be as busie to go in the Second day's Meetings Errands , as an hired Apparitour is to go in the Errands of a Bishops Court . And that R. S. and C. H. thou takest to be fitly qualified , to say ANY THING , right or wrong to defame thee ; accusing one of them with a Lying Spirit entred him , p. 79 , 80

These Persons of Bristol , whom thou calumniatest are well known , both to their Neighbours and others , who I am perswaded will not give credit to thee therein ▪ Thy scornful Invectives against them will go but a little way with those who know the honesty and good Repute of the Persons whom thou here writest against , and their deep suffering , with many more for Conscience towards God , which it appears thou hast little regard to , or sence of , who whilst they are suffering under strait Confinement and Duress in a Nacious Goal in the City of Bristol , for their tender Consciences ( as they were when this thy Book ( 7 th part ) came forth , and as many yet are ) thou art secure in a Corner , studdying and scribling against them , to calumniate and defame them in Print , as men of no Conscience towards God , fitly qualified to say any thing , right or wrong , a Lying Spirit entred , &c. Such is thy Treatment to the Prisoners of Jesus Christ , to add Affliction to their Bonds , and to make void their Testimony and Suffering for his Names sake . And not only thus , but thou art cruelly mocking , flouting and deriding at them , telling a story against one of these suffering Friends of Bristol , which thou sayst , occasioned Derision and Laughter ; and that by a Lying Spirit entred them ( thou sayst ) they may become a derision , both to Professor and Prophane , and a scorn to Fools themselves , p. 80. No doubt thy scornful and malicious Work against them ( though otherwise under Persecution and Suffering ) and against many others fearing God , is to make them as ridiculous , and as much the Subjects of scorn and derision as thou canst ; but 't will all return upon thy own head , thou wilt reap the fruit of thy own doings . Thy pretended Love , Christian Charity , Lamentation for thy Brethren , &c. ( in thy hypocritical Epistle directed to the flock of God ) go but a little way it seems ; but that and other Instances of thy Insincerity and Dissimulations are numerous .

§ . 6. And with what Sincerity or Conscience , couldst thou not only pretend an inclination toward an accommodation of the Controversie , but also propose to our second day's Meeting for thee To read thy Answer , ( viz. thy 7th part , when in Print ) amongst us , and after so done to leave it with us , and to pretend , thy end was , that if the Meeting should that day propose any expedient , answering the Witness of God in thy Conscience , to stop the Publication thereof , thou shouldst then answer the same by forbearing a further Publication thereof , as in thy Letter , dated , London , the 17 th of the 2 d Moneth , 1682 ? pag. 80.

I do still question , with what sincerity or conscience thou couldst make such Proposition , and pretend such an end in it to that our Meeting , when thou hadst already prejudged the same Meeting in Print , as being Apostate Innovators , & c ? What capacity could such be in to answer the Witness of God in thy Conscience , if apostatiz'd from it in themselves ? And what ground couldst thou have to expect such a change in them from Apostacy , as that Now ( when thou proposedst the reading thy Book ) they might be in a capacity to reach thy Conscience , as thou sayst ? p. 82. Besides , can any in reason suppose thee real or sincere in thy Proposition for an expedient to stop the Publication of thy Book of about twelve Sheets , when already Printed ? Was not the design of thy Proposition rather for a pretence to excuse thy self , and for a flourish over us , as thou hast made an empty one , and what hast thou got by it ?

And was it not manifest , that thou wast still at least jealous of our said Meeting , as being Apostate , in thy not being free then to answer our three Questions , which were very proper , to try the reality of thy own Proposition , and thy end pretended thereof , in order to our hearing thy said Book read . The Questions were these , viz.

Question 1. Whether thou art sensible thou hast done evil or hurt to Truth in the Publication of thy great Book , entituled , The Christian-Quaker distinguished , & c ?

Quest. 2. Whether thou hast any better thoughts of our Second day's Meeting now , than thou hadst when thou wrotest that Book , as not now to esteem the said Meeting Apostate , & c ?

Quest. 3. Whether thou lookest upon the said Meeting now in a capacity to answer the Witness of God in thy Conscience ?

To which thou only gave us this return , viz. I am not free to answer at present .

Our Reason for the Questions was , That we might not spend our time in vain , or to no effect , in hearing thy Book read , which we should do , if we should undertake it , and have no assurance of thy having any better thoughts then of our said Meeting , than to deem it Apostate ? Or if thou didst not then look upon it as capable to answer the Witness of God in thy Conscience ? To which thou not being then free to answer , we might very well then not be free to hear thy Book read among us , nor be so imposed upon , as to spend our time upon such uncertainty , having no probability of thy performing thy own Proposition , with respect to the end proposed , whilst not prov'd sincere or Christian on thy parts Therefore thy Reflection upon our said Meeting , and supposing us like a Company of lazy or guilty Priests , for our refusal to suffer the reading of thy said Book amongst us , is both very unjust and scornful , and bespeaks thy Lording Imposing Spirit , thus infamously to upbraid us for not implicitly giving up to spend our precious time to answer thy prejudicate will and humour upon thy reserved dark uncertainty . And also as a farther aggravation of thy Injustice and Prejudice , thy taking our said Meeting 's Treatment of thee on this occasion , to be an Evidence of our affection to sit on the Seat of Vnrighteous Judgment . This also is thy unrighteous Conclusion and false Judgment upon our affection , and is no ways naturally deducible from our forementioned Treatment of thee .

I have omitted many other Instances of thy abuse of Truth and Friends , leaving the righteous God to reckon with thee for all thy injurious dealing and hard speeches , as thou seemest to refer the Pen man to such a Reckoning , pag. 46 , 63. The Lord awaken thee out of this hardened gain-saying state , and deliver them that are betray'd by the Enemy , and preserve his Heritage in love and peace over this scornful , exalted , conceited , crooked , quarrelsom apostate Spirit . The Lamb shall have the Victory .

CHAP. VII . A Letter in Two Parts , Which was sent in Manuscript to Francis Bugg , Except two Passages left out in favour to him , unless he will further expose himself to danger thereby .

IN the first part , his fraudulent dealing against Samuel Cater about the 15 l. Fine . His Abuses against him and others . His Conceitedness , Pride , Scorn and Shallowness are detected and reprehended .

In the Second part of the Letter , relating to Francis Bugg's Book , is evinced , 1. His unjust Reflection on the people call'd Quakers , and his being turned Informer . 2. His Judgment in espousing and presenting false Doctrine against the divine Light of the Son God in man . 3 His unjust Charge , and the collection thereof against certain Persons among us by name , who are the Servants of Christ , and against our faithful Womens Meetings . 4. His Instances for Proof of his Charge and Contempt , no proof thereof . 5. His Opposition to our Testimony for Mens and Womens Meetings in the Church of Christ ; and his scoffing and smiting thereat , no proof of his Charge , nor of their having No Relation to Scripture . 6. His upbraiding our sober and faithful Womens Meeting as an Idol , and comparing it to the Papists great Idol ; rebuked . 7. The same Challenge returned upon him , that we laid upon W. Rogers , being unanswered by either . 8. His Rambling impertinently , not following the terms of the Challenge , which therefore is further urged against him . 9. His charge of Imposition plainly proved false by the conclusive Recommendation of our Testimony instanced by him . 10. His grosly belying and abusing G. W. and his Conscience about Condescention and Accommodation . 11. His scornful Forgery on a Certificate from Huntington Meeting : His falsly representing them therein , proved very wicked , on his own Concession . 12. His scornful detraction against R. Richardson , his Impertinency and silliness in opposing DEACONESSES , as found out of some Popish Author , &c. 13. His scornfully writing and reflecting on G. Whitehead ; and his insolent Reviling , Boasting , Abuse and Slander , confuted by Certificate from divers Persons of Credit . 14. His trumpeting abroad the Fame of Henry North , Knight , &c. disgustful . A Proposition and Advice to Repentance and publick and plain Condemnation of his Wicked and Scurrilous Book aforesaid , with desire of an Answer shortly , &c. [ But no such Answer ( nor any ) as yet return'd , being now above six weeks since this Letter was left at Ely Prison with Samuel Cater ▪ to be conveyed to him ] With a Postscript since added .

The First Part. Francis Bugg ;

UPon the perusal of thy two Letters lately sent me , the one directed to Samuel Cater in Ely Goal , and the other to my self , and the rest of the second day Meeters ( as thy terms are . ) And since thou art become such an open contending Adversary , I thought my self the more concerned in Conscience to take some notice , and give thee my sence of thy proceeding and treatment in the Controversies thou hast so confidently undertaken , and become an officious Advocate in , that yet thou mayest be cautioned to stop thy pernicious Current , and destructive Race thou art running , and seriously bethink thy self , and Repent , before thy final Destruction ▪ which I clearly perceive thy extraordinary Conceitedness , Pride , Scorn and Envy , &c. do tend to bring upon thee . By the way , I observe thy Allegations against Samuel Cater , about the old Difference between thee and him so long depending , touching the FINE laid upon thee for him , as a Preacher , for which thou confessest , That thy Cousin George Smith , as his Wifes Agent , made thee Restitution ; and yet I perceive thou art uneasie under that Restitution ( as thou callest it ) thou seemest concerned that several Friends now bring up that old concern , since thou published thy Book . But how did George Smith make thee Restitution ? Did not he proffer thee half the Fine to stop thy Turbulency ? but thou by Craft got beyond him for the whole , &c. wherein he and many more are greatly dissatisfied ; and which , if the Friends in those parts give a circumstantial Narrative of the whole transaction , and of thy Selfish Craft , Over-reaching and Fraudulency in that case , and be as free in their Publication , as thou hast been against many faithful Servants of Christ , in thy confused scurrilous piece of Impertinent Prate , Malice and Scorn , I am perswaded it will greatly redound to thy Dis-repute and Infamy in the Eyes of all sorts of intelligent Persons , and lower thy Topsail to thy great abasement , shame and confusion of Face . Thou makest thy own terms for the repayment of the whole 15 l. that thy Cousin George Smith ( thou sayest ) by S Cater 's Wifes order , paid thee in Satisfaction for the Fine , thou suffered from him ( as thou pretendest ) And now I have the Money ( sayest thou . ) But I never yet understood that Samuel Cater's Wife did order him to pay the whole 15 l. neither would he have done it , but that thou madest him believe , It was not for love of Money thou wouldst have the whole tendred , &c. for thy Word's sake ▪ Thou confessest he first proffered thee 5 l. and when THAT would not do , he proffered thee 7 l. 10 s.

Thus far it seems was his proffer to pacefie the business on thy part : The other part , to make it up 15 l. he did deposit , in expectation thou wouldst return it him , so he understood by thy smooth and crafty Pretensions , That THY END WAS NOT FOR MONEY , &c. Thus he , poor , well-meaning man was insnared , and S. Cater become the sufferer . But upon what account got'st thou the whole 15 l from him , seeing the Penalty of the Conventicle Act doth not exceed 10 l. upon a Hearer , for the Poverty of the Preacher , or in default of his payment ? And yet hast thou the boldness to assert , That if the Justice please , he may lay the 20 l. upon any single Person present , of the Hearers . But by what Law may he do so ; if the Pena●ty upon any one for anothers Offence amount not in the whole , to above the sum of 10 l. as 't is twice over limited in the Conventicle Act ? For though the Justice be impowered to levy the 20 l. by Warrant , as aforesaid ( as the Words of the Act are ) Vpon the Goods and Chattels of any such PERSONS , who shall be present at the same Conventicle , in case the Preacher be a Stranger , and his Name and Habitation not known , or is fled , and cannot be found , or in the judgment of the Justice , shall be thought unable to pay the same . Note , that 't is upon any such PERSONS , in the Plural , not upon any one Person the Fine is so to be levied ; 't is to be proportioned , so as that no one Person shall be lyable to pay above 10 l. for any one Meeting , in regard of the Poverty of any other Person or Persons , as the express Words of the Act are . See what a mistaken Lawyer thou art . And was not the said 15 l. an arbitrary punishment of thy own inflicting , both Illegal and Extrajudicial ? What an arbitrary Persecutor wast thou therein ? Mayest thou not be ashamed to cry out against Imposition , arbitrary Authority , and yet be such an arbitrary Imposer , and thy own Carver , to serve thy own fraudulent Enterprizes ? IGNOBLE AND BASE ! And now to excuse thy arbitrary , extorsive Fraud , to assert that which is contra formam Statuti● in the case : Be ashamed of such Collusion . I cannot but take notice of thy saying , Thou toldst him thou wouldst have the whole tendred , which done , thou shouldst make it appear that thy End was NOT ONLY for Money . And how rarely hast thou mended the matter now ? Thou madest him believe 't was not for love of Money ; but now to mince and smooth it over , thy end was not ONLY for Money : It seems thy end was then in a great part for Money ; but thou shouldst have told him plainly aforehand how far thy end was for Money , and how far 't was not for Money , that so he might not have been defrauded out of the whole 15 l. and thereby poor Samuel Cater his Wife and Children sufferers in their Estate , meerly for quietness sake , from thy complaints and clamours ; if thy end was not ONLY , but PARTLY for Money , thou mightst have been content with half of the 15 l. which G. Smith proffered thee ; but it seems thy end was so WHOLLY for Money , that thou wouldst have the WHOLE Fifteen Pound , according to thy own account : Thus Selfish , Arbitrary and Avaricious wast thou . What a mean shift is it therefore for thee to say , Thy end was not ONLY for Money ? We see what sorry shifts and slighty Subterfuges a bad Cause must have . And as a person conscious to thy self , disquieted and uneasie for a pretence , thou now makest this Proposition ( namely ) S. Cater 's signing a Paper like this which follows , of thy own forming ; and then thou wilt return the whole 15 l. Thy Paper is this , viz.

† †

Francis Bugg's Proposition implyes a Contradiction ; for if Samuel Cater subscribe the Instrument , he ought not to have his Money by the tenure of it , because he told not his Name . If he do not subscribe it as his judgment , then he also ought to have his Money again , according to F. B's tenet of Christian Liberty , As not seeing it his duty ; ergo he may not , or at least ought not to be compelled to suffer for it .

Another contradiction is from the ground of his Law or Canon , viz. the equality in suffering For by his Rule a poor Minister must suffer 20 l when a rich Hearer , whom he ministers to , but 5 s. And he on the apparent sight of the Informer must tell his Name , when the other , but when he is asked it . Oh equal levelling Law ! Are not the children of the world wiser ( looking on us as Levellers ) to make the rich Hearers pay the poor Preachers penalties , as well as they look on them obliged to maintain them , on their own supposition .

Memorandum , That I S. Cater do hereby testifie , that is my judgment , That all Friends in the Ministry , where they are Strangers , ought to tell the Name and Habitation upon the apparent sight of the Informers coming into a meeting , taking friends names in writing , or otherwise , in order to convict the Meeting , that so we may all stand in a like suffering capacity . Or if any have not freedom thus to do , that then they ought to make satisfaction to such who suffer for them through their concealing their Names and Habitations ; and that such as refuse to perform his or their part in either of these two Propositions , ought from thenceforth to be reputed blame-worthy , and noted as such ▪ Witness my hand , the day above-written , per me .

[ Thus far thy Prescription . ]

Further adding , viz. I say , signe this Paper , or one like it , and I will return the said 15 l. for the reason aforesaid . And this thou esteem'st a Condescention sufficient .

Thus art thou become a Dictator and Prescriber and Imposer upon others : Here thou hast made a general Rule and Prescription , as condition of thy returning the 15 l. to S. C. [ such an improbable condition as thou couldst not reasonably suppose would be complied with . Thus insincere thou appearest . ] Here 's a Canon , an Edict of thy framing , who hast made a great part of thy Book against Canons , Prescriptions , Rules , Edicts , Orders , Excommunications , &c. How consistent art thou in thy work ? yea , and if the Ministers will not observe this thy Canon to perform it , then to be reputed Blame-worthy , and noted as such ; and this thou wouldst have S. Cater subscribe . But thy Canon or Prescription is illegal , lame and defective ; yea , it exceeds the severity and extent of the Conventicle Act , which no where compels all Friends in the Ministry , where thy are strangers , to tell their Names and Habitations upon their apparent sight of Informers coming into a Meeting and taking Friends Names in writing or otherwise ; nor are any of the Meeters compelled by Law to tell their Names to Informers .

Thus Arbitrary , Illegal and Foolish too art thou in thy Canon and Constitution ; thou wouldst enforce upon Friends of the Ministry , where they are strangers , who sometimes may be silent in a Meeting , and sometimes ministring when Informers come in to take Names , by thy Canon the Ministers in silence must tell their Names and Habitations to Informers , and those that are ministring must stop to tell the Informers their Names and Habitations . This illegal Imposition of thine I further except against , in that it tends to gratifie the Informers , and forward them in their designs and prosecution , for a more speedy and easie Conviction ; * * Marg. added , Yet I do not limit Persons in this case ; there may be a special occasion to tell Names for the sake of others , but not to make that a general Rule — Friends are to be left free to Gods counsel . for if they get their Names thus readily told aforehand , as thy Canon and Prescription requires , they go presently to the Justices , swear the Offence , and cause the Conviction in the absence of the party concerned . In consideration of which , divers of us , even of late time , in the Meetings at Westminster have not had freedom presently to tell our Names to Informers and Officers , to leave them to inform the Justices what they please upon Oath , without controul , in our absence , but rather we have chosen to go to the Justices , that there we may tell our Names to them , and have opportunity to object to their faces against any Mis-informations . Thus thou hast failed and shewed thy shortness and shallowness in thy imperious and illegal Prescription and Imposition .

As for thy pressing for the Preachers who are Strangers to tell their Names , as aforesaid , and so to be in an Equal capacity with the Hearers in suffering .

1st , We cannot make a Law to enjoyn them to tell their Names to Informers , which the Law requires not : I know none that refuse to tell their Names to the civil Magistrate . We know the Preachers generally are most struck at , and most liable to suffer , and the Penalties are most severe upon them , as 20 l. for a first , and 40 l. for a second Offence ( so called ) and if Strangers , they are not wholly free from Sufferings ( as thou sayest . ) But all Preachers more lyable in the first place to suffer Imprisonment , &c. than others , being most envyed and aimed at by the Persecutors .

2dly , We cannot in point of Christianity , Truth or good Conscience , deem the Preacher an Offender , if we own his Ministry , So as to lay an Obligation upon him not only to tell his Name to Informers , but to be the greatest Sufferer . Truth 's interest and cause is but one in Minister and Hearer , and Christian love leads us therein to sympathize and suffer one with another in Spirit ; yea , and outwardly too , if there be necessity , and not to make preaching the Gospel an offence , any more than meeting or hearing it Preacht , seeing the Labour , and Pains , and greatest Hazard commonly is the Preachers , the advantage thereof is the Hearers . And if we have true Unity with the Gospel Preachers , we shall not complain against them , because of the Fines , nor think our selves to be bound under thy Prescription or Canon , who art both in Dis-union with them , and Enmity against them , much less to follow thy Crafty method , to pay our selves out of their Estates , when fined for them , or for their not telling their Names to Informers on sight , &c.

3dly , If thou makest the Preachers such Offendors , as that for want of telling their Names to Informers , they must be Responsible to the full , or wholly for the Fines laid upon Hearers on their account , and thereupon thy Eye is so severe upon them , as if they were the greatest Offendors . This is but the same Spirit that 's in the Persecutors and Informers , that 's not in unity with , but in Enmity against the Gospel-Ministers . This would not lay down its Life for the Brethren , that will not suffer 5 l. or 10 l. for them : And then I presume there 's no danger of thy suffering much on that account , who couldst so craftily repay thy self the whole 15 l. from Samuel Cater .

In this very Action , and thy malicious Book , thou appearest a Person more ready to turn Informer against the true Ministers and Servants of Christ , than to lose 10 l. on any of their account , by thy offensive Characters and Popish Comparisons thou hast put upon them , particularly upon George Fox , William Penn , George Whitehead , Stephen Crisp , Alexander Parker , Thomas Salthouse and John Burnyeat , whom thou hast represented in Print as Apostates , Antichristian , Innovators , Imposers , Popish , &c. for their Christian advice in divers particulars , cited by thee in thy printed Book , De Christiana Libertate , with thy scandalous defaming Observations upon them severally , from page 32. to page 57. to prove thy Unjust charge of doing Violence to our first Principles of Vnion , which they and we all utterly deny .

4thly , And the more like an Informer hast thou appeared , in ambitiously dedicating thy Book to a Great Man , i. e. Henry North , Knight , and in shewing that thou designed it for the Magistrates , in pretending to have laid before them a clear Demonstration for Liberty of Conscience ; thy Book being in two Parts , as is confest in the Title , and both Bound up and made to go in one : So that if the Magistrates see the first Part for Liberty of Conscience , ( which is not thy own ) they are liable to see thy second Part , wherein ( as an Enemy to Christian-Liberty ) thou art bitterly inveighing and clamouring against many faithful Servants and Ministers of our Lord Jesus Christ ( who are well approved among the People called Quakers ) for their signifying and giving their Christian Advice and Sence , in things needful to be practised in the Church , whereby thou art opposing the Liberty of their Consciences , which they have in Christ Jesus ; and art endeavouring to expose them as obnoxious and offensive to the Magistrate and outward Government , rendering them Tyrannical and Popish , like the Pope's Councils , &c. Thus false Informer-like , thou hast broke all Bonds of Christian Friendship , Society and Church-Order , and hast acted the part of a treacherous , persecuting Informer , in the very nature , purport and series of thy Book .

And I doubt not , but thy Infamous work will become odious to all Serious , Religious and Impartial Dissenting Protestants , the more it comes to Light , and to be strictly scand , and that thou wilt appear thereby not only as a turbulent , but perfidious , treacherous Person , and malicious Informer against thy own Society , and therefore not to be trusted by any other Societies or People , on any Religious and sociable account .

Thou hast also in thy Letter scurrilously abused and misrepresented S. Cater , J. Parks , and my self , and also the Womens Meeting , as That Samuel Cater had 10 l. presently sent him out of the Treasury from London : And that The Women's Meeting gathered so much Money for James Parks , upon his pretence of being Robbed . Both which I have made enquiry into , and find them false in Fact ; Samuel Cater belyed , the Women's Meeting belyed , and James Parks belyed , in the state of these Accusations . Be ashamed therefore of such Abuses , or produce Proof both of Fact and Circumstance , as stated by thee . Be ashamed also of thy saying , James Parks acted the part of an Oliverian Preacher , or G. W. once at Snare-Hill , or like some SVCH PENSIONERS .

Didst thou ever tell me of any thing thou hadst against me at Snare-Hill ? I am not Conscious to my self , but am sure thou dost shamefully belye me and J. P. in calling us Pensioners . What Pension , Wages , or yearly Stipend dost thou charge me or us withal ? What an unconscionable Defamer art thou ? Dost thou know what Pensioner means ? This is somewhat like thy espousing and printing the Report of Nicholas Lucas's saying , That I went up and down to Cheat the Country . And thy affirming , That truly my Behaviour hath manifested the truth thereof , page 150. of thy Book .

Thus in thy Letter before , sent after me in Manuscript , without the least occasion given thee by me , that I know of ; since which to amend the matter of thy Scandalous defaming abuse of me , before cited , thou addest this Parenthesis , viz. [ I reckon he meant not of Money , but the People of their Liberty they have right to ] Which is also a Slander and base come-off , and thousands of God's People are able to testifie against these thy defaming and insolent Lyes . I never was accounted a Cheat and Pensioner before . As also in thy calling Thomas Rudyard LYING LAWYER , for saying , Thou paidst thy Money Voluntarily before Distress was made on thy Goods : This I shewed Thomas Rudyard , and he counts it a foul abuse , slander and defamation upon his Person and Employment , to call him Lying Lawyer , supposing thou placest his Lying upon the word Voluntarily . If thou didst pay or deposit thy Fine on thy Appeal , and so prevented Distress ( as he understood thou then didst at that time ) he accounted it Voluntary , in respect of the Law , because the Act of Parliament in that case doth not compel thee to pay thy Fine upon entring thy Appeal ; for that the Appeal may be entred within one weeks time after the Fine is paid , OR Distress made ; so that 't is in the Appealants choice whether to pay the Fine or suffer Distress first ; for the Particle OR is disjunctive between both . Where is now the LYING LAWYER ? Art not thou herein manifest to be the LYING DEFAMER , that hast so little regard to the Reputation or Credit of others ? Where 's thy Conscience , or doing as thou wouldst be done by ?

Thy Envy and Defamation stops not here , but thou hast falsly accused us ( of the Second days Meeting ) with loving to have the Pre-eminence : He that searches and knows our Hearts , sees and will judge thy false Judgment and Abuse in this and many other things ; as also in thy false and abusive Insinuation in telling of the Sums , Gratuities and large Pensions , privately extended to such ( speaking of James Parks ) and others of his Fraternity : And which far exceed THAT of the Bason and Platter , we usually , and with too much confidence ( sayst thou ) bespatter the Professors withal , seeing we do the same thing for which we condemn them only a little privater . [ Thus far thy false and abusive Accusation against such as James Parks and his Brethren . ]

Oh horrid Impudence and Falshood ! be ashamed hereof : Thou heapest up Slanders and Defamations against the Innocent , for which God will rebuke thee . 'T is not unknown how many of us spend our Strength , Labour and Substance in the service of the Lord and his People in many respects , wherein I for one have not had the least share , though now by thee rendred a Cheat and a Pensioner . Oh! blush and be ashamed of such abominable Lyes and scurrilous Detractions .

To conclude thy Letter , on thy falshood against the Womens Meeting gathering Money , &c. thou scornfully inferrest , that therein they have forfeited their Charter , mentioned in thy Book , p. 37. and deserves a COERANTO to be brought , &c. I cannot but take notice what a liberty thou takest to scoff , mock and jeer against our Religious Christian Womens Meeting , and how abusive and silly thou art therein , although thou hast often scornfully twitted me with the words LEARNED FRIEND , in thy Book and Letters , as if it were such a great Crime to ascribe that to any Friend , whilst yet thou art ambitious to shew thy self a learned Person . Here to shew thy Learning in the Latin Tongue , thou tellest us of a COERANTO , which is no good Latine to be sure , and thou mayst be questioned in what Language thou hadst the Expression . * * Q. added , If it be not Dog-Latin ? I suppose thou hast lately heard Discourses of Quo Warranto about the City-Charter , upon which from thy own imaginary conceit thou writest us COERANTO in a large Italick Character , that it may appear how learned and skilled thou art in Latine and Law ; and likewise we must have a Latine Title to thy Book , second Part , i. e. De Christianâ Libertate : But where thou learnedst this Title , and what stress or Emphasis canst thou place upon its being in Latine more than if it had been in English , i. e. Concerning Christian-Liberty ? For Liberty of Conscience asserted , is not the English of thy Latine Title , but varies from it in the Terms , as well as in the Nature of it : And thy prosecution for Liberty of Conscience , as asserted by thee , appears a Liberty not only in opposition to Persecution , but also to our Godly Care , Advice , Counsel and Admonition , relating to good Order and Church-Government amongst us , and testified unto in our Paper opposed by thee in thy Book ( from page 41 , to page 51. ) And if this must be the extent of thy Christian-Liberty , thou mightst better have entituled thy Book , Pro Libertate Carnali ; for it seems the Liberty pleaded for by thee , admits not of Spiritual Censures , Reproofs , Advice or Judgment , according to Christ's Law exhibited , as appears by thy scurrilous opposition & infamous Characters thou givest to our said Paper , partly cited in thy Book , and most Unchristianly and Unjustly made thy great Proof of our Doing Violence to our first Principles of Vnion , and consequently turned Antichristian ; and such thou renderest William Penn , George Whitehead , Alexander Parker , Stephen Crisp , Thomas Salthouse , John Burnyeat , whose Names thou hast exposed in Print , as the Persons unjustly charged by thee . But we have not yet concluded thy Learning in Coeranto , but must view a little more of it in thy Book , on the passage thou hast borrowed on trust from William Rogers his Translation , as he confesseth , for which we have only his own Authority in these Words , ( viz. ) Which for the sake of some , I thus Translate , ( 7th Part , Christian Quaker , p. 62. ) 'T is in thy 125 , 126 , 127 , 128 pages , out of Bishop Hooper ; the first Words , Scitis quod res sancta , et vera quo magis examinatur . Thou accepts his Translation hereof in these words , KNOW YE , that by how much the more , &c. Here Scitis , the very first Word , which is , Ye know , in the Indicative , is falsly translated know ye , as Scite in the Imperative ; whereas by Scitis in this place was intended Indication , Demonstration , or Proof , and not imperatively Teaching ; and likewise Nam quod variis modis tentatur ; ac probatur , modo pium ac sanctum FVERIT , Jacturam ab hostibus nullam sentit , is thus translated ( viz. ) For that which is tryed and proved after various manners , if IT HATH BEEN , &c. instead of IT SHALL BE ; for FVERIT is exact future ( as they term it . ) Many things of the Types and Shadows under the Law , as Tythes and Offerings , &c. have been holy , but shall not be again , afficitis is made afflict instead of affect , and also Legem & Evangelium Dei , are translated The Word of God , instead of The Law and Gospel of God ; then at last Judicio , is , to the Judgment , when it should be more properly by the Judgment ▪ But the most material Mistake is in the very first word Scitis , falsly translated , as to the Mood .

But these Instances are only to shew thee what a ridiculous Novice and Ludibrie thou hast rendred thy self , both in Writing and Print , even to School-Boys : I saw lately a School-Boy of Eleaven Years old Laugh at thy Absurdity , as a Person wise in thy own Conceit . Yet whilst thou wouldst make a show and flourish of Learning , thou hast here taken a false Translation upon an implicit Faith and blind Credulity : Thou that art such a fierce opposer of implicit Faith and blind Obedience , and hast so often scoft at me for the Words , Learned Friend , in reference to R. R. I wonder thou art not ashamed of such scornful treatment , and medling so often with Latine , when I find thou canst not write true English in many things .

This is only a small Check to thy Pride and empty Conceits , this not being one of the absurdest Faults or Falshoods thou hast presented the World withal . Come down and be humbled before the All-seeing God .

From thy antient Friend , and yet Well-wisher , though insolently abused by thee , G. Whitehead . Middlesex , the 22d day of the 7th Moneth , 1682.

The Second Part of the said Letter . Francis Bugg ;

NOw concerning thy Book , stiled , DE CHRISTIANA LIBERTATE , or Liberty of Conscience , &c. 1st , I observe thou beginest unjustly to accuse and reflect upon the People called Quakers in the very Title page , in these Words , viz. And the mischief of Impositions amongst the People called Quakers , &c. In two Parts . And that thou concernest the Magistracy with it , both in thy Epistle dedicated to H. North , Knight , ( as being obliged to publish it for the Information of the Magistracy , &c. ) as also in thy Epistle , directed to the Noble Bereans , thou concernest the Magistrates , as having in the Book prefixed ( i. e. thy first Part ) laid before them many weighty Arguments for Liberty of Conscience , &c. So that to the Magistrates thou hast given thy Information against the People called Quakers , as having mischievous Impositions among them ; which we utterly deny ; and thy Scornful Malicious Book proves it not . Thus thou art turned Informer to the Magistrates against an Innocent suffering People , whom thou hast so long walked amongst : How darest thou appear in their Meetings , and thus act the part of a treacherous , malicious Informer against them , even to the Magistrates ? Oh! Blush and be ashamed of this thy hateful Work .

2dly , Thou having entituled thy self to to the matters contain'd in a Treatise , entituled , Liberty of Conscience asserted and vindicated , by thy high Commendations given of it to H. North , as Being perswaded it will be of Good Service ; and ( in thy Epistle to the Bereans ) A clear Demonstration , &c. And in thy Preface to the Reader , of the Author , thou thus sayest , viz. His Judgment upon this Subject , is my Judgment .

Now observe what this Author's Judgment is concerning the Light in men , whereupon he chiefly placeth his Demonstration for Liberty of Conscience . In page 4. he saith , viz. Their Natural Light , derived to them from their first Creation , dictating to them what they ought to do , and what not , and enabling them to pass a Judgment upon themselves of their due behaviour towards God , &c. With some other passages of like nature in the said Treatise .

Here ( Francis ) thou hast presented H. North , and the Magistrates with unsound and unscriptural Doctrine , and appearest Apostate , and corrupt in thy Judgment , in calling the Light in men ( which thus dictates their duty ) Their natural Light , derived to them from their first Creation : Herein thou hast wrongfully informed H. N. and the Magistrates about the Principle , the Light in men , contrary to the Quakers Testimony , born from the beginning concerning the Light in men , which is according to the holy Apostle's Testimony , John 1.4 , 9. that In the Word , or Son of God , was Life ; and that Life was the Light of men ; And that this is not a natural or created Light , but a Supernatural and Divine Light of the Christ Jesus , the Son of God .

3dly , And now ( Francis ) having thus misrepresented our Principle to the Magistrates , and so mis-informed them about the Light in men . Thou proceedest upon an unjust charge of Impositions against certain Persons , chiefly concerned , owned and approved among the People called Quakers , whom thou scornfully callest G. Fox , and those of Party with him ; and hast exposed the Names of some of them in Print , whom thou meanest by that Party , as William Penn , George Whitehead , Stephen Crisp , Alexander Parker , Thomas Salthouse , John Burnyeat , p. 51. And what hast thou to charge all these with , that thou hast printed a Book and informed the Magistracy against them ? It is The mischief of Impositions ; The inconsistency betwixt the Church-Discipline , or Order and Government erected by those , Thy Charge collected . and THAT in the Primitive times ( as in the Title of thy second part . ) It is also , That there is Violence done to our first Principles of Vnion ; Consequently Tyranny introduced , and our Society turned Antichristian , p. 32 , 33. ( According to W▪ P's Proposition in his Address , thus falsly applyed by thee against himself , and the rest of us before-named . ) Now Francis , I must plainly tell thee , this Inconsistency and Violence charged by thee against us , we utterly deny , and the Instances thou givest do not at all prove it , As first , G. F's Paper for Women's Meeting distinct , that they might be in the practice of pure Religion , to visit the Fatherless and the Widows , and to see that all be kept from the spots of the World , &c. [ As 't is cited at large by thee , p. 33 , 34 , 35 , 36 , 37. ]

Now ( Francis ) where 's the Inconsistency charged ? Can there be an Inconsistency where there 's no Contradiction , nor the least opposition ? Thy judging such Women's Meetings as are for the Practice or Promotion of pure Religion , in the practical parts of it , inconsistent with the Christian-Discipline , Order and Government in the Primitive times , doth bespeak not only that thou dost not well understand what Inconsistent means , but also that thou hast undertaken a Charge thou art never able to make good . And thy charge of Violence done to our first Principles of Union is worse than Inconsistent . And thy scornfully telling of the Women's Charter and New Order , is no Proof ( man ) of thy Charge : Where 's the Inconsistency and Violence that 's charged , done by the faithful Womens Meetings among us , or by any of us , by encouraging them to meet for those Religious and Charitable ends and services mentioned ? How hast thou acted the part of an ignorant conceited Scoffer , instead of proving thy Charge before cited ? Besides , the very self-same Paper writ by G. F. which thou hast cited as an instance of our Inconsistency and Violence , was received , owned and approved at a Quarterly Meeting at Kendal in Westmorland , in the Year 1671. And another written in approbation thereof , and subscribed by some of thy own party , as John Wilkinson , Richard Stephanson , Henry Garnet , and Twenty one more Friends , for encouraging of the Women's assembling , and Religious Charitable Services before proposed , both which are cited at large in our Book , Entituled , The Accuser of our Brethren , from pag. 98 , to p. 102. Thus contradictory art thou to some of thy own Brethren , in thy condemning the same Paper as an Imposition , Inconsistency and Violence to our first Principles , which they so plainly approved of .

4thly , Again , in pursuance of thy unrighteous Charge before cited , thou recitest four passages out of a Paper of ours , dated , London , the 27th of the 3d Moneth , 1675. which was given as our Judgment and Advice in certain things needful , for good Order among us ( as we believed ) The first Passage thou hast cited , is that for Marriages to be at least twice propounded to the Meetings , that are to take care therein , &c. before they are accomplished , &c. Now where 's the Inconsistency here , with the Discipline in the Primitive Christian Church , or the Violence done to our first Principles of Union ? Instead of proving thy charge by this instance , we have in thy Observation a piece of Scorn and Mockery , viz. This notable , if not universal Council : Their new stamped Government , p. 42. Oh! be ashamed of such Scorn and Folly ! Is this thy proof of thy charge ? Is it a violation to our first Principles of Union , to have Marriages proposed at least twice to the Meetings concerned ? ( both Mens and Womens , where both are established ) However , to be twice proposed to such Meetings as are established , and to take care therein , to understand that the Persons be clear , and Friends satisfied , before the Marriage be accomplished ? And this has been these many Years practised among us ; and I know no true Union broken thereby , nor any violation done to our first Principles thereof : Be ashamed therefore of thy fruitless attempts , in giving such an high charge against us , when thou canst make no proof it .

5thly , Concerning our Testimony on behalf of Mens and Womens Meetings in the Church of Christ ; as for their Rise and Establishment , being in the counsel of God , and for the encouraging Faithful and Grave Women therein , and to admonish them that discountenance or weaken their Hands in the Work and Service of the Lord , &c. Thou callest this A Decree , a decretal Order ; This New fashioned Edict , p. 45 , 46. And sayst , It has no relation to Scripture-Authority , Precept or President ; no relation to the Example of the Holy men of God recorded in Scripture , nor any command of God or Jesus Christ . Why no Relation to them ? How provest thou that ? what because we have not every particular circumstance of Persons and things exprest ? Whence it follows not that this has no relation to Scripture or President , &c. Holy Women and Sisters in the Faith , Elder Widdows that were honourable , and Deaconesses , did many Religious and Charitable Services in the Primitive Christian Churches : What then might they not meet and confer together for one anothers help and encouragement in those Services they had , and were frequently imployed in ? Can it either be a violence to their Principles of Union for such to meet together ? or have their Assemblies no relation to Scripture ? What contrariety thereto have they ? Surely we alwayes accounted our Religious Meetings , to serve one another in Love , consistent with our Union and the Principles thereof . And so for Godly Women to meet for those Religious and Charitable ends and Services , for which their Assemblies are intended , must needs be consistent with the same Principles of Love and Union , and tend to the Increase thereof , and not to the Violation thereof , as thou hast falsly charged . Upon our Admonition , Not to discountenance or weaken their Hands in the Work and Service of the Lord . Thou maketh this observation , viz. See what a strict and severe admonition is uttered forth , even as if it had come from the Pope's Council of Jesuits and crafty Fryars , [ Scoffing and Smiting still at the Womens Meetings ] p. 46 , 47.

How now ( Francis ) is this thy treatment and comparison of us ? Hadst thou no better than the Pope's Council of Jesuits and crafty Fryars to compare us unto , in our Testimony and Admonition ? Oh! be ashamed of such foul , sordid , and scornful , and false treatment , who instead of proving thy Charge of Inconsistence and Violence , as before , now abuseth us , mocks and scoffs , and scandallizeth us , like a conceited proud Fool.

6thly , Be ashamed also of thy scornfully upbraiding us with our Womens Meetings , as an Idol of our own erecting ; and asking , Why should it not publickly be brought to Light , and made as manifest as the Lord Cromwell made the Papists great Idol , to wit , the Rood of Grace ( which had goggling Eyes , and would smile when a good Gift was offorded to it ) when he caused it to be brought to Paul's Cross , where the People tore it all to pieces , in King Henry the 8 ht's time , p. 47.

Oh , thou ungodly Wretch and malicious Informer ! is this a fit Comparison and Instance to present the Magistrates with , against our Christian , Religious , Charitable and Sober Womens Meetings ? And dost thou under such an abominable and odious Comparison thus expose them to the Magistrates , for their Meetings , to be torn to pieces ? Thou vile Wretch , blush and be ashamed of such malicious , scornful and defaming Impertinences , thus instead of proving thy before-cited Charge , to act the malicious , reviling and false accusing Informer against God's People ; then scornfully concludest thy Observation with these words , viz. This notable , not Scriptural , but Anti-scriptural Edict , p. 48. Which is a false Conclusion , without Premises , and a shameful begging the Question , wherein thou art an Imposer ; for not one sentence or word in all that said Paper of our sence and Advice hast thou proved ANTI-SCRIPTVRAL , or directly contrary to Scripture , as thy terms are , p ▪ 79. Thou shouldst then have shewn us what Scripture forbids either faithful Womens Assembling , or those Religious and Charitable ends and services proposed , which their Meetings are intended for ? I dare challenge thee in this to prove thy charge of Anti-scriptural .

7thly , I do affirm , thou art so far from making good thy Charge , that for all thy Attempts , I have still occasion to return the same charge upon thee that we did upon William Rogers , which for a pretence thou citest , but dost not answer it , p. 39. viz.

What new and unchristian Doctrines and Practices are we fallen into ? We find no proof nor discovery thereof in all thy Book . I do profess seriously ( however thou scoffingly callest me a notable serious George ) I see no cause nor reason thou shewest for the great noise & rumble thou makest about outward Laws , Prescriptions , Orders , Edicts or Decrees , outward form of Government , Apostacy , Innovation , Impositions , Lording over Faith , over Conscience , &c. ( To which I may add thy terms , Womens Charter , Grant , Confirmation , New Order , Decretal Order , New fashion'd Edict , Popes Council , Papists great Idol , Canonical Rules , New spiritual Lords , Decrees , Canons , Edicts of Men , Tyrannical proceedings , &c. ) whilst thou shewest to us no unjust , no unlawful nor uncomely Order or Proceedings amongst us , as a People , nor yet givest us any Catalogue or Instance of those Impositions , Innovations , New Doctrines or Practices brought in and received amongst us , which are INCONSISTENT with our first Testimony to the Light and Grace of God within , and teaching thereof , or thereby condemned as Evil , or wholly unnecessary in themselves ( as our words are . )

8thly , This thou dost not answer , but Marvellest that G. Whitehead should have the Confidence thus to call for a Catalogue of New Orders that are introduced among us ; or rather ( sayst thou ) Impudence to deny such things as are every Moneth put in practice among us . And therefore sayst , thou wilt bring forth Proof and President ; first the Confirmation of the Foundation of the Womens Meetings , namely , G. F 's Order by a general Council held at London , 1675.

To all which I must tell thee , thou dost not follow the terms of the Challenge , but ramblest impertinently , telling us of New Orders , such things , the Confirmation of the Foundation of the Womens Meetings , &c. but provest not those things ( nor one thing ) practised among us as a People ; or that first Confirmation , as thou falsly callest it , to be Inconsistent with ( or contrary to ) our first Testimony to the Light and Grace of God within , and teachings thereof . 'T is not thy making a noise with New Orders , Decrees , &c. shall serve thy turn in this point ; but I challenge thee to prove that the setting up and encouraging our faithful Womens Meetings are contrary to the Light and Grace of God within and teachings thereof . This is matter thou hast undertaken to bring proof and president for . This is close to the terms of our Challenge , and thou hast but made shuffling , slubbering work about it .

9thly , Moreover , what we propounded in our Paper aforesaid , ( which thou callest The Confirmation by a general Council held at London , Anno 1675. and which thou hast instanced for proof of thy Charge of Inconsistency and Violence , and consequently as Antichristian ) was tenderly concluded in these terms , viz. All which we recommend to the Evidence of Gods holy Witness in the Hearts of his People . * * Query added . I do seriously ask William Rogers , if this Paper of ours , thus Recommended , be sufficient proof of Imposition , and being turned Antichristian ? I desire plain Answer hereunto , in relation to what he has granted for a Recommendation , &c. Why didst thou not take notice of this Conclusion , to have prevented thy false charge of Imposition , wherein thou hast contradicted thy Brother William Rogers ; for he hath divers times assented to and own'd the giving advice and counsel by way of Recommendation , distinguishing that from Imposition , as his own Books and Words are evidence . But thou cryst out , Impositions , Inconsistency , Violence to our first Principles of Vnion , on that very same Paper which is concluded by way of Recommendation to the Evidence of Gods holy Witness in the Hearts of his People . And to this and other Papers of Advice , Judgment , &c. thou hast opposed Liberty of Conscience , and so made void Spiritual Censures , contrary to the very Author thou hast printed , owned and espoused , as being of the same Judgment with thee , where he saith , pag. 138. part 1. 'T is very fit , that wheresoever you will suppose Errors to be sprung up , all the means Christ hath appointed for that end should be used to suppress them , and reclaim Men from them : Let their Mouthes be stopped with sound Doctrine and Spiritual Censures . The only Question is about the use of the Temporal Power in such things . — Principles and Opinions in the Mind were never extinguished by the punishing the Body . Here his Liberty of Conscience pleaded , is not from spiritual Censures , as thou hast perverted it , but from corporal Punishments .

10thly , Whereas in our Book , Accuser , &c. pag. 127. we signified , that having these things in our Eye , viz. The great ends of true Religion and Christian Society , a godly Care over one another , provoking one another to Love and good Works , we can the more easily concur and accord , as to Circumstances and outward Methods ; and in the Wisdom of God so to condescend one to another , and accommodate matters , as not to divide about them , &c.

Against this thou exceptest , in these words , viz. p. 96. I marvel that the Author of the Accuser , &c. which is said to be G. Whitehead , should have the Confidence thus to appear in Print , when his own Conscience tells him the contrary , instancing R. Smith of Colne , as not admitted to have his Wife , because he would not go into the Womens Meeting : The grand Opposer was G. W. — It may evidently appear how far G. W. was from Accommodation or Condescention , which he fallaciously pretends to the World , in order to deceive them , to cover their Deceit , Hypocrisie and Arbitrary Church-Government , Dominion and Lordship , &c. p. 97.

And to aggravate the matter against G. W. in page 129. thou sayst , That the pretence of the Author of the Accuser , to Condescention and Accommodation is fallacious and false , and a meer piece of feigned Hypocrisie to amuse the Reader and delude the World . And likewise in pag. 150. thou art smiting at G. W. on the same account .

Here thou hast brought my name upon the Stage in Print , but hast most grosly belyed me and abused me , as to my Conscience , in saying it tells me the contrary . Be ashamed of this thy presumptious bespattering and abusing me in Print ; for my Conscience tells me , I was real in what I proposed in Condescention and Accommodating matters , and that I was no deceiver therein , as thou proudly slanderest me . The Condescention and Accommodation was to those that had the great ends of true Religion , Christian care and love one to another in their Eye ; it was to the upright and tender hearted , and not to the exalted , hard and wilful . And I gave my Christian and tender Advice to the Person who then proposed his Intention , in order to convince him of the reasonableness of what I proposed , and he shewed no reason against it , but remained stiff and pertinacious , which I cannot impute to a real tender Conscience ; the woman was tender and flexible , and of a better Spirit . Therefore be ashamed of abusing and belying me in Print , as for appearing in Print contrary to my Conscience , as thou hast shamefully belyed me , and so falsly informed the Magistrates against me , as about Condescention and Accommodation ( and divers other things ) about which I must farther tell thee , The condescention of primitive Christians was to them of low degree , the strong in bearing with the weak , bearing one anothers burthens , and so fulfilling the Law of Christ . The Persons unto whom the Condescention was , were in a measure of the same faith and love ; it was not to false Brethren ( such as thou art ) or to false Apostles , deceitful Workers , who caused Divisions , &c. false Brethren that watched with an evil Eye , to such the true Apostle gave not place by subjection , no , not for an hour : What Apostolical condescention was then given to them ? There was an Apostolical authority and sharpness , against such evil Agents of Strife and Division ( such as thy self ) that they should be marked , as well as a condescention to weak ( yet upright-hearted ) Brethren .

11thly , In the Certificate , printed by thee from Huntington-Meeting , to the Quarterly-Meeting in the Isle of Ely , about the said R. S. his publishing his Intentions of taking to Wife A. O. of Aldred , but grieved some Friends by rejecting their Counsel ; After some Friends , there 's this Parenthesis added , viz. [ Perhaps Richard Jobson and Tobias Hardmeat , G. Fox 's two principal Studs in that Country . ] This looks like a scornful Forgery of thy own framing and addition ; And I find no Advertisement to distinguish or except it as thy own , as thou hast done in thy Letter to W. P. about the Copy of Orders Recorded as Your Canon ( as thou scornfully callest them ) in the Quarterly — verbatim , Parenthesis excepted ( sayst thou ) p. 139. Remember thou hast confessed , That to expose and falsly represent a People , would be very wicked ; and such a Practice is , and ever was hated of God & good men , p. 208. Yet after thou hast promised to recite the said Certificate , p. 96. thou hast , as before , inserted the said scornful Parenthesis , viz. [ Perhaps R. Jobson and T. Hardmeat , G. Fox 's two principal Studs in that Country ] p. 97 , 98. Unto which thou hast subscribed Jasper Robins , Edward Neel , William Whitehead , James Parris , Thomas Bundy , Richard Tayler , Thomas Bagly , Nathaniel Cawthorn , Nathaniel Neel . Now I am perswaded , that these very Persons , Jasper Robins , and the rest , if they come to observe the said scornful Parenthesis inserted in their said Certificate , unto which their Names are subscribed , as well as the rest of it , and that without such Advertisement or Exception , as before , they 'l look upon it , and judge it as thy own Scurrility and gross Forgery , and thereupon they may testifie against thee , for exposing and falsly representing them in Print , to that which is none of theirs , and that therefore thou hast done that which is very Wicked , a practice that is and ever was hated of God and good Men , according to thy own Sentence .

12thly , Whereas in thy printed Letter to Friends of our Meeting in London , thou sayest , That R. R. needed not be admired by G. W. in Print , for his great Learning , nor perhaps had not , only he hath found out some History , or Popish Author , which sayes , there were Deaconesses as well as Deacons ; which ( sayst thou ) was helpful to G. W. in his Preaching and Disputing for Womens Meetings lately in Huntingtonshire , and elsewhere , &c. p. 178.

Thou mightest have forborn these and other scornful Detractions , cast upon R. R. and my self , and upbraiding him with , Oh! Profound Learning , Logick &c. He can easily answer thy Impertinencies and Silliness , and evince thy Pride and Conceit , in meddling with Learning and Logick , which thou hast so little of . As for R. R. he is known to be learned both as a Man and a Christian ; yet not admired by me for any acquired parts ; though without offence , he may be allowed his due in those things , without admiration or boasting , and therein to be prefered to thy self , who neither writest good English , nor understandest divers words of Learning thou makest use of improperly and impertinently , which I do not mention to detract from and upbraid thee , meerly because of such defect in Learning , but rather as a Reproof to thy high Conceit , and busying thy self so much in Scribling , and that about matters beyond thy capacity to mannage , or render a Reason to decide , and that thou mayest see that there are others can see and discover thy Ignorance and shallow Conceits , as even in this thy Objection against Deaconesses , concluding , That only R. R. hath found out some History or Popish Author , which says , there were Deaconesses as well as Deacons . In this thou hast shewn as well a great deal of ignorance of History , as scorn and contempt ; yea , not only Ignorance in that , but Presumption too , and as little Learning to be sure , in other respects , to place the proof of Deaconesses so indifferently upon some History or Popish Author , as if there were so little difference or distinction , but that if it be some History , then it may as well be said some Popish Author ; however , thou knowest not whether it be some History or Popish Author . But to correct such Ignorance and Presumption , there are Histories and Authors which are not Popish , yea , divers Protestant Authors , which affirm Deaconesses to have been in the Primitive Christian Churches , and they were called Diaconissae ▪ and even in Rom. 16.1 . Paul himself called Phaebe 〈◊〉〈◊〉〈◊〉〈◊〉〈◊〉 ( i. e. a Deacon , which is a Word borrowed of the Greek ) in Latin Ministra , in English A Servant or Minister . I hope thou wilt not call Paul a Popish Author , writing so to the Romans . And on Rom. 16.1 . 1 Tim. 5.9 . Deacon is said to be a Title of Office or Administration , given sometimes to Women , vide The Christian-Dictionary , by Thomas Wilson , Bagwell , and Andrew Simpson ; to which also agrees Edward Leighs Critica Sacra , and T. C's Greek Lexicon on the word 〈◊〉〈◊〉〈◊〉〈◊〉〈◊〉 , * * 〈◊〉〈◊〉〈◊〉〈◊〉〈◊〉 Mas. and Fem. given to Sister Phaebe , in Rom. 16.1 . We have William Cave's Lives of the Primitive Fathers for the three first Ages of Christianity , and that even in the time of the Emperor Trajan , there were Deaconesses that suffered , that were examined upon the Rack ( see fol. 21. ) As also I find in a Book , entituled A Brief of the Bible's History , by Enoch Clapham , Printed 1608. who writ against the Romish Idolaters , fol. 162. And in fol. 171. He thus affirms , For the Deacons all almost easily grant , that there were two sorts of Deacons , or Church-Servitors ; the first of Men , Acts 6.3 . &c. 1 Tim. 3.8 . The second of Women , 1 Tim. 5.9 . &c. Rom. 16.1 . That the first had the charge of gathering the Benevolence of the Saints ( especially every first day of the Week , 1 Cor. 16.1 . ) — That the second attended the Sick & Impotent , it is by many held . [ Thus far this Protestant Author , besides many other Protestants that might be cited in this very point , some whereof I told R. R. of , who says , He has many others he has not produced , and Challenges you to bring one approved Author , to shew that Women had no Service in the first Churches . ] And though the Rhemists grant there were Diaconissae or Deaconesses , I do not find that Dr. Fulk doth oppose them in that , but about their being concerned in the Sacraments , and in their Superstitions , Nunneries , denying Marriages , &c. ( as the Papists would have them . ) For as to Deaconesses , and their Services in the Christian Churches , there is great concurrence of History , and antient and modern Writers , as well Protestants , ( if not more ) as Papists . And therefore thy placing it upon some Popish Author , does greatly manifest not only Ignorance , but rather Presumption , Pride and Contempt against faithful Women's service in the Church of Christ : And I can assure thee , that I had not these precedent ( and other ) Citations from R. Richardson , but mostly from my own search and observations on the Authors themselves ; though R. R. may be better credited in his Affirmation on Knowledge , than thy self in thy ignorant Negation .

13 th , Again , I take notice of thy Charge against me , in thy said printed Letter to our Meeting in London , p 178. where scornfully writing against , and reflecting on G. W. his preaching and disputing for Womens Meetings in Huntingtonshire . Thou goest on in these words , viz. Where he took too much upon him , and behaved himself more like a Lordly Bishop , or Popish Prelate , than an humble Minister of Christ ; and by me at this time is , and stands impeached as an Enemy to Christian-Liberty , a Vsurper over the Conscience , the which I stand ready publickly to assert , maintain and vindicate , p. 178.

Thus far thou in thy insolent Reviling and Abuse , boasting of thy pretended Impeachment against me : But I have met with no lawful nor due Impeachment from thee in any Gospel judicial way . Thou writest thus against me to the Friends of our Second day's Meeting in London , but they cannot own nor receive any such pretended and proof-less Impeachment against me upon thy bare Accusation , nor that thou hast any Jurisdiction to impeach me , as by thy unjustly comparing me to a Lordly Bishop , or Popish Prelate , and rendring me an Enemy to Christian-Liberty , an usurper over the Conscience : But this is but like thy accusing me as a Cheat , at having gone up and down to cheat the Country , after thou hadst flatter'd and fawn'd in another Letter , and intreated my assistance for the ending of the Controversie , as one that could do much in the matter ; but now revilest me all to nought , boasting how ready thou stands Publickly to assert , maintain and vindicate . And what ? But that G. W. took too much upon him in Huntingtonshire , and behaved himself more like a Popish Prelate , &c. An Enemy to Christian-Liberty . And what worse Marks and Characters of Infamy couldst thou have cast upon me ? and what more severe Excommunication or Bull couldst thou have exhibited in Print against me ? How like an exalted , malicious , prating Diotrephes ? how like a Pope ? how like the Accuser of the Brethren hast thou acted ? Thou accusest , scornest and railest , but provest nothing of matter charged : And can any reasonably think thou hast thy Proofs in readiness against me out of Huntingtonshire , of these black and infamous Characters thou hast cast upon me ? Thy own bare Accusations are no Proofs to be sure . The Lord rebuke this thy envious dark Spirit : And he will rebuke it .

But ( Francis ) art not thou thy self against Christian-Liberty of Conscience ? and an usurper over the Womens Consciences ( so far as thou canst ) in thy perverse and ignorant opposition against Womens Meetings , who have a Conscience towards God , and our Lord Jesus Christ therein ? What Liberty of Conscience dost thou allow them therein ? or to me in preaching and discoursing in Huntingtonshire , or elsewhere , thus to send out thy Roaring Bull against me in Print , without first either enquiring of me , or hearing me and my Accusers ( if there be any besides thy self ) face to face ? What kind of illegal Precipiancy art thou guilty of ! and yet none more ready to make a great clamour against Excommunications , Orders , Edicts , &c. than thy self ? Oh Imperious , Proud , Conceited Person ! Blush and be ashamed of such Abusive , Inconsistent and Self-contradictory Work ! Be ashamed of thy assuming such Power of Excommunication to thy self over thy Elders , Antient Friends and Brethren , who are approved Servants of Christ . How like a Popish Prelate , yea , like the Pope himself hast thou proudly , maliciously & imperiously acted against me and others of the faithful Servants & Ministers of Christ Jesus ? Be ashamed therefore and confounded because of thy Insolent and Slanderous Abuses against the Innocent ; and particularly of thy gross Lye against me and others , viz. That the holy Scripture is by us slighted , p. 152. Be ashamed , I say , of this abominable Lye .

And for Confutation to thy abuse of me before , read the following Certificate from Persons of better Credit than thy self .

Huntingtonshire . From our Monethly Meeting at Godmanchester , the 11th day of the 5th Moneth , 1682.

WHereas George Whitehead hath been evilly traduced in two Letters of Francis Bugg's , and charged in one of them with behaving himself in Huntingtonshire like a Lordly Bishop or Popish Prelate , lately . — Now we whose Names are subscribed , do testifie , We never in this County , nor else-where at any time , saw any such thing ; and that he is a man far remote from any such matter ; but do believe he is a true Labourer in Gods service , and an humble Minister of the Gospel .

Matthew Kay , Samuel Nottingham , Tobias Hardmeat , Robert Lister , Jasper Robins , John Wilsford , John Aversett , John Marshall , William Starling , Richard Snazdale , John King , David Tisoeth , Thomas Lyster , Richard Jobson .

14 th , And thy malicious scribling tends , in divers parts of it , unjustly to render us Obnoxious and Offensive to Authority , by wickedly and falsly rendring the Proceedings of some of our Christian Meetings Tyrannical and Antichristian , and comparing us to the Popes Councils , to Popes , &c. And all this to Henry North , Knight , and the Magistrates too , is next to prosecuting us for our Liberties or Lives . —

So disgustful may be thy trumpeting and publishing in Print the Moderation of H. North , Knight , ( p. 194. ) and his mercifulness in taking notice of our threatned Ruin , and preventing it , &c. as in thy Epistle Dedicatory to him , that doubtless we think Henry North as a prudent man will not thank thee for thus trumpeting his Fame abroad in Print , on behalf of Dissenters ; for such kind of Ostentatious dealing is offensive and hateful to great Persons of Prudence , who would not have their goodness exposed to publick censure or reflection , nor be represented as Persons Popular for any dissenting Parties .

I have many more things material against thy Book ; but I desire thee to accept of my Labour and honest Endeavours ; and what I have written thus largely to thee , as an act of Christian Condescention and good Will for thy Conviction , that thou mayst yet be abased and humbled unto Repentance and publick Condemnation of thy wicked and scurrilous Book , if the Lord will yet please to give thee an Heart to Repent and acknowledge the Truth , which thou hast deeply offended and sinned against with thy Lyes and Lightness .

And I desire to know , if after the reading and perusal of this my large Letter , thou art at all minded to relent and retract thy Book , or any part of it , and accordingly to give forth a plain Condemnation or Recantation as publick . To this I expect answer shortly from thee , otherwise trouble me not with any disingenious or scurrilous Letters .

Thy Abused ( yet Well-wishing ) Friend , George Whitehead . London , the 3 d day of the 8 th Moneth , 1682.

Postscript since added . Wherein F. B's fallacy about the Record in the Quarterly Meeting Book in the Isle of Ely , his abuse of the Servants of Christ , his Contradiction about William Penn , his Scorn , Malice and Ranting Doctrine , are detected and reprehended .

WHen I was lately in the Isle of Ely , I made enquiry about the account which thou F. Bugg givest in thy Observations , pag. 52. viz. concerning a Minister ( thou knowest who thou mentionedst ) being recorded out of the Vnity , for not taking his Wife according to the Order of Friends ( i. e. ) not publishing his Intentions before the Womens Meetings , as hereafter * * Yet I find it not So manifest afterward in thy Book at all . will be further manifest ( sayst thou ) but not one recorded that ever thou remembrest for any breach of Gods Commandments , pag. 53. For which acount thou referest any man to search the Records of your Quarterly Meeting Book in Hadenham in the Isle of Ely , &c.

But upon my enquiry I find , that Friends do positively give a contrary account , and do plainly affirm , that there were no Womens Meeting Then at that time in being in those parts ( or within that Monethly Meeting ) in Cambridgshire , where the said Person lives , who proposed his Intentions of Marriage but once before the Men ; And if so , thy account must be notoriously false , and thou mayst be horridly ashamed to divulge it , as also of thy frequently saying , He was recorded out of the Vnity ; whenas Friends only recorded , That they have no Vnion with him in his so doing , as thou hast cited it , pag. 63. which is only relative to that particular Act ( viz. ) of his refusing to come twice to the Meeting , and not in such general Terms to exclude the Person Out of the Vnity in all respects : Therefore thou appearest fallacious in thy account .

As concerning the Paper of our sence and advice , dated , London , the 27 th of the 3 d Moneth , 1675. ( consisting of divers particular weighty matters ) which thou makest thy principal Instance of our Apostacy and Violence upon our first Principles of Vnion , and about which thou hast so much scofft and derided at us ; I must tell thee that I know not one Person who subscribed tha● Paper , but have cause to stand by it , an● will stand by it , though unjustly and defamingly smote at , derided and contemned by thee . And why didst not publish all our said Paper ? Thou sayst , Thou hast taken enough to shew our Innovations and manifest Apostacies , pag. 50. as if all that Paper were matter of such Proof ; which is a most slanderous Insinuation ; for thou hast not proved one of these Instances of our said Paper either a Violation to our first Principles of Vnion , Antiscriptural , or Inconsistent with the Church-Discipline , Order and Government in the Primitive Times among true Christians , as thou pretendest , nor in the least tending to Apostacy or Antichristianism . Thou hast taken upon thee to stigmatize , brand and defame both our Testimony and the Subscribers , particularly William Penn , thou hast compared and rank't among such Vnchristian Societies , Violators , Innovators , Apostates , Pope's Council , Arbitrary Authority , &c. Thou art very loud in thy Charge , but mute in Proof , and wanting in Argument . And how dost thou herein agree with thy self , where in pag. 133. thou callest William Penn , This Noble Man , and in pag. 135. Dear W. P. and in pag. 144. thou prayst for William Penn in these words , ( viz. ) I pray God keep thee steddy , and with a continual Dependency upon the Divine Revelation , &c. when thou hast represented the same Person W. P. Antichristian , Apostate , Innovator , &c. as if thou shouldst pray thus for him , ( viz. ) Thou Antichristian Apostate , I pray God keep thee steddy . Such Absurdity doth thy Contradiction produce , who thus one while calumniatest and revilest , and another while flatterest and prayest for the same Person ; one while judging and condemning the said Person as Antichristian , Imposer , Innovator , &c. another while counting him Noble Man , A Dear Man , &c. Thou exclaimest against Religious Societies , Excommunicating , Condemning a Person as out of the Vnity , when it was but that They have no Vnity with him in his SO doing , ( i e. in his irregular Proceeding out of Unity and Order with them , in proposing his Intention of Marriage but Once to the Meeting , and that in the Womans absence ) whilst thou thy self art ( like an exalted Diotrephes , yea , like a Pope with thy printed Bull ) Excommunicating , Condemning , Deriding and Contemning the Servants of Christ by Name in Print , as William Penn , George Whitehead , Stephen Crisp , Alex. Parker , Thomas Salthouse , John Burnyeat , &c. for proceeding and giving their Christian Advice , Sence and Judgment , according to their Consciences and inward Perswasions , relating to good Order in the Church of Christ .

Thus inconsistent art thou , conceited proud Scorner and false pretender to Liberty of Conscience , who hast given more black Characters , and made a worse ( to speak ad hominem ) Record even in Print against these and divers other faithful Servants of Christ , than only for a Meeting to Record in Manuscript their having No Vnion with a particular Person in his Irregular Proceeding in this or that particular act ; for thou hast recorded these before mentioned Servants of Christ by name as Antichristian , Imposers , Innovators , &c. and compared them to the Popes Council in Print , and that in thy Book intended for the Magistrates , as by thy Epistle appears , pag. 3. Thus inconsistent and contradictory to thy self art thou in thy pretended Plea for Liberty of Conscience , whilst thou art Defaming , Condemning and Excommunicating many of the Servants of Christ among us , for the exercise and testimony of their tender Consciences in their Christian Advice and Admonition , which is all one as to seek to stop their Mouthes from preaching , exhorting others , &c. And this is not all thy Inconsistency and Confusion , the fruit of thy Malice and Treachery ; but thou hast presented such a one as Henry North , Knight , and the Magistrates with such abominable Lyes and Abuses , as if ( like a malicious Informer and Incendiary ) the Devil and thou designed not only the perpetual Reproach of the People called Quakers , but an Aggravation of their Sufferings and Persecutions ; against whom the chief ground of thy Book also is a gross Slander and great Lye , ( viz. ) That their way of Compelling , and Antichristian way of proceeding to bring to and force an Vniformity , Epis. p. 4. And thus raging against our Friends in these terms , ( viz. ) These Tyrannical Proceedings have been used by our New Spiritual Lords , Epis. p. 6. with much more Infamy , Slander and Scorn cast upon us in thy Book , for which the hand of the Lord will be upon thee : Thy Envy and Wickedness is judged of the Lord ; take heed how thou persistest in it , lest he make thee an Example .

In thy sixth Chapter thou art , according to thy wonted course of Malice and Scorn , inveighing against our Womens Meetings , falsly charging them with usurped Authority , unlimited Power and Rule , placed in their Meetings by G. F. and others ; which is a gross abuse and slander . Also thou art inveighing against presenting Intentions of Marriage before them by both the Persons , p. 118 , 119. And this is not all the Fruit of thy perverse opposition , but in the same Chapter , p. 123. after divers Citations , thou bringest a comparison or instance of eating Flesh or Fish , as being indifferent and free ; and then addest , that These with ALL other outward Works be Things Indifferent , and may be used , and also left . I must tell thee ( Francis ) that this Position makes void all Christian-Discipline , good Order & Church-Government , leaving all loose and uncertain : And we are sure thou hast here asserted corrupt Doctrine , tending to practical Ranterism it self ; for here thou makest no exception ; thy assertion is general , not only of eating of Flesh and Fish , but of ALL other outward works , that they be things Indifferent , that may be used , and also left : See now if this be not sordid Ranterism ; this loose , gain-saying Spirit leads into both , to thy own contradiction , where thou pretendest for Church-Discipline , Order and Government , as in thy Title page thou seemest to grant were in the Primitive times , ( i. e. among the Primitive Christians , as we understand . ) But what Discipline , Order or Government in the Church canst thou Conscientiously plead , and be consistent with thy Position ( viz. ) That all outward Works be things Indifferent , & c ? How contrary to the Apostles Doctrine also is this ? for all good Works , which God hath ordained we should walk in ; these are not indifferent to be used , and also left ; outward works of Righteousness , Justice , Goodness , Charity , &c. commanded of God , are not Indifferent to be used and also left : Solemn contracts and engagements in Marriage are not Indifferent : Persons may not break solemn Contracts , due and orderly Proceedings : Men may not leave their Wives when they please , as an indifferent thing . But this Libertine Spirit that gave out and printed the said Ranters assertion , in placing such Indifferency upon ALL outward works or things , as that they may be used , and also left , hath thereby cast off all Bonds , Limitations , outward Discipline , Order and Government of Truth , relating to Conversation .

We have much more in reserve against thy Book , which at present I do forbear adding for brevity's sake , and refer the Reader to R. Sandiland's single Answer , Entituled , Righteous Judgment placed upon the Heads of malicious Opposers and persecuting Apostates , against thy malicious Book ; and also to Tho. Elwood's Antidote against the Infection of William Rogers 's Book , miscalled , The Christian-Quaker , &c. Your Envy , Confusions , perverse in-and-out ways and hard Speeches are judged by the Lord , and his Hand is against you therein ; and I question not but God will more signally determine the Controversie against that proud contentious Spirit of Envy , Scorn , and false Jealousie : And Truth lives , and shall live and reign over it all .

CHAP. VIII .

§ . 1. Thomas Crisp being joyned with William Rogers as a busie Agent in Division , as also his abuse of George Whitehead , by part of an old Letter from B. F. The reason of their being linked together in this Treatise . B. F. his late Testimony on G. W.'s behalf against T. C. § . 2. Notice taken of a few Passages in Thomas Crisp's Pamphlets : The reason thereof particularly about Tythes : His unsound Proposition : His Injustice unto and abuse of John Crook in impertinently quoting his Authority in the case , contrary to John's Principle and Testimony § . 3. How dis-ingenious Tho. Crisp is in his Authorities and Citatio●s about Tythes ; And how like his Brother John Pennyman , against our plain Language . Of J. Pennyman's furious roaring Letter against G. F. &c. containing the like unjust Reflections with W. R. T. C. &c. about Impositions , Prescriptions , &c. The Spiritual Christian , who hath the Power and Form of Godliness , distinguished and vindicated , both from the Formal Christian and Loose Apostate , who deny both Power and Form . § . 4. The unsound Doctrine of Robert Rich espoused by T. C. tending to Ranterism . About Forms , Prescriptions , Impositions , &c. R. R. a false Accuser like the rest of these Apostates : His Authority made use of by T. C. and F. Bugg , invalid . J. Perrot's Spirit and Language appearing in these present Opposers . § . 5. About T. C's Marrying by a Priest , and his Wife 's condemning it : His rendring the holy Spirit contradictory to it self in the matter of Tythes : His Answer to John Field , dirty , scurrilous , and impertinent : His abuse of his Wife and Friends in the case , misrepresenting them in his Prejudice and Vncharitableness ; judging and defaming others , contrary to his own warning . He himself reprehended and warned . § . 6. His endeavouring to extenuate his Offence about Marrying by a Priest , & paying Tythes . His Instance and Allegation in the case , but slight covers . And he proved Irreligious and Fallacious in his preceeding and arguing contrary to the Profession and Testimony of a real Christian-Quaker . § . 7. His Judgment about Tythes , as it accords with W. R's , still unsound & loose , & they not excusable in the Declension and Apostacy . § . 8. His Reply to Stephen Crisp , disingenious and fallacious . A Catalogue of some of the notorious Falshoods and Slanders therein . His Reviling and foul Detractions against Stephen Crisp. § . 9. Concerning the Paper which W. R. and T. C. have published and printed in Edward Burroughs's Name , To the scattered of Israel , &c. Their implicit Credulity and Confidence therein , and abuse of Edward Burroughs , with Reasons given by a Certificate and Testimony , to shew it in most probability to be John Perrot's , and not E. Burroughs's Paper : All which is recommended to Serious Consideration .

§ . 1. WHereas Thomas Crisp hath of late time struck in with William Rogers and his party , as a busie Agent in Division , and as hot and violent in his abusive Language and Reflection , as the most of them , for want of better Argument and Reason , he is also gotten into the same kind of stile and strain with W. R. and F. B. against promoting Government , Orders , Customs , Forms , Prescriptions , &c. as in several of his late Pamphlets , called Testimonies . I find also that these Opposers have recourse to one anothers Writings , and quote each other , and thereby show their own Authorities for themselves in the Controversie , for want of better Proof , as W. R. cites F. B. in his seventh Part , from page 64 , to page 75. and F. B. quotes W. R. and Tho. Crisp's Babels Builders , in his 112 page of his said Book , De Christ . Lib. and Thomas Crisp in his fifth part Babels Builders , quotes something he calls Q. Vn. M. which I understand to be a pernicious Pamphlet of John Pennyman's , which F. Bugg has threatned us with in several Papers * * And whereunto we have a full Answer in being , in Manuscript , reserved ( about five Years ) in order to pursue and detect that of J. P.'s , if divulged abroad in Print . so that these Opposers seem to be joyned together in one and the same Spirit of Division , Opposition and Separation , and therefore may well be linked together as Persons concerned in one and the same Interest ; and not only so , but I find a Paper in T. Crisp's third Edition , which he calls George Bishop's Testimony , against a Paper of Orders , which is the very same Paper that Jeffery Bullock ( some Years ago , cited against us , in his Pamphlet , stiled , Antichrist's Transformations , and which the said Jeffery Bullock did so publish in Print against G. Whitehead , J. Whitehead , T. Green , T. Briggs , A. Parker , J. Coule , R. Farnsworth , T. Loe , S. Crisp , J. Moon , J. Parkes , by Name , who are struck at for no other cause , but a Paper , wherein we gave our Christian sense and seasonable advice , which we see no cause to Repent of ; and therefore G. B's Paper cited by the said Jeffery Bullock and Thomas Crisp , in opposition to that of ours , proceeded from a mistaken Judgment and is , Uncharitable against us , as well as Erronious in divers parts of it † † As in his opposing Pastors , Teachers , Elders , &c. in our day , and the Spirit to them , and rendring us at inforceing Orders , and setting our selves in the place of the HEIR , &c. And he was Answer'd in his Life time by several of the Servants of Christ w●● withstood his opposition in this matter . But the Author is gone , I shall say the less , and charitably believe God took him away in Mercy , and that if he had remained to this day , he would not have stood by these Gain-sayers , in the evil use they make of his Paper in Print against so many of the Servants of Christ . But I have not done with T. Crisp for his so often printing part of a Letter from B. F. to me , when he was under a Cloud and mistake in the Controversie and Division occasioned by J. Perrot , &c. against Friends for putting off their Hats in Prayer ; in which Letter I and some others are reflected upon , and charged , That if ever any separation be , it will be through mine , and some lording , rigid , driving Spirits , against which I have in humility appealed to the Lord , to plead my Innocency in the Consciences of all concerned , my labour having been and still is , for Love and Unity among God's People ; and I take it not only unkindly from T. C. but as his Injustice and an Abuse so often to bring forth that piece of a Letter in Print against me , which was before published and printed more fully by some malicious Adversaries , in their Pamphlet , stiled , Tyranny and Hypocrisie , printed in the year 1673. In answer to which , I desire T. C. and the rest of the party concerned would now accept and consider B. F's own late Testimony , seeing the Lord in mercy has reduced him to a better understanding and judgment , than he was in when he writ the said Letter .

Benj. Furly's Testimony follows .

WHereas I understand that sundry persons , to me unknown , have divers times formerly , and now again lately published in Print certain extracts of a Letter written by me , as I take it about sixteen years ago to G. W. keeping up and feeding thereby a Spirit of Contention and Strife . This is in brief to signifie , That what has hitherto been done of this nature , has been altogether without my order , consent or privity ; for my soul hates that Spirit of Prejudice , Enmity and Contention , by which some men ( though perhaps , poor men ! not knowing by what spirit influenc'd , what spirit they gratifie , and what spirit they grieve and wound in this their work ) so acted , led and driven . As for so many of them that are meerly under a mistake , I do from my heart pity them , and am touched with the sence of their Condition , as having laboured under the same snares . Wherefore my earnest desire for them is , That they may be made sensible of that which they seem so earnestly to contend for ; yea , even for them that are so tinctur'd and leaven'd with Prejudice , that they do wittingly and with some degree of Malice , foment Contention . I cannot but desire , if it be the will of God , that they may through Judgment come to know Repentance , and through Repentance receive Mercy and Remission in and by the Blood of Jesus Christ , to whom all such do doe despight .

And as for those Papers so long since given forth by me , not discerning what spirit did then influence me ( for so it is , that the actions of men are many times influenced both by good and evil Spirits , though they perceive it not , how much soever the Notion of Spirits , ridiculed by the Atheistick Philosophasters and wild Wits of this age ) I did many years since recall them , and make it my request , that any that had them in their custody might make no further ill use of them ; and to have found the contrary since , has been no small grief to me , especially to see so often repeated these personal Reflections by me used against G.F. and G.W. whom I truly honour in the Lord for their works and labours of Love .

However , I would not have any malicious Persons from hence take occasion to think , much less to say or represent , that I have hereby revoked , or do in the least intend to inervate any of the words in that or any other Paper , so far as they are assertive of a just and equal Liberty of Conscience .

For I do firmly believe , That there is no Principle maintained amongst Mankind that stands upon f●●●er Foundations , that is more becoming the Rulers of this World in their respective Dominions , nor more agreeable to the Life and Spirit of Christianity , than is that of Liberty of Conscience . Neither let any man on the other hand think or say , That I do hereby in the least hinder the Church of Christ from judging , condemning and testifying against things and Persons by the Spirit of Christ , for preaching things which those persons erring from the spirit of Christ , may judge not only to be allowable as their Christian Liberty , but even look upon to be their very duty .

For as the Principle of Liberty of Conscience is in it self most reasonable and christian , so is this latter of denying All Iudging upon any account most unreasonable , blind and foolish .

And they that cannot see , that these two Principles of Liberty and Judgment , are not only consistent , but very harmonious with each other , are to be pitied for their weakness and half-sightedness ; of which perhaps , God giving life and ability , I may at another time say more — In the mean while I wish heartily , that all that profess and name the Name of Jesus , the Prince of Peace , would seek peace and ensue it .

Benjamin Furly .

Now Tho. Crisp and the rest concerned , see by these Lines how far B. F. hath distinguished the point in Controversie , and cleared himself upon a better understanding concerning the said Letter , and against the perverse use thou hast made of it in Print to reproach me withal .

§ . 2. And since thou hast causlesly aspersed me with it , and so far censoriously exposed me in Print , as thou hast done , when I sought no occasion against thee , nor designed Controversie with thee ; and seeing thou art grown so hardy and confident as to make thy self such a publick Agent and Advocate for W. R. and his Party in the Controversie , I have not yet done with thee , but am concerned further to take notice of a few Passages in thy Pamphlets , which I look upon as very corrupt and perverse , and contrary to our antient and constant Testimony , born among us on behalf of Christ .

The first is in thy Pamphlet , stil'd , Several Testimonies , 3 d Edition , which is also printed in others of thy Pamphlets , in these words , viz. pag. 26.

I fear you take more care for the strict Observation of your own Orders and Traditions than the Truth in the Heart ; for if any use not your Language , or observe not to do just as others , in Tythes or other CIVIL RIGHTS , which the Laws of our Land require , and ought to be observed , ( unless God by his Spirit in the Heart doth forbid , or any do really for Conscience sake refuse ) But if one cannot do so , must he therefore judge his Brother ? That may be required of one that may not be required of another ; for Growth or Measure may differ , Rom. 14.

AND J. Crook saith , We read of — Cain and Abel , two men performing the same Action , attended with the same Formalities , &c. and yet the one accepted , and the other rejected . In like manner may two Persons be found in contrary Actions , Postures , Gestures , and yet both accepted of God ; for if I should lay a Bond upon my self therein , I transgress the liberty of the spirit , either as to time , constancy or place ; or if another should lay a Bond upon me , or put a Yoke about the Neck of the Disciples , this is no more justifiable than the former .

To the first part , being thy words , I must tell thee , thy Proposition is unsound and inconsistent with our antient Testimony , as well as Contradictory in its self : Vnsound in that it bespeaks thou art not principl'd against the Payment of Tythes in this Gospel day , and hast not retain'd a true or certain Judgment against them in thy esteeming and accounting of them amongst Civil Right , but Rites in thy other Pamphlet , which ought to be observed ; and implying , that a Brother is not to be judg'd for observing ( or paying ) them . I am sure this is contrary to the Testimony born and received among us from the beginning . And to thy granting , that God by his Spirit in the Heart may forbid them , or that for Conscience sake some refuse them ; as if the Spirit of the Lord did allow one Brother to pay Tythes as a civil Right , and forbid another ; or that from a different Growth or Measure of Grace , one Brother may be required to refuse the Payment of Tythes , and another Brother not so required , and therefore not to be judged for the Payment of them , being both under the same Profession and Dispensation : Is not this Inconsistent & Babylonish , yea , and tending to apparent Ranterism , to render the Spirit and different Measures thereof so contrary and opposite in its requirings , in a matter so eminent & weighty as that of Tythes ? wherein our manifest Testimony hath been so positive , and the Sufferings of many so deep and heavy for not paying Tythes , and whereof the very first breaking forth of the Light and dawning of the Gospel Day did convince many Thousands , when their Eyes were first opened to see the Corruption of that Ministry which is upheld by Tythes and forced Maintenance ; therefore T. C. thou art gone from the Light that first convinced thee , in thus confusedly arguing for Tythes ; and thy Proposition is loose and fallacious , and there 's no such contradiction in the different Measures of Grace and Spirit received from God , as thou absurdly implyest . If ever thou knew'st or wast sensible either that Tythes were ended by Christ , or that the Ministry upheld by them is none of Christ's Ministry , thou couldst never suppose that any measure or degree of his Grace or Spirit would allow or lead any ( who have been really convinced of the Evil thereof ) in the payment of them , if thou wert not gone from the true sence and measure thereof in thy self ; for the different measures or degrees of Grace do not alter the Property of it ; and whatever it once manifests to be sin , and forbids as such , it always forbids , and allows none in the practice thereof ; and whoever are truly convinced by the Grace of God , and have their Minds turned to it , if they keep in it , and walk in its way and teaching , they are principled by it , and are a Law to themselves therein , against those things , ways and works which are corrupt or sinful , and cannot place a slight Indifferency where the Truth hath made a real Difference ; for what communion hath Light with Darkness , or Christ with Belial , or Truth with Error , or Sincerity with Hypocrisie , or Sobriety and Watchfulness with Ranterism and Looseness ? — Consider how and from whence thou art fallen , and Repent .

To thy subsequent Allegation of John Crook's saying , I must tell thee , that I look upon thee to have dealt unjustly , disingeniously and injuriously by him , and very impertinently alledged his words in this case , for thy unwarrantable , confused & loose Proposition for the Observation of Tythes , as a civil Right or Rite . I doubt not but he is better principled , even from the time of his first receiving the Truth , than to grant or allow any such liberty to any Christian Brother for the observation ( or payment ) of Tythes , as thy words import ; and that thy Allegation of his words in this case , is contrary to his very Intention . I dare presume and appeal to his Conscience to give Judgment against thee in this case , whether the different or contrary actions , postures or gestures , relating to time , constancy or place , &c. mentioned by him , were intended with respect to Tythes , * * For J. Crook hath given publick Testimony against the Payment of Tythes in this Gospel day , witness his Treatise , i. e. Tythes no Property , &c. the Payment or Non-payment of them . I dare say thou hast foully perverted his words and intention in this case ; for the different actions , postures and gestures , relating either to time or place , may relate to divers things only circumstantial and indifferent , as to God , and not to things substantial , wherein Truth 's Testimony has made a real Difference ; As I , or any other in Truth , may be in different postures and places praying to God or waiting upon him , in Closet , on our Beds , in Field , High-way , either kneeling , standing , sitting or walking , and yet truly led , moved and exercised by the holy Spirit , and accepted of God , † † But I must confess that in our publick Assemblies for divine Worship , such postures as bespeak the most Reverence to God and Union among our selves , are most commendable , edifying and exemplary , &c. which I cannot say in relation to the Payment of Tythes in this Gospel day , no more than in Sacrifice and burnt Offerings , since Christ hath put an end thereto . Those things offered by Cain and Abel as the fruit of the Ground and firstlings of the Flock , were things in themselves lawful , and allowed in their day and time , and were also according to the Law of Moses , being Types under the old covenant . But this can be no pertinent Instance , as alledged by thee ( Thomas ) in the case of Tythes , to observe ( or pay ) them in this Gospel day , and as now in Controversie ; since both Tythes and Offerings were ended by Christ in his Death ; nor is there any parrallel in the case , unless thou couldst prove that the Spirit of Christ doth move Believers in this Gospel day , both to the Payment of Tythes and the Non-payment ( or refusal ) of them , which I dare say , thou canst not prove . 'T is not to be supposed that what Christ has abolish'd in the old Covenant he will enjoyn or command in the new ; the Spirit of Christ is not contradictory to it self , nor are Gods substantial Commands contrary one to another , especially under one and the same dispensation and state .

§ . 3. Besides thy abuse and injury against John Crook , and Impertinency in this case , I cannot but take notice how dis●ingenuous , cover'd and fallacious thou art , in the management of thy loose design , in reference to the Personal Authorities thou bringest , particularly in thy citing part of John Wilkinson and John Story 's Paper concerning Womens Meetings , &c. in two of thy Pamphlets ( viz. ) thy second and third Edition ; in the 24th pag. of the last thou sayst , These foregoing Testimonies are not transcribed at large , but abridged for brevities sake , but the SENSE AND SVBSTANCE OF THE WHOLE included . But Thomas , I must tell thee , this is a down-right Untruth ; the Sense and Substance of the Whole of that very Paper of J. W. and J. S. is not included in thy citation , although thou hast confessed their Testimony to be weighty Truths , and hast cited more passages than that concerning Womens Meetings ; for thou hast left out these Words of their Testimony , ( viz. ) As to Tythes , we can in truth say , 't was never so much as in our Hearts to strengthen any in the Payment thereof , nor yet to weaken the Faith of any , having a Testimony in our Hearts that Tythes , as at this day paid , are ANTICHRISTIAN . ( Thus far they . )

How now Thomas ? Why didst thou leave these Words out of thy Citation ? Was here nothing of the sense nor substance of their Testimony ? or wast thou not conscious to thy self , that their Position here against the payment of Tythes , and thy Proposition aforesaid for the observation of Tythes , as a civil Right or Rite , &c. were inconsistent and contradictory ? their words are positive against them , as Antichristian , but thine are partly for them , and but doubtfully against them , that is [ If the Spirit of the Lord in the Heart forbid the payment of them ] or if the different measure of Grace require one Brother not to pay them , and allow ( or be silent at ) another Brother's paying them . Thus Thomas thou appearest in Confusion a BABEL-BUILDER .

And what is our Language thou reflects upon ? Is it the plain Language of Thee and Thou to a single Person ? And what are those Orders thou complainest of , and those Customs , Forms and Prescriptions ? Hast not thou appeared like thy Brother John Pennyman , in thy empty and fruitless opposition ? only he is a little more plain in his furious Roaring Letter to G. F. dated the 27th of the 3d Moneth , called May , 1680. printed among his other Letters to divers Friends , he furiously exclaims and roars out against us in these Expressions ( viz. ) Away with your long Prayers , and long Preachings , for they are an abomination ; away with your Pride and Arrogance , sitting as Judges and Lords over your Brethrens Consciences — Away with your set Form of Words of THEE and THOV , calling it the pure Language — O ye Blind and Ignorant ! how can you escape the Condemnation of the Just and Righteous One ; who have set up Shadows instead of Substance , and Form instead of Power ? — Builders of Babel , or Babylonish Builders — All your Buildings , your Inventions , Imaginations and Conceivings about your Forms , your proud self-conceited Modes , your Impositions , your Prescriptions , Laws and comely Orders ( as you in your fallen Wisdom call them ) must all be thrown down , laid waste , and become a By-word or Proverb of Reproach * * N. C 's Epistle . to the very Heathen , &c. ( Thus far John Pennyman . )

These Words are cited to show how far you Backsliders and Opposers resemble one another in Stile and Language against us , crying out against Impositions , Forms , Prescriptions , Laws , &c. but show no Unjust nor Unrighteous Law , Form , Order or Prescription practised among us ; and therefore in your Madness and Fury are but beating the Air , and unjustly and falsly accusing us with Impositions , lording over our Brethrens Consciences : And John Pennyman he is for crying out , Away with your set form of Words of THEE and THOV ; he is offended at the Form of sound Words ; his Backsliding , Apostacy and vain Imaginations have been these many Years openly manifest , and time will further discover him to be a false Prophet against us : The Lord has brought us into that Form and Order , which neither Apostates , fallen Spirits , nor the Father of Lyes shall ever be able to throw down or lay waste . We direct People to the Light and Power of Christ within , to guide them both in the Life and Form of Godliness , Form of sound Words , and to obey from the Heart the Form of Doctrine received from Christ , and therefore we impose no blind Obedience , nor dark Formality upon any , but desire that all may come to be living Christians in Spirit , Life , Power and Holiness of Conversation , that their Conversations may be as becometh the Gospel of Christ ; but you Backsliders are of disobedient and loose Spirits , else you would not rage , roar and foam out your own Shame as you do against the Servants of Christ , or that Form and Order which we are sure he has brought us into , and wherein we are Conscientiously concerned to follow our Lord Jesus Christ in Humility ; and herein we can distinguish between formal Christians and living Christians , and would have none to enter into either extream of Formality without Life and Power , or under pretence of Life and Power to deny or oppose all Form and Order ; for there may be a formal pretended Christian without Life and Power , but no real living Christian in Power without true Form ; And this distinction we had from the beginning , and therefore alwayes believed that the true Power would not lead into any false or wrong Form , nor into any Disorder or Confusion , knowing that our God is the God of Order , and not of Confusion ; he is the God of Love , Peace and Union , and not of discord or strife .

§ . 4. And Thomas Crisp hadst thou kept to that which first Convinced thee , and raised up a love in thee to Truth , and the People of God called Quakers , thou wouldst not have espoused such unsound Doctrine as this of R. R. printed and published in thy Pamphlets among thy pretended weighty Truths , nor reckoned it among sound Doctrines , as thou hast done even in thy third Edition , p. 22. where after he hath confessed in these words ( viz. ) I know that the Lord hath his People amongst them ( meaning those called Quakers ) as in All Forms , and such as love and fear the Lord , doing the thing which is just and right . [ The words which I chiefly take notice of , are these of his which follow , viz. ] And such are accepted with me as bone of my bone , and as my Brother Benjamin that came of the free-woman , and are in that freedom fitted to act in ALL FORMS , † † So the Work of Backsliders and Apostates tends to fit them to hear and sit under the Parish Priests , contrary to the real Christian Quaker ; Witness F. Bugg's Proposition , espoused by him as his own judgment , viz. Things Moral , under the Gospel men may be commanded by the Magistrate , as HEARING is an act purely Moral . A man may be commanded to hear the Gospel preacht , without being forced to give his assent to it . The Light of Nature guides the Magistrate to instruct his Subjects in whatsoever he thinks for their eternal Good . And the Light of Nature obligeth every man to hearken , &c ▪ A man that is only commanded to hear and receive Instruction , is dealt with as a rational Creature , and forced to nothing . The Judgment is still left in himself . [ Thus F. Bugg's De Christiana Libertate , or Liberty of Conscience , pag 91 , 92. ] Whereby he has plainly given away and betray'd the cause of all conscientious Dissenters . For what place is left for Liberty of Conscience to dissent , if the Magistrate may thus enjoyn the Subjects to hear what he thinks is for their eternal Good , and they be thus obliged to hear , when he thinks 't is for their good to hear the Parish Priests ? By this Proposition , when the Magistrate commands Fr. Bugg to his Parish Church and hear the Priest , he is oblig'd so to do by his own Proposition , and reserve his judgment in himself , whether to accept or reject what he hears . Thus he may be in a freedom fitted to act in ALL FORMS . But then let him not esteem himself a Christian Quaker , but another sort of a ( Latitude ) Christian , whose Religion and Principle , before cited , will not oblige him to suffer any more as a Quaker . as the Lord their Light shall lead them , that they may replenish the Earth .

This Doctrine or Proposition I look upon to be very unsound , and tending to plain Ranterism , making no distinction in Forms , but including ALL FORMS , without Distinction , under the leading of the Light of the Lord : Which also is an absurd begging of the Question ; for his Light doth neither lead nor fit the Children of the free-woman to act in All Forms † † So the Work of Backsliders and Apostates tends to fit them to hear and sit under the Parish Priests , contrary to the real Christian Quaker ; Witness F. Bugg's Proposition , espoused by him as his own judgment , viz. Things Moral , under the Gospel men may be commanded by the Magistrate , as HEARING is an act purely Moral . A man may be commanded to hear the Gospel preacht , without being forced to give his assent to it . The Light of Nature guides the Magistrate to instruct his Subjects in whatsoever he thinks for their eternal Good . And the Light of Nature obligeth every man to hearken , &c ▪ A man that is only commanded to hear and receive Instruction , is dealt with as a rational Creature , and forced to nothing . The Judgment is still left in himself . [ Thus F. Bugg's De Christiana Libertate , or Liberty of Conscience , pag 91 , 92. ] Whereby he has plainly given away and betray'd the cause of all conscientious Dissenters . For what place is left for Liberty of Conscience to dissent , if the Magistrate may thus enjoyn the Subjects to hear what he thinks is for their eternal Good , and they be thus obliged to hear , when he thinks 't is for their good to hear the Parish Priests ? By this Proposition , when the Magistrate commands Fr. Bugg to his Parish Church and hear the Priest , he is oblig'd so to do by his own Proposition , and reserve his judgment in himself , whether to accept or reject what he hears . Thus he may be in a freedom fitted to act in ALL FORMS . But then let him not esteem himself a Christian Quaker , but another sort of a ( Latitude ) Christian , whose Religion and Principle , before cited , will not oblige him to suffer any more as a Quaker . of Professions , but in its own form or way most proper and peculiar to it self , as the Form of Godliness is to the Power of God and Godliness , for granting the Lord may have a People that mean well under other Forms , as he has other Sheep that are not of this Fold : Howbeit , many that mean well are clouded and mistaken , under wrong Forms , empty Shews , Ceremonies and Circumstances , only of mens inventions and imposing , which the Light of the Lord guides them not into , being but humane Traditions and Impositions of men , neither proper nor suitable to divine Worship , or to a true spiritual Christian state ; and therefore it is not the freedom of the Children of the Free-Woman to act in ALL or any such Forms , nor will the Light of the Lord lead them therein ; nor may R. R's words be applied to the Children of New Jerusalem , who under the dispensation and order of the new Covenant , nor are they properly applicable to them , where he saith , Why may not God enjoyn that as an Ordinance to day , and give his Power to it also , which to Morrow he will lay aside as useless , and by his withdrawing his Power from it , leave it no better than an Idol ? as in pag. 19 , 20. of thy 3d Edition . This cannot be truly said of the Ordinances of the new Covenant , which are not to be compared to the Shadows under the old ; and therefore these his Expressions , as applied to this Dispensation which we are under ( which is that of the Gospel and new Covenant ) do tend to lead into Uncertainty , Instability , Looseness and Ranterism . Good Works are ordained of God , the practice of pure Religion he enjoyns us to walk it ▪ and he will not forsake the Children of the Free-Woman , who therein serve him in his free Spirit .

This R. R. whose pretended Testimony thou hast espoused , his exclaiming , accusing and smiting unjustly , also like the rest of you about Imposing upon Brethrens Consciences , Prescriptions , Impositions , and falsly accusing Friends with the Spirit of Dominion and Rule over the Conscience : Telling of the Yoke of your Prescriptions , your carnal and literal Impositions : G. F 's comely Order ; G. F. and his Tribe of Proselites ; creating a Dominion over your Brethren , and the movings of God in them , and claiming a power to judge of all Differences , prescribing Rules and Orders , &c. falsly comparing Friends with the Pope himself , and accusing them with swelling Soveraignity over the Minds and Consciences of men , heavily imposing upon others in such Circumstances and Indifferences wherein the Kingdom of God doth not consist , &c.

With many more Falshoods and unjust Reflections , and Abuses , * * The substance whereof is answered fully before to W. R. without innumerating or giving particular Instances of those Impositions , Rules & Orders complained of , only bids us witness the Hat ; which I take to be because we could not own J. Perrot and his party in their keeping on their Hats in publick Prayer : R. Rich being one of his Party , a Disciple and Agent in his Cause , confounded in his Judgment with a Spirit ( and Notions ) of Ranterism , though sometimes he confessed to the Power of God among Friends , but too lofty in his Spirit ; he now seems to be adopted by you in his opposition ( in this his Paper which thou hast printed for a weighty and sound Testimony , I mean , Robert Rich's , whom I take to be thy Author ) Why didst not set his Name , but R. R ? which may stand for another Name , as Richard Richardson ; but we are sure he is better principled than to write such Airy , Loose , Ranting stuff . One reason that makes me take it to be R. Rich's Paper that thou hast espoused , 't is so much in his floating , reflecting , accusing , lavish and conceited Stile ; and also that thy Brother Francis Bugg makes use of his Authority in his Book De Christ . Lib. p. 170. in these words ( viz. ) I begin to see the truth of Robert Rich 's words in a Letter from Barbadoes , to his Friends , Abstracts , &c. pag. 20. viz. I can assure you , that who meddle with the Quakers , had need to be fenced within and without with the whole Armour of God , Truth and love to Righteousness , David 's Sling and Stone , &c.

These Passages are mentioned that it may the more obviously appear how plainly you resemble one another , and tread the same Track , in the Stile and Terms of your Opposition , and that 't is no new Controversie in the Substance ; 't is but only John Perrot's Spirit of Division risen with some other Circumstances and Pretences , in a more Rough , Lofty , Contemning , Hectoring and Huffing Party , daring and scornful , who have not that seeming show of Humility , Lamb-likeness and Outside Demureness , that John Perrot had , * * For tho John Perrot placed his opposition to the Putting off the Hat in Prayer very high , as on express Commandment from the Lord God of Heaven , as against a Custom , Romish Tradition , and Triffle in the Apostacy , as in his Paper which Richard Hubberthorn answer'd . Yet he had more smooth and taking Expressions to temper and gloss his matters withal ▪ as , The Spirit of the Lamb is Poor , Low , Humble , Patient , Content , Temperate , Chaste , willing to Suffer , full of Thanks-giving in all things , and of Pity , Mercy , Forgiveness , Love unto all , not holding Prejudice against any — and ready to lay down Life for all . — Now all that will follow the Lamb wheresoever he goeth , must be of this Mind , &c. as in a Paper of John Perrot's . Now here was a more likely shew and resemblance and pretence of Christianity , than these Lofty Scorners do appear in , though he profest greater things than he possest ; his Spirit was not in that Lowliness , nor was he constant with God . His fall should be a warning to many . the tendency and end of whose work , time will manifest more directly to center in RANTERISM , as it now tends to FLESHLY LIBERTY , casting off the Yoke of Christ , and causing the offence of his Cross to cease .

§ . 5. And now Thomas I am not willing at present to spend much farther time with thee , thou having been so much answered by R. Richardson and J. F. only I would show thee a little further , how unfairly and disingenuously thou dealest with John Field in thy 5th part of thy Babels , &c. First , I take notice of the account J. Field gives in the 3d page of his Book , entituled , Thomas Crisp's Envy detected , about thy Doctrine , and then of what thou sayst in relation to the same ; and that which thou scornfully callest J. F's Bull of Excommunication against thee , his account is this , viz.

John Field signifieth , That Friends have " no Vnity with Tho. Crisp nor his Doctrine , which is as followeth ,

The 8th day of the 9th Month , 1681. Thomas Crisp said , That he had lately paid Tythes , and that the Spirit of God did or might allow him to pay Tythes , or Marry by a Priest . And that by the same Spirit of God another might be required not to pay Tythes , or not do the same Things .

This Thomas Crisp spake the day and year abovesaid , and consented to have it writ and printed , and took a copy of the aforesaid words . Witness ,

John Field , jun.

Oh Thomas ! How hast thou lost true tenderness and the sence of Truth ? How art thou backsliden , and gone from that which first convinced thee of the way of the Lord and his holy Truth , which is but one ? And how variable dost thou render his Spirit , and contradictory to it self in these great concerns of Tythes and Marriage ? Is this like the Testimony of the Christian-Quaker , as thou and thy Brother W. R. and his party would be rendred ? Is it not more like exact Ranterism ? Let all tender Hearts and sincere Souls in the Light judge . But what sayest thou to J. F's Question , Why did thy Wife condemn it ? meaning your marrying by a Priest : To this thou most unrighteously and scornfully answerest in these Words , ( viz. )

But may not those that pretend to sell Pardons , and pray Souls out of Purgatory ( your Brethren ) say , that if their Prayers and Pardons be not effectual , why have and do so many give so much Money for them ? If a Woman gives all she hath to have her Husband out of Purgatory , an effectual Proof of the worth of the Pope's Pardon .

Thomas , Thy Answer herein is dirty and scurrilous , & thy comparison with the Pope , and those that falsly pretend to pray Souls out of Purgatory , most unjust and slanderous : Be ashamed of such scribling and abusive dirty Work , and falsly calling such our Brethren : Be ashamed also of thus unnaturally exposing thy own Wife to an unjust censure in this comparison ( viz. ) As to a Woman that gives all she hath to have her Husband out of Purgatory : Oh sordid and bruitish ! As also in thy following Words , and foul Reflection upon thy Wife ( viz. ) It is like SHEE , as too many more have , gave too much credit to what some of G. F's CHEATS said : And she is not the first that hath been deceived by you , and perhaps some among you , that have prated others out of their Money , might prate her , unto the writing and giving you that Paper you pretend to . Thus far thou in the 9th page of thy 5th part of thy Babel .

O Thomas ! be ashamed of thus abusing thy Wife and others , ( our Friends ) with thy Railery in Print , as if she were cheated or deceived into the giving forth the said Paper in judgment against your marrying with the Priest ; I am satisfied thou hast most foully wronged her , as well as abused her Friends herein ; for I am perswaded that the Lord made her sensible you had done amiss in so marrying , that she was convinced in her Conscience of the Evil of it , and of your wrong proceeding therein by the Light of Truth , before she gave out the said Paper ; and that therefore thou hast not only abused and unjustly exposed thy Wife , thy near relation in Print , but also that thou hast abused the Truth , and the real Conviction thereof in her : I dare appeal to the witness of God in her Conscience against thy sordid abuse of her and Friends in this matter . I find thou art a shallow impertinent Scribler and Railer , and uncharitably Censorious and Reviling in much of thy Work ; thou hast an absurd and dirty stile of writing , if it be thy own , however it is patronized by thee . Remember from whence thou art fallen , and Repent of thy hard Speeches , Prejudice and Uncharitableness against Gods People , his Heritage . Thou hast abused the Servants of Christ , have a care thy dayes be not shortned in Darkness and Sorrow . I am sorry for thee . Thou canst advise and instruct others to Love and Gentleness , and pretendest to shew the necessity of bearing with , and not judging one another about such things , wherein they differ in Opinion or Practice in some things , viz. outward and circumstantial matters of Religion ; for that thou sayest , We may belong to one Shepherd , although not all in one Fold ; and confessest , That Love is part of the Seal in the Forehead of the Lamb's followers ; and so also Hatred , Strife , &c. the mark of the Beast , as in thy Introduction to thy third Edition : As also page 13. thou givest Friends this warning , To forbear judging any man any more , upon any pretence whatsoever , as in the Paper thou hast cited , and falsly callest E. B's Vision . Yet contrariwise thou art severely judging and contemning us on some Pretence ; thou appearest in Hatred and Strife in the most of thy controvertial Pamphlets . May we belong to one Shepherd , although not all in the Fold as yet ? Why then art thou and W. R. and F. Bugg , and John Pennyman , so severe in Judging , Censuring , Reviling and Reproaching many among us , whom we know to be the Servants of Christ ? And thou telling of G. F's Cheats , rendring thy Wife as one cheated and deceived by our Friends : Oh sordid and base Confusion , and Babylonish stuff ! Seriously recollect thy self , and give over thy false and fruitless Attempts , Impertinencies , and confused Scribling ; for the Day is dawned and broken forth , that has made a discovery of the miserable Apostacy and Darkness , which you contentious & quarrelsom Opposers are fallen into . Oh! come down , come down , and seek Repentance , and be humbled under the mighty Hand of God : May the Lord in Mercy give thee an Heart thereto , my Soul charitably wisheth it for thee , &c.

§ . 6. In thy Fourth Part , page 19. thou art endeavouring to extenuate the offence on thy part on thy Principle , that one may marry by the Priest , and pay Tythes , and yet be a Christian ; Thou shouldst have added , [ One of the darker sort of Christians . ] But to excuse the matter on thy part , Thy Wife was not then one called a Quaker , * * But it seems T.C. was one then so called ; and if she was instrumental to induce him to Marry by a Priest , contrary to his Perswasion or Profession , she had also cause to Repent it , and may yet see more cause to Rue it , because of his Apostacy . And thou couldst not satisfie her , so that thou CONDESCENDED to take thy Wife in the presence of a Priest , and acquainted him , that thou didst it not on any account of Religion , but to answer the LAW ; and sayest , who ( i. e. the Priest ) very Christian-like condescended to thee , so as not to say or do , or require thee to do or say any thing thou shouldst be dissatisfied with , &c. And you did before him declare you took each other , &c. nor was there half the Ceremony or Formality that is now practised according to G. F 's Form , &c. Oh Thomas ! These slight Covers , and Linsey-Woolsey Garments will not hide thy Disobedience , nor excuse thee from acting contrary to thy Conviction and Conscience . It appears thou wast marryed by a Priest [ but to mince it , 't was in the presence of a Priest ] though not in all Formalities ; and this was thy CONDESCENTION : Was it so ? Then thou wast come to a higher sight and state than to be marryed by a Priest . May it not be said further , how could it be consistent with thy Principle and Profession as a real Christian-Quaker or Conscientious Dissenter , to be so Marryed ? Mince it as much as thou canst , 't will not hold together . But thou didst it not on any account of Religion , &c. No! how couldst thou exclude that weighty concern of Marriage out of Religion ? How Irreligious wast thou then in it ? Is there not as much need to keep unspotted of the Word in the great concern of Marriage , as in any other concern in this Life ? How couldst thou then lay Religion aside in this weighty concern ? Is it not manifest Ranterism for a person to make so slight of Religion , as at his will and pleasure to lay it aside , and that under pretence of condescending in matters of greatest Moment here wherein all truly enlightned and clear sighted Christians have most need to be Religiously exemplary , and faithful in their Testimony , according to their Consciences ?

But to thy Question ; May not one Marry by the Priest , or pay Tythes , and yet be a Christian ? For thy Principle , That he may , ( in thy 5th part , p. 14. ) thou givest us this Instance , viz. I find George Keith very Christian like say , I do not doubt but the Lord had , and I believe he now hath many that are precious to him , and that belong to the Catholick-Church , even as I believe the Lord hath many such among Episcopalians , Papists , &c. Also , I do acknowledge the Lord hath among the Presbyterians some who belong to the true Church . Surely then ( sayst thou ) these must be Christians , and did and do Marry by or with a Priest , and pay Tythes .

Now ( Thomas ) this Instance , and thy Inference upon it , are the most cunningly alledged of any thing I find in thy writings , and yet they will not do , they will not serve thy turn ; for granting some among all these to whom the Lord hath regard , and who in some sence may belong to his Church , it is with respect to their Sincerity towards God , and their fear of him , Conscientiousness springing from his own Seed in them ; and not with respect to their Formalities , cloud of humane Traditions and Inventions , which thy are led into by their Priests , as Marrying by Priests , paying Tythes , &c. Therefore , however the Lord in Mercy hath a regard to them for the sake of the good in them , yet they are but dim-sighted , and of the darker sort of Christians , who see not beyond those humane Impositions and Traditions , as paying Tythes and Marrying by a Priest , &c. And for thee to excuse thy self therein , who professest a higher state and degree of Illumination ( no doubt ) as no less than that of a Christian-Quaker , thou mightst as well argue , that there are some of the better and more sincere sort of Papists that bow to Images , and use many Superstitions , which their Priests have misled them into , and to whom God shews Mercy in saving their Souls at length ; therefore thou or any Christian-Quaker may bow to Images , observe Popish Ceremonies , &c. Or thus , There are many of the sincerer sort of Episcopal People that have their Children sprinkled by a Priest , and signed with the Sign of the Cross , that hear Common-Prayer , conform , and do all Conscientiously , and are sincere to God in their Way ; so that in Charity we may conclude , that their Souls find Mercy with God at length . And what follows ? Therefore Thomas Crisp as a Christian-Quaker , and all other Conscientious Dissenters , both Anabaptists and others , may carry their Children to be Sprinkled by a Priest , have them signed with the Sign of the Cross , hear Common-Prayer , conform , &c. and yet be good Christians , precious to God , while thus inconsistent with their own Consciences , dissenting Principles and Profession . Thus inconsistently thou mightst as well argue for the Christian-Quakers paying Tythes and Marrying by a Priest , &c. But I must deny the consequence : Thou ( as a Quaker doubtless ) hast known better things , and that as to the knowledge of Truth and degree of divine Illumination . There is no just Comparison between a real Christian Quaker and the best sort of Papists and Episcopalians . Therefore thy pleading in thy 5th part of Babels , p. 19 , 20. for charity and forbearance to be allowed them who think it as much their duty to pay Tythes , as we do think it a sin ( and to those who do Marry by a Priest , and pay Tythes , being of different Perswasion from us . ) Granting such there are , who see no further , and are to be pitied ; 't is no argument for any that are of our contrary Perswasion to take liberty to pay Tythes and Marry by a Priest ; for their sin is greater than the other .

Oh Friend ! thy Disobedience , Declension and Apostacy from those Discoveries the true Light has made , will not be excusable by all thy slight Allegations in the sight of the All-seeing and Heart-searching God .

§ . 7. But — T. C 's Judgment about Tythes accords with what is in the third part of the Christian-Quaker , &c. by W. R. Christianly and largely treated on ( quoth he ) in his fourth part , p. 19. And what is W. R 's Judgment or Doctrine in that case ? Is it not for freely paying Tythes to the National Ministry , i. e. not as by Constraint ; yea , if any Person will freely of himself give a tenth part of his Estate or Encrease thereof to ANY VSE WHATSOEVER , having no regard to any humane Institution , or claim by any pretended divine Law , &c. as his words are , 7th part , p. 52. Compare his Objection and Answer in that case , in his 2d part , Christian-Quaker , p. 43. and the Apology he makes for it in his 7th part , p. 52 , 53. together with our fore-going Replyes , then it will appear how loose and apostatized thy Judgment is from the ancient Principle and Christian Testimony of the truly Christian-Quakers , whose Principle never allowed paying Tythes freely , ( or otherwise ) to the National Ministry , or to any use whatsoever . Therefore how little excusable is your Declension , Apostacy , and loose Doctrine in that case , who have seen and known better things from a farther degree of Illumination , than either the best sort of Papists or Episcopalians have as yet received ? Wherefore you , in sinning against Knowledge , are more condemnable in those things , than they in their Ignorance , blind Zeal , or Dim-sightedness . So that 't is high time for thee to bethink thy self better , and Repent .

§ . 8. I could say much to thy Reply thou hast given to Stephen Crisp , in thy Babels , 4th part , to evince how disingenuous , fallacious and abusive it is ; but I find little necessity upon me therein , considering what little weight it is of , and how that Stephen Crisp , the Person immediately concerned , did not look upon himself so deeply concerned , as to think it worth the while to spend much time about , or take much notice of : Only I must tell thee , thou hast abused both him , and those of us who gave our Testimony , and plainly showed our dislike against the Paper and Subscription from Barbadoes , which was not * * First ONLY a dislike of the Wording it , ( as thou falsly sayest ) but of both matter and subscription : And therefore thy saying , * * First There is no denial or disowning the Principle of giving up all ( i. e. Spiritual and Temporal ) to G. F 's Mens and Womens Meetings ( as thou scornfully accusest us , p. 2 , 3. ) This is a gross Untruth and foul Perversion , and our Consciences bear us witness to the contrary , that we do dislike and disown any such Principle and Doctrine : Thou hast mis-stated the case against us herein .

Secondly , As also thy Objection is false , That we were more afraid of the Publication , than ashamed of the Matter , p. 6.9 . Seeing we so plainly manifested our Dislike of the matter , in our Letter to those of Barbadoes concerned .

Thirdly , As also a scornful and two-fold Slander it is , That we endeavour to compel all to worship our Image ( as thy false term is ) of G. F 's Orders , p. 7. We deny both by terms and matter herein .

Fourthly , And likewise a gross Slander and Abuse it is , That G. F. and his Party sharply reprove others , who cannot against their Consciences give up as the Barbadoes Church have done , and for not bowing to our Image , G. F 's Laws , p. 8. What a scornful abominable Lye is this !

Fifthly , Also these are notorious Falshoods ; That we will drive them that will not follow us , contrary , or before the Spirit of the Lord lead them into our Ceremonies , else they must be Sons of Perdition , and all black Characters we can find to vilifie them , pag. 10. These are foul and false Accusations .

Sixthly , Again , That thou hast to thy understanding endeavoured the Advance and Honour of that Truth we profess , ( i. e. the Light in the Conscience ) p. 11. This is an untruth ; thy Vilifying and Abusing ( and Railery against ) the Servants of Christ ; who truly own and profess the Light for their guide , proves the contrary .

Seventhly , That we are zealous for Forms , more than the Power , p. 11. Is also a false Accusation and Slander .

Eighthly , That Stephen Crisp is an Engine of Satan , p. 12. And A Forger , p. 2. And A bold-faced Lyar , p. 4. appear slanderous Abuses and foul Detractions , also expresly contrary to thy own warning thou hast given forth in E. B's Name , for All Friends to forbear Judging any man upon any pretence whatsoever . However , Stephen Crisp is known to be a man Conscientious towards God , a man more Righteous than thy self , and I suppose better qualified , both as a Man , and a Christian , than ever thou wast ; and thy envious Detractions cannot lessen his Reputation , where he is well known . For the rest of thy Abuses , Perversions , foul Detractions , Railery , and bitter angry Stuff , ( in thy Pamphlets ) which are not here recited , I leave thee to the Righteous Judge of all to reckon with and judge thee , as I doubt not but in due time he will .

§. 9. I hereby give the Reader further notice about that Paper before-mentioned , which William Rogers and thy self have printed and published in your Books in Edward Burroughs's Name , as his Testimony , Vision , &c. concerning The scattered of Israel , the Shepherd and his Dogs , and Sheep , &c. and which in thy third Edition thou recommendest , To be considered by all , more especially by us called Quakers , among whom ( thou sayest ) 't is proved to be a true Vision , and not a Dream of E. B 's making : Shewing still thy confident Credulity , that 't is really Edward Burroughs's Paper . I am still the more confirmed that 't is none of E. B's , but John Perrots ; and that William Rogers and his party ( who encouraged the Publication thereof ) together with thy self , have been too credulous and confident , both in receiving the said Paper upon trust , and imposing it on others as Edward Burroughs's , and that therein you appear both implicit in your Faith , and meer Imposers , as well as Abusers of E. B. and his faithful Testimony , unless you can shew more manifest Testimony and valid Reason that the said Paper was E. B's , than we can show to the contrary that it was John Perrot's . It shall not serve W. R's turn to slight a Negative Testimony herein , unless he and his party can prove their Affirmative , that E. Burroughs was the Author of the said Paper , and that with more manifest Testimony and probable Reason than we have here to show to the contrary , namely , that 't was John Perrot's : For besides the Unsoundness of the said Paper in Matter and Manner , before hinted , as one Reason that 't was not E. B's ; observe the following Certificates and Testimonies from Bristol , viz.

I Having read and perused the Paper of The scattered of Israel , set down in W. R's Book , stiled , The Christian-Quaker , to which W. R. affixeth and subscribeth the Name of Edward Burroughs , as the Author and Giver forth of the same . I remembring that I had read a Paper of the like Import among the Papers of John Batho , when living , did search into them after his decease , and among the Letters of John Perrot , which John Batho choicely kept and transcribed with his own Hand , I found the same Paper above mentioned , without any substantial variation of matter , with John Perrot's Name subscribed at length , which if duely weighed , and compared with the Writings and Stile of E. B. and J. P. seems , according to my best discerning , much more likely to be the Stile of John Perrot , than of Edward Burroughs . Further , I am well assured that the Hand-writing of that Paper is John Batho's , which I have reason to know , by the many Years Co-habitation and intimate Acquaintance that I had with him and his Hand-writing , who hath often expressed to me a more than ordinary respect to , and admiration that he had of John Perrot his Ministry and Writings , which occasioned his Diligence and Care in transcribing his Epistles and Writings , of which he left a large Parcel behind him at his decease . This I am a Witness of , and do give this Testimony , in order to the undeceiving of the Simple in that particular , and the vindicating of that worthy Friend E. B. from W. R's Mis-representations in this matter .

Bristol , the 2d of the 10th Moneth , 1682. Laurence Steel .

WE , whose Names are hereunto subscribed , have also perused and compared the above-mentioned Paper , touching The scattered of Israel , &c. with that William Rogers recites in his Book , entituled , The Christian-Quaker , wherein he assigns Edward Burroughs to be the Author thereof ; And upon strict Examination , we find it to be the same in Substance , differing only here and there in some Words , which alter not the sence , and appears to be only by the Writers mistake on one hand or other . We have also compared the said Paper with John Batho's Books of Accounts , and divers other Papers and Epistles transcribed under his own Hand , and do most apparently discern that the above-said Paper is the same Character with them , and the same Hand-writings . We also further testifie , that at the end of the said Paper , John Per●ots Name , as Author thereof ( and not Edward Burroughs ) is subscribed at length by the same Hand : And if William Rogers , or any else , desire a sight of the said Paper , Epistles and Books , we do freely offer our selves ready to shew it them .

Witness our Hands , Charles Harford , Richard Snead , Richard Vickris . Dated in Bristol , this 2d of the 10th Moneth , 1682.

SErious Reader , please to take notice , that since the writing of the second Section of the eighth Chapter , containing a Charge against T. C. for his dealing unjustly and injuriously by John Crook in the aforesaid citation , which I sent him a true Copy of about Tythes , &c. as stated by T. C. I received John Crook's own Answer by Letter , dated , 6th of the 10th Moneth , 1682. plainly importing his dislike , and Testimony against such publication of his Name and Citation , contrary to his Principle and Practice , signifying , That if T. C. hath done him right in the Quotation , he is sure he hath wronged him in the Intention , by making his Words speak any thing at all touching Tythes : And that his Paper , which is only in Manuscript , ( near twenty Years since , writ on another occasion ) Cannot with any ingenuity be referred to the Payment , or Non-payment of Tythes : And that by a Book writ by him , and Printed 1659. against Tythes , together with his own clearness from the payment thereof , it is evident He cannot reasonably be supposed to favour the Payment of them . Thus far J. Crook hath ingenuously and plainly intimated and given his judgment , which ( compared with my Exception before ) doth confirm it against T. C. his disingenuous and injurious Citation , reflecting on J. C. and his Testimony , who concludes his Letter & Account in these Words to me , ( viz. )

What I have said , may satisfie those that are willing to be informed aright ; and for others , that will not be contented , except their Humour of Conceitedness be gratified , they need not greater Judgment here , than to be their own Tormentors , and hereafter to be left to the Judgment of the great Day , when every man shall receive a Reward according to his Deeds .

Thy Brother in the Truth of the Gospel of Jesus , John Crook .

CHAP. IX .

§ . 1. Why notice is taken of Jeffery Bullock , in this Treatise ; some Reasons given . § . 2. His charge of mens Inventions , false Doctrines . Of the Church of Rome , &c. Visible Church-Government , that 's altogether Antichristian , testified against . §. 3 Christ's Government in his Church , how Invisible and Visible , vindicated from Jeffery Bullocks opposition to Elders , Mens Meetings and Womens Meetings , &c. § . 4. Our Reverence to God in our Prayers , and reverent Deportment and Conscientiousness therein , both in uncovering our Heads , Kneeling , &c. vindicated from his false Objections . § . 5. His fallacious dealing with our Doctrine about the Seed of God in man : The matter truly stated against his Falshood . § . 6. Of his disowning the arising of the Seed of God in man . § . 7. Our preaching Salvation and Justification by the Man Christ , the Son of God , and his being our Way to the Father , questioned by J. Bullock ; here vindicated . § . 8. His Ignorance of the innocent Birth or Babe Immortal ; and of Gods appearance and speaking by his Son , and his opposing the inward feeling of Life . His slanderous repetition against us about God being held in Bondage , testified against , and the matter opened , as what it is that suffers , and what is in Bondage in man . His denying Christ to be the only Way to the Father again ; with a Collection of his Erronious and Atheistical Doctrines . § . 9. His opposing Justification , Salvation and Condemnation by that Christ that suffered , proved Erronious , and against his Mediatorship , and Scripture-Testimony . J. B. confounded about two Christs , &c. § . 10. His opposing Christ's coming of David , &c. And his asserting that his Soul dyed , that he internally dyed . And his holding the Mortality of the Soul of man , proved Erronious and Atheistical , and abundantly contradicted by himself and his Preaching . § . 11. His asserting the Scriptures to be the Fruit of the Tree of Knowledge , whimsical and erronious ; and disowning our Friends Book , Letter and Testimony , and yet confessing them to be in the Letter of the Scriptures , contradictory to himself and his Books against us . § . 12. His practical contradiction in separating himself from others , and preaching in our Friends Meeting at Sudbury . His erronious Denyings and Doctrines sumed up , and denyed by the true Christian-Quakers .

The Conclusion , by way of Solemn Appeal and Supplication to God .

§ . 1. COncerning Jeffery Bullock's four Pamphlets , slanderously charging us with Antichristian Doctrines , and an Antichristian Government , or a visible Church-Government that 's altogether Antichristian , as in his One Blow , pag. 9. &c.

Some may ask me , Why I take notice of such confused , muddled , blind , dark and mad Stuff , as his appears to be ? To which I Answer :

First , Because neither the Truth , nor us , as a Religious People and Christian Society , may lie under any Dis-repute , Blemish or Derision thereof , in the Eyes of those that know not , nor rightly understand the Christian Doctrine , Discipline , Church-Government , and wholsom Order among us , seeing the said J. B. has been for many Years conversant among the People called Quakers , and born the Name of a Quaker ( he saith ) this twenty Years , and more : Though he IS NO QVAKER , but turn'd an open Enemy to them .

Secondly , Because the said Jeffery Bullock , in a great measure , runs parallel with , and resembles William Rogers and his party , in his opposition and gain-saying of that Order and Church-Government that is among us , falsly accusing us with Men's Inventions , Imitations , Traditions , laying aside the Spirits Government , &c. as in his ONE BLOW , &c.

Thirdly , Because four Persons of William Rogers's Party * * Their Names I forbear exposing at present to this monstrous Birth they have adopted from Jeffery Bullock . But if they shall again suffer or encourage the reading of any such Unchristian , disingenuous and malicious Books ( or Pamphlets ) as W. R's 7th part , by any of their Party in Friends publick Meeting , ( as I understand , was once done at Chippinham , which was a turbulent , irreverent , and mad Action ) then they will more manifestly deserve to have their Names exposed , both in relation to that , and to Jeffery Bullock and his Books , &c. of Chippinham in Wiltsshire have given their approbation in a Letter to the said Jeffery Bullock of his Books , particularly that called , One Blow more against Antichrist's Ministers ; and have declared , that several Friends have good Vnity therewith ; Which I do not believe : And not only so , but this in opposition and contempt to others , whom they abusively revile in these Words ( viz. ) But here are also a company of called Friends , which are very much for Foxonians Orders , which may be called mens Inventions , that do make it their work to Defame and Calumniate all them 〈◊〉 do not conform thereunto . Some of which thou , and most of which we are in our Hearts perswaded are Servants of the living God , amongst which thou hast a share of being villified to be a bad man ; although to us it s no manner of Invitation for us to give Credit thereunto , &c — Barnadiston and another hath been here , their envious Darts fly very swiftly and secretly — If thou pleasest to send half a Dozen of thy Books , &c. With other Aggravations in the said Chippinham Letter , shewing not only their approbation and owning of Jeffery Bullock and his Books , but also their bitterness of Spirit in villifying and reproaching others ; although I understand they have been a little ashamed of their approbation of his Books , yet not that they have repented of the bitterness of their Spirits , nor condemned those villifying Reproaches and bitter Expressions in their said Letter , as Foxonians Orders , Barnadiston and another ; their envious Darts fly very swiftly , &c. What scorn , bitterness , and rancor do such Expressions bespeak ? Christ never taught them to give such Names to Friends as Foxonians , nor would they take it well to be so dealt by , nay , they would think much if they should but be called Johannites , and their reviling Giles Barnardiston , who was a peaceable innocent man , and of good Report , doth bespeak a great Prejudice and Enmity to have entred their Spirits , which they should plainly have condemned ; their Letter is all perverse , but I do not understand any sincere or tender Retractation , or real Condemnation thereof given out by them .

Fourthly , Notice is here taken of Jeffery Bullock's Pamphlets , to manifest the great Absurdity that opposit dividing Spirit leads into , and to warn others against it . And why these Persons should so hastily approve of Jeffery Bullock's Books , or say , that several Friends have good Unity therewith , I know no reason , being in several things so Corrupt , Erronious and Atheistical , as they are , except it be with respect to the Oppositions therein contained against the Church-Government , Order and Methods among us , in opposing whereof , Jeffery Bullock was these men's Elder Brother . Concerning which , take a view of some Passages in his said Pamphlet , viz. One Blow more , in his own Words .

§ . 2. Jeffery Bullock saith , And you my Brethren also ought to have Preached up God's invisible appearance by his Spirit in our dayes , to be the end of mens Inventions , Imitations and false Doctrines : But instead thereof , you have preached up false Doctrines , and also set up your own Inventions among the Quakers so called , p. 5.

Answer ; His charge of false Doctrines , and mens Inventions , we utterly deny as slanderous : God's invisible and spiritual Appearance , and the Testimony thereof still lives among us in as high esteem as ever , against false Doctrines and mens Inventions . But herein J. B. resembles the rest of the Opposers , in the work of the false Accuser of our Brethren .

Jeffery Bullock . My Brethren , I fear you are not past the Doctrine of the Church of Rome , nor yet of the Priests and Professors of England [ a false Fear ] There is as great necessity of Preaching up Salvation to us Gentiles , by God's invisible Appearance , who is a Spirit , and also his Spirit to be the end of all mens Inventions , Imitations , Traditions , &c. pag. 6. [ True , but misapplied ] Therefore I would have G. Fox , and the eleven Elders , who are preaching up false Doctrines , and also setting up their Inventions among the People called Quakers , as Rules , &c. p. 7.

Answer ; Herein he is a false Accuser still like the rest , and he 's far louder in his Charges than in 's Proof . False Doctrines and Inventions of men , both of the Church of Rome and elsewhere , we utterly deny .

J. B. My Brethren your visible Church-Government is altogether Antichristian , because that every Member of the Church in God is to be both ruled and governed by the measure of Gods Spirit in them ; and it is none of George Fox 's , nor yet the eleven Elders that is to be a Rule for the Quakers to walk by , p. 9.

Answ. His charge of Antichristian and Inventions we utterly deny , and testifie against as Antichristian ; and he , and the rest of his backsliding Spirit , and approvers of him and his Books , are never able to make his Charge good . However , here its plain that he opposes visible Church-Government , because of the inward Rule by the measure of God's Spirit , wherein he argues Erroniously , and contrary to the Apostles Doctrine and Primitive Christians Practice : Both the inward Rule , and outward Order , and due Methods among them , all springing from God's Spirit within , were not to draw them from a dependance on that Spirit , but to shew forth Obedience in Practice and Example to the holy Spirit and pure Religion , and therein to help one another , for which purpose the Holy Ghost made Overseers and Elders , The Elders that rule well are worthy , &c. He that ruleth with Diligence , &c. I left thee in Creet to set in order those things that are lacking , &c. But there were such Apostates then as despised Dominion , and spoke Evil of Dignities , even of those Instruments and Ministers , Helps and Governments , whom the Lord ordained and raised up and dignified in his Church ; and such are these Opposers now in the same Spirit of Opposition and Contempt .

§ . 3. J. B. And she ( i. e. the Church ) hath no need of your visible Government , because she is the Bride , the Lambs Wife ; and she hath no need of the Light of the Moon to shine in her , because the Lord is the Light , and the Lambs Spirit is the Light of the Church that is in him : But your visible Churches make use of the Light of the Moon , * * That 's a Whimsie ; where proves he that ? Or that the Light of the Moon is Antichristian ? that is , your Mens Meetings , and also your Womens Meetings , and the Orders which are set up by them , they are to be Rules for your visible Churches to walk by : For the Women have power to order the Affairs of your visible Church , as well as your Men ; and this Practice of yours is altogether Antichristian , and so also is your Church-Government , because it is the Invisible man Christ , who orders all things in his Church by his own Spirit . — Those who are Members of the Church in God among you , in time will abhor your Government , because it is Antichristian ; For you Elders do look upon your selves to be Judges , and that you have Power to determine things in matter of Conscience , &c. p. 10 , 11.

Answ. Christ's Government in his Church is both Invisible and Visible , he governs by himself and by his Ministers : all are not come to a ripe Age in him , there are many Children and weak Ones , who have need of helps in Government : Our faithful Mens Meetings and Womens Meetings were set up by the Power of Christ Jesus , and in his Light he governs and rules among them by his own Spirit : And faithful , grave and sober Women have power to be Teachers of good things , and to teach the younger Women . Christian-Church-Order and Spiritual Rule were exercised among the Primitive Christians , both Men and Women , who were Children of New Jerusalem , the free Woman ; the Inhabitants of this City are not without Order , or Ministers therein . And therefore this Opposers Blow and Charge of [ altogether Antichristian ] against our Mens and Womens Meetings , is both Silly , Proofless , Slanderous , and altogether Antichristian , against Christ's Work ( and appointment ) in Male and Female ; and as the Church-Government among us is Christ's Government , both revealed , set up , and ordained by him ; none that are and continue true Members of his Church , will ever abhor that Government , nor reject , slight or despise that promised Dominion and Judgment that he hath given to the Saints to determine matters of Difference , but only Apostates , false Brethren and deceitful Workers , and loose Spirits ; these will be smiting and accusing the Brethren , despising Dominion , and speaking evil of Dignities ; yea , speaking perverse things to draw Disciples after them , crying against outward Rule and Government , Forms and Order in the Church , whilst they are seeking Mastery , Dominion , Rule and Government to themselves . As for our visible Church and visible Church-Government ( or Order ) so much opposed by this Adversary , he talks blindly and ignorantly ; for though the Church be Invisible , as to the Spirits of Men , who are Members of it , and Christ's immediate Rule and Government in the Heart be Invisible , yet there is a Visibility both of the true Christian Congregation , and good Order and Rule therein , proceeding from the Spirit of Christ within .

The People of God and their good Conversations and Order in Christ , are not all shut up in an Invisibility , being as Epistles to be read and seen of all ; and they as a City set upon a Hill , &c.

J. B. You do prefer your selves , and the Church in the first place before God , who is Light — And have set up themselves and their Church as Head , instead of God and Christ , p. 12. Their setting up themselves and their Government , and are laying aside the Spirit 's Government and Authority , p. 13. Those Elders who call themselves Ministers , look upon themselves and their Image to be equal in Power and Glory , both with the Father and the Son , Testimony against the Quakers , p. 3.

Answ. These are notoriously false and slanderous ; We prefer the living God , and his Son Christ Jesus before all , and do not lay aside the Spirit 's Government or Authority , but in humility reverence , and desire ever to live under the same , knowing Self abased , and Images defaced and rejected by the Light of Christ Jesus .

§ . 4. J. B. If any of those called Teachers intend to speak a few words commonly called Prayer , then the Women and the Men that are set in the Meeting , shall rise up , and the Men will uncover their Heads . — Their Teachers have judged those Quakers not to be real Members of their Church or Body , that have not done it ( i. e. uncovered their Heads ) And herein the Quakers in general have given more Homage , Reverence and Respect to the Words or Prayers of another , wherein there was no Life at all , than they have done to the Word of Life it self in their own Particulars : And this is Anti-christ's work , p. 14 , 15.

Answ. His conclusion is false and slanderous herein . We Reverence the Word of Life in our living Prayers , and not Lifeless Words ; And why doth he thus judge any Reverent Posture among us in Prayer , as that of Peoples Rising up , and Mens Uncovering their Heads in our holy Duty of publick Prayer ? This is like John Perrot's prejudiced Party . And how foully Contradictory to himself is he in thus uncharitably judging us for our Reverent Posture or serious Behaviour , which is matter of Conscience to us , when yet he 'l not allow any Members or Elders among us to judge or determine matters relating to Conscience ? And cautions us in Christ's words , Judge not , that ye be not judged , p. 12. Oh , blind harden'd Man ! how darest thou thus judge over our Consciences , or falsly accuse us with leading People from the Power , to worship and reverence the Form more than the Power ? And then most falsly to add , That this is the work of Antichrist among the Quakers , p. 17. Here thou hast slandered , and shamefully belyed the People of God called Quakers , and hast shewn thy self not worthy of so much as the Name of a Quaker . Thou hast long been a Reproach unto them .

J. B. Postscript to his Antichrist's Transformations within , ( viz. ) If any amongst you pretend to be moved by the Spirit to go to Prayer , then both Men and Women , they either stand up or else kneel down , and the Men all pull off their Hats , which own your Form of Prayer ; and herein you do both Worship , Reverence and Adore the Form outwardly , and the Words more than you do the Word of Life in your own Particulars .

Answ. An erronious Conclusion , and no natural Consequence , either of our standing up , kneeling or putting off our Hats in Prayer ; for all these may be and are innocently and conscientiously performed with Respect ( and in a holy Reverence ) to Almighty God , whom we breathe and pray unto by his own Spirit . Besides , both Kneeling and being Uncovered have been practised among God's People and true Christians in Prayer to him ; so that these Postures are not condemnable in themselves . How blind and ignorant therefore is this Gain-sayer in his Opposition ? Read Psal. 95.6 . O come , let us Worship and Bow down ▪ Let us Kneel before the Lord our Maker . And Acts 21.5 . And we Kneeled down on the Shore and prayed ; see also 1 Cor. 11.4 .

§ . 5. Having thus manifested the Heads of Jeffery Bullock's Opposition to outward Order and visible Church Government , &c. and how blind and irrational he is therein , Inconsistent , Erronious and Antichristian in his Judgment . Now take a view of the Doctrinal part of some of those Doctrines he opposeth , and what Doctrines he asserteth .

J. B. The second false Doctrine by you Preached , and also Printed , is , That the Seed , Spirit , Word , or God , is both in Prison , Bondage and Captivity , and to be quickned , raised , &c. and that the Blessing is to the Seed , p. 2 , 3. of his ONE BLOW .

Answ. Herein he hath dealt unfairly and fallaciously ; he hath not produced any Book of ours , or our Friends , wherein this Doctrine is Printed , nor proved where any of us have thus asserted in these very Words , though much of his opposition in his Pamphlets depend hereupon . We deny the Doctrine that the Word , God , is either in Bondage or Captivity in the Sons and Daughters of men , but only that there is a Seed of God and of Christ that is oppressed , and suffers in many by reason of Transgression [ a Seed of God ] is commonly our phrase and terms in this case : God is greater , he is above all , he is God and Father of his own Seed and Birth in man , which is a tender Seed , a lowly and innocent Seed , of the nature of Christ Jesus as Mediator , who hath planted of his own Seed in man from the beginning , even of his own Life , Soul and Image , &c. who was The first born of every Creature , who said , My Father is greater than I : A●● from this Seed comes a holy Generation , in them that believe in his Name and Power . Read also the Parable of the Sower , which was the Son of Man , and of the Seed that fell , some on good Ground , some on stony Ground , and some in High-way Ground , &c. Matth. 13. And also how the Kingdom of Heaven is like unto a Grain of Mustard Seed ; as also the Parable of the Pearl hid in the Field , &c. And further , the Seed of God and Christ may suffer , and yet not be in Bondage nor Captivity ; nor hath the Devil or Sin , power or dominion over Christ or his Spirit in man ( as J. B. falsly infers against us ) but over the Soul and whole Creature in Sin , for whom Christ laid down his Life , and took it up again , who gave his Flesh for the Life of the World ; And every one that seeth the Son , and believeth on him , shall have everlasting Life ; and I will raise him up at the last day , ( saith Christ ) John 6.39 , 40 , 44. and ver. 54. Christ Jesus is not brought into Bondage or Captivity in man , though he condescends to suffer and bear Affliction for his own Seed and Generation , to bring them forth ; for his own Arm can bring Salvation to him : he can take unto him his great Power when he pleaseth : Though he was oppressed and afflicted , and his Soul was Sorrowful , nigh unto Death , when he bore the Sin of many in the dayes of his Flesh , & when the Iniquities of all did meet upon him , when he suffered on the Cross ; and he is also such an high Priest as can be touched with the feeling of our Infirmities , suffer with us , and be afflicted in all our Afflictions ; many are also said , To pierce him , grieve his holy Spirit , crucifie to themselves the Lord of Life afresh , and to tread under Foot the Son of God , &c. These are certain Allusions and Elegancies , intimating Christ's suffering , and also his being offended and grieved by the Contempt , Despight and Enmity of the Rebellious : And yet Christ cannot be properly said to be in bondage or captivity in the Sons and Daughters of men ; for ( as in himself ) he that was dead , and is alive , ever lives in Dominion , having power over all Flesh , that he might give eternal Life to all that come unto him , & truly believe in him : 'T is properly said of the Souls of Man and Woman in the Fall , that they are in Bondage and Captivity ; that they are in Prison and Thraldom , till Christ bring them forth and deliver them : Psal. 142.1 . Bring my Soul out of Prison that I may praise thy Name . And be sure he that brings the Soul out of Prison , does condescend to visit it in Prison . He that brings up the Soul out of the horrible Pit , does first descend or reach so low to fetch it up , or else it would alwayes remain th●re .

§ . 6. J. B. Antichrist's Transformations , pag. 9. The Seed is not to arise in man — And p. 25. I disown the arising of the Seed or God in man .

Answ. A sad Doctrine and State ! That 's because the Enemy is arisen to such a great hight in thee , that thou dost not own the arising of the Seed of God in thee : What Fruit canst thou bring forth to God , if thou dost deny the arising of his Seed in thee ? 'T is evident thy Heart is bad Ground , stony Ground and thorny Ground , in which the good Seed hath not taken Root , so as to spring up , and bring forth Fruit unto Perfection ; for in the good Ground or honest Heart it takes Root downward , and brings forth Fruit upward . And they that take heed unto the Light of Christ in them , where it shines but as in a dark place , they come to see the Day dawn , and the Day-Star arise in their Hearts : And is not Christ Jesus the bright and Morning Star ? But thou , as an enemy to the Seed of God , disownest the arising of his Seed in thee . Howbeit , that His Light doth ARISE : The brightness of his RISING : He shall grow up : Truth shall SPRING out of the Earth : The Sun of Righteousness shall ARISE : The Day spring : Let God ARISE and his Enemies be scattered , &c. The Word of God grew : So mightily grew the Word of God and prevailed . These are Scripture Terms and Language , though little heeded by thee : We shall see more of thy absurd and erronious Disownings and Denyings anon , concerning the very Christ of God , and the Soul , &c. But how comest thou to deny the arising of the Seed in man , when thou hast espoused and cited what G. B. writ as thou sayest , against that Paper of Orders , &c. seeing he herein plainly saith , The Revelation of God is to his Seed , and his secrets he reveals to it , for which he made the World , and for whose sake it is continued ; And now the SEED IS RAISED to reign over all . ( Thus far G. B. thy authority . ) But how shamefully hast thou contradicted him in this matter , in thy disowning the arising of the Seed in Man ?

§ . 7. J. B. You do preach both Salvation and Justification , and also Condemnation to us Gentiles , by the man Christ , the Son of God , as other Professions do ; and this Doctrine I would have you to prove , because you preach Salvation by Christ the Light within . — You Preachers do say in your Declaration , that the Son of God is come , and hath given you an understanding ; the which Doctrine I do deny , ONE BLOW , p. 20.

Answ. Thou that canst not reconcile ( or see the consistency of ) Salvation by the Man Christ Jesus , AND by his Light within , art gone from his Light into Imaginations . Why hast thou not better observed the Gospel preached by the Angel of the Lord to the Shepherds , concerning Jesus Christ the Son of God , Luke 2.11 . For unto you is born this day in the City of David a Saviour , which is Christ the Lord ; see also Mat. 1.21 . Read also good Old Simeon's Testimony , which he gave of the Lord 's Christ , Luke 2.26 , 27 , 28. And also read Verse 30 , 31 , 32. For mine Eyes have seen thy Salvation , which thou hast prepared before the Face of all People , a Light to lighten the Gentiles , and the Glory of thy People Israel . The true Christ of God is but one , though he hath appeared in divers manners , both in the Flesh and in the Spirit ; he is the Light ; he is the Way to the Father ; he is the Saviour ; he is the one Mediator betwixt God and Man , even the Man Christ Jesus , the heavenly , glorious Man , the Man that was promised to be for a hiding place , who in the dayes of his Flesh , said , I am the Light of the World — And , He that is with you , shall be in you . As he was the eternal Word , the Son of God ; the Life that was in him was the Light of men ( John 1. ) both before his coming in the Flesh , and ever since , and therefore he was that true Light that enlightens every man that cometh into the World ; he was given for Life and Salvation : This our one Lord Jesus Christ is our Light , Life and Salvation , he is also Judge of quick and dead , that MAN by whom God will judge the World in Righteousness ; he that believeth not in his Name , is condemned already ; and This is the Condemnation that Light is come into the World ( i. e. the Light of the Son of God ) and Men love Darkness rather then Light , John 3. see also 2 Thes. 1.7 , 8. When the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from Heaven with his mighty Angels in flaming Fire , taking Vengeance on them that know not God , and that obey not the Gospel , &c. Then such shall know him their Judge and Condemner unto their deserved punishment ; see Verse 9.

J. B. You Teachers do hold forth to us Gentiles Christ the Son of God , to be our Way to the Father ; The which Doctrine I would have you to prove ; One Blow , p. 20.

Answ. What defidence and unbelief hath entred thee ? Christ the Son of God testied , John 14.6 . I am the Way , the Truth , and the Life : No man cometh unto the Father but by me ; and no man cometh unto me , except the Father which hath sent me draw him . Wherefore in that no man cometh unto the Father but by the Son , the Son is the way to the Father , and the Father's drawing or teaching reacheth unto man , before he come to the Son or Father , that he may be drawn and come to both . No mans knows the Father , but the Son , and he to whom the Son will reveal him . Therefore Christ the Son of God , is the way to the Father out of Adam in the fall ( if thou l't believe him ) and 'T is by one Spirit through Jesus Christ ( the Mediator ) that we have access to the Father .

§ . 8. J. B. In his gross Errors detected , or many of the Doctrines of the leading Quakers disowned , as coming from an Antichristian Spirit , p. 1. he saith , John Webb's Doctrine was , That God's appearance in the Sons and Daughters of men , is to beget and bring forth that innocent Birth and Babe immortal , &c. This Doctrine doth signifie that God's appearance is to his Son Christ Jesus , and for the begetting and bringing of him forth in the Sons and Daughters of men ; the which Doctrine I do deny .

Answ. First , God's appearance in the Sons and Daughters of men , is not to bring forth a nocent Birth , nor a Babe that 's mortal , but an innocent Birth , and a Babe immortal . Except a man be Born of Water and the Spirit , he cannot enter into the Kingdom of God : And whosoever is born of God , doth not commit Sin , for his Seed remaineth in him .

Secondly ; This innocent Birth , which God by his Spirit brings forth in the Sons and Daughters of men , who truly believe , relates to them and their souls , as begotten and born of the immortal seed , by the living word : so that this Birth is not Christ Jesus ; for he is that incorruptible Seed and Word of Life , which begets , forms and brings forth the Soul of man into his own Nature and Image , and so he renews his own Image in man , that believes in his Power ; and so Christ may be said to be formed in us , as in a mysterious and elegant way of speaking : the property and effect being put for the cause ; for Christ in himself hath all Power in Heaven and Earth given to him , and it hath pleased the Father that all fulness should dwell in him .

J. B. That God's appearance is in and by his Son Christ Jesus to us , and that all are to hear the Son in them , by whom the Father speaketh to them , and that the Son in us is our way to the Father ; The which Doctrine I do deny . His gross Error , p. 1.

Answ. Here thou hast denyed sound Doctrine , which is according to Christs own Doctrine , i. e. He that seeth me , seeth the Father also : who hath shined in our Hearts , to give us the Light of the Knowledge of his Glory in the face of Christ Jesus : And my Sheep hear my Voice , saith Christ : And God hath spoken to us by his Son . Thy denying God's appearing , and speaking by his Son , and his Son to be our way to the Father ▪ Herein thou hast not only denyed Christ's own Testimony , but the blessed advantage we have by him as MEDIATOR .

J. B. Another of their Doctrines is , That the Quakers ought so to wait upon God , as that they may feel the Life in them to flow from Vessel to Vessel , whenas they are met together to wait upon God . This was Charles Marshalls Wife's Doctrine , p. 2 ibid.

Answ. This is neither false Doctrine nor gross Error , as thou imaginest , but sound Doctrine ; Hannah Marshall knew better than thy self herein ; for they that truly wait upon God , both receive an encrease of Life from him who is the Fountain , and feel Life to flow from Vessel to Vessel ; He that believes as the Scripture saith , out of his Belly shall flow Rivers of living Waters ; This spake he of the Spirit , which they that believe should receive . And the true Believers all drink into One Spirit . And there is among such a spiritual and effectual Communication of Faith and Virtue , in the living Communion of the holy Spirit ; all which thy dark Imaginations have deprived thee of .

J. B. These Doctrines of the Quakers are false Doctrines and Antichristian , because that God's Appearance is not by his Son Christ Jesus to us , p. 3.

Answ. Thou art guilty of Antichristian Doctrine , and Anti-scriptural also , in denying God's Appearance to be by his Son Christ Jesus , The Mediator ; for what God is to us for our Salvation , and what good we receive from him for our Souls , and what we are unto him in our Obedience ( as acceptable to him ) 't is all IN and Through our Lord Jesus Christ the Mediator .

J. B. That God , who is a Spirit , should be held in Bondage and Captivity by his Creation , or by the Power of Darkness , is contrary to Right Reason — So that it must needs follow by plain Argument , that not only the Creature , but the Power of Darkness too hath had Dominion over God — contrary to sound Doctrine , and is Blasphemy , pag. 5 , 6. GROSS ERRORS .

Answ. This thou hast often unjustly and slanderously repeated upon the Quakers ; and herein I testifie against thy Abuse , and dare Challenge thee to prove out of any of our Writings , that 't is the Quakers Doctrine , That either God is held in Bondage or Captivity by his Creation , or that the Power of Darkness hath Dominion over him . We utterly deny the Assertion and Expressions as Blasphemous ; but do say , the holy Spirit is grieved , and the Seed of God burdened by the Iniquities of the World , which suffering is in Condescention on Christ's part , and not for want of Power or Dominion over the Devil or Wicked men ; for he bruiseth his Head , hath Power to subdue , condemn and punish them , and his own Arm to bring Salvation to him .

J. B. Another of their Doctrines , That all are to come to the Son of God , Christ Jesus , whom they say is in them , and that he is the only Way to the Father ; which Doctrine I do deny , because it is God who both was and is a Spirit , which hath first appeared in and to the Sons and Daughters of men , after sin , &c. — Therefore every one is to be first turned to God in their own particulars , and NOT to the Son of God , p 8. Gross Errors .

Answ. This Erronious Denyal and Doctrine of thine , against coming to the Son of God , as the only Way to the Father , is but the same reiterated over and over . The Father and the Son are not divided in the work of Regeneration . I and my Father are one , saith Christ : No man cometh to the Father but by me . But 't is no marvel that thou hast denyed Christ ( the Mediator ) to be the way to the Father , and so opposed his Mediatorship ; for thy Denyals and Oppositions appear more Gross , Erronious and Antichristian against Christ himself and the holy Scriptures in thy Antichrist's Transformations .

1st , In thy not owning Justification or Condemnation by Christ * * N● marvel if Giles Barnardiston's Wife did say that she trembled to hear the Blasphemy that thou heldst , as thou sayest ; Antichrist●s Transfor . pag. 21. that dyed without the Gates of Jerusalem ; which thou confessest to be the ground and main Difference that arose between some of the Quakers and thee , p. 10.

2dly , In thy asserting , That Christ's Soul dyed , p. 19. * * N● marvel if Giles Barnardiston's Wife did say that she trembled to hear the Blasphemy that thou heldst , as thou sayest ; Antichrist●s Transfor . pag. 21. And so thy holding the the Mortality of the Soul in general .

3dly , Thy asserting , That the Book of the Scriptures both was and is the fruit which the Tree of Knowledge bears , p. 22.

4thly , Thy affirming , That there is Two Christs , p. 23. Thus thou arguest .

§ . 9. J. B. It is no where written in the Scriptures , that we shall either be justified or condemned by that Christ which dyed without the Gates of Jerusalem ; but it is written , By Grace ye are saved , and by Grace ye are justified ; and 't is also written , By the Light of the World ye are condemned ; and not by Christ that dyed without the Gates of Jerusalem , Antichr . Transf . p. 17.

Answ. Here again thy erronious Blindness is apparent , who seest not how consistent being saved and justified by that Christ who is the very Christ of God , to whom all the Prophets gave witness , AND being saved and justified by his Grace ; both which the holy Scripture testifie . Isa. 53.11 . By his Knowledge shall my Righteous Servant justifie many ; for he shall bear their Iniquities . This was a Prophecy of the same Christ that suffered ; and Mat. 1.21 . She shall bring forth a Son , and thou shalt call his Name Jesus , for he shall save his People from their Sins ; and verse 23. Behold , a Virgin shall be with Child , and shall bring forth a Son , and his Name shall be called Emanuel , which being interpreted , is , God with us : And Luke 2.11 . For unto you is born this day in the City of David a Saviour , which is Christ the Lord . And that Grace by which we are saved , is that Grace of God which comes by Christ ; see also Tit. 2.11 , 12 , 13 , 14. Where the saving Grace of God and our Saviour Jesus Christ , who gave himself for us that he might redeem us from all Iniquity &c. are testified of ; and therefore Salvation by that Christ , through his Grace are not Inconsistent .

J. B. Now if Salvation be by that Christ that dyed without the Gates at Jerusalem , then are all the Gentiles perished that were in the World before that Body came into the World , Antich . Trans . p. 18.

Answ. Thy consequence is erronious ; for that very Christ , the Son of God , was ( and is ) Mediator and Saviour from the beginning ; his outgoings were from of Old , he was spiritually in being by his Life , Light , Spirit and Grace before he took upon him that Body prepared of the Father to do his Will. John bore witness of that Man Christ , saying , He that cometh after me is preferred before me , for he was before me , John 1.15 . And again , vers. 30. After me cometh a man which is preferred before me , for he was before me : Therefore the Man Christ Jesus was before he came in the Body or Flesh : He was that spiritual Rock which all Israel drank of ; his Life was the Light of men from the beginning , and all the generations of the Righteous did spiritually p●rtake of the benefit of Christ as Mediator , both before and after his Coming in the flesh they vertually pertook of the Sacrifice of the Lamb , of the vertue of the Blood of the Covenant for Remission , and were saved by the Life of this Mediator ; by Faith they pertook of the spiritual Advantage of his suffering and sacrifice , who was as a Lamb slain from the Foundation of the World , and as ( in the fullness of time ) his coming and suffering in the flesh , and his tasting Death for every man , and his giving himself a Ransom for all , were for a Testimony in due time of God's great kindness to Mankind . So Christ's coming in the flesh an eminent Dispensation from God , ordained and decreed in great love to Mankind : So that thereby a greater and more eminent discovery and breaking forth of his Light and Glory in the Gospel Day and Dispensation was manifest in due time , which Glory the holy spirit of Christ in the holy Prophets testified of , as that which should follow his sufferings ; and in him are all Nations and Families of the Earth blessed and saved , who believe and walk in his Light .

J. B. All the World was freed from their Offerings for sin by that one Offering — reconciled to God by the death of his Son — But we must be redeemed , justified and also saved by a measure of the same Life that dwelt in the Son , in which Life the Son of God offered up his Soul and Body to be crucified to the Death a Sacrifice once for all * * These precedent words ( except that of his Soul ) are true ; but not the subsequent . Then NO Salvation to the Souls of the Sons and Daughters of men by him that dyed without the Gates at Jerusalem , p. 19. Anti. Transformations .

Answ. An erronious Inference still , and most blindly reiterated ; for if we must be saved by that Life that was in the Son of God , how darest thou deny Salvation to the souls of Mankind by him that so suffered and dyed ? seeing we are reconciled by his Death ; who dyed and rose again , and Death has no more dominion over him ? And hast not thou confessed that we are reconciled by his Death , so we shall be saved by his Life ?

Well , by whose Life ? by the Life of the very same Christ of God , who ( as concerning the flesh ) was put to Death . And was his Death then no ways conducing to our Salvation ? How are we then reconciled by it ? Is Reconciliation no degree of Salvation ? Surely thou art under great Contradiction and gross Mistakes in this matter .

To thy Objection , That Mary saith , her Soul did magnifie the Lord , and her Spirit did rejoyce in God her Saviour , p. 21. And that God said , Look unto Me all ye Ends of the Earth , and be saved , p. 23.

This is no proof that his Son Jesus Christ was No Saviour ; for God saves by his Son ; God was in Christ reconciling the World to himself ; God works by the Mediator ; and Jesus Christ , who is the Saviour and the Redeemer is both truly God and Man Inseparable .

But how comest thou off in answer to the Objection made against thee , ( viz. ) If no Salvation by that Christ that dyed without the Gates of Jerusalem , then thy Doctrine implyeth two Christs , which we do not profess , nor preach , nor own ; for in words thou over and over tellest us of that Christ that dyed without the Gates , and that he was the Son of God , the Christ of God , &c. What sayst thou to this ? Review thy following words :

J. B. ( viz. ) Now that there are two Christs , it is plain according to the Scriptures ; for there is both the true Christ and Antichrist , p. 23.

Rep. Oh , sad and lamentable ! How absurdly , blindly and erroniously hast thou answered here ! The Objection or Question against thee was not about Antichrist , but about the True Christ , who is the very Christ of God , who was crucified at Jerusalem , and is in his Saints ( by his Light , Life and Spirit ) whom thy Doctrine tends to render Two Christs , and so to divide the True Christ ; but we testifie he is but One ; As to us there is but ONE GOD , the Father , of whom are all things , and we in him ; and ONE Lord Jesus Christ , by whom are all things , and we by him , 1 Cor. 8.6 . And of this ONE Lord Jesus Christ the true Apostles testified as One and the same Christ , though he variously appeared , according to what is written of him , ( 1 Cor. 15. & 3 , 4 , 5 , 6 , 7 , verses ) of his Death and Resurrection , and how he was seen of many , And last of all he was seen of me also , ( saith Paul ) as of one born out of due time , v. 8. This was ONE and the SAME CHRIST still .

§ . 10. J. B. Now Christ he neither came of David , nor yet of Israel , according to the Flesh ; not as to his outward appearance as he was a visible Man ; but he came of David and Israel both , according to the Spirit : And this is the Spirit whom God hath exalted , both as a Prince and a Saviour ; Anti. Trans . p. 23.

Answ. This is a gross Mistake , and Contradictory to plain Scripture ; see Rom. 1.3 , 4 , 5. Concerning his Son Jesus Christ our Lord , which was made of the seed of David according to the Flesh ; and declared to be the Son of God with Power , according to the spirit of Holiness , by the Resurrection from the dead ; by whom we have received GRACE and Apostleship for obedience to the Faith among all Nations for his Name ; see also Rom. 9.5 . But thou sayst , He neither came of David , nor yet of Israel according to the flesh , quite contrary to the Apostle's testimony ; Which shall People believe , thee or the Apostle ? Surely not such a blind , muddled , confused , dark and dull Soul as thou art . I wish thee ( with the Light of Christ within , on the holy Scriptures ) to recollect thy self better , that thou mayst repent , and condemn , and call in thy muddled , confused , distracted , whimsical and mad Pamphlets , that would be the safest way for thee upon all accounts ; for thou hast no matter of Religion to suffer for , thy hope being in this Life only according to thy Principle of the Soul's Mortality .

J. B. He that dyed without the Gates at Jerusalem — he was the Christ of God , being one with the Spirit of God ; but it was the Womans part * * What Scripture hath he that saith His Soul was the Woman's part that dyed ? The Scripture says otherwise ; That 't was according to the Flesh , he was made of the seed of David , Rom. 1.3 . that dyed , that was his * * What Scripture hath he that saith His Soul was the Woman's part that dyed ? The Scripture says otherwise ; That 't was according to the Flesh , he was made of the seed of David , Rom. 1.3 . Soul and Body . — Now Christ as he was a visible Man , and made of a visible Woman made under the Law , he INTERNALLY DYED , as to his SOUL and BODY ; Antichrist's Transformations , pag. 19.

Answ. Oh poor Jeffery ! Whither art thou run in thy whimsical Conceits , and distracted Imaginations , one while to DENY Jesus Christ the Son of God , to be the Way to the Father ; another while to DENY Salvation by him ; another while to DENY the Immortality of his Soul ; and here most erroniously to AFFIRM , That his Soul dyed , and that he internally dyed as to his Soul . Oh! Antichristian and Antiscriptural Doctrine ! For though he was put to death only as to his Body , his Soul dyed not with it ; for he said , Father , into thy Hands I commend my Spirit , Luke 23.46 . see Acts 7.59 . And to the penitent Thief , To Day shalt thou be with me in Paradise , Luke 23.43 . Therefore his Soul ( or Spirit ) dyed not with the Body , he did not internally dye , he dyed only as to the Body , being put to death as concerning the Flesh , and rose again the third day , according to the Scriptures ; and Death has no more dominion over him . And although it be said , He hath poured out his Soul unto Death : This concerned the travail of soul , and sorrows of death , which he was under the sence of , when he said , My Soul is exceeding sorrowful , even unto death , Matth. 26.38 . whilst yet his soul was living and immortal in its own being , praying and making intercession unto the Father : For pouring out the Soul or Heart , sometimes ( in Scripture ) imports an earnest supplication to God , and travail in Prayer ; Psal. 42.4 . I pour out my Soul in me . And Psal. 62.8 . Pour out your Heart before him , God is a Refuge for us . The soul of Messiah was poured out in Prayer and Supplication to the Father , whilst in great sorrow and deep suffering for Mankind , even when he bore the Sin of many , and made intercession for the Transgressors . Isa. 53. Thus his soul was poured out , and made an offering for Sin , that he might see his Seed , and the effect of his Souls travail , and be satisfied , and through all Reign with the Father in the same Glory which he had with him before the World began . So that the Messiah reigneth in Life , Glory and Immortality , blessed forever ; and his Saints shall reign with him for evermore .

But thy Error ends not here , in asserting that Christ's Soul dyed , seeing thou hast publickly opposed the Immortality of the Soul in my hearing , and the hearing of many more , and hast affirmed , The mortality of the Soul of man , that it dyes with the Body . And so denying future States , Beeings and Rewards of mankind . Thou knowest ( Jeffery ) I have laboured with thee at sundry times , and before several endeavoured to Convince thee of thy Atheistical Error in this very point ; and many are my Witnesses therein : But thou hast appeared wilful , dark and pertinacious in thy blind , dark and confused Imaginations , whereupon I have exhorted thee , and do exhort thee , to give over Preaching , and telling People of saving their Souls by the Word , and of raising of our Souls out of the Grave of Sin and Death , by the Light and Power of God within , when thou dost not believe any Immortality of the Souls of Men , more than of a Beast , as I have told thee to thy Face ; when the Beast dyes , there 's an end . So what gross Hypocrisie is it in thee so often to Preach in Friends Meetings at Sudbury , in opposition to our Friends , and to pretend , as if thou hadst such a great Regard to Peoples Souls , that they might be saved , raised up , and delivered from Sin in this Life , when thou hast nothing further to propose to them , than only a Hope in this Life , a Happiness in this Life , a Portion in this Life ? which is so short and uncertain , that the dayes of Man here are compared but to a Shadow , Psal. 90.4 , 6 , 9. & 102.11 . & 103.15 . & 144 , 4. See Jo● 7.6 . & 16.22 . Isa. 40.6 James 4.14 . and to a Cloud that vanishes , and as being swifter than a Post , or than a Tale that 's told , and swifter than a Weavers Shuttle , &c. So that if we have hope in this life Only , we are of all men most miserable . But I cannot take thee as a Person consistent with thy self , in this thy Atheistical Doctrine of the Soul's Mortality , no more than in other things ; for thou art manifestly inconsistent and contradictory to thy self in this matter ; for in thy Pamphlet ( i. e. GROSS ERRORS ) thou hast confessed , His Concessions manifestly Contradictory to his Doctrine of the Soul's Mortality . That Christ's Soul never was captivated , p. 4. And , That the Blessing is to God's invisible Creation within the Sons and Daughters of men , as that cometh to be begotten by a measure of divine Life , into a true and living Faith ; the which invisible Creation ( sayest thou ) or the Souls and Vnderstandings of men and women , over the which Death , that power of Darkness hath invisibly reigned , p. 3. And , That Ministry which is sent of God , it is to the Souls and Vnderstandings of Men and Women — That so their Souls may be turned to the Light , or measure of divine Life which hath appeared to their Souls , p. 4. As also thou sayest , That God's appearance is both to the Souls and Vnderstandings of the Sons and Daughters of Men , even whilst they are altogether Children of the Vnrighteous Nature and Spirit , for that very end , that so they may be quickned , and also raised up , and so come to be changed , they being made partakers of the Divine Nature , pag. 7.

Query : How then dost thou affirm that such Souls are Mortal ? This change in such Souls does not only bespeak their Immortality , but their being Immortally happy : Is not that Soul or Birth immortal that 's capable of partaking of the divine Nature , or that doth partake thereof ? Can that Soul dye with the Body , or end in Mortality ? No , no ; the very Souls of the Wicked , and impenitent workers of Iniquity , shall live in Torment , where the Worm dyeth not , and the Fire is never quenched ; Christ's instance of Dives and Lazarus doth really intimate the two different states hereafter ; see Luke 16.22 , 23. &c. How grosly Erronious and Contradictory art thou in this point ? and farther to thy own confutation , addest , ( viz. ) Thus the Sons and Daughters of Vnrighteousness come to be made the Children of Righteousness , they being changed , and also lifted up by the Spirit of Life from under the power of Death , into the Kingdom of God , with him to reign over the Power of Death , even as the Son of God did in the dayes of his Flesh , p. 7.

How now Jeffery ? These passages relating to the Soul's conversion , and their being made partakers of the Divine Nature , and being lifted up into the Kingdom of God , are some of thy better sort of Preaching ; but thy Doctrine of the Soul's mortality , or the Soul 's dying with the Body , doth allow the Souls of the Children of men , even of the Converted , but a very short share , and uncertain time in the Kingdom of God , if but in this Life only . O Jeffery ! give over thy troublesom , hypocritical Preaching in our Friends Meetings for shame , and never pretend such a concern for the Conversion and Salvation of Peoples Souls , whilst thou holdest this Atheistical Opinion , That they are all Mortal . Keep at home , and give over such Hypocritical Preaching , for 't is neither Conscientious nor Religious .

§ . 11. Now concerning the Scripture , thy Doctrine followeth .

J. B. ( in his Antichrist's Transformations , p. 22. ) saith , ( viz. ) For the Book of the Scriptures both was and is the Fruit which the Tree of Knowledge bears . And in his Testimony against the Quakers false Doctrine ( as he falsly calleth it ) page 19. He saith thus , viz. The Book of the Scriptures is part of the Fruit of the Tree of Knowledge — I say , that the Book of the Scriptures is the Fruit that the Tree of Knowledge bears .

Answ. This Doctrine is not only Unscriptural , but a dark , erronious Imagination and Whimsie of thy own : Thou knowest not whereof thou affirmest , and hast plainly contradicted thy self herein , by confessing not only , That the Scriptures are opened by the Spirit of Truth , but that They were given forth by the Word of Life , p. 22. and 29.

Thou farther proceedest ( like a whimsical , self-opposing and contradictory Person ) in these words , ( viz. ) Let all that read your Book , and also the Letter that was given me , which I disowned ( which Letter is printed in my first Book ) and they may easily perceive that the Line of your Testimony is in the Letter and Book of the Scriptures , and not in the Light and Law written in the Heart . Thus in thy Testimony , p. 19.

Here thou hast at one dash confuted and overthrown thy own Work , and knockt down thy own evil cause at one blow . Thou hast undertaken to detect the Quakers Errors , and many of the Doctrines of the leading Quakers , as Erronious , Antichristian , &c. And , To give a Testimony against the Quakers false Doctrine , ( as thou falsly callest it ) even in the Titles of thy Pamphlets ) but now confessest our Testimony is in the Letter and Book of the Scriptures .

Thus hast thou denyed and opposed that Testimony which is in the Book of the Scriptures , and not only So , but most erroniously opposed the Light and Law written in the Heart thereunto ; when as they do agree , and the Scripture cannot be broken . Therefore Repent of thy vain and Antichristian opposition . Another Contradiction is in thy following words ( viz. )

J. B. Your Paper to the Churches is not to be owned by the Churches , inasmuch as it was written from a sight or a sence , and not in and from the Spirit of Revelation : Now whatsoever is written , declared , or given forth in the sight or in the sence , is not to be owned . Antichrist's Transformations , p. 2.

Contradictions . And p. 25. ibid. I disown that to be any true Ministry for God , who in their Declarations do exhort both Friends and other People , to come to a sence , and to wait in a sence , and continue in a sence ; for God is not a sence , neither is his Spirit a sence .

But in plain contradiction ●ereto , p. 9. Lazarus was raised , and so must we be raised by the same Voice , Spirit and Power , must we come both to FEEL and Witness Christ the Light within , to be our Resurrection , and our Life , by FEELING and Receiving his Power revealed from Heaven , &c.

Observe ; Here thou hast confessed to the Truth of Feeling and witnessing Christ , Feeling and receiving his Power , &c. contrary to thy opposing and denying what 's written in the sense , and exhorting Friends , &c. To come to wait and continue in a sence , whereas there is a spiritual sence and feeling of divine Life ; there are spiritual Sences to be exercised by the holy Spirit , to discern between good and evil . There is a spiritual seeing , tasting and handling of the Word of Life , but thou hast lost these Senses , thou art out of they right Senses , which makes thee so Sensless and Nonsensical in thy scribling , and full of rambling confused Whimsies , Delusions and dark Imaginations , which are the effects of thy Disobedience to , and Apostacy from the Light of Christ within , which convinced thee long ago .

§ . 12. And now I would have thee observe thy manifest and practical Contradiction to a Passage in conclusion of thy Gross Errors , Postscript . The Passage is this , ( viz. )

J. B. It is an Antichristian Spirit in all which leads People ( under what Profession soever ) to think of themselves above others , or to be in a better state than others , or to separate themselves from others , although their Souls may have seen by the Light within them beyond others ; yet these ought not to separate themselves from others ; for they have been Children of Darkness as well as others ; for if they do separate themselves from others , then this holds forth a certain Testimony , that they do think of themselves above others , and also to be in a better state than others are in ; so that this is all Antichrist's work .

Answ. Why dost thou then separate thy self from others , that is , from the Church of England ? for by this Proposition thou oughtst not so to separate , nor to frequent the Quakers Meetings , nor to preach in them , whether thou thinkest thy self in a better state than those of the Church of England or not , or that thy Soul hath seen by the Light within beyond them , as doubtless thou thinkest thy self herein above them : On this Proposition of thy own thou oughtst not to separate , nor to preach in the Quakers Meetings . And if thou didst not think thy self to see with the Light within beyond them of the Church of England , there were no reason for thee then to separate from them . Behold ! thy Practical Contradiction and Ranterism , in thy Proposition or Doctrine against separating from others , on the account of seeing with the Light beyond them , which is to maintain a confused mixture and society in Worship , between those that see with the Light , and those that see not with it , between the Seeing and the Blind , the Children of the Light and the Children of Darkness ; for thy opposing a Separation from others is without distinction , and yet thou art in a Separation from others . Why separatest thou from the National Worship , and makest thy self a Preacher at the Quakers Meetings in Sudbury ? when they disown thee , thy Preaching and Corrupt , Erronious and Antiscriptural Doctrine ? As ,

Thy Denying Christ , the Son of God , to be our way to the Father .

Thy Denying Salvation or Condemnation by the same Christ that suffered .

Thy Denying the Immortality of the Soul of Christ Jesus , or of any other Souls of Mankind , and affirming , That his Soul dyed , and that he internally dyed , as to his Soul , &c.

And thy asserting , The Book of the Scriptures to be the fruit of the Tree of Knowledge .

And thy Denying the Arising of the Seed of God and Christ in man .

And thy Denying to come to a Sense , and to wait in a Sense in thy self , and opposing preaching from a sight and sence ; as in thy Antichrists Transformations , p. 2 , 25.

Thy dark and erronious Doctrine and Preaching in these things the True Christian Quakers utterly deny , with many other dark erronious Positions , Whimsies , Contradictions and blind Oppositions , Falshoods and Abuses , foolish and unlearned Questions in thy Pamphlets here omitted ; as also thy Hypocritical Preaching in pretence , For the good of Souls , For the quickning of Souls , For the raising up of Souls , For the converting of Souls , That Peoples Souls may partake of the divine Nature , and be lifted up into the Kingdom of God , &c. Which though this be the best sort of thy Preaching , and in the best words thou hast , yet while thou denyest the Immortality of the Soul , and concludest , They all dye with the earthly Tabernacles , and so a total end of all : This thy gross and Atheistical Error is enough to evince thy abominable Hypocrisie and Irreligiousness in the best sort of thy Preaching . And therefore give over thy preaching in our Friends Meetings , hold thy Tongue , lay thy hand upon thy Mouth , keep at home , and seriously bethink thy self , and remember from whence thou art fallen , and then condemn , retract and call in thy Erroneous and Antichristian Pamphlets . Remember I have herein given thee the safest Counsel , in Love and Friendship to thee , and to thy Immortal Soul , which shall remember me when thou art awakened under the hand of thy Righteous Judge , who is the Judge of all , to whom I can sincerely appeal , and commit my Christian and faithful Endeavours concerning these Controversies and Differences with thee and the rest concerned in this Treatise , you being all concerned in one Spirit of Opposition , Prejudice , Strife and Enmity , though thou hast exceeded the rest in thy Doctrinal part , in presumptuously attempting such an Antichristian Confutation of the Quakers Doctrines . And with my solemn Appeal and Supplication I do Conclude .

OH ! Thou Heart-searching God and righteous Iudge of all , unto thee I make my Appeal and Supplication , against this Jealous , Dividing , Rending Spirit that hath appeared in Strife and open Contention against thy Servants and faithful Witnesses , and against that good order and society that thou hast been pleased to gatber us into . Thou knowest the integrity of my soul before thee , and that I have waited for thy Counsel how to act and behave my self in these matters , and that I have not sought to exalt my self , nor any Popularity , Party or Interest to my self , but only thy Glory and the good of Souls . Thou knowest , that in the first place my soul hath sought for Peace in the way of Peace , and for a quiet Composure of Differences , occasioned by some Self-willed and Luke-warm Professors of thy Truth , whilst there was any hope or probability thereof , before the opposite Party became open Adversaries . And O Lord thou knowest I am not alone in this concern , many others of thy faithful servants have traveled in the same Christian Spirit with me , for peace and quietness , and for a quiet end of Differences in Truth and Righteousness : But thine and our Adversaries have rewarded us evil for good , and to me hatred for my love .

And now ▪ O Lord , behold how true love and tenderness is rejected by thy Adversaries , and how thy holy spirit is offended ! Behold and judge the bitterness of their spirits ; Their Rancor and Fury , their Words of Hatred , Reviling and Slander against thy faithful Servants and Witnesses ; Their Disregard to the Honour and Reputation of thy Truth , thy Name and People ; Their working against the Glory and Honour of thy excellent Name among us ; Their crucifying thy Son afresh to themselves , and putting him to open shame and reproach in the Eyes of thy open Enemies and Persecutors of thy People .

Oh! Lord , Lord , look down , behold and judge for these things , show thy Power in putting an end as openly to these Controversies , as they are openly forced out into the World by Apostates and Adversaries of thy Truth and People .

Thou knowest , O Lord , that though thou hast endued me with a Christian Spirit , and with Faith , Patience and Rejoycing under all my Sufferings and Tribulations for thy Name sake , and enabled me patiently to undergo the open Revilings and Infamies cast upon me , both by open , profest ( and secret ) Enemies ; in all which I daily praise thy Name for thy Goodness . Yet thou hast also endued me with the Spirit of Righteous Judgment , Understanding and Zeal for the Glory of thy holy Name and Truth , and hast raised me up in defence of thy Gospel , to vindicate thy Truth and innocent People , who are Lovers of Peace and Union in thy Son Christ Iesus .

And now , O Lord , I humbly pray thee , preserve thy Lambs and tender Babes , and open the Eyes and unvail the Understandings of all whom the Enemy has deceived and prejudiced , who are mistaken in their Iudgments , and not guilty of willful Opposition and Hatred ; That they that have not sinned out their day nor become judicially hardened , may yet find a place of Repentance and Mercy , in returning to thee with Humility , true Contrition and Brokenness of Heart , that thou maiest heal their Backslidings , and love them freely .

O my God! in these my Labours and Endeavours , as I have eyed thee and thy Counsel , and thou hast been with me , for which I praise thy Name . So I recommend all to thee , to manifest the real intent and end of all , and to plead and justifie my Cause , it being thy own Cause , and the Cause of thy whole Heritage : Amen , Amen , saith my Soul .

ADVERTISEMENT .

FIrst , Note , That where in pag. 158. of this Treatise , mention is made That G. F 's intention and sence is by another hand spoken to . That and much more is yet reserved in Manuscript against W. R's abusive Books .

Secondly , That whereas in pag. 205. it is said , It being now above six Weeks since the Letter was left at Ely , &c. and yet no Answer . — It is now above three Moneths since , and yet no Answer received from F. B. being now ( at the Printing hereof ) towards the latter end of the 11th Moneth , 1682.

Thirdly , That this Treatise has been long in the Printer's hands , and not hastened in the Press , because of these Additions in the three last Chapters , to Francis Bugg , Thomas Crisp , John Pennyman and Jeffery Bullock ; for the Answer to William Rogers's 7 th part of his Christian-Quaker , was writ in a short time after it was out .

Fourthly , It is some question whether two or three of the Names in pag. 250. be right , i. e. Averset , Snazdale and Tysoeth , by reason of their Names being badly writ in the Certificate sent up .

Fifthly , Note , That where in the Postscript , after the Letter to Francis Bugg , pag. 253 , 4. and in his Book also , p. 52. he gives account of a Minister thus , viz. That in the Quarterly-Meeting Book at Hadenham , they shall find a Record , wherein he is recorded out of the Vnity , for not taking his Wife according to the Order of Friends , i. e. not publishing his Intention before the Womens Meetings . Which Account is excepted against upon Friends positively giving a contrary one to me .

Let it be farther remarked , that Francis Bugg's pretended Proof appears not from Evidence of the Fact , but is his consequence drawn from the Records . But first , his Consequence appears not only fallacious , but false in Fact , in his restraining the Order of Friends only to the Womens Meetings , which is not consequent to the Record of the Quarterly Meeting , dated , the first of the 10th Moneth , 1675. and cited by F. B. ( p. 61. ) for Proof ; for the extent of that Record is , For the consent of Friends at two Mens Meetings and two Womens Meetings , &c.

2dly , Neither can his Account be true , if there was not then a Womans Meeting established in that part of the County , but that the complaint of the Monethly Meeting was , That the Person concerned did not publish his Intention above once to the Mens Meeting , and refused to bring the Woman to any Meeting at all , before the time of their Marriage .

3dly , Since the said Exception was writ , I have met with a Certificate under the Hands of several Persons of Credit , i. e. Phillip Taylor , William Brasier , John Prime , and Jacob Baker , who do confirm the matter excepted against Francis Fugg's said Account ; whereby they declare it to be his false Insinuation , and a manifest misrepresenting of Friends in those parts , and a malicious Falshood . For they affirm , That there was no Womens Meetings established in that part of the County where it fell in course for the said Person to publish his Intention of Marriage ; and that because he refused to bring the Woman to any Meeting at all ( to manifest her consent and intention of Marriage with him ) And his proposing it but once to the Mens Meeting , and that in her absence , before he took her to Wife . This they looked on as an irregular Proceedure and Innovation , and no safe President or Example . For which cause , together with his refusal to give the Monethly Meeting satisfaction for the Irregularity ( as desired ) on complaint thereof to the Quarterly Meeting , a Record was made , according to their Consciences and Care , That they had not Vnity with him in this his SO doing ( as 't is cited by Fr. Bugg himself .

Sixthly , Let it be noted , That Francis Bugg is guilty of notorious Falshood and malicious Slander , where he pretends to discover That hypocritical and two-faced Practice of pleading to the Magistrates for Liberty of Conscience , and at the same time using and exercising all Force , Rule and Dominion they are capable to inflict upon their dissenting Brethren , who cannot fall down and cry Hosanna to every Likeness , &c. And the Reason he suggests is , Lest the Ruling Party should be encouraged to introduce a numberless Number of needless Ceremonies , till at length Rome may , if possible , be outdone , pag. 115 , 116. 2d part . Thus like a false informing Judas he has belched out his Lying Insinuations , tending to incense the Magistrate against us . For ,

1st , In the first part I take his Charge [ Hypocritical ] to intend our Applications to the Magistrates for Liberty from Persecution : and then 't is malicious , false and scandalous , and therein he has acted the part of a base Informer against us , for which God ( who knows our sincerity and consistency in our pleading to the Magistrate on this account ) will certainly rebuke his lying malicious Spirit .

In the second part , I take his Charge [ Of using all Force , Rule and Dominion , &c. upon dissenting Brethren for not falling down to every Likeness ] to intend that Church-Government , Discipline and Order , and those Ministers concerned therein which he opposeth among the People called Quakers : And then he hath herein most wickedly and falsly informed the Magistrates , 1st , To render our Applications for Liberty of Conscience of no credit with them , but Hypocritical : 2dly , To render us guilty of that which we are pleading against , i. e. Exercising Force upon our Brethrens Consciences , and that for not falling down to every Likeness . Oh , horrid Abuse and Slander ! And what lamentable Blindness and gross Absurdity is this Adversary fallen into ! like as if he should thus argue , viz. You plead to the Magistrate for Liberty of Conscience in the free exercise of Religion , from Persecution , Corporal and Pecuniary Punishments on that score . Therefore you are Hypocritical , Two-faced and Inconsistent in your Practice , whilst you exercise a Church Authority , by giving true Spiritual Judgment , Admonition or Censures upon any that dissent or divide from you , or cause Divisions or Offences : Such are the Consequences of his before-cited Charge , considering that he has not proved our Judgment VNJVST , or Advice and Admonition ERRONEOVS or VNCHRISTIAN in any of those things opposed by him ; or our Paper , which he makes his great Proof against us , and Scornfully calls , A Grant and Confirmation by a general Council held at London , Anno 1675. pag. 41. For which he falsly accuseth us of INNOVATIONS , IMPOSITIONS , APOSTACIES , NEW-STAMPED GOVERNMENT , ARBITRARY RVLE , &c. comparing us to the POPES COVNCIL . ( pag. 42 , 46 , &c. ) And then he might as well say , 'T is a great infringement of Liberty of Conscience for a Christian Society to Reprove , Judge or Censure disorderly Walkers under the same Profession . And by the same absurd way of Arguing and shallow Opposition he may as well assume a Power to stop the Mouthes of all Gospel Ministers for exercising their Consciences in that divine Authority that Christ hath given them , To renounce the hidden things of Dishonesty , and to Exhort , Rebuke , Reprove , Admonish , Command , &c. according to their Commission , both in the primitive Times and our Day .

Thus we may justly conclude , that a corrupt , defiled , immoral Conscience would have its unchristian Liberty .

Seventhly , Some Errors have escaped the Press , in this Treatise , both in Points , Letters and Words , the most material whereof are here noted , which I desire the ingenuous Reader accordingly to Correct ; ( the sense will shew the rest ) wherein I do as I would be done to ; for I examine the Errata's , even of my Adversaries Books , as they are noted , before I answer the Matter .

ERRATA .

PAge 19. Line 4 , 6. for bear read bare . p 26 l 10 r questioned . p 33 l 24 f mian r main . p 34 l 17 f twining r turning . p 43 l 13 dele there . p 47 l 1 f the r thy p 59 read by laws made in the reign of . p 62 l 3 f tives r tive . p 84 l 20 f bear r bare . p 88 l 16 f justifying r insisting p 144 l 10 r blind zealot is . p 158 l 1 r in the case . p 167 l 9 f it r in . p 209 l 2 f Statutis r Statuti . p 210 l 14 r their names . p 228 l 21 r upon W P's p 233 l 20 , 21 r abusest , scandalizest . p 237 l 3 r the matter . p 252 l 16 f disingenious r disingenuous . p 254 l 10 r horribly . p 262 l 1 r Apostates . p 272 l 14 r rights . p 279 Margent r Like the Postscript of N. C 's Epistle . p 284 l 3 r are under . p 295 l 16 r their Conscientiousness . p 300 l 7 f by r thy . p 310 l 16 r because thereof p 311 l 12 r and of p 315 l 14 r his pretence being , because . p 326 l 17 f herein r therein . The sense will evince the rest of literal fauls , less material .

THE END .

BOOKS Printed and Sold by A. Sowle at the Crooked-Billet in Holloway-Lane in Shoreditch , 1682. DVe Order of Law and Justice pleaded , against Irregular and Arbitrary Proceedings . By George Whitehead . The Real Quaker a Real Protestant . By G.W. A legal Examination of Abuses of Law . The Religious Assemblies of the People called Quakers vindicated . The Christian-Quaker and his divine Testimony vindicated ; in two parts . By W. Penn and G. Whitehead . An Answer to a foolish Libel , called , The Quakers Opinions . By William Penn. England's present Interest discovered , with honour to the Prince and safety to the People . By W. P. An Epistle to the Churches of Jesus throughout the whole World . By W. P. An Epistle to the Children of Light . W. P. An Address to Protestants ; in two Parts . By W. P. A brief state and examination of Liberty Spiritual . By W. P. An Epistle , containing a solemn Farewell , &c. By W. P. A Mite into the Treasury : or , A Treatise concerning the seven Liberal Arts. By Thomas Lawson . A Testimony against Tything among Christians . By R. Richardson . The Foundation of Tythes shaken . By Thomas Elwood . Tythes ended by Christ . By W. Gibson . The great Case of Tythes once more revived . By Francis Howgill . A Treatise of Oaths , &c. Universal Love . By W. Smith . The Principles of Truth , or a declaration of our Faith , who are called Quakers . An Epistle of Love and good Will to the called and choson of God . By J. Songhurst . An Invitation of Love to all that hunger and thirst after Righteousness . By Isabel Yeomans . A Warning to London in particular . By James Parks . A Warning to England in general . By J. P. A Testimony to the Lords Power and blessed appearance in and amongst Children . A plain Path-way opened to the simple hearted , for the answering all Doubts and Objections , &c. By S. Crisp. A Blast blown out of the North , ecchoing up towards the South , to meet the Cry of their oppressed Brethren . The Lamentable Cry of the Oppressed . H. Smith's Books collected into one Volumn . The Spirit of the Martyrs revived . ☞ A faithful Warning , and Lamentation over England . By William Bingley .

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