A replie to a relation, of the conference between William Laude and Mr. Fisher the Jesuite. By a witnesse of Jesus Christ

THE REPLIE TO THE RELATORS EPISTLE DEDICATORY TO THE KING .

L. p. 1. THIS Tract will need Patronage , as Great as may be had : and that 's yours .

P. Thus you begin your Epistle . But you might have added , on Earth . On Earth , no doubt , the greatest Patronage you can have , is the Kings But haply you neither thought , nor hoped of any higher Patron of this Tract , then on Earth . And therefore it will so much the more need some humane Patronage , and that as Great , as may be had ; and all little enough , you will find in the end . But I hope , when once your Tract shal be well troden out and beaten , that you will find but few that will travell your way , or follow such a Leader , and much lesse hazzard their own both honour and safety , by Patronizing such a perillous Tract , as this will appeare to be . And though you should find some to protect you from the Courts of Civill Iustice , yet never from Christs dreadfull Throne , where you shall certainly be judged , * * Rom. 2.6 . according to your worke . And let me tell you , in putting forth this your Book under the Kings Patronage , you lay a greater burthen upon his shoulders , then he is able to beare ; and should he undertake it , it would break his back . For then he must Patronize all your blasphemous lyes against GOD and his Word , and against all Truth ; which when he comes once to know , instead of Patronizing , hee will Anathematize both you and your Book .

L. p. 2. He that seeks it ( Court Truth ) with a Roman Bias , or any other , then for it selfe , will run counter , when he comes neere it , and not find it , though he come within the Kenning of it .

P. Sir you say true . And for proofe hereof , it will appeare , and that too palpably , that this Roman Bias hath too much wheeled you about from the Truth , which you pretend to seek , but neither come neere it , nor within the Kenning of it . Or if within Kenning , so as you have been at any time by its cleare light convinced of it , the greater is your sin , and the more desperate your case , not to confesse it , but how much more to fight against it ? And think not my L. that your plausible naming of Truth here , will so blind mens eyes , as to beleeve all is truth , that you have written in your Book . If you seek Truth , 't is but as those * * Gen. 19.11 . Sodomites sought for Lots doore , to violate his Angel-guests . For where you find the Truth sincerely preached and professed , doe you not lay violent hands upon Gods Angels , the Messengers of his Truth , and break into the houses of those righteous Lots , those Preachers of Righteousnesse , to cast them out ? And then mervaile not , if GOD smite you with blindnesse , that you shall never find the Truth , for the end you seek it , namely to destroy it .

L. p. 6. He did but skip up and down , and labour to pick a hole here and there , where he thought he might fasten ; and where it was too hard for him , let it alone .

P. What the Jesuite did , let him answere for himselfe . But perhaps , you will say the like of me here . For I touch not every particular passage , as where for your reputation sake you speake some truth , thereby to gaine credit to what is contrary , as you know * * Math. 4. who useth to doe ▪ and therfore ‡ ‡ Mark 1.34 . Christ would not suffer the Devils to confesse him at all : nor need I labour to pick holes here and there , when every where I find such wide gappes , wherein you lye so open , that you give me advantage to fasten at pleasure . And I have unmasked such dark holes , as your selfe have made with such artifice , as through which men may easily passe thick and three-fold to Rome . So as I feare you will rather complain of me , as for being too busie in reading some of your dark and mysticall Riddles , which perhaps you would not have had all men to have known .

L. p. 7. I fell into a most dangerous Fever , but it pleased GOD , beyond all hope , to restore me to health .

P. This was ( as you there tell us ) upon your thoughts of giving A. C. an Answer . But how ever , surely your Fever was as well sent of GOD to admonish you to desist from such an Enterprise , as you had then in hand , which was , under pretence to Answer a Jesuite , to overthrow the truth , and to reconcile the Church of England with that of Rome : as your restoreing was , to oblige you to walke more worthy of that mercy for the future , and not to renue and prosecute this your Designe . Or else it pleased GOD so to restore , and reserve you , to be not onely a scourge to his People for their further tryall and humiliation , for a time , untill he had ( as now he is in hand ) * * Isa. 10.12 . performed his whole worke upon his Sion : but also to be a plague to that sinfull Land , upon which , since that your restoring , you have been an Instrument to bring so many and grievous sins , as open profanation of the Sabbath , Altars , sheding of much innocent blood both of soules and bodies , and of terrible discontents , and divisions in the State , and the like : and so at length , that he might call you ‡ ‡ Ier. 20.3 . Magor Missabib , Feare - round-about , making you a terrour to your selfe , when you shall come to feele the fire of his fiery indignation to kindle upon you .

L. ibid. How of late I have been used by the Scandalous and Scurrilous Pennes of some bitter men ( Notable Hypocrisie . whom I heartily beseech God to forgive ) the world knoweth ; little leasure , and lesse incouragement given me , to Answer a Iesuite , or set upon other Services , while I am under the Prophets affliction , Psal. 50.19 , 20.

P. And what those Scandalous , and Scurrilous pennes are , and who those some bitter men , the marks you have set upon them are sufficient to shew , the Scarres whereof they will carry to their graves , to be a witnesse against you in the great day of doom . And bitter men you may well call them , as whose lives you have filled with all manner of bitternesse , and that in a high degree , as hell could invent . Of these THREE Remarkable bitter men , one was a Minister , of your own Coat , saving that his was not of the * * Rev. 17.3 . Scarlet couloured-Dye . He preached against the Scarlet-sins of the Land , especially in the Church , which touched your Lordship not a little , and therefore Bitter . For this , he was extraordinarily summoned to the Court of High-Commission ; from whence appealing to his Majesty he was notwithstanding proceeded against by suspension in the same Court : his house violently broken open , and searched , his person neither flying nor resisting ) seased on , and carryed away late in the night to prison , and made a closse prisoner ; his very Wife debarred from him : brought into the Starre-Chamber , and there Censured to be degraded , deprived of his living , of his Liberty , of his Eares on the Pillory , fined in five thousand Pounds to the King , and to indure perpetuall Closse imprisonment , in Lancaster-Castle , whence he was after 12. weeks imprisonment there , in the base Common Goale , where his Wife might not come to him , nor any Physitian in his necessity ; closely conveyed to the Sea side , and thence by a Sea-voyage of sixe weeks space in a stormy winter , and dangerous Seas , to be carryed to Guersosey Castle , where ever since he hath indured Banishment in Closse prison ; where nor wife , nor children , nor any friend , nor acquaintance , are permitted to visit him ; and where he is not allowed the use of pen , and inke , and paper , a little to deceive time withall in his solitary muse , the solace of a Scholars life . And what was the Cause of all this sharp and teerrible Censure ? In summe this : He had put in his Answer to the Bill into Court , and that by speciall Order of the Court , where it was , upon his Oath to be a true Answer , admitted . But about a week after , the main body of his Answer , which contained his defence of what he had confessed upon Oath to be his ( which was one onely Book , intituled , For GOD and the King , containing the effect of his two Sermons , preached in his own Church , on November 5 th . 1636. for which , he was first questioned by the High Commission ; together with an Apology of an Appeale , all in one Book ) which was by the two Lords Chiefe Iustices wholly expunged ( containing about foure-score sheets of paper ) as Impertinent and Scandalous , and all this , before the Interrogatories were brought to him in his Closse Prison , to Answer ▪ the Answer whereunto was to be reckoned as a part of his Answer in Court , such as now it was left . So as the Interrogatories coming at length to be tendred to him ( for I have all circumstances by credible intelligence ) hee refused to make Answer to them , alledging , that his Answer , which he had put into the Court , being expunged as Impertinent and Scandalous , he saw not himselfe any further bound to Answer Interrogatories ; for so doing , he should assent to the condemning of his Cause before the heareing , by assenting to the expunging of his true Answer , as Impertinent and Scandalous . Hereupon his Censure was drown up in black and white , and concluded on , before the Day of hearing came , in which he tendred to the Court a Copy of his Intire Answer , as it was f●rst put into the Court , desiring the Court it might be there publickly read , but it was refused ; then he tendred a Copy of his Reasons ( seaven in number ) of not Answering the Interrogatories , desiring they might publickly be read in Court ; but that was also refused . And in all the Kings Attourneys Pleading ( which was his Speciall Taske against BURTON ) hee could alledge or object nothing at all , in his Book confessed , against him , but some Few Passages , wherein they said hee was too bitter . To which he Answered , there was Cause for it ; and that he had not exceeded the Latitude or Liberty of a Minister in reprooving of Sinne : and for any thing in his Book , hee was there ready ( as he told the Court ) to make it good , if hee might be heard . But his Doom was already set downe in the blacke Booke , before the Censure came , which ( for all hee could say ) must not be reversed : So he was Censured ( as before ) as one holding Seditious and Schismaticall opinions , though none was or could be proved against him . And the like censure had the other two with him , the one a Physitian , the other a Lawyer . Now my Lord , do not you well enough know all this to be true , and better then I can tell you ? I know you do : but I tell you , to rub over your memory , and awaken your sleepy Conscience , who were the main moving cause of all this , as All the world knows . And how farre you we●e an Instigator of the Court , so to censure , and of the King to inflict ; you very well know . Who ? Your Lordship ? Farre be it . For your Piety doth heartily beseech GOD to forgive them . Indeed in the conclusion of that your Pamphlet which you read then in the Court after the Censure was past , Notorious Hypocrisie of the Prelate . you had these words , or the like , whom I leave to the Mercy of GOD , and the Iustice of the King . But if indeed you doe heartily and unfainedly beseech GOD to forgive them : why doe you not ( if indeed they have justly offended GOD , and the King , in transgressing any Law , divine or humane ) both your selfe from your heart forgive them , if they have done you any wrong , and testifie it by a serious soliciting of the King , and that now after two whole yeares , and more Imprisonment , and Banishment , yea and Divorcement from their Wives , to release and acquit them ? Or why do you not ( if you be as you pretend , one of Christs Ministers ) at least inform the King , how contrary it is both to Gods Law , and Mans Law , and the Law of Nature , to separate Man and Wife in this sort , without any just cause given on either part ? But the King , in his Clemencie had granted to their Wives liberty and leave to goe to their Husbands : And do not you know , my Lord , whose piety and charity , and equity , and policie it was to reverse and hinder it ? Well my Lord , let me deale freely with you , and that from the mouth of the Great Iudge , * * Iam. 2.13 . There shall be Iudgement without Mercy , to him that sheweth no Mercy . Yea , Suppose the Cause of that most terrible Censure had been just : yet should there be no place for Mercy , and that now after so long a time , and so sharp a Tryall ? What ? Not one drop , nor crumb of Mercy ? That 's enough for hell . But you will say ( as you have done ) Mercy was shewed in sparing their lives . How I pray you ? They were never questioned for their lives , much lesse was any Sentence of death passed upon them ; nor was there any Cause found , although perhaps narrowly searched for , but no preced●nt was found . Againe , Suppose they had been in a legall way , and justly sentenced to dye : yet so to spare life , as to make and leave it worse then any death can be , as being a continuall and languishing death : Call you this a mercy ? Take heed , least herein that be verefied of you , which the wise-man saith , * * Pro. 12.10 . The tender mercies of the wicked are cruell . Or shall the examples of Heathen cruelty be justified by theirs , who professe to be Christians ? Prelates Mercies exceed all Heathen Cruelty . But what Heathen example can you parallell to this ? Indeed I remember one , and but one , that comes somwhat neere it . The Roman Verres , Praetor in Cicily , closse imprisoned one Apollonius a rich Citizen there , so as neither his old Father , nor young Son might , for the space of one whole yeare and a halfe , come to see him ; and this for no other cause , but that he was rich ; a punishment ( saith the Orator ) to be redeemed with a mans very life ; when life hath nothing left Praeter Calamitatem , but meere Calamity . Whereupon the Author saith ( who was himselfe no meane Statesman ) Haec cum accidunt , nemo est , quin intellegat ruere illam Rempub. Haec ubi veniunt , nemo est , qui ullam spem salutis reliquam esse arbitretur . I need not English it to your Lordship , Yet I will : When such things happen , there is none but understands that Common-wealth to be falling : when these things come to passe , there is none , that can imagine any hope of safety to be left . And what have you left to those THREE remarkable Men , Praeter Calamitatem ? What , but a miserable life ? As the Prophet saith of Ierusalem's Captivity in Babylon : * * Lam. 4.6 . The punishment of the daughter of my people , is greater then the punishment of the Sin of Sodome , that was overthrowne as in a moment , and no hand Stayd on her . And ‡ ‡ vers. 7. They that be slain , with the sword , are better then they , that be slain with hunger : for these pine away , stricken through for want of the fruits of the Field . So as a life , stript of all the outward comforts of the world , yea and of the meanes of spirituall comfort , which one Friend should minister unto another , haveing nothing left Praeter Calamitatem , but Calamity , is it not a greater punishment , then death it selfe ? How is it then a mercy , instead of death undeserved , to grant such a life . But you say , 't is just . For they were Censured pro Confesso . Pro Confesso ? Of what ? Of all charged in the Bill . Why , they did Answer , and it was condemned before hearing . And , Si sat est accusasse , quis innocens erit ? If it be enough to have accused , who shal be innocent ? And againe , let the Court-Records be searched , if there be ever such a Precedent , that a man should be so censured , for not assenting to the condemnation of his Cause , before the hearing ? Or that ever any Defendants whole and intire body of his Answer , containing his just Defence , yea and when he could not expect any Counsell to plead for him , that either would , or durst : should unaliturâ , at one dash be expunged , as Impertinent and Scandalous , and that after it was orderly admitted upon Oath into the Court ? Or if this be found to be the Custome of such Courts , may not a man here apply the foresaid Speech of that Roman Orator : When such things happen , there is none , but understands that Common-wealth to bee falling : when these things come to passe , there is none that can imagine any hope of Safety to be left ? Were not these things Prognostications and Presages , if not rather immediate fore-runners , and causes of some terribl● imminent and impendent Stormes , that should shortly after fall upon the Land ? * * Is● . 26.11 . But , O Lord , when thy hand is lifted up , they will not see . But they shall see , and be ashamed , &c. But how ever you are so charitable , Prelates notable Hypocisie . as heartily to beseech GOD to forgive them . Now , suppose you did this from your heart , as some naturall man may do : doe you think it a sufficient discharge to your Conscience , or holy water enough to wash you cleane from the guilt of the blood of these men , which you have so shed ? Is not this a meere mocking of GOD and Men , to pretend piety in praying for those , whom you still most cruelly persecute with all the damnable malice and hatred which you could learne of none , but of the Schoole-master of Hell ? And doth not your notorious hypocrisie appeare in this , that you still pretend piety in praying GOD , and that heartily , to forgive those , as Malefactors and Offendors , whom your own Conscience knows to be innocent , and of whose punishments ( at least some of them ) you cannot give so much as the least colour of reason , or just cause , other then such , as the very Heathen do hisse out of all Courts of justice , as the bane and ruine of Common-weales ? So as while you heartily beseech GOD to forgive those that be innocent persons , you forget once to pray to GOD to forgive your selfe , who have been the main Instrument of committing such an example of Diabolicall cruelty and iniquity , as is without all example either in the Christian or Heathen world .

And yet running on furiously in this desperate course , you say † † Pag. 388. after in the very Conclusion of your Book , that you are now 65. yeares of age : and yet you tremble not to think it cannot be long , before you must appeare before that strict Judge , from whose Tribunall and Sentence not your Greatest Patron in the world can rescue you . And if this be all your Charity , thus to pray for these men , whom you desist not to plague , they may say to you , as Christ did to those women , that * * Luk. 23.28 . wept for him , Pray not for us , but pray for your selfe , that GOD would pardon your sin , in not taking vengeance on you for the blood of his Servants , which you have shed . And consider how you have used Christs Minister , with what horrible and detestable cruelty , and all for the faithfull discharge of his duty , in reprooving such enormities , and impieties , as your selfe cannot be but guilty of ; the very remembrance whereof were enough to shake all the veines of your heart , and to cause your Conscience to quake and tremble , had you but the least sparke of common grace in you . Oh , the bloud and members of a Mans body are precious : and do you think they were made , and Redeemed with such a price , as Christs own bloud , for any Man to satisfie the lust of his Diabolicall and damnable malice upon , in taking them away gratis , and so easily ? And especially the bloud of Christs Servant ( which you have shed for no other cause , but for bearing witnesse unto the Truth ) is it not * * Psal. 72.14 . precious in Gods sight ? And When he ‡ ‡ Psal. 9.12 . maketh inquisition for blood , will he not remember , and not forget the complaint of the poore ? Without doubt my Lord , his Great King and Master will utterly shame and confound you for ever , unmasking all your hypocrisie , and leaving you naked before all the world , if you still desperately goe on in this course . Nor is it your Fine-spun-cob-web-Lawne-veile , that can hide the grossenesse and foulenesse of your actions from the worlds eyes . And though you could mock men , yet God you cannot ; † † Gal. 6.7 . but , Whatsoever ye sow , ye shall reape . Doe you beleeve the Scripture ? What saith it ? A man that doth violence to the blood of any Person , shall flee to the pit , Let no man stay him . But I leave you to GOD , whom ‡ ‡ Pro. 28.17 . because you have no changes , you doe not feare : yet one day shall you feele .

But you tell us , that you have little leasure , and lesse incouragement thereby , to answer a Iesuite , or to set upon other Services . To answer a Iesuite . Oh glorious word ! A Sound Protestant sure , that Answers a Iesuite· What may we not expect ? This one word were enough to vindicate that reputation of yours , which you tell us anon of . But the mischief is , I have observed a § § A New found Art . New-found-Art of Late-dayes , that which our Protestant Doctors of the Now Church of England , have practised , and grown great Proficients in : namely , under the name and colour of Answering a Iesuite , or so to meet him at least the halfe-way between England and Rome , if he goe not further . So did your Brother of Chichester in his Appeale to Caesar , his Answer to the Popish Gagger . How finely jumpes he with the Jesuite , and comes closse to his doores ? A pretty veile , to bring that old Hagge into request againe , and to set up her Throne in the Church of England . And whether your Lordship do thus or no , in this your glorious Answer to the Iesuite , we shall see at after . But why you should complain of little leasure , when you have so many Chapleins and Doctors at hand , and command , to set a worke : and , of lesse incouragement , when for such services , you have gotten the Metropolitanship of all England : I cannot see .

But before I passe further , I may not balke the close of your words , complaining , You are under the Prophets affliction : Psal. 50.19 , 20. And what is that ? Between the mouth that speaks wickednesse , and the tongue that sets forth Deceit . And whose affliction was this ? The Prophets you say . What Davids ? Yes . How prove you that out of that Psalme ? 'T is true , David had many afflictions in this kind ; which hee in other Psalmes much complaines of : but he speakes not a word of his owne proper afflictions in this kind in that Psalme , which you quote . Therefore to passe by both your forced expression of the words , and false application of the sense : Let us take the Prophets own word : But unto the wicked , GOD saith what hast thou to doe to declare my Statutes , or that thou shouldest take my Covenant in thy mouth ? Seeing thou hatest instruction , and castest my words behind thee ? When thou sawest a thiefe , thou consentedst with him , and hast been partaker with Adulterers . Thou gavest thy mouth to evill , and thy tongue frameth deceit . Thou sittest , and speakest against thy Brother , and thou slanderest thine own Mothers Son . These things hast thou done , and I kept silence , and thou thoughtest , that I was altogether such a one as thy selfe : but I will reproove thee , and see them in order before thee . Now consider this , ye that forget GOD , least I teare you in pieces , and there be none to deliver . Thus farre GOD speaketh in that Psalme . In all which you see plainly , that the Prophet complains not of his owne suffering such things of wicked tongues . It is GOD that speaks here to wicked men . And if you had well and wisely looked ●our face in that Glasse , you might farre sooner have discerned your selfe to be one of those to whom GOD speaketh , then to be as the Prophet so afflicted by them . And because you are so briefe in perverting the Scriptures , to make them a veile for your iniquity , and a Vergula Censoria to argue and accuse Gods own innocent Servants , as if their mouth spake wickednesse , and their tongues set forth deceit : lend your patience a little , while we doe truly interpret , and impartially appy the forecited words of this Psalme . Here GOD speakes to the wicked , and sets him forth by sundry markes and properties : as First , his notorious and audacious , shamelesse hypocrisie , in pretending to be for GOD , and for his true Religion : For he taketh upon him to declare Gods Statutes , and takes his Covenant in his mouth , but for all this , he hateth instruction , and casteth Gods word behind him . Secondly , his taking part with Theeves and Adulterers . Thirdly , his giving his mouth to evill , and framing his tongue to deceit . Fourthly , his sitting and speaking against his Brother , and slandering his owne Mothers Sonne . Fifthly , his carnall security , and vaine and wicked thought concerning GOD , as if he favoured him , and his wicked practises , and all because GOD was silent and patient , in forbe●reing to reprove and punish him . Now to apply this . If you can find any , to whom these things may more fitly and truely be applyed then your selfe , doe you apply them home unto them . But till you doe , give us leave to apply them so farre to your Lordship as we have sufficient warrant , and good evidence for . First , do not you in this your Booke in particular pretend at least to declare Gods word , and speak of his Covenant , as if you would become a Champion to maintain the holy Scripture , against the Roman Adversaries thereof ? This you professe , and willingly grant . But in the proofe hereof , you set us up Mans Authority above the Scripture , as we shall see in the due place . And doe you not withall hate instruction , and cast Gods word behind you , when being by Gods Minister ( as of late ) reprooved and convinced of such things , as you neither could , nor can deny to be true , as being written in Capitall Letters in your forehead , and on the palmes of your hands : yet you not onely hated and despised the reproofe , and instruction , which was according to Gods word , and the duty of a Minister , whose strict charge is among other things , to * * Tit. 2.15 . reproove with all authority : but also have manifested this your hatred and contempt , in persecuting this poore Minister beyond all measure and example , yea and still continue persecuting him to this day , and that most Antichristianly ; and not onely him , but his Wife and Children , who have done you no offence at all , not suffering the one to goe see her Husband , nor the other their Father . O my Lord , heaven rings of this your fury , and the earth groaneth under such more then Heathenish inhumanity , not sorting with the Law of common humane nature . O * * Math. 23.38 How shall you escape the damnation of hell ? And what plagues may not the Land expect , for being guilty of such innocent blood , and of such unheard of Barbarisme , and that also maintained and continued in cold blood ? Yea and doth not the spirit of the Beast in you breath out persecution , and blast many other of Gods faithfull Ministers , never leaving them , till you have rooted them out ? And this you neither feare to practise , nor shame to professe . And then againe , vers. 19. Doe you not give your mouth to Evill , and frame your tongue to Deceit ? You frame it as having a special art and * * Ephes 4.14 . Kubeia , Ka●ournia , methoda . Method in it , as the Apostle spekas : which you expresse in the fourth mark especially . Sitting and speaking against your brother , and slandering your own Mothers Son ; as will further yet appeare , and doth by your continuall and dayly practises , and specially in or at your High Commission chaire or Boord , where ( as else where ) you have a power to doe what you list without controule or contradiction . And for carnall security , in an impious and Atheisticall conceit of GOD , as if a favourer of wicked practises , because a patient forbearer to punish them presently : examine your own heart ; nay may we not both read it in your courses , and understand it by your speeches , in sundry places of your Booke , where you would seem to have a speciall interest in Gods favour ; as in his admirable restoring you ( as you say ) from your dangerous Fever , though you there forgot ( as those nine Lepers that Christ clensed ) to return him thanks , so much as verball . And for the further and fuller clearing of the verefying of all this in your selfe , I shall call your Book to witnesse . In the meane time here , Heare Gods doom against this wicked Man : But I will reprove thee , and set them in order before thee . * * Eccles. 12. He will bring every worke to judgement , with every secret thing , whether good or evill . And as David elswhere saith , § § Psal. 10.13.14 , 15. Wherefore doth the wicked contemn GOD ? He hath said in his heart , Thou wilt not require it . Thou hast seen it O GOD , for thou beholdest mischiefe and spight to require it with thy hand : the poore committeth himselfe unto thee , Thou art the helper of the Fatherlesse . Breake thou the arme of the wicked , and the evill man : Seeke out his wickednesse , till thou find none . But , ‡ ‡ Rom. 6.10 . How long , Lord , Holy , and True ? Surely , when he maketh inquisition for blood , he remembreth them : he forgetteth not the cry of the Humble . There is a day of Gods visitation a comming , and it hasteneth , yea we may see it even at the doores . Therefore Davids inference hereupon will sort well in this place . O consider this ye that forget GOD , least I teare you in pieces , and there be none to deliver .

Thus you may see what need you have to beware how you meddle with such edg'd tooles , in misapplying the holy Word of God : for it is a sharpe two edged sword , which not skilfully handled ( as a Sword in a mad mans hand ) but applyed to a wrong use and object , will rebound back upon you , and wound you . God give you Grace to repent , if possible , if you be not come to that § § Rom ▪ 2.5 . Sklur●tata kai ametanamton kardian ( as the Apostle speakes ; hardnesse , and impenitent heart , treasuring up wrath against the day of wrath . I am plain , you see , if there may be hope , and surely 't is no time now to spare , when we heare Gods Trumpet sounding the Alarme . You proceed :

L. p. ibid. In the midst of these libellous outcryes against me , some Divines of great note , and worth in the Church of England , came to me ▪ one by one , and no one knowing of the others coming ( as to me they protested ) and perswaded with me to reprint this Conference in my owne Name . This they thought would vindicate my Reputation , were it generally known to be mine .

P. What libellous outcryes , my Lord ? Of Scandalous and Scurrilous pennes ? If Scurrilous , I approve not : If Scandalous , is not that in your sense onely , because against you ? But the Authours names were to the Bookes , which they avowed to be theirs . How then libellous ? And Master BURTON in speciall offered to the full Court at his Censure , to prove all his Book to be true . And how then Scandalous ? And if just reproofe of Iniquity and Enormities , and that by a Minister of GOD in his own Charge , be Censured for Scandalous : then how shall the writings of the Apostles , and Prophets , and the words of Christs owne mouth , escape this Censure of being Scandalous ? For Master BURTON was a Minister of CHRIST , which under the Gospell is called a * * 1. Cor. 14.4 . Prophet , whose Office is to convince and reproove sinne . But he named your Lordship , and some other of your Brethren in his Book . True . And what of that ? Doe you make this to be Scandalum Magnatum ? Then what say you to the Prophet Elias , telling King Ahab to his face , (a) (a) 1 Kings 18.18 . Thou art hee , that troubleth Israel ? And in his (b) (b) 2 Chron. 21.12 , &c. writing to King Iehoram , hee told him his owne , which hee shortly after found too true . So the Prophet Elisha , when hee spake to the Elders of Israel , and called this Iehoram ( Ahabs Sonne ) a (c) (c) 2 Kings 6.32 . Murtherers Sonne , was at least Scandalous . The Prophet Ieremy is sent to the King and Queen , to admonish them to repent , and to humble themselves . 'T is true indeed the (d) (d) Ier. 38.4 . Nobles incensed the King against Ieremy , as a troubler of the Land . The Prophet Nathan told King David , (e) (e) 2 Sam. 12. Thou art the Man . The Prophet Isaiah named (f) (f) Isa. 22.15 . that Treasurer Shebna . The Prophet Hosea said of the company of Priests ( Chap. 6.9 . ) They make the King glad with their lyes ; as also vers. 5. All these Prophets of the LORD , it seems were Scandalous men . And was Christs tongue Scandalous , when he spake to some , saying , * * Luk. 13.32 . Goe and tell Herod that Fox ? Or Pauls , in naming Demas and Alexander the Copper Smith , and Hymeneus and Philetus ? And Iohn for telling of ‡ ‡ 3 Ioh 9 , 10. Diotrephes his ambitious pride , and prating against the Apostle , and playing other Prelaticall pranks ? Alas ▪ Sir , you want either leasure , or the spirit of right judgement , to observe and discerne the nature of such things . And what then will you say of the Prophet Isaiah , who thus thundereth against the State , and against Ierusalem . † † Isa. 1 21.22.23 . How is the faithfull City become an Harlot ? It was full of Iudgement ▪ Righteousn●sse lodged in it : but now murtherers . Thy silver is become drosse : thy wine mixt with water . Thy Princes are rebellious , and companions of theeves : Every one loveth gifts , and followeth after rewards : they judge not the Fatherlesse , neither doth the cause of the Widow come unto them . And what of the Prophet Micah ? Who saith * * Mic. 3 8. Truly I am full of power by th● spirit of the Lord , and of judgement , and of might , to declare unto Iacob his transgressions , and to Israel his sinne . Heare this I pray you , ye Heads of the house of Iacob , and Princes of the house of Israel , that abhorre judgement , and pervert all equity , that build up Sion with bloud , and Ierusalem with iniquity . The Heads therof judge for reward , and the Priests therof teach for hire , and the Prophets therof divine for money : yet will they leane upon the Lord , and say , Is not the Lord among us ? None evill can come upon us . And againe : ‡ ‡ Mic. 7.2 ▪ The good man is perished out of the Earth , and there is none upright among men : They all lie in wait for blood , they hunt every man his brother with a net . That they may doe evill with both hands earnestly : The Prince asketh , and the Iudge asketh for a reward , and the Great man he uttereth his mischievous d●sire : so they wrap it up . The best of them is as a briar : the most upright is sharper then a thorne hedge : the day of thy watchmen , thy visitation cometh , now shal be their perplexity . And what of the Prophet Zephanie ? ‡ ‡ Zeph. 3.1 . Woe to her , that is filthy and polluted , and to the oppressing City : She obeyed not the voyce : she rec●ived not correction : she trusted not in the Lord : she drew not neere to her God : Her Princes within her are roaring Lyons : her Iudges are evening Wolves , they gnaw not the b●nes till the m●r●ow : Her Prophets are light and trecherous persons : her Priests have polluted the Sanctuary : they have done violence to the Law . And what againe of the Prophet Isay ? † † Isay. 29 . 2● . For the terrible one is brought to nought , and the Scorner is consumed , and all that w●●ch for iniquity are cut off . That make a man an offender for a word : that lay a snare for him that reprooveth in the gate , and turn aside the just for a thing of nought . Infinite are the Instances in this kind , both in the Prophets , and elswhere , as in the New Testament . This is the very dialect , and usuall language of the Prophets , when they reproove sin , and especially , scarlet and predominate sinnes of the Court , and of Great ones . They deale plainly , roughly , and home . So Iohn Baptist. So Christ : * * Mat. 3.7 . & 23.33 . O Generation of vipers , how shall ye escape the vengeance to come , the damnation of hell ? So Paul to Elymas the Sorcerer , ‡ ‡ Act. 13.10 ▪ O full of all Subtilty , and all mischiefe , thou Child of the Devil , thou enemy of all righteousnesse , wilt thou not cease to pervert the right wayes of the Lord ? And Paul here is said to be full of the Holy Ghost . And Elymas the Sorcerer was of great power with Sergius Paulus the Governour . Now my Lord , to recollect all , with some application : Suppose either your Lordship had lived in those times of the Prophets , and of Christ , and his Apostles , or they had lived in these our times , and had used the like language to you , and your Compeeres , which they used to the wicked Priests , Prophets , and Princes of Israel : what would you have done ? Would you not have been one of the foremost in (a) (a) Act 7.57 . stoning some , in (b) (b) Heb 11.37 sawing some , in (c) (c) Rev. 20.4 ▪ beheading some , in (d) (d) Math. 27 ▪ 20.35 . crucifying some , in (i) (i) Heb. 11. imprisoning some , in scourging some ; and ( if it had been , then in use , as it is not much unlike the Crosse ) in pilloring some , and cutting off of the Eares closse to the stumps , with many other grievous things ? And when ye had done all this , would ye not have loaden them with the infamous reproaches of Bitter Men , Scandalous tongues Libellous pennes , and Seditious persons ? But perhaps you will say , as the Pharisees did , * * Math. 24.30 , 31 , 32 , ●3 . If we had been in the dayes of our Fathers , we would not have been partakers with them in the bloud of the Prophets . But Christ tells them wherefore ye be witnesses unto your selves , that ye are the Children of them , which killed the Prophets . Fill up then the measure of your Fathers . Ye Serpents , ye generation of Vipers , how can ye escape the damnation of hell ? Wherefore behold I send unto you Prophets , and Wisemen , and Scribes , and some of them you shall kill and crucifie , and some of them shall you scourge in your Synagogues , and persecute them from City to City . That upon you may come all the righteous bloud , shed upon the earth , from the bloud of righteous Abel , unto the bloud of Zacharias , the Son of Barachias , whom ye slew between the Temple and the Altar . What , did these hypocriticall Pharisees ●lay Zacharias , which was many hundred yeares before ? So faith Christ here . Why , but they professed the contrary . True : and so will you . But did not those Pharisees crucifie the Lord Iesus Christ , the Prince of the Prophets , and afterwards persecuted and slew his Apostles , and that for no other cause , but for that truth which they preached ? Thus hereby they prooved themselves guilty of all the blood of the Prophets shed by their murtherous Fore-Fathers ; So as if they had then lived , they that crucified Christ himselfe , would also have slaine his Prophets , who spake before of him . Now what fence hath your Lordship against this Sword of Christ , to ward off the like imputation of guilt of the blood-shed of the Saints and Servants of God ? Have you not shed the bloud of a Minister of Christ , and that for no other cause , then for beareing witnesse to the truth , in discharge of that Embassage committed unto him ? And so consequently have you not brought upon your soule the guilt of the bloud of JESUS , who under Pontius Pilate witnessed a good confession , and so of all his Prophets , Apostles , and Martyrs ? But you will say , BURTON had no such speciall mission , and commission as the Prophets had . No ? Could not you see , that he was extraordinarily raysed up by GOD , and by him extraordinarily assisted , both in his Sermons , and in his Book , and in his free and undanted Spirit in his appearance and Answer before so many ‡ ‡ Ier. 15.20 ▪ 21. Terrible ones in that Court , and in that fiery tryall on the Pillory , and other tryalls , wherein he carryed himselfe from the First to the Last with that constant magnanimity , that he seemed rather a Triumphant , then a Patient ? Can you ascribe this to any humane strength of a poore impotent Man , wrastling and warring against such a dreadfull and direfull host of Adversaries : and not to the sole and extraordinary support of the Spirit of Christ in him ? So as , when being a Spectator of the Tragedy ( as you had been the maine Author ) wherein you thought to glut your eyes with such a Spectacle , and to make your selfe even drunken with his bloud : were you not on the contrary amazed and confounded , to see a Man on the Pillory triumphing over your incomparable cruelty ? Did not your Conscience then at least check you , and tell you , that you did then Pillory Iesus Christ in his § § Act. 9.4 . Servant , as it were nayling him ‡ ‡ Heb. 6.6 . afresh to the Crosse , and putting him to an open shame ? But you goe on : Saying :

Now in the midst of these Libellous outcryes ( what ? ) some Divines of great note and worth in the Church of England , &c. 'T is no hard matter to Divine of what stamp , your Notable and worthy Divines in the Church of England be . But I passe them by , as unsaluted , it being obvious to all men , what kind of Divines doe merit to be accounted of you of Note and Worth in the Church of England : who are , and must be either Arminian , or Popish , or both , Flatterers and Sycophants , Proud and Profane persons , by which they are most noted and known , and whose worth is valued according to the rate of the magnitude or multitude of their Fat Benefices , Prebends , Deaneries , Prelacies , or other dignities , and according to their great Scholarship show'd in their seldome preaching in their own Cures , and their curious and quaint Rhetorizing in the Court , where the plainest part of the Sermon is down-right-rayling against the Puritans , and the base and grosse flattering of the Court. ●ut what of these your worthy divines ? First they come to your Lordship . Well , that s but good manners , to expresse their officiousnesse , though but with a complement . Secondly , not together , but one by one , not one knowing of anothers coming . Every one thinking perhaps to prevent other in so notable a piece of Service , and so to promerit all the thanks . Well , thirdly , What 's the matter of this casuall , or rather miraculous confluence ? To perswade with you to reprint this your Conference in your own name . But cui bono ? To what purpose ? For it would vindicate your Reputation , being generally known to be yours . Now least your Lordship may run into a strong misconceit , as if this strange concurrence of persons and Spirits , not one knowing of anothers coming , or occasion , were from some Constellation of the Starres , or rather from Divine Providence for your good : you know your Brother of Chichester protested in his Appeale , that he had never read Arminius : and yet how pat did he hit upon , and hold all the Arminian Points , as if he had been an old Disciple of Arminius his Schoole ? By what Spirit trow you was this ? But to the point : All this was to vindicate your Reputation . With whom ? With Jesuites ? Certainly not with any good Christians . Yet this you labour too , with laying on colous enough . But this Art of writing against Jesuites is now grown so stale , and triviall , as in these dayes it begets new Suspicions of a Popish Spirit , especially when it once comes forth under the Authority , or Name of Canterbury . Yet haply your Divines are Astrologers , observing the Constellations of the times , and thereupon divining or conjecturing , what fearefull events might come of it , and those perhaps prognosticating and ominating little good to your Lordship upon whom they saw a generall bad and malignant Aspect to be cast : might strain their wits , and use their strongest reasons to perswade you to use the best meanes to prevent the worst , whereof they imagined this their motion to be the best . And therefore they might perhaps frame their Speech in such a like forme , as this : My Lord , we observe abroad what discontents possesse most men against your Grace , about these late Innovations in the Church ( as they call them ) and you know , the Truth of Religion ( as they apprehend it ) as also the Liberty of their Consciences , are with the Puritans of high estimation : and men will not easily part with them , especially those that be Zealous indeed ; as accounting them their best freeholds ; Such especially , as acknowledge no other King over their Soules and Consciences in matters of Faith and Gods worship ( as we have heard them say ) but onely CHRIST . And they have shrowd Arguments herein for themselves : And you see what necessary occasions and exigents may constrain the King to call a Parliament , and how farre that ( being a meanes to fasten and confirme the Subjects affections to his Majesty now especially upon this Defection of Scotland ) may draw the King to be willing to give his People contentment , in permitting them that purity in Religion in Faith and Discipline , which Christ and his Apostles ( they say ) have taught , and left them , without which ( they say ) they cannot be freed from the Yoake of Antichristian or humane Ordinance ( for we use but their words ) and how dangerous this may be to your Grace , whom they have marked out , as the maine Active Agent , or Instrument in disturbing their peace , and distracting their minds , and trenching upon their said Liberty , as they account it : And considering how the whole Land generally groaneth under many heavy Grievances ( as People now adayes account Grievances ) as their deep Sighs do interpret their minds : and of these your Honour is reputed one of the Prime Movers : And however your Lorship may haply conceive , that if ye be put to a pinch , your Book ▪ your late Conference set forth against Fisher , will prove sufficient to ward off , and beat back all accusations annent Religion : yet my Lord , it is not put forth in your own Name , they may Question whether it be yours , or no , and say , that , being namelesse , you may in time disclaime it , if ever you can bring your pious purpose for peace to passe : And besides , 't is now a long time since it was Printed , and so is forgotten : Wherefore our humble advise ( with all due Submission to your Lordships pregnant wisedome ) is , that your Grace would revise , correct and more fully expresse your selfe in some things , in the said Book , and so republish it in Print under your own Name : This in our poore opinions , will mightily take with the vulgar , and easily vindicate , and set upright your Graces Reputation . And because we are not ignorant of your multiplicious and waighty affaires in Court , not permitting your thoughts that vacancie , which such a worke would require : let not that trouble your Lordship , our Service shall not be wanting . Thus , or so your Divines . Well , now that you heare your friends Counsell , what 's your Resolution .

L· ibid. I confesse I looked round about these men , and their motion ; and at last my thoughts working much upon themselves , I began to perswade my selfe , that I had been too long diverted from this necessary worke : And that perhaps these might be in voce hominum tuba Dei , in the still voyce of men , the loud Trumpet of God .

P. And perhaps my Lord ( and that whereof it may be ye wil be the rather perswaded ) the unanimous cons●nt of these Divines , might be by the instigation of that same Spirit , in which those * * 2 King . 22. 400. Prophets by their unanimous vote prevailed to perswade King Ahab , to goe up to Ramoth Gilead , that so according to Gods own purpose he might there perish . But it might be , you say , Gods loud Trumpet . What , to hasten you to Judgement ? Certainly , that lying Spirit in those Prophets was sent from GOD , to prepare the way of executing vengeance on that Ahab the more speedily , as who had sold himselfe to worke wickednesse , in sheding Nabaths blood . And surely when I look'd into the intrals of this your Booke ( as the Roman Southsayers of old did into the bowels and entralls of their Sacrifices ) and found them so exceedingly vicious and corrupt , and withall ( like to Caesars Sacrifice , wherein was found no heart , which the Astrologers took for a bad signe ) no heart at all to the true Religion indeed : it suggested these conceits into my mind , about this very passage of yours . But time will try all things . And if you will have my poore opinion , I am perswaded , if you had never put pen to paper ( it having been super-sufficient to have expressed your mind in your other handy-works , or Practises ) and so had reserved your Apology ( when requisite ) to your perswasive Language , and powerfull Rhetorick , men might have had lesse hold to take off you , when you might have put all your other Actions upon a higher moving Cause , as usually ye doe . But for writing , you know Litera Scripta manet . Or else it had been better to have reprinted your First Coppy , as it was at first , without Alteration , and in your Chaplains name still ; for so you should both have vindicated it from obscurity , lying hid , and lurking in the belly of Dr. Whites Works , and also at pleasure have either owned , or disclaimed it , as you found occasion . Or might have excused any thing , that might be taken in it as offensive , either imputing it to your Chapleins mistake , or to want of leasure to revise it , or ( which is the surest and most beaten way ) to the Printer ▪ as was lately done about that notorious Popish Book of Salis his Devotions . And hereof ( if your Lordship knows it not ) I will tell you a pretty Tale. This Book of Devotion of Salis , A pretty tale . bearing the Title of Bishop of Geneva ( although the Church of Geneva have no such Bishops ) had been so long ago translated into English , and being purged from those grosse points of Popery , which were in the Originall Coppy , was by Authority published in Print , and sold well . But of late dayes , since you came to sit in that Chaire , one undertook to translate the Originall anew , and intire , as it was at first set forth by the Author , without altering any thing , as the Translator professed in his Epistle Dedicatory to Mris Anne Roper , a notorious Recusant . This Translation being brought to your Chaplein to license , it past for currant , as containing nothing in it against Faith and Manners , and so was licensed without the least correction of the grossest things in it . It came to the Printer , who falling aworke upon it , began to stumble at some no small Popish blocks , that lay in his way , insomuch as he was afraid to goe on , but went and shewed them to your Chaplein ▪ who making a tush at it , bad him goe on , and he would beare him out in it . So Printed it was . And coming abroad , some began to find fault with it ; and the stinke of the Booke more and more increasing with stirring , it came at length to be smelled by your Lordship . Hereupon what serious examination you used about it , I know not : but there being some Jealousie , that some one of those THREE forementioned troublesome bitter men ( whose Cause was then shortly to be heard ) might haply among other things ( might they have been permitted to speake freely ( cast that Booke in your Lordships dish : the next newes we heard of it , was , that a Proclamation is published for the burning of the Book in Smith-field , wherein also all the blame was layd upon the poore Printer , for which he must to prison , and you and your Chaplein were acquitted and cleared , as no way faulty . So easie is it with the least breath to blow away the blackest clowds , when they threaten a storme either against you , or your Chaplein in such cases . But now in this your Booke , so exactly Reprinted , and revised , and republished , wherein also you have ratified and avowed all in your former Booke for yours , you have for ever fast bound your hands , that you cannot helpe your selfe at a dead lift . Well , 't is too late now either to prevent , or remedy what is past . Yet one thing there is , which you may perhaps deem to be operae pretium , worth your paines , as wherein lyes your maine Confidence of vindicating your Reputation with good men : and that is , some Large Discourses in your Booke , wherein you seeme to be point blanke against the Papists ; as about the Scripture Transubstantiation , &c. This indeed might say well to it , and passe for currant , were there not in some of them so much grosse allay , as makes the whole to be * * Ier. 6.30 . reprobate Silver , as the Prophet saith ; and also , did you not commit a grosse Solecisme in writing a seeming Truth , and practising apparently contrary ; and did you not overballance seeming Truths with too much Popish Truth throughout your Booke , as will all along appeare . And you know that if one ‡ ‡ Eccles. 10 . 1· dead Fly will corrupt a whole box of oyntment , how much more a Swarme ? And a little poyson corrected , and infused in a Potion , proves medicinall : but if uncorrected , and of two great a quantity it becomes mortall , and so instead of bealing , kills the Patient . But to proceed .

L. p. 9. I have thus acquainted your Majestie with all occasions , which both formerly , and now againe have led this Tract into the Light .

P. And not without cause needs your Tract to be led into the light . I will not here apply that speech of Christ , Blind needs leading . If the blind lead the blind , but leave it to the event .

L. p. 11. GOD forbid , I should ever offer to perswade a Persecution in any kind , or practise it in the least .

P. How ? What doe I heare ? GOD forbid ? What , neither perswade , nor practise Persecution , no not in the least ? And must GOD be named in it too ? What meaneth then ( as * * 1 Sam. 15.14 . SAMUEL said to SAUL ) the bleeting of the Sheepe , and the bellowing of the Cattell in mine eares ? Or you mistook the word , when instead of GOD forbid , you should have said , GOD forgive me both for perswading Persecution , and for practising it , and that in as high a measure as possibly I could , the times considered . And GOD forgive , should be from your Heart ; whereas GOD forbid , is but from the lippes outward , and spoken out of meere Hypocrisie , shamelesse grown with Impiety ; Or else Persecution is with you , as sin is with many , so frequent and habituall , as the custome of Persecuting takes away , the sense of it . Or els as Paul , before his conversion , was * * Act. 26.11 . mad with persecuting the Saints : So you are so intoxicated with drinking the blood of innocents , that you know not what either you say or do . Or , in a word , notwithstanding you have been so long a Practitioner in this kind of Trade , yet you know not what persecution is , nor what or who the Saints of GOD be , nor who are the true Ministers of Christ , nor who are his true members . 'T is well , if Ignorance will excuse you : that you might come once to say with Paul , * * 1 Tim. 1.13 But I was received to mercy , for I did it ignorantly through unbelife . But can you say so ? Or rather doe you not sin against the light of Gods Word , against the light of your Conscience , against the light of naturall Reason , and the Law of Humanity , and against Gods Law , and against Mans Law , and ( I had almost said ) against the Holy Ghost it selfe ? Unlesse you be one of those , that for blindnesse stumble at noon day . How many godly and able Ministers of Christ , together with their Wives and Children , are cast out , and undone by you , and all for not daring to obey you in those things , wherein of necessity they must have dishonour'd GOD ? Or for omitting one of your Ceremonies , perhaps but once , or twice , and the like ? Yet this with you is no persecution , no not in any kind . What is it then ? Onely a punishing of the Puritans , that so they may be rooted out . This you blushed not to say openly in Starre-chamber , when you with your Brethren were charged for casting out above a hundred Ministers in Norfolk , Suffolk , Essex , Kent , Surrey , and where not ? But you neither practised , nor perswaded to it . Why did you not disswade ? Why did you not enterpose ? Why did you not relieve them , when upon Petition to the King , they were referred to you ? No such thing . They are a sort of Puritans : they must be rooted out , This is enough to wash your hands of persecution : as Pilate did of his condemning of Christ : for they are Puritans . So the Popish Prelates in Queen Maries dayes , in burning the Martyrs , were no persecuters ; for those Martyrs were Hereticks . Nor will the High Priests and Pharisees prove persecuters , and murtherers in Crucifying of Christ , for they could say , He was a seducer and deceiver . And so in summe , There wil be found no such thing in rerum naturâ , not in the whole world , as persecution is . Now what patience can refrain it self at these things ? O notorious , impious , shamelesse , gracelesse Hypocrisie . Or Hypocrisie shall I call that , which hath not the least veile , or cloake , or vizard , or pretence , or colour , or shadow of a shadow to overshadow it withall , but meere shamelesse impiety daring God to his face , using his Sacred name as a white veile to lay over the black-butchery of Gods own deare Saints , saying God forbid , when his own wicked heart , and blood-guilty Conscience , and foule bloody practises , cannot but convince him of a more impious and shamelesse lye , then the Divel himselfe , ( except he were incarnate ) durst make ? Not practise Persecution in any kind , no not in the least ? What kind of persecution is there , ô Prelate , whereof thou art not an Actor , and that in the highest Degree ? Dost thou not persecute Gods Ministers with Suspention , Silencing , Excommunication , Deprivatoin , Degradation , spoyling their dwelling place , Confiscation of their goods by intollerable Fines , Imprisonment , dismembring of their bodies , shedding of their blood , banishment , or driving them to seek for refuge from thy cruell Tyranny among the wild Beasts , and wild Woods , and wild Salvages , in Countryes not inhabited , in desolate Deserts , the worst of which is to be preferred before thy all-destroying Cruelty ? Nay when they have escaped thy Lyons Clawes with their Skin , dost thou not ( * * Rev. 12. as the Dragon ) vomit after them a Flood of persecution with thy venemous tongue ? So insatiable is thy blood-thirsty Cruelty : and yet after all this hast thou a Forehead to say , God forbid , that I should practise Persecution in any kind , no not in the least . Now I call heaven and earth to witnesse against thee ; and that holy and righteous God , the Father and King of Saints , whom thou persecutest , and whose Sacred Name thou darest prophane with tongue and pen , judge thee for all thy Cruelties , and Lawlesse persecutions of the poore Servants of Iesus Christ . Lawlesse indeed , wherein thou outstrippest the persecutions of Stephen Gardiner and Edmond Bonner , who had a Law for what they did , but thou hast none . O what punishments in Hell shall be sufficient for these things ! I must confesse my zeale is here transported , but it is not beyond the Cause provoking it . I will conclude with this hearty Prayer , though in your words , but not with your Spirit . God forbid that you should ever , to wit , for ever , perswade Persecution in any kind or practise it in the Least . God forbid you should Ever doe it : Ever ? Amen . Ever . Nay what saith the Lord ? * * Psal. 12 ▪ For the oppression of the poore , for the sighing of the needy , Now will I arise , saith the Lord , I will set him in safety from him that puffeth at him . Now : even Now from him that puffeth at the godly ? Who is that ? The Tongue-master , he that speaks with flattering lippes , and a double heart , and proud things , saying , Who i● Lord ●ver us ? Now , Now will the Lord arise against such as are in the highest and ruffe of all their wickednesse . And do not you think you are one of these , yea and a Prime one too ? You think ? Say I ? Doth it ever enter into your thought , that you shal be judged for these things , and that , Now , even Now ? The Scripture tells us No. For David Saith , * * Psal 92.6.7 A brutish man knoweth not , neither doth a foole understand this , ( what this ? ) when the wicked spring as the grasse , and when all the workers of iniquity doe flourish , it is , that they shal be destroyed for ever . Even Then in the top of their flourishing estate they shal be destroyed . Yea their flourishing estate is the immediate cause of their perishing : when the wicked spring and flourish : It is that they shal be destroyed for ever . But wicked is a Generall word , and perhaps it hath no reference here to you in particular . Yes certainly , you in particular ; the Holy Ghost doth in this Psalme point you out as it were with the finger . How ? Note but the Title of the Psalme : A Psalme for the Sabbath day . But it may seem strange that David should heare speake of the wicked , and of their flourishing estate . What coherence hath this with the Sabbath day ? Surely hereby the Spirit of Prophesie notes out unto us a speciall time or age of the Church , wherein ungodly men should most notoriously oppose themselves against the sanctification of the Sabbath day , and wherein they should extraordinarily flourish and prosper , even as the green and goodly bladed * * Psal. 129.6 . Grasse , that groweth on high upon the house tops : but in that their flourishing estate , they should sodainly perish . And of all other times and ages of the Church , ever was this Prophesie so extraordinarily and remarkably verefied , for ungodly and desperate offenders in this kind , as in this present age , and especially in the Church of England , now since your springing up and flourishing upon the toppes of Canterbury Palace ? For shew us any age , wherein the sanctification of the Sabbath , or Lords day was by publike Edict dispensed with , and by sundry Printed Books cryed down , and you shal be excused from being of those men , whom the Holy Ghost notes out here for wicked and ungodly . But you cannot . Therefore this Psalme for the Sabbath day speaks of you in speciall , as being a professed enemy of the sanctification of the Sabbath , and so of all true holinesse , and yet you doe so flourish and prosper in this your wicked and impious opposition to all Godlinesse as never any have done more , nor so much in mans memory . But what 's the issue of this ? These wicked enemies of Godlinesse , and of the sanctification of the Sabbath in speciall shal be destroyed for ever ? But when ? Even then , when they are in the top of their flourishing estate . But how shall we know this ? First , GOD hath said it , and therefore 't is sure enough : and Secondly , this their flourishing estate is an immediate both signe and cause of their utter ruine . But doth your Lordship beleeve that this shall ever be verefied of you ? Why should you not ? For are not you the great Instrument and Agent in advancing the Edict for Sports to its full execution ; And why should you not then beleeve the rest , that in the height of your present prosperity you shal be destroyed for evermore ? And why doe you not beleeve it ? For David saith , A brutish man knoweth not , neither doth a foole understand this : to wit , when he wicked spring as the Grasse , and when all the workers of iniquity doe flourish , it is that they shal be destroyed for ever . And doe you not know , do you not understand this ▪ Then you fill up the Prophesie to the full , as verefied of you wholly .

L. p. ibid. But on the other side , GOD forbid too , that your Majesty should let both Lawes and Discipline sleep , for feare of the name of Persecution , and in the meane time , Let Master Fisher and his fellowes angle in all parts of your Dominions for your Subjects , &c.

P. Here ( I hope ) you speake it seriously , GOD forbid . At least in part . For you name two things : Lawes , and Discipline : Lawes , against Jesuites , as Fisher and his fellowes . And herein it may be questioned perhaps by some , whether you speake seriously GOD forbid , that such Lawes should sleep . For you know they have slept so long a time , and so soundly , Taking Gods Name in vaine by the Prelate . that I feare your God forbid will not prove loud enough to awaken them . And as for Discipline , that 's for your Puritans . And for that you need not trouble the King to breake his sleep , your selfe I trow , can look well enough to the keeping of that awake . For in truth it can take no rest for you . And therefore neither in this respect need your God forbid to be serious , as being altogether superfluous . Onely the best use , that you can make of it ( as you know it better then I can tell you ) is , is that your God forbid here may prove so happy ( for the vindicating of your Reputation ) as to perswade the misdeming world , that if the Lawes against Iesuites do sleep , you are not the cause of it , who ever els : God forbid : and if Dissipline be over wakefull and too quick , and exceed all bounds , as having no Law to confine it ( alas ! ) you are not the Man , God forbid . For wake or sleep your [ God forbid your Ma●esty should let them sleep ] argueth plainly , that the keeping of the Discipline awake , is his part , whose it is not to let them sleep ? 'T is well , my Lord you have so strong a back to lay your burthens upon ( as is touched before ) especially when they presse too hard upon you , as in the clamours and outcryes against your outrages . But what ? Doe you come here with your God forbid your Majesty should suffer Discipline to sleep , when but a little before , and almost with the same breath , you said God forbid I should ever offer to perswade a Persecution in any kind ? Do we not know what the awakening of Discipline is ? Is it not like the awakening of a sleeping Lyon ? Doth not then the rigorous and incessant restlesse execution of Discipline ( so as it can never be suffered once to sleep ) trench upon Persecution at least as neare , as you say at after , sundry errours of the Church of Rome come neare the overthrowing of the Foundation , or as their worshiping of Images comes too neare heathenish Idolatry ? But in your Close , you apply your God forbid onely against the Jesuites . That 's well , that you presse it not with your Discipline upon your Puritans , as you do the Lawes against Romes Fisher-men . And I note here , that for Jesuites you have Laws : but for Puritans you have Discipline , without Lawes : or as it stands in opposition to Lawes . But what followeth ? Alas ! what do I find saluting me in the very front of your next page ?

L. p. 12. Now as I would humbly , beseech your Majesty to keep a serious watch upon these Fisher-men , which pretend S. Peters , but fish not with his net : so I would not have you neglect an other sort of Anglers in a shallower water .

P. Yet your words seem to import a greater zeale in you against the Iesuites , then against your Puritans . For touching those , you humbly beseech : but concerning these , you onely would have . And yet what you onely would have , is somwhat , and perhaps as prevailing ( especially when you set it on in private ) as your open humbly beseeching . Yea being Primate of all England , or Patriarcha Alterius Orbis , I know not whether you may speake it in the Popes stile , * * Platina in ●ita Bon. 3. Volumus & jubemus , as much to say , I would have : and then by this reckoning it would surmount , I humbly beseech . But what 's this other sort of Fishers , that you would not have his Majesty to neglect ? Or what these Anglers in a shallower water ? or what their bad nets ? This hath relation to Discipline , as the former to Lawes ; and so though for your Reputation sake you modestly spare to name them , yet they are in plain English , your Puritans , and those , Puritan-Preachers especially , because Anglers . But where are there any such creatures , as Puritan-Preachers now adayes ? Doe not all conform , and submit to your Discipline ? And are not all Non-Conformists put to perpetuall silence , as in the grave ? O , but you say , there is a sort of Puritan Conformists which are worse then the Non-Conformists , whom you have often said , you would worme out . And to worme out , is as men tread out the wormes out of the ground . Onely we must not call this Persecution , to set your feet with all your waight , upon Gods Ministers . God forbid . But who are they ? Such as will not conform to your New Discipline and Ceremonies : Such as will not read in their congregation the Edict for Sports on the Lords day : Such as will not observe the Kings order for not preaching of Predestination , and other doctrines of Grace : Such as will not observe the order for bare Catechising out of the Booke , by Simple Question and Answer , without any exposition : Such as will not forbeare preaching in the Afternoon , and that often times beyond their houre , the people standing on thornes the while , to be at their Sports , considering that Afternoone-Sermons are forbidden , but not afternoon-Sports : Such as though for feare they submit to their Prelates domination , yet you suspect them to be disaffected with your Church Government , as being an intollerable Tyranny . These are that Serious Sort of Fishers you mention . But what are those Shallower waters , which you say they Fish in ? Perhaps you meane , they are a Sort of Shallow-braind fellowes , poore Snakes , that angle in shallow waters , that is , have but a poore Vicaridge , or Stipend , or preach to Shallow-simple people , ( the Great-Fishes being in your deeper Seaes taken with your Long-lined Angle , or Sweep-net ) or in a Shallow water , and that of force , because you forbid them to Fish in the Deep waters of Election and Predestination , leaving them onely the Shallowes of morall Divinity to fish in , whereby they shall never be able to catch one good Fish , but onely such small Gudgions , as when the net is drawn to shore , or cast away . And the Shallower waters ye oppose to these Deep waters the Iesuites Fish in . For they Fish in all the deep Rivers , and Ponds in the Land , yea and most , in the Bishops Seaes , or Cathedrals , where they find and inclose whole Sholes of Fish ; and they * * Egkathetoi . Fish in the Deeps of mens hearts , and leave not a Creeke unfished , and those no simple ones neither , I will not say , Lords and Ladies in the Court , though themselves dare professe it So as they can ‡ ‡ Episcari . Fish out of them the discovery of all the Mysteries of State , whereby they maintaine a rich Trade of such Commodities , by way of intelligence to Rome and Spaine and other Forraigne parts . Whereas your other sort of Anglers have indeed an Angle and Line , that will dive into the secrets of Mans heart , and that is the plaine and powerfull preaching of Gods Word , which pierceth even to the dividing asunder of Soule and Spirit , and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart : but haply , this is that which you call their bad nets , which they Fish withall . Indeed they Fish not with the Golden-nets of Heliogabalu● ; they use not to bait their hooks with guided Flattery , nor with the glittering shew of humane learning , in powring forth Greek Sentences , which the Fish onely gaze upon , but never bite , onely ( as * * Nihil est facilius , quàm imperitam multitudinem volubilitate verborum decipere , quae quicquid non intelligit , plus miratur . Nabis sine Cortice ▪ H●r . Ierome saith ) most admiring , what they least understand ; and which every novice newly cropt out of the shell of Grammer Schoole , with the help of Books can con , and recite : which is not to Fish with Peters net , not to preach sound Divinity to the edification and Salvation of Gods people , but to Fish for a Whale , for some great Cathedrall , or so . And therefore perhaps also you call the nets of these men , bad nets , as being either broken with age ( preaching the good old Saving Truth ) such as will not hold a good Fat Fish , or benefice , as when they take to themselves such a liberty in Preaching the truth , and against sinne , as they come to loose all : or too small , such as will not inclose a plurality of great Fishes , though they be in Severall Seaes or Diocesse . Or not like to the Monkes net , which he used to spread his Table withall , till under this veile of humility he crope up to the Lord Abbots chaire , and rich Table , where he used his net no more , having taken the Fish he lookt for . Thus I suppose by this time I have fished out your meaning of that other sort of Fishers and Anglers , whom you would not have his Majesty to neglect . But if he doe , I hope your Lordship will not neglect to hinder such Fishers from setting up their Busses in your Seaes , or to have the least private Pond or Chappell to angle in . You said well to such fellowes ( when the time was ) when with the help of Noy's Arke you suppressed that great Busse of the Feoffees in Trust , which had it gone on , would have in time drawn many Fishes out of the Devils * * 2 Tim. 2.26 Ezogremenoi nets , of whom they are taken captive at his will , and have translated them out of your brackish and bitter Seaes , into those Fresh Rivers of the waters of life , where they should have bin out of danger to be catcht with your carnall baites , though they could hardly escape your tearing Hookes . But enough of this . Yet one thing more here I cannot but note , and that is this : you humbly beseech his Majesty to keep a serious watch over the Romish Fishers : and withall you adde , The Prelates Counsell to the King perillous . that another Sort of Anglers be not neglected . Who this other sort is , is shewed , namely your Puritan Preachers : that is to say , The most godly , painfull , zealous Ministers in the Land ; and so the most vigilant watchmen to preserve the flockes of Christ from Wolves and Foxes , that seek to devoure them . And who are these Wolves and Foxes , but these Romish Fishers you speak of ? that I may not say also , your homebread Wolves and Foxes , the Prelates , and their Faction . Now if the Lawes against these Wolves and Foxes doe sleep , and if the faithfull watchmen be removed , and none but a sort of dumb * * Isay. 56.10 , 11. dogges left , that either cannot , or will not , or dare not barke , but themselves helpe to devoure the flocks , as the Prophet speaks : do you think , that though the King should keep never so serious watch , it were possible to preserve his people from perishing by these Wolves ? Certainly the case being so , though the King should watch both night and day , and had Argus his eyes , yet he should but weary himselfe to no purpose , yea although he had the help of your many-eyed dogges your Pursuants ( who are cunninger at fastening upon the Shepheards , then upon the Wolves ) to boot . For then how easily and quickly may the Wolves and Foxes devoure all the Flocks in the Land , when the faithfull Shepheards and wathmen ( as your Lordship knowes Leo-well ) are taken away ; and when those Fishers can show the people this your Book , which as a vast net were able at one draught to inclose multitudes , by ex●rting them to be reconciled to Rome , and that upon this one ground , that the Church of England and of Rome is one and the same Church , no doubt of that ? of which anon .

But yet , me thinks , I have not all this while dived deep enough to sound the bottome of this word , Not neglect . Somwhat of a moderate Speech , in the smoothnesse of the barke . Not neglect , as if you should say , I would not have your Majesty to be too rigorous against the Puritan Ministers , good men , but yet I would not have you to neglect them . But we cannot better find out the full meaning of this word , but by the large Commentary of your Practises , which summed up together , amount to thus much . I would not have your Majesty to neglect , that is , I would not have your Majesty neglest means , that can possibly be devised , for the utter rooting out of these Puritans , that do so pester your Kingdome . And for that you must make your main aym at the suppressing of the Puritan Ministers . For smite the Shepheard , and the sheep wil be Scattered . Now forasmuch as all Non-conformists , are put to perpetuall silence , wherein we have been helped by your good Lawes : and we want Lawes to deal● with your Puritan Conformists : therefore we must supply that with policie , backed with your Royall Power . Your Majesty must set forth Edicts , laying a straight charge on us Prelates , to see them executed . For instance : That all Ministers , yea and that in their own Persons ▪ not by their Curates , do read in their severall Congregations respectively your Book for Sports on Sundayes and Holy-dayes . This will pack away a good many of them , who I know will never read it . Le● another be made , for setting up of Altars in all Churches , as that for S. GREGORIES under S. Pauls , which would be pulished in Print , although in the meane time it be safely kept among the Records of the Counsell Board ; and your Proclamation since enjoynes all Orders for Religion to be observed , whether Publique , or Private , being made at the Counsell-Board . A third , to prohibit all Lectures on the week dayes , and also preaching on the Afternoones on Sundayes . A fourth , prohibiting Controverted points to be preached on at all , or Predestination , &c. which will mainly pinch the Puritans . A fift , That whatsoever Rites we Bishops doe or shall impose upon the Churches , may be ratified under your Majesties Broad Seale , both for the preventing of Premunires , and suppressing Clamours of the People against the Prelates , and enforceing Ministers to obey them . A sixt , That a Proclamation be published , to inhibit all men from speaking or writing against the Religion of the Church of England , As it is now established , leaving out that other Phrase , as it was in Queen Elizabeths time , and turning into , As it is Now established . And to all these adde , Vnder pain of your Majesties most heavy Displeasure ; not nominating any particular punishment , because of the Lawes , but leave that to us ▪ for so long as you doe but give us power , we shall not want meanes and wayes to punish them , so long as either the High Commission , or Starre-Chamber doe stand . And thus in short time , there should not one Puritan be left in the Land . And all this I meane , by , I would not have you neglest .

Thus we know your mind , But in the meane time , my Lord you might doe well to consider and consult , what may be the Consequences of these things , that you thus load the King withall , What ? Thus to root out the Puritans , and so by your Innovation of the State of Religion by Law established , to make way for your Reconciliation with Rome ? Take heed what you doe . Have you not learned that principle in the Politicks , That Suddaine Changes in the Civill Government , and most of all in Religion , is full of perill ? And another notable point of prudence I have read of , For a Prince ( how ever he may haply connive , yet ) not to appeare the prime Author of such projects and practises , as may breed a heart-burning in the people . For as the Heathen Poet sung , Invidia Siculi non invenere Tiranni Majus Tormentum — . And the Wise-man saith , * * Pro. 27.4 . Who can stand before Envy ? Not Caesar himselfe And therefore if you tender the Kings honour , and the peace and weale of his Kingdome , doe not lay too great a burthen upon him . Give way , that some things may be imputed to your zeale , so as if you should come to be questioned for it ( as you have no such feare , so long as there is no Parliament , which I hope you will look too well enough ) the King may have opportunity to show his favour , in spreading his Royall wing over you . But my Lord you professe great love to his Majesty , and to the peace and prosperity of his Kingdome : Will you now show how zealously and sincerely you love the King and his people at this time ? At this calamitous and dangerous time , when you see a whole Kingdome , even his Native Countrey fallen off at one clappe . And for what cause ? Some say , 'T is for Religion , because they cannot injoy it in that purity , nor their Consciences in that liberty , as antiently they did , before the Prelates came to be set over them ; but by that their meanes , they are more and more pressed ( as they complain ) to bring them to a full conformity to your Church of England , as now you have made it , which you say , is all one with the Church of Rome , and which in your Booke you labour to reconcile to Rome . And can there be any thing more offensive to true Christian Stomacks , then the burthening of their Consciences with such things as are against Gods Word , and Christs Kingdome , and their Christian Liberty ? Or is it not for this Cause ▪ that they are thus fallen off ? But the Late Proclamation given at White-Hall Febru . 27. 1639. seemes to intimate , that one maine Cause of the Scots discontent , is the Hierarchicall Government . For there it is said , We neither can , nor will permit Episcopall Government established by many Acts of Parliament in that our Kingdome , to be abolished . And againe , the Proclamation saith , And further we thinke to declare unto you , and to the Christian world , that by our Intention of introducing the Service Booke into that Kingdome , we had not the least thought of Innovation in Religion , in this or that , but meerely to have a conformity with that Worship of God , which is observed within both our other Kingdomes , though il-minded men have wrested some things in it to a Sinister Sense . Thus it seems to me , that the Scots are discontented with Episcopall Government , and Ceremonies ; which usually go together . Now were it not a worthy and admirable piece of Service in your Lordship to his Majesty to study , how the State may be reduced , and that in the most peaceable and safe way , that may be ? Will you be pleased to take a Fooles Counsell ? Would you purchase to your selfe an immortall name , and become a Mirrour and Miracle of this age , and an example to all posterity ( the King having past his word ) and so do the best service to the King , that ever any of his Subjects hath done ? Do no more but this : Cast away your Rochet and Miter ; Divest your self of all Episcopall Ornaments and Titles ▪ Utterly renounce and relinquish your Hierarchy , as being not onely against Christs word and Kingdome ( as afterwards shall by Gods Grace appeare ) but also as being most pernicious to the Peace and Welfare of Civill States , most Antichristian , and one particular cause expresly of the defection of a whole Kingdome from his Majesty . Now show hereby , that you so love the King , that rather then he shall loose one of his Kingdomes thus , you will utterly and voluntarily depose your selfe from your Hierarchicall throne . And I know your Lordship doth every where professe your love to peace , and tell us very much of it in your Book . Now can there be a more peaceable way then this to reconcile Scotland , and reduce them under the Kings Government ? And as for ceremonies , if they stand in the way , I assure my selfe , were your Hierarchy but once removed out of the way , either his Majesty would take an Order for them , or they would even sponte sua of their own accord fall , as having now no more Masters to waite upon . But enough of this . It shall be my dayly prayer in the mean time , that GOD would establish his Majesties Kingdomes with the Gospel of peace , and the Peace of the Gospel in our dayes , and to our Posterity till the coming of Iesus Christ . You proceed .

L. p. 13. 'T is truth , I must tell it , 't is the Gospel I must preach it . 1 Cor. 9.16 .

P. 'T were well , if you told nothing but Truth , and that not onely , of necessity , with a must , but of * * Phil. 1.15 . love , and of a ready mind . But your Book will further show what truth you tell And for the Gospel , when doe you preach it ? Or how ? What ? As the Apostle did whom you quote ? And if you must preach it , why doe you restrain others from it ? That your selfe onely might preach ? Why then preach you no oftner ? Surely your restraining of others from preaching , puts the greater necessity upon your selfe ( if indeed you be a Minister of the Gospel , and not a dumb Priest ) to preach the more frequently . For indeed you Prelates take upon you to be as so many Popes , or universall Pastors over all the Churches in your Diocese respectively ( though you seldome or never preach in any ) and the Ministers must be but your Curates ; So as they also must preach no more , nor oftener , nor otherwise , then you their good Lords and Masters doe prescribe and limit them , by vertue of their oath of Canonicall obedience . Thus have you taken away the * * Luk. 11. Key of knowledge , and hangd it at your owne girdle , so as neither ye goe into heaven your selves , and those that would enter , ye hinder . But what doe I say ? Have you and your Prelates reserved to your selves ( as one of the Papall Reserved Cases ) the power of preaching the Gospel ? My Lord under correction you forget your selfe . Do you not remember the Kings Order for preaching , or rather for not preaching , that no Ministers , of what degree or ranke soever they be , Archbishop , Bishop , and all under them , shall not preach of the Doctrines of Election , Predestination , Redemption of the Elect onely , Effectuall vocation of the Elect onely , Iustification of the Elect onely , Assurance of Salvation to the Elect onely in Grace , all which Doctrines are the maine and sole Doctrines of Grace , and of the Gospel , So as for Ministers not to preach of these , and maintaine them against the Adversaries thereof , and especially in these times of opposing and undermining the truth of Grace , and of the Gospel , is to cease to be Ministers of the Gospel ? According to which reckoning ( if the said Order be strictly observed , as you Prelates in all your Visitations doe charge the Ministers , inquiring of those , that be Delinquents in this kind , to suspend or admonish them ) you have no preachers of the Gospel left in the Church of England . And doe you not remember , that one Lent , after the said Order was come forth , two of the learnedst , Du●ham , Sarisbury . and most Orthodox Prelates of the Church of England for preaching before the King of such points , were both checked for it , since which time , I doe not heare they have transgressed the said Order ? And therefore I conceive , that his Grace of Canterbury is by the same Order inhibited to preach the Grace of the Gospel , or the Gospel in these dayes . King Iames indeed gave out an Order , inhibiting all inferiour Ministers onely to preach of those points , but reserved a liberty to Prelates and Deanes , to preach of them , as being men of more discretion , then ordinary . But now Bishops , nay Archbishops , and all are involved . Therfore had not your Lordship forgot your selfe , I suppose , you would not have told the King to his face , That the Truth you must tell , and the Gospel you must preach . Therfore correct that word , my Lord .

L. ibid. And when the Foundations of Faith are shaken , be it by Superstition , or Profanenesse , he that puts not to his hand , as firmely as he can , to support them , is too wary , and hath more care of himselfe , then of the cause of Christ .

P. A Speech Surely , which without any more adoe were sufficient to vindicate your Reputation with all good men ▪ had your words but a right meaning . But your Foundations of Faith are layd so low in the Earth , * * Polosus versatur in universalibus . in Generalibus , that no man can come clearely to discerne them , or what you meane by them . And besides , did you in this place meane the true Foundations of Faith indeed , yet being not constant to this in other of your passages , and much lesse in your practises , this is of the lesse credit , to obtain even of Charity it selfe any favourable interpretation . And having read over your Book , we come to be so well acquainted with your Foundations of Faith , that we may say truely , It no more belongs to you to put to your hand to support the true Foundations , then it did to § § 2 Sam. 6.6 , 7 Vzzah to stay the Arke , when the Oxen shooke it . For which his meddling , the Lord smote him . And I feare little better will be your reward . Nay what reward shall you expect , who instead of supporting the Foundations of Faith , doe put your heart , and head , and hand , and all you can to supplant them ? ( As we shall see all along . ) And I am perswaded , the more you speake in this kind , the more you rubbe and gall your owne Conscience , and make it so tender in this respect , that the least touch of conviction goes to your heart .

But stay : Do I not mistake , Foundations of Faith , instead of Superstition and Profanenesse ? For Them , here , may have for Antecedent aswell Superstition and Profanenesse , as Foundations of Faith . And so the sense runnes thus , He that puts not to his hand as firmly as he can to surport them , that is , Superstition and Profanesse , is too wary , &c. And now that I consider it better , this must be your meaning , if your words and deeds agree . And for proofe , let us come to particulars . You give us two generall instances , whereby the Foundations of Faith are shaken . The one , Superstition , the other Profanesse , Answerable to these two , I will help you out with two particular instances , the one of Superstion , the other , of Profanesse ; by both which the Foundations of Faith are shaken ; which we shall see how firmely you Support .

First , For Superstition , I instance in Altars . These you erect : these you bow unto . Now to set up , and bow unto , or before , or pray towards an Altar of wood or stone , overthowes Christ , the Prime and maine Foundation of Faith ; and that by your owne Confession . For Altars in the Old Testament were ordained of GOD to be Types and Figures of Christ , as also were the Sacrifices , and the Priests . But now Christ being come , our onely Sacrifice , our onely High Priest , and our onely Altar , those Types doe all cease . And in the New Testament , as Christ is called our Sacrifice and High Priest ; So also our Altar . * * Heb. 13.10 . We have an Altar ( saith the Apostle ) whereof they have no right to eate , which serve the Tabernacle . Why so ? For the Levites or Priests , which still served the Tabernacle , rested still in the Typicall Altar , denying Christ to be come , and so they have no right to Christ the true Altar , he being come , and having abolished all Types . And the Apostle there doth clearely prove this our Altar to be Christ . For ( saith he in the very next words , as a reason annexed ) The bodies of those Beasts , whose blood is brought into the Sanctuary by the High Priest for sinne , are burnt without the Campe : Wherefore Iesus also , that he might Sanctifie the people with his own blood , suffered without the Gate . Let us goe forth therefore unto him without the Campe , bearing his reproach For here we have no continuing City , but we seeke one to come . By him therefore let us offer the Sacrifice of praise to God continually , that is , the fruit of our lips , giving thanks to his name . In which words taken together , Christ is set forth unto us both as our onely Altar , and as our onely High Priest , and as our onely Sacifice . First , as our onely Altar , vers. 10. Secondly , as our onely High Priest ; For so he stands in relation to the Leviticall Priesthood , as the Truth to the Type , v. 11 , 12. Thirdly , as our onely Sacrifice , in offering his owne blood , v. 11. And thus he is said to Sanctifie us . And this sanctifying hath speciall relation to Christ , as the onely Altar . For in the * * Exod. 29.37 . Law , no Sacrifice , or Offering was sanctified , but by the Altar . being offered up upon it . As Christ saith to the Scribes and Pharisees those blind guides . ‡ ‡ Math. 23.19 Ye Fooles and blind : whether is greater the gift , or the Altar , that sanctifieth the gift ? Thus every gift , every Sacrifice is sanctified by the Altar , on which it was offered up . This Altar is onely Christ , whose blood being offered up upon the Altar of his Divinity , Person , or Nature , was thereby sanctified , and accepted of GOD , for an All-sufficient Sacrifice for our sinnes . And thus both the persons of all true beleevers , and their Spirituall Sacrifices are Sanctified , being offered up , and presented to GOD on the Altar Christ . Our Persons , as , Heb. 13.12 . and our gifts , or Sacrifices , v. 15. By him therefore let us offer the Sacrifice of praise continually , that is , the fruit of our lippes , giving thanks to his Name . Thus through Faith in Christs Name , all our Sacrifices of Prayer , of Praise , of Almes , and of a Contrite heart , are Sanctified and accepted of GOD , as Testimonies of our Faith , Charity , Repentance , Thankfullnesse , and Obedience , as being offered up upon our onely Altar Christ . This onely Altar it is , that Sanctifieth the gift . Thus we see how these three , Altar , Priest , Sacrifice , are equally , and inseparably resident in Christ . So as he is as well our onely Altar , as our onely High Priest , and our onely Sacrifice of expiation . And Bellarmine himselfe confesseth , that these three , Altar , Priest , Sacrifice , are Relatives , and alwayes goe together . Hee therefore that sets up another Altar besides Christ , may as well set up another High Priest , and another propitiatory Sacrifice , as Antichrist doth in the Masse . And to set up any one of these , not onely shakes , but quite overthrowes the maine Foundation Christ . And for the Altar , the Sanctification of all Sacrifices and offerings is so proper and peculiar unto it , that one of your * * Dr. P●●klinton in his Sermon of Christian Altars . Divines , going about to maintaine your Christian Altars ( as he calls them , but indeed Antichristian ) saith expresly , that of necessity there must be an Altar in every Church , as of wood or stone , to Sanctifie the Sacrifice , otherwise it should be altogether unsanctified . And how comes this Altar of his and yours to have such a treasure and overplus of holinesse in it , as to communicate such holinesse to the Sacrifice , yea to the Sacrifice of Christs body upon it ( as he puts it ) but by the Bishops Consecration of it , as the same Author saith , whose Book is by your Chapleins license published in Print . So as it seems your Episcopall consecration of the Altar infuseth a holinesse into it , and the Altar communicates and imparts its holinesse to the Sanctifying even of the Sacrifice of Christs body it selfe , which you would not have to be farre off from the Altar . But now it being most evident hereby , that your Altars doe quite overthrow the Foundation Christ , who is our onely Altar : how firmely you put to your hand to support this Foundation , I call heaven and earth to witnesse against you ; who being on the contrary a Supporter of Altars , and so a Supplanter of the onely true Altar Iesus Christ , you give sentence against your selfe , as one that is too wary , and hath more care of himselfe , then of the Cause of Christ . And forasmuch as you are so zealous in promoting your Altars in every Church , I do here in the Name of Iesus Christ , protest against you , as a most notorious Adversary of Christ , and so an Antichrist , a setter up of Judaisme or Heathenisme in your Altars ; and I doe utterly renounce all communion with you in your services , the principall part whereof you place in your Altars , which are so many damnable Idols , which you adoring , are damnable Idolaters , and which are set up and upholden to the intolerable reproach of Christ , and whereby he is altogether denyed and renounced . And thus you give just cause to all true Christians to seperate themselves from your communion , in your worship of a false Christ , as your false Altar , if they will hold their communion with Christ .

Now for the second Instance of shaking the Foundation Christ , which is Profanesse . Tell me , are not the ten Commandements Fundamentalls , as being the principles and rules of our Sanctification . So as the Popes Parasites are not so impudent , as in their Decretals , and other writings , to affirme , that he can dispence with the morall Law , although they say of him in the Decretalls , That Papa aliquando nimium Papaliter dispensat , The Pope sometimes dispenseth too papally , or Pope-like . What say you then of the 4 th Commandement , touching the Sabbath day of the Lord our God , and the Sanctification thereof ? Dare you say , the Commandement is not Morall , being placed in the midst of the Ten ? And though that seaventh day ( being the Last of the week , as wherein God rested after the finishing of the worke of Creation , which he therefore appointed to be the Sabbath day , of the Old Testament ) be now abrogated , as giving place to a new Sabbath day , the First of the Weeke wherein our Lord Iesus Christ ( having finished the worke of a New creation ) rising againe , entred into his Rest , namely the State of Rest , Immortality , and Glory : is therefore the 4 th Cammandements Morality so abrogated , as it is not still in force to injoyne us Christians the Sanctification of that day of the Week , which is the Sabbath day of the Lord our God , Iesus Christ ? Or doth it not aswell , and by the same Reason bind us Christians to the Sanctification of the first day of the week , as whereon the Lord our God Iesus Christ rested from a greater worke of Creation : as it did the Jewes to the Sanctification of the 7 th or last day of the Week , as whereon the Lord God rested from his worke of the Creation of Heaven and Earth ? It is so demonstrative and cleare , that to deny it , argues not onely grosse ignorance in the knowledge of Christ and of Divinity , but also a mind destitute of grace and true sanctity , that dare imagine the least imperfection or mutability to be in that , or any other of the Morall Commandements . Now if the 4 th Commandement bind us Christians ( as 't is cleare it doth , and as hereafter I shall take occasion to be a little more large in it ) to the Sanctification of the Sabbath , or rest day , of the Lord our God , which is now the First day of the weeke , upon the same Reason , that it obliged the Jewes of the Old Testament to keep the 7 th or last day of the week : then is not the open profanation of the Lords day by sports and pastimes , a shaking of a foundation of Faith ? Nor doe I meane onely a Profanation thereof de facto , in practise , either through ingnorance , or custome , or frailty : but by open and professed Toleration and Dispensation , and that by publick Edict , incouraging people to such vain sports , and pastimes , as doe most Heathenishly profane not onely the Day , but the very name of Christianity and Christian Profession . So as this Profanation and so violation of the 4 th Commandement , is of a very high nature , and a sinne of presumption , as wherein humane Authority lifts it selfe up against and above the Law-giver himselfe , daring to dispense with his holy and eternall Law , and that in giving liberty to the flesh to commit sinne , even with greedinesse . Now this Foundation of Faith , whereby the Communion of Saints , and all true sanctification of life , is supported , and maintained , to wit , in the due sanctification of this day , in all holy duties , publique and private , being thus not onely shaken , but with high contempt troden under profane feet , through intollerable pride of men : have you put to your hand as firmly as you can to support it ? Did you interpose your selfe , that that Booke for Sports might not be revived out of the Ashes , wherein it had lyen so long buried , as it was all , rotten , and forgotten ? Or , that it might not be reprinted , with a new Enforcement ? Or at least ( if it must needs be so ) that it might not be pressed upon Ministers , to read it in their Congregations to the manifest dishonour of GOD , and their holy Ministry , and to the great offence of their Consciences , and of their People ? And when the feare of GOD , and their owne Conscience withheld some from reading of it : did you spare any of them from suspension at least ? Did you spare Mr. Wilson of Kent , from Suspending him with your own mouth ? Nay were not divers Ministers , in Surrey and els where , as in Kent , Essex , &c. so prosecuted , as either they were put out of their livings , as Mr. Snelling of Kent , or els for feare of worse , did voluntarily quit their livings , and got them gone ? And when upon petition some were referred to you , what reliefe had they ? Did you put to your hand , as firmely as you could to support the poore men ? Or did you show them the least mercy or favour ? Nay , on the contrary , are you not the Grand , if not the Sole Instrument both of reviving , republishing , pressing it upon Ministers , punishing and oppressing them , yea and undoing them about it ? Is this to put to your hand as firmly as you can to support such a Foundation of Faith , when you not onely shake , but breake down the Pillars , by whose Ministry such a foundation is maintained ? Are you not then not onely too wary , and one that hath more care of himselfe , then of the Cause of Christ : but too unreasonably bold , and impious , in not onely not supporting , but putting to your hand as firmely as you can to the utter demolishing and ruinating of these holy Foundations of Faith , both by your Antichristian superstition , and Heathenish profanesse ? Nay , in so shaking one Foundation , the 4 th Commandment , in the open toleration of the profanation of the Lords Sabbath day , you shake all those ten Foundations , overturning all holinesse , all duties to God and Man , as Infidelity against the first Commandement ; Setting up your May-Idol-Poles against the second Commandement : taking Gods name in vaine , in breaking that Baptismall vow of Christianity , in renouncing all vanity , against the third Commandement : despising and abusing Gods Ordinances against the fourth : teaching irreverence and disobedience to Parents and Masters , and that expresly against the fifth Commandement : giving occasion of murther , against the sixth : of adultery , against the seaventh : of drunkennesse , and so of theft , and opening the very flood gate to all wickednesse . To conclude this point , Either your Lorship is most grosly ignorant of the Foundations of Faith , what they be , or you are extreamely selfe blind in imagining , that the world will not suspect any Serpent lurking under the green leaves of your goodly words , having too much tasted of your bitter fruits ; so as your fair words , and foule actions , must needs make men asmuch abhorre your gracelesse hypocrisie , as they doe your shamelesse impiety , while under a faire colour and meere pretence of holding and upholding the Foundations of Faith , you undermine them , and blow them up .

L. p. [ 13 , 14. Comparing the Church to a Hive of Bees , you say ] Now the King and the Priest , more then any other , are bound to look to the Integrity of the Church , in Doctrines and Manners , and that in the first place . [ And a little after ] Now in this great and busie worke , the King and the Priest must not feare to put their hands to the Hive , though they be sure to be stung . The Kings case ( as King Davids ) is to be stung with Bees : but when it comes to the Priest , the case is altered : they come about him like Waspes , or like Hornets , rather ; All sting , and no honey there . And all this for no offence , nay sometimes for service done them , would they see it , &c.

P. However you may please your selfe in your conceits , in playing with this your similitude of Bee-hive : yet perhaps upon a review of all circumstances , you will begin to discerne no small incongruity , except you can salute it with , Similitudo non currit quatuor pedibus : A Similitude runs not upon all foure . For first , A Hive of Bees you know , is a kind of compleat Common-weale within it selfe . Such is Christs true Church . The Chiefe and great Master-Bee in this Hive , is Christ , and his holy Spirit : A Christian King , who is in and of the Hive , is under Christ , a kind of Subordinate Master-Bee ; whose Office it is , to see , that the expresse voyce and Law of Christ , and that alone , both touching Doctrines and Manners , be duely observed both by the Ministers and People , and that the Delinquents and Offenders be either reformed , or punished , according to the same Law of Christ . As for the Priest , whom you name , and set Cheeke by Jowle with the King , and that twice here for fayling : let me tell you , that the New Testament , and so the true Christian Church knoweth not , neither acknowledgeth any Priest , besides Christ , who is , as the onely Altar , so the onely Priest of his Church ; as is noted before . And did not I say , That Altar and Priest would ever goe together ? Here you are up with your Priest . And who is this Priest ? Even no lesse , then the Metropolitan of all England . Poore humble Priest ! But a Priest , however . Otherwise what should you doe with your Altar , we spake of , if you had not a Priest to it ? And having an Altar and Priest , you must needs have a Sacrifice too , els all would be lame . As Isaack said to his Father , * * Gen. 22.7 . My Father , here is fire and wood , but where is the Sacrifice ? So you may Say , we have here an Altar , and Priest ; we must have a Sacrifice too . But ( I say ) the true Church of GOD acknowledgeth no Priest , but Christ , as no Altar , no Sacrifice but Him . Onely indeed all true beleevers are called , and made of GOD ‡ ‡ Rev. 1.6 . Kings and Priests and ‡ ‡ 1 Pet. 2.5.9 . a royall Priesthood , as were also the beleeving § § Exod. 19.6 . Jewes under the Old Testament , to whom Moses saith , Ye shal be unto me , saith God , a Kingdome of Priests , and an holy Nati●n . As for Aarons Priesthood , it is abolished and swallowed up in our onely High Priest , Iesus Christ , † † Heb. 7.17 . made a Priest for ever after the order of Melchisedech . Yet every beleever is a Priest , to * * 1 Pet. 2.5 . offer up Spirituall Sacrifices to God by Iesus Christ . Which shews a plain difference between Christs Priesthood , and our royall Priesthood . For We offer up Spirituall Sacrifices to God by Iesus Christ , but he by himselfe offered the Sacrifice of himselfe to GOD for us . So as not even Ministers of Gods word are otherwise Priests , but as they are beleevers onely in their publick Ministry they are the mouth of Gods people , in offering up to GOD Spirituall Sacrifices of Prayer and thanksgiving by Iesus Christ . But your Priesthood , my Lord is a new Order , of humane Ordinance , and Ordination , not found in , nor founded upon Gods word , and therefore a false , and unlawfull Priesthood . ‡ ‡ Heb. 5.4 . For no man takes this honour upon him , but he that is called of GOD , as was Aaron . But your Priesthood hath no calling from GOD. Nor doth the New Testament once call a Minister of the Gospell hierùs , Sacerdos , Priest . It calls them Presbutèrous indeed , Presbyters , or Elders , but never hiereis , Sacerdotes , Priests ; for hiereùs , is properly such a Priest , as offereth a slaine Sacrifice , as hiereion , is a Sacrifice that is slaine . And thus are you Priests , in Sacrificing either Christs body , as in the Masse , or els the Bodies of his Saints , who are in this respect accounted as Sheep for the Slaughter . Rom. 8.36 . Let therefore the Church of Rome , ( and yours of England , if ye will ) have her Priests , Altars , Sacrifices : as for the true Church of Christ , she admitteth none of all these . And though you yoak your Priest , or ( as at * * P. 155. after ) your very aliâs , the Archbishop of Canterbury with the King : yet we must put kasma méga , a vast difference and disparity between them . For first a Christian King , or Magistrate Supream is ( as we touched before ) both within , and of the Hive : but the Priest you speake of , is quite without the Hive , and none of the Hive , no Priest of Christs true Church , but an intruder , Droane , Waspe , or Hornet .

Secondly , good Christian Princes , executing their office aright , are § § Isa. 49.23 . Nursing Fathers to the Church , and helpe to bring in supply to the Hive , and guard it from vermine and weather : but your Priest , even the whole Generation , and swarme of them , are Step-fathers to the Bees , and are Droanes , eating up the Honey , as you confesse here of some ; if not Waspes and Hornets also , Stinging and Killing the Bees , or chasing them out of the Hive , into some hollow tree in the Desert .

Lastly , the King doing his office in , and to the Hive , is loved , reverenced , and ob●yed by the Bees , and they yeeld him a Tribute of their Honey : But when your Priest puts his rough hand to the Hive , the Bees are ready to fly about his eares , as not acknowledging any such Usurper . And have you never read nor heard , that if one that is chaste , come among the Bees , not offering violence unto them , they will never offer to sting him : but if an adulterous person come amongst them , they will quickly smell him out , and be all about his eares ? And be sure , Christs Bees cannot brooke such Priests , as smell of the whore of Babels Smocke , and commit spirituall whoredome with her , or have any hankering affection after her . And therefore mervaile not , if ( as you say ) when it comes to the Priest , the Bees come about like Waspes , or Hornets , all sting , and no honey for your Priest there . And you seem to speak it feelingly . Surely if you deale roughly with the Bees , and begin to lay about you , they wil be about your Eares . Therefore be not curst unto them , least you make them as angry as a Bee . Thus by your patience I have truely and genuinely applyed your Similitude . As for the occasion , what ever it be , or may be , whereupon you bring it in , and so apply it , so much complaining of the Bees , for their stinging , as if you felt the present smart of it : though perhaps an ordinary Bee may smell it out , yet I will not take upon me to divine it . But if you will contend and offer violence to a whole Hive , forcing the Bees beyond their nature , though you be never so well armed Cap a pied , from top to toe , as with * * 1 Sam. 17.38 . Sauls armour , so as the Bees cannot reach you : yet how shall you escape the sting of the great Master-Bee , JESUS CHRIST , who is able with one whoope to rayse an army of flies to plague the Aegyptian Tyrants and Taskmasters , for their extreame violence offered to his poore Bees . And never look that such Bees should ever brook your Priest , as having learned by too much experience , that § § Ioh. 1● . 10 . he comes not but to kill , and take the honey . As Christ saith of the Thiefe , or Vsurper , that climbeth up into the Sheep-fold another way , He cometh not , but to steale , kill , and to destroy .

Againe , I must crave a little more of your patience , while I somewhat more thorowly Scan your Conjunction of the King and Priest so closse , and inseparably together . The King and the Priest : or , The King and the Prelate : or , The King , and the Bishop : according to a new Late Start up Proverbe , or ( as you make it ) a new Maxime in the Politicks , No Bishop , no King . Now for a ground whereon to pitch the Mathematicall Staffe of my ensuing Demonstration , I must begge two Ait●mata , or Demands : First , That ever a King is , good ; this is such a principle , as transcends the Demonstration of Art . For , * * Rom. 13. He 〈◊〉 Minister of GOD to thee for Good : Ergo Good . The Second is , That a Priest or Prelate ( as being out of the ranke of Gods Creation , and Ordination ) is ever Bad. These two things granted , ( as they may not be denyed ) I say : It is not good , that Good and Bad be joyned together . Although as ‡ ‡ Scal. Exercit. contra Cardanum . Scaliger saith , Malum non est , nisi in bono : Evill is not , but in good . But the King and Priest thus linked together , are like to two Planets in Conjunction , the one ( as Astronomers tell us ) Benigne , the other Malignant ▪ and during the Conjunction , the Benigne Planet is not so forcible in its kindly influence , as the Malignant is potent in hindering it , and in sending forth his own more predominant Malignity , not so easily qualified by the Benignity of the other . And they say againe , that some Planets are of such a temper , as they are neither good , nor bad , but as they are in Conjunction with others ; if with a good Planet , they are good ; if with a bad , evill . As we read of King ‡ ‡ 2 Chro. 24. Ioash , who so long as good Iehoiada the High Priest lived ▪ raigned well : but he being dead , he by the bad Counsell of his Princes fell to Idolatry . So an evill Planet being in Conjunction with an indifferent , may cause it to doe hurt , which in its owne nature is not much malignant . Againe , 't is observed of the Oake ( which for strength among all the Trees , may be an Embleme of a King ) being all overgrown with the Ivie ( which for its many insinuations and windings every way , may well resemble your Priest ) it thrives not ; the fewer leaves and branches it puts forth , for shade and protection from a shower or storme , or heat of Summer : and litle fruit , to feed the hungry : for it is hide-bound , so guirt in by the Ivie , that it cannot prosper . Yea such a Conjunction cannot be more fitly parallelled , in my judgement , then to the feet of that Image in § § Dan. 2. Daniel : the Head whereof was of gold : the breast and armes of silver : the belly and thighs of brasse : his legges of iron : his feet part of iron , and part of clay . The Image represented the Successive Raignes in the Babilonian Monarchy , each worse then other , till at last it came to ruine . And it may be an Embleme of all Kingdomes and States , which if they want the ancient Roman Lustration , or Purgation every five yeares ( like some old Statutes of England for a Trienniall Visitation , a certain thing , which was wont to be called a Parliament ) or so , will ( according to an old observation in the Politicks ) easily grow worse and worse . As the Roman Poet observed in his time : Aetas parentum pejor avis ; Tulit nos equiores , mox daturos Progeniem vitiosiorem .

In English thus : Our Fathers Age , which they did passe , Grew worse then our Grand-fathers was : Our selves worse then our Parents be , And our next race proves worse then we .

But we pitch ( to be silent in the rest of the Image ) upon the feet , mixt of iron and clay ; the last legges ( as the Proverb ) which that Empire went upon . Iron ( as Daniel interprets it ) signifies strength ; but Clay , brittlenesse ; which intermeddled with the Iron , addes no strength to it , but onely makes it swell the bigger , which swelling portends and causes ruine . For the Iron relying on its mixture with the Clay , and the Clay presuming to doe great things , by being joyned and backed with the Iron : here is the Portent . * * Rev. 17. In the Revelation we read of Kings , giving their power to the Beast , that is , giving way to the Beast , or to his limbs , the Priests , to exercise a power over them , and their Kingdomes : For which cause England was wont to be called the Popes Asse . ‡ ‡ v. 16 , 17. The ten hornes , which thou sawest upon the Beast , these shall hate the whore , and shall make her desolate , and naked , and shall eate her flesh , and burne her with fire . For God hath put in their hearts to fulfill his will , and to agree , and give their Kingdome unto the Beast , untill the words of God shal be fulfilled . On this GOD , and on his word , will we wait . Sure we are , that the whore of Babylon , with her Priests , shall ‡ ‡ Rev. 18 , 19. come down into the dust . And § § vers. 4. all Gods people are admonished to come out of her , least they partake of her sinnes , and receive of her plagues ; So in due time , when Gods word shall be fulfilled , the Iron shall unmixe it selfe from the Clay , that the one may be preserved , and the other goe to his * * Act. 1.25 . owne place , to the earth , whence it came , and whe●eof it is .

But in the next place , for what good end and purpose doe you linke your Priest with the King ? Because ( say you ) They , more then any other are bound to looke to the Integrity of the Church , in Doctrine , and Manners . Surely , for the first , the King , we doe in all humility imbrace and acknowledge him , as Gods vicegerent , bound to doe that office for the true Church of Christ , which Gods word hath injoyned and requires of him . And that consists generally in ●his , as he is Custos utriusque Tabulae , the * * Deut. 17.18.19 . Keeper in trust of both the Tables of the Law : he is to see , ut currat Lex , that Gods Law and Word hina treke , that it may run , have a free passage , without impeachment ; that the Commandements of the Law be kept Sarta tecta , safe and sound , without diminishing , much lesse demolishing any one of them ; that nothing be done , either in Doctrine or Manners , or in the worship of GOD , besides the prescript and precise Rule of Gods written word : that able and godly Ministers , duely chosen by Gods people , and Congregation , be set over every Congregation , to preach Gods word diligently to the people , and that the well deserving be cherished , incouraged , countenanced , and protected from oppression , but the Droanes cast out of the Hive . This is all the King need to be carefull of about the Hive of Christ . For then , as for Doctrine and Manners Gods word in the due administration thereof , will sufficiently direct , informe , instruct , and teach both what to beleeve , and how to live , and † † 1 Pet. 2.17 . worship God , and honour the King .

But for the Priest you speake of , to intermeddle : Procul ô ! hands off , Here 's no roome for him , he may get him to Rome to his Sacrifice . This Priest ( as is already touched ) hath no calling of GOD at all , and therefore not bound to any such thing : much lesse ought he to yoake himself with Kings , that he may prescribe what Doctrines and Manners do best please his own corrupt and blind fancie . And as for you my Lord , if you be that Priest ( as 't is most likely ) what kind of doctrine we might look for at your hand , your Book here will sufficiently inform us , as we shall see throughout , and as partly we have seen by your acts , edicts , declarations , and practises . And for Manners : I pray you what Manners will your Priest teach us ? Namely , how to make a legge , or a courtesie at our coming within the Church , with the posture of our face towards your Altar : devoutly and lowly to bow , passing by , or approaching your Altar : devoutly to pray with the face east-wards , towards your Altar : to make a low legge , or crindge , when the name Iesus is named : to doffe the bonnet , with some other courtesie , before an ‡ ‡ Appeale to Caesar. Image , Crosse , or Crucifix : to receive the Communion kneeling before your Altar : and many such like , as will fit time and place . Yet whether these be your Manners or Doctrines , you can best resolve us . And if you meane Morall Manners in life and conversation , can your Priest teach them ? Can he that ruffles up and downe the Court in his Silkes and Sattens , teach men humility ? Can he that ambitiously aspires to honours and riches in the world , teach men contempt of the world , and contentednesse with a meane estate ? Can he that flatters and dissembles , and playes the Hypocrite , teach men Sincerity and Truth ? Can he that is an * * R●v . 12.10 . Accuser of the Brethren , teach men Charity ? Can he that is a cruell persecuter of Gods servants and children , teach men to be mercifull ? Can he that oppresseth the innocent in their cause , and takes away the righteousnesse of the righteous from him , teach men to doe justice ? Can he that hates the very name of holinesse , and the practise and profession thereof in a strict life , as GOD commandeth , teach men to be holy ? Can he that labours all he can to put out the light , and to put down ‡ ‡ Rev. 1.20 . Candlesticks that hold it forth , to set up his blind Priesthood , teach men to walke as Children of the light ? Can he that stops Ministers mouthes for preaching the truth , teach how Ministers ought to preach ? Can he that hates holy Wedlocke , and violently ‡ ‡ As in the Case of Dr. Bastwick , and Mr. Burton . Separates Man and Wife without Cause , teach Man and Wife their mutuall duties to each other ? Can he teach Chastity , who thus exposeth marryed Couples to Satans temptations to § § 1 Cor. 7.5 . incontinencie ? Or ( in a word ) is he fit to look to the Integrity of the Church in Doctrine and Manners , whose both judgement and affections in both , are altogether corrupted ? Away therefore with your Priest from the King , least that come to passe indeed , which here you say ( as it were to prepare the way ) that the Priest undertaking to qualifie the Church , with a new kind of integrity ( as he hath already done in a good measure in Doctrine and Manners , he bring to utter ruine both Church and Kingdome .

Lastly , before I leave your Comparison of the Bee-hive , I cannot but note two pl●ces of Scripture , which you make ( as you use to doe , when you apply any Scripture , which is not a Shooe will fit your foot ) very bold with . For the first : you say , The Kings case ( as King Davids ) is to be stung with the Bees . For this you quote in the Margent , Psal. 118.12 . And you apply it to the King , saying , God grant it be never yours . Why , was David stung by the true Church and Children of GOD , which you compare to a Hive of Bees ? You are much mistaken . David there speakes not onely in his owne Person , but as a Type , ingenerall of Gods Church , and in particular of Christ . First , as in his owne Person : who were those Bees that stung him , or buzzed about his eares ? Were they any of Gods Children ? Was it not especially Saul , who continually persecuted him , and sought his life , to have stung him to death ? Wherein was he not rather the Master-Wasp , or the Master-Hornet , that with his * * 1 Sam. 20. Swarms of Wasps and Hornets , armed troopes pursued after Davids life , and sometime inclosed him like a Swarme of Bees ? And for this very Cause , did not David complaine to the Lord of Sauls cruelty , setting forth his wickednesse under the name ‡ ‡ Psal. 59.58 . of Heathen ? For when ‡ ‡ Psal. 59. Title of the Psalm . Saul sent , and they watcht the house to kill him , coming about him like Bees : David thereupon flyes to GOD in prayer , to deliver him from the workers of iniquity , and to save him from bloody men . ver. 1.2 . § 5. Thou therefore , O Lord God of Hosts , the God of Israel , awake to visit all the Heathen : be not mercifull to any wicked Transgressors . And vers. 8. But thou , O Lord , vers. 8. shalt laugh at them , thou shalt have all the Heathen in derision . Now by Heathen here is plainly meant , Saul and his wicked Servants and Officers , and that for their heathenish cruelty , seeking to murther innocent David . With such Bees therefore was he compassed about . That 's for his Person . Secondly , David in that Psalme , 118. represents the Church of God , that Bee hive you Spake of , whose Bees are often smoaked out of their Hive , or smothered in the Hive , and their honey devoured by the wild Boares of the Forrest , the Common Bee-hunters , a right Embleme of the cruell persecuters of Gods Children and Church , who are here in the world , as Sheep in the midst of Wolves . One fresh bleeding-new example I could give you of one Member of this Church , one Bee of this Hive , whom you sent your Officers with Swords and Weapons beseting his house to take him , as you did , and though not to kill him presently , yet with intent , that in case He did live , His life should be worse then any death . So as , hath not such a one reason to hold himselfe one of that Church , which David in his † † Psal. 58. Psal 59. Psalmes , prefigured , as touching the afflicted estate therof in this world ? But enough of this Instance before . Thirdly , in that Psalme , and that passage by you quoted , and so foulely misapplyed , David speakes Typically and Prophetically of Christ , and that principally . They came about him like Bees . Who ? The High Priests , the Scribes and Pharisees , who also hooked in the secular power , Caesar , and the Priest ; these came Swarming about Christ , like Bees ; which they did , first in the Garden , where they apprehended him ; then in the High Priests hall , where they accused him ; then in the Praetorium , before Pilate , where they condemned him ; as before Herod , where they mocked him : and last of all , they Stung him to the heart with a Roman Speare , his hands and feet fast nayled to the Crosse. Thus the Great Master Bee of the Hive was stung to death by the Hierarchies instigation . And thus indeed , GOD grant it never be our Kings case , as it was Christs . Thus I hope you see by this time , what a Divine you are in your application of Scripture . If you heare but the buzzing of a Bee , presently that 's the Bee that stings you . Whereas in truth , you and all such as you , who are persecuters of Christ , and murtherers of him in his Saints , and Servants , are those Bees that David , and in him Christ complaines of , They came about me like Bees . But take with you what followes : They ( these Bees ) are quenched as the fire of thornes : For in the Name of the Lord I will destroy them .

The Second place ( which I wonder at more ; and yet I will now * * Nil admirari , prope res est una , Solaque quae 〈◊〉 facere & s●rvare b●atum . cease to wonder at any thing you either doe , or dare to speake ) which you quote , is Rev. 22.12 . Behold I come quickly , and my reward is with me , to give to every man according as his works shal be . Now this you apply to your selfe , as a medicine to cure that sting , which ( you say ) the Bees have given you . Why , what Bees doe sting you ? If any , are they not ( and that by your own confession ) the Bees of Gods own Hive , his true Church ? And why doe they sting you ? Is it not for your slapping of them , and smoaking them out of their Hive ? But how , or wherewithall do they sting you ? Alas , poore soules , they have no other stings , but Prayers and Teares , and the sting of Truth , which they preach and professe . These are their proper stings . Perhaps ( as they have cause enough ) they pray against you , as a most cruell persecuter of the poore painfull Bees of Christ , his Ministers , and an overthrower of their Hives , and a destroyer of the Bees . But such stings you little care for , as which you are not affraid to provoke more and more against you every day . But beleeve it , their Prayers like winged darts , or arrowes , fly swiftly , and pierce deep , and will deadly wound where they light , though as yet ye be not sensible of it . But all this while I heare not a word of the Hornets-Selfe - stinging . Why doe ye not yet cry out of the deadly sting of your own Conscience , For all the innocent blood of Gods Servants , which you have shed , and for all the havock you have made in his Hive ? Nay rather , your heart is so hardned with sinne , and blinded with Romish zeale , that instead of remorse , you look for a reward . And a reward you shall have of him , whose words you feare not to cite , who Saith , Behold I come quickly , and my Reward is with me , to give to every man , according as his works shal be . But you tell us immediately before this , that you are stung of the Bees , many times for no offence , nay sometime for Service done them , would they see it . Many times for no offence . Therfore it seems sometimes it is for offence done them by you . But can you name any one time , when they sting you without being extreamely provoked by your offence given them ? Shew it if you can . Nay , sometimes ( you say ) for Service done them . Somtimes ? When ? And what Service ? Your oppressing and burthening their Consciences with more and more Romish rites and Ceremonies ? Your fetching them up to your High-Commission , and there undoing of them , clipping their wings , that they can now no more doe their office , and bring any more honey to the Hive ; and so muzling their mouthes , that they cannot , dare not , so much as humme ? What other Service can they see you doe them ? Or do you your selfe know any , that you do in private for these Bees ? Do you now and then whisper a good word for them in the Kings eare ? That were a good heareing , if you did it on the right side . But this service we confesse you do them : You drive them closser to their GOD , make them pray the more earnestly and fervently , and to be the more provident in the well husbanding of that poore stock of honey they have got , both because you have stocked up all those flowers , on which they should gather more ; and least that which they have , you should take from them .

For a Conclusion of this your similitude of the Bee-hive : the Church of Christ upon earth you compare to a Hive of Bees . And when the Priest putteth his hand to the Hive , he shal be sure to be Stung , and there is no Honey for him . This Priest is the Prelate , an Hierarchicall man . And as I noted before , the true Bees of Christ , his true Church , cannot brook such Priests , such Hierarchicall men , to meddle with them . Ergo hence I conclude , that the Hierarchy , consisting of Priests , and such like men , as Prelates , or an Hierarchicall Church , is no true Church of Christ , is not this Hive of Bees , to which you compare the Church of Christ upon earth . How so ? For your Prelaticall Church is such a Hive of Bees , as the Priest may put his hand to the Hive without any feare or danger of stinging , at his pleasure . For in that Hive all the Bees are so conformable to the Priest their Master-Bee , as they yeeld all subjection to his dictates , neither doe they , or dare they , at any time offer to sting him . But if this Priest offer to meddle with Christs Bee-hive , and to impose his Cannon Law , and Ceremonies upon Christs Bees , to inforce them to conformity to his Rules , the Bees doe no more acknowledge such a Priest , or Prelate for a Master , then Christs Sheep , which will not heare the voyce of a strange Shepheard . Iohn 10.5 . And if he will needs force them , he must not blame them , if they sting him . For as Christ said to the Jewes , Ye are not of my Sheep : So such Priests , with their Hierarchy , are none of Christs Hive . Prelaticall Churches , therefore are none of Christs true Churches . And thus much of the Bee-Hive .

L. p. 15. The Church of England is in a hard Condition . She professes the Ancient Catholick Faith , and yet the Romanist condemnes her of Novelty in her Doctrine . She practises Church Government , as it hath been in all Ages , and places , where the Church of Christ hath taken any rooting , both in , and ever since the Apostles times , and yet the Seperatist condemnes her for Antichristianisme in her Discipline .

P. It matters not so much , who they be , that thus condemn your Church of England , as how true it is , whereof you are condemned . Doth the Romanist condemn you of Novelty in Doctrine ? And what defence have you against this charge ? You say , She professeth the Ancient Catholick Faith . Is this your best Apology for your Church of England ? Profession of Faith no Sound and Sufficient proofe of a true beleever . Is profession sufficient , when you are departed from the Ancient Catholick Faith ? And is not the Ancient Catholick Faith , that , which Christ and his Apostles taught , and have left recorded in the Scriptures ? Dare you deny this ? Now in what particular the Romanist condemnes you for Novelty in Doctrine , I know not . Surely not in those , wherein themselves are equally condemned , I will instance in two Doctrines , wherein both you and they are Apostatized and departed from the Ancient Catholick Faith in your Novelty of Doctrine . The first is your Forbidding of Marriage , wherein thus farre you goe with the Romanist , in forbidding Marriage to all sorts of persons for certain times in the yeare , in all , amounting to upon 20. weeks , wanting not halfe a quarter of halfe of the yeare . The Second is , Forbidding Certain Meates , on certaine dayes , and weeks , in the yeare . And your Zeale in the observation hereof showeth plainly , that you make it a matter of Religion , as the Romanist doth , and not a meere civill thing , as the Statute makes it . Now let us see what the Adostle saith of both these : for he couples them together : * * 1 Tim. 4.1 , 2 , 3 , 4 , 5 , 6. Now the Spirit speaketh expresly , that in the latter times some shall depart from the Faith , giving heed to seducing Spirits , and Doctrines of Devils , speaking lyes in hypocrisie , and commanding to abstain from Meats , which GOD hath created to be received with thanksgiving of them , which beleeve and know the Truth . For every Creature of GOD is good , and nothing to be refused , if it be received with thanksgiving . For it is sanctified by the Word of GOD , and Prayer . If thou put the brethren in remembrance of these things , thou shalt be a good Minister of Iesus Christ , nourished up in the words of Faith and good D●ctrine , whereunto thou hast attained . So the Apostle . Where we may observe these particulars . First , That these two Doctrines , Forbidding of Marriage and certaine Meates , are , Doctrines of Devils : Secondly they proceed from lying Spirits : Thirdly they are lyes spoken in hypocrisie ; as if some times were more holy then Marriage it selfe , * * Heb. 13.4 . which is honourable amongst all , and at all times : or , as if some meates were holyer then other , or some more uncleane then other , at some times . Fourthly such as teach , hold , and practise these Doctrines , have cauterized or seared Consciences , which instead of remorse , glory in these Doctrines , and stiffely maintain them , and out of which your Prerogative Courts , and other Episcopall Courts sucke no small advantage , making a rich merchandise of them . Fifthly , That the holding of these Doctrines is a departing from the faith : Apost●sonta , tines , some shall apostatise , or be Apostates from the faith ; such as hold these Doctrines . And this faith is the true , ancient , Catholick Faith , which they depart from . Sixthly , These Doctrines , are the markes and fruits of the last times , perillous times , times of Antichrist , and Antichristian Apostacie ; and therfore they are Doctrines of Novelty . Seaventhly , For the truth and confirmation of all this , The Spirit speaketh it expresly , So as it admits of no doubting , or gainsaying . Eightly , and lastly , That it is the duty of every good Minister of Iesus Christ , nourished up in the words of faith and good Doctrine , to put the Bretheren in remembrance of these things . So as it were to be wished , that the Church of England had some good Ministers of Iesus Christ , that durst and would cry out against these Doctrines of Divels , practised by the Prelates and their Disciples , and learned from Antichrist himselfe , and upheld by his Canon Law against the expresse word of God . Thus then doth not the Church of England justly lie under the Apostles sentence of condemnation for Novelty in Doctrine , yea holding Doctrines of Devils , and that by the expresse testimony ( not of Romanists , ) but of Gods Spirit , that cannot lye ? I could give many more instances of novelty in your Doctrine , though not as yet generally professed , yet practised , preached and printed by Authority ( though if ye be charged home with it , either that Book shal be burned , and the Printer blamed , or they will prove but private mens opinions , as you say in your Book ) As Invocation of Saints , Iustification by Charity , Erection of Altars , with many other Popish Doctrines , as also New Arminian Heresies , old Pelagianisme , newly raked out of hell againe , whither they had been long agoe remaunded , which to entertaine , and maintaine in your Church of England , you have made your Articles of Religion ( and that by an Edict , or Declaration prefixed before them ) to be of a dubious sense , and to equivocate , having a mentall Reservation of sense for the adverse party , while the Orthodox imagineth the letter to be on his side , and as it hath ever so been taken , till you altered the case : But the two former Instances shal be sufficient witnesses against you for the present , that you are departed from the Ancient Catholick Faith , being justly condemned of Novelty in Doctrine , yea Doctrines of Divels . So as here ye may have a sounder Answer to stoppe the Romanists mouth , charging the Church of England with Novelty in Doctrine , then to say , She professeth the Ancient Catholick Faith : Tell the Romanist by way of Retortion , That in some things the Church of England is no more to be condemned of Novelty in Doctrine , then the Church of Rome is , nor altogether so much .

We come now to your discipline , wherein the Separatist ( you say ) condemnes her ( the present Church of England ) of Antichristianisme . A sore Charge , and sufficient , if true , to seperate from you . But what defence have you for this ? Surely you say , She practiseth Church-Government , as it hath been in use in All Ages , and all Places , where the Church of Christ hath taken any rooting , both in , and ever since the Apostles times , and yet the Seperatist condemnes her for Antichristianisme in her Discipline . Here you say something indeed , and to some purpose , could you make it good . For to say , you professe , is nothing : but to professe and practise , that 's matter of cleare evidence . And yet I say , could you prove it so , it were but to some purpose , and not sufficient to acquit you from Antichristianisme , which is the maine Point . For Some things were in use even in the Apostles times , and have continued ever since in all Ages , and all Places too , where the Church you meane of , hath taken now in tract of time a deepe rooting in the Earth , yea even there also , where Christs true Church hath taken rooting : and yet all this is no sufficient Argument or warrant for the true Church of Christ presently to imbrace them . For instance , The Mystery of Iniquity began to worke in the Apostles time , as he affirmeth , 2 Thesse . 2.7 . And an example hereof St. Iohn notes in his third Epistle , of Diotrephes , 3 Iohn 9. who was ambitious of Prelacie , hee loved to have , The Preeminence , the Bishops Chaire , hee prateth against Iohn , hee receives not the bretheren , and forbids them that would , and and throwes them out of the Church by Excommunication , just as you and the Pope doe . This ambition and erection of Prelacie or Hierarchy , was that Mystery of Iniquity , which Satan began to brood and hatch even in the Apostles dayes , and wherein we have Diotrephes , quickly grown up as the first Cocke of the Game , of speciall and particular note , and name , that durst affront even the Apostle himselfe . And this Mystery of Iniquity , hath continued ever since , though at first , and in the first Ages it grew up but slowly , by reason of a tò katekon , à Remora , or maine impediment , the Roman Empire , whose Imperiall Seat being once removed from Rome to Constantinople by Constantine , who consopited , appeased , and put an end to those tenne Persecutions , which had been a great hinderance to Antichrists growth : then began this Mistery to perke up , and the Bishop of Rome Silvester the first could be content to weare a Crown , put upon his head by Constantine , which upon Boniface the eight his head , was multiplyed to a triple Crown , one for heaven , another for earth , and third for purgatory ; and thus by degrees successively it grew up to that height , which we see it now arrived at , even its Akmè , or full Stature , beyond which it cannot goe , though it would : So as its main care , strength , Nec ultra quo jam progrediatur habet . and policie , is all little enough Parta tueri , to maintain what it hath got . Now ( I say ) in this Mystery of Iniquity ( I mean the Prelacie , or Hierarchy ) was Antichrist begotten , born , bred up , and at length brought to his full maturity and perfection . Now is this Mystery of Iniquity therefore good , because it is able to vie and plead Antiquity even as high up , as the Apostles owne times , and so along downe to ours ? Though I doe more then suspect , that you take it in foule Scorne , that I should Anti-christen your Prelacie or Hierarchie with the name of the Mystery of Iniquity . But if ye will be patient a while , I shall , ere I have done , give you ( I hope ) good Satisfaction . And in the meane time the Apostle shall passe his word for it , who in the very same place , where he speakes of the Mystery of Iniquity , doth speake also of the Man of Sin , the Son of Perdition , who is an Adversary , and exalteth himself above all that is called God , or that is worshiped , who sitteth as God in the Temple of God , shewing himselfe , that he is God . The very recitall of which words may suffice to stay any reasonable mans stomacke from breaking out into outragious impatience , against him , that saith , The Prelacie is the Mystery of Iniquity . But you shall have it ( God willing ) at full anon .

Againe , some of your Divines goe about to drive the Antiquity of your holy Lent-Fast from the Apostles very times , and so to have continued ever since in all Ages , and Places , where the Church hath taken any rooting . And indeed some Christians even then began to observe * * Col. 2.21 . Touch not , Tast not , handle not ; and to ‡ ‡ Gal. 4.10 . observe Times , daies & Moneths : but the Apostle condemns all such observation ; and ( as before ) brands them for Doctrines of Devils , and departing from the Faith , and denying of Christ . So as though you could prove your Church-Government to have been in use both in , and ever since the Apostles times , yet it will not follow , that it is such a Government , as either was practised , or yet approved by the Apostles themselves . For your Church-Government is altogether Hierarchicall , by Prelates ; which the Apostles never practised themselves , nor yet approved , but condemned in others , that either began to practise it , or were inclined and affected thereto . ‡ ‡ 1 Pet. 5. Not as Lords over Gods Heritage , saith Peter . § § 2 Cor. 1.24 . Not as having dominion over your Faith , saith Paul . † † Math. 20. It shall not be so among you , saith Christ . * * 3 Ioh. 9. Diotrephes loveth to have the Preeminence , saith Iohn . But of this we shall have occasion to speake more at after . In the meane time , take this with you , Did the Apostles , nay ( for some hundred yeares after them ) did Prelates keep Courts , and Consistories , with their Chauncellors , Archdeacons , Commissaries , Officialls , Tipstaves , Pursuivants , Apparators , like the Roman Lictors , with their ‡ ‡ I. lictor , liga . rodds , for terrour , and state ? Or had they their private Courts to excommunicate whom they pleased , and that by a dumbe Priest , and for every triviall matter , and for no just cause ? Prove these things my Lord , to have been in use in the Primitive Ages , at the least for the first 500. yeares , or in any place , but where Diotr●phes was , untill Antichrist , the Pope , set up that frame of Hierarchy , with all its Equipage , Traine , and Rabble , the just Image whereof you have set up in the Church of England ? You speak bigge indeed , but you cannot be as bigge as your word . If you had leasure to read the Histories of the Church , and among the rest the ‡ ‡ Though your Altar-man Dr. Pockl. in his Christian Altar hath censured those Centuriators . Centuries , they will show you what a vast difference there is between your Church-Government ( as both now and of long time it hath been practised in the Church , both of Rome , and England ) and that ancient Government practised by the ancient Prelates in the Primitive Ages . And in the Popes Canon Law , and other Records , à Polidor Virgil De Inventorebus rerum , &c. you may come to know the Antiquity of your Prelaticall Courts and Consistories , Chancellors , Archdeacons , Officialls , Commissaries , Registers , and all the frie. For beyond that seaven hild City , the head-spring of this Seaven-Streamed Egyptian Nilus is not found .

Hath not then the Seperatist ( as you call him ) just cause and ground to charge your Church of England with Antichristianisme , whose Church-Government , and Discipline is such as the Apostles never approved , but expresly reproved and condemned , and practised the contrary ? For if your Church-Government be that , which the Apostle brands with the Mystery of Iniquity , and of Antichrist , then surely you cannot excuse it from Antichristianisme . If you say , This is rather meant of the Church of Rome , and of the Pope the Head thereof , who you must needs confesse is very like to Antichrist , if he be not the very Antichrist , as indeed he is : then of the Church of England . Why , wherein differeth the Church of England , from that of Rome in Church-Government ? Do you not say you are both one and the same Church ? And wherein one and the same , but in Church-Government especially ? Of which we shall speake more anon .

Now for Antichristianisme , you know it comes of Antichrist : Of Antichristianesme and Antichrist . and Antichrist is a compound word , Anti , in the Greek signifying both for and against : So as Anti-Christ is one , that under pretence of being for Christ , is against Christ . Such is the Pope , who pretends to be Christs Vicar , which is as much to say , as Antixristos , Antichristus , as Anthupatos , Pro consul , so Antichristus , Prochristus , or Vice-Christ . And yet he is Anti , Against , * * Act. 13.12 . Antikeimenos , an Adversary to Christ , as the Apostle sets him forth . So as the Pope is Antichrist , both as he pretends to be Christs Vicar , for Christ , or Vice - Christ , as he practiseth against Christ . And for this reason he is noted to be ho Antikristos , That Antichrist , by a note of singularity , 1 Iohn 2.22 . as 1 Iohn 2.22 . to distinguish him from other Antichrists , of whom there are many , as 1 Iohn 2.18 . 1 Iohn 2.18 . Of which many your Lordship and all Prelates are , and especially Arch-Prelates , or Patriarchs , as the Pope call'd you . For you tell us at after , that you Prelates are Vice-roys , whereby Christ governes his Church . So as you being Christs vice-roy , over the Church of England , you are as vice Christus , vice-Christ , or in the Greek Antikristos , as Anthúpatos , Vice-roy , under the King Christ . This you confesse and professe . And under this Title you practise Antichrist , you are an * * 2 Thess. 2.4 . Antikeimenos , an Adversary , as all your practises proclame you ; and as we have in part noted , and shall yet more set you forth . And this is that Mystery of Iniquity . For it were not els a Mistery , if it were not veiled with a pretence and profession to be for Christ , and under that to be against Christ . So as the difinition of Antichrist pertaineth no lesse properly to you , then it doth to the Pope , onely he is Antichrist with an Ho , That Antichrist , And you are An Antichrist , and no little one neither , as being Papa alterius Orbis , The Pope , or Patriarch of the other world , to wit , of England , as the Pope said of you . Now this being so cleare , as is without all contradiction , and you being Metropolitan of all England , and the Church of England under you , and the Government thereof being Prelaticall or Hierarchicall , and this Hierarchy being that Mystery of Iniquity of such Antiquity , for it pretends and professes to be for Christ , as the Government of a vice-roy , but in practise is against Christ , and so is altogether Antichristian : can you blame your Seperatist , for condemning your Church of England of Antichristianisme , and that for that very Church-Governments sake , which you Say hath been used both in , and ever since the Apostles in all Ages and Places , where the Church hath taken any rooting .

But you will , with the Jesuite , alledge that place of Iohn , to defend you from being an Antichrist , as they doe , to defend the Pope from being that Antichrist . Iohn saith , ‡ ‡ 1 Ioh. 2.22 . Who is a lyer , but he that denyeth , that Iesus is the Christ ? He is Antichrist . But you Say , you doe not deny Iesus to be Christ , therefore you are neither a lyer , nor Antichrist . 'T is true indeed , none is a more devout adorer of the Name JESUS , then your selfe : but yet I must tell you , that for all this , you deny the Person Iesus to be the Christ . But you confesse him to be the Christ . In words you doe . But what saith the Apostle ? They ‡ ‡ Tit. 1.16 . professe that they know God , but in works they deny him , being abominable and disobedient , and to every good worke Reprobate ? So that in words a man may confesse and professe Christ , and yet in works deny him . And so doe you for all your faire pretences , and professed love to Iesus . And who was fitter to betray Christ , then he that with a Hale Master Saluted him with a Kisse ? But let us now see , what it is to deny Iesus to be the Christ . Iesus in that place is spoken of his Person : and Christ is spoken of his Offices . So as there is meant , not a denyall of Iesus to be the Sonne of God , or God-man , not a denyall of his Person , and two Natures ; these you doe not deny : but a denyall of Iesu● to be the Christ , the Anointed of the Father . And this you deny . How ? For Christ is that Anointed King , Priest and Prophet : which three Offices of his are comprehended and signified in the Title ho Kristòs , The Christ , as Iohn there sets it down , and our English doth well expresse it . The Christ , That Anointed , Anointed above his fellowes , namely King , Priest , and Prophet , so as none of his fellowes , those foregoing Types , or Figures of him , were anointed . Melchisedech was King and Priest : Samuel was Priest and Prophet : David was King and Prophet : but never any was this ho Kristòs , The Christ , The Anointed , King , Priest , and Prophet . And Christ was anointed solemnly , and in a conspicuous and visible manner King , Priest , and Prophet , by the Holy Ghost lighting upon him at his Baptisme , whereupon that voyce of the Father from heaven proclamed him King , Priest , and Prophet , * * Mat. 3.17 . & 17.5 . 2 Pet. 1.17 . Luke 9.35 . This is my Beloved Son ( there he is King ) in whom I am well pleased ( there he is Priest ) heare him ; there he is Prophet . Now he that denyeth , or destroyeth any one of these three Offices of Christ , which are inseperably inherent in him , and incommunicable to any Creature , denyeth Iesus to be the Christ , as either denying him to be the onely King , or the onely Priest , or the onely Prophet of his Church . Now 't is no hard matter to prove , that you Prelates as Prelates , deny and destroy all these three Offices of Christ . And first , you deny Iesus to be the Onely Priest , and that not onely in taking upon you the Title of Priests , but also the Office . The Title of Priest you professe , and take a pride in . And the Office of Priest , you Priests of the Church of England doe in part at least usurpe . For the Office of Christ , as Priest , is in two things : First , to Sacrifice : Secondly , to forgive Sins . Now though you doe not yet openly professe your selves to be sacrificing Priests , as the Romish Priests doe : yet you take upon you to doe that , which never any Priests under the Law did , or might by their Office doe , namely to forgive Sinnes . This , I say , never any of the Leviticall Priests did . This was and is Christs onely Prerogative , as he is God and Priest . For who can forgive Sins , but onely God ? This the proud Pharisees confessed . But this power you Say , you have derivatively from Christ , by his Authority committed unto you , as Priests . But first , we have before proved that you are no Priests of Christ . Secondly , where hath Christ given any such power , even to his Apostles and true Ministers of the Gospell , to forgive Sins ? Indeed he saith unto them , ‡ ‡ Ioh. 20.22 ▪ 23. Receive ye the Holy Ghost : whose Sins ye remit , they are remitted : and whose Sins ye retaine , they are retained . Was this by a Priestly Absolution ? But the Apostles were no such Priests as you professe to be . Therefore it was not by any such Priestly Absolution , as you practise . How then ? How then , Say you ? You are here at a Non-plus , if it was not by a Priestly Absolution . It must needs remaine then , that it was by the Ministry of the Gospell , and by the preaching of Faith and Repentance , and pardon of Sinnes to the Penitent Beleevers . As * * Mar. 16.15 , 16. He , that beleeveth , and is baptised into Christ , professing his true Faith and Repentance , hath his Sinnes remitted : but he that beleeveth not , hath his Sins still retained . And this is that remitting of Sins Declarative , the power whereof Christ committed to his Apostles , and their Successors , the true Ministers of the Gospell , who by their preaching declare who have their sinnes pardoned , and who not . So as your colouring over your usuall evasion of the Papists about their merits , which , they say are not absolutely meritorious of themselves , but as being dipped and dyed in Christs blood , whence they receive the tincture of merit . But as the merit of Christ is altogether immanent in himselfe , and not transient to us , but onely by Imputation through faith , and not by any infusion or inherencie , as Papists teach : So the power of Priestly Absolution is so proper and peculiar to the Person of Christ , that it is not communicative , or derivative to any Creature . No not ( I say ) to the Leviticall Priests , who otherwise were Types of Christ . They onely offered sacrifices for sinnes , but as Types , and which ‡ ‡ Heb. 10.4.11 . could never take away Sinnes , as the Apostle speakes . And their Office was to ‡ ‡ Levit. 13. discerne and judge of the Leprosie , and to pronounce a man cleane or uncleane , according to those signes and markes , which God himselfe gave . Now Leprosie was an Embleme of Sinne. And as those Ministers of the Old Testament , did with the Leprosie , namely pronounce or declare it onely , to be , or not to be : So the Ministers of the Gospell are to declare unto beleevers the pardon of sinnes , by those signes and markes , which God hath set in his Word , and to impenitent persons condemnation , except they beleeve and repent . But for power of Absolving men from Sinnes , as to Say , Thy Sins are forgiven thee , that 's Christs voyce alone . Never any of the Apostles used this voyce to any , Thy Sins are forgiven thee : but as Peter said to those that were pricked in their hearts , and asked , Men and Bretheren what shall we doe ? § § Act. 2.37 , 38. Repent ( saith he ) and be baptised every one of you in the Name of Iesus Christ , for the Remission of Sins . But to Say , I absolve thee from thy Sins , or Thy Sins are forgiven thee , is onely his , who can give Repentance and Faith . These two Prerogatives are inseperable in Christ , as Peter sheweth . * * Act. 5.31 . Him hath God exalted with his right hand to be a Prince and a Saviour , for to give Repentance to Israel , and forgivenesse of Sinnes : and we are witnesses of these things , Saith he . Now if you can prove that Christ hath made you Such Princes and Saviours , as to give you a power ( which ‡ ‡ Act. 8.19 ▪ Symon Magus would have bought with his money ) to give Repentance to any man : then I will without any more adoe confesse , that you have also a power to forgive Sins . Otherwise not till then , by your assumed and usurped Priesthood , and presumptuous , yea blasphemous forgiving of Sins , I Absolve thee : you deny Iesus to be the Christ , the onely Christ , to wit , the onely Priest , who onely hath merit and power , as to give Repentance , so remission of Sins to whom he will . And thus , as you take upon you to be a Priest , both by your profession and practise , you are an Antichrist . For who is a lyer , but he that denyeth Iesus to be the Christ ? He is Antichrist , Saith the Apostle Iohn .

Secondly , neither were it any great difficulty to prove , that you Prelates , ( and that according to your owne Doctrine in many places of your Book ) do deny Iesus to be the Christ ; to wit , the onely Prophet of his Church . For you allow no beliefe , that the Scripture is the voyce of Christ the Prophet , except the voyce and Tradition of the present Church doe first usher it in . And this Church must alwayes be meant of a Prelaticall Church . No question of that . And for Exposition and Sense of Scripture , you deny that the Scripture it selfe , and of it selfe , hath sufficient light , ( as at after we shall see at large ) and therefore you referre us either to the Exposition of the Primitive Church , or the Decisions of Generall Councels , for the right Sense of the Scripture . Thus you doe akurōsa , ( as Christ saith ) or make voyd and of no authority the voyce of Christ , by your Tradition . Nay you Say also , That if a Generall Councel should Conclude and Decree an Errour , yet all men ought to yeeld obedience ( at least externall ) thereunto , till another Generall Councel , equall to that , shall reverse and correct it . And ( by the way ) what if it shall make it worse , or adde more Errours to it ? But thus doe you not deny Christ to be the onely Prophet of his Church ( of whom God Saith , Heare Him , Him onely , His Word onely , His Voyce onely ) when you do not take his Word to be light enough , and to be sufficient to interpret it selfe , but that you must have recourse to Generall Councels , consisting of Prelates ; as your Oracles , to decide all doubts and controversies of Faith ? Doe you not thus attribute a greater light to men , then to the voyce of Christ ? GOD Saith of Christ , that Prophet , * * Act. 3.22 . Heare him in all things , whatsoever he shall say unto you : but you say , In all doubts and controversies of faith , heare what a Generall Councel Saith , yea though it determine Errours , yet all men are bound to yeeld obedience thereunto . Thus the expresse voyce and cleare word of Christ that Prophet , must depend upon Men , and those an Assembly of Prelates or Priests , which Christ never ordained in his Church ; and not men , upon It. And so in this respect also , denying Christ to be the onely All sufficient Prophet to instruct and establish his Church in all Truth , while you deny his word to be Autópistos , and Autàrkes , of selfe-Credit , of it selfe to be beleeved , and selfe-sufficient to shew and interpret it selfe : you prove your selfe an Antichrist : For who is a lyer , but he that denyeth that Iesus is the Christ ? He is Antichrist . Your Grace therefore is an Antichrist .

But I come to the third Instance , to which ( I confesse ) I thought to have confined my selfe , and not to have touched the other two in this place , though they be no lesse proper , then this : which is , That you Prelates , both by Profession and Practise , as you are Prelates , doe deny Iesus to be the Christ , in that you deny him to be the onely Lord , and King of his Church . For what is for Christ to be the King of , and over , and in his Church , but ( as to exercise his Almighty power , and Fatherly care , and Spouse-like love , in protecting and preserving his Church , from all evills , in comforting her in the midst of afflictions , in supplying her with all necessary Graces and Blessings , and in vindicating the cause of his People against all their Persecuters and Oppressors : So also ) in bearing a Speciall Kingly Rule in and over their Soules and Consciences , in all things concerning Faith , in the Worship and Service of God . So as the people of God doe , and ought to acknowledge Christ herein their onely King , and not to suffer their consciences to be captivated , and insnared by any ordinance of Man , whatsoever in point of faith and ceremonies in Gods service , injoyning a necessary conformity thereunto . 'T is Christs Prerogative alone in this case , to sit as King in the throne which he hath set up for himselfe in every mans conscience . And Christ hath redeemed us from all bondage and subjection to humane devises in Spirituall things : as the Apostle saith , ‡ ‡ 1 Cor. 7.23 . Ye are bought with a price , be not the servants of men So as this Kingly office ▪ this Kingdome over his Church , Christ hath purchased with a deare price , even his precious blood . But Prelates ●ra●ple this blood of Christ under their feet , and make this his purchase voyd , by setting themselves in his throne , by sitting in and over mens consciences , making Laws , and imposing Rites ( as absolute Kings over the Church ) binding the Conscience to a necessary conformity to them in the worship of God . And to this purpose , this their Kinglike Authority ( indeed intollerable usurpation and Tyranny ) comes usually armed with a strong guard of Canons , and attended with metà pollēs phantasías , with a pompous train of Ceremonies , ever waiting at their heeles . For their Maxime is , No Ceremonies , no Bishop . A Bishop and his Ceremonies are Relatives , and can no more be seperated one from the other , then an Altar and a Priest . But of Ceremonies I shall have occasion to speak more anon : and therefore I am the briefer here . The Summe is , That a Prelate , as a Prelate attended with his Ceremonies , which he imposeth upon the Consciences of Gods people in the worship of God , doth thereby deny Christ to be the onely King of his people , and so to be their Redeemer , as who hath freed them , as from all Leviticall and Legall Rites , so from all humane Ordinances and Devices in the worship of God . I conclude therefore , That a Prelate , by his very place , profession and practise , as a Prelate , usurping domination over mens Consciences in Gods worship , by imposing his Ceremonies , denyeth Christ to be the King of his people , denyeth Iesus to be the Christ , and so is a Lyer , and Antichrist ; For who is a lyer , but he that denyeth Iesus to be the Christ ? He is Antichrist .

Thus the Case being so , that the Church of England , being a Prelaticall and Hierarchicall Church , and so for Church-Government and Discipline , ruled and Lorded over by the Prelates : doth thereby ( as a Prelaticall Body united to Prelaticall Heads ) and by subjection and conformity unto their Lordly impositions and injunctions in point of Ceremonies , and of the worship of God , conspire with the Prelates in denying Christ to be her onely King ; and so with them denying that Iesus is the Christ , is justly condemned of Antichristianisme .

I should now proceed to some other passage , but that one rub here comes in the way , and that is concerning the Church of Christ , which here ye name . For you say , The Church of England practises Church-Government , as it hath been in use in all Ages ▪ and all Places where THE CHRCH OF CHRIST HATH TAKEN ANY ROOTING . Why , my Lord , what say you to all the reform●d Churches beyond the Seas ? Hath your Church-Government in England been in use in all places where th●se Churches have been rooted now for the space of at least 100. years ? What ? In Geneva ? In France ? In Belgia , and other places ? Now therfore you must either plainly confesse this one Clause to be most notoriously false ; or else , that the best Reformed Churches beyond the Seaes , are no true Churches of Christ . But for that you passe not much to confesse , that those Reformed Churches are no true Churches , because they have no Prelates . This you Spake openly not long agoe at your High-Commission , in Cathedra , when your charity called that famous and glorious shining Lamp , Mr. CALVIN , Rascall , when you gave those Churches that doom . Had you been a Prelate in Queen Elizabeths time , durst you have done so ? Nay in King Iames his time , who with the Church of England gave all those Reformed Churches the right hand of fellowship , as true Churches of Christ ( as in the Councel of Dort ) durst you have done it ? And why now tam audax omnia perpeti , as that Heathen * * Horace . Poet said ? And have not these Churches taken rooting ? How then have they continued so long , and flourished so much , and put forth so many beautifull and goodly branches , godly and learned Divines , and brought forth such abundant good fruit ? Could all this be without taking root ? yea and a sound rooting too , well planted by Gods own hand , and watered abundantly with his blessed showers of Grace from heaven , and fenced about with the wall of his mighty protection , against Stormes and Tempests ? And I trust they shall stand and flourish , when all ‡ ‡ Ier. 2.21 . Math. 15.13 . degenerate plants , which our heavenly Father hath not planted , shal be plucked ▪ up by the roots , as bearing no other fruit , but the Apples of Sodome ; without beautifull , but all black and rotten within . Although it might justly be feared ( could you effect your so laboured thorow Reconciliation with Rome , to become all one , as you say , you already be ) you would doe your best , to root out all those Reformed Churches , as that of the Palatinate now is . And 't is true inded , that no particular visible Churches can promise to themselves perpetuity of continuance in one place , longer then God is pleased . But for thee , O ‡ ‡ Psal. 137.8 . Rev. 17. & 18. daughter of Babylon , thou Mother of whoredomes , God hath particularly designed , and marked thee out for destruction , so as thou , with all thy confederate Lovers , shall not escape ; and the day of thy visitation sleepeth not . But for the Kingdome and Church of Iesus Christ , it shall abide , to triumph over Antichrist , and all his accursed Crew . And for thee ô Church of England , beware of being an Ivie about that old rotten Romish Oake , least you both be cut down together , and be cast into the same burning Lake for ever , beware of grappling thy selfe with that old leaking and sinking Peter-boate , as thy Pilate would perswade thee , least you both be swallowed up together .

L. ibid 'T is very remarkeable , that while both these ( the Romanist , and Seperatist , presse hard upon the Church , both of them cry out of Persecution , like froward Children , &c.

P. What cause the Romanist hath so to cry , I know not ; especially if the just Lawes against them be suffered to sleepe . But for your Seperatists , ( among whom you reckon and ranke godly and zealous Ministers , and all good men , whom you hunt after , and prosecute continually in all your Courts ) what cause these have to cry out of persecution , and that even in the throwing of them out of their Churches and Houses , and native Countrey , that they can rest no where for you , and so what cause they have to cry , and complain to their GOD of such persecution , ( as having none on Earth to complaine to ) both the world may see , and you shall one day feele , withot speedy repentance , which we have as little hope of , as you can have of heaven . But they being thus persecuted , you impute the cause to their hard pressing upon the Church , comparing them to froward Children . Indeed Children will cry , when they are swadled , or beaten , and misused . And the poore Innocent , or Infant , being pinched too hard with the swathing bands , or pricked with a pin mis-put , will cry out , and roare , till they find ease . So as there is cause enough of their crying . And is it not ( trow you ) your too hard pressing upon your Seperatists , with your Canons and Ceremonies , and which as with swadling bands you bind them too strait withall , and your hard and rough handling of them , that gives them just cause to cry ? But however , for all this , your hard usage must by no meanes be called persecution . Farre be that from your piety , and clemencie , that you should either perswade to Persecution in any kind , or practise it in the least .

L. p. 16. To the Papists common Objection , Where was your Church before Luther ? Your Answere is : It was just there , where theirs is now . One and the same Church still , no doubt of that . One in Substance , but not one in Condition of State and Purity ; their part of the same Church remaining in Corruption : and our part of the same Church under Reformation . The Same Naaman , and he a Syrian still , but leaprous with them , and cleansed with us ; the Same man Still .

P. Here you teach us a Point , which had the Divines of the Church of England in former Ages known , it might have saved them a great deale of puzzle , which the subtile Jesuites , for diversion and gaining of time put them unto , in tracing the footsteps of the Protestant Church , and the professors thereof , through all ages , yeares , weeks and dayes , ever since the Apostles times . Where was your Church ? Why , it was just there , where Romes is now . This had been a short Cut to find the Protestant Church ; Like the North-East passage to China , or the North-West to the Westeran - America , could they be found out . But you have at length found out a South-East passage to Rome , where the present Church of England , loosing her selfe , may find her selfe . Which passage or path had now for a long time through disuse , and want of Travailers and Pilgrims thither , been grown up with grasse , till now again beaten out , by your hard and continuall travaile in it . Would an English Protestant then know , where his Church was before Luther ? Why , goe but to Rome , and if you have lost both Church , and Religion in England , there you may be sure to find it againe ; no doubt of that . Surely I hope Iesuites wil be no longer such fooles , as to take such a tedious pilgrimage , compassing Sea and Land , to the Shrine of Canterbury , to aske of the Oracle there , where your Church of England was in diebus illis . They might have stayd at home , and there have found it , even in Rome , within the Sacred Thresholds of S. Peter , or S. Iohn Lateran , and that ( with some favourable Interpretation ) where and when the Priest is at his Masse . So as well might your Lordship call it ( as you doe ) an Idle and Impertinent Question , Where was your Church before Luther ? What a jeast is that ? Iust there , where Romes is Now. One ▪ and the Same , no doubt of that . And who shall doubt that , what your Lordship è Cathedra defines , out of Canterbury Chaire defines ? But now henceforth I hope , you will not so much complaine of Seperatists from your Church of England . For you teach them to Seperate from the Church of England , as from Rome it selfe , as being one and the same Church . And you know that all Protestants of that Spirit , cannot away with the Church of Rome . So as you may expect every day new Companies , and that by threaves , to get them packing from your Church of England ; and that according to Christs warning piece , Rev. 18.4 . Come out of her my people , least ye bee partakers of her Sinnes , and least ye receive of her Plagues .

But you distinguish : Yours in Purity , and under Reformation : Romes Church under Corruption ; yours Naaman cleansed ; theirs Naaman Leprous ; yet both one Naaman , and be a Syrian , the Same man still . A paradox indeed . A Riddle . A Riddle to pose Oedipus himselfe For riddle me this : One and the Same Man both Leprous , and ▪ Cleansed , at the same time . Cannot the Priest in the Masse as easily riddle , how one and the same numericall body of Christ may be both in heaven , and in his Masse-pix , or on his Altar , at one and the same instant ? Even as soon . But not to stretch your paradox too farre , least we teare it , and so make the rent wider betwixt you and Rome ( which in your Book you say , you are loth to doe ) Is your Church of England Cleansed , and Romes Leprous ? Remember your selfe well ; and Consider . Why then doe you not cast out that Leprous woman , and * * Levit. 13.46 . Shut the doore upon her ? Nay , why would you so faine be reunited with that filthy and polluted Leper ? And yet , why not ? For is the Church of England in the Condition of Purity , and under Reformation ? Indeed Solomon saith , ‡ ‡ Pro. 30.12 ▪ There is a Generation , that are pure in their own eyes : and yet is not washed from their filthinesse . And is your Church of England Cleansed from all her Leprosie and pollutions ? What from the bitter root of the Hierarchy , which hath defiled the Land with Idolatrous Altars and Images , and Sundry Superstitious Ceremonies ; and open Profanation of the Lords day , by tolerating of Heathenish Sports , and Whorish and Drunken meetings ? Is it cleansed from those Doctrines of Devils forementioned , accounting holy Wedlock uncleane at Some times , and at Some times the Creatures uncleane ? Or is England cleansed from the guilt of Innocent blood of the Saints and Servants of Iesus Christ , whom she hath cruelly persecuted and oppressed , and with whose blood the whole Land is defiled , and yet she is not washed from it , She repenteth not , but goes still on , to fill up the measure of her Cruelty ? How art thou then purified , ô Land ! How reformed ! How cleansed ! Nay dost thou not hate and persecute true holinesse , and purity , and especially in godly and painfull Ministers , who preach against thy profanations ? So as may it not be said of thee , as the Lord said of Ierusalem , ‡ ‡ Eze. 22.24 ▪ Thou art the Land , that is not cleansed ?

Seeing then thou art not cleansed from thy Leprosie , but art a Syrian still , a Leprous Naaman still : well mayst thou be Sayd to be One and the Same Church with Rome , even one and the same body , even one and the same in Substance . For what is that substance wherein you say , the Church of England and Rome , are one and the same ? Is it not that , which you account the very Essence , Forme , and Beeing of your Church ? And what is that ? Or what be those things , wherein the Substance of your Church consisteth , as wherein the Church of England and of Rome , are both one and the same , so as we need make no doubt of that ? Surely wherein we find you both one and the same , we need not doubt , but in those things consists the one and onely substance of your one and the same Church . For as for other things , wherein the Church of England either in profession dissenteth , or in practise differeth from the Church of Rome , you reckon those among Romes corruptions . Therfore on the contrary , in whatsoever you are one and the same Church with Rome , those must be no corruptions , but the very pure Essence and Substance of that one Church , which is just there where Romes is now . And what are those ? Namely : One and the same in the Hierarchy , or Prelaticall Government , which is so essentiall to your Church , as where 't is not , there 's no Church : Onely with this difference : The Pope Christs Vicar over the whole world , and your Lordship his Vice-roy over all England , that other world . One and the same , in all the members of this great body of the Hierarchy , and in all the Officers of this Church-Government : as Chancellors , Archdeacons , Officialls , Commissaries , and so downe to the very Skirts of that goodly guarded Babilonish Government . One and the Same in all your Ecclesiasticall Courts : as the Prerogative Court , the Court of Arches , the Bishops Ordinary Court , the Spirituall Court , the Court of Inquisition , and High Commission ; with a little difference in the name . One and the Same in their Canons , and chiefly the Popes Canon Law . One and the Same in your Episcopall Robes and vestments , both rare and rich , as purple , and scarlet , and fine linnen , as it were the livery whereby you are known to be of one and the same house , or family , with that Woman ( Rev. 17. ) aliâs , the Great Whore of Babilon , with whom you claim Sister-hood ; So also in your Miters , your Rochets , Palls , Semiters , Square Caps , Tippets , and so cap a pied . One and the Same in your Liturgy , Service , or Matins , or Service-Booke , which even your Iesuite confessed to be Catholick ; and so One and the Same in all your Service dressing and garbe : as rich Copes , Palls , and other Altar-ornaments , goodly guilt plate , faire Crucifixes over them , and devout adoration unto them , and praying toward the East , where your Altar and Crucifix standeth ; goodly gay Images , and Loud-sounding Organs , and sweet chanting Choristers and Chanters , Deanes , and Subdeanes , and Prebends , Epistlers , and Gospellers , Singing-men and Viergers , and a huge Sately pome , and Equipage , more then I can tell : where you have Long Service , and Short Sermons , or rather ( to avoyd tediousnesse ) none at all : yea and your Service in your Cathedralls in an unknown tongue , the Popish Service mumbled in a strange tongue , and yours in a strange tone chanted and roared out so loud by a sort of profane and drunken Singing Men , and Apish Boyes , with such a black Sanctus , as the people is no way edified , as not knowing whether they sing a Song of Robin Hood , or play a Scotish Jigge . One and the Same in your Altars , Priests , Sacrifices : Onely with some small difference in some termes , and manner of expression , both holding a reall presence , Rome explicitly by Transubstantiation , and England implicitly , not daring to speake plainly how ; onely willing to come as neare Rome , as the time will give leave ; in stead of an Host , you will have at least your Crucifix , a representation of Christs body ▪ Sacrificed on the Crosse , either upon the Altar , for a pawne till the Host it selfe come , or as neare over the Altar , as may be . One and the Same in exercising an Antichristian Tyranny over mens Soules , Consciences , Bodies , Purses , Estates , by holding them in hard bondage under your roaring Canons , and intollerable burthens of Ceremonies ; but this is rather to be referred to the Title or Caput of Hierarchy , the Essence , and Substance of your One and the Same Church . One , in punishing the Transgressors of Ecclesiasticall Canons , more severely , then of Gods Commandements . One , in execution of Discipline by Excommunication in your blind Courts , for every trifle , which must cost more then a trifle to get off , So as there must be a Commutation , and Solution , for Absolution . One , in Dispensations and Prohibitions , dispensing with such as will dispend , that by Licence they may Marry , or eate flesh in Lent . One and the Same in persecuting the true Church of Christ , his Word , his Ministers , his People , onely Rome doth it under the name of Hereticks , of which you are none , and you under the name of Puritans , the worst of Hereticks . One and the Same in bowing at the Name Iesus . One and the Same in observation of Holydayes , onely with some difference , Rome hath more : yet not an English Almanack , but sets them forth at least in black attyre , ( as the Papists veile their Images all the Lent from the peoples view , to make them hunger the more after such food after their long Fast , at Easter ) in hope that in time , they may come to be cladde in * * In red Letters . Scarlet , their Holy-day suit ; So as , a ‡ ‡ Mr. Gellybrand , quem honoris causa nomino . Religious Gentleman , late the Astronomy-Reader in Gressham-house , but now translated above the Starres for Setting out an Almanacke with a Martyre to every day , in stead of the Popes Saints , was brought into the High Commission Court , where he hardly escaped findging for an Heretick . One and the Same in profaning and disesteeming the Lords day ; both accounting it to be of humane Authority ; both , preferring their Church-holy-dayes before it , both , profaning it , onely with this difference , Rome profanes it onely practically , but England both practically , and professedly , and Authentically , by Speciall Dispensation and Edict . One in condemning Innocents in your Ecclesiasticall Courts , mixt with temporall Iudges , as in your High Commission ; and in temporall Courts , mixt with Ecclesiasticall Iudges , such a sower leaven , as * * As in the Case of Mr. B. first Suspended in the High Commission , and then brought into a temporall Court , where your selves are also Iudges , and Parties . after Ecclsieasticall Censure , you deliver them over to the Secular power , where through your instigation no mercy can be expected , your selves being both Parties , and Iudges . One and the Same in holding the rule of Faith , onely with this difference ; Rome , equalling her Tradition with the Scripture ▪ and you , puting a necessity of the present Churches Tradition and voyce , as without which the Scripture cannot be beleeved to be the word of God , as was touched before , and as will appeare more fully at after : So as Rome yoaketh her traditions in equall ranke with the Scripture , and you put your Churches Authority and Tradition for the Forehorse , to draw and lead the Scripture into mens beliefe ( as the ‡ ‡ 2 Sam. 6.6 . Oxen drew the Arke towards Ierusalem ) that it is the word of God . One and the Same in exempting your Clergy from the Civill power and Iudicature ; onely with this difference : Rome hath got it in possession , and you have often attempted it , and openly professed your hope of Seeing the Clergy of England , as high , as ever they were ; or as the Lawyers now are . In a word , One and the Same in your Babilonish Faith and Religion : For Rome hath so contrived some of her doctrines ( as those about Grace ) layd down in the Decrees of Trent , as that those two mighty dissenting Sides about merit of Congruity , See the History of the Councel of Trent . to wit , Andreas Vega with his Franciscans , and Dominicus Soto with his Dominicans , both Sides bearing a great sway and swindge in the Councel : as that each side perswaded it selfe , that the Decrees ( brought from Rome in a Cloake-bag , as most of the rest were ) was for them , and favoured their side : And the present Oracle of the Church of England , ( Papa alterius Orbis ) hath so handled and hammered the matter in his forge , that by a Declaration before the Articles of Religion , he hath with no great difficulty , made those Articles concerning Grace , so to speak , as to please both the dissenting parties . Like to a Picture , which each man in the room imagins looks upon him in particular . Or , as easily ( I say ) as if a man should take away the prick of a Hebrew Letter from the right side , and place it on the left , according to which variation a man pronounceth respectively the word * * Iudg. 12.6 . Schiboleth , or Sibboleth : The false pronounciation of which word cost the Ephraimites their lives . Lastly ( to end as I began ) The Church of England and of Rome are One and the same , in turning Christs Kingdome , which is altogether Spirituall , and not of this world , into an earthly and seculer Kingdome , although Styled a Spiritualty , and Hierarchy , or holy Government , and Kingdome , whose Governours are temporall Lords ▪ calling themselves Christs viceroys , whose kingdome , glory , pompe , dignity , riches , is all earthly , not heavenly ; carnall , not spirituall , verefying that of the Apostle , ‡ ‡ Phil. 3.18 . They are the enemies of the Crosse of Christ , whose end is destruction , whose God is their belly , whose glory is in their Shame , which mind earthly things . Here are particulars enough ( to be silent in the rest ) to prove your Speech true , That the Church of England and the Church of Rome , are in Substance one and the Same ; no doubt of that . As for Romes corruptions ( as you account and call them ) they are neither so many , nor so great ( So long as they overthrow not the foundation , as you not say , they doe ) but that the large Mantle of your Charity is broad enough to cover them ; So as that need not to break square , or greatly hinder your so much desired and attempted Reconciliation ; wherein I know you will be ready to meet Rome the halfe way , or three quarters and more rather then faile , to give his Holinesse the kisse of peace , so he will be content to leave your Patriarchate or Popedome in England , while himselfe enjoyeth the Vicarship of the wider world , and at his death leave you his Heir apparent of the triple Crown . Yet perhaps for your Reputation sake you would require , that some grossenes at least might be payred off the outsides of her fouler corruptions , and they a little smoothed over : and for your part ( I dare say ) you will not be behind hand to bring on the Church of England in such a faire forwardnesse , and neernesse ( as possibly the time will permit ) to a just conformity in all things fecible .

But is the Church of England , now come to this , to be in Statu quo , So as a man may find her just there , where Rome is now ? Alas , poore England ! Shall not now all thy brave Worthies , that are for the most part dead and gone , and Some yet surviving , as brands out of the flame , rise up , and bring their ‡ ‡ Learned Treatises . Rev. 17. & 18. Evidences , as witnesses aganst Rome , that Shee is a False , Hereticall , Idolatrous , Apostatized , Antichristian Church , the very Whore of Babylon , plainely described in the Revelation ? And one of the last Bookes written against her to purpose indeed , Intituled BABEL no BETHEL , ( which came forth in a good season , somwhat before you came to sit in the Chaire of Canterbury : and for which you may remember you convented the Author before your High Commission Board at London house out of Terme , and committed him to prison , ( Mr. BURTON I mean ) now a closse prisoner and Exile ) hath by many impregnable Arguments so strongly proved the Church of Rome , to be no true Church of Christ , but a meere Antichristian Apostacie from the Faith : So as neither his two hot * * Mr. Chalmley , and Mr. Butterfield , who is since gone to Doway and turned Iesuite . Antagonists , your ‡ ‡ Bishop of Exon. Brothers Champions ; nor any Jesuites since hath undertaken to Answer it , as being indeed unanswerable ; And so it Stands , his Adversaries giving him the Bucklers in the plain Field . And yet now is the Case so altered , that so suddainly the Church of England is become One and the Same with the Church of Rome , So as She may find her selfe just there where Romes is now , and that , no doubt of that . But how doth this appeare ? Surely you may take it for truth , for the Primate and Metropolitan of all England hath so bestirred himselfe , and playd his part , in Chopping and Changing , puting down truth , and seting up errour and superstition in the Church of England , that she is Sodainly so metamorphosed into another form , and in a manner transubstantiated , into a new Substance of a Church , as now you may find her just there , where Romes is now , both one and the Same Church , no doubt of that .

If then we may take your word for your Church of England in this Case , and considering that the Church of Rome is that notorious Harlot : how any true Christian ( as I said before ) that will not become the member of a Harlot , can hold longer communion with you , I cannot see . And for my part , I doe here ingenuously professe , and protest against you , againe and againe , that I abhorre you , and all such Churches as hold communion with Rome , as one and the Same Church , and doe utterly seperate from you , till you seperate from all communion and conformity with that Babylon in all those particulars forementioned . And so I have done with you thus farre in this point . You proceed .

Notorious blasphemy in puting aly upon Christ . L. p. 17. According to Christs Institution , the Scripture , where 't is plaine , should guide the Church : and the Church , where there 's doubt and difficulty , should expound the Scripture .

P. How ? Where , I pray , hath Christ so instituted ? And who hath bewitched you to dare to utter such a notorious , Prelates Blasphemy against Christ . and pernicious untruth , as this , and to Father it upon Christ , and that upon your bare word ? For What Scripture doe you , or can you bring For this ? Nay if the Scripture , Christs own voyce , and wherein the Spirit of Christ breatheth , be not sufficient to interpret it selfe , and that in all more doubtfull and difficult places of it : what Man , or Men , or Church , shal be able to doe it ? For how can any interpret difficult places of Scripture , especially such as concerne Faith and Salvation , but by the Scripture it selfe ? But we shall speake more fully of this afterwards . And you have told us what the Church is , namely a Hierarchy , or Kingdome of Prelates , who generally * * Rom. 8.5 . Savour the things of the flesh , and not of the Spirit : And if you● Lordship should but stand for a proofe and Say in this Case , and that all other Prelates would hazzard their credit upon your Ability in interpreting the Scripture : it would quickly appeare what hope the world might have of Prelates helpe at a dead lift , for the establishing of our Faith and Consciences in some perplexed Cases . O then what brave Prelaticall Glosses should we have ? As for the purpose : Some doubts of late are risen in England about Altars , Prelates Calling , Ceremonies ▪ Now if they should consult your Lordship Siting in the Chaire of Canterbury to resolve them in these difficulties , what would be your finall determination of them ? For the first , would you not alledge Heb. 13.10 . We have an Altar ? For the second , Psal. 45.16 . Princes in all Lands , that is Prelates . For the Third , to wit Ceremonies 1 Cor. 14.40 . Let all things be done , decently , and in Order : Ergo , what Ceremonies the Bishop shall injoyne , you must observe . These are your Glosses , and such interpretations as these we must looke for of your Church . Such as the Church of Rome is very dextrous and expert in . As ‡ ‡ Mat. 26.26 . This is my body : Ergo , The Bread is transubstantiated into Christs very body . ‡ ‡ Luke 22.32 I have prayed for thee Peter : Ergo , the Pope cannot erre . § § Luke 5.4 . Launch out into the deep : Ergo , the Pope may fish all the world . † † Act. 10.13 . Arise Peter , Kill and eat : Ergo , the Pope may kill the Venetians . * * 1 Cor. 3.15 . As it were by fire : Ergo , there is a Purgatory . Thus the Scripture , where 't is plaine , should guide the Church ; otherwise not : but in doubt and difficulty the Church should expound the Scripture , that is , guide the Scripture . Ergo , the Church is above the Scripture , because onely where 't is plaine , it guides the Church : but where difficult , the Church must guide it , interpret it . In difficulties then the Scripture , it must not guide the Church . Ergo , in difficulties and doubts the Church may interpret , as She pleaseth .

No , not so : for you adde ibid. Saying , Yet so , as neither the the Scripture should be forced , nor the Church so bound up , as that upon just and further evidence , She may not revise that , which in any Case ●ath slipt by her .

P. Here be two things enterfeerinch each other . First , a Caution . Prelates Subtile , but vain evasion . Secondly , a Condition . The Caution , That the Scripture be not forced . Take heed of that . But who shall Judge of that ? Even the Same that forceth it , the Church . And who shall defend that Scripture from forcing ; if it be left to mens interpritation , and those men in matters of doubt and difficulty are not guided by the Scripture , but the Scripture by the Churches interpretation ? But in no Case let the Scripture be forced . You will have a care of that . Prelate a most notorious forcer of Scripture . But why then doe you show your selfe so expert in forcing and misapplying the Scripture , and that most pittifully , as both hath been shewed , and will all along appeare ? But however the Condition will helpe all . Forcing , or not forcing , the Church must not be bound , but that upon just and further Evidence She may revise that , which in any Case hath slipt by her : Now what is this just and further Evidence ? Or what , this Revising ? And what this Sliping by her ? I take the Sense and Summe of all to be this : That here you lay your ground to make way for an Index expurgatorious to revise . But is that all ? Nay 't is implyed , that some thing els be done : as to correct and expunge , or at least more clearely interpret ; but indeed , to expunge , with a Deleatur , let it be blotted out , whatsoever in any Books formerly Printed by Authority in England , hath in any Case slipped by her ; or if the maine Subject of the Book be not Catholick , and consonant to the Doctrines of the present Church , that they may be censured as Prohibited Bookes , and so una Litura cancelled . And withall , whatsoever you find in any Books , which you do not very well resent , to declare which be the Doctrines of the Church of England , and which private mens opinions . And 't will be requisite , in my judgement , that you hasten this worke , to dispatch it in your time , least if you die , such another Phoenix will hardly arise out of your Ashes , that will have the courage to adventure upon these things . But among all other things , leave us not in that perplexed estate ; whereinto you have brought us by your Declaration before the Articles of Religion ; but make us a New Declaration , to certifie us what to beleeve , and rather resolve us plainly , that the Articles are to be taken in that sense , which agreeth with your own opinion , then that they should give an uncertain sound : for then who shall prepare himselfe to the battell ? And there may be great reason , why we should preferre your Lordships opinion , before the judgement of all other those learned men that have formerly lived in the Church of England , because the Church may now see more , and further into a Milstone , then of old ; as a Dwarfe upon a Giants shoulders . And so what slippes have formerly passed by the Church of England , your Lordship with your Chapleins and Divines will so revise , and repurg , as there shal be nothing left upon record , whereby it might appeare to Posterity , that there is any such difference between the Church of England and of Rome , as to hinder their most wished and desirable reconciliation . And I think I am not in this farre wide of your Project . The Wardens of the Company of STATIONERS can tell , what you lately gave them in Charge about such a matter for the revising of Puritan Books ; that so when you have purged out the Puritanism , there may be neither Purity nor Verity left . As I remember the Orator said of a certaine * * Chaerea . Roman , that he alwayes had his head and eye-browes Shaven , that men might take him not to have one haire of a good man . Thus when you have given such Books a dry shaving , you will make them to appeare as ridiculous , as ‡ ‡ 2 Sam. 10.4 . Davids Messengers , whom the young Ammonitish King took , and caused halfe their beards to be Shaven off , and their garments to be curtalled to their bare buttocks . But herein you prudently follow both the example of Rome , and the Counsell of Franciscus â S. Clara , who commends you for seting afoot this Project . But I hope , the Stationers will look a little better to their tò méros , & ●rgasía , the gaine of their Trade , and that which is their Freehold , and Livelyhood ; as well knowing , that if the good Books be guelt of their masculine vertue , and verity , none will buy them , except perhaps Chandlers , to stop their Mustard pots , and put about their Candles . And then should the Company of Book sellers , and their Posterity be deprived of the benefit of their Coppies , which are as a Coppy-hold of Inheritance to them , and theirs . But time will try all things .

L. p. 18. And though I cannot prophesie , yet I feare , that Atheisme and Irreligion gather strength , while the truth is thus weakened by an unworthy way of contending .

P. Cannot you prophesie , being the High Priest of England , as that High Priest did , ‡ ‡ Iohn 11.50 ▪ that it was necessary Christ should dye , that the whole Nation perish not ? So , cannot you prophesie , That it is necessary that all Puritans , Christs members should perish , that the whole Generation and Hierarchy of Priests perish not ? But though you cannot , no more then § § Num. 23.23 . & 24.1 . Balaam , prophesie , or bring an Inchantment against the Children of Israel , that God should curse them : yet can you not doe , as that wicked Prophet did , in * * Rev. 2.14 . Counselling King Balack to put a stumbling block before the Children of Israel , by inticing them to his Idols , with his faire Damosels ? You can tell us , that the Church of England , and of Rome , are one and the Same Church , and that her worship of Images , is but a trenching , or coming neare Idolatry ( as at after ) so as none need fear communion with her , so he be but ignorant of her Corruptions . Of which more hereafter . But though you cannot prophesie , what is all your practise , but a cleare Prognostication , and that , not onely foretelling , but causing and haling in a Deluge of Atheisme and Irreligion flowing in upon you . Prelates Practise . Yea witnesse this your Book , which could not spring , but from the root of Atheisme , and Sourse of all Irreligion ; and which doth not onely prognosticate , nor onely teach the way , how Atheisme and Irreligion may gather strength : but doth certainly presage , and that by necessary consequence , most terrible Judgements and Calamities , to fall upon the Church of England ; I would say rather , upon the Hierarchy of England : and which you doe with both hands , in writing and publishing this Book , and by all other your practises , pull upon your own heads .

But this your feare of Atheisme and Irreligion to gather strength , is ( say you ) while the Truth is weakened by an unworthy way of contending . What Truth ? Or what is that unworthy way of contending for the Truth ? Or what is your Atheisme and Irreligion ? For all these termes need your interpretation . But your prudent modestly therein we will make bold , as well as we can , to Supply . First for Truth , it is much in your mouth , I meane , the name and word Truth . But when you name Truth , you alwayes mean Falshood ; as when you Speake of the Church , you meane such a Church , as is a false Church ; and when you Speake of Peace , you meane such , as is a false Peace , when your Reconciliation with Rome , is a Conspiracie against Christ , and his true Church ; and when you name Priest , you meane , such , as is a false Priest ; and when you name Devotion , you meane such , as is a false Devotion , of humane devising : and when you name Faith as the gift of God , you meane not the true Saving Faith , whereof the Apostle speakes , where he Saith , ‡ ‡ Ephe. 2.8 . Faith is the gift of God . As we shall see at after . So as ever under the green leaves of such faire words , as Truth , Peace , Church , Devotion , Faith , &c. we may ever Suspect , and shal be ever sure to find a false Serpentine Sense to lurke .

Secondly , your unworthy way of contending for the Truth , what is it , but that , which the * * Iude 3. Apostle exhorts unto , that Christians should earnestly contend for the Faith , given to the Saints ; and ‡ ‡ Phil. 1.27 . Paul , that we should sunathlein , wrastle together ( as for Mastery , or for a Crown ) for the Faith of the Gospell . Now is not this that , which you call an unworthy way of contending for the Truth ? No doubt of th●● . As to write Books , or preach Sermons , proving the Pope to be Antichrist ; and the Church of Rome to be a false Church , or no Church of Christ ; and no Salvation to be hoped for in that Church : and that all true Christians ought to have no Communion with that Church , but to abhorre , and abandon her , as the ‡ ‡ Rev. 18.4 . Lord commandeth ; and that Prelates are not Jure divino , but are Antichristian , and their Hierarchy Tyrannicall ; and that Altars in Churches are a denying of Christ the Onely Altar ; and that all Ceremonies invented and imposed by men in the Service of God , is a will-worship , condemned by § § Mat. 15.9 . Christ , and his † † Col. 2.8.16.18 . Gal. 4.10 . Apostles ▪ and many such like . This is that unworthy way of contending , whereby ( you say ) the Truth is weakened . No marvaile .

Thirdly , what is that Atheisme and Irreligion , which you feare will gather Strength , while the Truth is weakened by such an unworthy way of contending ? This , I take it , may be taken two wayes . Either that by Atheisme you meane the true Faith of Christ , which is opposite to the Romish faith , wherewith you hold such correspondence ; for whatsoever is contrary to Romes faith , or ( which is all one ) your faith , is with you branded for Atheisme . Or Secondly , Atheisme , truely and properly taken gathers strength , by such an unworthy way of labouring a Reconciliation between the Church of England , and the Church of Rome , which to make way for , you are glad to say , that these two Churches are for substance one and the Same Church . Now before your time , the Church of England , though in many things it symbolized with Rome , ( as hath been shewed ) yet still it renounced all communion with her , as being a Strumpet , and that great Whore , whose Husband is the great Antichrist . But now you have so turned the Cat in the pan , by making way to bring the Church of England back againe to an union , and communion with Rome , that you put the people to a stand , to a nonplus , so as they know not what to beleeve , or what to think , but are ready to cast off all further thought of God , as if there were no God , because they see those to flourish , and to goe on unpunished , who overthrow the faith formerly professed in England , seting up the Romish faith againe , where it had been cast out : and on the other side , Preaching and Preachers to be put down , and the true Professors to be persecuted , and thrown out of all , and forced to quit their native Countrey , and the like . Now where all this is , do you but feare , that Atheisme gathers Strength ? Nay is not the root of all your cruely in persecuting Christs Ministers and People , meere Atheisme ? It is noted of the Sadduces , that of all other Sects they were the most cruell in their judiciall Censures : As Euseb. Eccl. Hist. l. 2. c. 14. out of Iosephus . And no marvaile . They denyed the Resurrection , and the Last Iudgement . So as they were Atheists . This made them dare to practise all cruelty , and injustice . For Maxima peccandi illaecebra , impunitatis Spes . So , how durst you be so unjust and cruell in your oppressions and persecutions , did you certainly beleeve , that there is a Resurrection and Last Judgement , wherein you shall be Judged . But this by the way , 't is an Item .

And Irreligion also : what 's that ? That 's soon resolved , to wit , Obstinacie in not admitting of Altars in some Churches : Irreveverence , in not bowing to Altars , and worshiping towards the East : and adoring the name Iesus , and the like . This is with you Irreligion : because your whole Religion is placed in these things . For so you tell us in the words following .

L. p. 19. The externall worship of God , in his Church , is the GREAT WITNESSE to the world , that our hearts stand right in the Service of God . Take this away , or bring it into contempt , and what light is there left to shine before men , that they may see our Devotion , and glorifie our Father , which is in heaven .

P. Surely were it not for this GREAT WITNESSE ( which here you bring in arayed in Capitall Letters ) to wit , your externall will-worship in many devised Ceremonies , of seeming Humility , Devotion , and Piety : the world could not come to know , what Religion is in your heart towards God , in that internall part of his worship , which you Speak of . But now through the cleare perspective of your bright shining Devotion without , we can discerne what Devotion is within . Herby we come to know all that spirit of Infidelity , and Apostacie , and consequenty of Atheisme , and Irreligion , which is in your heart . Do you set up Altars , and adore them , and set up Priests to serve at them , to which you must needs adde a Sacrifice sutable , some materiall and corporall thing ? Hereby we come to know , how in your heart you deny Iesus Christ to be the onely Altar , Priest , and Sacrifice , as is shewed before . And were it not for your lowly bowing at the bare nameing of the Name Iesus , you should want witnesse to testifie to the world that deep hypocrisie in your heart , while in bowing to Iesus , you persecute the Lord Iesus Christ in his Word , in his Ministers , in his Members . So as your externall ceremoniall worship is the GREAT WITNESSE to the world , that there is in you an Antichristian heart , a Popish heart , a Superstitious heart , an Idolatrous heart , an * * Heb. 3.12 ▪ Evill heart of unbelife , in departing away from the living God . How then , with what inward testimony of your Conscience , with what evidence of truth can you say , that your heart stands right in the Internall worship of God , when the externall is so crooked , and bowed together with so many lowly duckings and crindgins , so as your Head and Feet doe even meet together ? And is not the Devotion of your heart every way as crooked ? Doth not your heart bow , as , and when your body doth ? And is not the Same object which your body boweth unto , the object , to which your heart boweth , and wherein your internall worship is ultimately terminated and bounded ? For as Aug. Saith , Quis intuetur Semulacrum , &c. Who beholdeth an Image , that is not so affected as to imagine the Divinity to be in that Image , which he adoreth ? And doe not you Say , that your God-Almighty is upon your Altar , which you bow unto , when you Say of your Altar , you will have none to fit above God Al-mighty ? So as either you Locally place God there ; or you make your Altar your God , and goe no further . But suppose you doe in and by that Altar , which you bow unto , worship God : Who hath required such worship at your hands ? Nay hath not GOD in the Second Commandement expresly forbidden any such worship , in or by an Image , or any such thing as Man deviseth , in and by it to represent and worship GOD ? And such will-worship is it not the fruit of the Will of your Evill , Corrupt , and Superstitious , Idolatrous , and Proud Heart , whence it springeth , and proceedeth ? O Proud and Blind Hearts indeed , that dare make choyce of their owne selfe-pleasing devises in Gods worship , thinking thereby to please GOD ? But GOD abhorres all such will-worship . But it is ( Say you ) a testimony of your Humility . But the Apostle expresly condemneth such ‡ ‡ Col. 2.18 . voluntary Humility . And tell me , what is there in all the World ( seting your Honours , and Dignities , and Favour in Court aside ) wherein you take more Pride and Glory , then in such counterfeit Humility ▪ Prelaticall pride in Will-worship wherein your Heart is more lifted up , in perswading your selfe , that thereby the World comes to take you for the most Devout and Pious Prelate , or Person in all England , and as whereby you so bewitch the Court with an opinion of your incomparable Sanctity , then simply in these your externall Ceremoniall Complements ; Will-worship is no true Service of God . Saving onely that they Serve for your GREAT WITNESSES to all the world , that your heart stands right in the Service of God ; which indeed is a Service done to your selfe ? And this appeares in part through those Swelling words set down at large Characters , EXTERNALL WORSHIP , GREAT WITNESSE . Is not this a cleare expression of a heart full of pride , selfe-conceit , and vain glory , when you doe thus ( as the Poet said ) Proijcere ampullas , & Sesquipedalia verba , strout it in such a swelling Style , and big words ?

And that the world may yet further see how little I misjudge in this , let your own immediate words further witnesse . For Say you , Take this away ( this EXTERNALL WORSHIP this GREAT WITNESSE ) and what light is there left to shine before men , that they may See our Devotion , and glorifie our Father which is in heaven . I remember indeed what Christ said , to his Disciples , * * Math. 5.16 . Let your light so shine before men , that they may see your good works , and glorifie your Father which is in heaven . These be the words you play withall as a Descant of your Devotion . But ‡ ‡ Rev. 22.18 , 19. cursed is he ( Saith Christ ) that addeth to , or taketh from Gods word . Here you doe both , for you leave out good works , and in stead of that put in your Devotion ▪ and you put out the true Light there , which is faith , and put in the place of it your false Light , which is your blind Devotion . I say , blind Devotion , because of your own devising . For as the Prophet saith , ‡ ‡ Isa. 8.20 . If they speake not according to this word , it is because there is no light in them : So I say of that Feare , or Devotion , which is taught by the precepts of men : Such have no light in them . But your Dovotion is your Light , when both you and it be blind . As I have read of some Creatures , that are múopes , Mope-eyed ( as we Say ) that see better in the darke , then in the day . To such , darknesse is light . Such a light is your Devotion . And such Devotion was in the Priests of Baal , which was mixt , or rather inflamed with great zeale . § § 1 King . 18.26.29 . Zeale , in Launcing themselves , that the blood sprang out : Devotion , in their long Prayers from Morning till Noon . And this ( secundum usum Sacrum ) after their manner . Now might not they have said , as you doe , This our externall worship is a GREAT WITNESSE to the world , of our Zeale to our God , and without which , what light have we left , whereby men may see our Devotion ? And such also was the Devotion of Hypocrites , of whom Christ saith , † † Math. 6.5 . They pray standing in the Synagogues , and in the Corners of the Streets , that they may be seen of men . Now might not these Hypocrites say for themselves , This our externall Devotion is the GREAT WITNESSE unto the world , that our hear●s stand right , being testified by standing in Prayer , so as without this light men could not see our Devotion ? So the Pharisees who were curious Masters of Ceremonies in will-worship , * * Math. 23.5 . & 14. they wore goodly broad Phylacteries , and for pretence made long prayers . Might not they also have said , as you : This our externall worship in long Prayers , in our Solemne Robes , with goodly Boarders , is the GREAT WITNESSE to the world , that our hearts stand right , and without this Light men could not see our inward Devotion towards God ? And say not you , Our externall worship is that light , without which men could not see our Devotion ? Iust , as the Pharisees , ‡ ‡ Math. 23.5 ▪ All they did , was to be seen of men .

But you would perswade us you doe it to a higher end , which is Gods glory . For you Say , ‡ ‡ Prelates abusing of Scripture Take this away , and what Light is there left to shine before men , that they may see our Devotion , and glorifie our Father which is in heaven ? So here be two ends of all your externall worship , and solemne service , and great pompe , and humble expressions of Devotion : First , that men may see your Devotion ; for els it were not worth a rush : Secondly , that they may glorifie God . As I noted before , these words of Christ you falsely apply to your blind Devotion , which he Spake concerning the Light of faith shining forth in good workes to the glory of God . Whereas your externall worship , as it is a fruit of your blind Devotion , so it is that , whereby God is greatly dishonoured ; and that both actually in it selfe , and effectu●lly in the beholders : First , Actually in it selfe , all false worship , or will-worship ( for both is one ) is a dishonour to God . § § Math. 15.9 . In vaine they worship me , teaching for Doctrines the Precepts of Men. Now God is not glorified , or honoured with any vain worship . Nay , on the contrary , he is greatly dishonoured by it . For such will-worship is a high presumption , derogating from the Majesty of God , who wil be worshiped no otherwise , then as himselfe hath expresly commanded in his word . As the Prophet saith , And shalt honour him , not doing thine owne wayes , nor finding thine own pleasure : And such is all will-worship . Secondly , God is greatly dishonoured , by such externall will-worship effectively in the Beholders . First , because when they see such a great Prelate as your selfe use such gestures in Gods Service , they are apt to imitate you , and so to partake of your sinne , as too many doe . Secondly , because in such false worship , the neerer they think to * * Isa. 29.13 . approach to God in imitating of you , the further off their hearts are from God , as the Prophet Speaketh . And they whose hearts are farre removed from God , cannot glorifie God . Now your will-worship , which is taught by the Precepts of men , though it seem to be very humble , and so to draw neere unto God : yet it drawes away mens hearts farre from God ; as there the Prophet sheweth . And such as behold , and affect , and imitate your devises in externall worship , they are as much puffed up with vaineglory , that they imitate and so please such a great Man , as your selfe , as they never think of glorifying God . And lastly , God is not glorified by blind and Superstitious worshippers : but by good works springing from the inward light of Faith . Now your blind Devotion is not to be reckoned and ranked among good works . For good works are such , and so done , as God hath commanded : but your externall worship ( as you call it ) being a will-worship , and so a false worship , which God no where hath commanded , but every where expressely forbidden , are no good works , but as Aug. Saith , Splendida peccata , a glaring false worship . But it seemeth this your externall worship , the fruit of your Devotion , is all the good works you have to show , that men thereby may See what Kind of light is in you ; which is not any true , but a false light .

I proceed . But how hath this ignis fatuus of yours carryed me so out of my way , that I have over Skipt one Passage in the same Page , a little before ? But yet coming in here , it will the more fitly usher in the next , which we shall note in the Same Page .

L. ibid. This I have observed further , that no one thing hath made Conscientious men more wavering in their own minds , or more apt and easie to be drawn aside from the Sincerity of Religion professed in the Church of England , then the want of uniform and decent Order , in too many Churches of the Kingdome .

P. A little * * Pag. 34. before you commended unto us the Integrity of the Church in Doctrine and Manners ; and but now , how right your hearts stand in the Service of God : here , you use a third word , Sincerity of Religion , and that professed in the Church of England . By this time we are sufficiently acquainted with your Sincerity of Religion , professed in the Church of England . For we have your externall worship as the GREAT WITNESSE thereof , of which your Sincerity so much is spoken , as we have left a great hole in it . And the nature of that your Sincerity of Religion , professed in the Church of England , duely considered , can we marvaile , if most mens minds in the Kingdome fall a wavering ; yea , and if they be truely Conscientious men indeed ( not such as you meane , to wit , meere Formalists , or Newters ) no marvaile if you find multitudes of them ( if multitudes of such be left ) to fall quite off from the Sincerity of your Religion professed in the Church of England . But if any of your Conscientious men be drawn aside : what 's the Cause ? Want of uniforme and decent Order in too many Churches in the Kingdome . But doe you not see on the other side a whole Nation driven aside , and that ( as they Say ) by your too much pressing upon them your uniforme and decent Order in all Churchs for the erecting of the Sincerity of Religion professed in the Church of England ? And yet you complain , that you cannot set up your uniformity in too many Churches in England . Surely , ye might have done well , first to have made all uniforme at home , before you pressed too hard upon your Neighbour-Countrey . And if too many Churches in England be not uniforme , whose fault is that ? Not yours , I dare say . Have not you and your brother Prelates done pretty well to it , in Suspending , Silencing , Excommunicating , Casting out of their Ministry and Living , so many Ministers ? Witnesse Norfolke , Suffolke , Essex , Kent , Surrey , and other Diocesse and Shires . Will not these Examples , terrifie all other Churches in England ? But yet if nothing els will doe it , the publishing of this your Book anew , will certainly effect it , or nothing . And therfore you adde .

L. Ibid. To deale Clearly with your Majesty these thoughts are they , and no other , which have made me labour so much , as I have done , for Decencie and an Orderly Settlement of the externall worship of God in the Church . Now no externall action in the world can be uniform , without some Ceremonies : And these in Religion the ancienter they be , the better , so they may fit Time and Place . Too many overburthen the Service of God , and too few leave it naked , &c. Ceremonies are the hedge , that fence the Substance of Religion from all the indignities , which Profanesse and Sacriledge too commonly put upon it . Weaknesse it is , not to see the Strength , which Ceremonies ( things weake enough in themselves , God knows ) adde even to Religion it selfe ; but a farre greater , to see it , and yet to cry them down , All , and without choyse , by which their most hated Adversaries Climbe up , and could not cry up themselves , and their Cause , as they doe , but by them .

P. I shall have here occasion , and that in sundry respects , to be more large upon your words . First , for the Substance of the matter , being of such moment . Secondly , for the Circumstance of the Person , to whom you speak , his Sacred Majesty , which makes your matter of the greater Consequence : and Lasty , in respect of the Excellency of the Person Iesus Christ , whose honour and regall Soveraignty is here undermined by you . For when Kings are misinformed , and miscounselled in matters of Religion especially , and that by those , whom they repose greatest confidence in ▪ and whose judgement they most rely upon , and have that high opinion of , both for Learning and Sanctity ; which they conceive to be in them ; 't is a matter full of weight . And when we see the glory of Christ , and of his Kingdome troden under foot , it will , & ought to stirre up , and kindle the Zeale of every true Servant of Christ , to vindicate his Masters honour , to the utmost of his power . Now to your words .

And to deale truely with your Majesty . What els ? Surely one of your honourable place , and in whom such trust is reposed , should deale clearely with Kings at all times , and in all things . But wherein doe you deale clearely with his Majesty ? In this ( as you say ) in telling him , These thoughts are they and no other , which have made me labour so much , as I have done , for Decencie and an Orderly Settlement of the externall worship of God in the Church . Is it so ? Why , a little before ( if you remember ) you told his Majesty that you put forth this worke , wherein you have bestowed so much paines , for the vindicating of your Reputation : And now you tell him , that your thoughts for Decencie , &c. and no other● , made you thus to labour . And no other then ? Then what 's become now of your Reputation ? Yea , and ( pag. 9. before cited ) doe you not tell his Majesty expresly , saying , I have thus acquainted your Majesty with all occasions , Prelates Contradiction . which both formerly , and now againe have led this Tract into the Light ? All ? But how all , where here is one more comes in the Reare , not mentioned before , which excludes all other , Saying , These thoughts are they , and no other , which have made me labour so much , as I have done , for Decencie , and an Orderly Settlement , &c. And herein , you say , you deale Clearely with his Majesty . Did you not then deale Clearely in the rest ? You have occasion now to cleare your selfe . But to let this passe ; we can easily beleeve , ( that setting your Reputation aside ) these thoughts of yours were of greatest force with you to set upon such a worke . For I beleeve you have been no small time in hammering this Project , how to beat and fashion it to such a Decencie and Orderly Settlement of the externall worship of God in the Church of England , as you speak of ▪ But what doe you call Decencie ? Certainly that onely is Decent in the worship of God , which God himselfe approveth , and that is onely That , which himselfe commandeth in his word . But you account and call that onely Decent in the worship of God , which either your selfe , or that Whore of Babylon hath devised for Decent , as the seting up of her pompous Devotion , and voluntary humility in Rites and Ceremonies in Gods worship , as ye pretend . And can you Say , that your decencies are not just the Same , with those of Rome ? Perhaps you cannot yet attain to all hers . And if not hers , how could they with you be Decent ? But She being That Whore , and marked out for such , even by her very attyre ( Rev. 17. ) Will Christ ( trow you ) aporove that for decent in his Spouse ▪ which is the Whores Fashion ? Is not this enough to provoke his jealousie , and ( if he knew it not ) to suspect your Church of England for Scarce an honest Woman ? Yea an honest Woman for her Credit sake , will not goe in gaudey and garish garbe , proper and peculi●r to such as are notorious Strumpets , and such too , as whereby famous Whores are known from honest and vertuous Matrons ? But let it be the Decencie of your Church of England , to be suited like her Sister Rome ; that so they may be the better known for Sisters , and both of one House , and ( to prove your words true ) both one , and the Same Church .

But decencie is not all . Your thoughts are also for an Orderly Settlement of the externall worship of God in the Church . Why , what Settlement ? Were not all things sufficiently settled ( yea and * * Ier. 48.11 . upon the Lees too ) in the Church you speake of , before you were settled in the Throne of Canterbury ? Was there not settled an universall conformity to those Ceremonies prescribed and limited by Act of Parliament ? Are not all Non-conformists Silenced , and casheered ? Was not all quiet then ? Yea so quiet , that the Church of England was fallen quietly asleep , and so securely setled ( I say againe ) upon ‡ ‡ Zeph. 1.12 . her Lees. What hath now then made the disturbance , and unsetled the State of things ? Did not that begin with your Primacie ? How so ? For just then , when you were Scarce warm in the Chaire , began there not to be republished , with an Addition , that Edict to dispense with the due Sanctification of the Lords day , by giving liberty for profane Sports ; wherein also Gods people , whom you call Puritans , were marked out , as not worthy to be suffered in any Countrey . Then also , began there not to be published a Declaration with and before the Booke of your 39. Articles , prohibing all Disputes about all the Controverted Points in those Articles , and commanding to keep to the letter of the Text , which yet ( as it saith ) might be taken either way ? So as was not this a most grosse unsettling of the Doctrines of your Church , and a strowing of the way to Fr. a S. Clara his Booke , wherein he goes about to prove , that the Doctrines of England and Trent , are one and the Same , or with but small difference , which Book coming forth was much Graced by you in Court . And so that Declaration because also a Shelter to Shroud your Arminian Faction against a Storm , if ever it should come , yea and to defend their Heresies , and defeat the truth ( had it no surer footing , then your prevaricating Articles ) when once you could make your party good . Began not then an Order to be a new set forth , with an Inlargement of restraint , reaching even to Deanes and Prelates , and the greatest Rabbies of your Church not to meddle in their Sermons with those controverted points , as of Predestination , Election , &c. but strictly to observe the said Declaration ? Under your Primacie began there not a more remarkable restraint of writing , or at least of Printing against the Pope , and a larger licensing of most notorious Popish Books ? As Shelfords five Sermons or Treatises , wherein ( among many other like things ) he indeavours to prove Iustification by Charity , and the Pope not to be Antichrist , and no necessity of frequent Preaching , and none to preach but Bishops and Deanes , and that onely and especially at the three Solemn times in the yeare . Also another Book intituled the Femall Glory , as full fraught thoughout with the most grosse , blasphemous , Idolatrous Popish Stuffe , as it can hold ; and this in plain English , allowed by one of your Chapleins , or of London house ; and for ought I heare , not yet suppressed , or call'd in . Besides many other of the same branne , some whereof are printed , but kept up under deck , not daring yet to peep forth , till the Storm ( as in Starre Chamber you call'd it ) raysed by BURTON and others , be over ; and least they should be made Popish Martyrs in Smithfield , as Salis his Devotions were , which for feare were burned , as afore . Under your Primacy hath there not been a mighty stirring and stickling for the seting up of Altars , &c. yea of Images too , and Crucifixes , and that in Collegiate Churches , or Chappels , both in Oxford , you being Chauncellour , and in Cambridge , where you want not a Vice-Chauncellour , and which you indeavour in all the Churches of England ? Under your Primacie , have not your pregnantest wits , and profoundest Divines been set aworke to write Books to unmorallize the 4th Commandement for the perpetuall keeping of the Lords Sabbath day , and so unbind Christians from the sanctification of the Lords day ; and their Books allowed by your Authority , and Dedicated to great ones , and much applauded by your Faction ? Under your Primacie have not your Doctors also written stoutly for your Altars , and that , even unto blasphemy , Saying , that the use of the Altar is to sanctifie the Sacrifice , and without an Altar the Sacrifice is not Sanctified , or dedicated by the Bishop ? Under your Primacie began not Ministers to be Suspended , Silenced , Excommunicated , put out of their Benefices and Cures of Soules , for refusing to read the Book of Liberty for Sports on the Lords day , and to set up Altars in their Churches at their Ordinaries Command . These these my Lord being thus , doe you complaine of unsettlednesse ? Who hath troubled the Fountain ? The Wolfe , above at the Spring head , or the Lamb below ? To recollect then , and recapitulate these things : When Profanation of the Lords day is by publick Edict allowed : when the Articles of Religion are made as the Delphick Oracles , to be taken two contrary wayes : when the Doctrines of Gods Grace are universally restrained and forbid to be preached : when Popish Books publickly allowed in Print , and Orthodox Books against Popery restrained : when Altars set up in all Churches , where there was none before : when Books published by Authority to disanull Gods Morall Law : when Books allowed publickly to maintain the seting up of Altars in Churchs : when Godly Ministers by multitudes put down , for not yeelding to those things , which are contrary to the Laws of God and man : and all this in the State of England , where from the first Reformation ( such as it was ) have been universally and constantly maintained both by writing and preaching , the morality of the 4th Commandement for the sanctification of the Lords Day : the Articles of Religion concerning Grace , to have but one Orthodox sense : the free and unrestrained preaching of Gods word , and confuting of all opposite Errours : that the Pope is that Antichrist : that the Lords Supper was to be celebrated onely at the Lords Table : that Ministers Conformity was extended no further , then was limited by the Law : all these things considered , in the tumult of so many bold Innovations , ( Innovation ? I cry you mercy : Renovations I should say , of old Popish ragges and outcast reliques , for you disclaim Innovation ) against Gods law and Mans law : what settlement , what peace , what tranquility can be expected ? and then again al these new Attempts for Uniformity and Conformity coming in under and with your Primacie , can they vindicate your Reputation from a generall opinion of your being the most perillous and pernicious Instrument of unsettling and troubling the State o● the Land , What a Settler the Prelate is , and of Religion ( and you may , if you will , take Scotland in to boot ) with generall discontents and heart burnings , to see the State of Religion , thus turned topsie turvie turvie ▪ And doe you complain notwithstanding , that you cannot attain to an Orderly Settlement ? Stay , my Lord , be not so eagre : See Scotland first settled , before you proceed further in the settlement of England , least you unsettle all . Be not deceived in the confidence of your own active brain , and borrowed power . And see also how your Booke will take . For Certainly therein you have run your selfe upon the Pikes , get off as you can . Your Reputation ( if you meane it for the Repute to be a good Protestant : unlesse you meane it , that you would be accounted what you are , a member of one and the Same Church with Rome ) is now bound to the Stake , ready to be Sacrificed for a whole-burnt Offering . For what your Ordinary practises proclaimed to the world of you , now in your Book you stick not openly to professe , that you desire for the Church and State of England to be reconciled to the Sea of Rome . So as your Book , besides the turbulent matter in it ▪ ( like the Trojan horse , full of armed enemies ) could not possibly have been borne into the world in a more unhappy time , then now , when you see two Kingdomes all in a combustion , which the Sprinkling of your Romes Holy water wil be so farre from quenching , or allaying , that it will prove rather as Oyle to increase and feed the flame . But GOD give the King the Spirit of Wisedome and Iudgement to see into these things betimes , both for the preventing of further mischiefes , and for the reuniting of the great rent between his two Kingdomes . But as Iehu said to Iehoram , when he asked , Is it peace , Iehu ? What peace ( said he ) so long as the Whoredomes of thy Mother Iezabel , and her Witchcrafts are so many ? So what peace can be expected in the Land , where such an Uniformity and Settlement is required , as is so repugnant to the Laws of Christs Kingdome , and conformable to Antichrists Tyranny , and conducible to a reconciliation with that old Iezabel of Rome ? Certainly , the case being so , as Deborah said in her Song , They chose new gods , then was warre in the gates : So when a Nation falls to advance higher and higher a new and false Religion , where it had been formerly in some good measure cast out , to set up Idolatrous and Romish Altars , whereby Christ the true and onely Altar of true Christians ( as hath been shewed ) is denyed and renounced : and to cry down Gods holy Commandements : and to oppresse Gods holy Word in the Ministry of it : and to persecute Gods faithfull Ministers and People : and like the Aegyptians to oppresse Gods People more and more with intolerable burthens of humane inventions , to the great reproach of Christ , and the throwing down of his incommunicable Royall Soveraignty over his Church and People , in matters of Faith , and the worship of God : Can peace , or settlement be expected there ? Can , or will the Lord Iesus Christ long suffer such things ? And what doth England now attempt ? The recovery of Scotland ? First , ô England , be thou thy selfe reconciled to God : humble thy selfe for thy fearefull Apostacie : revoke and call in all thy ungodly Edicts against Christ , and his Word : reforme all thy oppressions of Gods People , and thine owne : maintain not still open warre against the Spirituall Kingdome of Iesus Christ , least he destroy thy temporall : looke up to God , as highly offended with thee , and who hath for the present rent a whole Kingdome from thee , who hast rent thy selfe from his Kingly Dominion over thee . Be no longer rebellious against God : stand not upon the confidence of thine own conceited Prudence and Power , which unlesse thou hast God on thy side , shal be but a snare unto thee , and shall stand thee in no stead at thy need , except thou dost repent and turn to God unfainedly , and refraine thy violent courses , and reform all . My zeale hath carryed me thus farre for my God , and for my King , and for my Countrey , and for all the People of God , and the King , in all his Kingdomes , my dayly prayer being for Truth and Peace ; as the Prophet Saith , * * Zach. 8 Love the Truth and Peace . Truth is both the Mother , and Nurse of Peace .

But to proceed : you say , No externall action in the world can be uniforme , without some Ceremony . If you speak of Naturall Actictions , ‡ ‡ 1 Cor. 11.14 . nature it selfe doth teach a fit manner in doing of them . If of Morall , or Civill actions , we commonly use such Ceremonies , as either humane Lawes , Customes , or a mans owne reason hath brought in use . But if you Speake of Religious actions , such as are conversant about the worship of God : That 's quite of another nature , for point of Ceremony . Onely thus farre it holds proportion with the other : that as every naturall action hath for its manner of performance and carriage certaine Principles of Nature to guide a Man in the decent and orderly doing of it : and as every Civil and Morall action hath for its manner of the decent carriage of it some Rule , either intrinsecall , within a man , and in his own choyce and power , or extrinsecall and without him , according either to Custome , or humane Law : even so the externall manner of performing Gods worship , hath for its Sole Principle and Rule the will of God himselfe , whose service it is , and over which he is the Sole Lord , whose will for his whole service both internall and externall he hath clearely expressed in his word , the holy Scripture . And this is a principle , which every man , that seeth not but by the Spectacles of Natures Light , assenteth unto , as a firme and universall truth , namely That every Master is so to be served , as himselfe commandeth . And if a Servant presume to serve his Master as himselfe listeth , and not as his Master commandeth , shall have small thanks for his labour . How much more , and beyond all comparison is God to be served of us , not as we fancie , but as himselfe hath expresly commanded in his word ? And this is a safe obedience , wherein a man , observing his Rule , cannot erre . Whereas obedience to Mans command is onely so farre good , as the commandement it selfe is good and lawfull . But Gods Word and Commandement being every way perfect , and given us with a strict charge , and under a most severe penalty , even a Curse to those , that shall either adde to it , or detract from it : who , but * * Katàras tékna . Children of the curse , will presume to invent what manner of externall service of God his own proud fancie liketh best ? Such service cannot be called the service of God , as wherewith he is served and pleased , but the service of Man , wherein he pleaseth himselfe . Yea when a man hath pleased his own fancie in the invention of this or that Ceremony in religious worship , and not content herewith , doth withall impose and injoyne it to be of necessity observed of all , so as their Conscience is now by humane Law captivated thereunto :

Heresie what it is .

Prelates Ceremoniall worship Hereticall .

this service of God becomes Hereticall . For what is Heresie in the common use among Divines , but an obstinate holding , and maintaining of an errour in faith , which mans pride hath made choyce of But , not onely presumtuously to elect , and obstinately and pertinaciously to maintain , but to make a Law to enforce others to conform to any such errour in faith : this is the highest degree of Heresie that can be . And that the inventing , holding and imposing of such Ceremonies in Gods worship is an errour in faith , and so hereticall , is cleare . For it is a point and ‡ ‡ Artcile of faith , Christ the onely Lord in and over his own house and Service . Article of Christian faith to bebeleeve , that Christ is the onely Lord and King of his Church ; and therfore in the Creed we say , And in Iesus Christ , his onely Sonne , our Lord . To whom then doth the power of ordaining Ceremonies in Gods holy service appertaine , but to the King or Master of this service ? This power is Christs Prerogative in his Church . This is Christs Throne , wherein he sitteth , raigneth , and ruleth in and over the Soules and Consciences of his people , as before is touched . He is the onely Teletarkes , or Master of ordaining Ceremonies in Gods house , or family ( as the learned Budaeus interprets that word out of Dionisius Areopageta ) so as Teletarkía , which signifies a Prerogative and Power in GOD , incommunicable , to ordaine Ceremonies in his worship , is used for the Soveraigne Deity or Godhead , and so for the Holy Trinity . And Christ hath ever from the beginning reserved this power intire and peculiar to himselfe , even as his glory , not imparting it to any earthly power , not to his Church , not to his Prophets and Apostles , not to the Kings of Israel under the Law , nor to the Fathers before the Law . For before the giveing of the Law in Mount Sina , * * Gen. 4. & 7. & 8. & 35. ● . GOD taught his Church the use of Sacrifices and Altars , and other Rites , with the difference of Meates cleane , and uncleane . At the giving of the Law , GOD shewed Moses a pattern for the Tabernacle , and all things thereunto belonging , ‡ ‡ Exod. 25.9.40 . with a Charge to doe all things according to the Pattern which he had seen . Not the least Ceremony , no not a pin about the Tabernacle was left in Moses power or choyce to make of his own head . So afterward , when the Temple was to be built , David received the ‡ ‡ 1 Chro. 28·12 . 19 . pattern thereof , and of all things appertaining to the whole service thereof from God in writing , which David delivering to his Son Salomon appointed of God to build the Temple Said , All this the Lord made me understand in writing by his hand upon me , even all the worke of this Pattern : even the § § v. 12. Pattern of all that he had by the Spirit . So as , though David was a King , and a Prophet , and that of singular eminency , † † 1 Sam. 13.14 . a man according to Gods own heart , and aboundantly indued with the holy Spirit of God , and * * 2 Sam. 2● . 14 . the Sweet Psalmist of Israel : and though King Salomon was indued with admirable and incomparable wisedome : yet the Lord would not commit to either of them any part of this his Prerogative in appointing what manner of service they thought good , or in the fashion of building the Temple . Nor yet did the Lord deliver the patterne of these things by tradition , but in writing , that in nothing they should come short , or over shoot their bounds . Neither had any of the Kings of Iudah the power afterwards , either to adde , or alter the least thing , but at their perill . No not the King , and the Priest together , as you would now have it . So as when in a case of necessity ( no Law or Rule for us to take liberty to doe what we please , without warrant from Gods word ) * * 2 Chron. 30.2 , 3 , 4. King Ezechias was to keep the Passeover in the Second Moneth : he did it not alone , nor with the Priest alone , but with the unanimous assent and approbation of all the Princes and People in Ierusalem : So as the thing pleased the King , and all the Congregation . Likewise when ‡ ‡ 2 Sam. 6. & 1 Chron. 15.1 , 2 , 3 , 4. King David was to bring the Arke to Ierusalem , he did it not alone , or with the Priest alone , but gathered all the chosen men of Israel together about it . And what to doe ? Not what himselfe , and they thought fit , but according to the Law and Commandement of the Lord . And is it come to this passe now , that the King and the Priest must doe all , and that according to their owne Fancie in the worship and service of God ? ‡ ‡ 2 King . 16. When the Priest Vriah had according to the Kings Commandement built an Altar , according to the patterne sent him by the King from Damascus , on which the King offered Sacrifice , did God approve it ? Is he not branded with this note , which sticks upon his name to this day , § § 2 Chron. 28.22 . This is that King Ahaz ? And did not the Lord † † 2 Chro. 26. smite King Vzziah with Leprosie , for offering Incense , which pertained to the Priest onely ? And was not * * 1 Chro. 13. Vzzah smitten , for but puting his Hand to stay the Arke , when the Oxen shook it , it not pertaining to him , being but a Levite , and not a Priest , who onely was to meddle with the Arke ? So dangerous is it for men , to take upon them , be they Prince , or Priest , or both , to intermeddle in any thing about the service of God , which God hath not given them warrant for . Now where hath Christ , or his Apostles from him left any such power to man , Prince , or Priest , or both ( as you claim and usurpe ) or to the Church , to ordaine any Ceremonies in Religion , to bind the Conscience of his People to the observation of them ? And if ye have either a pattern , or pattent for it from Christ , and under black and white , in writing , not by any unwritten Tradition , produce and shew it . But none can you shew , we are sure . I know your usuall places , which you use to wrest for this purpose . As 1 Cor. 14 . 4● . Let all things be done Decently and in in Order . Hereupon ( it seemeth ) your words of decencie , and orderly settlement are grounded . But what conclude you hence ? Ergo the King and the Priest ( although in things of this nature you use the King but as a Cypher , to back and countenance the Priest in what he doth ) may appoint what Ceremonies they please in the service of God . But frame your Argument in a Syllogisme .

All things in the Church are to be done Decently and in Order . But for the King and the Priest to prescribe and impose what Ceremonies they please in Gods Service is Decent and Orderly . Ergo , it is left to the Power of the King and the Priest to prescribe and impose what Ceremonies they please in Gods Service .

Or thus :

What is Decent , and according to Order , is lawfull to be done in the worship of God . But for the King and Priest to prescribe and impose Ceremomonies in Gods Service , is Decent , and according to order : Therefore it is lawfull for the King and the Priest to prescribe and impose Ceremonies in the Service of God .

Now if I have not framed your Argument according to your mind , I desire you to mend it . But I conceive it is all that can be framed upon that test , which you alledge , so as if you argue not thus , you can make nothing at all of it , according to the Rules of Logick . Nor for answere . First , I deny , that the Apostle speakes there of the Service of God in Prayer , but onely of an Order , and Dencie in Prophecying , such as was then in use in the Church : as , first , that it should be done * * 1 Cor. 14 ▪ 31. one by one , and not confusedly . Secondly , ‡ ‡ v. 34. that women should not be permitted to speak in the Church . Thirdly , ‡ ‡ v. 27. that it be not in a strange tongue , without an Interpreter . And such like . And to this hath that of the Apostle particular and immdediate reference , Let all things be done decently and in order . As for Praying in the Church , the Apostle gives no other Rule but this , that it be not done in a strange tongue . Againe , we have before excluded the Priest you speak of , from having any thing at all to doe , or meddle in Gods service , for the Reasons fore-shewed . So as if for the King and the Priest you put the Church , I answere . First your Prelaticall Church is a false Church , as hath been proved , and so with your Priest is altogether excluded here from having any such power , as to ordain Ceremonies in Gods service to bind the Consciences of Gods people . For in so doing you shew your selves to be Antichrists , and Tyrants over mens soules , as before is shewed . Secondly , not even the true Churches and Congregations of Christ , the King , Minister , and People put together , have power to ordaine and impose any Ceremony in Gods service to bind the Conscience : For the Apostles themselves neither had , nor exercised any such power . We find not any one footstep of it in all the New Testament . But in this case Christians were left altogether free . And the Apostle admonisheth the Collossians , and in them all Christians , Saying , * * Col. 2.8 . Beware , least any man spoyle you through Philosophy , and vaine deceit , after the Tradition of men , after the rudiments of the world , and not after Christ . And v. 16. Let no man judge you in meat , or drink , or in respect of an holy day , &c. which are a shadow of things to come : but the body is of Christ . Let no man Judge you : that is , subject not your Conscience to Mans command and ordinance in these things , as matter of Religion . And v. 20. If ye be dead with Christ from the rudiments of the world , why , as living in the world , are subject to Ordinances , Touch not , Tast not , Handle not ; which all are to perish with the using ; being after the Commandements and Doctrine of men ; which have indeed a Shew of wisedome in will-worship , and humility in neglecting of the body : not in any honour to the Satisfying of the flesh . The summe of all which is to shew , that Christians being freed by Christs death from all humane Ordinances and Traditions in matters of Religion , they ought to be so mortified , as to be dead to these things , and not any more to suffer themselves in such things to be vassalized by men : which to doe , is to deny Christs death , and so to fall away from Christ , not holding the Head , that is , not holding Christ , as the Apostle Saith , v. 19. And therefore he chargeth , Saying , ‡ ‡ v. 18. Let no man beguile your reward ( or the Crowne of your victory , as the ‡ ‡ Katà . word imports ) in a voluntary humility , &c. That is , Subject not your selves to mens devises in matters of Religion , though they have never so faire pretences of voluntary humility , and devotion : for so you suffer your selves to be spoyled of your Crown , that you fight for ; as Christ Saith , † † Rev. 3.11 . Hold fast that thou hast , that no man take thy Crown . Thus we see , that it is a matter of no small moment and consequence , to be subject to Mans devises in matters of Religion , and Gods worship , when it is a denyall of Christs death , yea a falling from Christ , and so a loosing of our eternall Crown . And here againe on the other side , such as wil be Masters of Ceremonies in the service of God , may take notice of their damnable pride and presumption , in daring to bring into bondage the people of God , whom Christ with his own precious blood hath redeemed from all such Slavery . And for matter of decencie : Is it decent , for a Judge set over a Province by the King , or Supreame Magistrate , with expresse written Laws how to govern , and no otherwise , to take upon him to rule them as he list , and to yeeld what service to the King he pleaseth ? Or is it decent , that one King , subordinate to a higher , as Emperour , or so , as King Herod was to Caesar Augustus , should presume to make Laws to bind Caesars Subjects , without any expresse warrant so to doe ? Now all earthly Princes are subordinate to Christ , as his vice-gerents , who is King of Kings , and Lord of Lords .

Nay more then this : Christs Kingdome here on earth , is Spirituall , and the Laws therof altogether spirituall , enacted by his Spirit , and recorded in the Scripture : Is it decent then , that earthly Powers , or Princes , or Priests , how ever styled , should make Laws according to their carnall fancies , for the government of this Spirituall Kingdome , and the service of God , who wil be * * Ioh. 4.23 24. served in Spirit and Truth ? Yea , in this Spirituall Kingdome , Christ our King keeps his perpetuall residence by his Spirit immediatly , and that in the heart , soule , spirit , and conscience , of every one of his Subjects and Saints , the true beleevers . So the Apostle : ‡ ‡ Heb. 3.6 . But Christ , as the Son ●ver his own house , whose house we are , &c. And , * * 2 Cor. 6.26 you are the Temple of the living God , as God hath Said , I will dwell in them , and walke in them , and I wil be their God , and they shal be my people . Wherfore come out from among them , and be ye Seperate , Saith the Lord , and touch not the unclean thing , and I will receive you : And I wil be a Father unto you , and ye shal be my Sons and Daughters , Saith the Lord Allmighty . And § § 1 Cor. 3.17 Know ye not , that ye are the Temple of God , and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you ? If any man defile the Temple of God , him will God defile , or destroy : For the Temple of God is holy , whose Temple ye are . And , † † 1 Pet. 2.5 Ye are built up a Spirituall house , an holy Priesthood , to offer up spirituall sacrifices , acceptable to God by Iesus Christ . Now , is every true beleever the Temple of God , a Spirituall house , over which the Son of God ruleth as King , and in which he dwelleth and walketh , in which also spirituall Sacrifices and Services are offered up in Christs Name , as himselfe hath commanded in his word ? And is all strange service , devised by men a profaning of the Temple of God , as the * * Exod. 30.9 Levit. 10.1.3 Mal. 1.7 . 2 Chro. 36.1 . Scripture every where teacheth ? And must Gods people Seperate themselves from all such profanesse , and touch no unclean thing , by subjecting themselves to profane ordinances of men , whereby they should cast off God for their Father , and Christ for their King , and the Holy Ghost from his residence and dwelling in them ? Then how not onely undecent , but unholy , profane and impious is it , for any sort of men whatsoever , to impose the devices of their own brains upon the Consciences of Gods people in the worship of their God ? What is this , but to thrust Christ out of his Throne ( as before ) and to set up an Antichristian Throne of Tyranny ( like Caesars Image in the Temple , the abomination of desolation ) in the living and spirituall Temples of Iesus Christ ? Thus Christ being that O●kodespotes , the Father of the Family of God , is it decent for any Steward ( Such whose Office you doe usurpe ) of his own head , without warrant , to give carnall Lawes to the Family for their spirituall Service to their Lord , and * * Math. 24.49 . to beat them , if they refuse to conforme unto them .

Secondly , neither is it according to Order , for men to Set up Ceremonies in Gods service . First , because they have no order from God so to doe : So as God may Say unto them , ‡ ‡ Isa. 1.12 . Who required these things at your hands ? And , ‡ ‡ Math. 15.9 . In vain they worship me , teaching for Doctrines the Commandements of men . Againe , 'T is the greatest violation of Order in the World , for any Man to usurpe and exercise a Tyranny over his Fellow-Servants , § § Math. 24.48.49 . which the Lord hath expresly forbidden , and which he will most severely punish . And of all Tyrannies in the world , is not this the greatest , and most intolerable , to hold under the yoake of bondage the Consciences of Gods people , in the observation of humane rites in the worship of God , from all which Christ hath freed them by the shedding of his blood ? And will a King think it to be according to Order , and not the highest degree of rebellion , for a Subject to usurpe his Throne ? Can it then be either decent , or orderly , for any power on earth , Prince or Priest , or altogether , to invade Christs Throne , and therein exercise their Tyranny over his people ? Certainly such as doe so , 't is just with God to thrust them out of their Thrones , and to breake the Staffe of their Tyranny , wherewith they beat his Children , over their heads . Thus this Scripture , the Same weapon , which you violently wrest and take out of Gods Armory , to beat us withall : we vindicate out of your hands , and turne both edge and point against your usurped Tyranny . And so being beaten out of the maine Fort , which you had violently seased , you can have small confidence in the rest .

But you goe on , and Say , Ceremonies in Religion , the ancienter they be , the better ; So they may fit Time , and Place . We all know your Lordship to be no small adorer of venerable and hoary Antiquity in point of Ceremonies . Indeed Salomon Saith , † † Pro. 16.31 . Antiquitas sin● Veritate vetustas erroris est ▪ The hoary head is a Crown of glory , if it be found in the way of Righteousnesse . Els not . And Tertullian an ancient writer of the Church , Saith , Antiquity without Verity , is oldnesse of Errour . And againe ; Illud antiquissimum , quod ●erissimum : That is most ancient , which is most true . You commend unto us ancient Ceremonies ; and the ancienter the better , so they may fit time and place . But here is never a word , how fit , and agreeable they be to the word of God . As Tertullian els where Saith to Hermogenes the Heretick , Scriptum esse doceat Hermogenis Officina ; Si non est Scriptum , timeat vae illud adijcientibus ▪ &c. Let Hermogenes his Shop shew this to be written ; if it be not written ; let him feare that woe to all them , that adde to , or take from the word of God , &c. But if antiquity be with you in such request , you may take in also the Mystery of Iniquity , if antiquity will commend it for good . For even in the Apostles time ( as is noted before ) it began to work , though ( as a Mystery ) more covertly , as not yet then fiting time and place . Not time : For the Apostles then living , thundred it into holes and thickets . Not place : For not Ierusalem , but Rome must be the place for it , but was not yet fitted for it . And the Devil , with his Lyes can plead great antiquity . And with his Lyes came in all Errours , which may stand in competition for antiquity even with verity it selfe For Satans Religion had the Start for antiquity of time , even of the Gospel it selfe ; as we may see , Gen. 3.1.15 . And therefore no marvail if your Lady Mother Rome doe stand so much upon the Tiptoes of her antiquity , both in her Hierarchy , and its whole frame of Errours , and Superstitious Ceremonies , as all claiming from the antiquity of the mystery of Iniquity , the common Grandmother and root , whence hath sprung in successive ages the Stock and branches of all Popery .

But for answere to all your Plea ▪ and Pretence of Antiquity , we alledge against you the antiquity of Truth . And if you plead for antiquity of humane devices , because Satans Lyes were born into the world , and imbraced , before Christ was revealed ; So as the very foundation of all will-worship , and inventions in the service of God , was layd in Adams fall from God , by the Serpents seducement : yet we preferre the Religion of Christ before it , because this brings with it the blessing . As in the Old Testament , when through Adams fall nature had lost her birth-right , the blessing still descended upon the younger , and that through grace . And doth not the antiquity of your ancient Ceremonies take its very rise and Originall from that poyson of pride , which the Serpent infused into our First Parents , telling them they should be as Gods , selfe-wise , selfe-sufficient ? Now there is nothing , wherein men would seem more wise , and please themselves more in that opinion , then their own devises in the worship of God . As the Apostle notes of the Gentiles , * * Rom. 1.22 . Who professing themselves to be wise , they became fooles . Wherein wise ? The Apostle sheweth , in their devised worship of God , in framing and worshiping false similitudes of God , yea even Images of beasts , and creeping things . Herein they thought themselves very wise men . And doe not you so in all your Train of humane inventions in the service of God ? If you do not think it the highest point of your wisedome , why do you make it your main Study , and spend all your wits , and strength , to fill the Church with such inventions ? But you will Say , They are not your owne invention , they are ancient , and the ancienter the better . But your seting them up , makes them your own , and makes them new againe , where they had been antiquated and cast out to the dunghill . Nay one thing more for antiquity of your Ceremonies you have from the Old Serpent , to be perswaded that you are as Gods , that you have all power in your hands over mens Consciences , in imposing upon them what Ceremonies you please in the service of God . Do you not here take upon you to be as Gods ? Sit you not in Christs Throne , while you thrust him out ? Thus we see what antiquity not onely your Ceremonies , but your absolute Tyranny in imposing of them may justly challenge . Well , take , your antiquity , but withall there 's another antiquity goes with it , which falls unto you by right of inheritance from that Old Syre of your Ceremonies , and that you may find in those words , to the Serpent and his Seed § § Gen. 3.14 , 15. Cursed art thou . And this is confirmed unto you ( Deut. 27.26 . ) Cursed is he that confirmeth not all the words of this Law to doe them . And doe you not make the word of God of no effect by your Traditions , Ceremonies in the worship of God put for the very Substance of Religion . while you set up your Ceremonies for and Essentiall part of Gods service ? For so you call them in plain termes , The externall worship of God , which you expresse to be those externall actions which you use in your Church-Service , as your devout bowing to your Altars , and the like . Thus you make Gods word of no authority , which alowes of no other worship of God , internall and externall , but such as he hath expresly commanded in his word . To which purpose Christ alledgeth against those hypocriticall Pharisees the Prophet Isaiah , in these words , This people draweth nigh unto me with their mouth , and honoureth me with their lips , but their heart is farre from me . But in vaine they doe worship me , teaching for Doctrines the Commandements of men . Which is expressed in Isaiah thus : § § Isa 29.13 . Their feare towards me is taught by the Precepts of men . Where , by feare is meant the worship of God ; as is noted before ▪ but you give me new occasion here to mention it againe . And I have no other Weapon , but Gods word , to incounter your vanities withall .

So they may fit Time and Place . Can you find any time or place in these dayes in England , so uncivill , or so irreligious in your religion , as not to intertaine your ancient venerable Ceremonies ? Or is not time yet ripe for it , but that some places at least shut out such guests ? Why then , what 's wanting ? Have you not a remedy in a readinesse ? Either the Popes Dispensation , to suspend all those without Law , that stand out , or some Edict or other will serve the turne . And no marvaile , if your English Christians , so long brought up in Christs Schoole , think Scorn to be brought back to Romes A.B.C. againe . And they have read how Iosua and the Elders of Israel , not consulting God , were deceived by the Gibeonites faire pretence of longinquity , by the appearance of Antiquity , Shewing it selfe in their mouldy bread , and old Shooes . Which was all they had to pretend for themselves , to be received into a League with Israel . The Same pretence is yours , who to strike a League between England and Rome , you pretend your Ceremonies come from farre , from antiquity it selfe , and the Ancienter the better . But all this Chaffe will not intice the old Birds into your Snare . Your Ceremonies for all their antiquity , will not yet fit Time and Place , at least not all Places in these Times . Why my Lord cannot your zeale be patient a while , till Time fit the Places ? Though you doe parturire , are in travaile to bring forth whether a Man , or Monster , or perhaps ( as the * * Parturient Montes , Nascitur ridiculu● Mu● . Hor. Mountaines once did ) a mouse : yet you must wait for Time and Midwife to helpe to deliver a birth of such Difficulty . Soft and faire . Rome was not built in one day . 'T is too rude , at first dash to hoyse up your Altar , and flappe down upon it presently your God-Allmighty . And though the heat of your zeale hath hastened the times to such a ripenesse , as they are even white againe ( as your Rochet ) with a pure outside of sanctity : yet some places being of a more solid and well watered soyle ( not like Summer fruits , soon ripe , soon rotten , but as Winter corne , that abides many a storme , and many a nipping frost ) all your zeale cannot so easily worke upon ; insomuch , as you shall sooner burn those fields , then ever come to reap your harvest of them . Ah , my Lord , you have undertaken a hard taske upon you , so as before you shall come to fell down that good old Oake of the Gospel , that hath grown so long , and taken such rooting in England , you will meet with many a hard knot , that will goe neer to turn the edge of your hatchet . Oh these Puritans ( my Lord ) are tough Laddes , you cannot with all your Rhetorick wooe them to be in love with old Mother Babel , or so much as once shake hands with her . And they are a strong Faction : for the head of it is Christ , and the guard of it is the holy Angels , and their weapons are such , as you cannot take from them ( though you labour to strip them of all the rest , as their faithfull Pastors , and solemne Fasts and dayes of humiliation ) and that is , their Prayers and Teares , which are of a prevayling power . So as you may suspect some thing is the Cause , that since you have so hampered them , and more remarkably since you cooped up those three Men , you have thriven so ill , as your Cause is rather gone backward , then got any ground ; and on the contrary the Puritans are mightily multiplyed , and their zeale and courage sharpened against you . And how comes this to passe ? Doe you not know ? Why , partly by the Antiperistasis of a hard frosty winter , and partly by their strong cryes to God ; which are also redoubled in their fervencie , by reason of the outward cold , and of your h●t and furious pursuing of them . And this is no new thing . The * * Exod. 1.10 . Psal. 105.25 . Israelites of old in Aegypt , the more subtilly and cruelly they were handled by the Aegyptians , under hard taskes , the more they multiplyed And the High Priests , Scribes and Pharisees , thought they had made their Kingdome Cock-sure , and utterly overthrown Christs , when once they had nayled him fast to the Crosse , and Seal'd him up in the Tombe : but it proved quite contrary , even the ruine of their State , and the inlargement of Christs Kingdome over the world . And Ecclesiasticall Stories tell us , that the Primitive Christians in the greatest heat of those 10. Persecutions , did so multiply , that at length they wearied out their persecuters . And it is noted of that Apostata Iulian , that when he saw his cruell persecuting of the Christians , and banishing of their Bishops nothing avayld , but that they did the more increase , he altered his course , and began to use them gently , and to recall their banished , and to promote them : So as by this meanes he drew a number of them to his bow , and they grew cold and feeble in their Christian profession , whereas by his former down-right cruelty , they grew upon it . And my Lord , be not so eagre in your zeale for a Reconciliation with Rome , as therfore to fall out with all good men . You have done much for your Time , as any one possibly could doe , yea and more a great deale , then I am perswaded any Man of wisedome and judgement ( all things considered ) either would or durst have done , although he had all your incouragements ; which though great ▪ yet because humane , a wise Man would not put so much confidence in . And besides , though you have calmed those THREE : yet is the Storm you Spake of in the Starre-Chamber at their Censure , over , otherwise then over your heads , So long as you storme so upon others ? You have exasperated the world against you by your desperate fury and cruelty : but much more the wrath of Heaven . And have you not had some terrible Signes of Gods wrath upon the Land , since their Censure ? Are all things quiet , now that they are in safe-Custody ? And though they be quiet , poore men , yet doe you not heare the voyce of their blood crying out against you ? Can you wash your hands of it , while the guilt of it sticks so closse to your Conscience , as the fire rather must purge it , then the water wash it .

But you goe on : Too many overburthen the Service of God , and too few leave it naked . You seem here somewhat reasonable : neither too many , for burthen ; nor too few , for nakednesse . You could be content then with some reas●nable mediocrity , could you hit upon the meane . But my Lord , in this Case of Ceremonies , Even Mediocrity is Extreme : and even your too few ( in your reckonig ) are too many , and doe overburthen the true service of God . For indeed the Imposition of your Ceremonies , though you think them too few , doth so burthen Mens Consciences , that their backs are ready to break ; and it doth so alter the property and nature of Gods service , that it is to be termed rather a servitude of men , then the service of God . For Gods Service is perfect Fre●d●me , as your owne Service Book Saith : but your Ceremoniall service is a yoake of bondage , and therefore no service of God , but such as God saith of it , In vain they worship me , teaching for Doctrines the Commandements of men , and for my Service the Ceremonies of Men. But admit , that Ceremonies were lawfull : who shall limit the Mediocrity inter nimium & parum , between too many and too few ? How few or too few ? And how many are too many . Mediocrities , you know , are as hard to be kept , as to be found . And especially in Religion you must have a care , that not onely the Service it selfe , but least your servants the Priests , be not overburthened . Therefore as one of your Canons provides , that your Priest that is not able to have a Long Gown , may weare a Short Cloake : So you may doe well to provide , that your Ceremonies and habits in your Service be fitted both to the Persons , and to the Seasons . For some Ceremonies may be tolerable in Winter , which are not so fit for Summer : as for your Priest to administer , and preach in his Surplice and Hood in Winter time , is more tolerable , yea and perhaps more usefull too , as keeping both his Corps , and cold Sermon that hath never a Soule , nor any heat of zeale in it , warme from freezing . But in Summer time to administer and preach with Surplice and Hood , 't is enough to stifle any man , especially if he be a fat Parson . But you will say , he may Preach the seldomer , and when he doth Preach , it may be the shorter . For better , Preaching be omitted , then the least of your Ceremonies should be neglected . But yet for shame of the world , at least in the Church of England ( which is not yet grown so Romish , as that Ceremonies should altogether thrust out Preaching ) me thinks you might doe well , as men doe for their wearing apparell , to have some habits for Summer , and some for Winter . But now I remember my selfe , that will put many a poore Priest to the more charge . And therefore to prevent both trouble and charge , I remember a pretty device of * * Plutarch . Dionisius , who coming into an Idols Temple , and finding rich cloth of gold , very Massy , upon the Idols , he tooke away their Robes of gold , Saying , they were both too heavy for Summer , and too cold for Winter , and he put upon them good course Freeze , saying , this would be both light wearing for Summer , and warme for Winter . But I suppose you would be loth to have your rich cloth of gold Copes , and the like , to be turned into course Freeze , as preferring Aurei Calices , & Lignei Sacerdotes , before Lignei Calices , & Aurei Sacerdotes ; which were of old in fashion : Golden Chalices , and Woodden Priests , before Woodden Chalices and Golden Priests ; I meane , such Golden Priests ( so called ) as then were , when the Chalices were of Wood , that is , Learned , Godly , and Preaching Presbyters . For otherwise , as Rome , so you , want not your Golden Priests sutable to your Golden Chalices , as Bernard in his Booke De Consideratione to Pope Eugenius the Fourth hath liberally taxed in the Pope and his Clergie of Priests : But these things I leave to your Lordshippes Cosideration .

But to returne to the point : in plaine termes my Lord till you doe resolve us justy how many Ceremonies you will have , and no more , for burthening the Service , or how few Ceremonies , and no fewer , for leaving all naked ( though I think you incline rather to the extremity of Excesse , in the too many , then to the extremity of Defect , in the too few , as loth to leave your Service naked ) you doe to a haires breadth resolve us , you must give us leave with one voyce or * * The Shout of Mariners when they hale together . Kéleusma , to cry downe all your Ceremonies of what sort soever , whereof the very least is a burthen intollerable to Gods People in the service of God . For ( as we said before ) Gods service admits not of any Will-worship at all , no not in the least Ceremony , wherewith the Conscience as it is bound , so it is overburthened . One Fetter , or Linke , or Chaine , or Bolt makes a Prisoner as sure , as many . As the Israelites were enslaved by the Aegyptian Taske-masters , as well when they were allowed Straw , as when it was denyed them . Though the bondage was the greater . But when a man is once made a Slave , who shall hinder his Master to lay as much burthen upon him , as he pleaseth ? And if you have a power to impose one Ceremony , who shall stint you for more , for ten , twenty , an hundred , if you doe but say the word that too few leave the Service naked ? But you will not have too many , for burthen . But how will you know when 't is a burthen , for you touch it not with one of your fingers , and so feele it not , as the Aegyptian Taske-masters did , while the poore people of God cry out for intolerable burthens ? All your burthen is to get it but up upon the peoples , and your Priests shoulders , and then you are so farre from feeling any more burthen , as you turne it into no small benefit , in Case any for very wearinesse and irksomnesse of the burthen , doe either lay it downe , or cast it quite off , yea or doe but rest himselfe a little with some intermission . Then your High Commission shall ring of him . Nor can we in any reason imagine that a few Ceremonies will serve the turne . For your maine Scope is to bring your Church of England to a full Reconciliation with Rome , the way to which must be strowed with many Ceremonies , as at a Marriage they strow the way to the Church with Herbes , that so when you have brought the matter to a pretty Conformity with as many Ceremonies as Time and Place will permit , the Match being already agreed upon and concluded between the parties , and friends , there may nothing be wanting to hasten the full and finall consummation . But herein the maine burthen will lye upon you . For it can little be hoped , that Rome for her part will abate any of her Ceremonies , so as the greater addition and accumulation wil be required on your part ; to make up tò íson , an equality in some reasonable proportion at least . For Amici●ia est inter pares . Friedship is between Equalls . But howere , in any Case not too few ; for then your Service would be naked ; and it might either hinder your Project , or hurt your reputation with Rome , when upon your coming home to Rome , She should find you naked ( such guests as Rome useth not to entertaine ) unlesse you will trust to her Kindnesse in furnishing you out of her rich Wardrobe and Magazin of Ceremonies , wherein She hath a large Overplus of Treasure , which your Church of England might afterwards recompense , either with reviving the Peter-pence , or returning his Holinesse his Old Tribute of Annates .

But in the meane time , how would too few leave your Service naked ? Surely many wayes , now when I better consider it . Without the Surplice and Hood , the Minister naked : without rich Ornaments and a Crucifix , the Altar naked : without a Signe of the Crosse , Baptisme is naked : without Kneeling before the Altar at the Communion , the Sacrament naked : without a devout Crindge when Iesus is named , Iesus is naked : without looking towards the East when you Pray , Prayer naked : without goodly Images , the Walls naked : without the rich Copes , the Epistle and Gospel naked : without a faire payre of Organs , and Chanting to it , the whole Service naked . But what if the whole Service were thus naked ? God neither requires , nor respects any such pomp in his Service . You will say , 'T is , sightly and stately . But one of the Heathen * * Persius Satyr . 2. Heathen more holy then Prelates . Poets could tell you , that God regards more a simple and honest heart , then all such gifts , or pompous Service . As he saith : Dicite Pontifices , in Sancto , quid facit aurum ? &c. Compositum jus , fasque animi sanctosque recessas Mentis , & incoctum generoso pectus honesto . Tell us , ye ‡ ‡ Or Bishops . Pontifies , what such glittering gold Makes on your Temples ? &c. A mind compos'd of justice , and of right , And holy contemplation ( Gods delight ) A brest well dipped in the purple grain Of noble honesty , That will not stain .

‡ ‡ Horace Carm. lib. 3. Ode . 23. Another of them saith : Immanis Aram si tetigit manus , Non sumptuosa blandior hostia Mollibit aversos Penates , Farre pio , & saliente mica . Th' innocent hand , if it the Altar touch , The sumptuous offring pleaseth not so much , T' appease the anger of your House-hold Gods , With Sacred Corn , and savory Salt by oddes .

Yea and every Schoole-boy knowes that Distich of old Cato : Si Deus est animus , nobis ut carmina dicunt , Hic tibi praecipuè sit pura mente colendus . If God as Poems say , a Spirit be : Then with pure mind let him be serv'd of thee .

And as the Roman Orator also said . Non in Ambrosia Deus , &c. I doe not think ( saith he ) that God is delighted with Ambrosia , or Nectar , or such like sensuall delights in his Service . [ Tuscul. Quaest. lib. 1. ]

Thus you see how those Heathen , even by the glimmering light of nature , had a better opinion of God , then our modern Prelates have , or at least , then our present Oracle of Canterbury hath shewed himselfe to have , for how neere came they to that truth uttered by Christ § § Iohn 4.23.24 . God is a Spirit , and they that worship him , must worship him in spirit and truth , &c. And if you propound the Jewes for example of State in the service of God ; first , God commanded it : and the magnificence of it was a Type of Christ , and of his Spirituall Temples , † † Psal. 45.13 all glorious within . Those Types are all vanished , the truth being come . And to revive that Service , and those Types , or to set up an Image of them , you doe with the Jewes deny Christ to be come . And for this Ierome shall answere you , Si placeat aurum , placeat et Iudaei : If gold please you so well in the service of God , let the Jewes also , and Judaisme please you . And the Poet : Dicite Pontifices in Templo quid facit aurum ? Tell us you Pontificiall Priests , what makes gold in the Temple ? And tell me , whether was Adam and Eve more beautifull in Gods eyes , and their own too , having no other cloathing , or ornaments upon them , but their naked Innocencie ▪ then in their new devised fashion of Fig-leave-Aprons ? Although they now seemed gay with their borrowed leaves , as the Crow with his borrowed feathers . And surely this may be a very fit patterne to Sample your Church by . For yours and Romes Church , having lost their Primitive and Originall beauty of Innocencie , Simplicity , and Purity of Christs Spouse , as the Love of God , Saving Faith , Soundnesse of Doctrine , Sanctity of Conversation , and Purity of his Worship , which you have by so many of your Superstitions so miserably corrupted : think you now to please GOD with a curious painted Service , which serves to no other purpose , then to please your owne fancie , and other mens carnall senses ? Is not this a GREAT WITNES to the World of your notorious blindnesse , and most grosse and palpable ignorance of the very nature of the Godhead , who Is a Spirit , and therefore will be worshiped in Spirit and truth ? And they who thus worship him in Spirit and Truth , are the true Worshipers , as the same Scripture Speakes ; and GOD seeketh such to worship him ; as is noted before . So as that Inscription , which the Apostle found upon that Altar in Athens , * * Act. 17.23 . Agnósto Theo , To the unknowne God : may it not be written as well upon your whole service , which you dedicate to the unknowne God ▪ which being patched up , like a Fooles gay Coate , of so many diverse coloured shreddes , wherein your service being dressed up , you think it is wondrous pleasing to God : doth not all this bewray , that you doe all this service to a God , whom you know not , as whom your fancie frameth to be some carnall Man , whose senses are delighted with such service : as his Eares with Organs , his Eyes with goodly Images , curious wrought Copes , rich Palls , faire guilded Plate : his Smell with sweet Incense , his Majesty with siting upon your Stately High Altar , as upon his Throne , and to keep his Residence in your goodly Cathedrall as in his Royall Court ? May not then that which the Apostle thereupon Preached to the Athenian Philosophers , be hereupon applyed to the Romish Rabbies , and blind Prelates of Rome , and of the Church of England ? ‡ ‡ Act. 17.22 ▪ 23. &c. Ye men of the Church of England , I perceive , that in all things ye are too Superstitious . For as I passed by , and beheld your Devotions ( marke your Devotions ) I found an Altar ( for blind Devotion cannot be without an Altar ) with this Inscription , To the unknown God : whom therefore ye ignorantly worship , him declare I unto you . God that made the world , and all things therein , seeing that he is Lord of heaven and earth , dwelleth not in Temples made with hands , neither is worshiped with mens hands , as though he needed any thing , &c. * * ve●s . 29. Forasmuch then , as we are the Offspring of GOD , we ought not to thinke that the Godhead is like unto Gold , or Silver , or Stone , graven by art , and mans devise . And the times of this Ignorance GOD winked at , but now commandeth all men every where to Repent . Because he hath appointed a day , in the which he will judge the world in Righteousnesse , &c. Now what say you to this , all you blind Ceremony-Mongers ? Are you growne so stupid , as not to be sensible how this toucheth you , as much , yea and much more , then those Athenians ? What ? Are you so blind and senselesse , as for all this to dreame , that GOD accepts your ga● Puppet-play as a Service of Piety done to him ? Nay , GOD tooke so little delight in those Sacrifices and Rites , which himselfe ordained in the Law , and much lesse when the people rested in the outward performance and observance of them , that he Saith , ‡ ‡ Is● . 1.12 . Psal 50.8 . &c. Who required these things at your hands to tread in my Courts , &c. So also Psal. 50.8 . I will not reprove thee for thy Sacrifices , to have been continually before me : I will take no bullocke out of thy house , &c. No : ‡ ‡ v. 23. Who so offereth me thanks and praise honoureth me : and to him that ordereth his Conversation aright , will I shew the Salvation of God . § § v. 22. Now consider this , ye that forget God ▪ least I teare you in pieces , and there be none to deliver . Yea the consideration hereof , brought † † Psal. 4.6.7 . Heb 10. ● ▪ 6 , 7 ▪ 8 , 9 , 10 Christ down from the bosome of his Father , to offer up his body as the onely acceptable , and All sufficient Sacrifice , to put an end to all carnall rites and services . If then Gods own Ordinances in the Law did not please him , but that he must send his Sonne in the flesh to fullfill all things ▪ then what hope can you have , that your vaine Superstitious devises should please GOD , or that he should otherwise be affected with them , but thereby to be provoked to send his Sonne the Second time * * 2 Thess. 1. ● ▪ 8 ▪ 9. in flaming fire , taking vengeance on them that know not God ( even all blind worshipers , but much more willfully blind ) such as obey not the Gospel of our Lord Iesus Christ , &c. Then shall all your Sumptuous Ceremonies , and Solemne Service be discovered , and the rotten inside of your hypocriticall formalities be turned out to the view of all the world . Like to Cardinall Campeius his Sumpter , which with a justle in Cheape-side , the girts bursting , downe it falls , and out fly the old Boots and Shooes , and such like baggage which it was stuft withall , becoming a ridiculous spectacle to all the beholders . So when your faire glorious guilden earthen pot , striving with your Maker ( as the Prophet speaketh ) comes to justle with the godlen pot of Manna Iesus Christ , and to be struck with a blow of his Iron-rod , all that filthy inside of hypocrisie , and infidelity , shall fly out , to become a laughing stocke , to all the world , which shall then see that GREAT WITNESSE of what sincerity was in your heart , when you bleared ignorant mens eyes with the glaring luster of your ▪ externall worship . Yea your externall pompous service , as wherewith you think to please Christ , argues you to have no other conceit of Christ , then such as the Jewes had , dreaming of a temporall Messias , and an earthly Prince .

But let us heare your tale out : And scarce any thing hath hurt Religion more in these broken times , then an opinion of too many men , that because Rome had thrust some unnecessary , and many Superstitious Ceremonies upon the Church , therefore the Reformation must have none at all . For Answere in short , All your Ceremonies are Superstitious , and therefore unnecessary ; or ( if you will ) all unnecessary , and therefore both Superstitious and Superfluous . What necessity ( I pray you ) of your Crosse in Baptisme ? What necessity of a Surplice , except to hide your poore Priests dublet , when 't is either greasie , or out at the elbowes ? What necessity of Kneeling at the Sacrament , and so before your Altar ? And how can you sever these from Superstition ? What 's a signe made in the Ayre , to signifie and set forth the life of a Christan , and that also after Baptisme , the seale of his vow to renounce the Devil and all his works , and to be a souldier and servant of Iesus Christ ? And how is your Surplice a signe of sanctity , when commonly he that weares it hath least holinesse , and hath cause to blush , when he hath no better signe to hang out , then that which tells the world , ther 's no true Sanctity within ? And when you so devoutly kneele before your Altar , at the receiving of the Sacrament , ( to which your Altar-men , usually apply that in the Psalme , O come Let us worship , and bow downe and kneele before the Lord our Maker . ) What is it a signe of ? Of your adoring Christs body imagined to be in the bread ? Or of your adoring the Altar , as which you call Gods-Mercy-Seat , and where Christ keeps his personall residence ? Or of your adoring the Crucifix , upon or over your Altar ? Or is it a signe in generall of your humility , See pag. 3. Will-worship Idolatry . or of your Idolatry rather , or both together , Idolatrous humility , or humble Idolatry ? And so is it not a plaine signe of your pride and presumption , in perverting the ordinance of Christ , while you injoyne such gestures before an Altar in receiving the Lords Supper , which Christ ordained not at an Altar , but at a Table , where a Supper ought to be eaten as a Supper sitting , and not kneeling .

But ( say you ) ought the Reformation to have none at all ? Yea , none at all , of mens devising to bind the Conscience of any Christian. For els how is it Reformation , if it retaine any thing , that is either unnecessary or Superstitious ? Your Reformation is deformed with your Hierarchy , and Ceremonies the very badges and Ensignes of Antichristian Tyranny , and Romish Apostacie ; for thereby ( as is noted before ) you thrust Christ , the King of his Church out of his Throne , and put a yoake of bondage upon his peoples necks .

But ( say you ) Ceremonies are the hedge , that fence the Substance of Religion from all the indignities , which profanesse and Sacriledge too commonly put upon it . You meane such Substance of Religion , wherein Rome and you are both one Church ▪ that is Hierarchy and Ceremonies ; as is shewed before . And you use your Ceremonies as the Traine and Guard of your Hierarchy and Principality , which were contemptible , without such Attendance . And 't is not without need , that you make such use of these beggerly Rudiments , when you have no fence for your selves in Gods word . And in one respect your Ceremonies may fitly be termed a hedge , yea * * Mi●h . 7.4 . Sharper then any thorne hedge ( as the Prophet speaketh ) which who so offereth to thrust away , must be ( as David saith ) ‡ ‡ 2 Sam. 23 . 7· fenced with iron , and the Staffe of a Speare , to be utterly burnt with fire in the same place , otherwise they will pierce thorow his hand . And this hedge of your pious seeming Ceremonies is a fence to your Hierarchy against Profanesse , while profane ignorant persons , led by their carnall sense , are thereby more then halfe perswaded , that Prelates , when they are at their Church-devotion , are pious and holy Men , although they doe not so much as seem so out of the Church . And againe , Ceremonies you use as a hedge to f●nce you against Sacriledge : for were it not for your pompous dayly Service , and at Solemne Feasts , in your Cathedralls , you might be in some danger of having all those fat Corpses alienated to some other use , then to the maintenance of a sort of Idle-bellies . As once a ‡ ‡ Dr. Andrewes Brother of yours answered , being asked of King Iames to what use their Cathedrals did serve : your Majesty ( quoth he ) is there dayly and Solemnly prayd for . Although those Solemne prayers , in regard of their fat feeding , and customary Chanting and Roaring out of a Sort of ignorant Chanters , may be thought to have but little vertue in them , except it be for the poore Singing mens poverty , whose allowance will scarce maintaine their Credit upon the Ale-house Score .

You adde : And a great weaknesse it is not to see the strength , which Ceremonies ( things weake enough in themselves , God knowes ) adde to Religion it selfe : but a farre greater to see it , and yet to cry them downe , All , and without Choyce , by which their most hated Adversaries Climbe up , and could not cry up themselves , and their Cause , as they doe , but by them . Now , as we said before , Considering what your Religion it selfe is , in Substance one with that Religion of Rome : 't is weakenesse indeed , not to consider ▪ what a Strength your Ceremonies doe adde unto it . Yet what strength in Ceremonies , so weake in themselves , as you seem to acknowledge , when you Say , God knowes ? And indeed the Apostle calls them * * Gal. 4.4 . Weake and beggerly Rudiments . But as weake as they be in themselves , yet being backed with your Canons and Courts , they prove strong enough to make the strongest to stoop , and vaile bonnet unto them . Yea are they not strong bonds and chaines to bind and captivate the Conscience of Gods people worse then either the Aegyptian or Babilonian captivity . B●nds of Aegypt So as were it not for your Canons mounted , and full charged , these hedges or mud-walls would prove but weake enough to fence the Substance of your Rel●gion . And indeed this is the reason , that so many cry them down , All , without Choyce , because of that strength which they adde to your Romish Superstition , your Religion it selfe : and because on the other side , they eat out the very heart of true piety , and the power of true Religion in all those , or the most part , who are insnared by them . Although you call this Weakenesse in those , that cry them all down . But I hope this weaknesse is So crying , especially reaching up to heaven , will in time so prevaile with God , as to batter them down , and to dismount your Canon that holds them up .

But such consider not ( Say you ) that by this meanes , their most hated enemies ( the Jesuites , I suppose you meane ) cry up their cause , and not els , but by them . Surely , [ By them ] here , if rightly taken , 't will prove very true , you Say . By them , that is by your Ceremonies . For what is there , whereby the Jesuites doe more climbe , and cry up themselves , and their Cause , then your crying up of your Ceromonies ? This they professe in their Bookes and English Pamphlets , which they scatter among the People , that the Church of England is coming amaine towards Rome , as being weary of her Religion , or ashamed of it . And all this especially , since you have climbed up to the top-pinnacle of Canterbury Church . And well you Say , Their most hated Adversaries ▪ You say not , Your most hated Addversaries , the Iesuites : for then you should account Jesuites no better then Puritans . Though I think your Lordship can give no great good reason why the Jesuites should be the Most hated enemies of those , that most cry down your Ceremonies , except you will give the Jesuites precedencie of you in persecuting those men . But ( I say ) your Zeale for Ceremonies is a fiery Chariot , to carry the Jesuites to that heaven of their happinesse , to wit , Englands Reconciliation with Rome , which is hastened and advanced by nothing so much , as by hoysing up of Altars , and other Idolatrous Superstitions , and puting downe of good Ministers , and all true Religion . This , this is the Ladder , by which Jesuites Climbe up , not now to the top of Tyburne , but to the top of their Mount Tabor ; beholding the Church of England transformed into the Church of Rome ; being also so exceedingly helped up and advanced by this your handy worke now published for that end .

L. p. 21. In this insuing Discourse , I have indeavoured to lay open those wider Gates of the Catholick Church , &c.

P. So you have indeed , having set open Englands broad Gates , that That Great Whore of Babylon , with all her Train and Trinkets , her Superstitions and Idolatries , may have the more easie reentry , without so much as the ruffling of her Ruffe . Nay rather then fayle , as the Trojans , at the Subtile Counsell of their perjured Sinon , brake downe a great part of their City-wall to let in the Trojan horse , ( which unknown to them , was full of armed Greeks , their Enemies ) by which meanes their City was surprized , sacked and burnt : So you having been a great Instrument , of not onely Seting open the broad Gates , and making them wider then they were before , but of pulling downe the Walls and Bulwarks of the Church of England , to wit , in Suppressing Gods Word , and Supplanting the most Painefull and Godly Ministers , as the Watchmen of the City , yea the Chariots and Hose-men of Israel : and having prepared it by the Setting up of your Altars , and Superstitious Service and Devotion attending thereupon , all conformable to Rome ; doe in this your Book now published , as with open voyce proclaime , how happy a thing it were , that the Church of England and of Rome , were perfectly reconciled and reunited .

The Prelates wider Gates whither they lead . Againe , you have in this also layd open those wider gates of your Catholick Church , in that therein you have in some respects made those broad Gates that lead to destruction , wider then they were before . For at after in your Booke you can find a broad way for the silly ignorant Papists to find Salvation in the Church of Rome , and so to be Saved living and dying in the Roman Faith . But of this in its due place . Onely you have altogether shut the Gates of the Catholick Church against all Reformed Churches beyond the Seas , as having no Prelates , and therefore no Churches . As hath been noted .

You adde : ( The Catholicke Church ) confined to no Age , Time , or Place , nor knowing any bounds , but that Faith , which was once ( and but once for all ) delivered to the Saints . Jude 3.

P. My Lord , what have you to doe with the Saints faith , except that you indeavour to destroy it ? Or with those Saints , except to persecute and root them out ? Or would you make us beleeve , that you are one of those Saints ? Certainly then you must become another-gates Man , then as yet you have shewed yourselfe to be . Your Tyranny , your Hypocrisie , your Superstitions , your Persecutions , your Reconciliation with Rome must be utterly abandoned . Except by continuing in them , you hope to be the next Canonized Saint to ▪ Ignatius , the Father and Founder of the Jesuites Society , Lately Canonized by his Holinesse at Rome , for his good Service for the Catholick Cause : and so may you haply after 100. yeares , come to be Canonized for the notable Service you have done in the Church of England for the Church of Rome , if ever you shall bring them to a perfect Reconciliation . And as for that Faith you Speake of , as the bound of the Catholicke Church , which you say you and Rome doe both professe : we shall have occasion hereafter to speake more largely of it .

L. p. 22. I have delivered with a single heart , that truth which I professe .

P. What truth it is , which you professe , we have in part already discovered , in this your Dedicatory , and shall further and more fully in your insuing Discourse . But with what singlenesse of heart you have done it , that we leave to the Judge of all hearts . Onely where we find your hypocrisie so palpable , as that we cannot chuse , but use it as a Perspective to see into the constitution of your heart , as where we find your words so directly contradicting your deeds and practises , the clearest Indexes of your mind , expressed and written in Capitall Letters : we doe not spare to informe you of it ; both because * * Ier. 17.9 ▪ the heart is deceitfull above all things , and desperately wicked ; who can know it ? So as your own heart , when you think it single , may double with you : and that others also taking warning by such a dangerous example , as the greatest Prelate of England , may not also be deceived and seduced by your deep dissimulations .

L. ibid. In the publishing whereof I have obeyed your Majesty , discharged my duty , to my power , to the Church of England given account of the hope that is in me , and so testified to the world that Faith , in which I have lived , and by Gods blessing and favour purpose to dye .

P. For your obedience to his Majesty , we say no more , having touched before , how strong that backe had need to be , that beares all your burthens , so intolerable to be borne . But is this the discharge of the duty of the Metropolitane of all England to the Church of England , to compile and publish such a Booke to reconcile England with Rome ? What thankes the Church of England may returne you , I know not . But thus did not any of your Predecessors , ever . And have you more Charity , or more Devotion , then they had ? And for the hope in you , whereof you give account to the world , and your faith testified , wherein you have lived , and resolve to dye : I will say as Ierome said to the Pelagians , Sententias vestras prodidisse , Superasse est : The discovery of your opinions , is our victory . So , thus to give account of your hope , and testifie your faith to all the world , as that wherein you have lived , and resolve to dye : Let 's see by your own testimony , now irrevocably upon Record , what to judge of you formerly , namely as of one , Qui cum Lacte nutricis errorem Suxisse videatur : who seemeth to have sucked in Errour with his Nurses Milke ; Tuscul. Quest. lib. 3. As the Orator Speakes of all naturall men : and what to expect of you hereafter : that as you have lived a most notorious Persecuter of the truth of Christ , and of his Saints ; So we must look for it Still , so long as you live . And this is our victory , that we have to deale with one , who is not now any longer a disguised , but unmasked Enemy of the true Faith and Religion of JESUS CHRIST . And however you may flatter your selfe in regard of the World , and favour in Court : yet if you repent not of your former life , but dye as you have lived , you can have neither hope nor faith in expecting Gods blessing or favour . And so I passe from your Dedicatory to your Discourse , as followeth .

THE REPLIE TO THE RELATION OF THE CONFERENCE .

L. p. 2. IT is very fit , the People should look to the Iudgement of the Church , before they be too busie with particulars But yet neither the Scripture , nor any good Authority denyes them some moderate use of their own understanding and judgement , especially in things familiar and evident , which even ordinary Capacities may as easily understand , as read . And therefore some particulars a Christian may judge , without depending .

P. What you meane by Church , you have told us before , namely that , wherein your Church of England , and that of Rome , are one and the same , one Prelaticall and Hierarchicall Church , out of which are excluded all those Reformed Churches , which neither have , nor acknowledge Prelates to be of divine Institution . We have also made a Say of the difficulties : So as it is no difficulty to divine , what Christians we are like to prove in understanding and judgement in the mystery of Faith and Salvation , when we must be limited to that narrow Scantling of some moderate use of our owne understanding and Iudgement , and that but in things familiar and evident to every ordinary Capacity . O poore Christians , that for Understanding in the Scripture must be at the allowance of Antichristian Lords , who would bring into bondage Gods people , by Chaining them up in Darknesse and Ignorance , and doe with them , as * * 1 Sam. 11.2 . Nahash the Ammonite answered the men of Iabeth Gilead ; On this condition will I make a Covenant with you , that I may thrust out all your right eyes , and lay it for a reproach upon all Israel . But the Apostle exhorts Christians , Saying , ‡ ‡ 1 Co● . 14.20 Be not children in understanding ; howbeit , in malice be children , but in understanding Téleio ginesthe , be perfect . And , ‡ ‡ Heb. 6.1 . Leaving the Principles of the Doctrine of Christ , Let us goe on unto perfection . And , § § Heb. 5 ▪ 14. Strong meat belongeth to them that are of full age , even those , who by reason of use have their Senses exercised to discerne both good and evill . But you allow Christians onely some moderate use of their owne understanding , and that in things familiar and evident , which men of ordinary Capacities may as easily understand , as read . So as what they read , except with the very reading they doe as easily understand it , as they read it , they must not meditate further of it , but in what they presently upon the reading understand not , they must depend upon your Churches judgement . So as you would exclude your Christians from being of those † † Psal. 1.1 , 2· blessed men , of whom David Speakes , which delight in the Law of the Lord , and in his Law to meditate day and night . You would not have them with * * He● . 5.14 . use to exercise their wits and Senses to discerne 〈◊〉 good and evill . Yea the Apostle useth a word very emphaticall , di● tò exin , by an habituall use , or long custome have their Senses gegumnasm●na , exercised ▪ the word properly signifieth such an exercise , as Wrastlers , or such , as contend for victory , doe use , which is with all their might and strength , being train'd up unto it by long exercise . So as the Scripture doth not onely not forbid , but Commands and exhorts Christians to all diligence in the Study of the Scriptures , C●l .. 2.2 . That their hearts might be comforted , being knit together in love , and unto all riches of the full assurance of understanding , to the aknowledgement of the Mystery of God ; as the Apostle speakes . And , Col. 3.16 . Let the word of God dwell in you richly in all wisedome , teaching and admonishing one another , &c. And the Bereans are Said to be dugenésteroi , more noble , then those of Thesselonica , in that they received the word with all readinesse of mind , and searched the Scriptures dayly , whether those things were so , which Paul taught . Loe ●ere , they examined Pauls Doctrine by the Scriptures : they depended not upon his bare word ; and therefore the Holy Ghost markes them forth for men of a more noble spirit . But you would have your Christians to be poore and beggerly in the knowledge of the mystery of Christ , and to be so base-minded , as in all things , which are not obvious to every Capacity , to depend meerely upon your Church-Authority and Judgement . So as what you meane hereby , except to bring into your Church of England the Iesuiticall blind obedience , captivating the peoples senses to your Dictates , that they might pinne their Salvation and Faith upon your Priests Sleeve : I cannot imagine . Which will appeare yet more clearely at after .

Againe , these words of yours are in Answere to the Jesuit's words , namely , That it was not for the Lady , or any other unlearned Persons , to take upon them to judge of Particulars , without depending upon the Iudgement of the true Church . The Prelate yeelds the Iesuite this , that the Church of R●me is a true Church ▪ on whose Iudgement people must depend . To which all your Answere in full is , as before . Wherein you easily let the Jesuite slip , and run away with this , that the Church of Rome is that true Church , on whose Iudgement for Particulars all unlearned Persons must depend . But you understand the true Church to be that , wherein you told us before , your Church of England and of Rome , are one and the Same . And so for Rome to be a true Church , you plainly confesse at after . But your words here may stand you in very good Stead , to be a faire Item to all the Readers of your Booke , not to be too busie with the Particulars of it , but first to look to the Iudgement of the Church of England , whose mouth you seem to be in this your whole Discourse . So as I may see my Doom already set down in black and white , that I must be Censured as one too busie , or Allotroepíoskopos , playing the Bishop in anothers Diocese , in our English Translation , a busy body . But I must beare it off with Head and Shoulders . And , as the Proverbe is , Over Shooes , over Bootes . I have already waded through the Fords of your Dedicatory , and now I must launch into the Deep of your Discourse . And there 's now no returning . Nor have I put my hand to the Plough to turn up your weeds by the roots , to look backe , or desist , for feare to be censured as one too busie . Yea all my businesse is about particulars ; and namely such , as summed up together in the totall , conclude you to be , though not a profest Invader , yet a most subtile and pragmaticall Enginer , and underminer of that Truth of Christ in the Scripture , which yet the Gates of Hell shall never prevaile against .

L. p. 4. Bellarmine of very great ability , to make good any truth , which he undertakes for the Church of Rome .

P. What one thing ( I pray ) which Bellarmine undertakes to make good for the Church of Rome ( as the Church of Rome ) is a truth ? I say , as the Church of Rome . For what he undertakes to make good for the Church of Rome properly , must needs , be some point of Popery , or Popish Doctrine . Otherwise he undertakes not to make it good , as for the Church of Rome . Now the Church of Rome , as it is the Church of Rome , namely the Papall Church , holds not any one Saving Truth . I say againe , it holds not any one Saving Truth . I shall prove this more particularly at after . Yet you seem to intimate here , that either all , or most things so undertaken by him , are truth . But the contrary will appeare ; So as what things are in themselves false and erronious , can by no humane ability either of that Champion of Rome Bellarmine , or of the great Champion of the present Church of England , be so made good , as to deserve the name of Truth .

L. ibid. After Bellarmine hath distinguished , ●o expresse his Meaning , in what sence the particular Church of Rome cannot Erre in things which are de Fide , of the Faith : he tells us , this Firmitude , is , because the Sea Apostolicke is fixed there . And this he saith is most true .

P. Your last words here are somewhat darke , whether we should take them for Bellarmines words , he saith ; or for your owne assent therein , And this he saith is most true . This Later is the Likelier . And then againe , here is another doubt , whether [ And this he saith is very true ] it be referred to the whole Sentence going before , and alledged by you ; or onely to the Last Clause . If to the whole Sentence , then in Saying , And this he saith is most true ; you assent , that Romes infallibility consists in the Firmitude of the Sea Apostolicke fixed there . Which you seem afterwards more expresly to contradict . But if onely to the Last Clause your Speech hath reference , And this he saith is most true : then first , you should have expressed it more Clearely and punctually , as in some things you doe . But taking it in the best sense , you confesse it is most true , that the Sea Apostolicke is fixed there : thus you give occasion of Dispute , about Peters being at Rome , and of his being Bishop of Rome ; and if so , whether consequently Rome be yet the Sea Apostolicke . But because your words , here are not Cleare enough , and at after you declare your selfe herein more plainly , what we have to say of this , we will reserve to a fitter place .

L. p. 23. I shall ever be glad , that the Church of England may have farre more able Defendants , then my selfe .

P. Certainly the Church of England her selfe may be glad hereof , to vindicate her Reputation , which you , by this your Defence , have layd flat in the dust . But , May have , seems to import , that now she hath not , at least , now , that Dr. White is dead . Nor hath the Church of England any great cause to glory in either of you both , as Defendants , unlesse by the Church of England you understand that new Start-up Faction of Arminianized , and Iesuited Atheists , whose Standard-beares you have been and are to bring the whole Land backe againe to Rome , and so to make a full League and Confederacie against the true Church of Iesus Christ .

L. p. 29. Things not Fundamentall , yet to some mens Salvation are ne●essary .

P. How prove you this ? Seeing what is necessary to some mens Salvation , is necessary to all , and every mans Salvation . And Fundamentalls onely , to wit , Such things as are de Fide , of Faith , are the onely things necessary to every mans Salvation . According to the Athanasius his Creed . Whosoever will be Saved , it is necessary that he hold the Catholicke Faith : which Faith unlesse a man keep whole , and undefiled , without doubt he shall perish everlastingly . For the Catholicke Faith comprehends all Fundamentalls , which to violate in any one particular , overthrowes the Faith , and cuts a man off from Salvation . But your adding of other things , besides and unto the Fundamentalls , as necessary to Some mens Salvation : doth necessarily inferre this Consequence , that there be other things besides Christ , which are necessary to Some mens Salvation : And so you make Christ an insufficient Saviour to some men at least , as to whose Salvation things not Fundamentall are necessary . For things not Fundamentall are extra Christum , out of , or without Christ . Whereas the Scripture Saith of CHRIST , * * Act. 4.12 . That there is no Salvation in any other : for there is none other name under heaven given , whereby Dei sothenai emas , we Must be Saved , which words doe plainly evince , that besides Christ , nothing under heaven is necessary to any mans Salvation . But give us some one particular instance of such things , as being not fundamentall , yet are necessary to some mens Salvation . You tell us of certain ( I wot not what ) Deductions from the Articles of Faith , which you make to be your Not-Fundamentall , and yet necessary to some mens Salvation : but for our better Information you particularize in nothing , neither in the things , nor in the persons , for whose Salvation they are necessary , but leave all in the Cloudes , the fittest man●le to fold●up such foule and blind errours in .

L. p. 31. The Churches Declaration can bind us to peace , and externall obedience , where there is no expresse Letter of Scripture , and Sense agreed upon .

P. By the Latitude of this Sentence , you , or your Church of England may ( as you have done ) by your Declaration prefixed to your Articles of Religion ( as before ) bind Ministers not to preach of those Doctrines of Grace , as Election , Predestination , &c. because , though there be expresse Letter of Scripture for them , yet the Sense is so farre from being agreed upon by your present Church , as that you Say plainly , they may be taken in two opposite Senses . So as upon this your Churches Declaration of the ambiguities of your Articles , you have stopped all the Ministers mouthes , binding them to peace , and externall obedience . Although I cannot yet conceive , how that Declaration should be the Church of Englands , though published in the Kings Name , and perhaps compiled in the Conclave of Canterbury . And thus also that Order for the Altar of S. GREGORIES , which yet is but Dormant in Cryptis , not published in Print , in which respect it cannot be called the Declartion of the Church , yet must be of force to bind all Ministers to Peace and Obedience ; first to Peace , not to speake a word against Altars , for his Eares : and next to Obedience , that if he refuse to have an Altar set up in his Church , himselfe shal be made a Sacrifice . But why should such an Order thus bind ? I must crave pardon for making Question . And the rather , because your Lordship here gives us a Rule or Canon saying , The Churches Declaration can bind us to Peace , and externall , Obedience , where there is no expresse Letter of Scripture , and Sense agreed on . Now though we have expresse Letter of Scripture , proving Christ to be the onely Altar of Christians ( as before is shewed ) yet because this sense is not agreed on by your Lordship , and so by your present Church of England , therefore men must be peaceable , and obedient in that point , and quietly submit to Authority , in the admitting , and the Adoring too ( if you will ) of Altars in every Church . And so in all other your superstitious Ceremonies , of what force is the expresse Letter of the Scripture , where the Sense of it is not by you and your Church agreed upon ? To give an Instance or two more , This is my Body : the Sense of these words is not agreed on between your Church of England , and that of Rome ( though you are in Substance both one Church ) what then ? Ergo Ministers are bound to Peace and Obedience , in not medling to or fro with the manner , How Christ is present in the Sacrament ( though your Article of the Lords Supper doth declare it , both affirmatively , and negatively , how it is , and is not ) but to content themselves with Really ; which is a very peaceable word , about which Rome and you have no great reason to fall at oddes . Againe , for bowing at the nameing of the Name Iesus , although you have no expresse Letter of Scripture for it , ( no not Phil. 2.10 . where it is Said , En to onómati , In , or ( as your Translation hath it ) at the name of Iesus every knee should bow ; but it is not Said , En to onomazethai tò onoma Iesoun , or Iesous , In the naming of the name Iesus , every knee should bow : So as that place is plainly expounded , and agreed on by other places of Scripture , as Isa. 45.23 . and Rom. 14.10 . as some of your old English Bibles note those places in the Margent over against the place ; as in that of Isaiah , there is set in in the Margent , Rom. 14.10 . and Phil. 2.10 . all which three places unanimously shew the universall Subjection of all Creatures in heaven , and earth , and under the earth to Christ in the day of Iudgement ) yet because this Sense is not agreed on by the present Church of England , therefore her Declaration in her Canon binds all to Peace and Obedience : to Peace , in not speaking or writing against bowing at the nameing of the name Iesus , nor in preaching to expound the Letter of Scripture ( Phil. 2.10 . ) by the plain sense of other Scriptures , as afore cited : and to Obedience , by bowing themselves , when they heare that Name to be named . So as your Lordships Rule here is very usefull for many things , although you have neither Letter , nor Sense of Scripture for them .

L. p. 32. The power of adding any thing contrary , and detracting any thing necessary , are alike forbidden . No power of the Church can doe this .

P. This Sentence you alledge out of Vincentius , and allow it ; So as it is to be accounted your owne Confession , which I suppose you will not deny . Whereupon you with your Church fall under just condemnation , both for adding things contrary , and detracting things necessary . For you adde to the service of God ( as you call it ) your Altars , and sundry other superstition● , which the Scripture excludes and condemnes , and so are contrary : and you detract things necessary , as Preaching of the saving Doctrines of Grace , Preaching on the Lords dayes in the after noon , Preaching Week-day Lectures , and Cathechising by expounding the Grounds of Religion . Which things are necessary , profitable , and usefull to the people of God , and which God commaundeth ; as 2 Tim. 3.15.16 . and 4.1.2 . Gal. 6.6 . Let him that is Katekoúmenos , Cathechised in the word , communicate To katekounti , to him that Catechiseth , or instructeth him , in all good things . Thus you and your Church take upon you to do those things which are alike forbidden , and which no power of the Church can doe , though you can .

L. p. 35. Wrangle while you will , you shall never be able to prove that any thing , which is but de modo , a consideration of the manner , of being onely , can possibly be fundamentall in the Faith .

P. Wrangle I will not , but prove , that some things which are , de modo , considered in the manner of being onely , not onely may possibly , but are really , in that very respect , fundamentall in the Faith . So as to deny them , or not to beleeve them , is in it selfe damnable . And hereof I shall give some Instances . 1. Christs body in receiving of the Sacrament , is to be considered in the m●nn●r of its being present to the beleeving Communicant . In so much as to exclude such manners of being present , as doe destroy either the Article of his perpetuall Residence in heaven till his c●ming againe , or the truth of his Naturall Body , doth deny and destroy two Articles of the Faith , 1. touching Christs sitting 〈◊〉 t●e rig●● hand of God , from whence he shall come to Judgem●●● ▪ and 2 ly . that he was borne of the Virgin Mary , with a true humane body . As the Papists apprehending and beleeving Christs naturall body to be locally present in the Eucharist , doe thereby overthrow his perpetuall residence in heaven , till his coming againe : and withall , the truth of his naturall body : which being a true naturall body , with all its naturall properties , cannot be locally or corporally in many places at one and the same time ; which yet the corporall presence in the Eucharist doth necessarily import . And if the truth of Christs naturall body be destroyed ( as by the Manichees , and other Hereticks ) Christ is wholly evacuated , and shall profit nothing . Besides , this Popish beliefe of Christs corporall Presence in their Eucharist , makes Christs natural body , which hath its dimensions of length , breadth , thicknesse , to be a meere fantasticall and imagina●y body , as being contained within the narrow circle and compasse of a thinne Wafer-cake : and so they destroy Christs body . And so also , in that they beleeve they eat this body of Christ , which is to destroy it : as 1 Cor. 6.13 . And this beliefe of Christs corporall presence as aforesaid , destroyes spirituall communion with Christ , and with the Holy Ghost , and consequently the Article of faith concerning the Communion of Saints . For Christ saith to his Disciples , * * Iohn 16.7 ▪ I tell you the truth , it is expedient for you that I goe away : for if I goe not away , the Comforter will not come unto you : but if I depart , I will send him unto you . So as to beleeve Christ to be corporally present on earth , and that men have by that meanes a corporall communion with him , doth debarre such men from all communion of the Spirit of Christ . And ‡ ‡ Rom. 8.9 . If any man have not the Spirit of Christ , the same is none of his . He hath not Christ , that hath not his Spirit : and he hath not Christs Spirit , that rests in the beliefe of Christs corporall presence on earth , as before . For except I depart ( saith Christ ) that is , except I be absent from you , as concerning my corporall presence , the Comforter will not come unto you . And thus by a false beliefe of the very manner onely of Christs presence in the Popish Eucharist , Christ the Foundation is overthrowne . And this errour de modo , of the manner of being onely , overthrowing the Foundation , must needs be a Fundamentall errour , if any errour may be said to be Fundamentall .

My Second Instance is about Christs humane Nature , Synodi Chalcedonensis ●lepistis : Asmukutos : Akoristoes , Adiairétoes , Atr●ptoes ▪ de modo Subsistendi , of its manner of subsisting in the Person of the Son of God . For to beleeve , that it is either after the manner or way of Commixtion , or by adherence , as one thing cleaving to another , or Inherence , as an Accident in the Subject , or by Conversion into the divine nature , or by Concomitancie , as Bellarmine saith , Christs divinity and soule is present with his body in the Eucharist by Concomitancie : all these manners doe destroy the personall union of Christs two natures in one person . As those two Hereticks , Nestorius and Eutiches , the one condemned in the Councel of Ephesus , the other in the Councel of Chalcedon , the later for holding , that Christ had but one Nature , the humane converted into the Divine Nature : the other , that Christ had two Persons : both these destroyed Christ the Mediator , who is not a Mediator , unlesse he be both God and Man in one Person Christ . So Bellarmines devise in holding Christs divine nature , and humane soule to be present in and with that body , which they frame unto him in the Masse , by way of Concomitancie , as being inseperable companions : destroyes the Sacrifice of Christs Passion , wherein the soule of Christ was in death seperated from his body , untill his Resurrection . Now the Papists say , they offer up Christs body in the Masse , as representing the Sacrifice of his death and Passion . Which how can it be , when they say his soule is by concomitancie with his body offered up ; So as all this while there is no representative , or Commemorative , much lesse a propitiatory Sacrifice of Christs death , Seing in that body ( as they say ) Christs soule is inseperably present ? And againe , to say Christs divine nature is present with that body of Concomitancie , this destroyes the Personall union . For Concomitancie is no personall union of the two natures , concomitancie being but an accompanying of each other . Whereas the divine nature of Christ doth not accompany the humane nature , but assumes it : and the humane nature doth not accompany the divine , but subsists in it . Thus it is cleare , that the Consideration of the manner of being onely may possibly prove to be Fundamentall in the Faith .

L. p. 37. All , which pertaines to Supernaturall , Divine , and infallible Christian faith , is not by and by fundamentall in the Faith to all men .

P. You told us * * See pag. 94. ●●fore . before , That things not fundamentall , yet to some mens Salvation are necessary : and here , that all that pertaines to Christian faith is not fundamentall in the faith to all men . It seems you have some peculiar way to heaven , which is not common to all . But take heed , least leaving the common road-way of true Saving Faith , attended with a holy life , you fayle of heaven . ‡ ‡ Iohn 14.6 . I am the way , the Truh , and the Life , saith Christ . And is not Christ this way , Truth , and Life to all that are Saved ? Is not he to all such as are called , both Iewes and Greekes , Christ , the Power of God , and the Wisdome of God ? But what doe I speake to you of Christ , or what doe you speake of Christian faith , that know not what Christian faith is , otherwise , then as you discerne in it some thing , for which , in whomsoever you find it , you persecute it to the death ?

L. p. 39. If new Doctrines be added to the old , the Church may be changed in Lupanar errorum , which I am loth to English .

P. Nay , are you not ashamed to English it ? For this you Speake of the Church of Rome : and you have told us , that the Church of England and of Rome are one and the Same Church . And now you Say , If new Doctrines be added to the old , the Church may be changed in Lupanar errorum . And this the Church of Rome hath done , as you elsewhere affirme : She hath added new Doctrines to the old , and such new , as She doth with the old , a● men doe when they put on a new suit , make the old a Cast suit . But because you are loth to English in Lupanar errorum , for the reverend respect you beare to that Venerable Apostolick Sea , I will doe as much for you , as to English it : If new Doctrines be added to the Old ( as the Church of Rome hath done ) the Church may be changed into a Stewes of Errours . This Phrase you take out of Vincentius Lyrenensis his Sentence , quoted in the Margent : which is this in English , The Church by adding new Doctrines to the old , becomes a Stewes of impious and beastly Errours , which was before a Sacrary of chast and undefiled verity . Whence I note , how you , not onely smother some of his words , but smooth others , Saying , for , [ The Church becomes a Stewes ] The Church may be changed . So as herein you falsify the worthy Saying of Vincentius , when you make but a May be , of his , Is made . But let the Conclusion be , If a Church be turned Whore , 't is good that all should know her to be so in plain English , that they may avoyd her , and ( as Salomon saith ) * * Pro. 5.8 . remove their way farre from her , and not come neere the dore of her house . And for this Cause have I taken the Paines to be your Translator .

L. p. 39. Some Decisions , yea and of the Church to● , are made , or may be , ( if Stapleton informe us right ) without an evident , nay without so much as a probable testimony of holy writ . But Bellarmine falls quite off , and confesses in expresse termes , that nothing can be certaine by certainty of Faith , unlesse it be contained immediately in the word of God , or be deduced out of the word of God by evident consequence . And if nothing can be certain , then certainly no Determination of the Church it selfe , if that Determination be not grounded upon one of these , either expresse word of God , or evident consequence ●ut of it . ( And a little before ) Every wrangling Disputer may neither deny , nor doubtfully dispute , much lesse obstinately oppose the Determinations of the Church , no not when they are ( Dogmata deposita , Deposed Principles .

P. Now all these Passages weighed together , do clearely and distinctly resolve themselves into these Conclusions : 1. That the Church may decide and determine some things , without any evidence , or so much as a probable Testimony of holy Writ ; and herein you consent and jumpe fully with that notorious Papist , and adversary of the once Church of England , Stapleton , whom the learned Dr. Whitakers publickly confuted in the Divinity Schooles in Cambridge , as his Works can yet testifie . And yet behold now the Church of England hath got a Champion in the Chaire of Canterbury ▪ who pleads for , and applauds that in Stapleton , which Dr. Whitakers , and many other learned Divines in England formerly have refuted . And for further Confirmation hereof , you tax Bellarmine as of untruth , where he confesses , that nothing may be certaine by cert●inty of Faith , unlesse it be contained immediately in the word of God , or be deduced thence by evident consequence . Whereupon you inferre , that if nothing can be certaine , then certainly no Determination of the Church it selfe , wanting expresse word , or evident Consequence out of it . Thus you condemne Bellarmines true Saying ( if by the Word of God he understand the Scriptum alone , and not his word unwritten ) and approve and preferre Stapletons false and hereticall sentence before it . Secondly , That things so decided and determined by the Church , without either evident , or so much as probable Testimony of holy writ , yet are so de fide , so firmely to be beleeved , as every wrangling Disputer may neither deny , nor doubtfully dispute , much lesse obstinately oppose . Consonant hereunto you ●ay at after ( pag. 224. ) The Determination of a Generall Councel ●●ring , is to stand in force , and to have externall obedience at least yeelded to it , till evidence of Scripture , or a Demonstration to the Contrary make the errour appeare , and untill thereupon another Councel of equall Authority do reverse it : And so also , pag. 226. &c. Where here I mention for clearer proofe of what you say here , but not to anticipate or prevent our fuller Answere , when we come to those places , where we shall supply our brevity here .

L. p. 40. I hope A. C. will not tells us , there 's any Tradition extant unwritten , by which particular men may have assurance of their Severall Salvations .

P. But what think you of it ? Will you tell us there is no such thing written in the Scripture , That true Beleevers may have assurance of their owne Salvation ? But if there be , why doe you forbid Preachers to meddle with it , considering the true and solid comfort which it bringeth to him that hath it ? As the 17 th Article confesseth , might it be suffered to speake out , and had you not put a gagge in the mouth of it .

L. p. 43. Mine is , That the beliefe of Scripture to be the word of God , and infallible , is an equall , or rather a preceding prime Principle of Faith , w●th , or rather to the whole body of the Creed .

P. How ? The Belief of Scripture to be Gods word , and infallible , no more but an equall , or rather a preceding prime Principle of Faith , with , or rather to the whole body of the Creed ? This is yours ( you say ) your Saying . And I beleeve it to be yours . For it is as like to one of your Sayings , as may be . For here you attribute no more credit to the Scriptures , then to the Creed , both equall , onely differing perhaps in point of some precedencie of time , or So , with an , or rather equall , or rather preceding , the difference not great , if any . Thus doe you not equall a Church Tradition with the Divine Scripture ? For we have it by Tradition that the Apostles compiled the Creed , and each his Severall Article . And is this or any other Tradition of equall Credit with Scripture ? And is not the Scripture the Rule , whereby the Articles of the Creed are to be interpreted , which are no otherwise to be beleeved , but as they are agreeable to the Scripture ? So as ( for the Purpose ) if you goe no further for the Sense of the Article of Christs Descent into hell , then the very Letter of the Article , you can make no Sense of it , nor give any reason for it . And how then can you give a reason of your Faith in this particular ? Except you do beleeve it , because you do beleeve it , and because the words are , He Descended into Hell . But of this more by and by .

L. p. 44. Some Traditions I deny not , &c. to be Apostolicall , but yet not fundamentall in the Faith .

P. You might do well to point out unto us , which be those your Apostolicall Traditions , that we may distinguish them from those Traditions , which Rome calls Apostolicall . Or rather perhaps you admit of all those as Apostolicall indeed , but yet not Fundamentall . Surely if you can prove them to be truely Apostolicall , namely , that the Apostles delivered them immediately to the Church by word of mouth , why are they not fundamentall in the faith ? Why are not all bound to beleeve them , or give as much Credit to them , as to the Articles of your Creed , which you Say are fundamentall in the faith .

L. p. 45. The Church of England taketh the words , He descended into hell , as they are in the Creed , and beleeves them without further Dispute , and in that Sense , which the ancient Primitive Fathers of the Church agreed in .

P. Here a Question may be moved , 1. In generall , Whether a man taking up a matter upon such trust , as he gives equall beliefe unto it , as to the Scriptures themselves , doe not therein Sinne damnably . As making that a fundamentall ground of his Faith , which is not found to be in the Scripture . Secondly , in particular , Whether a man resting in the very Letter of the Article , He descended into Hell , beleeving th●reupon , as surely as he beleeves that God is in Heaven , that Christs Soule did locally descend into Hell among the damned there , having no regard at all to what the Scripture Saith of it , whether the Scripture Say any such thing , or no : doe not hereby make way for his owne Descent into Hell ? Or thirdly , Whteher you do as verily and firmly beleeve Christs Descent into Hell , as you doe his Ascent into Heaven , Seeing the Scriptures Speakes clearely and expresly of this , but not so of that ; and whether you are a● much bound to beleeve his Descent into Hell , because you find such words in the Creed , as his Ascent into Heaven , because you find it in the Scripture ? Now for Answere to all these together , I conceive , that to make any thing of the necessity of Faith to Salvation , besides what is found in the Scripture , is Sinne , and in particular to beleeve , that because it is Said in the Creed , He Descended into Hell , therefore Christ did locally in Soule descend into Hell , the place of the damned , without any proofe from Scripture , is Sin . My reasons are these : 1. Because this opens a gappe to men to beleeve humane Traditions to be of Faith to Salvation , as of equall credit and authority to the Scriptures . Now it cannot be proved , that the Creed it selfe , with its forme and words , and Articles , and Title , called The Apostles Creed , is other , then a humane Tradition , or that the Apostles composed the Creed . Secondly , This argues , as a too high estimation of a thing humane , as if it were autópistos , of selfe-Credit : so a too base estimation , and undervaluing of the holy Scripture , as if they alone were not the Rule of Faith , or not to be relie● and rested on alone for all matters concerning Christian Faith . So as to give Credit to any thing else besides the Scripture , as of equall Authority with the Scripture , ( as you make your Creed to be ) and not examining it by the Scripture , is a detracting from the Authority of Scripture , and consequently a denying of the Scripture to be the Sole Rule of Faith . For the Creed , it is either a part of the Scripture , or not a part : if it be not a part of Scripture ( as indeed it is not ) then all the Articles of Faith in it ( being but a small abridgement of Christian Faith , and so , of necessity , and in comparison of Scripture it selfe , very obscure , and Scanty ) are to be proved and illustrated from Scripture , the Sole Rule of Faith , and Tryall of all Truths . Thirdly , in Particular , to beleeve Christs descent in Soule into hell locally , must stand with some reason , and analogy or proportion of Faith layd downe in the Scripture . For Christ did or suffered nothing , but the Scripture shews the Reason , Cause , and End of it . For instance : Isaiah Saith , * * Isa. 9.6 . To us a Child is borne , to us a Son is given . So the Angel to the Shepheards , ‡ ‡ Luke 2.11 ▪ To you is borne this day a Saviour which is Christ the Lord . This then shews the End of Christs Incarnation , namely for our Salvation . Then for his Death , ‡ ‡ Rom. 4.25 ▪ He was delivered up for our Sins . And , § § Heb. 2.14 , 15. Forasmuch as the Children were partakers of flesh and blood , he also himselfe likewise took part of the Same : that through death he might destroy him that had the power of d●ath , that is , the Devil . And deliver them , who through feare of death were all their life time subject to bondage . So for his Resurrection , † † Rom. 4. He rose againe for our Iustification . So for his Ascention , It was that he might * * Ioh. 16.7 . send the Holy Ghost , and goe to prepare a place in heaven for all his . So for his Sitting at Gods right hand , ‡ ‡ Ephes. 4.8 . Ioh. 14.2 . Rom. 8.34 . Psal. 2.6 . Act. 7.56 . Heb. 1.13 . There he makes Intercession for his people , rules as King his Church , in preserving , protecting , governing his people , and makeing his and their foes his Footstoole . But for any such thing , as Descent into hell , neither is it found in the Scripture , nor much lesse any reasons given there of it . Indeed Peter Speaking of Christs Resurrection , alledgeth Psal. 16. Thou wilt not leave my Soule in Hell : So in the English . In the Hebrew it is commonly taken for the Grave , not for the place of the damned . But will you take Peters exposition of it Speaking by Christs owne Spirit ? ‡ ‡ Act. 2.29 , 30 , 31 , 32. This ( saith he ) David Seeing before , Spake of the Resurrection of Christ , that his Soule was not left in Hell , neither his flesh did see Corruption . So then , this place ( Psal. 16. ) was by the Holy Ghosts owne Interpretation , a Prophecie of Christs Resurrection from the Grave , and not of any Descent into Hell , the place of the damned . For he is not said to rise out of hell , as you say he went downe into Hell , nor to ascend out of Hell , as you beleeve he descended into Hell . Will you have a particular Article of Christs descent into Hell , and shall you not need another Article for his Ascent out of Hell againe ? And the Apostle saith , § § Eph. 4 9 ▪ Christ descended Eis tà katótera mère tes ges , to the lowest parts of the Earth , which is spoken of his humiliation to the Death , and the Grave : but here is no word of his Descent into any such place as Hell , the place of the damned . But admit your Faith to be true , that Christs Soule descended locally into Hell : I aske , to what end or purpose ? Can you shew any Reason from Scripture for this ? Will you say , his Soule went thither to suffer ? Surely that had its * * Ioh. 19.30 . Psal. 18.5 . Consummatum est upon the Crosse , there it was finished . Will you say , he went to triumph over the Devil in his owne D●nne ? That was also done on his ‡ ‡ Col. 2.15 . Crosse , as on his Triumphall Chariot . And can you give any reason why Christ should descend into hell in regard of us ? What ▪ that so he might deliver our Soules out of Hell ? Surely this also was done in his ‡ ‡ Heb. 2.14 , 15. Death . And againe , if it were necessary that Christs soule should goe locally into hell , to deliver our soules : then also it was necessary for his body to descend into hell , to deliver our bodies from thence . For he came to redeem our bodies , as well as our soules . Or what els can you Say ? Certainly what ever you can invent , the Scripture will presently discover the vanity of it . But for my part , I dare beleeve nothing concerning Christ , and my Salvation , but what the Scripture hath revealed . But the Scripture hath revealed no such thing , as the Descent of Christs Soule into Hell locally . But you will then object unto me , Do I not beleeve my Creed , and every Article in it ? I answere , I doe . Why then ( say you ) Doe I not beleeve the Article of Christs Descent into Hell ? I say , I doe , being understood , or expounded according to the Scripture , and the Analogy of Faith therein . How is that ? Christ dyed , and in his Passion he suffered the Torments of Hell in his † † Psal. 18.5 . Math. 26.38 , 3● . & 27.46 . Soule on the Crosse , and in the Garden . But his Descent into Hell is set after his buriall . And doe you not know , that the ancient Heathen used to put Hádes for the state of the dead . So as katelthein eis hadou , is to goe , or to abide in the state of the dead , which Christ did for 3. dayes , and then arose againe and revived . So as the Article shewes the continuance of Christs being dead and buried , till his Resurrection . Againe , you know the Nicene Creed mentions onely Christs buriall , and no Descent into Hell : and Athanasius his Creed , katelthen eis hadou , He Descended into Hell , without speaking a word of his buriall . All which doe confirme what I say , that christ in being buried , remained so long in the State of the d●ad , his soule seperated from his body : and being said to D●scend into Hell , hades signifying also the Grave , thereby is meant his being buried for so long a time , till his rising againe . As it is said in the next Article , The third day ●e rose againe from the dead , that is , from the Grave , where he abode in the state of the dead .

Now I have given you a reason of my Faith : Can you give one reason of yours , concerning this Article , as you take and beleeve it with your Church of England ? Show but one reason , or shadow of a reason out of Scripture . Nay , except you bring every Article of the Creed to the examen or tryall of Scripture , for the staying and establishing of your Faith , you may run into many monstrous errours . What doe you beleeve concerning Christs death ? You beleeve that hee dyed . But for whom ? Whether for the Elect onely , in Gods Purpose , Account , Appointment , Acceptance : or universally for all men , Elect and Reprobate ? I tell you , my Lord , if you beleeve that Christ dyed for all men universally , as well for the Reprobate , as the Elect , you destroy both Gods Grace in giving Christ for his people onely , the Elect , and also the merit and eff●icacy of Christs death . The Scripture shewes these things aboundantly . But I mention this onely by the way . Againe , What doe you beleeve concerning the holy Catholicke Church ? You beleeve ( I dare say ) and you doe say it , that * * L. p. 62. compared with other places . See p. 109. the Catholicke Church on earth , consists visibly of all Prelates , and those that are subject unto them , as one intire Body . This is your Faith . But if you examine this by the Scripture , you will find it to be an Errour no lesse soule then false , as hath been shewed . So , doe you not beleeve the Article of the Communion of Saints ? You doe . But who are your Saints on earth ? You will hardly allow any Saints on earth , till after their death , they be Canonized by his Holinesse at Rome . Nay in plaine termes you persecute both the Saints themselves , and their Communion . Can you indure such as but professe holinesse ? And for their Communion , doe you not hunt out and persecute Private Fasting and Prayer among the poore soules of Christ , when publick they can have none , and no other remedy or weapons are left them to defend themselves withall against your bloody Cruelty ? So as the truth is , you neither rightly beleeve the Holy Catholicke Church , nor the Communion of Saints ; but are a notorious both denye● and persecuter of both . And therefore we see what a necessity there is , that we should bring the Articles of the Creed to the Standard Rule , the Scripture , both as the surest and safest way , yea and the onely way to preserve our Faith from Errour .

But you object the Fathers for the Sense of this Article of Christs Descent into hell , as you beleeve it . What if they beleeved so ? Is their example a sufficient Rule for us ? We must examine their sense they held of it , by the Scripture . If it be not according to the Scripture , we reject it . The Fathers might for a time hold an erronious generally received opinion , before it came to be controverted , and well sifted and examined by Scripture . But they were ever ready to have their faith , and opinions tryed by the Scriptures . All the ancient Fathers were of this mind and spirit . As before * * Nondum ●ato Pelagio , securius loque●●ntur P●t●●s . Aug. Epist. 103 Pelagius his time , the Fathers spake too liberally of Mans Free-will : which after , upon his Heresie , they reformed , and by Scripture abundantly confuted the Pelagians , and especially Augustine ▪ Ierome , Prosper , Fulgentius , Hilarius , and others . And Augustine inticing a Donatist to dispute about that Heresie , Saith unto him , Ratione agamus , divinarum Scripturarum authoritate agamus : Let us dispute the matter by Argument , let us be guided by the Authority of the Divine Scriptures . Not what I , and thou Say , but what Christ Saith . And this was the Spirit ( I say ) and practise of all the Fathers in such cases . So as if this Article of of Christs descent into hell had been by occasion of controversie about it well searched into , and examined by the Scripture : no doubt but the Fathers would therein have regulated their Faith according to the truth of Scripture .

But the Church of England ( say you ) holds and beleeves that Article , as you doe . No marvaile , when you doe . And should you hold otherwise , must it not doe so too . And yet we have but your bare word for it . But you will alledge your Article , That Christ went downe into hell . But we must examine your Article by the Scripture . And it is not the sound of your Article , but the sense , and that it agreeth with Scripture . But we have shewed , that no such thing is in Scripture . And you tell us withall , what Mr. Rogers upon the Articles saith of this ; That then ( Then I say ) in diebus illis , the Church of England was not resolved of this Article : and he was then the Arch-bishop of Canterbury his Chaplein , your Predecessor Richard Bancroft . But now your Lordships bare word is enough to Sway the Ballance , which before stood but in aequilibrio in an even peize , not resolved ; but now resolved . But this I can tell you , what ever your Church of England now beleeves , there is ( and I hope a good sound Church of Christ ) yet in England , that beleeves the Creed , and all the Articles thereof , and this in particular , no otherwise , then they find them agreeable to the Scripture , and the Analogy of Faith . And this is agreeable to that , which once a ‡ ‡ Dr. Bilson . Prel●te of England said , By the generall conf●ssion of all Antiquity , Traditions must he warranted by the Scriptures , or els we must reject them . And Isidore saith : A Prelate , if he teach or command any thing , besides that which is evidently cammanded in the holy Scriptures , let him be taken for a false witn●ssie to God , and a committer of Sacriledge .

But looking a little further , I find you confessing , That the Church of England hath not determined as yet either way by open Declaration upon this Article . No , hath she not ? How then doe you affirme , and would perswade us , that you beleeve , with the Church of England that Christ descended into hell , without any further Dispute ? We hope therefore it will not be long , before your Declaration come forth with a Definitive Sentence , determining the sense of this Article one way or other . And the rather , because in the late Declaration before the Articles , wherein this Article of Christs going down into hell is particularly set downe for one , they are declared to be of ambiguous sense , and yet men must hold to the letter of the Article . So as by that Declaration we are lesse resolved of the Articles , then before . A new Declaration therefore we would faine see , which is cleare , Declarative , and Determinative ; and therein tell us , whether Christs Soule descended into Hell , the place of the damned , or into Purgatory ▪ the Suburbs of hell , and whether Locally , and for what end and purpose ( because the Scripture is altogether silent in this whole mystery ) and whether you find hell to be in the Center of the Earth , or no , because your Article saith , He went down into hell , &c. But in the mean time , I have for my part ingenuously given you a reason of my Faith touching this Article , which I am so resolved on by the Scripture , that whatsoever Declaration you or your Church of England shall set forth to the contrary , I must crave pardon if it be not of the same faith with you . And thus farre you allow any in the Church of England this liberty , for your words are , * * p. 45.46 . Is it not lawfull for any in the Church of England to say , I conceive thus or thus of it , & c ? Although you adde

L. p. 51. It is one thing to hold an opinion privately , within himselfe , and another thing boldly and publickly to affirme it .

P. I doe , I confesse , boldly and publickly affirme this my faith concerning this Article , which my faith I doe assure my selfe is true , being grounded upon good and cleare evidence of the Scripture , on which my faith is built , and not upon any thing of humane Authority . And in making open confession of this my faith , I doe therin follow the Rule of Scripture , which saith ‡ ‡ Iam. 5 . 1●.20 . Bretheren , if any of you doe erre from the Truth , and one convert him : Let him know , that he which converteth a Sinner from the errour of his way , shall save a Soule from death , and shall hide ● multitude of Sinnes . Now what know I , that this Declaration of my Faith with Reasons from the Scripture , may by Gods grace be a meanes to convert , if not your Lordship from your errour , yet others , or may preserve them from falling into it , being dangerously entred into it by such an example , as your selfe And however , if it be lawfull for you boldly and publickly to affirme such things of beliefe , which are not found to be in Scripture : why may it not be as lawfull for me boldly and publickly to affirme the Contr●ry ? But the Scope of your Speech ( as I conceive ) is , to maintaine your practise in punishing in High Commission , such as expound this Article by and according to the Scripture ▪

L p. 53. For that all the Positive Articles of the present Church of England , are grounded upon Scripture , we are content to be judged by the joynt and constant beliefe of the Fathers , which lived within the first foure or five hundred yeares after CHRIST , when the Church was at the best , and by the Councels held within those times , and to submit to them in all those points of Doctrine .

P. But first ( as is before noted , as you give accasion ) why have you made your Articles to be Dípsucoi , of a double sense . So as in that respect , how can you call them Positive , being so perplexed in themselves ? And againe , Whom doe you meane here , by , Wee ? I suppose you and your church of England . You are contented to be Judged by Fathers and Councels within the first 500. yeares , whether your Church-Articles be grounded on Scripture or not . Are you contented so indeed ? Then you must be contented to undergoe the Censure of departing both from the judgement of the Scriptures , as disavowing them for the onely rule of Faith and Doctrines to be tryed by : and also from the joynt and constant beliefe both of Fathers and Councels within the first 500. yeares . For their joynt , constant , and unanimous beliefe was , that nothing besides the Scripture , is to be Judge in matters of Faith . And if you want leasure to read the Fathers , doe but peruse the learned Discourses and Disputes of the Divines of the Church of England before your being a Prelate , as Dr. Carleton of the Church , De Ecclesia , Dr. Whitakers forementioned , Dr. White his way to the true Church , Dr. Bilson , yea and all those that have written of these Controversies , and they will abundantly show this , that it was ever held as a Principle , and therefore not to be denyed , nor needfull to be proved ; and which Dr. Carleton in his said Book proves never to have been altered , till in and by the Councel of Trent , That the Scripture is the sole rule of Faith . But thus you and your Church of England are contented to be one and the Same Church with Rome , in refusing the Scripture as the Sole Iudge of your Doctrines . But will you be judged by the joynt and constant beliefe of Fathers and Councels within the first 500. yeares , whether your Articles about Grace , Election , Predestination , &c. bearing ( as you Declare ) a double and opposite sense , in their Pelagian and Arminian sense be according to the Scriptures , or no : If I name onely Augustine , who was Pelagionorum Malleus , that Hammer to knock down the Pelagians , both the Fathers and Councels within those first 500. yeares did joyntly and constantly professe that which he writ to be the Beliefe of the whole Church , it was so clearely and fully proved out of Scripture . In so much as you may read in the Histories of the Councels , as in Binius , how that some Councels and Bishops of Rome set downe Large Passages in Augustins Tracts against the Pelagians , as the Jugement of the Catholick Church , and the particular Decrees and Acts of such and such councels . If then you will stand to the Judgement of those ancient Fath●rs and Councels , then you must at their Barre hold up that hand , which was a chiefe instrument in drawing up the said Declaration , which hath so enigmatized and darkened the Articles , as they have no other Light left , but a kind of twilight , which inclines rather to the night , then to the day , rather to favour the Pelagian Heresie , then the Orthodox verity . But this being your language all along , that you put not onely your Articles and the Articles of the Creed , but the Mysteries also of the Scriptures to the Iudgement of the Primitive Church , Fathers , Generall Councels , we will Supersede from speaking more of it in this place .

Again , where you say , that the Church was then at the best : if you understand it , during the age and time of the Apostles , 't is most true : but if of the Succeding ages within 500. yeares , we may doubt of it , or rather resolve the contrary : unlesse you meane it comparatively to the ages after that , wherein Antichrist and the Mystery of Iniquity began more brightly to shine forth and display themselves in the Roman Sea , both in corruption of doctrine , and of Gods worship , beyond all excesse . For you may know , that within the space of the first 500. yeares , the Church was so overgrown and pestered with the heresie of Arius , as the world groaned under it , wondering it was become an Arian ; as Hierome speakes . Totus ingemuit mundus , miratus se factum esse Arianum . And among many corruptions , and much unsoundnesse in Doctrine , what multitudes of Superstitious devises , and heathenish Customes , not onely crept but crowded into the service of God ? Which Heathenish Rites ( as we find in B. Rhenanus his Annotations upon Turtullian ) were by the Christians in a kind of carnall policie admitted , both because many ancient men being converted to Christianity ( such as it was ) could not easily part with their old Customes : as also that thereby they might draw other of the Gentiles to become Christians . Just such a policie , as our new Doctors , ( I meane of your Church of England ) have used , in a pretence at least , making us beleeve , that coming as neare as you can to the Papists in their Ceremonies , you shall thereby bring them to the Church . And surely this is the ready way either to bring Papists to your Church , or you to their Church . But ( I say ) the Church was so pestered with Rites and Ceremonies even in Augustins dayes , that he complained , that Christians were now in a worse case and condition , under the Gospel , then the Iewes were under the Law : for though their yoake was grievous , yet those Leviticall rites were of Gods owne ordaining , and commandement , but Christians ( saith he ) are brought under an intolerable yoake of Ceremonies of mens devising and imposing .

But now on the other side , if I should enter into a Comparison between the Reformed Churches since Luther , and those Primitive and ancient Churches as aforesaid , I know it would be very tedious to your Lordship and extremely move your Patience ; especially if I should by many degrees preferre Calvin , Bez● , Zanchius , Iunius , and many hundred more Worthies both for learning and piety , and chiefly for Soundnesse in Doctrine , in the Reformed Churches , beyond the Seaes , yea and not a few , on this side , as Cranmer , Ridley , Latimer , Hooper , all Martyrs , Iewel , Whitakers , Reynolds , Perkins , with infinite more , and all within one Century , before such as those Centuries aforesayd produced , whose Names for Envy-sake I forbeare to mention .

Lastly , you say , you are content to submit to them in all those points of Doctrine . If you be , then for Shame cleare away those Cloudes , which the said Declaration hath over-cast your Articles withall , and cast away your Arminian Pelagian sense , and take off your Suspension of them , and let them speak one single truth , as they formerly did , and as all understood them , according to the Scriptures .

L. p. 62. The Catholicke Church we beleeve in our Creed to be the Society of all Christians .

P. What you beleeve is one thing . But we beleeve the Catholicke Church of Christ in the Creed to be the number and Society of all the Elect , as the next Article expounds it , The Communion of Saints : but not that Company of all Christians which you name and meane , Christians in name and profession , tag and ragge , pell mel , good and bad , Papists and Protestants , of which the greatest number are no true living members of the true Catholick Church , the mysticall body whereof Christ is the Head , and which by Faith onely we apprehend ( for we beleeve the Holy Catholicke Church ) but cannot discerne with our bodily eyes , as we doe a visible Object . This is that * * Ehes. 5.25 , 26. Church which Christ loved , for which he gave himselfe , that he might sanctifie and cleanse it with the washing of water by the word , to present it to himselfe a glorious Church , not having spot or wrinckle , or any such thing , but that it should be holy and without blemish . This we beleeve to be the Holy Catholicke Church , and no other . But thus indeed ( as you tell us before ) you make wider the Gates of the Catholicke Church , then ever Christ made them ; or rather indeed you exclude the Catholicke Church of Gods Elect , and set up a new Catholicke Church , which may be seen , but ought not to be beleeved .

L. p. 66. Agreed on for me also it shal be , that Gods word may be written , and unwritten .

P. Agreed on ? with whom ? Even with no lesse , then Bellarmine . For in the very next words you give us the reason , why it is agreed upon for you , that Gods word may be written and unwritten . For ( Say you ) Cardinall Bellarmine tells us truely , that it is not the writing or Printing , that makes Scripture the word of God , but it is the Prime unerring Essentiall Truth , God himselfe uttering and revealing it to his Church , that makes it Verbum Dei , the word of God . Doth Bellarmine say so ? And that truely ? And to what end , I pray you , doth the Cardinall say so ? Is it not to overthrow the Scripture for being the Sole word of God , and to bring in another word of God , which he calls verbum non Scriptum , an unwritten word , that is , a word besides the Scriptures , and equall to the Scriptures , which is Romes unwritten Traditions . And to this end and purpose Bellarmine using these words , doth he tell you truely , and is this the reason , for which it is agreed on for you , that Gods word may be written , and unwritten ? Now though it be true , that that which is spoken by God , is his word though it be not written : yet to us there is now no other word of God , but that which is written , that which is contained in the Scriptures . And this word written is that alone , which our Faith is grounded and settled upon . According to that of Iohn : * * Ioh. 20.30 , 31. Many other Signes truely did Iesus in the presence of his Disciples , which are not written in this Booke : But these things are written , that ye might beleeve , that Iesus is the Christ the Son of God , and that beleeving , ye might have life through his Name . So as we are not to inquire further , what Christ spake , or did , besides what we find written . But your Lordship tells us before , of certaine Traditions Apostolicall , which it seems are that word of God ▪ which may be unwritten . For you say : ‡ ‡ pag 52.53 . If the Scripture be a Foundation , to which we are to goe for witnesse , if there ●e doubt about the Faith ; and in which we are to find the thing that is to be beleeved , as necessary in the Faith : we never did , nor never will refuse any Tradition that is Vniversall and Apostolicke , for the better exposition of the Scripture . And to this place you referre that which you say , pag. 58. As for Tradition , I have said enough for that , and as much as A. C. where 't is truely Apostolicall . From which words , first we observe , that you make but an If , of the Scripture as a Foundation , If the Scripture be a Foundation : and , If in it we are to find the thing that is to be beleeved ; as If it were to be found in any thing else . And Secondly , how home you come to A C. the Jesuite , in admitting Tradition Apostolicke to expound any doubt about the Faith : and so with Bellarmine you are agreed for a word of God unwritten , as well as written . And you further adde here ( pag. 66. ) Speaking of the Scriptures : their being written gave them no Authority at all , in regard of themselves . Written or unwritten the Word was the same . But it was written , that it might be the better preserved , and continued with the more integrity to the use of the Church , and the more faithfully in our memories . So you . Now 't is true , that by the writing of the Scriptur●s Gods word contained therein is preserved , continued in integrity , and the more faithfully kept in our m●mories . But is thi● all ? Nay the very writing of them , though it added no Authority to Gods word in regard of it selfe , yet as the Scriptures are to us , Gods word , is of the greater Authority , because written . For we acknowledge no other word of God as t●e Rule and Foundation of our Faith , but what we find written in the holy Scriptures . This is that word of God which is authenticall , of Authority to his Church ; and therefore Authority to us , because written . So as your unwritten word , wherei● you agree with Bellarmine , and your Apostolicke Traditions , wherin you come home to your A. C. the Jesuite , we receive none of them all as authentick , or to have any thing to doe to expound the Scripture in any doubt about the Faith . But if you can shew us any Traditions Apostolick , we will by your leave examine them by the Scriptures , and not the Scriptures by them . You name baptizing of Infants for a Tradition Apostolicke . We doubt not but the Apostles baptized the Infants of beleeving Parents . For the Infants or Children of such are * * 1 Cor. 7.14 . holy , as the Apostle sheweth ; And so they belonged to the Covenant . And as the Children of the Jewes in the old Testament were circumcised , as pertaining to the Covenant and promise made to Abraham and to his Seed : So Baptisme , succeding in place of Circumcision , as a Seale of the Same Covenant , belongs to all Children of beleeving Christian Parents . As the Apostle saith , ‡ ‡ Rom. 4.16 . Therefore it is of Faith , that it might come by Grace , and the Promise might be sure to all the Seed , not to that onely which is of the Law , but to that also which is of the Faith of Abrah●m , who is the Father of us all . So as beleeving Christians have the same interest in the Covenant with Abraham , and their Children or Infants have the like priviledge of Baptisme , as the Infants of the ancient Israelites had for Circumcision . Therefore the Baptizing of Infants was certainly practised by the Apostles , as well as the baptising of beleeving Parents . So as we doe not baptize Infants , because you tell us it is a Tradition Apostolicke , but because it is as clearely and firmely grounded in the Scripture , as the baptizing of beleeving Parents . We exclude therefore whatsoever Word unwritten , or Traditions Apostolicke ( as you call them ) as being either partiall or equall Rules of Faith with the Scriptures , as Bellarmine calls them , or as Interpreters and Iudges of the Scripture in doubts about Faith , as you are bold to affirme . We have no word of God , but the Scripture : we acknowledge no Traditions Apostolicke , but what we find they delivered in Scripture . The Prophets in the old Testament sent Gods people to the Scripture , for information , instruction , resolution in all matters of Faith , and Cases of Conscience . ‡ ‡ Isa. 8.20 . To the Law and to the Testimony ( Saith Isaiah ) if they Speake not according to this word : it is because there is no light in them . He Saith not , To the Traditions of our Fathers , but , To the Law , and to the Testimony , Gods word written . Els , there is no light in men ; they are blind guides , that in matters of Faith lead us any where , but to , and by the Scriptures . And the Prophet Ieremiah : 〈◊〉 . 8.9 . They have rejected the word of the Lord , and what wisedome is in them ? All wisdome , without this word of God , is foolishnesse : all knowledge , without this , is ignorance and blindnesse . So our Saviour Christ : ‡ ‡ 〈◊〉 . 5.39 . Search the Scriptures , for in them ye thinke to find eternall life , and they are they , which testifie of me . So as Christ allowes us no other Testimony of him , and of Faith in him , but the Scriptures . We must erunan , Search them , not the Archives , or Sacraries of blind Traditions though guilded over never so faire with the name of Apostolick , nor of any pretended word of God unwritten . And Christ answereth the Lawyer , when he asked ‡ ‡ Luke 10.25.26 . what he should doe , to inherit Eternall life : What is written in the Law ? How readest thou ? And the Apostle , § § 1 Cor. 4.6 . That none presume above that which is written . And , † † Rom. 15.4 . Whatsoever things were written afore time , were written for our learning , that we through patience and comfort of the Scriptures might have hope . And Peter : * * 2 Pet. 1.19 . We have a more sure word of Prophecy , ( to wit the Scriptures of the old Testament ) whereunto ye doe well , that ye take heed . In all which places , and many more , the Scripture is still commended to us , as the onely absolute , sufficient , perfect and compleat Rule of our Faith in all matters , or doubts of Faith touching our Salvation , So as it hath no other interpreter , but it selfe , not any Tradition , not any word unwritten . But of this you will give us occasion to speak more at after .

L. p. 72 , 73. Faith is the gift of God , of God alone , and an Infused habit , in respect whereof the soule is meerely recipient . The Sole Infuser is the Holy Ghost . Till the Spirit of God move the heart of man , he cannot beleeve .

P. I confesse , when first I read these words , I began to muse with my selfe , and to argue thus : What , is my Lord of Canterbury turn'd Orthodox , no Arminian , in the Doctrine of Grace ? But looking a little further , and observing both the Authors you alledge ( as Stapleton , a great man with you , and other Popish Authors ( as is usuall with you throughout your Book ) and also considering of what Faith you here Speak , I changed my conceit , and found that you were no Changeling For wheras I thought that all this faire ●●ourish of Faith is the gift of God , of God alone , A habit infused , The Holy Ghost the Sole Infuser , The soule meerely recipient , Till Gods Spirit move mans heart , he cannot beleeve : had been meant of that Grace , of Saving and Iustifying Faith , which the Scripture teacheth , and particularly the Apostle , Ephes. 2.8 . By Grace ye are saved through Faith , and not of your selves : it is the Gift of God , &c. I imagined ( I say ) that as you used the Apostles very words , and the Language of Scripture , so you had done it in the sense and mind of the Apostle , and of the Scripture , which Speaks so of the Saving and Iustifying Faith . But when I found the contrary , I confesse I blushed at my folly , in having such a conceit of you , having had so much experience both of your usuall perverting of Scriptures , and your corrupt sense throughout your Book , and considering that light and darknesse cannot stand together , and how you h●ve altogether suppressed the Preaching of the Doctrines of Grace , and finding that all this Faith you Speake of , is nothing els , but that historicall Faith in beleeving the Scriptures to be the word of God , which beliefe is common to the very Reprobates , and Devils themselves , who * * Iam. 2 . 1● . beleeve and tremble Phristou●i , they quiver and Shake , as when mens teeth Chatter in their head in extreme cold . And yet how doe you abuse the Scripture , and your Reader , in giving to this Faith those peculiar Attributes , which are proper and peculiar to the onely Saving Grace of Saving Faith , the Sole Infuser , Giver , and worker whereof is the Holy Ghost ? Tell me , how come the Devils to that historicall faith , whereby they beleeve the Scripture to be the very word of God , and all things therein to be most certainly true , and so all those plagues written therein , and threatned against Reprobates and Devils , shal be most certainly inflicted , in beliefe whereof they tremble ? What , have they this Faith given them of God , and is the Holy Ghost the Sole Infuser of it , or any Infuser of it at all ? And yet I say , This historicall faith is that which you Speake of here . For you do in that 16 th Section , consisting of about 30 leaves in folio , Speake of that Faith alone , which beleeves the Scripture to be the word of God , the onely subject of that long and tedious Discourse , wherein you have spent so much sweat to so small purpose . And the words immediately preceding doe shew this . And your words immediately following are to confirme it , which you alledge out of Stapleton , Saying , The Holy Ghost did not leave the Church in Generall , nor the true members of it in particular without Grace to beleeve , what himself had revealed , and made credible . Wherupon you inferre a little after : Till the Spirit of God move the heart of man , he cannot beleeve , be the object never so credible . Thus we see your mind at full , what Faith , what Gift of God , what Grace , this is , which you Say none but the Holy Ghost giveth to his Church ▪ namely , not that faith , not that gift of God , not that Grace , not that worke of the Holy Ghost , whereby a man comes to beleeve in Christ , and to be indued with the Grace of Regeneration , and Sanctification , the proper worke and gift of the Holy Ghost , whereof the Apostle speaketh in the fore-cited place : but such a faith , such a grace , as the * * Co●●il . Trid. Sess. 6. Councel of Trent professeth and aloweth , and so , that which Stapleton , and all other Pontificials write of , which is common to all wicked men and Reprobates , as we have elswhere fully proved .

L. p. 75. The world cannot keep a man from going to weigh the Scripture at the Ballance of Reason , whether it be the word of God , or not . ‡ ‡ Abasing of the Scripture , in subjecting it to natural Reason . For the word of God , and the Book containing it , refuse not to be weighed by Reason . And , ( pag. 76. ) For Reason by her own light can discover , how firmely the Principles of Religion are true : but all the light Shee hath , will never be able to find them false .

P. 'T is ●rue , that mans naturall Reason , being not bridled by grace , is so head-strong , that the world it selfe cannot restrain it within its owne bounds , but will be medling . But yet , though Reason be not excluded from giving her voyce and assent to the Scripture , yet She must know her place , She must come in the Reere of all , and as a hand-maid , not as a Mistresse . Nor is it Reasons office to bring her ballance to weigh the Scriptures , whether it be the word of God , or not ; for herein She hath no negative voyce , but onely of assent : So as in this respect ; as a Judge , Gods word refuseth to be weighed by Reason : much lesse can it be true , that Reason by her own light can discover , how firmly the Principles of Religion are true . For mans Reason being but Naturall , and Gods word Supernaturall , there is no proportion between them , and Reason can no more judge of Scripture in this respect , then a blind man can judge of colours . So as Reason must not come in with her ballance and weights , till a man be illuminated by the Scriptures themselves , and by the Spirit of God ; and then being convinced of the truth thereof , She gives her full assent , that the Scripture is the word of God . The Apostle saith , ‡ ‡ 1 Cor. 2.14 . The naturall man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God : neither can he know them , because they are Spiritually discerned . How say you then , That Reason by her own Light can discover how firmly the Principles of Religion are true ? Point blanke against the Apostle . § § Act. 16.14 . The Lord openeth the heart of Lydia , to attend to the things spoken of Paul . Now if the naturall man by the light of his naturall reason , receiveth not , nor is thereby capable of the things of the Spirit of God contained in the Scripture , but that they are foolishnesse unto him , untill God open the heart , and * * 1 Cor. 2. reveale those things by his Spirit ( as the Apostle saith ) then Reason cannot judge of Scripture by her owne light . For what is Reasons light in a naturall man ? Surely darknesse it selfe , unto Spirit●all things . Ye were once darknesse , saith the Apostle . Darknesse in the very abstract . Mans naturall understanding and Reason darknesse . And therefore as Christ saith , ‡ ‡ Math. 6.23 . If the light that is in thee be darknesse , how great is that darknesse ? And Rom. 8.5 . They that are after the flesh , tà tes sarkòs phronousin , doe savour the things of the flesh : but they that are after the Spirit , the things of the Spirit . Spirituall things are as unsavory to a naturall mans Reason , as wholesome meat is to an aguish palate . They are unto him * * 1 Cor 2.14 . moría , foolishnesse , saith the Apostle . And Rom. 8.6 . § § Rom. 8.6 . The wisdome of the flesh is death , “ “ v. 7. and ekthrà , emnity against God ; and it is not subject to the Law of God , neither indeed can be . Ye saith Ieremy , † † Ier. 10. Every man is brutish in his own knowledge . Can you then hale the Scripture to the barre of mans naturall Reason , which is brutish , to be judged by it , whether it be Gods word , or no ? And David saith , * * Psal. 62.9 . Surely men of low degree , are vanity . Yea , say you , Men of low degree : but not so , men of high degree , of learning and parts . But take all with you : Surely men of low degr●e are vanity , and men of high degree are a lye : to be layd in the ballance , they are altogether lighter then vanity . What , men of low degree , vanity ? and men of high degre a lye ? Yea Surely , yea altogether lighter then vanity it selfe , being ●ayd in the ballance . But in what ballance ? In the uneven ballance , with the false Scales of your naturall Reason ? No : but in the § § Exod. 30. ●3 Ballance , and with the weights of the Sanctuary your Reason must be weighed . And this ballance of the Sanctuary is the Scripture . If then your Reason must be weighed at the ballance of the Scripture , and there be found too light , yea lighter then vanity , yea altogether lighter then vanity , yea , Surely altogether lighter then vanity , yea a very lye : then what weights can your Reason bring , being altogether lighter then vanity it selfe , whereby to weigh the Scriptures ? Or how shall Reason , which is a lye , with her unequall Ballance , and false weights weigh verity it selfe ?

But if all this will not put you out of conceit of your naturall Reason , as an incomptent Judge of Scripture to be the word of God ( which must needs argue the truth of Scripture , that mans Reason is blindnes , darknes , emnity against the truth , brutish , vanity , a ly , altogether lighter then vanity it self ) give me leave a little to put you to it . You perswade your selfe that you can by the strength and light of your naturall Reason judge , Pr●lates Reason put to its tryall . or weigh the Scripture , whether it be Gods word , and discover how firmely the Principles of Religion are true ( for had you been perswaded hereof by Gods Spirit , you would never have attributed so much to mans Reason ; but herein you have consulted altogether with flesh and blood , having no acquaintance certainly with the Spirit of truth , that leads his into all truth . ) Now then by the Same Reason , you may discover whether Christ be of God or no ; for he is the Summe , Substance , and Scope of the whole Scripture , and so is called * * Rev. 19 13. The word of God . And Christ Saith , Search the Scriptures , for these testifie of me . Doe you beleeve then that the Scripture is Gods word , and therefore true ? Doe you beleeve all things in it to be true ? And to be a word of wisdome , surpassing all the wisdome in the world ? Doe you beleeve this ? And that to obey and follow this word of God , is mans chiefe wisdome , and happinesse ? Doth your Reason apprehend this ? What say you then to that word of Christ , ‡ ‡ Luke 9.22 . If any man will come after me , let him deny himselfe , and take up his daily Crosse and follow me ? Doth your Reason comprehend this ? Is it not durus sermo , a hard Saying , as that to the rich man , Vade , vende omnia , † † Luk 18.21 . Goe , Sell a●l , and give them to the poore , and thou shalt have treasure in heaven , and come and follow me ? But all Gods Saints doe thus . M●ses accounted the R●buk●s of Christ greater riches then the Treasures of Aegypt , and chose rather to suffer affliction with the people of God , th●n to enjoy the pleasures of Sin for a Season . § § Ps●l . 8.8 . Paul accounted all his Prerogatives losse , and dung to win Christ . The Apostles forsooke all to follow Christ . You will Say , A few poore 〈◊〉 nets . Nay , Saith Aug. they forsook not onely what they had , but whatsoever they might have in the world . Abraham , when God called him , forsook his native Countrey ▪ and all his friends . Do you beleeve these men did wisely in doing this ? Doth your Reason apprehend so ? Do you thereupon Conclude , that this Scripture is Gods word , because it teacheth such things , as the doing whereof brings a man to true happinesse ? Can you then be content to follow Christ upon his Conditions , to forsake all , and take up your Crosse dayly , and follow him ? Can your Reason down with his , or your Stomack digest this ? Or will you Say , To forsake all , is but matter of Councel , not of Precept ? Yes certainly of Precept , in those things especially , the retaining whereof detaines us from Christ , and are a barre to come to him , and so to heaven . Si in Limine Pater jaceat , per calcatum perge patrem : Saith Ierome : Hieronimus Epist. If they old Father lye crosse the threshold to hinder thee from Christ , tread on thy Father to come to Christ . If any thing stand in our affections in competition with Christ , we must forsake it . * * Math. ●● . 3● . He that loveth Father , or Mother , or lands , or honours , more then me ( Saith Christ ) is not worthy of me . For ‡ ‡ Iam. 4.4 . the amity of the world , is emnity against Christ . Now if things in themselves good and lawfull , being loved above Christ , keep us from Christ , and therefore must be forsaken : then how much more , such things , as are in themselves evill , unlawfull , unwarrantable , for a man to keep , as being against Gods word , and against Christ , and against a mans salvation ? How then can your most refined Reason perswade his Grace of Canterbury to deny himselfe , to abandon all that Grace , to forsake his Hierarchy , as being emnity against Christ , and a Tyranny over his Church , and therewith to account all his Dignities as dung , to cease persecuting of Gods word , Ministers , People , to abandon his counterfet and hypocriticall Devotion in in will-worship , which is a vaine worship of God , and in stead of all these , to take up his Crosse dayly , and to follow Christ in obedience , in patience , in humility , in meeknesse , in holinesse ? Doth your Reason apprehend this to be good , to be the wisest and onely way to come to heaven and happinesse ? For this Gods word commandeth . Then either follow this word , as Gods word , or els never looke to perswade the world that your own Reason can with her own light discover how firmly the Principles of Religion are true . No , no , my Lord , away with these vain Speculations , and presumptuous Speeches , which have not one crumb of Salt in them . ‡ ‡ Tit. 1.16 . Will you professe you know God , and in works deny him ? Do you beleeve the Scripture to be Gods word , and yet by accounting the preaching of the Crosse foolishnesse , make God a lyer .

But I will conclude with your last Clause : Reason ( say you ) for all the light she hath , will never be able to find the Principles of Religion false . Nay certainly , although you deny Reason any ability by her owne light to discover how firmly the Principles of Religion are true : yet we will not deny unto her blind impotencie a Speciall faculty in finding them to be false : not false in themselves , but yet false , in her own apprehension . For is not this one of the main Principles of Religion , to wit , to know Iesus Christ , and him Crucified ? This was the Apostles Chiefe Learning , § § 1 Cor. 2.2 . I determined ( saith he ) to know nothing among you , save Iesus Christ , and him Crucified . But ( saith he ) † † 1 Cor. 1.18 . The preaching of the Crosse is to them that perish foolishnesse : but unto us which are Saved , it is the power of God . And who are they that perish ? Such as are wise in their owne conceit , and prudent in their own understanding and Reason ; as the Apostle saith in the next words : for it is written , I will destroy the wisedome of the wise , and will bring to nought the understanding of the prudent ; Such as exalt their own understanding and Reason to such a height , as they presume therwith , as with a Ballance , to weigh , whether the Scripture be Gods word , or no ; and with the light thereof to discover how firmly the Principles of Religion are true . And when they have said and done all , their actions and practises doe plainly shew , that they reject and despise the Scripture , as being none of Gods word ▪ yea they Persecute , oppresse , and seeke all the wayes they can to destroy it , and utterly to quench the light of it . As will yet more clearely appeare by those things that follow .

L. p. 77. Though this Truth , that the Scripture is the word of God , is not so demonstratively evident , à priori , as to enforce assent : yet it is strengthened so abundantly with probable Arguments , both from the light of nature it selfe , and humane Testimony , that he must be very wilfull , and selfe conceited , that shall dare to suspect it . [ And more plainly ] pag 80. Prelates blasp●●my against 〈◊〉 Scripture . The light which is in Scripture it selfe , is not bright enough , it cannot beare sufficient witnesse to it selfe . The Testimony of the Holy Ghost , that is most infallible , but ordinarily it is not so much as considerable in this Question ; which is not , how , or by what meanes we beleeve , but how the Scripture may be proposed as a Credible object , fit for beliefe .

P. We are still in your 16 th Sextion , mentioned before , which continueth from p. 59. to 116. wherein are sundry passages ●o this purpose , whereof the last was one , and the rest we shall touch , as we meet with them . And here I cannot , ( though I said I would no more wonder ) but admire , that such Speeches should flow down so fast from the Sea of Canterbury , which is a mighty Catarrhact or distillation of the eye , drowning the sight , and flowing from such an abundant humour in the head , as it is like to turne into a Dropsie , possessing and putrifying the whole body , which if not prevented by some remedy from h●aven , must needs prove Epedemically mortall . You are the first Antagonist of Iesuites , that ever uttered such things , and you might well have given them leave to utter such base Speeches of the holy Scriptures , as more proper for a Jesuite , then one pretending the Faith of a Protestant . But the difference is not great , nor matters is much , which of you be the mouth , having all one Spirit , and being all one and the Same Church . So as being the Metropolitan of that Church , which with Rome is one and the Same : you have the greater priviledge to speake in the language of that pregnant Mother ▪ who is so * * Rev. 17.3 full of the names of Blasphemy against the word of God .

Now is not the Scripture so demonstratively evident in it selfe , as to enforce assent ? What then shall doe it ? Probable Arguments from the light of Nature . But Nature is blind , as we shewed before of naturall Reason . And againe , how can that which is but probable , confirme that which is truth ? For the Scripture is Truth it selfe . As Christ saith , Thy word is Truth . Now there being strictly , no proportion between Probability and Truth : how can the Light of Nature , which you say is but probable , confirme that which is truth . And we shewed also how the Naturall man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God , which things are contained in the Scripture . But you adde , Arguments from humane Testimony , confirme the Scriptures to be Gods word . That which is but humane , cannot strengthen that which is Divine . I receive not the Testimony of man , saith Christ . Ioh. So the Scripture is so farre above humane testimony , that it can receive no strength from it , no more then God can receive strength from the creature , Gods word from mans word . And the Scripture , being Gods written word , is above Mans bare word . As Christ tells the Jewes , who took Christ for a meere Man : If ye beleeve not Moses his writings , how shall you beleeve my words ? Thereby implying , That Writings , the Scripture , are above mans words . Againe , humane testimony in Comparison to Gods word , is but a lye . For * * Rom. 3.4 ▪ every man is a lyer . Moreover , in saying , The Scripture is not evident enough to demonstrate it selfe to be the word of God , and to enforce assent : but being strenthened by Probable Arguments from the light of Nature , and of humane Testimony , 't is then wilfullnesse and pride to suspect it : Here you set the light of Nature above the word of Grace , probability above Truth , humane Testimony above Divine , Man above GOD. For Christ tells us , that the Scriptures beare witnesse of him : And you Say , the Scriptures are not sufficient witnesses of themselves , and so consequently of Christ , without mans testimony , So as hereby you disable the Scripture , as being an incompetent witnesse of Christ , because not evident enough in themselves without humane Testimony , So as how you can cleare your selfe from blasphemy , I see not . But this is but one degree . For you adde , The light which is in Scripture is not light enough , it cannot beare sufficient witnesse to it selfe . Now you open your mouth a little wider to blaspemy . But we shall have yet more of ths Suffe out of your Wardrobe . Of which I may say this by the way , That you bewray how grosly and palpably blind you are in discerning the Scriptures glorious brightnesse , being like that Woman in Lipsius , who being blind her selfe , blamed the house she was in for being very darke : So you , because you are blind your selfe , the * * 2 Cor. 4.4 . god of this world having blinded your eyes : therefore you blame the holy Scriptures of GOD for being darke , not bright enough to to beare witnesse to it selfe . Why , Surely all light is Sui index , & sui Communicativum , it is a witnesse to it selfe , that it shineth , So as all in the house doe see it ; yea though it be but the ‡ ‡ Math. 5.15 . light of a Candle , as Christ saith . If therefore the Scriptures have not so much light in them , as all may see it to shine forth , then they have no light at all . For if there be any light at all , it will shew it selfe . But this you will not stick to tell us anon , that the Scripture hath no light in it selfe , and therefore no mervaile if here you say , the Light that is in it is not bright enough . And you tell us here also , That the Testimony of the Holy Ghost ordinarily is not so much as considerable in this Question . Why ? What is the Question ? Is it not how , or by what meanes we beleeve the Scriptures to be the word of GOD ? Is not this the Subject Question of this whole 16 th Section , and which you handle throughout ? And this being so , have you forgotten what you told us before of this beliefe , that the Scripture is the word of GOD ? Namely that faith is the gift of God , of God alone ; and an infused habit , in respect whereof the Soule is meerely recipient , and that the sole infuser is the Holy Ghost ? and Till the Spirit of God move the heart of man , he cannot beleeve ? And now doe you come and tell us , The Holy Ghost ordinarily is not so much as considerable in the Question ? Yea , but here you tell us , this is not the Question . What then ? Namely , how the Scripture may be proposed as a Credible Object , fit for beliefe . And for this you set us downe a rule of Proposall , which must of necessity take its rise from the Tradition , or Authority of the Present Church . Whereof we shall heare more anon . But by your leave , this is not the Question , but the other . For this your manner of Proposall , you put it not as a Question , but as an a'ítema , a Question begged , not to be argued , and disputed upon , as the nature of a Question is to be , but you doe dogmatízein , obtrude and force upon us a novell opinion of your owne devising , without proofe of Reason , Argument , or Authority from the Scripture . And therefore we deny your Question , or Position as Heterodox , or a Paradox , contrary to the truth of God word , which is the onely rule of determining all Questions in Divinity about faith , whereof this is not the least , How , or by what meanes a man comes to beleeve the Scripture to be the word of God ? Now for the determining herof you would tye us to the one only manner of Proposing the Scripture , as a Credible object fit for beliefe : and that is , necessarily to begin at the Tradition or Authority of the present Church , or els there is no dealing with you . But what if we shall propose a better manner and way of propounding the Scripture as a Credible object fit for beliefe ? And this we shall doe , God assisting , overthrowing your false way , and vindicating the onely right and true , safe and sure way , that will certainly lead us to this beliefe , That the Scripture is the word of God .

And for a ground hereof , I lay down the Contradictory of your words for my true Position , which is this , That the light which is in Scripture it selfe , is bright enough , it can and doth of it selfe beware sufficient witnesse to it selfe . For proofe hereof : The Scripture is the witnesse of Christ , as is said before : and a witnesse must be a sufficient and competent witnesse , without all exception ; els 't is rejected . Now the Scripture is without all exception , it is a holy , true , and faithfull witnesse , free from all vice , or defect . It is pure and perfect , so as it needs nothing to be added to it . So Salomon , * * Pro. 30.5 , 6 ▪ Every word of God is pure : Adde thou not unto his word , least he reprove thee , and thou be found a lyer . Adde thou not ; Ergo it is a most perfect and competent witnesse . Againe , as the Scripture is every way a Competent and sufficient , a perfect and Compleat witnesse , without all exception : So it brings full and cleare Evidence with it for that whereof it is a witnesse . For this , Salomon saith , ‡ ‡ Pro. 8.8 , 9. All the words of my mouth ( saith Wisdome ) are in righteousnesse , there is nothing froward or perverse in them : they are all plaine to him that understandeth , and right to them that find knowledge . The Scripture is plaine , cleare , and evident . So Peter saith , ‡ ‡ 2 Pet. 1.19 . Ye have a beba●oterón tòn prophetikon logon , a most sure word of Prophecie , whereunto you doe well that ye take heed , as unto a light that shineth in a darke place . The Scripture then is a most sure witnesse , and it is a light that shineth . The light is not in it , as the fire in the flint : but it a light shining forth , as the light of the Sun . § § Psal. 119.105 . Thy word ( saith David ) is a Lamp unto my feet , and a Light unto my path . And , * * Psal. 19.8 . The entrance of thy words giveth light , it giveth understanding unto the Simple . The very first entrance or gate ( as the word signifieth ) of Gods word , doth illuminate , and give light , it giveth understanding to the Simple , the rude and ignorant ; it ‡ ‡ Ps. 119.130 enlightneth the eyes . Now all this could not be , without a light that shineth , and that clearely too , such as upon the first entrance of it giveth light and understanding to the simple .

But how comes this light of the Scripture to shine forth ? I Answere , First of its own proper nature . Let but an unregenerate Man read the Scriptures , Scripture convincing a naturall man . and he shall feele such a Convincing light in them , as he will perceive there is a Divine power in them . But this light of Scripture , by Gods owne appointment , shines forth more bright , and is more effectuall , when it is preached . Of this the Apostle saith , ‡ ‡ 1 Cor. 14.24 , 25. If all prophecy , ( that is , preach the word of God , as in that place ) and there come in one that beleeveth not , or one unlearned , he is convinced of all , he is judged of all : And thus are the secrets of his heart made manifest , and so falling down on his face , he will worship God , and report , that God is in you of a truth . Now whence is all this Conviction , and Confession , but from the power of Gods word preached . So Heb. 4.12 . The word of God is quicke and powerfull , and sharper then any two edged Sword , Heb. 4.12 . piercing even to the dividing asunder of Soule and Spirit , and of the joynts and marrow , and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart . This , this is that , that dazleth mans clearest reason , convinceth and confoundeth his Conscience , and as a mighty Engine § § 2 Cor. 10.4 , 5. batters down , and layes levell Strong holds , and all high things that exalt themselves against the knowledge of God , bringing into Captivity every thought to the obedience of Christ : as the Apostle speakes . And is Gods word ( the Scripture preached in the power and purity of it ) a discerner of the thoughts and intents of mans heart ? Then let that man tell me , whether , without any more testimony , this be not the very word of God ? And that there is in it ▪ Theiónti a divine Spirit , and power , that thus can search into the inmost bowels , and secrets of mans heart ? So as , as the Samaritan woman said to her neighbour , Come , and see the man , that hath told me all that ever I did ; is not he the Christ ? So a naturall man thus convinced and confounded by the power of Gods word , and Secrets of his heart discovered , may he not now truely report , and say Come , and heare that word , which hath discovered unto me all the Secrets of my heart : must not that needs be Gods owne , word ▪ So as this Discovery , is it not by that native , operative , effectuall , and resplendent penetrating lihgt , shining in the Scripture , the beames whereof are displayed in the Ministry of this word of God ? what is it then , that enforceth and even extorteth this assent and confession from a naturall man , but the cleare evidence of Gods word preached , that the Scripture is the word of God , which is so preached ?

And to bring this a little neerer home , and set it closse against your owne Gate : What Say you my Lord ( for I must deale plainly with you , seeing you are so bold with the Scripture ) will you be tryed by this word of God , whether it have not sufficient Light in it selfe , and of it selfe , even to convince your owne heart and Conscience , that the Scripture is the word of God ? I say , in , and of it selfe , without all those circumstances which you put as necessary previous inducements to this beliefe , whereof your Church Authority is ever the Prime . Will you be content but to make tryall of your selfe in this Case ? How is that ? Why , doe but once come into some obscure , poore Parish Church , A motion . where there is a good Zealous , and Orthodox Preacher ; and come disguised ( as * * 1 King . 22 ▪ Ahab at the Battell of Ramoth Gilead ) in a private manner , not in your Pontificalibus , with your long Sattentraine carried after you , et magna comitante Caterva , a troope of gallants at your heeles ; So as none takes notice of you , much lesse the Preacher : and come your selfe in person , not sending your tà o'ta , your Long Eares , I meane your Scouts and Spies , Informers , Promoters , Priests , or Pursuivants , Delators , and Sycophants ; for these will seldome tell you the truth of things : But I say , come your selfe in a private disguise , and so stand muffled up in the Croud , and hearken diligently to the Preacher , first how he doth o'rthotomein tòn lógon , divide his text aright , as it were anatomising and ripping up the bowels of it and then how fitly he grounds his docttrines , or points of Instruction upon his text , and so prosecutes them with proofes of Scripture , and Reasons ; and lastly applyes this word in sundry uses to the hearts and Consciences of the hearers , reproving this or that sinne , and pressing it home ; And all this while , knowing nothing , that any such Creature , as the Archbishhop of Canterbury is in his Congregation , in the ardor of his holy Zeale , hee lets flye his Darts of sharpe Reproofe , Steeled with Divine Authority of GODS Word , the Scripture , as against Pride , Hypocrisie , hatred of GODS Word , Persecution of Gods Ministers and People under a colour of piety , and pea●e-making in the Church , and the like , and so drives the nayle to the head , as that the dart ▪ pierceth through all your armour of proofe ( as the * * 1 King . 22. Arrow , shot at adventure , hit Ahab between the joynts of his Armour ) to the the very quick of your Conscience , not onely to the awakening of it , but driving it to a trembling fit , ( as Pauls preaching did to ‡ ‡ Act. 24.25 . Felix ) and to be in a cold Sweat , and to wax wanne and pale , ( as Belshazzar at the sight of the hand-writing , which is a part of Scripture ) what would you imagine of this ? Perhaps , that the Minister knew of your being there . But the contrary appeares to your selfe , you did it so secretly , as you knew none could discover it ; as you want neither wit nor art to doe such a feate , if you will . Well , you can draw no other Conclusion from that your Conviction upon this occasion , but that sure those were the Darts of the Scripture , that wounded you , yea and sounded you , and found you out in the Croud , pulling off the veile of hypocrisie from off the the face of your Conscience , and therewithall so terrifying it , as you are perswaded all the men in the world could not have struck such terrours into your Soule : and therupon you are forced to Conclude , and Confesse , that surely the Scripture must needs be the word of God , having such a mighty power in it , being applyed but by a weake man . As the Apostle saith , ‡ ‡ 2 Cor. 4.7 . We have this treasure in earthen vessels , that the excellence of the power might be of God , and not of us . For you could discerne nothing of the Minister himselfe , but that he was a simple plain man , and did but speake , as his text led him , and for which he brought good proofe from the Scripture . Thus if your Lordship should make but such an experiment as this , would you not doe with this your Book ( wherein you have , besides many other strange passages all along , as will appeare yet more at large , pronounced so many disgracefull Sentences against the Sufficiencie of the Divine Scripture , to prove it selfe to be the word of God ) as those Converts in the Acts did with their Books of Curious Arts , or as you did ( though against your will ) with that Popish Book of the Bishop of Geneva in Smithfield . But I proceed .

As the Scripture , not onely in and of it selfe , but by the Ministry of it discovereth such a cleare selfe-light , as whereby even naturall men are convinced , and enforced to beleeve and confesse , that Surely the Scripture is the very word of God : so this word , this Scripture is not ( as the Papists say , and you say little better ) a dead letter : but as it is the word of God , uttered by his Spirit , by which * * 2 Pet. 1.21 . holy men spake and wrote it : so it carries meat in the mouth ( as we say ) it never goes alone , but is accompanied with the Spirit of God , which Spake it , giving testimony unto it , that it is the undoubted word of God . For even as the veines in a naturall body doe carry and convey in them the life-blood , and as the Arteries doe containe in them those animal Spirits conveyed from the head to all the members , whereby they are vegetated , and moved : So the Scriptures and every part of them have in them the Spirit , whereby they are quickned , and which is in them , as the light in the body of the Sun , their proper light , wherein they shine forth in such a brightnesse , as is sufficient to convince all men , that they are the word of God , and effectuall in perswading and assuring all the Elect of God of the truth thereof , even to their Salvation . And as the Soule with its faculties , as understanding and Reason , in mans body , doe shew him to be a reasonable creature , Man : So the Spirit of God , breathing and moving in the Scriptures , doe shew them to be the very word of God . For in the Scripture doe shine forth Gods Majesty , Wisdome , Holinesse , Power , Providence , Iustice , Mercy , Truth , Goodnesse , Omniscience , and all his excellent Attributes , so as they all beare testimony unto it , that it is the word of God . So as to seperate these from the Scripture , as they doe , who affirme , that the Scripture is not bright enough to be a sufficient witnesse to it selfe , to the begetting of Beliefe , that it is the word of God : Comparison . is as if they should abstract and seperate the light from the Sun , and say , it is not sufficient to prove it selfe to be the Sun . For indeed take away the light from the Sun , and then you may say truely , it is not bright enough to shew it selfe to be the Sun . Nay it ceaseth to be the Sun any more , when the light and heat of it is taken away . For the Sun is pherónumos , according to its names in the Hebrew , Shemesh , so called , because by its light it is a Minister or Servant to the world : or some derive it , quasi Sham-esh , ibi ignis , There is fire : or according to another name , from its property of calefaction , or heating . But take away its light , and it looseth both its nature , and its name , and serves for no use . So if you take from the Scripture those things in it , which are its life and soule , its native light and ●uster , which can no more be seperated from it , then the light from the Sun ( nay the Sun * * Mat. 24.29 ▪ shall come to loose his light , as it once did at the Ecclipsing of the ‡ ‡ Mal. 4.2 . Sun of Righteousnesse in § § Mat. 27.45 . his Passion on the Crosse , but Gods word † † Ps. 119.89 . endureth for ever in heaven ) you quite destroy the nature of the Scripture , and so make it to be no longer the word of God .

I might here inlarge my Discourse upon this excellent Subject , but I shall have further occasion ministred by you to speake something more of it , as I passe along . For you proceed .

L. p. 83. A man is probably led by the Authority of the present Church , as by the First informing , inducing , perswading meanes , to beleeve the Scripture to be the word of God : but when he hath studied , considered , and compared this word with it selfe , and with other writings , with the helpe of ordinary Grace , and a mind morally induced , and reasonably perswaded by the voyce of the Church : the Scripture then gives greater and higher Reasons of Credibily to it selfe , then Tradition alone could give .

P. Here you begin to tell us your manner of proposing the Scripture as a credible object , fit for beliefe . And you place the Authority of the Present Church in the forefront , as a prime leader and inducer to this beliefe . And this you inculcate very often , and Say , pag. 120 , I confesse every where , that Tradition introduces the knowledge of them . And pag. 126. you tell the Jesuite , A. C. saying , Herein we goe the same way with you , because we allow the Tradition of the present Church to be the First inducing Motive , &c. So as herein you jumpe with the Jesuite . So then , Authority of the present Church is the Prime . Or as sometimes you call it Tradition , or otherwhiles , The voyce of the Present Church . All comes to one reckoning . Then , to this Leader you muster up a troop of followers ; as here , Ordinary Grace , a mind morally induced , and reasonably perswaded ; and before : a mans owne Reason , and humane Testimony , morall perswasion , Reason , and Force of the present Church , the Holy Ghost , Conferring of the Scripture with it selfe , and other writings . And what then ? Then , and not before , the Scripture gives greater and higher Reasons of Credibility to it selfe , then Tradition alone could give . What ? No more effect for all this , but a Credibility ? I expected you should with such a Troope , under the command of such a Generall , as the Authority , Tradi●ion , and voyce of the present Church have effected that Rockie For● of mans heart to have yealded to open the Gates of his Infidelity to let in this Beliefe , that Scripture is the word of God . And can you obtaine no more then a Credibility ? Alas poore Scripture ! Can all Mans witty inventions advance thy credit ( which they have taken away ) no higher , then to a Credibility ? But thus we may see the vanity of Mans wit , when it hath cast away the truth . This is right , as the Preacher Saith , * * Eccles. 7.29 ▪ L●e , this onely have I found , That God made man upright : but they have sought out many inventions . So when men reject the word of the Lord , what wisdome is in them ? Then they fall to their inventions , like ‡ ‡ 1 Sam. 19.13 . Michals stuffing her Image with Goates haire , and laying it in the bed , instead of David . Or a right Embleme hereof we have in our First Parents : when they had disrobed themselves of that plain , simple seamelesse , but glorious robe of their Innocencie , having thus lost their uprightnesse , wherein God made them : presently they fall to their inventions ; they will supply the want of that robe with a many faire fresh Fig-leaves sowed together without either needle or thread , vainly imagining , that this would cover their shame , when indeed it was a plain signe , they had lost their Glory , and yet could not hide their nakednesse . So when a man hath lost the Truth , he shall loose his wits in his manifold Inventions , before he shal be able thereby to make up his losse . Thus did the Church of Rome of old , no sooner had they thrust out Gods word , and the preaching of it out of their Temples , but up goe their Images for Lay-mens Books , and in comes crowding a multitude of Ceremonies , the Inventions of man , as if these would make amends , with advantage , instead of the holy Scriptures . Just your practise in the Church of England at this day . And just your like practise here . When you have cast a black veile over the Scriptures native beauty and light , disabling them as sufficient witnesses , to prove themselves the word of God : Magno 〈◊〉 magnas nuga● ▪ you invent here a number of things to stop our mouthes , to make us beleeve , that by these you will bring Mans naturall blindnesse to see , and his infidelity to beleeve just nothing at all , that the Scriptures are the word of God . So as you deale with us here , as some Parents doe with their Children , take the piece of gold from them , and please them with a handfull of deafe nuts . Onely , they doe it providently , to preserve the Gold from being lost : but you Popishly , to destroy the Gold , and to set up the painted dresse of your New-nothing . Or you put out the Eyes of the Scripture , and then light your Candle before it : as after you tell us .

But let 's a little examine your words . First I note here , what a blind guide you commend to blind men , to lead them to the beliefe of the Scriptures to be the word of God . For what is it ? Certainty ? No , Probabilty . A man is probably led . But of Probability we have spoken before . And take this with you for a certaine truth : Probability may beget an opinion : but never , a belief . But by whom probably led ? By the Authority of the present Church . What present Church ? Of the Prelates , or Hierarchy ever . But who gave you Authority , to be a Church ? Or Suppose you were the true Church of Christ : who gave you this Authority to take away from the Scriptures their sufficiencie of guiding men to the faith of them , and to tie men to depend upon the Authority of the present Church , thereby to be induced to beleeve the Scriptures ? And what 's your present Church ? Is it not the Same with that of Rome ? And is not this Authority which you arrogate , Romish ? And what if your present Church with Rome , shall induce us to beleeve the Apocryphall Bookes to be part of Scripture ? Or some word unwritten , which you call Apostolick Traditions , to be equall with the word written , as you agree with Bellarmine in this Distinction of the word written , and unwritten ; as before is touched ? And what if ( as you have given us too much proofe ) you should limit us in beleeving the Scripture , what part to beleeve for Canonicall , and what otherwise ? For as * * Adversus Luciferian●s . Hierome saith , The Scripture consists more in the marrow of Sentences , then in the barke of words , more in the Sense then in the Syllables . What say you then to the 4 th Commandement , which your present Church denyes to be Morall for a Seventh day Sabbath , and thereby overthrow the Sanctification of the Lords day ? What say you of the Doctrines of Grace , which you have overthrowne by your Declaration before your Articles ? What of Altars , and the like ? If herein you overthrow the Sense of Scripture , doe you not proclaime to the world , that such and such Scriptures are not Canonicall ? Or if the words be still holden for Canonicall , yet it must be according to the Sense of your present Church . As Paulus 4. the Pope , in the End of the Councel of Trent , tyes all Priests by oath to interpret the Scriptures no otherwise , but according to the Sense of the Catholick Church ; the Summe whereof is the Decrees and Canons of Trent . Is not thus the whole Scripture made voyd ?

But , come on , let men be primely induced by the Authority of the present Church , The onely way how men may know the Scripture to be Gods word as the Prelate teacheth . to wit , of the Prelates or Hierarchy ( for no other Church you allow , nor we you to be any other , but of Antichrist ) by what Argument ( trow you ) is it likelyest they will be perswaded , that the Scriptures are the word of God ? Will you give me leave to tell you my Opinion ? It is this in briefe : When men upon your Authority and Commendation should be brought to read the Scriptures , and therein should find many Prophecies , and among the rest , how there should come * * Math. 24. False Proph●ts , being Wolves in Sheeps Clothing : ‡ ‡ Revel. 13. pretending holinesse , but Persecuting Gods Saints ; pretending Religion , but oppessing Gods word , pretending to be ‡ ‡ Math. 24. Christ vic●royes , but § § Col. 2. ●8 . tyrannizing over his people ; and such as should Apostatise from the Faith , and set up Doctrines of Devils , as in abstinence from certaine Meates , and Marriage at certaine times , and how Christ and his Apostles were humble , and despised the world , being crucified unto it , and how they which were proud , pompous Lords , claiming to be their Successors follow none of their steps , neither in diligent preaching , nor practise of a holy life , are such Antichrists as the Scripture hath foretold : and how † † 2 Tim. 3.13 2 , 3 , 4 , 5. in the last dayes perillous times should come : when men should be Selfe-lovers , covetous , boastors , proud , blasphemers , unholy , without naturall affection , implacable , covenant-breakers , false , accusers , incontinent , fierce , despisers of them that are good , Traitors , heady , high-minded , lovers of pleasures , more then lovers of God , Having a forme of Godlinesse , but denying the power thereof ; with many other like things ; which when they come to compare with the State of the present times , and especially of the present Church , and chiefly of the Prelates themselves , and shall find most of these Prophecies fulfilled in these present times , they will certainly hereupon conclude , that these be those last dayes , and perillous times wherin these things , so long agoe foretold , doe clearely shew , that certainly the Scriptures are the word of God .

The next thing I note here is , that you Say , a man so probably led , must compare the Scripture with it selfe , and other writings . What other writings , I pray you , shall he compare the Scriptures with ? Shall humane writings light him a Candle to shew him the Sun shining at noon day ? But thus humane testimony comes in for a Second Inducer . And for all your previous inducement , you must still at last joyne some thing of man with Scripture .

Well , what 's the third ? Ordinary Grace . And this with the Authority of the present Church may beget in a man an ordinary beliefe , that Scripture is the word of God . As it seemes such ordinary Grace brought King * * Act 26.28 ▪ Agrippa to beleeve the Prophets to be the word of God : yet for all that he was but almost perswaded to become a Christian. And this Ordinary Grace is ( it seems ) that Holy Ghost , which you told us of before .

The Fourth is morall inducement . Well , admit this bring him to a morall beliefe or opinion . The Fifth is a reasonable perswasion by the voyce of the Church . Well , what the● ? After all this , the Scripture gives greater and higher reasons of Credibility to it selfe , then Tradition alone could give . Here 's then the upshot of all ( as we noted before ) you by these steps advance the Scripture to a Credibility . So as all this while , you have walkt the round , and gone in a Circle , and end just where you began ; for you began at Probability , and end in Credibility ; whereas the Scriptures were credible at least , that is such as might be beleeved ; before you taught this new way to come to the beliefe of them . So as this your Conclusion comes to just nothing . Only you seem to attribute some thing to the Scripture , being assisted with those other inducements , wherein it surpasseth your Tradition alone . Which is such a comparison and commendation , as you could not devise the like , to abase the Credit of the Scripture . But to conclude : What a Tedious Dispute you make here with the Jesuite about that , which ( when you have done all you can ) will never bring a man upon any sure grounds so much as to beleeve , that the Scripture is the word of God : much lesse to bring him to Saving faith in Christ . But what doe I speake of Saving faith ? Alas , that 's no worke for your pen. You are for a Scholasticall Dispute here , which is so jejune , and barren , that many Scholasticks would hisse it out of their Schooles , much more Divines out of the Divinity Schooles , as indeed nothing pertaining to true Divinity , but to a * * Col. 2.8 . Spoyling through Philosophy and vaine deceit , as the Apostle Speakes . But the summe of all your inducements ( the Prime whereof must necessarily be your present Churches Authority ) amounts to this : That men being by a bond of necessity tyed to this your Church as without which he cannot come to beleeve Scripture to be Gods word : and without this beliefe , no faith of Salvation : and your Tradition with all other helps cannot bring a man to that beliefe , when all is done : the Conclusion is , that according to your Tradition no man can come to be Saved . So as thus by this your new Doctrines you overturne the Foundation of Faith by the very roots , leaving no footing for faith to stand upon , whereby a man may have any hope of Salvation .

But I shew'd you before , a short and sure way for a man to come to this beliefe , and not onely so farre , as to beleeve the Scripture to be the word of God , but to beleeve , that he hath his part of Salvation in that word . And this way is , by hearing the word of God preached . For ‡ ‡ Rom. 10. Faith comes by hearing , and hearing by the word of God . And this faith being the Saving faith in Christ , as it apprehends all the Promises of God in the Scripture to be true , and to belong to him , so it comprehends the beliefe of Scripture to be the word of God . And this , this word of God preached and heard , is that voyce of the Church of Christ , or rather Christs owne voyce in the Church , calling men , yea and instrumentally causing , Gods Spirit effectually working in and by the word , to beleeve unto righteousnesse , and to confesse to Salvation , whatsoever is written in the Scripture to be most true , as being the word of God himselfe . And besides this true Christians in all ages , never beleeved and Authority , Tradition , voyce of men simply to be any necessary prime inducement to beleeve so much , as the Scriptures to be the word of God .

L. p. 84. That divine light , which the Scripture , no question , hath in it self , is not kindled , till these helps come . Thy word is a Light . So David . A Light ? Therefore it is as much a manifestation to it selfe , as to other things , which it shewes , but still , not till the Candle be lighted : not till there hath been a preparing instruction , Prelates Blaspheming of Scripture all along , and exalting his Present Churches Authority above it . what light it is , till Tradition of the Church , and Gods grace put to it , have cleared his understanding : So Tradition of the present Church , is the first morall motive to beleeve .

P. These words confirme your former , with a little illustration . A divine Light here you confesse to be in the Scripture . But you meane some dimme Light . At the best , not bright enough , not sufficient to shew it selfe to be the word of God . And here , That Light , whatever it is , is not kindled , till these helps come . 'T is but a kind of Light potentially in the Scripture , as fire in the flint , which must be struck out with the steele . Nay you compare it but to the light of a Candle ; and yet not all that neither : for the Candle must first be lighted . The Scripture then of it selfe is but as a Candle in the box , of 12 in the pound , as you Say ibid. which hath no Light , till it be lighted . And Tradition of your present Church must light the Candle . And surely , then may not the Tradition of your present Church put out the light of this Candle again , after you have lighted it ? As the Pope crowned the Emperour with his feet , and then struck the Crown off again with his foot , to teach the Emperour , that his Crown was at his Holinesse Devotion to dispose of as he pleased . So may you do with the Scripture , light the Candle , and put it out again . Prelate lighting the Scripture ▪ and puting out the Candle . As you have don with the Doctrines of Grace , with the Sabbath , or Lords day , with preaching , and the like . And Thy word is a light : So David . But not , So you . For David Said , Thy word is a lampe unto my feet , and a light unto my pathes . So say not you . You like not ( it seems ) such a lampe and light to your wayes . For wayes you leave out , as the Devil did , when he recited that Scripture , Psal. 91.11 . He shall keep thee : but he left out , In all thy wayes : as Luk. 4.10 . And you could never have the hap hitherto to cite Scripture right . And no marvaile if you be out of your way , when you come to the Scripture , seeing you can find no light in it to give you sufficient direction . But you Adde : A Light ? Therefore it is as much a manifestation to it selfe , as to other things . Even just as much as if you had Said , A blind man seeth as much in the darke , as in the day . So 't is here with the Scripture , for the light you allow it . And what 's that ? But none still , no light , till the Candle be lighted . 'T is just so then , as I say . I guest your meaning right . But you adde : Not till there hath been a preparing Instruction , what light it is , till the Tradition of the Church and Gods grace put to it , hath cleared his understanding . How ? I am here at a losse , except you helpe me out , and cleare the understanding of your words . For before , you must have the Candle first lighted : and here , you seem to grant some light , when 't is once discovered to be a preparing instruction what light it is . I pray you my Lord deale plainly with us . Speake out . Hath the Scripture a light in it , or no , before the preparing instruction hath shewed what light it is ? For to shew , what light it is , doth necessarily presuppose that there is a Light . And if there be a Light , how is it true , that you Say , Not till it be lighted by Tradition of the Church ? Must Tradition doe all , both light the Candle , and also shew what light it is ? Or doth Tradition with the same act of lighting the Candle , shew also what light it is ? If so , then I begin through this darke lanterne of yours to discerne what light the Scripture hath : namely a borrowed light , lent it by Tradition . For you say , The Candle is not lighted , till Tradition light it . Or if I be out , 't is for want of Cleare Light from your darke Lanthorne . But here followes a worse perplexity . For from the lighting the Candle of Scripture by Tradition , you come to the lighting of another Candle , namely the Clearing of the naturall mans understanding by the Tradition of the Church , and Gods grace put to it . 'T was well you put Gods grace to it . For if the Tradition of your present Church have but Gods grace put to it , it may worke wonders . But stay . Cannot your Churches Tradition or Authority , doe the deed without Gods grace ; at least doe its office of the fore-horse , as the necessary prime leader ? Or is your Churches Tradition some jade , that puts all the brunt upon the next horse that follows ? Then you should rather give Gods Grace the Precedencie . But now I remember , this Grace of God is but an ordinary Grace , as you told us before , which at the most worketh but an ordinary morall and probable beliefe , that Scripture is the word of God , but not certaine and evident : So as the naturall mans undestanding being but thus farre cleared to have a probable opinion of Scripture to be Gods word , except you can bring him to beleeve in Christ , and forsake his sins , his opinion will but aggravate his condemnation so much the more . But what evidence can you shew us , that your Church Tradition is certainly seconded with so much ordinary Grace ? For if your Tradition be derogatory from the Credit of the Scripture , you cannot hope for the least degree of ordinary Grace to give it either assistance , or attendance . It behoves you therefore to prove , that this your Authority in this point is from God , is Gods ordinance : and if so , you may then easily perswade us , that Gods grace will accompany his owne Ordinance . But this you will hardly prove . But will Say , Traditions are Traditions , and therefore not to be proved from Scripture : and this Church-Tradition is that , which the Scripture must be proved and tryed by . And so here upon belike it is , that you conclude : So Tradition of the present Church is the first morall motive to beleeve . The Conclusion might serve the turne well enough , if you had but good logicall or rationall Premises to bring it in , better then yet you bring , for the inducing of beliefe , That Scripture is the word of God .

L. ibid. So after Tradition of the present Church hath taught and informed the Soule , More and more Blasphemy of the Prelate , ascribing that to his Tradition , which is onely proper to the word and Spirit of Christ . the voyce of God is plainly heard in the Scripture it selfe . And then here 's double Authority , and both Divine , that confirmes Scripture to be the word of God , Tradition of the Apostles delivering it , and the internall worth and argument in the Scripture , obvious to a Soule prepared by the present Churches Tradition , and Gods Grace .

P. The more you speake , the more we come to Sound the depth of your meaning . You told us before of the present Churches Tradition , and Gods Grace put to it , by which the naturall mans understanding is first cleared . And here Tradition of the present Church alone doth the deed : for you say , After Tradition of the present Church hath taught and informed the Soule , then , the voyce of God is plainly heard in the Scripture it selfe . Surely my mind gave me all this while , that although for fashion sake , and for a colour you named the grace of God in the second place after your Tradition , yet your principall ayme was to advance the Credit of your Church-Authority , as that alone , which does the deed . This , this is it , that cleares the naturall mans understanding ; this it , that teacheth and informeth the Soule ( Tradition I say of the present Church ) before the voyce of God is plainly heard in the Scripture it selfe . As if you had Said , The Tradition of the present Church does all , it openeth the blind eyes of the naturall mans understanding to see , and the deafe eares of his Soule to heare : for after it hath cleared his understanding , and taught and informed the Soule , then the voyce of GOD is plainly heard in the Scripture it selfe .

And besides you tell us here , that after Tradition of your present Church hath taught and informed the Soule , the voyce of GOD is plainly heard in the Scripture . Ergo not till then . Ergo your Tradition opens the eares of the deafe . And then there 's double testimony , and both Divine . What ? Tradition of the Apostles delivering it . You meane surely , the divine Tradition of your present Church , one of your obstruse Apostolick Traditions . Otherwise , what doth the mention of the Apostles Tradition in this place ? And thus you acquaint us with the whole Mystery of your new Divinity . New , I call it , because it is contrary to the old . For the old is ( which is not yet antiquated ) * * Psal. 19·8 . The Commandement of the Lord , ( that is the word of God ) is pure , inlightening the eyes . And vers. 7. The Law of the Lord is perfect , converting the Soule : the testimony of the Lord 〈◊〉 sure , making wise the simple . And Psal. 119.30 . ( mentioned before ) The entrance of thy words giveth light , it giveth understanding unto the simple . Now who is the blind and simple , but the naturall man , before his Conversion and Regeneration ? And what is that , which inlightens his eyes , and cleares his understanding ? Gods word . For , The entrance of thy words giveth light , it giveth understanding unto the Simple . The light of Gods word going forth in the Ministry of it , is the first that makes entrance into the Soule . Now doth not your Lordship grant all this ? Yes , you cannot but confesse it : but alwayes provided , that it is ever understood , the Tradition of the present Church must prepare the way first : that must first cleare the naturall mans blind eyes of his understanding ; that must first teach and informe his Soule , before Gods word can inlighten his eyes , and give understanding to the Simple . But do you consider what you Say ? The Scripture ( you must needs confesse , you cannot deny ) inlightneth the eyes . Well , but you Say againe , your Tradition must first cleare the understanding , and light the Candle of Scripture . Now to cleare the understanding , is to open the eyes . How then can Gods word be said to open and enlighten the eyes , when they are cleared before ? Or how can it give understanding to the simple , when the Soule is taught and informed before ? The Tradition of the present Church prevents all , and saves the word that labour . Unlesse you will say , The Tradition of the present Church is a preparing instruction to the opening of the eyes by the Scripture , as the * * Iohn 9 ▪ anoynting of the blind mans eyes with clay went before his washing in the poole of Siloam , whereupon he received his sight . Indeed your Church-Tradition in this Case might well be compared to the daubing of a naturall mans blind eyes with Clay , to confirme him in his blindnesse , that he shall never see , so long as he depends upon the necessity of your present Church-Tradition as a preparing instruction to cleare his understanding , and to teach and informe his soule , as without which he shall never come to have his eyes inlightned by the word of God . So as in very truth this Tradition , Authority , voyce of the present Church , which you every where so plead for , and presse , as a necessary previous inducer , A Doctrine of damnable Blasphemy . yea clearer of the naturall mans understanding , and teacher and informer of his Soule , before he can plainly heare the voyce of God in the Scripture it selfe , is a Doctrine of Damnable Blasphemy against Christ , and his holy word . For this clearing of the naturall mans understanding , this inlightning of the blind eyes of his mind , this teaching and informing his Soule , is both the proper and prime act of Christ , of his Spirit , and of his word , working together . Of the words inlightning David hath sufficiently informed us before . And Christ sends us to the ‡ ‡ Ioh. 5.39 . Scriptures for search ( and not to any Church Tradition ) as bearing witnesse of Christ , and so directing us to him for eternall life . And Saith Christ , † † Ioh. 6.44 ▪ 45 No man can come to me , except the Father , which sent me , draw him : and I will rayse him up at the last day . As it is written in the Prophets . And they shall be all taught of God ▪ Every man therefore that hath heard , and hath learned of the Father , cometh to me . Heard ? What ? The Tradition of the present Church ? No , the preaching of Gods word , which is Gods owne voyce ( as we said before ) this voyce in the eare , being accompanied with Gods learning and teaching within ( as § § August . in Iohan ▪ & alibi . Act. 16.14 . Augustine hereupon well notes ) is that , which brings us unto Christ , Thus the Lord opened the heart of Lydia , that she attended to the things which were spoken of Paul . It was not the Tradition of the present Church , but as she was hearing the word , the Lord opened her heart , both to attend , and to beleeve Pauls Doctrin● . And Luke 24.45 . Then opened he their understandings , that they might understand the Scriptures . Away then with your Blasphemous Romish Doctrine of Tradition of your present Church , from having any thing to doe in this divine businesse , wherein onely God , and Christ , and the Holy Ghost , and the voyce of God in the Ministry of his Word , have the whole and sole worke in opening both the eyes and eares of mans Soule to see and heare the wondrous things of Gods Law contained in the Scriptures . As David Saith , * * Ps. 119.18 . Open thou mine eyes , that I may behold wondrous things out of thy Law .

But you adde : And then here 's double Authority , and both Divine , that confirmes Scripture to be the word of God , Tradition of the Apostles delivering it , and the internall worth , and argument in the Scripture , obvious to a Soule prepared by the present Churches Tradition , and Gods Grace . And. Then. Sill : Then , and not before , all goes currant : Worth in Scripture comes in with their double Divine Authority . Then , when the Soule is prepared ( as before ) with the present Churches Tradition . Els , all the fat is in the fire : Nor Apostles Tradition , Nor worth in Scripture , are worth a rush in this matter . And thus all must depend upon your present Churches Tradition Still . But here you bring in againe , Gods Grace , as a Second to your Tradition . But I told you before , and tell you againe , that your present Churches Tradition hath nothing to doe with Gods Grace , nor with any Grace of God , not with common and ordinary Grace , Gods Grace is a concomitant and Assistant unto his owne Ordinance . But for the Authority and Tradition of the present Church to be a necessary inducer to the beliefe of Scripture , by clearing a naturall mans understanding , and teaching and informing his Soule is none of Gods ordinance , but an Antichristian Romish presumption , and therefore hath no promise of , and so no title to Gods Grace , either to accompany or assist it . When Christ tooke his Farewell of the Apostles , he left his Commission with them for the Ministry of his Word , and Sacraments , and thereupon gave a Promise of his continuall assisting grace to them , and to all his faithfull true Ministers of his Word successively to the end of the world : ‡ ‡ Mat. 28.19 , 20. Goe , Saith he , and teach all nations , baptizing them , &c. teaching them to observe all things , whatsoever I have commanded you : And Loe , I am with you alway , even unto the end of the world . Now 't is plaine ( as is both shewed before , and will yet more ) that your present Church being Prelaticall , and Hierarchicall , is a false and Antichristian Church , a Church of Priests of a strange Order , not of Christs institution , nor your Government of Christs ordinance , and so your Church is of no Auhority : nor doe you faithfully and truely preach the Word , and administer the Sacraments , but with the mixture of your owne Superstitious devises , nor doe you teach men to observe all things , whatsoever Christ commanded in his word , and hath left written in the Scripture : but on the contrary , you suppresse the preaching of his word , and oppresse his faithfull Ministers , and by publick Authority assumed , make voyd Christs eternall Law ( as before . ) So as Gods people have cause to take up that complaint and prayer of David , It is time for thee , Lord , to worke : for they have made voyd thy Law : And therefore , that promise of Christ to his Apostles and true Ministers of the Gospell , pertaines not to you , and so not to any of your usurped Authority , and pretended Tradition of your present Church .

But you proceed : L. p. 85. After the morall perswasion , reason , and force of the present Church , there is ground enough to move any reasonable man , that it is fit he should read the Scripture , and esteeme very reverently and highly of it . And this once done , the Scripture hath then In , and home Arguments enough , to put a soule that hath but ordinary Grace out of doubt , that the Scripture is the word of God , infallible and Divine .

P. The same man Still . But what if , as with the Church of Rome and the Jesuites your present Church of England doth hold this Paradox , so She should take up Romes practise , and by your Authority forbid all men the reading of the Scriptures , but such onely , as shal be thought fit to be dispensed withall to read it ? We know not what you may doe , if once you can obtain voyces in Convocation ( as what may not you doe ) to make this your bare assertion , and Antichristian opinion an Irrefragable Canon of the present Church of England , That men ought not to presume to read the Scriptures , till the Authority of the present Church hath made way , and her Tradition cleared their understanding , and taught and informed their Soules , and thereupon very reverently and highly esteeme of it . For this is the Cleare Summe of your words here : No reading of the Scriptures , no esteeming highly and reverently of it , no In , and home Arguments enough to pu● a soule out of doubt , that Scripture is the word of God , Infallible and Divine : So as till he be perswaded hereof , 't is but vaine and frivolous for a man to read the Scriptures : and this perswasion he cannot have , till after the morall perswasion , reason , and force of the present Church . And here I note again , how you put the Tradition of your present Church single and alone , forgetting to Second it with Gods Grace : which doth but confirme what I said before , that Gods Grace , Ordinary Grace , when you doe mention it , it is but when you stumble upon it , and it stands but for a Stale ; it is your Tradition , and Authority of the present Church that is all in all . But you proceed .

L. p. 85 , 86. Thirdly , you ( to wit , A. C. ) pretend that we make the Scripture absolutely and fully knowne Lumine suo , A subtile and sly evasion of the Prelate from the Iesuite , who objecteth truly . by the light and testimony which it hath in , and giveth to it selfe , &c. We doe not Say , that there is such a full light in Scripture , as that every man upon the first sight , must yeeld to it , The Question is onely of such a light in Scripture as is of force to breed Faith , not to make a perfect knowledge .

P. The pretence of A. C. herein , was not without just cause ; onely he considered not what the present Church of England now , under your Primacy , doth hold . So as you should or might have shaped your Answere thus : A. C. Distingue tempora : Distinguish the times . Know you not who sits now in the Chaire of Canterbury ? True it is , that formerly the Church of England , or rather some private men , all or most of the Divines thereof that have written of this Subject , allthough very learned ( I confesse ) and of great note , place and ranke in the Church in their time , held and writ so against you : but that was onely their private opinion , though all their Bookes were published by Authority . But what 's all this to the Church of England now ? Now you may heare , and understand by me , who am the voyce of the present Church of England , that it is otherwise . And what you doe pretend , I doe thus interpret : We doe not Say , &c. But what doe you not Say ? We doe not Say that there is such a full light in Scripture , as that every man upon the first sight must yeeld to it . How ? So perhaps not any hath Said . Yet this all our Orthodox Divines before you have said , That there is such a full light in Scripture , as that every man by the thorow and serious reading over of the Scripture , hath sufficient evidence therein to convince him , as to yeeld it to be the very word of God . And if he doe not therupon yeeld , the defect is not in the Scripture , but in himself . A miserable Shift . But at first sight ? This is a miserable shift , and poore put off , to answere fully to the Jesuites pretence , or rather true assertion . For in this he saith true , that we ( to wit , all the Orthodox Divines of the Church of England as aforesaid ) do hold the Scripture absolutely and fully to be known lumine suo , by the light and testimony which it hath in , and gives to it self . Only we do not make it so ( as you expresse the Jesuite ) but we find , know , and beleeve it to be so . But they never said , At first sight , This is your owne Flam. But what our ●ormer Divines have written hereof , they have with such Arguments confirmed , as not you with all your Divines of note and worth , of which you patch up your present Church of England , are able to Answere , oudè gru , not one word or Syllable .

But come we to the Question as you State it . The Question is ( say you ) onely of such a light in Scripture , as is of force to breed faith , not to make a perfect knowledge . And what 's your resolution of this Question of your own Stating ? Do you yeeld thus much , that there is in the Scripture such a light , as is of force to breed faith ? Nay , you have already again and again , and I know not how often expresly and flatly denyed , that there is in Scripture so much light , as of it self hath force to breed so much faith , as to beleeve it to be the word of God . And this was all the Question with you but even now . But how comes in this Negative , Not to make a perfect knowledge ? The Question was not all this while , whether the Scripture had so full a light in it , as to make a perfect knowledge . But seeing you took this in , to cast a myst before mens eyes , that they may not so easily discern your * * A pretty jugling tricke of Legerdemain . jugling trick in answering A.C. and yet keeping your credit , as if you herein maintained no other thing , then what they Divines of the Church of England have held , that which you say the Jesuite pretends : I will answere this too : That all Orthodox Divines do hold ( and that according to the Scripture ) that there is in it such a full and cleare light , as to make a perfect knowledge . For First , there is a knowledge perfect : and 2 ly we have no other Schoolmaster to teach it , but the Scripture : and 3 ly this perfect knowledge is required of Christians : ‡ ‡ 1 Cor. 14 20. Be not children in understanding ( saith the Apostle ) but in understanding be men . So the English hath it . But the Originall is tais dè phresì téleio gínesthe . In understanding , or wisdome be ye perfect . So , Heb. 6.1 . Wherfore leaving the Principles of the Doctrine of Christ , let us be caried on to perfection . That is , to perfection of Knowledge in the mystery of Christ . Now this knowledge is no where , but in the Scripture , and so this perfection no way to be attained unto , but by the Scripture , as the onely rule and meanes thereof . So the Apostle to Timothy saith , ‡ ‡ 2 Tim. 3.15 , 16. From a child thou hast known the holy Scriptures , which are able to make thee wise unto Salvation through faith which is in Christ Iesus . All Scripture is given by inspiration of God , and is profitable for doctrine , for reproof , for correction , for instruction in righteousnes , that the man of God may be perfect , thorowly furnished unto all good works . So as Tertullian might well say , Adoro plenitudinem Scripturarum , I adore , or admire the fullnesse of the Scriptures . It is a Fountaine , yea an Ocean of Knowledge . And if we cannot attaine to that full perfection of Knowledge in this life , which is to be found in the Scripture , it is defectus vasis , non fontis : the defect is in the vessell , mans soule , ( For * * 1 Cor. 13. we know but in part , and we prophecy in part , saith the Apostle ) and not in the fountaine , the Holy Scripture , which is like Iacobs Well , full of Water , but deep ▪ so as every one hath not such a lage vessell , and long line , as can draw forth a full measure of knowldge out of it ; yet he may draw for a plenitude or fullnesse of the vessell , according to its quantity , and the ‡ ‡ Rom. 12.6 . proportion of Faith given to every man ; yet not so exactly full , by reason of our infirmity , and in-capacity of our vessell , which is partly of a leaking condition , plenus rimarum , as he said , full of cracks , and a great deale we lose in the very drawing of it up , as a bucket doth of water , before it come to the toppe . So as the defect is not in the Well , wherein it was , but now over head and eares ( as we Say ) under water , and fuller then it could hold : but in the bucket in bringing it up , or containing and retaining of it .

L. p. 87. Faiths evidence is not so cleare , for it is of things not seen ( Heb. 11.1 . ) in regard of the object ; and in regard of the subject that sees , it is in ‡ ‡ Prelate perverts the sense of Scripture , conf●●●ding the Regenerate with the Vnregenerate , and Saints Faith with Historicall . enigmate in a glasse , or darke speaking . Now God doth not require a full demonstrative knowledge in us , that the Scripture is his word : and therefore in his Providence hath kindled in it no light for that , but he requires our faith of it , and such a certaine demonstration , as may fit that . And for that he hath left sufficient light in Scripture to Reason , and Grace meeting , when the Soule is morally prepared by the Tradition of the Church .

P. Speaking Still of that Faith , whereby a man beleeves the Scripture to be the word of God , which Faith is Historicall : here you confound it with the Saving justifying Faith , just as the Papists doe . For as † † Andreas Vega . Bellarmine , and others . they , so you here alledge for your faiths unclean evidence , Heb. 11.1 . where the Apostle describes Faith thus : Faith is the substance of things hoped for , the evidence of things not seen . By which very description , it is cleare and evident , that he speakes not of that Historicall Faith of Scripture , common to all men : but of the Saving Faith peculiar to Gods Elect ; Tit. 1.1 . and given to the Saints . Jude 3. which notwithstanding comprehends in it , the Historicall Faith of Scripture to be the word of God , and that in a higher degree and measure , then any Reprobate can have ; even as the Rationall Soule of man being it comprehends in it the Sensitive faculty in a more excellent manner , then it is in the bruit beasts , and the Vegetative faculty in a more excellent manner , then it is in the plants ; because as the sensitive and vegetative qualities of the soule of man being comprehended under the Rationalls , are subjected to the rule and command of Reason , and so doe participate in some kind of the very nature of the Rationall faculty ; man being both moving , and seeing , and hearing , and smelling , and tasting , and touching , not as a bruit beast , but as a Reasonable creature . So Historicall Faith , being comprehended under the Saving and Justifying Faith in a true beleever , it is in him more excellent , and advanced to a higher pitch of perfection , then it is , or can be , in a naturall man ; so as it participates so farre of that plerophoría tes písteoes , that full assurance of Saving Faith , as that it not onely apprehends and beleeves the Scripture to be the word of God , but doth beleeve it so certainly and firmly , and with such an affiance and affection , as that the Beleever will rather dye then for the terrours of death it selfe be brought to deny this truth . And what is this ( trow you ) but a full and certaine demonstrative knowledge , that perswades him to this ? But for This Historicall Faith , in a meere naturall man , or one unregenerate , though he be sufficiently convinced in his Conscience , that the Scripture is the word of God , yet he hath neither so much affiance in it , nor affection to it , as that he wil be content to loose life and all ( if need be ) for the maintenance of this truth . This full Demonstration he wants .

But for that Faith which the Apostle speakes of and describes ( Heb. 11.1 . ) which you make to be your Historicall Faith , and the evidence of it in regard of the objest , not so cleare , as being of things not seene : it is requisite here a little to consider the Apostles words . First , Faith ( saith he ) is e'lpizomenon vpostasis , the substance , or subsistence , or confidence ( at the Apostle useth the word * * 2 Cor. 11.17 . elswhere ) of things hoped for . And as some well expound it , such a Faith , as causeth the things hoped for so to subsist in our hearts , not onely in a sure expectation , but also in a degree of possession and fruition , as if they were present with us . And this object , of things hoped for , argues plainly , that this Faith is not your Historicall Faith , to beleeve simply that the Scripture is the word of God : but the true , lively , and Saving Faith , which hath not onely for its common object , the Scripture , but for its more proper and peculiar object , Christ , and the Promises of God in him contained in the Scriptures , which are those things hoped for , , here . Whereas your Historicall Faith , as that of the Papists ( as both Vega and others affirme ) looks onely to the common object , the Scriptures , but not specially on the Promises therein contained . This ( I say ) is the proper worke , and object that Saving Faith doth chiefly exercise it selfe upon . Faith is the substance of things hoped for . Secondly , it is pragmaton elegkos , ou blepoménon , the evidence , or Demonstration of things not seen : Which things not seen are also the proper object of Saving Faith , wherof it is the evidence . And those are * * 2 Cor. 4.18 . See also 1 Cor. 2.9 . & 1 Pet. 1.8 . eternall things in heaven , as the Apostle sheweth : The things which are not seen , are eternall . So Rom. 8.25 . If we hope for that which we see not , then doe we with patience abide for it . But now your meere Historicall Faith , which beleeves in generall , that the Scripture is the word of God , looks no farther , then things that are seen . But for the Faith which is the evidence of things not seen : is the evedence of it , therefore not so cleare , because it is of things not seen ? Surely had you such an evidence of thos● things not seen , as Faith is , you would not goe on thus blindly in speaking of divine things , which ( it appeares ) are ‡ ‡ Psal. 10.5 . farre above out of your sight . Is Faith the evidence of things not seen : and therefore not of so cleare evidence in regard of the Octject ? Nay certainly , being an evidence of things not seen , it argues the quick and piercing cleare eye of faith , whereby it so clearely seeth things not seen , as it is a cleare evidence of them . As Chrysostome upon these words commenteth : poía lèxis , saith he ? What a speech or expression is this ? elegkos , an evidence ? Whereupon he Saith , That faith is a farre clearer and surer evidence of things not seen , then the eye is of a visible object before it . And you have here forgotten what you writ but in the next page before , † † pag. 86. That beliefe is firmer , then any knowledge can be . Which it seemes you mean , as the Papists doe , who to elude certainty of faith , doe say , That Faith is certain , ratione objecti , in respect of the Object , the Scripture , but not ratione Subjecti , of the Beleever himselfe . Otherwise how doe you say , here , that Faiths evidence is not so cleare as being of things not seen ? But I conceive the reason to be because you beleeve no further , then you see . So as what things you doe not see with your bodily eye , you have not any such cleare evidence of by your faith , as if they were present before your Eyes . Thus you may see , ( could you see ) what all your Faith comes to . But that faith whereof the Apostle there speakes , and elswhere , hath an eye , more piercing , then the eye of an Eagle . For by this faith , as by a most cleare Perspective , we so see things afarre off , eve● in the highest heavens , as if they were present before us . Thus the beleeving Saints in the Old Testament , by the eye of this same Faith ( illustrated by so many examples in the same Chapter ) did * * Heb. 11 . 1● . See the promises afarre off , and were perswaded of them , ●nd imbraced them . ‡ ‡ v. 27. By this ●aith Moses forsook Aegypt , not fearing the wrath of the King , for he indured , as seeing him that is invisible . And by this Faith , ‡ ‡ Ioh. 8.56 . Abraham , though afarre off , saw Christs day , and rejoyced . As § § Act. 7.56 . Stephen at his stoning , saw Iesus Christ standing at the right hand of God . This you will Say , was with the eyes of his body miraculously . 'T is true . But I will Say again , Stephen with his bodily eyes at that time saw not Christ more certainly , nor more clearely then a true beleever by the eye of his faith sees him standing at the right hand of God , as a mighty Saviour , Advocate , Judge , Protector , Avenger of his People , when so used as Stephen was , So as the faith of all true beleevers being one and the Same , it fully agreeth with that Difinition of the Apostle , Faith is the Substance of things hoped for , the Evidence of things not seen : therefore it hath an eye that sees those things not seen more clearely , then I dare say your Lordships eye seeth , when you look upon the Kings Countenance Smiling upon you . For you think you see now clearely the object before you : when indeed you see it not clearely , but through a false glasse of your imagination , as apprehending your chiefe happinesse to consist in that Object , the Kings favour , which may easily be overclowded . Whereas God saith † † Ier. 17. ● . Cursed be the man , that trusteth in man , and maketh flesh his arme , and whose heart departeth from the Lord . For though he may flourish for a time , yet he shal be like the Heath in the Desert , and shall not see when good cometh .

Againe , this Faith of yours ( Say you ) is not of such cleare evidence in regard of the Subject that sees , it is in enigmate , or darke speaking . We shewed but now , how this Historicall Faith is different , according to the Subject , in which it is , in the Reprobate , or in the Elect beleever . For in the true beleever being comprehended under the Saving Faith , it is so much both the more cleare and infallible , in beleeving the Scripture to be the word of God , as wherein all along he finds Christ * * 2 Cor. 1.20 ▪ in whom all the Promises ( wherwith as so many Sweet Roses , that Garden is set , and strowed , or as so many Starres shining in that Firmament ) are yea and Amen to the glory of God the Father . And thus to every true beleever the Scripture is the sure word of God , and more especially sure to him in all the Promises of it . Thus Davids Faith tells him : * * Psal. 19.7 . & 93.5 . The Testimony of the Lord is sure . Thy Testimonies are very sure . ‡ ‡ Psal. All his Commandements are sure . So Esay ‡ ‡ Esay . 55.3 . The sure mercies of David . Thus the Apostles were sure : § § Iohn 6.69 . Act. 13.34 . We beleeve and are sure , &c. Now are we sure , &c. And Paul , † † Rom. 4.16 . It is of Faith , by Grace , that the Promise might be sure to all the seed . And Peter , * * 2 Pet. 1.19 . We have a most sure word of Prophesie . Thus the whole word of God , with the Promises therein , are sure to a true beleever , both as being of God , and belonging to all the faithfull . As the Apostle Saith , ‡ ‡ Rom. 15.4 . Whatsoever things were written aforetime were written for our learning , that we through patience and comfort of the Scriptures might have hope . But on the other side , this beliefe , that the Scripture is the word of God , being in a Reprobate , or wicked man , the stronger it is in a perswasion and conviction , that it is Gods word , and so a word of truth , the greater terrour it strikes into him , when he considers of those fearefull judgements , punishments , and torments of hell therein denounced against all impenitent persons . As ‡ ‡ Act. 24.25 . Felix trembled , when he heard Paul reasoning of judgement to come . And § § Act. 26.28 . Agrippa said to Paul , en olígo , somewhat , or almost thou perswadest me to be a Christian : when Paul had said unto him , † † vers. 27. Beleevest thou the Prophets ? I know that thou beleevest . So that a wicked man may be throwly convinced in his Conscience , that the Scripture is the word of God , he may certainly be perswaded of it , and that hoes en horámati , as a thing visibly before him , and he apprehends it as too true . But that place of the Apostle , * * Scripture perverted by the Prelate ▪ as pag. 134. We see here dì ainìgmatos , as through a darke Saying , it is not to be applyed to this Faith that is in a wicked man . For the Apostle there speakes of true beleevers . ‡ ‡ 1 Cor. 13.12 We ( Saith he ) now doe see through a glasse darkly , but then face to face : now I know in part , but then shall I know , even as also I am known . So as there he speakes of the estate of the godly here , comparatively to their estate of glory hereafter : and that , concerning their knowledge and spirituall vision of God here , and hereafter . Here we doe with Moses see but ‡ ‡ Exod. 33. Gods back parts , in comparison to that we shall see , when we shall see him face to face : here we know him at the best but imperfectly : but then we shall know even as we are knowne , in full perfection . And yet so great and glorious is our knowledge of God in the State of Grace , that the Apostle saith , § § 2 Cor. 3.18 . We all with open face beholding as in a glasse , the glory of the Lord , are changed into the same Image from glory to glory , even as by the spirit of the Lord . So glorious is the Image of Christ , in every new-Creature , or regenerate man , had men but eyes to see it . But this by the way . On the other side againe , as some naturall and morall men may have a certaine evidence of an Historicall Faith thus farre , that the Scripture is the word of God , and so he trembleth at it : So others again , and such as think themselves great Clerks and glorious Priests may perhaps see but en skotómati , blindly in a brainsick miorim , or giddinesse , so as their head swimming with w●imses , the eyes of their understanding being darkened , or rather blinded with the god of this world , they imagine the world goes round with them , and while they so much dispute of the Authority of the present Church , in clearing a mans understanding to beleeve the Scripture to be the word of God , the conclusion is , that they can bring never a good Evidence to prove , that themselves have any faith at all .

You goe on , and Say , Blasphemy against God in his Providence . Now God doth not require a full demonstrative knowledge in us , that the Scripture is his word : and therefore in his Providence hath kindled in it no light for that , but he requires our faith of it , and such a certaine demonstration , as may fit that . * * Iob. 16.3 . When shall vaine words have an end , as Iob Speaks ? § § Iob. 19.3 . You have reproched the Scripture these 10 times , and therein blasphemed God , and are not ashamed , as he Speaks in another Case . God doth not require ( Say you ) a full demonstrative knowledge in us , that the Scripture is his word . No ? Doth he not ? But he requireth such a faith in us , which hath in it a full demonstration of knowledge . For such is Saving Faith , whereof we formerly Spake , it is a demonstration of things not seen , it is a plerophoría , a full assurance . Now whereon is this faith grounded ? Is it not grounded upon the Scripture ? And if this full demonstration of faith be grounded on the Scripture : is there not such a full demonstrative knowledge in the Scripture ? For alwayes the Foundation must have a full latitude , and depth , proportionable to beare up the building , which is layd upon it . Faith then being a full demonstration , and the Scripture being the foundation of it , the Scripture then must have in it a full demonstrative knowledge : and if such a full demonstrative knowledge be in the Scripture , God requires in us also such a full demonstrative knowledge , as is sutable to that full demonstration of Faith . As the Apostle saith , ‡ ‡ 2 Tim. 1.12 . I know whom I have beleeved . And our Saviour joynes knowledge and faith together , saying , § § I●h . 10 . 38· That ye may know and beleeve . And so the Apostle , speaking of beleevers , saith , † † 1 Tim. 4 3· Which beleeve and know the truth . And that which in other places is attributed to faith , is ( Ioh. 13.3 ) attributed to knowledge : This is life eternall , that they may know thee , the onely true God , and Iesus Christ whom ●hou hast sent . And the act of beleeving is typed out by an act of the eye in seeing , to shew , that beleeving is a seeing and knowing . As Joh. 3.14 , 15. As Moses lifted up the Serpent in the wildernesse : even so must the Sonne of Man be lifted up , that whosoever beleeveth in him , should not perish , but have eternall life . Where beleeving in Christ lifted up upon his Crosse , hath relation to those in the wildernesse , who being stung with the fiery Serpents , looked up upon the brazen Serpent upon the Pole , which Moses by Gods appointment lifted up , and looking upon it , they lived . There being then such an affinity , or rather unity , or union between Faith and knowledge , Faith being a certain knowledge of the thing beleeved , which is the Scripture , and faith being * * 1 Pet. 1.23 . begotten by the word of God , which is therfore call'd ‡ ‡ Iam. 1.18 . the word of Faith , both because it is the seed of Faith , and the ground wherin it is rooted , and every seed having in it the nature of that which springeth of it : it necessarily followeth , that there is in the Scripture a full demonstrative knowledge , and consequently God requireth in us such a full demonstrative knowledge , as whereby we are fully assured , and know certainly , that the Scripture is the very word of God . And this full demonstrative knowledge is in true Faith , which apprehending and imbracing Christ ; the beleever by the same Faith doth know assuredly , that that Scripture , by the heareing wherof preached he came to beleeve , is the very word of God . And there is such a necessity of this full demonstrative knowledge to be in every beleever , it is both de esse , of the be●ing of a beleever , and also de bene esse , of his well-beeing . That it is of the beeing of a beleever , we have proved out of Scripture , because it is of the very beeing of Faith . And secondly it is necessary for the well-beeing of a Christian. A true Christians life is full of affliction , more then other men . For this he hath the greatest need of comfort . Now wherein hath a Christian most solid comfort ? Surely in the Scriptures . David , a man of afflictions , can tell us this by his own experience . ‡ ‡ Psal. 119.49 , 50. Remember Lord ( Saith he ) the word unto thy Servant , wherein thou hast caused me to hope . This is my Comfort in my affliction : for thy word hath quickned me . And v. 52. I remembred thy judgements of old , ô Lord , and have comforted my selfe . And v. 54. Thy Statutes have been my Songs in the house of my pilgrimage . Gods word is that which supports Faith in prayer to God in affliction . As v. 76. Let , I pray thee , thy mercifull kindnesse be for my co●fort , according to thy word unto thy Servant . And v. 80. Let my heart be sound in thy Statutes , that I be not ashamed . And v. 92. Except thy Law had been my delights , I should then have perished in my Affliction : And that excellent Psalme , which Aug. so much admires ( and not without cause ) calling it Magnificum Psalmum ( it is his own word ) is full of such meditations , and consolations , grounded upon Gods word . And the Apostle also sheweth this , where he saith , * * Rom. 15.4 . Wha●soever things are written aforetime , were written for our learning , that we through patience and comfort of the Scriptures might have hope . Now how could a Christian in affliction comfort himselfe in the Scriptures , had he not a full demonstrative knowledge by Faith , that the Scripture is Gods word , and therefore all his promises therein are most true , and in Christ yea and Amen ? I say , a full demonstrative knowledge by Faith , which is ‛ élenkos ▪ the demonstration of things not seen , as before . Not that this full demonstrative knowl●dge in ●aith hath in it the full perfection of Degrees , which is not attained in this life : but it is such a full demonstrative knowledge , such a sure trust and confidence in God according to his word ; such a hope in his Promises in Christ , that although his ●aith be sometimes assaulted with temptations of feares , and doubtings arising either from infirmities and corruptions within , or from Satans suggestions without , yet the beleever sticks closse , and will not let go his hold , but as Iob saith , ‡ ‡ Iob. 13.15 . though God kill him , yet will he trust in him .

Then then being so , your assertion is very bold and blasphemous , Blasphemy . in saying , God in his Providence hath kindled in the Scripture no light for that , namely full demonstrative knowledge : wherof we have made sufficient demonstration to the contrary . And your own next words will confute you ; for you say , ‡ ‡ The Prel●te contradicts himselfe , not understanding wherof he ●ffirmeth . He requires our faith of it , and such a certain demonstration , as may fit that . Doth he so ? And what is that faith : but wherin there is such a certain and demonstrative knowledge , as gives a man full assurance , that the Scripture is the word of God ? And this is that faith , which God especially r●quireth in hi● people , as without which they cannot § § Rom. 10.10 . beleeve unto righteousnes , and confesse unto Salvation . But this is not that faith , with its certain demonstration , which you mean . For ( as you adde ) yours is such a faith , as is begotten of Reason and ordinary Grace ( which is ever the burthen of your Song ) where the soule is morally prepared by the Tradition of the Church . Of which enough before . Neither can your morall faith probably perswaded by your Tradition , ever become to be élegkos , a demonstrative assurance , that Scripture is Gods word : So as hereby you overthrow both the beeing and well-beeing of a Christian , and leave him stript of all means and hope of Salvation and consolation by the Scripture .

L. p. 88. Hooker gives a very sensible Demonstration : It is not the word of God , which doth , or possibly can assure us , that we doe well to think it is his word . For if any one Book of Scripture did give testimony to it , yet still the Scripture would require another to give credit unto it . So that unlesse beside the Scripture there were some thing that might assure , &c. And this he acknowledgeth ( saith Buerly ) is the Authority of Gods Church . Certainly Hooker gives a true and sensible Demonstration .

P. First , for your Author here alledged , he was ( we all know ) not onely a Creature , but a Champion for your Hierarchy and Ceremonies . And besides that , his Book was guelt in some things , before it could have its passeport to travaile abroad . However ( as you say of Others , so I of him ) he was but a private man . And if you take his words to be the Doctrine of the Church of England , you may , seeing the Jesuite doth so approve of it , as also your selfe doth . Well , let Hookers words be so , as you alledge them : yet give me leave to detect in them a mixture of some absurdity , and some impiety together . As in these words , It is not the word , which doth , or possibly can assure us , that we doe well to think it is his word . And so in that sense ( which is the onely sense a sensible man , and sound Christian can make ) 't is true , that the Scripture neither doth , nor possibly can assure us , that we do well to think onely it is his word . For as the Scripture cannot lye , so it cannot assure us , that we do well , when we come short of our duty , as in thinking , ( which is but opinion ) when we should beleeve , which is Faith . For the Scripture requires a firme Faith in us , and approveth not of thinking , as sufficient .

But now for his sensible Demonstration , which is this : That if any one book of Scripture did give testimony to all : yet still the Scripture would require another to give testimony to it ; and so we can never come to assurance this way : I answere , The Scripture is a compleat body in it selfe , and every part of it an uniforme , and homogeneall member , to the making up of this body . So as the Scripture is to be taken first in the whole lumpe , or body , as bearing full witnesse to it selfe : and every part or Book of Scripture hath a witnesse in it selfe , and for it selfe , and for the rest too , there being such a sweet and full harmony in the whole , and all the parts , Gods Spirit speaking and breathing in it ( as the Animall Spirits in mans body , moving the whole and every part ) and shewing , that it is Gods word . And we must never in this notion fever the Spirit of God from the Scripture , his owne word , which it filleth in every part , as the life-blood doth the veines . So as there is not a Book of Scripture , wherein the Majesty of GOD , and his Wisdome , and Goodnesse , and Righteousnesse , and Holinesse , doe not in some degree more or lesse shine forth . And Mr Hooker might as well have reasoned thus : It is not the whole frame of mans body , that can perswade us , that we doe well to thinke , that it is a mans body ; for though one member by its motion doth beare witnesse to the rest , that they are parts of mans body , yet still that member wants other members to beare witnesse unto it , that it is a part of mans body . As if every particular member of mans body by its inherent proper motion , were not a sufficient witnesse , not onely to all the rest of the body , that it is a living and true organicall body of man : but also to it selfe , that it is a true living member of this body . Or as thus : It is not the whole frame of heaven and earth , that can assure us , that we doe well to thinke , that God made all the world : for if any one Creature should give testimony to all the rest , yet still that Creature would require another Creature to give testimony to it , that it is one of Gods Creatures : and so we should never come to any pawse , to rest our assurance this way , that God created the whole world heaven and earth , and all the Creatures therein . Now what is there besides the Creature , that can assure us of this ? What ? The Authority of men , or the Tradition of the whole world ? No : for * * Heb. 11.3 . By Faith we come to understand , that the worlds were framed by the word of God , so that things which are seen , were made of things which did not appeare . Now whereupon is this Faith grounded ? Surely on the word of God , and confirmed abundantly by the whole frame of heaven and earth , and all the Creatures therein , not one of them , but having a stampe of the Creator upon it , to assure us , that it is his Creature . And how doe we come to be assured that this word of God is contained in the Scripture ? By the Authority of the present Church ? Doth Hooker Say so ? Had you Said , The Ancient Church : as the Jewes , in witnessing for the Old Testament : and the Ancient Apostolick Church , in witnessing for the New : you had said Somthing . As also , if you had put the Ministry of the Word , for the Authority of your present Church . For ( as we said before ) the Ministry of the Word is Gods own voyce , which commends unto us the Scripture , as the word of God . This is Gods owne ordinary meanes to bring men to Faith , and not the Authority and Tradition of I wot not what present Church .

And now against Mr Hookers sensible Demonstration , as you call it : I will oppose another Demonstration , which is not onely sensible , but most true , as proving , that the testimony of Scripture to be the word of God , is in the Scripture it selfe . First , Paul in the Epistle to the (a) (a) Rom. 3.2 . Romans , witnesseth , that unto the Iewes , or Israeliets under the Old Testament , were committed the Oracles of God : those Oracles were contained in all the severall Bookes of the Old Testament , which the Jewes kept intire , and inviolate , without the mixture of Profane Books . And of this Scripture Paul speaketh , and testifieth saying , (b) (b) 2 Tim. 3.15 , 16. All Scripture is given by inspiration from God . And Christ himselfe giveth testimony of the Old Testament , saying to the Jewes , (c) (c) Ioh. 5.39 . Search the Scriptures for in them ye think ye have eternall life , and they are they which testifie of me . And what those Scriptures were , the Jewes knew well enough , for they were deposited with them , and they kept them as their chiefest treasure . And (d) (d) 2 Pet. 1.20 , 21. Peter also gives testimony to the Old Testament , saying of it , that Holy men of God spake , as they were moved by the Holy Ghost ; speaking of the Scripture expresly in that place , in the former verse . And , (e) (e) Act. 10.43 . To Him give all the Prophets witnesse . Thus the New Testament gives testimony to the Old , that it is the word of God . And I hope you will not except against this testimony as insufficient . Againe , the New Testament gives witnesse to it selfe , that it is the word of God . Peter witnesseth of Pauls Epistles , that Paul wrote them according to the wisdome given unto him ; that is , the Holy Ghost . And Christ said to Peter , (f (f Luk 22.32 I have prayd for thee , that thy Faith faile not . Yea He (g) (g) Ioh. 16.13 . sent the Holy Ghost to all his Apostles , that should lead them into all truth ▪ Ergo what they preached and wrote , was the Truth and word of God . And Christ made all his Apostles his witnesses , who in all their writings beare-witnesse of him , both of (h) (h) 1 Ioh. 1.3 . what they saw and heard ; and so their record left in writing is true . See Luk. 1.2 . 1 Joh. 1.3 . 3 Joh. 12. And none writ the New Testament , but either Euangelists , or Apostles , all indued with the Holy Ghost . And the Wisdome of Christ reserved his beloved Disciple Iohn as the last surviver of all the rest , to write the Book of the Revelation , and to conclude , as the New Testament , so the whole Bible with that Charge . (i) (i) Rev. 22.18 If any man adde to this Book , or take away from it , &c. as shewing , that the whole and intire Scripture was now compiled , and consummate . I might be copious in this point ▪ But I will summe , up all this : The New Testament gives testimony to the Old that it is the word of God ▪ also to it selfe , one Book to another , one Apostle to another ( who were all witnesses of Christ ) Christ and the Holy Ghost to all the Apostles , all their writings being guided by the Spirit of Truth , and giving joynt witnesse unto Christ , and to the truth of the Gospell . Yea and the severall parts beare witnes to themselvs . As 1 Cor. 14.37 . If any man think himselfe to be a Prophet , or Spirituall , let him acknowledge , that the things that I write unto you , are the Commandements of the Lord . And 1 Pet. 5.12 . I have written brieflly , exhorting and testifying , that this is the true Grace of God , wherein ye stand . And Joh. 20.31 . These things are written , that ye might beleeve , that Iesus is the Christ the Son of God , and that beleeving ye might have life through his Name . So 1 Joh. 1.3 , 4. 2 Joh. 5. 3 Joh. 12. And we also ●eare record , and ye know that our record is true .

And as the New Testament doth every where beare witnesse both to the Old , and to it selfe , both in the whole , and every part , even by the Spirit of God , that speakes and breathes in the whole and every part : So the Old Testament , in like manner beares witnesse both to it selfe , and to the New Testament , and that by many Types and Prophecies , all which are fulfilled in the New . So as these two Testaments are as Ezechiels Wheeles one within another , the New Testament being the Old revealed , and the Old the New veiled . Or they are like the two Cherubims , both looking towards the Mercy-Seat , which is Christ , the Summe of them both ▪ the Old looking upon him as he was promised and to come ; the New , as he is now exhibited , and come . Thus we have here ▪ a full , true , and evident Demonstration , that the whole Scripture gives testimony to it selfe , that it is the word of God . And yet you Say ▪ * * pag. 88 ▪ That Truth it selfe cannot say , that Scripture it selfe can doe it . But you adde .

L. ibid. That Scripture cannot beare witnesse to it selfe , nor any one part of it , to another , it is grounded upon Nature : which admits of no created thing to beare witnesse to it selfe : and is acknowledged by our Saviour , ‡ ‡ Io● . 5.31 ▪ If I beare witnesse of my selfe , my witnesse is not true , that is , is not of force to be reasonably accepted for truth .

P. Though the Scripture , The Prel●t●s Ground 〈◊〉 false , if appl●●● to S●ripture . as it is considered in the written Letter , be a Creature , yet the matter of it , the Light , the Truth , the Authority and Evidence of it is meerly Divine , as wherein God hath imprinted and expressed his Divine Nature , Counsell , and Will. So as ( as is said before ) we must never abstract the Scripture from that Spirit of God , which is alwayes in it , and with it , as a cleare and sufficient witnesse of it , and as the very life and Soule of it . Whereas you , with the Papists , take the Scripture for no other , but as a bare Letter , or barke of a Tree , or dead Corps , without any Divine Spirit in it . But you aledge Christ , Saying of himselfe , If I beare witnesse of my selfe , &c. You must know , that Christ here speaks , as the Jewes took him for no other ▪ as a meere Man . But take him as Christ , God-man in one Person , and is he not a'ut●pistos , worthy of himselfe to be beleeved ? And what Saith he , when the Pharisees objected unto him , * * Ioh. 8.13 , 14. Thou bearest record of thy selfe , thy record is not true ? Though I beare record of my selfe , yet my record is true , Saith he . For is not Gods record true ? And againe , v. 17. It is written in your Law , that the testim●ny of two men is true . I am one that beare witnesse of my selfe : and the Father that sent me , beareth witnesse of me . So may the Scripture say , Though I beare record of my selfe , yet my record is true : for the Father speaketh in me , and Christ speaketh in me , and the Holy Ghost speaketh in me , and all these joyntly beare witnesse in me , with me , and to me , that I am the word of God . And in the mouth of two or three witnesses shall every word be established . And hereunto might I adde the many Divine and Admirable works and effects , which the word of God produceth , all which beare witnesse abundantly , that the Scripture is the word of God . Why , what works , what effects doth it produce ? Yea what not ? ‡ ‡ Psal. 19. It enlightneth the eyes : ‡ ‡ Ps. 119.93 . it quickeneth dead Soules : § § 2 Cor. 10. it is that great Engine of battery , that subdueth the world unto Christ . Heb. 4.12 . It is the sharpe two-edged sword , lively and mighty in operation , &c. “ “ Rom. 1. it is the mighty power of God to Salvation : ‘,‘ ‘,‘ 2 Cor. 2.15 . it is to all men the sweet savour of God , the savour either of life , unto life , or of death unto death . Loe my Lord , what think you now of this Word ? Is it trow ●ou onely a dead letter , being of such a Divine and Spirit-full efficacie , as no word of man is , or can be ? And here might I bring many negative proofes , to shew it cannot be the Word of Man . But let this suffice . I will passe on .

L. p. 89. No man can set a better State of the Question , then Hooker doth , his words are these : The Scripture is the ground of our beliefe : the Authority of man ( that is the name he gives to Tradition ) is the Key , which opens the doore of entrance into the Knowledge of the Scripture .

P. We have already answered sufficiently , that the Scripture is both the Garden wherein all the pleasant Flowers , and wholesome Fruits of Paradise are planted , and grow ; which are of that beauty , fragancie , sweetnesse , and relish , as he that beholds them , smells to them , and tasts of them , may easily discerne they are not of a terrene or earthly nature ( Non vox hominem son●t ) and it selfe is the Key that lets in those that will , to tast of her Fruits : which I say , when they once tast , they will Say , This is none other , but the Garden and Paradise of God , even the Word of God . This is that * * Luk. 11.52 . Key of knowledge , for the taking away whereof , Christ denounceth a Woe to the Pharises . And that by this Key is not meant Tradition , is plain , seeing the Pharisees did not take away Tradition , but they exalted it so farre , as therby they made the Word of God of none effect . Is this the Tradition , that you call the Authority of Man , and so highly commend , which the Pharisees used for no other Key , but as a false Key , or picklocke to robbe the Scripture of their Divine Authority . But if you understand by Tradition here the Delivery of the Scripture from hand to hand to be kept as a Depositum by the Church of God : thus the Scripture is a rich Cabinet full of precious Jewels , together with the Key , or Spring-lock so united unto it , as it is a part of the Cabinet , and so deposited with the Church of God , as by the Ministry and preaching of the Word the Key is turned , and the Cabinet unlocked , the Key being no other , but of Gods owne making and appointing ; and so the Cabinet thus opened , and man looking into it , his eyes being also opened by the same Key , there he finds that goodly ‡ ‡ Mat. 12.44.46 . Pearle of the Kingdome , and that rich Treasure , which to purchase , he goes and sells all that he hath .

But suppose now for all this we should either grant your Lordship such a Key , as Prelaticall Authority , whereby you assume a power of opening an entrance to men to read the Scriptures : when the Key is once in your hand , what if you should prove so closse fisted , and so churlish a Keeper , as not to suffer them to come to read the Scriptures , as you have done in not suffering them to heare them preached on the Lods dayes at least in the After-noones ? As also , in so keeping fast under Locke and Key those precious Jewels of the Doctrines of Gods Grace ( as aforesaid ) as the Ministers themselves may not come at them , once to touch them ? So as it might prove a dangerous thing , and too suspicious , if you had such a Key of Authority , or the Authority of such a Key put into your hand , men should rather be shut out from the Scriptures , then have the entrance open to goe freely to them , when they will . But if you will needs perforce wrest this Key , as the Preaching of Gods word , out of the hands , or from between the teeth of Godly Ministers ▪ as you have done : we have no remedy , but to complain to the Lord of the Vineyard , and pray him to vindicate his Key out of such Hucksters hands , and to force you to give up your usurped false Keyes .

L. p. 91. Could the Pope and his Clergie put this home upon the w●●ld ( as they are gone farre in it ) that the Tradition of the Present Church is Divine and Infallible : how might they and would they then Lord it over the Faith of Christendome , contrary to S. Peters Rule ; whose Successors certainly in this they are not .

P. Thus you confesse , there is , or may be a Lording of the Clergie over the Faith of Christendome , or Christians , contrary to S. Peters Rule . But you restraine this to Romes usurped Infallibility , as if without this she could not Lord it over Christendome . How comes your Lordship then with your Hierarchy to Lord it over the Soules and Consciences of Gods people , even over all England , that other world ? You disclaime your Church-Authority , and Tradition here to be Divine and Infallible . By what Authority then doe you Lord it over all England ? Certainly Divine Authority you have none for it . And as you Say of Rome , so I doe to you : Certainly you are no successors of the Apostles in this ; as both hath been , and shal be more shewed . And because you cite here that place of Peter : what think you of it ? Doth it not condemn all kind of Lordship over Gods heritage ? As Lordship over mens Consciences in captivating them to humane Ordinances , as Ceremonies in Gods worship ? As Lordship over Ministers , forbidding them to Preach Gods word , both how farre , and when you please ? As Lordship over the very Commandements of God , in dispensing with them , as in the 4 th and 5 th Commandement ? Or Lordship over mens Soules , as touching their beliefe , and reading of Scriptures , as the word of God ; all which must depend upon a necessity of your present Church-Authority , as without which you tell them it is not fit , that they should either read the Scriptures , or beleeve them to be the word of God ? Now is Rome so far g●n in puting home her Infallibility ▪ as therby to Lord it over the greatest part of Christendome ? Then how farre are you gone in Lording it over the Soules and Consciences of all the People in England , and Ministers too , in all these particulars formentioned ? But to proceed .

L. p 93. The Lawfully sent Pastors , and Doctors of the Church in all Ages , have had , and shall have continuall assistance , but not infalli●le , at least not Divine and Infallible .

P. Such therefore as are not Lawfull Pastors and Teachers , have not continuall Assistance , as all Prelates and Priests , as you call yourselves . But for Lawfull Pastors , if they have continuall assistance , whence have they it , but from Christ ? And how then is it not ●ivine ? And if Divine , how , not Infallible ? The assistance certainly , for so much as it is , and in those things wherin it is , is no lesse Infallible , then Divine . For that which is Divine , is Infallible , as was touched before . But because this Assistance Divine is given to every man but in part ( for * * 1 Cor. 13. we know in part , and we prophecie in part ) and to some in one kind , to some in another , both to whom , and when , and how much , and to what speciall purpose , as it seemeth good to the Divine wisdome , but to all ‡ ‡ 1 Cor. 12.7 ▪ to profit withall , and ‡ ‡ 2 Cor. 10.8 ▪ & 13.10 . for edification , as the Apostle speakes : therefore it comes to passe , that even good men , and good Pastors lawfully called , may somtimes run into some errours , both by reason of humane frailties and infirmities , and when they passe the bounds of their peculiar karísmata , or Ministeriall Graces bestowed upon in this or that kind , or measure , and doe not keep closse to the Rule , Gods word : Having therefore gifts ( saith the Apostle ) differing according to the Grace that is given unto us , whether Prophecie , Let us Prophecie according to the proportion of Faith : or he that teacheth , on teaching : or he that exhorteth , on Exhortation . And yet when we have done all that we can , we come farre short of what we should doe . Yet all Gods Elect , both Pastors and People , have Christs promise so farre fullfilled in them , and made good unto them , by continuall Divine , and Infallible Assistance , of his Grace , and Spirit dwelling in them , that they are preserved from all those Errours , which might seduce them from Christ , as himsefe Saith , Math. 24.24 .

L. p. 95. When Command is for Preaching , the Restraint is added , Goe , Saith Christ , and teach all Nations . But you may not Preach all things , what you please , but all things , which I have commanded you . The publication is yours , the Doctrine is mine .

P. How then dare your Lordship be an Instrument of Restraining and Prohibiting any Doctrine of CHRIST , The Prelate self-condemned . which hee hath in his Word commanded to be Preached , and Published to his People ? How will you answere this be-before that Judge ? And why do you suborne your Arminian Faction to preach their Heresies out of your d●psucoi , double minded Articles , while you restrain Gods Ministers from preaching the Truth , and Suspend them for so doing ?

L. p. 98. Though Tradition and Scripture doe mutually , yet they doe not equally confirme the Authority either of other . For * * The Prelate bel●s the Scripture to credit his false Tradition . Scripture doth infa●libly confirme the Authority of Church Traditions truly so call●d : but Tradition doth but morally and probably confirme the Authority of the Scripture .

P. Then Surely your Church-Traditions make the Scripture but a poore requitall , when for an infallible confirmation of them , Scripture little beholden to the Prelate for his Tradition . they returne a Confirmation onely morall and probable . Can they not returne such as they receive , at least in some degree ? But what be those Traditions of the Church truly so called ? That inducing Tradition , which of necessity must lead men to beleeve the Scriptures to be the word of God ? But shew us where hath the Scripture given you any such Authority , much lesse infallibly confirmed it ? Or how is this a Tradition truly so called ? Because you call it so ? But ‡ ‡ The Prelate catcht in his own Delemna , or net . if Scripture have not sufficient Light to prove themselves to be Gods word : what Light find you there infallibly to confirme the Authority of your Tradition ? And if your Church Tradition doe not confirme the Authority of Scripture infallibly : how then ? Ergo fallibly , and deceitfully . But probably , you Say . But probability cannot confirme truth . This is a meere Solecisme of yours , A Solecisme of the Prelates . and any common Aristotelian would hisse it out of the Philosophy Schooles . And in a Law-Case , a Probable Testimony is not Legall , it is no Testimony . And will you Say then , that the Scripture hath confirmed to your present Church such an Authority infallibly , to be a confirming Testimony of the Authority of Scripture , which is insufficient and illegall ? How much the neerer is Scripture Authority for such a Testimony ? Or your probable testimony doth confirme Scripture-Authority to be probable . That 's all ; and that 's nothing , saving that hereby you make the Scripture to be of no Authority at all . For first you Say , The Scripture hath no testimony of its Authority , sufficient in it selfe : Secondly , that it must first have testimony from the Authority of the present Church : and thirdly , that this testimony is but probable , not infallible . Therefore necessarily it followeth , that it is but at the most probable , if the Scripture have any Authority at all . And this is that Goates-haire , wherewith you have full stuffed almost 30 of your Folio-leaves , as before we have noted . And yet the thread of that 16 th Section is not yet cut off , or spun out .

L. p. 100. The Iesuite in the Church of Rome , and the precise party in the Reformed Churches agree in this : That the Sermons and Preachings by word of mouth , of the Lawfully sent Pastors , and Doctors of the Church , are able to breed in us Divine and Infallible Faith . Nay , are the very word of God . So A. C. expresly . And no lesse then so have some accounted of their owne Factious words ( to Say no more ) then as the word of God . † ( in the margent at this marke ) For the freeing of Factious and Silenced Ministers is termed The restoring of Gods word to its Liberty . In the Godly Author of the Late Newes from Ipswitch . p. 5.

P. That the Sermons and Preachings by word of mouth of the Lawfully sent Pastors and Doctors of the Church , are able to breed in men Divine and Infallible Faith ; being according to the Rule and Evidence of Scripture , as true Preaching is : what good Christian makes a doubt , though you deride it ? I pray you , ( you that are the great Rabbi : and Champion of the present Church of England ) What Say you of the Apostles words ? How shall they call on him , in whom they have not beleeved ? And how shall they beleeve in him , of whom they have not heard ? And how shall they heare without a Preacher ? And how shall they Preach except they be Sent ? So then Faith cometh by hearing , and hearing by the word of God . But we shall heare your judgement by and by . As for A. C. ( with whom you yoak the precise party in the same sentence ) surely were he no Jesuite , nor illegitimate Priest , but either a Sound Christian , or a Lawfully sent Pastor and Doctor of the Church of Christ , the words rightly meant , and understood , are most true . I remember I have read a Story of a Grecian State , I take it of Athens , where when a vitious Senator in Court on a time gave very good Counsell for the Common-Weale they approved of the Counsell , but would not have it Registred in his name , A. Gelius . Noct. At●icarum . but caused an honest man to utter the same forme of words in Court , and so under his name it was recorded . So I may here , Let a good Christian , or ( if you will ) one of the precise party you mention , utter these words ( and not A. C. ) and then the sense wil be good and true . And by your own words we shall convince you of folly by and by . Now for the precise party in the Reformed Churches , doe you not meane those , who are most reformed in their life and conversation , and most refined from the drosse and dregges of all Deformed Churches Superstitions and Idolatries in the pretended worship of God , and from all grosse errours in Faith and Doctrine ? Surely those you must and do meane , as whom you most deadly hate , and therefore in your wretched malice do couple them with A. C. Of which precise party Iesus Christ is the head , that pure and precise Nazarite , and Seperatist from all sin and errour , with all the Apostles , Prophets , and Martyrs . And what do they say ? No lesse ( say you ) then A. C And what faith A.C. ? Expresly , that Sermons , &c. ( as before ) are the expresse word of God . And how prove you that this precise party saith no lesse ? Nay you say more , that they account their own Factious words no lesse ( to say no more ) then as the word of God . To Say no more ? Nay surely , you have said enough , if it be true . But if not true , a great deale too much . Well , true , or not true , 't is enough you Say it ; and so you make this precise party to be ten times worse , then the Jesuite . And so you would have it . For say you , the Jesutie saith , Sermons are the very word of God : but the Precise , That their own factious words are . What ? The word of God . No , but , As the word of God . Why , do you call them factious words , because they are As the word of God ? Doe you not know that true Preachers words should be * * 1 Pet. 4.11 . hoes log●●●eou ; as the Oracles , or word of God , as Peter speakes ? such words as become ‡ ‡ T●t . 2 ▪ 1. Sound Doctrine ? ‡ ‡ v. 8. Sound Speech , that cannot be condemned ( but unjustly , by such as doe heterodidaskalein , teach strange Doctrines , and agree not to wholsome words ) keeping the § § H●pot●posin T it 1.13 . Forme of Sound words . But you charge here the precise party with factious words . How prove you that ? For Si sat est accusasse , quis innocens erit ? If your single Accusation be sufficient , who shal be Innocent ? But you bring your proofe è Scriptis , good evidence sure . What 's that ? † For the freeing of factious and Silenced Ministers , is termed , The restoring of Gods word to its Liberty But where do you find these factious words ? In the Godly Author of the late Newes from Ipswich . Well then , here be 2 things obserbable : 1. The Matter : 2. the Author . 1. The Matter charged , The freeing of factious and Silenced Ministers , is termed , The restoring of Gods word to its Liberty . And who are these factious and Silenced Ministers ? Namely a matter of about an hundred godly and Conscientious Ministers in Norfolke , Suffolk , Essex , Kent , Surrey , and other Sh●res , who were in one Summer , and the most in the Circuit of one Visitation , some silenced , some suspended , some also excommunicated , from Church and Chimney ( ab Aris ac Focis , aqua & igni ) and with their Wives and Children exposed to beggery , and all calamity ? Wherefore ? They were factious . Wherein ? They would not ob●y and conforme to the Orders of their Ordinary . What Orders ? For the reading in their severall Congregations the Book for Sports on the Lords dayes : For the setting up of Altars in their Chancels : For the causing of their People ( never accustomed to it before ) to come up to the Altar , and there receive the Communion , or the Lords Supper on their knees . For these , and the like , which they refused to do , they are doomed Factious . But the Ministers aledged , these were new Impositions praeter praescriptum Legis , besides the prescript Law or Statute , so as their obedience should have incurred a Premunire . No matter for that . They are a sort of factious fellows , and ringleaders of Puritan-people ( as you apologised in the Starre-Chamber ) and so being once silenced , 't is too late to talk . Yet these men were all Conformists to the Discipline by Law established , and lived peaceably . How then were they Factious ? Why , surely they would not observe Orders . They would ( notwithstanding an Order to the Contrary ) preach twice every Lords day : They would open the Catechisme-points , and not content themselves with the bare words of Question and Answere , as it is in the Booke : they would hold the people so long with their preaching in the Afternoons , that they had no time left to goe to their Laudable Sports ▪ nor could the people enjoy their pleasures with a quiet Conscience , the Ministers would so trouble them with pressing the Sanctification of the Sabbath according to the 4th Commandement , and the like . Well then , diligent Preachers they were : and they preached the word of God by expounding and applying it , which we shall heare you by and by to commend , if we may beleeve your words , when we see your deeds contrary . So as then , in Norfolke , and Suffolke , and Essex , while these godly and painfull Ministers preached the word of God , it did as the Apostle saith , * * 2 Thes. 3.1 . trékein , run , or diarrusai , flow forth like the ‡ ‡ Ezek. 47.12 . waters in the Sanctuary . When Paul was prisoner at Rome , and yet had liberty to preach the word , ( for in those dayes , ‡ ‡ A French Proverbe . Les Diables estroyent encores en Leur Donat: the Devil was but a Grammer Scholar , and had not learned in Machiavels Schoole to be one of Antichrists Statesmen , to shut Ministers up in the Inquisition-house , that they shall never tell Tales more in the Pulpit ) he Said , § § 2 Tim. 2.9 ▪ For the which I am a Prisoner in bonds , but the word of God is not bound . So as while Gods Ministers , are not restrained from preaching the word of God , but that they freely preach it without impeachment , it may be truly said , The word of God is not bound . But on the contrary , when Godly and painfull Ministers are silenced , then it may alike truly be sayd , The word of God is bound . I will recollect all , and conclude with a Syllogisme :

If the free Preaching of Gods word be the liberty of it , and the silencing of Gods faithfull Ministers be a binding of Gods word : then the freeing of such silenced Ministers , is the restoring of Gods word to its libetty : But the free Preaching of Gods word is the liberty of it ; and the silencing of Gods faithfull Ministers . Therefore the freeing of silenced Ministers is the restoring of Gods word to its liberty .

The consequence of the Antecedent cannot be denyed : and the Minor is the Apostles in that place forealedged , 2 Tim. 2.9 . so as here is nothing left for you to deny , but the Conclusion . And that 's enough for you . Yet might those Ministers have but eq●all Law , and liberty to plead their Cause against you , they would easily purge themselves from such an aspersion of being Factious , when some of your party would prove to be deep enough plunged at least in a Premunire ( to say no more ) were not the Laws asleep , and ( in this case ) in as much bondage , as the Gospell . I passe from the matter of your Ipswich Newes , to the Author . And it would be News , to tell us truly , who that might be . But all the tidings you can tell us of him , is by certain marks to describe him unto us . And those are three ▪ 1. Is H.B. which ( in your Book set out concerning those three foresaid bitter men , The Prelates 3 marks of his imagined Author of Ipswich Newes . and which you read in the Starre-Chamber , before all the Court at their Censure ) you set in the margent over against those passages which you cite out of Ipswich News . This is one of your marks ; although ( as I said before , and as I have it by very credible intelligence ) he was not the Author of it , and therfore you take , and have set your first mark amisse , for H. B. it was not . And yet this mark falsly set , became the occasion of the seting on of the second mark ; and that was an Eare-marke , and that upon both the Eares for failing ; and that closse to the head , which escaped scarce a hayres breadth , and this upon the Pillory , that some thousands of beholders might be witnesses of it . The third mark I find here in your margent , in this form , † a Crucifix I cannot call it : but it is next unto it , a Crosse it is , and very like to Christs Crosse , and as like to that Pillory , wherein H. B. stood , as can be ; A fit mark therfore for him , whom you had so marked before . So as , if any inquire of this Author , who it should be , your Book can shape him a ready answere , Ecce signum ▪ Loe here a signe of that Pillory on which he suffered . In the last place , you call him here in scorn , and through the nose ( as Tertullian speakes in another case of an Hereticke ) the Godly Author of the late Newes from Ipswich , and all this he may do by Authority , that sits in Cathedr● derisorum , in the scorners chaire , making a mock of all true Religion , Godlinesse , and honesty . And thus you cease not still to persecute the poore Man every kind of way here , * * Heb. 11.36 ▪ by ●ruell mocking , as the Apostle speakes . But he but drinks of the same ‡ ‡ Mar. 10.34 Mat. 27.31 . Cup which his Lord and Master drunk of before him . And all these things you load Christs Servant withall , shall but make his crown the more glorious . For I heare , he indures that his perpetuall closse Imprisonment , and Banishment , from Wife , Children , Friends , Countrey , all ; with as great a continued magnanimity , as he did his standing and suffering on the Pillory .

L. ibid. Prelates words and deeds agre● n●t . I ever tooke Sermons ( and so do still ) to be most necessary expositions and applications of holy Scripture , and a great ordinary meanes of Saving knowledge . But I cannot thinke them , or the preachers of them divinely infallible . The Antient Fathers of the Church preached farre beyond any of these of either Faction : and yet no one of them durst thinke himselfe infallible , much lesse , that whatsoever he preached , was the word of God . And it may be observed too , that no men are more apt to say , that all the Fathers were but men , and might erre , then they that think their own preachings are infallible .

P. Here you acknowledge Sermons to be necessary expositions , and applications of holy Scripture , and a great ordinary meanes of saving knowledge . Doe you so ? Have you indeed ever taken them to be so ? And so still indeed ? What still ? What , all this while , that you have been , and are a most notorious persecuter of , and rooter out of godly Preachers , whom your late Brother White in Scorne ( in his Book of the Sabbath , or rather against the Sabbath ) calls Sermonders ? And is there a generation , or profession of men above ground , whom you hate , more then these ? If you ever took Sermons to be such ; why do you continually take the Preachers themselves in your nets , and so devoure them ? Are Sermons necessary expositions , and applications of Scripture , and that by your owne confession ? Then the greater your condemnation , that take away this Key of Knowledge . And that they be a great meanes of Saving knowledge : Then why do you not onely suffer the people to * * Hos. 4.6 ▪ perish for want of them , but chase away good Pastors from them ? Thus are you not guilty of the blood of so many thousand Soules , and have pronounced the sentence of condemnation against your selfe with your own mouth ? And thus doth not the nakednesse of your notorious and shamelesse hipocrisie discover it selfe to all the world , while you professe in words one thing , and in your deeds practise the contrary ? But you give the reason your selfe ▪ because you take Sermons to be such , as you say , therefore you persecute the Preachers of them . Neither yet come you full home to the truth , Prelate a notorious persecut●r of the true preaching of Gods word . in giving Sermons their due , for all your sugred words ; Sermons , I meane , the plain , powerfull , and sound preaching of Gods word , by explication , and application . You say , they are great meanes of sound knowledge . You doe not say so of Sermons , as of your externall worship , The GREAT WITNESSE : but , a great meanes , not The great meanes , nor the GREAT MEANES put in Capitall Letters : Rom. 1.16 . much lesse doe you say , as the Apostle , That preaching is the power of God unto Salvation , to every one that beleeveth . Or as , 1 Cor ▪ 1.18 . The preaching of the crosse is to them that perish foolishnesse : but to us that are saved , it is the power of God . Or , 1 Cor. 1.24 . To them that are called , we preach Christ , the power of God , and the wisdome of God . And yet with you it is but a great meanes . And well too , that you will vouchsafe to give it so good a word . But it is such a great meanes , as there is none other ordinary meanes of saving knowledge whatsoever to be compared with it .

But you cannot thinke Sermons divinely infallible . I thinke not such Sermons as you make . But are not those Sermons , which being a true explication and application of the the word of God , the Scripture , doe convert soules to God , doe beget faith in the hearers , and make of them new Creatures divinely infallible ; can such Sermons be otherwise , then divinely infallible ? I doe not meane your Court Sermons . And can that preaching which is a great meanes ( as you confesse ) of saving knowledge , but be divinely infallible ? Can that , which brings men to salvation , deceive men ? I speak still of true preaching .

But you put Sermons ( which you say are expositions , and application of Scripture , and a great meanes of saving knowledge ) and preachers together , whom you doe not think to be infallible , There is some difference , by your leave . For the Sermon may ●e divinely infallible , saving the hearers soules , and yet the preacher himselfe be deceived , and put by his purpose in preaching of it . For instance : I remember Augustine tells how on a time preaching upon a text , he did , besides his purpose and intention extravagate from his text , and fell upon the Manichean Heresie , which was nothing to his text , in which extravagant discourse , he notwithstanding , according to his dexterity , ●oundly confuted that Heresie : Well , after the Sermon a Manichean that there had heard him , came to Augustine , and told him , that his Sermon had much wrought upon him , and convinced him of his error , desiring him further to instruct him in the true Faith : Hereat Augustine fell into an admiration , saying to the man , give glory to God , and never thank me for it : for I never intended , when I came into the Pulpit at that time , so much as to touch upon that poynt . But now I see ▪ Gods mercifull hand led me out of my intended course , that I should , going out of mine owne way , bring thee into the right way . Thus we see the Sermon may be divinely infallible , when yet the Preacher himselfe was deceived . Againe , the Preacher being a man is subject to error , when yet his Sermon is infallible , being divine , that is , according to Gods word , the Scripture , and his life through infirmity may have many errors , when yet his doctrine is upright and sound , being regulated by Gods word , and Spirit , which is not wanting to his faithfull Servants , in his owne Ordinace .

But ( say you ) the ancient Fathers of the Church preached beyond any of these , of either Faction : and yet no one of them durst thinke himselfe infallible , much lesse , that whatsoever he preached was the word of God . Here first you shew still your teeth , and utter your extreme malice against Christ , in calling his faithfull servants , the Ministers of his word , a Faction ; and such a Faction , as you yoake with that of the Jesuites . Certainly if godly Ministers ( such as you place , in the precise party of the reformed Church ) be a Faction , it is under and with their King and Captain Christ , fighting , and confederating , against all Antichristian adversaries , the disguised enemies of Christ , and of his word , and true Church , and of all his faithfull Ministers , and people , that doe sincerely professe his Name . Which your malice being so Diabolicall , The Prelates Diabolicall malice against the true Ministers of Christ . the Lord reprove you for it , and reward you according both to your * * Iude. Ier. 15.19 . Esay . 5.20 . words and deeds , who doe thus confound , the precious with the vile , the good with the evill , light with darknesse , Christ with Belial , true Christians with Antichristians . Certainly ther 's a woe belongs to you for this . We doe utterly reject all Iesuites and Antichristians , as who neither doe , nor dare , nor can preach Gods word truly , to the begeting of Saving Faith , and Saving Knowledge . For then they must preach against the Popes Kingdome , and his cursed doctrines , which in the Councel of Trent , doe both forbid , and accurse all saving doctrines of grace , and burne with fier and fagot the Preachers of them ; whom you also most cruelly persecute with all the Engines of cruelty , that malice it selfe can invent , and a desperate man against all Laws of God and man dare execute .

For the antient Fathers of the Church , whose preaching you farre preferre , before any of that precise party ( as you call it ) for as for A. C. and his Faction , we altogether exclude them out of the number of preachers in the reformed Churches : whether ignorance , or malice hath more blinded your judgement in this , I cannot directly say . Ignorance , not onely of the Fathers preaching , but much more of the preciser party of preachers , in the Reformed Churches , whose Sermons , and writings I suppose you have but a little acquainted your selfe withall : but for your malice against these , I dare confidently say , you have no want of that . And seeing you draw me ( though against my will ) to enter within the lists of such a comparison between those antients , and our moderne reformists , I hold it fit to speake somthing of it , ( though I declined it before , when you gave the like occasion ) both to discover the weaknesse of your judgement herein , and to vindicate the truth it selfe , in maintaining the just reputation of the truly Reformed Churches . Now no reason can be given ▪ why those Antients ( though otherwise of honourable mention ) should preach farre beyond the best preachers of the Reformed Churches . For they could not have that knowledge , and learning , which so many ages since have produced , together with much experience ; all which the truly reformed preachers make use of . Again , doe but compare most of the writings and Sermons of those Antients , with our moderne Reformed Divines , and a right judgement will find the oddes of your farre beyond , to be on the side of the reformed party . In comparison of whom , how poore were those Antients , both in their expositions and applications of Scripture . Augustine , that excellent light in those times , though in his Polemicall Tracts , and especially against the Pelagians , and Semi-pellagians , in the vindicating of Gods grace , and so in opening all those places of Scripture , concerning those points , he shewed an accute dexterity , and sound judgement : yet in his other exercises , or Sermons , and expositions of Scripture , he was not so pregnant . As in his 8 th Tome , containing his expositions , and Sermons , upon the Psalmes , although the Reader shall not repent him of his labour , because he shall meet with many passages of good note , yet he may observe how farre wide he is of the scope and meaning of the Psalmes , which he handleth all along . He preached indeed every day : as Calvin did at Geneva ( besides all his other weighty imployments ) but what a disparity there is between their expositions , I referre to the judgement of K. Iames , who commended Calvins Commentaries , above all those of the Ancients . So for the Greek Church ( as Aug. for the Latine ) that golden mouthed Chrisostome ( according to his Name ) the best preacher in his time , though many of his expositions were good , yet when he came to his tò u'thikòn , his morall , or application , though in it selfe it was very good , yet for the most part no way pertinent to his text he handled : but he would sometimes make his use against covetousnesse , somtimes against pride , or some other sinne , or , to exhort to some morall vertue , or other , but ( I say ) without any coherence to his text , for the most part . And for the most of those Antients , what was the common Theame of their preaching , but morality , delighting rather to contemplate in a solitary life , then to practise such preaching , as might win soules . How few of them did preach the Doctrine of Iustification by Faith in Christ . In somuch as Bernard , who lived many hundred yeares after those ancients , and in those times , wherein he noted Antichrist to be come ( which he plainly poynted out to be the Pope ) did preach more soundly of this doctrine , of Iustification by Faith onely , then all those Fathers had done : if we may judge of their preaching by their writings . They spent themselves more in preaching for good works . Then to set forth the faith in Christ ; though some flashes they had here and there . And whether this be not one reason , why you so commend the Fathers preaching , because they were so much for good works , and so little for faith , I know not . Whereas the moderne Divines of the Reformed Churches are most singular , and excellent in seting forth the Mystery of faith , and that doctrine of Iustification thereby , therein exalting Gods grace , and excluding mans merits ( though not negligent in exhorting to good works , as the fruits of faith ) Those Doctrines of Grace and faith , being the main substance of the Gospell , and the true practising of Iesus Christ , besides which there is no true preaching . Admirable they are also in seting forth the nature of sinne , to bring man out of himselfe , and to plant him into Christ . And in a word , have so set forth the whole body of Divinity , as the Fathers writings to theirs , are in comparison , in respect of sound Divinity , but as a barren Field to a fruitfull , well planted , and well watered Garden . And great reason there is for this . The Fathers had to deale with some Hereticks , as with Arius , whose Mal was Athanasius , and with Pelagius , knockt down by Augustine , and others : but they knew not as yet the Mistery of iniquity : which in these latter times seeking to overtop the Gospell ; and , to overthrow the Doctrine , and Kingdome of Christ , hath given occasion , not onely of a reformation , in a seperation from that Whore of Babylon , but to many Worthies , whom God hath raysed up in these last times , to bestirre themselves , and to study Christ his Military Discipline , and spirituall warfare , against the Beast , and his Crew , and to be expert in maintaining Christs Cause , with weapons both offensive , and defensive . So as by this occasion , Gods Grace working with it , this last Century hath produced , more excellent , sound , and learned Divines , and famous preachers , then ( I may say truly , though not without envie ) have been ever since the Apostles times ; The Name of our God , and of our Lord Iesus Christ , who by this meanes , hath Tryumphed over Antichrist , be praysed , and glorified for evermore . These have been and are Christs * * The manner of the old Triarian Souldiers fighting . Triarian band fighting against Antichrists power , with the sword of the Spirit in their lippes , their pike , their pen in their hand , and fighting on their knees by Prayre , and have so confounded Antichrist by the dint of their Sword , and Pike , the word of God , that he hath no meanes left him , but by his legates à latere , to negotiate his cause with Kings and Princes of the earth , to ‡ ‡ Rev. 16.14 . incite them against the precise party , by taking their weapon ( Gods word , and the preaching thereof ) from them , leaving them nothing , but their bare knees to plead their Cause upon , even Prayers ▪ and Teares , these which the powers on earth may cause , but never deprive them of And how farre you have been a stickler , and instigator in this kind , I appeale to your practises , and to this your Book , sufficient , and competent witnesses against you .

But to return to your Fathers : ( you say , that they , for all their preaching so farre beyond others , yet no one of them durst think himselfe infallible , much lesse , that whatsoever he preached , was the word of God . 'T is true , they had been no wise Fathers , but Children rather , yea proud and foolish Men , if they had thought themselves to be infallible , which is proper to God alone ▪ But whatsoever they preached out of Gods word , that they had good evidence it was according to the Scripture , why should they not , not onely thinke , but be assured , that being the truth , it was infallible , as being the substance of Gods word , which they preached ? And so all other preachers .

Lastly , where you say , It may be observed , that no men are more apt to say , that all the Fathers were but men , and might erre , then they that thinke their own preachings were infallible . And what say you , I pray you , of your antient Fathers ? Were they any others but m●n ? And might they not erre ? But you are not perhaps so apt to say , They were but men , and might erre . You are willing to entertain , and retaine a higher opinion of them , then so . Or at least you are not so apt to say so of them , as they , then whom none are more apt to say , The Fathers were but men , and might erre . Sure if there were cause enough , and urgent too so to say , ( as when it concernes the glory of God , and the truth it selfe ) he that is aptest to say so , is the most to be commended . And now let us here a little inquire , who these men be , that are so apt to say thus of the ancient Fathers , and for what cause , That they were but men , and might erre . Why , who should they be , but the precise party of the reformed Churches , as all the worthy , reverend , pious , religious , learned , and judicious Divines , both beyond the Seas , and on this side , who undertaking to defend the truth of Christ , against Antichrist : and their Adversaries objecting , and pressing so much the authority of the antient Fathers in such things , wherein they could not be otherwise excused , but that they did a'n●ropopathein , speake as men , who are not in all things infallible : what could they in such a case , answere otherwise , But that those Fathers were but men , and might erre ? Nor did they speake this out of any disesteem of those Fathers , but when they were ( I say ) so urged to defend the truth against the Adversaries of it , by the evidence whereof , they were able to make good what they sayd , that those Fathers were but men , and might erre . Now for this , who is more apt , then your Lordship to cast in the dish of this precise party ( as you call them ) that they should upon just cause speake thus of your antient Fathers ? What would you say then , if all this party should as one Man rise up , and openly professe against you , as a notorious enemy of the truth , and of the Church of God in England , and elswhere , and of all pious , sincere , and zealous Preachers of the Gospell , and that under the Name of the precise party , which you so yoake with the Jesuites , you doe maliciously , not onely seek to undermine , but even professedly to invade and oppugne , the whole Kingdome of Iesus Christ , as also your practises , and this your Book can witnesse . And how doe you come to know the thoughts of this precise party , so well , that you say , they think their own preachings were infallible ? Surely you do but think so . You might therfore judge more charitably . But as I said of those Fathers , so do I of these , what they have a good and sure ground in Scripture for , to preach and teach , they may be sure , and they know it to be the truth , and so infallible . As for those that * * Psal. 59.12 ▪ preach of cursing and lyes ( as David speaks ) and suggest slanders , and false reports into the eares of Princes , and Courts against Gods Ministers and Preachers : let them thinke , and be assured too , that what they preach , or print , is not onely not infallible , but most malicious , and detestable , both before God and Man ; as tending also the blinding , and so to the downfall of such as beleeve such falshoods to be infallible .

L. p 104. When the Fathers say , we are to rely upon Scriptures onely , they are never to be understood with exclusion of Tradition , in what causes soever it may be had . Not but that the Scripture is abundantly sufficient , in , and of it selfe for all things : but because it is deep ▪ and may be drawn into different senses , and so mistaken , If any man will presume upon his own str●ngth , and goe single without the Church . And citing an excellent sentence out of Vincentius Lynnen●is ▪ quum sit perfectus Scripturarum Canon , sibique ad ommia satis superque sufficiat , &c. Forasmuch as that Canon of Scripture is perfect , and superabundantly selfe-sufficient to all things , and if you adde this your note upon it in the margent . And if it be sibi ad omnia , then to this , to prove it selfe , at least , after Tradition hath prepared as to receive it .

P. A little * * pag. 101 ▪ before , you cite also Augustine seting downe 4 speciall notes and marks internall to the Scripture to prove it to be the word of God . As 1. The Miracles . 2. That there is nothing carnall in the Doctrine . 3. That there hath been such performance of it . 4. That by such a Doctrine of humility , the whole world almost hath been converted . And there also to the same purpose Lynnen●is : who placeth the Scripture before Tradition . And here againe , That the Scripture is selfe-sufficient to all . What room then for Tradition ? Or if Tradition have any place at all , it were good manners for it to come behind , as a Handmayd waiting on her Mistris . But you can salve all with a wet finger , or with one drop out of your pen : If it be sibi ad omnia , that is , selfe-sufficient to all things , then to this , to prove it selfe , at least after Tradition ●ath prepard us to receive it . This is your own Addition , or Comentary and Glosse of your own Mother wit , which is , as Tertullian saith of the old Roman Senate , which had made a decree , that none should be taken into the number of their Gods , but such as the Senate it selfe should first think worthy , and approve of : So as Tiberius Caesar under whose Empire Christ suffered , when he had heard much fame of Christ , he moved the Senate , that Christ migh be entertained for one of their Gods . But the Senate for the foresaid Reason rejected it , because they first had approved of it . Whereupon Tertullian saith , Ergo nisi homini pla●uerit , Deus non erit Deus . Therfore except it please man , God shall not be God . A fit parralell for this very purpose . The Scripture , by the consent of all the antient Fathers , is abundantly selfe-sufficient to prove it selfe to be the word of God : but the present Church hath a Senatus consultum , a Decree , Tradition , which must first give her voyce and approbatiton , that the Scripture is the word of God ; otherwise in vaine are all those Encomiums and Commendations of the Fathers , though never so antient , affirming , and confirming , the Scriptures selfe-sufficiencie , even beyond all measure . The Tradition of the present Church must first give her voyce . Ergo , nisi homini placuerit ▪ Scriptura non erit verbum Dei : Therfore except it please man , the Scripture shall not be the word of God . Onely herein you goe beyond the Roman Senate : for their Decree for the admiting of a God was by the generall voyce of all the Senators : But yours is here from the sole and single Oracle of the Church of England . The Chaire of Canterbury . 'T is enough that you tell us , with an if , if the Scripture be , Sibi ad omnia , then to this , to prove it selfe , at least after Tradition hath prepared us to receive it . Otherwise , never talke of Fathers Authority , all is in vaine , The Scripture cannot be beleeved to be the word of God , unlesse The Tradition of the Present Church prepare the way to receive it . And , at least , you say ; which is no small deminution of the S●riptures selfe-sufficiencie , which you put with an if , at least . But of this sufficiently .

But let 's heare your Reasons further for your Tradition . The Scripture ( Say you ) is deep , and may be drawn into different sences ▪ and so mistaken , that any man will presume upon his own strength , and goe single without the Church . So it seemeth your Articles of Religion are deepe , as which not onely may be , but are drawne into different sences , and so mistaken , and that by the presumption of one mans strength , going single without the Church . But for the Scripture , though it be deep , yet it affords us both line , and Bucket sufficient to draw water out of those * * Esay 12.3 ▪ well● of Salvation , and so to give us a full tast , whereby to relish and resent whose word it is ; except the Tradition and Authority of your present Church doe cut off our line , and breake our Bucket . The Scripture hath both Milke for Babes , and strong Meat for Men. 2 Pet. 3. In the Sea both the Elephant may swim ( as AUG. and GREG. saith ) and the Lamb wade , and when it is by unstable men wrested and drawn into different sences , and so mistaken , yet it remaines the same unchangable truth still , and hath in it sufficient evidence , both to reconcile those differences , and to convince the gainsayer . 'T is true , Let no man presume upon his owne strength ; * * Psal. 25.14 . for the secret of the Lord is with them that feare him . Wha● was the cause then , that you have all along your Booke , ( as in part hath been shewed ) so perverted the Scriptures ? was it not because you took not with you for your guide , the Tradition of the present Church ? And was not this then a prusuming upon your own strength , when you goe so solely , and singly to worke ? But what meane you by going single without the Church ? The not consulting the Prelates ? Or because the Papists object , as you , The Scriptures are deep and darke : therfore we must in all things take the present Church Tradition in our way , where it may be bad , and be guided by that , as by Ariadnees Thread , through those manyfold Meanders of that intricate Labyrinth , the Scripture , as you make it . Or that you meane by Church Tradition , the Authority of the present Church of England , as one with that Church whereof none is ; and that this Authority must needs proceede and like a Candle before the Sun at noon-day ( as before ) shew us the way to know the Scripture to be the word of God : if we be willing to shut our eyes , and blindfold to be led by the Traditionall Authority of this your Church : what know we , but by such Authority you may tell us ( puting the ●ible clasped into our hands ) All that is cantained within those claspes , is the word of God . This you may be sure of , you have Authority for it , you need goe no further . And all your Bibles of your present Church of England , being by expresse Charge bound with the Apocrypha , so as they are punished that doe it not , all the Books forfeited , which may breed an opinion in the people , that those Bookes also are a part of the word of God : If now one hereupon opening the Bible , and lighting upon either that ridiculous tale of Tobies Dog , or that of the Angel , who tells Tobia● , that he is his kinsman ; and of the Smoke of the Fishes Liver that drives away the Devill ; or of Razis killing of himselfe , and commended for it by the writer of the Books of the Maccabees ; or that of the same Authors , doubting whether he hath done well , or no , in writing that Story , and the like : he may possibly by this meanes be brought to think meanely of the Scriptures , and that they are not the word of God , because he finds such things in the Bible ( so as it is bound ) as are ridiculous , false , vaine , impious , and uncertaine whether the rest be done , as it should be , &c. And thus by your Apocrypha , delivered into his hand by the Authority and Tradition of your present Church , he is brought to beleeve , that either the Scriptures of tha● Old and New Testament , are not the word of God , as wherwith those Apocryphall Books are equally bound in all Bibles : or else , that such Tradition of the present Church it little to be regarded , while pretending to lead men to the beliefe of the Scriptures , to be the word of God , there is no more difference made between them , and the Apocrypha , so full of vain lyes and ridiculous tales . And perhaps you may come in also as Epistle Dedic●tory . Time , and Pla●e , will permit ) with your Verbum Dei non scriptum to boot , the word of God not written , of which you tell us before , agreeing therein with Bellarmine . And at last , when your Tradition , and Authority hath sufficiently prepared the way , you will perhaps bring in your Traditions Apostolicke accompanied with the Decretalls of Gratian , which your Sister Church of Rome equall with the 4 Euangelists . But however , were it for nothing else , but to maintaine the credit of your present Church Tradition and Authority in commending to men the Scripture to be the word of God , you might doe well to take away your Apocrypha , which your Zeale will have placed in the midst between the two Testaments , not suffering any Bibles to be bound without it , which is , as ‡ ‡ Mr. H. B● . one saith , as a Blakamore placed between two pure unspotted Virgins . Nor doe I think , that your Lordship so placeth your Blackamore , as Ladyes put a black patch upon their Cheek , or Chin , as a foyle , to make them seem more fayre : so you , to make the Scriptures the more lovely , and desireable , or the better to be known , as things by their contraries , as white by blacke , or the straight by the crooked , or truth , by error ▪ Hierom. Epist ▪ ad Laetom . standing near it . And though Hierome ( who excludes the Apocrypha out of the Canon of Scripture ) saith , they may be read ad morum institutionem non ad confirmationem Fidei , for instruction of manners , and not for confirmation of faith : yet considering both the fooleries , and falsities , and vanities , and commended impieties , and confessed uncertainties in them ( as aforesayd ) all these things put together , might be ( me thinks ) of sufficient strength to thrust out that Blackamore by the head and shoulders from betweene those two fayre and unspotted Virgins .

L. ibid. It is most reasonable that Theology should be allowed to have some Principles ( as well as other Sciences ) which she proves not , but presupposes . And the chiefest of these is , That the Scriptures are of Divine Authority .

P. How ? Is the chiefest of these Principles allowed to Theologie , This , A true Principle overthrown by a false . That the Scriptures are of Divine Authority ? Doe you not forget Tradition now ? Doe you not reckon that for the first , and so the chiefest , as without which , the other cannot be granted ? Or perhaps you doe not reckon your Tradition , or Authority of the present Church to be a Principle of Theology . What then ? Perhaps , of Muthology , the science of setting forth Fables , Or , of Buttologie , the science , of much babble to no purpose . Or , Argologie , the science of vaine , and frivolous talke . Or , Carphologie , a gathering of Chaffe , as if you would by the heape of Chaffe shew us , where the Wheat is . Onely , your Tradition is no Principle of Theologie , and therfore a heape of chaffe wherein there is not one grain of the pure corn .

But let us come to see what is most reasonable . It is most reasonable ( say you ) that Theologie should be alowed to have some Prin●iples ( as well as other Sciences ) which she proves not , but presupposes . And what is Theologie , but the Scripture it selfe , and the Doctrines therein contained ? And however it be with other Sciences , which in comparison of Theologie are but imperfect and beggerly , so as they have need to begge their a'itemata , some Principles to be granted them , as grounds to worke upon , as the Mathematicks , &c. yet you might have given that honour to Queen Theologie , to which all other Sciences are but handmaids , as to exempt her from being a begger , yea and of that too , which is her own , and in her own possession , namely , That the Scripture is the word of God . This is one of Theologies prime Principles , which the Scripture doth suo jure vindicare , challenge as her own right , and which no man can take from her . And if Theologie must borrow or begge this principle : Of whom ? Of the Tradition of the Church ? Beware of that : For then * * Pro. 22.7 . the Borrower , should be servant to be Lender , as Solomon saith . And to Begge it , were worse . But if Theologie have this principle of her owne , and it in the Scriptures possession ; what need she goe either to begge or borrow it , and that of those , who can neither give , or lend it ? And if this be a Principle , that Scripture 〈◊〉 the word of God . What use of your Church Tradition ? For Principles are not to be denied . But you denying , that this can be beleeved , without the Tradition of the present Church doe first induce unto it : then you are one of those , that deny Principles . And Contra negantem Principia non est disputandum , we are not to dispute against him that denyeth Principles ; but in this case to hold him as an Heretick , Tit. 3.10.11 . and to deale with him as the Apostle admonisheth : A man that is an Hereticke , after the first and second Admonition reject : knowing , that he that is such , is subverted , and sinneth , being a'utokatákritos , selfe-condemned .

L. p. 105. The evidence of supernaturall Truths , which Divinity teaches , appeares not so manifest , as that of the Naturall , though in themselves more sure , and infallible .

P. Appeares not : true indeed to a naturall man . Here you speake by experience . But to the spirituall man this evidence appeares very clearely ; for ( as the Apostle saith ) The Naturall man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God , for they are foolishnesse unto him : Neither can ●e know them , because they are spiritually discerned . But he that is spirituall , judgeth all things ; as Solomon also saith Evill men understand not judgement : But they that seeke the Lord , understand all things .

L. p. 106. Faith is a mixed Act of the Will , and the understanding , and the Will inclines the understanding to yeeld full approbation to that , whereof it sees not full proof . Not but that there is full proofe of them : But because the maine grounds , which prove them , are concealed from our view , and folded up in the unrevealed Councel of God , God in Christ , resolving to bring mankind to their last happinesse by Faith , and not by Knowledge , That so the weakest among men may have their way to blessednesse open .

P. 'T is true , that Faith , being the life of the soule , anima animae ( as Aug. speaks ) doth informe and quicken all the faculties thereof , as the Will , Understanding , Reason , Affections : so as the Will doth no more incline the Vnderstanding to assent ( this being the opinion of those Schoolmen , that hold the Will to be the seat of Faith , as others do hold the Vnderstanding ) Then the Vnderstanding doth the Will , or Reason the Affections : But Faith being that Grace , which quickneth the whole soule , and in it all the faculties as aforesaid , it is this Faith Principally that inclineth all the whole soule with all its faculties to yeeld their unanimous assent unto it . And yet I deny not a mutuall reciprocation , and interchangeable cooperation , which is between these faculties , as in the naturall man , so in the spirituall man , regenerate by faith . For as in the naturall man somtimes the Vnderstanding inclines the Will , somtimes the Will the Vnderstanding , sometimes Reason inclines the Affections , and somtimes the Affections incline Reason , and that oftentimes with great violence to a wrong object : the like working there is among the sanctified faculties of the soule Regenerate , somtimes the Vnderstanding inclining the Will , somtimes the Will the Vnderstanding , and sometimes the Affections incline both ; as the Apostle saith ( speaking of zeale for God ) Whether we be besides our selves , ● Cor. 5.13 , 14. it is to God , or whether we be sober , it is for your Cause . For the love of Christ constraineth us . And the affections of the Apostle towards Christ were so strong in him , that they carryed his Vnderstanding , Will and Reason along with them with strong hand , when notwithstanding he was told of dangers , yea bonds abiding him at Ierusalem , and earnestly desired of his Friends not to goe thither : he answered ▪ What meane ye to weep , and to breake mine heart ? For I am ready not to be bound onely , but also to dye at Ierusalem for the Name of the Lord Iesus . Act. 21.13 . And Christ himselfe was so full of holy Zeale , and strong Affections , as he was carryed with a wonderfull violence of them , insomuch as they said of him , that he was madde . And his friends one time went to lay hold on him , Io● . 10.20 . Mar. 3.21 . saying he was besides himselfe . And many of Christ his Servants , his Ministers , being carryed with a strong love of Christ , and zeale for his glory , expressed in their courragious witnessing of the truth against wicked men , the enemies thereof , although their Vnderstanding apprehend the danger , and their Will could be content to live in peace , yet the Affection here carries all along with it , and they willingly follow , because the same Faith guides and carries all along with it , whence it comes to passe , that the affection here to Christ , and to truth being as it were the Leader of the rest , the Vnderstanding , Reason and Iudgement least appearing in the sence of the world , men are thereupon so apt and prone to Censure such Ministers of indiscretion . But this may shew the inward opperation of the faculties of a regenerate soule , how one works upon another reciprocally , and one inclines another , somtimes the superiour faculties , the inferiour ; and somtimes the inferiour , the superiour , but Faith is the principall agent working in , and inclining all .

It is not then the Will that alwayes inclines the Vnderstanding , but the Grace of Faith , which infused , doth at once both illuminate , incline , and draw both the Will and Vnderstanding to rest in the saving truth of God apprehended by Faith . This Faith I say doth so illuminate , the whole soule , with all its faculties , as that it selfe brings meat in the mouth ( as ye say ) even a full proofe in it selfe of the things beleeved : so as now not onely the affiance of the Will , but the affiance , and certain knowledge of the Vnderstanding doe rest themselves in the cleare evidence , which Faith it selfe bringeth with it , which evidence hath the ample and sure Testimony , both of the word of God , and of the Spirit of God , whose worke it is . For this saving Faith never goes alone , but is both ushered in , and wrought , and accompanied with the word and Spirit of Christ . For so soon as Faith is conceived in the soule , it unites to Christ , and so it hath communion with Christ , together with his Spirit mimediately ; so as both the Will , and the Vnderstanding , and the whole soule , heart and affections , so soon as Faith possesseth them ( which Faith is a plerophoria , full assurance of the things beleeved , and a cleare evidence of them , though not seen , as before is shewed ) there is withall exhibited both in , and with Faith a full sufficient proof of the things beleeved . * * Belying of God , and of the Scripture , and bewraying profound ignorance . How say you then , that the maine grounds , which prove them , are concealed from our view , and folded up in the unrevealed Councel of God ? And what main grounds , I pray you be those ? Can you tell ? Or doe you speake in the Clouds , that you may seem to say something ; which you understand not . For certainly this Mystery of Faith is concealed from your understanding , as appeareth by your darke and clowdy words . And is that unrevealed councell of God the object of our Faith ? Cometh not Faith by hearing of the word of God , wherein God hath revealed his will to us ? Or doth the Tradition of your present Church , lead you to beleeve such sencelesse speculations ? Indeed the Apostle saith , ‡ ‡ Col. 2.3 ▪ That in Christ are hid all the treasures of wisdome and knowledge . Hid , that is , layd up , and contained as a Treasure . But not hid from his true Church , and faithfu●l people , as the Apostle saith , † † 2 Cor. 4.3 . ● ▪ If our Gospel be hid , it is hid to them that are lost , in whom the god of this world , hath blinded the minds of them that beleeve not , least the light of the glorious Gospel of Christ should shine unto them . And againe , § § 1 Cor. 2.9 ▪ Eye hath not seen , nor eare heard , neither have entred into the heart of man the things , which God hath prepared for them that love him : But God hath revealed them unto us by his Spirit . But where ? Search the Scriptures ( saith Christ ) for in them ye thinke to have eternall life , and they are they which testifie of me ; so to this purpose the Apostle speaketh excellently , Ephes ▪ 3.4 , 5 , 6. and 1.9.17 , 18 , 19 and in many other places . But to you it seems these things are hid , and folded up ; and therfore no mervaile you know not what you say , nor wherof you affirme : As the Apostle saith of some † † 1 Tim. 1.5 ▪ 6.7 . Who were turned aside from Charity out of a pure heart , and a good Conscience , and of Faith unfained , unto vaine ●angling . Desiring to be teachers of the Law , understanding neither what they say , nor wherof they affirme . Let therfore the Prophet Esay read you a Lecture , * * Esay . 29.9 ▪ Stay your selves , and wonder : Cry ye out , and cry : They are drunken , but not with wine , They stagger but not with strong drinke . For the Lord hath powred on them the spirit of deep sleep , and hath closed your eyes : The Prophets , and your Rulers , the Seers hath he covered . And the vision of all is become unto you , as the words of a Book that is sealed , which men deliver to one that is learned , saying , Read this I pray thee : And he saith I cannot , for it is sealed : And the Book is delivered to him that is not learned , saying , Read this I pray thee : And he saith , I am not learned . Wherfore the Lord said , Forasmuch as this people draw neere me with their mouth , and with their lippes doe honour me , but have removed their heart farre from me : and their feare towards me is taught by the Precepts of men : Therfore behold I will proceed to doe a mervailous worke amongst this people , even a marvailous work and a wonder : for the wisdome of their wise men shall perish , and the understanding of their prudent men shal be hid . Woe unto them that seek deep to hide their councel from the Lord , and their works are in the darke , and they say who seeth us : And who knoweth us ? surely your turning of things upside down shall be esteemed as the Potters Clay . Loe , my Lord , I hope this word is not folded up : if to you it be , you shall one day both see and feele it more clearly and sensibly fulfilled .

But you goe on . * * Bold belying and blaspheming Gods Secret Counsels . God in Christ ( say you ) resolving to bring Mankind , to their last happinesse by Faith , and not by Knowledge . What , by a blind Faith ? For by Faith , and not by Knowledge , is all one , as to say , by such a Faith , as is without Knowledge , and so without light in it , and so blind . Wheras the true saving Faith , is a knowing Faith , it is the evidence of things not ●een , it sees him that is invisible ; as before is shewed . But my Lord , if the maine grounds be folded up in the unrevealed counsell of God : I wonder by what revelation you come to know his secret , That God in Christ hath resolved to bring Mankind to their last happinesse by Faith , and not by Knowledge ; surely God hath no where in Scripture revealed any such resolution of his . And if it be not written , Timeas 〈◊〉 ill●d ( as Tertullian forementioned said to Hermogenes the Heretick ) Feare that Woe to them ▪ that shall adde to the Booke of Scripture . But if you had leasure to Read the Scripture , it reveales unto us plainly what God in this businesse hath resolved to do , and how he will bring Mankind to his last happinesse ; and that is by a seeing , not a blind Faith : by a Faith explicit and cleare , not implicit , and folded up : by light , and not by darknesse . This is Gods way , that he hath chalked out unto us in the Scripture ( as before is fully proved of Faith ) and therfore we are sure , that God in Christ in his eternall councell resolved to bring us this way to heaven , and no other way . And this * * Ioh. 14.6 . way is Christ : and Christ is ‡ ‡ Ioh 1.4 . light : and in this way we must walke as ‡ ‡ Ephes. 5.8 . children of the light , and not as children of darknesse . And every true beleever , as he becomes a new man , so of a blind man , he becomes a seeing man . For this cause Christ came the § § Ioh. 1.9 . true light , that he might lighten every man that comes to him . For this cause was Paul sent to preach to the Gentiles , † † Act. 26.18 . To open their eyes , and to turne them from darknesse to light , and from the power of Satan unto God , that they may receive forgivenesse of sinnes , and inheritance among them which are sanctified by Faith that is in me , saith Christ ; so that every true Christian in his conversion , of blind , becomes seeing , of darknesse becomes light in the Lord , of Satans bo●dm●n , Gods ser●ant ; and by this way onely through Faith in Christ , they receive forgivenesse of sinnes here , with sanctification , and hereafter the eternall inheritance . But as for you , my Lord , as you have found out another way , namely , a blind way , Prelates blind Popish way . not by the way of knowledge , by which yet you pretend to your last happines : so be assured of this , that the place you are going unto , is just like the way that leads unto it , blind and darke , yea , utter darknesse , where the Pit is , into which , both the blind leader , and the blind led shall fall .

And for your further conviction , or else confusion , and confutation of your folly , and information of your blind Disciples , and confirmation of the truth to all the children of truth : note what Christ himselfe saith expresly , point blanke against you . You say , God in Christ resolved to bring Mankind to their last happinesse by Faith , and not by Knowledge . But Christ saith , This is the will of him that sent me ( this God hath resolved on ) that every one that seeth the Son , and beleeveth in him , should have eternall life , Iohn 6.40 . and I will raise him up at the last day : Marke here ; This is the Fathers will , his resolution , his revealed councell , and purpose . What ? That every one that seeth Christ ( not with bodily eyes here , but with the eyes of his soule , being illuminated by holy knowledge ) and so beleeveth in him , should have eternall life , and Christ will raise him up in the last day . Here is Mans last happinesse , to which God hath revealed t● us in his word , that he hath resolved in his councel to bring Mankind by Faith and Knowledge , together , and without seperation , as both seeing , and beleeving . Ephes. 4.11 . And this doth the Scripture every where shew unto us . Wherfore did God give some Apostles ; and some Prophets ; and some Euangelists ; and some Pastors and Teachers : but for the perfecting of the Saints , for the worke of the Ministry , for the edefication of the body of Christ : And ( Col. 2.2 ) That their hearts might be comforted , being knit together in love , and unto all riches of the full assurance of understanding , to the acknowledgement of the Mystery of God . What a high and admirable expression is here ? And 6.7 . this is to be rooted and built up in Christ . Againe , on the other side , what 's the Cause and sourse of all wickednesse , and infidelity superstition and Idolatry , but ignorance of God , and of his word ? As Ephes. 4.17 . This I say therfore , and testifie in the Lord , that ye henceforth walke not as other Gentiles walk● , in the va●ity of their minds , having the understanding darkened , being alienated from the life of God , through the ignorance that is in them , because of the blindnesse of their heart , &c. So , 1 Pet. 4.3 . Hos. 4.1 . 1 Pet. 4.3 . and Hos. 4.1 . The Lord hath a controversie with the Inhabittnts of the Land , because there is no truth , nor mercy , nor knowledge of God in the Land . And vers. 7. My people are destroyed for lacke of knowledge : Because thou hast rejected knowledge ( mark it well my Lord ) I will also reject thee , THAT THOU SHALT BE NO PRIEST TO ME. And on the other side againe , Ier. 3.15 . The Lord saith , I will give you Pastors according to mine heart , which shall feed you with knowledge , and understanding ; namely , the people whom the Lord is in Covenant with : But it seemeth your Priesthood standeth not with the nature and office of those Prophets , which feed the people of God with knowledge and understanding . You can teach the people a shorter cut to heaven , and more easie for the Priest : for you tell us , God hath resolved to bring Mankind to blessednesse another way , then by knowledge . Wherin , how farre , you not onely dishonour , but blaspheme the truth of God , in Fathering such a foule and abominable lye upon him ; for this , I leave you to that judgement , which he hath revealed in his Word .

But you seem to doe all this in charity , That the weakest among men may have their way to blessednes open . A way open ? You meane surely the broad way , and you know whither that leads , and how the many such weake ones , as you speake of goe in that way . And broad and open your way had need to be , both for the multitude of the travailers therein , and for their blindnesse , and for the darknesse of the way , that so , though both they and their guides be blind , yet the way is so broad , as they cannot possibly goe out of it , so long as they do but follow their Nose , which must be their guide , for want of eyes . But it may be you will alledge that saying of Augustine , Indocti rapiunt regnum Caelo●um , &c. The unlearned and ignorant take by violence the Kingdome of heaven , where we that be great learned Clerks are shut out . Ergo , the way is open for the weakest ▪ and shut against those , that abuse their Learning to Gods dishonour , and soules destruction . But whom doth Augustine there meane , by unlearned ▪ Ignorants that had no Faith , nor true Religion in them ? Certainly , ther 's no heaven for such . The * * 2 Sam. 5.6 ▪ blind , and lame come not within the fort of Sion . But a true beleever may be unlettered , or ( as they say ) not book learned : yet , not without knowledge . For if he hath faith , he hath a knowledge of God in Christ . And being Christs , he hath the Spirit of Christ , and this quickens him up ●o diligence in the use of all good meanes of saving knowledge ; as to heare Gods word faithfully preached , ( for he knows Christs voyce ) and frequently read , and conferred upon ; and he meditates on it , his mind is much upon it , as yours is of your honours , and favour in Court , how to keep them : and he is still praying for increase of grace , and faith , and knowledge . And my Lord , many a such man I could bring , that cannot a letter on the Booke , that for all your seeming Learning , would put you to your Trumps , if your greatnesse would but descend so farre , as to reason with him of the Scriptures , and of Christ , and so of faith , and the like . For there 's all his Learning . And such unlearned ones they be , who goe to heaven , yea * * Mat. 11.12 . take it by violence ( as Christ saith ) when great Lord Prelates are shut out . As Christ saith to the Pharisees : ‡ ‡ Mat. 21.31.32 . The Publicans and ●arlots goe into the Kingdome of God before you , for they beleeved Iohns preaching : but ye , when ye had seen it , repented not afterwards , that ye might beleeve him .

But you goe on in your blind way , and say , pag. 109. Pag 109. Blasphe●●●g againe of Gods Counsells . The way of knowledge was not that , which God thought fittest for mans Salvation . 'T is true , not such a speculative knowledge , as you speak of : but God thought it fittest to bring men to salvation by a knowing Faith ; as before is shewed . I will conclude this with the Apostles thunder : ‡ ‡ Gal. 1.8.9 . As we said before , so say I now againe , if any man preach otherwise , then that is delivered in Gods word , let him be accursed . And if the Scripture accurse him , that § § Deut. 27.18 leads the blind out of his way , to which curse all the people say Amen : then what curse is due to him , that teacheth the blind such a way , as leads to certain destruction of Soule and Body ? Shall not all the people say Amen to this curse ?

L. p. 106. Credit of Scripture hang'd upon mans opinion of God . See 165. The Credit of the Scripture depends not upon the subservient inducing Cause , that leads us to the first knowledge of the Author , which leader here is the Church : but upon the Author himselfe , and the opinion we have of his Sufficiencie .

P. Doe you not make the credit of the Scripture to depend upon the Authority of the present Church , when without this subservient inducing Cause you deny the possibility of beliefe , that the Scripture is the word of God ? For you say expresly , pag. 120. When I said , Scriptures were Principles to be supposed , I did not , I could not intend , they were prius cognitae , known before Tradition ; Since I confesse every where , that Tradition introduces the knowledge of them . But if the credit of the Scripture depends not upon the Church , wheron then ? On the Author ( Say you ) and the opinion we have of his Sufficiencie . Here be two things which you couple together : 1. The Author : 2. The opinion we have of his Sufficiencie . 1. For the Author , which is God : 't is true , that God himselfe is the Author of the Scripture , and so it is the word of God ; and God the Author beares witnesse of the Scripture , that it is his owne word ▪ And where doth God beare this witnesse ? Is not this his witnesse in the Scripture it selfe ? Doth not his Spirit speake in it , and tell us , that it is his word ? Saith not his Spirit expresly , that * * 2 Tim. 3.16 . All Scripture is given by Inspiration from God ? And doth not the Scripture it selfe tell us this ? Saith it not then of it selfe , that it is Gods word ? And so saying , doth it not beare witnesse to it selfe , that it is the word of God ? And is not the witnesse therof true ? And if true , doth not the credit of the Scripture depend upon it selfe , as it is the word of God that speaks in it , that it is the word of God ? Or how can you so seperate the Author from the Scripture , he speaking in it , but that you must confesse the credit of the Scripture to depend upon it selfe , when you acknowledge it depends upon the Author ? For as ‡ ‡ 1 King . 19.12 ▪ 13. God was in the Soft and Still voyce : so he is in the Scripture , which is the Soft and Still voyce of God . And as Elias knew by the soft and stil voyce , that the Lord was in it : So we know by the Soft and Still voyce of God , the Scripture , that God is in it , and therein speakes unto us . And what God therein speakes unto us , the Scripture , which is his voyce speakes unto us . So as the Scripture being Gods own voyce speaking unto us , what it saith , is of the Same credit , that God himselfe , the Author and Speaker , is of . And therfore , if the Credit of Scripture depend upon the Author , it depends withall upon it selfe , because it is Gods own voyce .

But Secondly , you couple here with the Author , the opinion we have of his Sufficience . Mans opinion of Gods Suffi●iency 〈◊〉 ●ain and blind . So as first , it seems you doe not allow the Credit of Scripture to depend simply and Solely upon the Author , but withall upon the opinion we have of his Sufficiencie : And what if we fayle in our good opinion of the Authors Sufficiencie ? Wheron will you then hang the Credit of the Scripture ? Surely it must depend upon our opinion . That 's the dint of your speech . But of our selves we are altogether ignorant of Gods Sufficiencie . How then , or whence shall we come to have such an opinion of his Sufficiency , as whereon the Credit of the Scripture may infalliby depend ? From the Authority or Tradition of the present Church ? Alas your present Church will tell us , that the holy Trinity may be expressed in a Picture , and that God the Father may be pictured like an Old Man , because Christ in Daniel is called the Ancient of dayes . For thus you pleaded against Mr. Sheruile in the Starre-Chamber , when you fined him 500. pound to the King , for defacing the Images of the Trinity in his owne Church-window , he being a Justice of Peace . If therefore the Almighty and Incomprehensible God may be expressed in an Image , what opinion can we have of his Sufficiencie , to be the God of truth , and the Author of the Scripture , as whereon the credit therof may depend , when we expresse and represent him by that which is a lye , a meere vanity ? For the Scripture calls an Image , a lye , as Esa. 44.20 . And , a teacher of lyes : Hab. 2.18 . And vanity , wind , and confusion : Esa. 41.29 . And falshood , Jer. 10.14 . And v. 16. God the portion of Iacob is not like them . And an Image made to represent God , is a lye , and falsehood , because it is a false representation of God . For God is a Spirit , Invisible . And , Esa. 40.18 . To whom will ye liken God ? Or what likenesse will ye compare unto him ? And the Second Commandement expresly forbids any Image to be made , to represent God by . So as the practise of your present Church in adoring and seting up , and maintaining Images in Churches , and Copes , and the like , whereby you represent God , The Prelates blind opinion of Gods Sufficiencie . doth teach men a base and false opinion of God , and so of his All-Sufficiencie . And therfore , Secondly , in Saying Wee , upon the opinion Wee have of his Sufficiency , you that are the Setters up , and maintainers of lying Images of God in your Churches , must needs be those Wee , upon whose opinion of Gods Sufficiency must depend the Credit of the Scripture . And what opinion can you have of Gods truth , that represent him by a lye , and falshood ? And what opinion can you have of his Sufficiency in being the Author of the Scripture , that hold and affirme his Scripture and word to be an insufficient witnesse to prove it selfe the word of God ? And what opinion can you have of Gods Sufficiency , who doe every where by your open practises , and your Shamelesse blasphemies in fathering your lyes upon God in this your Book ( as hath been noted but now ) proclaime to the world what little feare or dread you have of his Majesty , as if he were not a just God , in punishing wickednesse , or in his power insufficient to tame proud Rebells ? Thus if by the Tradition of the present Church we cannot come to such a knowledge of God , as to have a right opinion of his Sufficiencie : whence shall we have it ? Surely all true knowledge of God is to be learned from the Scripture . But that you make to be of no credit , but as it depends upon the Author , and your opinion of his Sufficiency ; which what it is , we have taken a Scantling of . And so the conclusion is from these your Premisses , that , No credit of Scripture to teach , no true knowledge of God : no right opinion of his Sufficiency , nothing for the Credit of the Scripture to depend upon : and having no credit in and of it selfe : Ergo , the Scripture is of no Credit at all . This is the very Summe and Sequele of your Speech , and indeed the upshot of those sharpe arrows , which you have with all your might and malice let fly at the Credit of Scripture , to give it the deaths wound . Yet you adde :

L. p. 111. Scripture , though it give light enough for Faith to beleeve , yet light enough it gives not , to be a convincing Reason , and proofe for Knowledge .

P. These words are to be expounded by what you have formerly Sayd . Though it give light enough : that is , though it should or could give ●ight enough . For that it doth not give light enough for Faith to beleeve , you have plainly told us . As pag. 80. The light which is in Scripture , is not bright enough : it cannot beare sufficient witnesse to it selfe . If it cannot , then neither can it give light enough for faith to beleeve . For sufficient light for Faith to beleeve , springs from a sufficient light in Scripture , to beare witnesse to it selfe . But this ( Say you ) it hath not : Ergo not the other . Againe you Say ( pag. 81. ) Church-Authority must first light the Candle . Ergo the Scripture hath no light of it selfe , much lesse light enough for faith to beleeve But though it should , though it be granted , that Scripture had light enough for Faith to beleeve : yet light enough it gives not , to be a convincing Reason and proofe for knowledge . As if you said , Neither for Faith : for we have proved before , that faith and knowledge goe inseperably together , true faith being a seeing and knowing faith , and not a blind faith . The Scripture teacheth no blind faith . And why should not Scripture give light enough , to be a convincing Reason and proofe for knowledge ? When it is a sufficient light to * * H●b . 4.12 . discover unto a man the secret thoughts and intents of his heart , wherof man himselfe is thorowly convinced , and thereby in himselfe condemned of his own Conscience ? But this knowledge you cannot away withall . But you can never put out the eyes of your Conscience , though you may for a time fold it , or lull it fast asleep . Much lesse shall you be able to put out the light of Scripture , which is greater then the light of your Conscience . As Saith the Apostle , ‡ ‡ 1 Ioh. 3.20 . If our heart , or Conscience condemnes us , God is greater then our heart , and knoweth all things . If therfore the heart or Conscence , that is in man , be a sufficient witnesse of all his thoughts ‡ ‡ Rom. 2.15 . good and bad , and layeth them before him , as the Apostle saith : much more is Gods word a sufficient witnesse , and giveth light enough to be a convincing reason and proofe for knowledge . And Solomon Saith , * * Pro. 20.27 . The spirit of man is the Candle of the Lord , searching all the inward parts of the belly . If such then be mans spirit , the Candle of the Lord , searching all the inward parts of the belly , that is all the secrets of mans heart : how much more is the Spirit of God in the Scripture , his Word , such a searcher , yea saith the Apostle , § § 1 Cor. 10 . 2● The Spirit searcheth all things , yea the deep things of God . And these deep things of God he hath revealed unto us by his Spirit . And where but in his word , the Scripture , is the voyce of this Spirit of God ? And it was the constant sentence of all the Ancient Fathers , whom you would seem so much to adore , which Augustine expresseth in these words ; In Scripturu sacris apertè continentur ea omnia , quae necessaria sunt ad S●lutem : In the holy Scriptures are clearly contained all those things , which are necessary to Salvation . Now how should this be true , if the Scripture doth not give light enough , to be a convincing reason and proofe for knowledge .

L. p. 113. To prove the Scripture to be the word of God , first cometh in the Tradition of the Church , the present Church : So 't is no Hereticall or Schismaticall beliefe . Then the testimony of former Ages , &c.

P. Here at length , you come neere the winding up of the long thread of your endlesse Discourse in this your 16 th Section , the summe wherof is to prove , that the Scripture is of no selfe-credit and Authority , And first and last , your present Church Tradition must be the Prime hand to lead the bl●nd to this beliefe , that Scripture is the word of God . For otherwise the beliefe thereof should be Hereticall , or Schismaticall , For thus you say ; To prove the Scripture to be the word of God , First comes in the Tradition of the Church , the present Church : So 't is no Hereticall or Schismaticall beliefe . Ergo Beliefe of Scripture to be Gods word , comes by any other way , ( as by the word of God it selfe , read and heard , in the preaching of it , and by Gods Spirit speaking in it ) then wherein the Tradition of the Church , the present Church hath been the Prime leader . This beliefe is Hereticall and Scismaticall . Ergo this beliefe in all the Apostles , Martyrs , Ancient Fathers and Doctors of the Primitive Ages , who never knew any such Tradition of the present Church , as whereon this beliefe should depend , for its necessary prime inducement , was Hereticall and Schismaticall . They constantly held ( till Rome and you brought in this your blind guide , to tread down under feet the light of the Scripture and to exalt the Authority of your Antichristian Hierarchy ) that the Scripture was of self-Authority and Sufficiency to prove it selfe to be the word of God and by the hearing of it preached and read , to beget and confirme faith in al beleevers without any such inducement of Church Tradition as you speake of . And therefore here you passe your sentence of condemnation of this beliefe in all those forementioned , for Hereticall and Schismaticall . But how justly may this sentence be retorted upon your selfe , and your present Church , as both Hereticall and Schismaticall . Hereticall as in the maintenance of Doctrines of Devils ( as afore ) of the Pelagian and Semi-Pelagian Heresies , under colour of your doubtfull Articles of Religion as you have made them by publik Edict and Declaration , and flatly forbidding to preach of the Saving Doctrines of Grace , as they are clearly layd down and taught in the Scripture ; and in seting up and maintaining of your Altars , whereby the onely Altar Iesus Christ is denyed ▪ and in d●spensing with the 4 th Commandement ; yea destroying and unmoralizing of it , and so overthrowing the Lords-day-Sabbath , wherein you subvert the whole worke of Redemption , with the Resurrection ; and the like : thus your present Church is Hereticall : as also in this , in holding and stiffly maintaining by you a necessity of your present Church-Tradition , for the inducing of beliefe of the Scripture to be Gods word , as not sufficient , and wanting light of it selfe to doe it , and which otherwise is of no credit at all : Thus I say you are damnably and desperately Hereticall . Secondly your present Church is also Schismaticall , being a Seperation from the true Church of Christ , in your Hierarchy , or Prelacy ; which being altogether ●ntichristian hath no communion in that respect with Christs Church , and therfore is notoriously Schismaticall : yea in this also Schismaticall , that you account and brand that beliefe of Scripture to be Gods word , for Hereticall and Schismaticall , which is not first induced by your present Church-Tradition , wherein you are Schismaticks from the Faith ; and so from the Church of the Apostles , and Ancient Fathers , and succeding Churches which never held any such Hereticalll opinion , concerning any such insufficiencie of the Scriptures , and Authority of the present Church , as you most pertenaciously and pernitiously hold : Therfore I Conclude that if the present Church of England , approve of your Book , and hold as you doe , it is both Hereticall and Schismaticall . But you conclude :

L. p. 115. So then the way lyeth thus as farre as it appeares to me ) The Credit of Scripture to be Divine , reduces finally into that which we have touching God himselfe and in the same order . For as that : So this hath three main Grounds , to which all other are reducible . The First is , the Tradition of the Church : and this leads us to a Reverend perswasion of it . The Second is , light of Nature : and this shews us how necessary such a revealed Learning is , and that no other way it can be had : Nay more , that all proofes brought against any point of faith , neither are nor can be Demonstrations , but Soluble Arguments . Most notorious bl●spheming against the Holy-Ghost , making him the Author of falshood . The Third is , The light of the Text it selfe : in Conversing wherewith we meet with the Spirit of God inwardly inclining our hearts , and sealing the full Assurance of the suffi●iencie of all three unto us , And then and not before we are certain that the Scripture is the word of God both by Divine and by Infallible proofe . But our Certainty is by Faith and so voluntary , not by Knowledge of such Principles , as in the light of nature can enforce Assent whether we will or no.

P First here , you make the manner of the way and order of beliefe of God , and of the Scripture to be one and the same So as beliefe of Scripture to be Gods word must first be induced by the Tradition of the present Church , els it wants credit : so beliefe of God to be God must be in like manner and order induced ; els that 's without credit too . This is just , as we applyed Tertullians Speech before concerning the Roman Senate , which would not alow Christ to be admitted and inrowled in the Catalogue of their Gods a● Caesars motion , because , according to a Decree of the Senate , it had not first moved it , as the Prime inducing cause , whereupon Tertullian saith , Ergo nisi homini placuerit , ●eus non erit Deus , Therefore unlesse it shall please man , GOD shall not be GOD. So by your Doctrine here : God shall not be beleeved to be God , unlesse it come in by the doore of the present Churches Tradition , as the sole necessary prime inducer of it . How did men beleeved God to be God , before this new Doctrine of yours came in to lead them the way ? was all the world then drowned in a Deluge of Atheisme and Infidelity ? so it seems , Till this light of your present Church Tradition shined in the world , it was all as tha● * * Exod. 10. Aegyptian palpable darknesse , all men sitting all that time , and not stirring one foot to any degree of beliefe , that GOD was GOD.

But come we to your 3 Grounds , wherein you summe up all the Totall of all this tedious Discourse in this Section . The First is , The Tradition of the Church that 's ever presupposed , as a Prime principle , having the Precedencie before that other Principle , that Scripture is that word of God ; as before . Well , what doth this Tradition ? It leads us ( say you ) to a Reverend perswasion of the Scripture . This is a faire inducement . And without this , no Reverend perswasion of the Scripture can be had . Thus the Scripture must be beholden to your Tradition for a Reverend perswasion of it . And who will not have a Reverend perswasion of that , which the most Reverend Father in God commends as LAUD - able ? Well , let this suffice for that .

The Second is the light of Nature . Well ; and what office hath that ? It shews us how necessary such a revealed learning is , and that no other way it can be had . But your Revealed Learning here is somwhat obscure ; we cannot well tell , whether you mean this your Revealed learning of this your present Church-Tradition concerning beliefe of Scripture ; or the Scripture it selfe . But be it either , or both , all is one , we doe not much stand upon it . Let it be the Scripture beleeved to be Gods word , by the first necessary Inducing cause , Tradition ; as then which no other way can be had . This is then your Revealed learning , which the light of Nature shews us how necessary it is ; How necessary it is , that the beliefe of Scripture to be the word of God ; should be induced by Tradition , bec●use no other way it can be had . Of Natures light we have spoken before sufficiently . And one no●e more resulteth from your words here . And that is , That forasmuch as natures light is altogether blind in spirituall things , and can no more judge of the Scriptures , then a blind man of Colours , nor discerneth any more light in the Scriptures , then a blind man doth light in the Sun , when it shineth at noon day ▪ and Natures light judging all things according to her carnall sense ; and having those things in greatest admiration ‡ ‡ Iude 16. and highest esteem , which have the greatest and most glorious outward luster , dazeling the eyes of her carnall mindednesse : and there being nothing in the world , that carries with it a more glorious and glittering show in the eyes of carnall and naturall men , then a Hierarch or Prelate Sitting in his Chaire in his Pontificalibus , with all heads bare round about him in the Great Hall of his Princely Palace , and especially when he sits the supreme Judge in all those Causes brought into his Court : and all this glory is accumulated , and highly elevated in the light of Naturall mens eyes , not onely in respect of all the outward splendor of the Present Church : but because of an Instinct of nature in all men , concerning Religion and Piety , and the Service of God , which is ●ed and nourished with a great pretence and profession of holinesse in th●se Right Reverent Fathers whose very bare Titles of most Reverend Fathers , stike a reverence into all such Naturalists hearts , as in children toward their Fathers , and much more to their Gh●stly Father ; and which also is highly contented , and pleased with the variety of Ceremonies and Pompous Service , as most sutable and agreeable to natures fancy , which knows no other Religion , but that which stands in these externall things : And seeing this Tradition of the present Church , hath no testimony , ground , nor warrant for it in the Scripture , but is a thing meerly usurped by the pride of Man : And seeing none are fitter Judges to passe their sentence , on Traditions side , then such as are blind , as Nature is in all spirituall things , onely having a bare name of light , as a Candle going before her , whereby others may take notice of her ; Therfore not without great reason do you take the light of Nature for a Second to your Church Tradition , as a fit consort , which will easily speake for you , whatsoever you desire , giving her blind testimony to confirme your blind Cause .

And you adde : Nay more , that all proofes brought against any point of Faith , neither are , nor can be Demonstrations , but Soluble Arguments . To wit , without your Church Tradition , as the Inference sheweth . This is a pretty point in Divinity indeed , That the light of Nature is become a Iudge in points of Faith , whether the Arguments brought against it , be Demonstrative or no ▪ But this s●ppery is so fully refelled before , that we need to say no more .

We come now in the last place to your Third ground Which is the light of the Text it selfe : in conversing wherewith ( you say ) we meet with the Spirit of God , inwardly inclining our hearts , and sealing the full assurance of the sufficiency of all three unto us ▪ We meet ? Who ? Surely you never met with this Spirit of God in your conversing with the Text it selfe : Which if you had , you would not have uttered such things Yet if this Third ground you had put single by it selfe , as the sole , excluding the former , it were true Divinity : but puting the two former before it , as necessary inducing causes to perswade the Scriptures sufficiency ▪ you do therby utterly overthrow it , as also that Spirit of God breathing in it , and inwardly inclining and perswading the heart to beleeve . For how come we to meet with the Spirit of God in our conversing with the Text , but because , conversing a ●ight by prayer and humility , we find it breathing and speaking unto us , in his own word and voyce ? For the Spirit is never seperated from his word , as is shewed before . Now if Gods Spirit breath in the Scripture , and in our reading thereof , with a mind rightly disposed , we find the same speaking effectually unto us to the setling of our faith : is this spirit and word tyed to any necessary dependance of any outward things , as without which it can have no operation ? Doth not this spirit ( as the * * Ioh. 3. wind , to which Christ Compares it ) blow where it listeth ? Can you by any art or invention cause the wind to blow ? Doth not ‡ ‡ Psal. Iob 35. God bring it out of his Treasures ?

But your Conclusion is the foulest of all . For you say , this Spirit of God sealeth the full assurance of the sufficiency of all Three unto us . Belying and blaspheming the Holy spirit of God . That is , First of your Church Tradition , as aforesaid . 2dly Of the light of Nature . And ●dly , and in the last place , of the Scripture . But you make the sufficiency of these 3 equall , and alike , Saving that you give your Church Tradition , and the light of Nature , the Precedency of the Scripture And in saying , that Gods Spirit sealeth the sufficiency of those two , to wit , Church Tradition , and light of Nature , for the reason aforesaid , which are altogether insufficient , and are a meere lye , and falshood , and have no ground nor warrant from Scripture : but are contrary thereto , and destroy the credit , authority , and sufficiency thereof . I must tell you that herein you do most impiously blaspheme the spirit of Truth , as if it were the Author , Approver , and ratifier of a lye .

And you adde : And then an not before , we are certaine , that the ▪ Scripture is the word of God , both by Divine and Infallible proofe Here still you shut out from the Scripture all Self Authority , sufficiency ▪ and Testimony to prove it selfe the word of God , not allowing it so much , as you doe to Tradition , and the light of Nature ; for these say you perform their offices sufficiently : but you have nothing to say for the Scripture , as if that had any thing at all to doe , but to wait upon the good pleasure of Lady Tradition , and light of Nature , for their Commendation and approbation , and then , having their good words , this is sufficient , to bring in the Spirits testimony , to seale the sufficiency of all three ; the Scriptures sufficiency being this , to be recommended by the other two ▪ And then , and not before , we are certain that the Scripture is the word of God , both by Divine , and infallible proofe ; but not of the Scripture it selfe in any case .

But ( say you ) our certainty is by Faith , and so voluntary , not by knowledge of such Principles , as in the light of Nature can enforce assurance , whether we will or no Why , what certainty can we have , but by Faith in Christ ? But what mean you by voluntary ? By your Free-will ? That which Luther calls Servum Arbitrium , servile Will , such as mans naturall will is to Spirituall things . And surely this you mean by voluntary . For before you do so highly magnifie the light of Nature , as being of such sufficiencie , as we need not doubt of your good opinion of the Naturall Will of man , having as much liberty in heavenly things , as light . Well ; by Faith , and so voluntary , not by knowledge of such Principles , as in the light of Nature can enforce assent , whether we will or no. You spake of such Principles before , which we answered ; as also the forceing of assent . We come now to the close of the 16 th Section .

L p. 116. I have said thus much upon this great occasion , because this Argument is so much pressed * * Notorious and grosse hypocrisie , pretending respect to Scripture , when never any Iesuite , did more vilifie and nullifie the Authoritie and credit of it . Detection of the Hipocrisy . without due respect to Scripture . And I have proceeded in a Syntheticall way , to build up the Truth , for the benefit of the Church , and the Satisfaction of all men Christianly disposed . ( And a little after ) I labour for Edification , and not for Destruction .

P. When I look back to the premises of this Argument , and now upon the conclusion : I cannot but stand amazed at two things : 1. Your notorious vilifying or rather nullifying the Authority , sufficiency , and Testimonys of the Scripture , to prove it selfe to be the word of God : and 2dly your egregious hypocrisie , here in the close of all , as if you had done all with due resp●ct to Scripture . And how finely you would seem to put it off from your selfe , but laying the blame upon others , as the Jesuites . As if you had taken all this paines to vindicate the Scripture from that Disrespect , which Iesuites ha●e of it , in their pleading for Church-Tradition . And yet doe not you tell us before , that you goe the same way with the Iesuites in advancing Church-Tradition ; onely you say , you goe not so faare as they . And wherein , I pray you doe you come short of them ? They say , Scripture Authority , that it is the word of God , depends upon the Authority and Tradition 〈◊〉 of the Church : and you say , Scripture without Church-Tradition of no Credit , Authority , or sufficiencie , to prove it selfe the word of God . Nay you goe further : ●or , for all your Tradition , and the light of Nature , going before , yet not one word hath dropt from your pen , that Scripture ( I say after all your preceding inducements ) is sufficient of it selfe , to prove it selfe the word of God , but that still its Authority is precaria , at the good will of Tradition , and Authority of the present Church , whose sufficiency you preferre before the Scripture , in many respects , as hath been shewed .

And you haue proceeded in this way ( you say ) Synthetically . What 's that ? That is ( in the true E●imon of the word ) by way of composition , or confederation with the Jesuite , to bring both the Churches to a reconciliation , by your mutuall discrediting of the Scripture , as Herod and Pilate could not be made Friends , but in consenting to put Christ to death . And as Pilate gratified Herod , in sending Ch●ist bound unto him whereupon they became Friends : so you here ingratiate your selfe with Rome , in sending her this Book ( as I suppose it is there before this time ) wherein you present her with the Scripture bound in the fetters of Tadition , which puts on your Synthesis or League , in a faire forwardnesse , the Foundation being already layd . For you say , It is to build up the Truth for the benefit of the Church . We have discovered before what the truth is you speak of through your Book ; which is as much to say , as all that , wherein you agree with the Church of Rome as one and the same Church , for the benifit where of you have writ this Discourse to discredit the word of Truth . So as by your building up of Truth , is meant your pulling of it down with that hand , that wrote this Book . And for satisfaction of all men Christianly disposed : that is of a peaceable Disposition , and not perverse , peevish , and refractory , but willing to meet Rome at least in the halfe way . And ( in a word ) All your Labour is for Edification , not for Destruction . For Edification ? Wherin ? By rasing the Foundation of Faith , the Scripture , to build up the Tower of Babel againe in England ? And not for Destruction , but onely of the Puritan Profession , and Religion and the power of Godlinesse , and the Purity of Gods worship , and the sincere Preaching , and Preachers of the word of God , and in a word , in rooting out the precise party , where ever your Arme of flesh can reach them . This being your practise too well known , this must needs be your meaning and sense of these words of the Apostle , * * 2 ▪ Cor. 10.8 . For Edification , and not for Destruction Which as you most wickedly pervert and abuse ( as you ‡ ‡ 2 Pet. 3.16 . doe all other Scriptures ) ▪ to your false purposes ; so in this respect it is a Conclusion not unsutable to your whole Section , while thus you make the word of God of no Authority by your Traditions . Mat. 15.9 . And so here an end of this Section . But not an end of the prosecution of the same subject still : For it follows :

L. p. 118. You see , neither Hooker , nor I , Sect. 18. nor the Church of England ( for ought I know ) leave the Scripture alone , to manifest it selfe by the light , which it hath in it selfe . No : but when the present Church hath prepared and led the way , like a preparing morning light to Sun-shine , then indeed we settle for our Direction , but not upon the first opening of the morning light , but upon the Sun it selfe .

P. In the former Section ( 17. ) consisting of one page , the Jesuite objecting your words , The Bishop said , That the Books of Scripture are Principles to be supposed , and needed not to be proved : your Answere is , ‡ ‡ A 〈…〉 or put off . Did I say it needed no proofe at all to a naturall man ? or to a man newly entring upon the Faith ? yea or perhaps to a doubter , or weakling in the Faith ? Can you think me so weake ? I doe but mention this by the way , as taking notice with what a pretty slight you put off your recantation of that speech . But the next passage will cleare this more fully . Now this your Comparison of the morning light , let us clearely see how weake and improper it is for your purpose . For what is the morning light , but a beame , or beames of that Sun , which as children of the § § Psal. 19.5 . Bridegroom , doe usher him out of his Chamber , signifying his neare approach ? These beames ( I say ) are of the very same nature of that light , which is in the body of the Sun , and do immediately issue and spring from it , inlightning the Sky , or that part of heaven above the Horizon , which beames or morning light , as the Sunne advanceth nearer to his Rising † † Prov. 4.18 . waxeth clearer and clearer unto the perfect day . But now the Authority of the present Church , which you compare to the morning light , is no such beame * * Mal. 4.2 . of the Sun of Righteousnesse shining in the Scripture ( as in his Sphere ) as that it is of the same nature of the light of the Scripture . For the Scripture light is Divine and Infallible : but of Tradition you say , ‡ ‡ Pag. 90. I cannot find that the Tradition of the present Church is of Divine and Infallible Authority . Which if you could by all the light in the Sky at noon day , find , you would be no Churle in hiding it from the world or puting it under a bushell . But to hold you to the propriety of your Comparison , which at first blush showes as faire , as the first morning light : you may know , That the Sunne makes the beames to shine , and not the beames the Sunne : whereas you say , The Authority of the present Church , lights the Candle of Scriptures ( which otherwise gives no light ) and so makes it to shine . Againe 2 2dly , The morning light is an Infallible Index , or immediate foregoing token of the approach of the Sunne ri●●ng which it ushereth in : but you dare not say , yea you deny , that the present Churches Testimony or Authority , is infallible for the inducing of beliefe , that Scripture is the word of God . Thirdly , the morning light , so soon as ever it first peepeth , or dawneth , we say , and that truly , It is day : but an Infiel , or doubting or weake Christian , upon the first hearing of the testimony of the present Church , That the Scriptures are the word of God , is not so infallibly Convinced and perswaded , as therfore to beleeve it to be true . Fourthly , The morning light is alone a sufficient and infallible signe ( as being an immediate effect , an essentiall quality issuing from the Sun ) of its neare rising : but you confesse , that though your present Church Authority , be the Prime , yet it is not the Sole * * Gnômon . Index or finger , to point us out the Scripture to be the word of God ; but you joyne with it sundry other helps , as before you tell us . Thus no way can we find your Comparison proper , or pertinent to your purpose , being as a blind Horse , that halts downright of a●l foure . But this by way of application to the right purpose , I conclude out of it : That as the morning light which certainly and infallibly tells us of the approching of the Sun rising , and which perswades every man , whose eyes are awake , of the truth therof , is an immediate beame of that Sun , and of the same nature and quality of its native and essentiall light : So , that which is both Prime and Sole in leading us , Certainly and Infallibly to beleeve , that the Scripture is the word , yea and working also , and begetting this Faith in us , is the light or beame of the Scripture it selfe , displayed by the Ministry or Preaching of the Word , which is as the dawning of the day , or the ‡ ‡ 2 Pet. 1.19 . Day Stars first arising in our hearts ( as Peter speakes ) by meanes whereof we come actually not onely to beleeve ( without any other externall Cause ) that Scripture is the word of God , but also to know and feele that the Sun of Righteousnesse hath now begun to shine in our hearts by the beame of his Spirit ; the immediate forerunner of his rising unto the perfect Day .

L. p. 120. A ▪ C. Cannot but perceive by that which I have clearly layd down before , that when I said Scriptures were Principles , to be supposed I did not , I could not intend , they were prius cognita , known before Tradition , since I confesse every where , that Tradition introduceth the knowledge of them .

P. I doe but name these your words ( as before ) being but an Inculcation and Confirmation of such things , as I have abundantly Confuted before . Onely this I adde . That if the Scripture be not before the Tradition or Authority of the present Church : whence hath the present Church this her Authority ? and so whence her Testimony the Credit , to be of that absolute necessity to bring men to beleeve the Scripture to be the word of God ? Must you not be forced to come into the same Circle , The Prelate in a Circle . where a little before you found A.C. as to say ( which yet you never went about to prove , to prevent the losse of your labour ) the Scripture authoriseth Church-Tradition , and Church-Tradition necessarily introduceth beliefe of Scripture to be the word of God ? But if you be in this Circle , there I leave you

L. p. 121. This Principle then , The Scriptures are the Oracles of God , we cannot say is cleare , and fully manifest to all men simply , and in selfe-light , for the reasons before given .

P. The Reasons we have weighed and found them too light . But to all true beleevers , in Christ ; This Principle , The Scriptures are the Oracles of God , is cleare , and fully manifest , and that simply , and in selfe-light ; For the reasons and proofes before given , and which all true Christians , and Saints of God Confesse .

L. ibid. Yet we say , After Tradition hath been our Introduction , the Soule that hath but ordinary Grace added to Reason , may discerne light sufficient to resolve our Faith , that the Sun is there .

P. As this so often repeated by you usque ad nauseam , as crambe bis cocta , Coleworts twise boyld , and to no other purpose it seemeth , but to fill the empty belly of this your volume , and to make your present Church Authority swell the bigger with its ventosity , is but a repetion of the former : So I shall not need to repeat the Refutation . Onely this : Do , or can you discerne the Sun in the Scripture , by the light of your divine Candle , your Church Tradition ; And hath it not so much shining light , or is it so over-clouded or ecclipsed with the black letters , as nothing but the Authority of the present Church , must in the first place put to her hand to withdraw the Curtaine ? Surely the Sun is so glorious in it selfe , as be it never so much clouded , yet that will shew day above our heads if we doe but looke up .

L. ibid. Now men may be apt to thinke out of Reverence that Divinity can have no Science above it . But your own Schoole teacheth me , that it hath : namely , The knowledge of God , and of the blessed in heaven .

P And truly , my Lord , how ever you account and Reverence Divinity : yet for my part , I do not onely most highly reverence it , but conceive and beleeve the excellencie of it to be so transcendent , as I hold there can be no Science above it . For what is Divinity in its native and proper Notion ? Divinity in its proper Prime , and most sublime Notion , is the Deity , or God-head it selfe : Theiòtes , signifying the Divinity or Deity , the derivation from ●eòs , GOD. This is the Prime Notion of this word Divinity . The second Notion of Divinity , is pan tò gnoston tou Theou , all which may be known of God , which being in God as the light in the Sun , comes to be made known unto us , as by so many beames shining partly ( though in Comparison more obscurely ) in his works , and partly ( and that most clearely ) in his word , and most gloriously in Christ the * * Mal. 4.2 . Sun of Righteousnesse himselfe , ‡ ‡ Heb. 1.3 . the brightnesse of his Glory , and the expresse Image of his Person , the very light of the Scripture , and so of his Church . And of this Divinity as Christ is the full patterne and perfect platforme : so the Essence of the eternall Deity , and the subsistances of the 3 Persons in that one Godhead , together with all the glorious Attributes of God : but also the whole Mystery of Christ the Redeemer , comprehending and expressing whatsoever is necessary for us to know and beleeve for our Salvation . In which respect the Scripture may be called ( and that most proproperly , as by a Title proper to it quarto modo ) Gods Divinity-Booke and his Churches Divinity-Schoole . So that in the Scripture we have a most perfect and Compleat body of Divinity , of all Divinity , of whatsoever holy knowledge of God , and of Christ , and of our selves , requisite to our Salvation , and the setting forth of the Glory of God . In which respect ( unlesse a man will presume above that which is written ) we may truly say , That Divinity being but one and the same , and Science therof one , and the Rule of this Science but one all comprehended in the Scripture , That Divinity hath no Science above it . Yet your Lordship hath learned in the Iesuites , or Romes Schoole , ( wherein it seems you have been more trained up then in Christs Schoole ) That Divinity hath a Science above it . And what is that super-science , I pray you ? The knowledge of God say you ) and of the blessed in heaven . If you meane such a knowledge of God , and of the blessed in heaven , as is not revealed in the Scripture , I say , Quae supra nos , quid ad nos ? And it is presumption to conceive of any other knowledge of God ( fit for us to know ) then what is revealed in the Scripture , wherein is declared the whole counsell of God , concerning his Glory , and our everlasting good . And for the knowledge of the blessed in heaven , If you meane of the blessed Angels , we may know as much of them as the Scripture hath made known unto us . But this knowledge is not a Science above Divinity . And if you meane the knowledge of the bless●d Saints in heaven ; it is the same with that of the Saints on earth , onely Differing in Degrees of perfection . Or if you had meant the knowledge that is in God , and in the blessed in heaven , you should so have exprest it , In , and not , Of. But I think you speake of such a speculation , as is above the Spheare of our expression . Onely something though it be de non ente , you must say , that we may take notice what a profound Proficient you are in Romes Schoole in teaching us such a sublime and hyperbolicall Science , as is inexpressible in Babylons language , and therfore the fitter to darken the lustre of that Divinity , which so gloriously shineth , and is so exactly set forth in the Scripture . But you have plentifully shewed us , what Reverence you beare to this Divinity .

L. p 122. ( In the margent ) I would fain know , why leaning too much upon Tradition , may not mislead Christians , as well as it did the Iews .

P. * * The Prelate selfe condemned . And I would fain know why leaning so much upon Tradition of the present Church , as you doe , might not be the Cause , that hath lead you so much to undervalue the Scriptures , and may not mislead Christians , by teaching them as base an opinion of the whole Scripture , as the Jewes have of the New Testament .

L. p. 123. Even that Scripture of the old Testament was a light , and a shining light too : therfore could not but be sufficient , when Tradition had gone before .

P. What , told you us but now of misleading the Jewes , by leaning too much upon Tradition : and do you goe about the same way to mislead them ( blind as they be ) and to make them yet more blind , if possible , That you have gone to mislead Christians ? Doe you tell the Jewes now , that the old Testament is sufficient , when Tradition had gone before ? So as without Tradition preceding , no sufficiency in the Book . I perceive you will not yet have done with your Tradition as without which nothing is done .

L. p. 125. Certaine it is that by humane Autthority , Consent , and proofe , a man may be assured Infallibly , that the Scripture is the word of God , by an acquired habit of Faith : Cui non subest falsum , under which no error nor falshood is : but he cannot be assured Infallib●y by Divine Faith cui subesse non potest falsum , into which no falshood can come , but a Divine Testimony . ( And a little after , If you speake of Assurance onely in Generall , I must then tell you a man may be assured , nay Infallibly assured , by Ecclesiasticall and humane proofe . Men that never saw Rome , may be sure , and infallibly beleeve , that such a City there is by Historicall and acquired Faith .

P. Although you use here a Schoole Distinction , Cui non subest falsum , & cui non potest subesse falsum : Of Faith Historicall , and Faith Divine : Assurance generall , and Assurance particular : yet in truth in the upshot it will appeare you speake very Confusedly , as in the Babylonish Dialect or Phrase . For first you attribute Infallibility to your acquired habit of Faith , wherein is no falshood , which habit of Faith you oppose to Divine Faith , wherein no falshood can be : whereas Infallibility , in its genuine , or Gramaticall sense importeth impossibility of Error or falshood . For infallible is that which is not subject unto error , which cannot be deceived . So as you doe ( under correction ) very much mistake in applying your Schoole distinctions , Non subest , & non potest , to Infalliblity . I remember indeed that the Schoole-men apply this Distinction to Faith . Cui non subest , & cui non potest subesse falsum : but never to Infalliblity , for that is alwayes such , Cui non potest subesse falsum , which cannot be deceived . Look a little better in your School-men , and I beleeve you will find it so , as I say . Secondly , while you would seem to put a Difference between your acquired habit of Faith , which you expresse and instruct to be Historicall and Divine Faith , which you say is onely , to beleeve the Scripture to be the word of God : you doe bring both ends together , making your Acquired Faith , and Divine Faith one and the same kind , both Historicall . Onely Historicall Faith may differ respectively to the object , Humane or Divine : For it is an Historicall Faith that beleeves there is such a City as Rome , in which respect it may be called Historicall Faith humane : and it is an Historicall Faith that beleeves the Scriptures to be the word of God , in which respect it may be called Historicall Faith Divine . Divine I say , respectively to the object ; but being in kind the same Historicall Faith with the other , whose object is humane . And you tell us before , that ordinary Grace and a morall perswasion , upon the necessary previous Authority and Tradition of the present Church , works this your Divine Faith . All which reacheth no further , but to an Historicall Faith ▪ call it what you will , acquired , or divine . And your building this your Faith upon the Rise of humane Authority , and morall perswasion ( how ever you use the ingredience of ordinary Grace by naming of it ) yet you are not able to say whether this Historicall Faith , be an habit infused or acquired , though you never so much daube it over with Divine . Onely thus you give us occasion to take notice , what an accute School-Divine you are , at least so farre as a distinction or two will goe , which rather confound then distinguish . But admit you could demonstrate , and make it plain unto us , that your ordinary Grace , what ever it is , and a morall perswasion puts a speciall difference between your Divine Faith , and Historicall : yet to what purpose , will all this prove ? May not both these Faiths be found in wicked men , and Reprobates , however distinguished by divine ordinary Grace , and the like ? The Schooles have a knowne Distinction much more proper and sensible , and agreeable to the tru●h of Scripture , then those you bring , and so apply For speaking of the Difference between ordinary common Graces , and those peculiar to the Elect , they call the first , Gratia gratis data , Grace freely given , meaning Ministeriall Graces , which God freely gives , as well to the wicked as to the godly ; he gave as Royall Karísmata , or Graces to Saul , as to David ; and Apostolicall Graces as well to Iudas , as to Peter . And this Grace , Thus freely given is grounded on those words of Christ , freely you have received freely give . But that peculiar Grace , which God freely gives too , but onely to his Elect , is distinguished from the other , being called Gratia gratum faciens , Grace makeing us acceptable unto God ; according to that of the Apostle * * Ephes. 1.2.5.6 . According as he hath chosen us in him , &c. haveing predestinated us , &c. To the praise of the Glory of his grace , wherein he hath made us accepted in the Beloved . Or that , ‡ ‡ Rom. 3.24 . Being justified freely by his grace , &c. Now ordinary and Common Grace , being freely given of God , to whom he will good or bad , depends not upon humane Authority , as a necessary inducing Cause . Yet you make your present Church Authority , which is but humane , a necessary previous Cause to ordinary Grace , whereby your Historicall or Divine Faith ( as you call it ) is wrought in beleeving the Scripture to be word of God ; and so what ever faire termes you guild this Faith withall , it wil be found no better then either meerely humane , or at least common unto the wicked and Reprobate , which for all this your Divine Faith goe to hell : and then the difference is not so great between your Historicall and Divine Faith ( which you keep such a puzzell about ) but that a man may without any great hazard winck and chuse .

Ob. But you tell us before , That ordinarily the Scriptures must have Tradition to goe before . Therfore , that you place not an absolute necessity in it . Ordinarily ? So you once say indeed . But so , as withall it must be absolutely necessary . For you make all other meanes of this beliefe to be deficient , without your Church-Tradition leading the way . As for the Scriptures , those have not light sufficient for themselves , and are as a candle that must first be lighted , before it can give light , and that is , by Church Authority . As for the holy Holy Ghost that works not this Faith but by an ordinary Grace , and this Ordinary Grace hath no force at all , unlesse the present Churches Authority prepare the way . So as this , Ordinarily , of yours , admits of no exception at all , in any case , though never so extraordinary . And thus you exclude that your Divine Faith , as it is a worke of ordinary Grace ( as you call it ) from being any Grace of God at all , except Grace of Canterbury can dubbe it for a Grace . For all Grace is one of those two kinds , I named even now : either that Grace of God , which makes a man freely accepted in Christ , which your Ordinary Grace by your own Confession doth not : or that common Grace , which is said to be freely given of God to whom he will ▪ without the intervention or prevention of any outward meanes or respect ; which your ordinary Graces cannot be : for your selfe every where professe , that no ordinary Grace , nor any thing else can worke beliefe , that the Scripture is the word of God , unlesse your present Church Authority , tanquam Gratia preparans ac praeveniens , as a preparing and preventing Grace , prepare the way . And thus you see to what a Confusion all your Schoole Distinctions are brought . And in truth your Schoole Distinctions for the most part , being weighed in the just ballance of the Sanctuary , prove too light , and doe corrupt the truth For even that Distinction which I named , of Gratia gratis data , & Gratia gratum faciens , though the termes are good and true : yet as some apply the latter , to wit , Grace making acceptable , it is corrupt . As when by that Grace they understand Faith , Hope , and Charity , which being infused into the soule , a●e the matter ( say they ) of Iustification , and of our acceptation with God Now in this sense this member of the Distinction holds not good ▪ but is Popish . For Faith onely is that Grace , which makes us accepted of God , but this , not as it is a worke , or Grace inherent , but as an Instrument apprehending and applying Christ , in whom alone we are through Faith accepted of GOD , who * * Ephes. 1.6 . make● us accepted in the beloved ▪ So as he that will find any good and sound Distinction out of the Schoole-men , he must doe as Virgil said of his reading of Ennius , Margaritas è caeno legere , gather pearles out of the mudde : and he must look to have them well washed , and polished , and tryed by the Scriptures , before he use them to illustrate or confirme any Doctrine of sound Divinity . This by the way .

L. p. 226. The time was , before this A. miserable rent in the Church of Christ ( which I B think no Christian can look upon , but with a bleeding heart ) that C you and we were all of one beliefe . D That beliefe was tainted in Tract and Corruption of time , very deeply . A division was made : yet so , as E both parties held the Creed , and other Common Principles of beliefe . Of these , this was one of the greatest , That the Scripture is the word of God . For our beliefe of all things contained in it , depends upon it . Since F this Division , there hath been nothing done by us ▪ to discredit this Principle . Nay we have given it G all honour , and ascribed unto it more sufficiency , even to the containing of all things necessary to Salvation , with satis superque , * * Blasphemous lye enough and more then enough , which your selves have not done , doe not . H And for begetting and setling a beliefe of this Principle , we goe the same way with you , and a better besides . The same way with you , because we alow the Tradition of the present Church to be the first inducing motive to imbrace this Principle : onely we cannot goe so farre in this way , as you , ‡ ‡ A subtile insinuation . to make the present Tradition , I alwayes an infallible word , of God unwritten .

P. Here I Have Alphabetically , as by A , B , C. &c. noted sundry particulars . A That you call the Protestants seperating from the Church of Rome , a miserable rent . Why miserable , when Christ Commands it ? As Rev. 18.4 . as is noted before , and shall yet more in a fit place . So as the Protestants had been in a miserable condition , if this seperation , this rent had not been made . B 2dly , And must every Christian heart bleed to see it , because ( it seems ) yours doth ? Surely this hath cost the heart-blood of many thousands of Gods Saints and Martyrs , shed and spilt by that blood drunken whore . Yet better so to perish , by her temporally here , then to perish with her eternally hereafter ; which must have been , had not this miserable rent been made . C 3 3dly , But before this rent ( say you ) they and we were all of one beliefe . You may speake , for your selfe , if you had lived before the rent was made . We doubt not , but both you would have been of the same Faith with Rome , and would have continued in it , so as for your part there should never have been made such a miserable rent . We know well , both your Faith , and your Charitable and Peaceable disposition for that matter . Yea though that one beliefe was tainted . That should have broken no square . For you say , D 4 ly , That beliefe , that ( very one beliefe , whereof you and they then were , before the rent ) was tainted , yea very deeply too . But I say still , speake for your selfe , and your Confederates onely ; usurpe not the name of all Protestants quorum tu pars minima ▪ whereof you were the least part if any at all ) that seperated from Rome , whereof many , ( before they came to be called Protestants , which was upon their protesting against the Whore of Babylon , and for their just and necessary seperating from her ) dissented from , and disliked , and ( so farre as the iniquity of the times , and humane frailty , and unavoidable necessity permitted ) seperated themselves privately at least from many of her most notorious and intolerable en ormites , and not a few in their severall ages , wherein they lived , openly protested against her , both by writing and preaching , though it cost them their heart-blood for it . You have at hand a Catalogue of them in Catalogus , Testium veritatis , and in the Book of Acts and Monuments , and other Authors , both forraigne and domesticke , and that of f●esh bleeding memory E 5 ly , You prove your Faith was then one for hol●ing the Creed , and other Common Principles of beliefe , of which one of the Greatest &c. Indeed before that rent , Rome professed and held the letter and externall form of the Creed , but not the sense , faith , life , and substance , as elsewhere you confesse of the present Church of Rome . Did you so then , so now ? I doubt 't will prove so , in a great measure . For though you tell us , that your beliefe of all things contained in the Creed , depends upon this principle , That Scripture is the word of God . ( For that is the best sense can be made of your words ) yet there be many , even fundamentall Doctrines in Scripture which your beliefe depends not upon , A shamefull lye . nor your practises agree unto , as both before is touched , and occasion will be given yet more to speake of . F 6 ly , But since this Division ( say you ) nothing hath been done by you , to discredit this Principle , That the Scripture is the word of God . No ? Nothing ? Not , * * Pag. 80. when you say , The light which is in Scripture it selfe , is not bright enough , it cannot beare sufficient witnesse to it selfe ? Not , when you say , ‡ ‡ pag. 83 , 84. The Scripture is a light , but as a Candle that yeelds no light , till first it be lighted by Tradition of the present Church ? Not , when you say , ‡ ‡ pag. 77. That Scripture to be the word of God , is not so demonstratively evident à priore , that is , of and by it selfe primarily , as to inforce assent ? Not , when you say , § § pag. 86. Such a full light we doe neither say is , nor require to be in Scripture as is in Prime Principles , which carry a naturall light with them ? Is not this point blank against this Principle , That Scripture is the word of God ? Not , when you say , * * pag 87. God doth not require a full Demonstrative Knowledge in us , that the Scripture is his word , and therfore in his Providence hath kindled in it no light for that ? Not , when you say , That the Scripture cannot beare witnesse to it selfe , nor one part of it to another ? And yet in all this , and much more , hath nothing been done by you to discredit this Principle , That Scripture is the word of God ? Now let the Lord of the Scripture , whose Word it is , and all the Children of Truth be Judge in this matter against you .

G. 7 ly , Yet you dare say more , that you have given it all honour , and ascribed unto it more sufficiencie , Blasphemous lye ▪ ( as more then all ) even to the containing of all things necessary unto Salvation , with satis superque , enough and more then enough . How ? enough , and more then enough ? What ? A worke of Superarogation ? or superarrogancie , rather . Now fie for shame . Will no bounds of Sober Speech contain your lawlesse spirit , but that you must cast it in Gods dish , That you had ascribed to his Word all honour , and more sufficiencie , and more then enough ? Had you yet turned Lyrinensis his word in the margent ▪ superque , Abundantly , it had been both more agreeable to reason , and not lesse disagreeing with Grammer . Certainly it had become you of all other , to have qualified the construction of Satis superque , better considering what palpable hand and harsh language you have dasht the Credit of Gods most holy Bible withall . Extreames are not good . And your Hypocrisie here is too grosly counterfeited . Just as some Gentlewomans bad face , for want of Art , is daubed so much with laying on of Colours , that it is ridiculous to every beholder . And how say you in the truth of your heart ( were there any there ) that the Scripture containeth all things , necessary to Salvation , when it doth not containt tha assertion of yours , That the Scripture is not known to be the word of God , but by the Authority and Tradition of the present Church ? When yet this , That the Scripture is the word of God , is by your own expresse Confession , one of the greatest Principles of beliefe ? H 8 ly , For your going the same way with the Jesuites , partly your whole Booke , and partly all your practises doe Satis superque , superabundantly witnesse . Onely you say , * * 〈◊〉 . Subtile Insinuation detected 〈◊〉 vanity . you cannot goe so farre in that way with them , to make the present Tradition , Alwaies an Infallible word of God unwritten . No , not Alwaies Infallible , I hope . Onely somtimes perhaps Infallible , when you say the word of God . And if your present Tradition be not alwaies an Infallible word of God unwritten : I pray you is it at any time an unwritten word of God ? If it be then at such a time especially ( when its Infallibility is in Season ) is it not Infallible ? For Gods word is alwayes Infallible , be it written , or when he speaks it from heaven . But when shall we se the time , when you will prove your present Tradition to be a word of God unwritten , or to have any Ground at all in written word of God , the Scripture ? But if your present Church Tradition be not alwaies infallible , but that somtimes at least it may deceive us , certainly I conceive our safest course wil be alwayes to goe immediately and directly the shortest Cut , to the Scripture it selfe , which I am sure , is alwaies Infallible , and will never deceive us , and not at any time to depend upon your present Tradition , which is not alwaies an Infallible word of God unwritten . But me thinks I heare you say , That you make not the present Tradition , An Infallible word of God unwritten . No not absolutely , not Alwaies . We understand English . But if you could prove , This your present Tradition to be but somtimes an infallible word of God unwritten ( in the use at least you put it to ) it were no great Mastery to conclude it to be ( in that case ) Alwaies an Infallible word of God unwritten ; and so you should by this way of the Jesuites come full home to Rome . But I hope you will more clearely and fully expresse your selfe in this grand point , when ( to use your own words before ) It shall fit Time and Place . Epistle Dedicatory . In the meane time , if this be not the genuine sense , which I have picked , but not stollen ( for the interpretation is Grammaticall , and sensible ) out of your words ; then I confesse , your meaning is more abstruse and mysticall , then can be gathered from your manner of expression , your words having a tang of that * * Gen. 11. Difference between Rome and the Prelate about Tradition . confusion of tongues at the building of that old Tower . But the summe of it is , Here is the grand difference , between you and Rome : She makes her Tradition alwayes a word of God unwritten unfallible , you , yours not Alwayes : somtimes therfore ; and so it is blasphemy .

But at length ( pag. 127. ) the Lady calls you from the point of Church Tradition , to heare what you will say of the Church of Rome , whether you will Confesse it to be the Right Church . And ( saith the Jesuite ) the Bishop granted that it was . Now if the Lady were not dead ( as elswhere you tell us ) I should give her hearty thanks for being an occasion of delivering us out of this Purgatory-lake of your tedious , irksome , and endlesse Discourse of your present Tradition ; wherein , otherwise , it is to be feared you lye so long , till you had been drowned in your own puddle , or burnt up with your own hot zeale . But let us heare your Answere to the Jesuites relation of what you granted .

L. p. 128. There is a great deale of difference between The Church , and A Church : and some , between a True Church , and a Right Church . For the Church may import in our language The onely True Church , and perhaps the root and ground of the Catholick . And this I never did grant of the Roman Church , nor never meane to doe . But A Church can imply no more , then that it is a member of the whole . And this I never did , nor never will deny , if it fall not absolutely away from Christ . That it is a True Church I granted also ; but not a Right as you imposed upon me , So as , No Right , that is No Orthodox Church at Rome . And yet no newes it is , that I granted the Roman Church to be a true Church . For so much very learned Protestants have acknowledged before me ; and the Truth cannot deny it . For that Church which receives the Scripture , as the Rule of Faith , though but as a partiall and imperfect Rule ; and both the Sacraments as instrumentall Causes , and seales of Grace , though they adde more , and infuse these ; yet cannot but be a True Church in Essence . How it is in manners and Doctrine , I would you would lo●ke to it with a single eye .

P. Not Right then , not Orthodox , you hold the Church of Rome to be , That 's somthing yet . Yet True , you ever have and will hold her to be , unlesse she absolutely fall away from the Faith . Well . And yet I wot well , you give absolutely falling away from the Faith . So large bounds , as it is to be feared , you will never come to give her for absolutely gone , and fallen away from the Faith , so long as she can have , but one bare thread or ragge of the profession of the Faith of the Creed ; nay if she can but say over her Creed , though ( as you Confesse elsewhere ) she hath quite overthrown the sense of it . And if the sense of it be destroyed , surely the Faith of it also . This will more fully appeare as we goe along . We come to your Reasons why you hold Rome a True Church .

1. For very learned Protestants , which hold with you in this : First , we can set both as learned , and double the number of of Protestants , who will weigh down the Scale against those , that seem to be of your opinion . Secondly , we could out of those very Protestant Authors , whom you mean ( though I suppose you seldome read such Authors , and in other things scarce name them Honoris causa ) collect more against this opinion , That the Church of Rome is a true Church , then you can for it . As out of Iunius himselfe , for Instance . I mentioned before a la●e Book , intituled , Babel no Bethel , never yet answered by any Jesuite , or other Priest Romish , or English , where the Author hath cleared all , or most of those Protestants , which his Adversaries alledged , and I suppose you meane , from this opinion of yours . And then also the Author proves by many concluding Arguments ( and in my opinion unanswerable ) that the Church of Rome is no true visible Church of Christ , as having lost the very Essence of a true Church . To which Booke I referre your Lordship , could your patience but brook the Authors name , or your Conscience not tremble at the mention of him .

To your Second Reason : First , I deny that the Church of Rome receives the Scriptures as A Rule of Faith For first , The Rule of Faith must be in it selfe simply Divine and Infallible . But such to the Church of Rome the Scripture is not . For she makes the Infallibility and Divine Authority of the Scripture to depend upon the Church , as you do upon Church Tradition , which you confesse to be not simply Divine and Infallible . Ergo Rome receives not the Scripture as A Rule of Faith . Secondly , Rome receives not , holds not The Rule of Faith : Ergo she is not a true Church ; As the late Dr Carleton of Chichester in his Book of the Church hath well and learnedly proved : For not to hold the Rule of Faith , is to deny and destroy the Faith , and to fall absolutely away from the Foundation of Faith , and to set up a new and false Faith , upon a new and false Foundation . Nor dare , or doe you say , that Rome receives the Scripture as The Rule of Faith , but onely as A Rule of Faith , to wit , a partiall Rule , as Bellarmine calls it . But if the Scripture be ( as it is ) The onely Rule of Faith , and ever hath been in all ages so held , till Rome in the Councel of Trent changed this Rule : then not to hold it so , for The Rule , that is , the onely Rule , but onely as a partiall Rule , joyned with other Rules equall to it , as her Traditions , which Bellarmine in his Book de verbo Dei non scripto , calls the word of God unwritten : is to reject the onely Rule , and so to fall absolutely away from the Faith . And you confesse , that the Church of Rome holds the Scripture but as a partiall and imperfect Rule . And is this nothing with you ? What is this , but to evacuate and utterly make voyd the Rule , when for a perfect intire and absolute onely Rule , it is made but a partiall , imperfect , and joynt Rule ? And when humane Authority is equalled with Divine : Humane Traditions with Divine Scriptures , as an equall Rule of Faith ? Nay , and those her Traditions , which she calls her word of God unwritten , are such as teach things directly contrary to the Doctrines of Scripture , as of Purgatory , Invocation of Saints , and the like . Is not this , a'kurosai as Christ saith , to make voyd and of no Authority the Commandements of God by mens Tradition ? Yet this Camel you can easily swallow , you slight this over , as a matter of nothing : as if it were all one thing in a manner to hold the Scripture The Rule of Faith , and A Rule of Faith , namely a part or piece of the Rule : The whole Rule , and a partiall Rule : The onely perfect Rule , and An imperfect Rule . All this breakes no squares with you , but that Rome for all this , holds the Rule of Faith , and therfore you hold her for a true Church of Christ . But yet in so saying , you plainly imply , That if Rome held not the Rule of Faith , she is no true Church of Christ , but is absolutely fallen away from Christ the Foundation . For you give this for a Reason , that Rome is a true Church because she holds the Rule of Faith . Ergo If she hold not the Rule of Faith , she is no true Church of Christ , but is absolutely fallen away from the Faith . Whereupon I argue thus :

That Church , which denyeth the Scripture to be the onely Intire , Absolute , perfect Rule of Faith , Major ▪ is fallen absolutely away from Christ , and so ceaseth to be a true Church , that is , to have the very Essence and beeing of a true Church of Christ : But the Church of Rome denyeth the Scripture to be the onely , Intire , Absolute , Perfect Rule of Faith : Minor . Ergo the Church of Rome is absoluely fallen away from Christ , and so ceaseth to be a true Church , that is , Conclus●●● ▪ to have the very Essence and beeing of a true Church of Christ .

The Minor Proposition is confessed by your Lordship , For you say , The Church of Rome holds the Scripture , but as A Rule , a Partiall Rule , an Imperfect Rule . Thus she denyeth the Scripture to be the onely , Intire , Absolute , Perfect Rule of Faith . And for the Major Proposition , you doe by necessary Consequence confesse it also to be true . For you set it down as a Reason , why you hold the Church of Rome to be a true Church , because she holds the Rule of Faith , the Scripture : Implying , that to hold the Scriptures to be the Rule of Faith , is one speciall note of A true Church . But now you confesse againe that Rome holds not this Rule , but as a partiall and imperfect Rule . And therefore denying this Rule of Faith , she ceaseth to be a pure Church of Christ , And ( which is the more ) this the Church of Rome doth ex professo & solemni Decreto , professedly and by solemne Decrees , ratified as irrefragable , and that under Anathema to be received of all . And this is farre more then to doe it by Practise onely . And yet in Practise to destroy , and overthrow , but onely some speciall Doctrines of Scripture , though otherwise the Scripture be professed , and confessed , in this or that particular Church , to be the intire and onely Rule of Faith : is de facto to disclaime the whole Scripture , and to unmake it the perfect Rule of Faith : and so thereby , such a Church , possessing such and such Errors , as are Fundamentall , that is , against the Foundation , is fallen from Christ : as hath been formerly proved . Now if but any one part of Scripture , in this or that Doctrine of Christ , be overthrown , so as therein it is not made the Rule of Faith ; and this overthrowing such Doctrines being once professed and maintained generally , in any one particular Church , makes that Church to cease to be a true Church of Christ , as not holding the Scripture intirely , but professedly overthrowing it in such and such particulars : then how much more the Church of Rome , professing and maintaining gumne kephale , with a whores forehead , that the holy Scripture is not the onely Rule of Faith , intire and perfect , but partiall and imperfect ( as your Lordship confesseth ) doth thereby proclaime her selfe to all the world , to be fallen away absolutely from Christ , and so ceaseth to be a true Church of God . And denying the Scriptures to be the Rule of Faith , she denyeth the Foundation of the Apostles and Prophets , Iesus Christ himselfe being the chiefe corner stone : and so is fallen quite from the Foundation .

Nor onely thus by Addition of another Rule , doth the Church of Rome overthrow the onely Rule of Faith , the Scriptures : but also by denying the selfe Authority of them ; as also you doe ; and withall , by tying the sense of Scripture to the interpretation of the Church , as also you doe ; at least in difficult places ; and by holding and maintaining false Doctrines , against the Scriptures , which overthrow Christ , and wherein they will not be regulated by the Scriptures ; as you also doe , in your Altars , and forbidding the Doctrines of Grace to be Preached , and other things : which if the Church of England hold with the Church of Rome , and with you , you and both your Churches are fallen absolutely from Christ , and so cease to be true Churches of God . As also your very Hierarchy makes you to be no true Church of Christ , were there nothing else ; as before is sufficiently proved . And if you desire any further proofe , that the Church of Rome is no true Church of Christ ; I still referre you to the forementioned Book , Babel no Bethel . And though you supprest the Book , yet ten to one , but one of your Hounds will hunt it out for you .

Next , for the Sacraments : which is your second Reason : you say , The Church of Rome holds both the Sacraments as instrumentall Causes and Seales of Grace , though they adde more , and misuse these : Ergo she cannot but be a true Church in Essence . For Answere : First , she holds them not absolutely to be Sacraments , but dependently upon the Priests intention ; which you mention elsewhere . And so hath the Councel of Trent defined , of the Sacraments : so Vega : so Bellarmine . Secondly , if she be sure the Priests intention be not wanting , or going a woolgathering in his Consesecration , then she makes the Sacraments to be , not Instrumentall Causes of Graces , but aitia kúria , Principall and efficient working causes of Grace , ex opere operato , as they barbarously speake , by the immediate vertue of the worke wrought . So the Councel of Trent also . So as they shut out the Holy Ghost from this worke , as the Principall Efficient worker and sealer of Grace . Thirdly , For Baptisme , which you make to be an Infallible Marke of that Church to be Christian , besides their infinite corruptions of the Element of water , ( which the Apostle calleth pure water ) with their spittle , salt , creame , exorcismes , or conjurations of the Devils insultations , and the like , they hang the very beeing , not onely the vertue , of this Sacrament , upon the Priests intention , which intention of the Priest is so uncertaine , as Vega ( one of the prime Sticklers in the Councel of Trent , as aforesaid , in his Booke upon the Councel of Trent , especially the sixt Session , where he treateth of certainty of Faith , in Iustification , Confesseth , that there can be no certainty of Salvation to a man , because he cannot be certain , whether he hath true Baptisme or no ; and that in regard of the Priests intention , whereof he cannot be certaine : So as by this their own Doctrine , no one Papist can be sure , that he is a Christian : and so consequently , neither can all the members of that Church severally , nor conjunctly the whole Body it selfe , be sure whether they , or it be Christian or no ▪ and so the Church of Rome , upon this very ground , cannot resolve certainly , whether she be a Church of Christ or no ; unlesse your Testimony will help her out at a dead lift . And that not onely in regard of the Priests intention in the Sacrament of Baptisme , but also in their Additionall Sacrament of Orders , one of these more , which they have added to the two . So as for default of the Popes intention in ordering of Prelates , or of the Prelates invention in ordering one another , and in ordering of Priests , and of Priests intention , in Consecrating their Sacrament of Baptisme ( as themselves , Vega and others , do argue the case ) they are all put to the stagger , whether they have in that Church either Priesthood , or Sacraments . For all hangs upon that weake pin , or haire , of the Priests intention . So as another of their Primipili , a Standard-bearer ▪ of the Dominicans , in the same Councell , Dominicus Soto forementioned ) in his Book de natura & gratia , saith , that , Deus in potestate Sacerdotis posuit Populi salutem , GOD hath put the peoples Salvation in the Priests power . Now all this considered , and withall , the time , when this was made a Decree , in the Councel of Trent , a matter of 100 yeares agoe , and when it was but new , and the Pope and Prelates , and Priests could not perhaps , of a good while learne their lesson perfectly , and so get a habit of it , but that in all their Consecration of Prelates , and Priests , still intention was to seek , and where it breakes off , as in the Pope and Prelates , in their Consecration of Orders , there followes a meere nullity in succession of the whole Generation of Priests downwards , and so through that whole body no Priesthood now , no Sacraments : what evidence can the Church of Rome now give us , or what assurance can she have ( besides the bare name ) That she is still a Christian Church ? Onely Vega helps it , aswell as he can , That in reason and Charity men are not to thinke , that the Priest should be so carelesse at the Consecration ▪ as not to look to his Intention , upon which the Salvation of all men● soules dependeth .

Fourthly for the Sacrament of the Eucharist , or of the Altar , as they call it : First this is in the same Predicament with Baptisme , for the Priests intention , which if not present , at the Consecration of the Host ( as they call it ) there is no Transubstantiation , no body of Christ , and so they worship , a wafer instead of Christ , and so by their owne Confession , in that case they commit materiall Idolatry , as a * * Sweet . Jesuite confessed in Dispute with Dr Featly . But Secondly , by the very name of Sacrament of the Altar , they destroy the Sacrament that Christ ordained in his last Supper , called therfore ‡ ‡ 1 Cor. 11.20 . the Supper of the Lord . For they have turned it from a Supper , to a sacrifice , yea and that from an Eucharisticall sacrifice ( as the Fathers called it ) to a Propitiatory sacrifice , for the sins of quick and dead ; as is noted before . And so this Sacrament they have Non sacramented , and made of it a whole burnt sacrifice . Secondly , they have utterly destroyed the materialls , or Element in this their Sacrament , the bread and wine , that no ma● should so much as dreame , or once take it for the Lords Supper . For a Supper cannot be without bread and drinke : and he●e is neither . And so it is neither Supper nor Sacrament . And thus they have taken away , no● onely the cup from the people , but the bread also , altogether . So as there is nothing in their Sacrament but a meere lye , meere imaginations , Phantasmes of Accidents without subject ; as we said before . And so enough of this .

And lastly , the Church of Rome having disanulled the Sacraments of Grace , it hath withall disabled them from being seales of Grace . For it is the property of a seale to give a sure and certain Impression , and thereby a Confirmation of the Covenant . But in Popish Sacraments all certainty is taken away , as is shewed ; and so having lost the seales , consequently the Covenant of Grace it selfe is of no force unto them . And thus , in denying the two Testaments to be the onely rule of Faith , and overthrowing the two Sacraments the seales of Faith ; yea having lost and disclaimed the true Saving Faith it selfe : what evidence hath Rome left her to shew and prove , that she is now a true Church of Christ , or hath the Essence of a true Church ? Let her shew her evidence . As he said , * * Iugd. 6.32 ▪ Let Baal , if he be a god , plead for himselfe . Yet all this is of no Force to your Lordship , but that , like Ixion imbracing a cloud for Iuno ( as it is in that Fable ) so you imbrace but a cloud , or rather the shadow of a cloud , instead of the once faire Virgin Rome ; you must needs have her a true Church still . She onely ( say you ) misuses the two Sacraments . A small triviall trifle , to speake of . Misusing then , is nothing with you . What say you then to those wicked Princes and Priests of Israel ‡ ‡ 2 Chron. 3● ▪ 16. that misused the Lords Prophets ? Was this nothing ? They so misused them , that they stoned them to death . And so the Church of Rome hath so misused the two Sacraments that they have stoned them them to death , and left not one alive : But they have made amends for it . For ( say you ) they have added more , even no lesse then five , which are as the five wounds , wherewith the Lord was crucified to death . For those five have eaten out the other two of Christs own ordaining , both expressing his death , the one for ‡ ‡ Rom. ● ▪ ingrafting us into it , the other for growth and strength by it , as our spirituall food . And these five Sacraments fo humane invention , they must have their vertue of conferring Grace ex opere operato , being all , as they use them , a meere evacuating of Christs me it s . But time permits not a longer discourse of them . Enough is said for Answer . And for Conclusion , the Church of Rome having taken away the Authority of Scripture , and added her own Traditions : and having taken away and misused the Lords Sacraments , and added their own Sacraments : what remaines to that Church but that which the Divine Iohn Concludeth the whole Bible withall ? I testifie unto every man that heareth the words of the Prophecie of this Book : If any man shall adde unto these things , God shall adde unto him the plagues that are written in this Book : And if any man shall take away from the Book of this Prophecie , God shall take away his part out of the Booke of life , and out of the Holy City , and from the things which are written in this Booke . Out of the Holy City , which is the Church of Christ . Here then , in this holy City , is no place for the Church of Rome .

L. p. 131.132 ▪ The Church of Rome both was , and was not , a right , or Orthodox Church , before Luther made a breach from it . For in the Primitive times of it , it was a most right and Orthodox Church : but upon the immediate times before Luther , or some Ages before that , Rome was a corrupt and tainted Church , farre from being right . And * * A Privy Nippe . yet both these times before Luther made his breach .

P. The Conclusion then of your speech here is this , That Luther made his breach from the Church of Rome , not onely as it was Corrupt and tainted immediately , or in some Ages before , but also as it was right and Orthodox in her Primitive Times . For you say , And yet both these times before Luther ( as well those wherein the Church of Rome , was most right and Orthodox , as those wherein after , before Luther it was corrupt and tainted ) made his breach . And thus you make the rent on the Protestant party , to be not onely from the corrupt and tainted Church of Rome , but from the most Right and Orthodox Church of Christ . A pestilent speech , bewraying the speaker to be in the very Act. 8.23 . gall of bitternesse ▪ and in the bond of iniquity , and worhty to be abhorred and abandoned of all that beare the name of Protestants . But this agreeth with that which we noted before , how you exclude all the Protestant Reformed Churches , beyond the Seas ( where your Prelacie and Hierarchy is not erected , nor my Lord Bishops Chaire allowed ) from being any Churches of Christ , or members of the true Catholick Church . For here also in Luthers rent from the Church of Rome ) not onely as corrupt and tainted , but as once Right and Orthodox ) you include all those Reformed present Churches , and to exclude them out of the true Church of Christ . But as before we have shewed and proved , and shall yet more upon fit occasion ministred , upon the same cause , for which you exclude all Reformed Protestant Churches beyond the Seas from being Churches of Christ , because they are seperated from the Church of Rome , and from all Prelacy and Hierarchy : we do exclude you , and Rome , with your Prelaticall and Hierarchicall Churches , and Government Ecclesiasticall , from being any true Churches of Iesus Christ . And whereas you say , Rome was once Right and Orthodox ; 't is true that in Pauls time the faith of those Christian Romans was famous throughout the world ; and so it might continue pure for a time after : but when once the Prelacie and Hierarchy of Rome , and that but within Romes Diocesse , was erected , it became , Ipso facto , Antichristian : and after when the Bishop of Rome became supream over all Christendome , then it was the Church of Antichrist , from which it is necessary for all true Christians to make a perpetuall Seperation .

L. p. 133. The Roman Church which was once Right , is now become wrong , by imbracing superstition and error .

P. Such is your stile , to touch that delicate Woman tenderly , as saying , She is now wrong by imbracing superstition and error . But not by defiling her selfe with abominable Idolatries . This you never once charge her with in all your Book : as we shall see more at after . And onely error , as , humanum est errare : but you never tell her of her Heresies , and Apostacie from Christ , and her Doctrines of Devils . Beware of that . You have therfore put me to the greater paines in dealing plainly both with her and you .

L. ibid. 'T is too true indeed , that there is a miserable rent in the Church , and I make no question , but the best men do most bem●ane it , nor is he a Christian , that would not have unity , might he have it with Truth .

P. You are often putting your finger into this scarre , or rent . An Argument it paines you , because ubi dolor , ibi digitus . And I am perswaded , the more you put your finger in it , the wider you will make it . And certainly those that are indeed the best men are so farre from bemoaning such a rent , as they rejoyce in it ( the cause considered ) as in their glory and safety . And such Christians as have the greatest wisdome tempered with their goodnesse , do see such an Impossibility of Reconciliation with Rome , that they account it the greatest folly in the world , once to dreame of such an unity , as is coupled with a condition of Truth , I mean Truth indeed , not such a Truth as you mean there , where nothing but superstition and error , Idolatry and Infidelity , Hypocrisie and Iniquity , Ambition and Avarice , Pompe and Pleasure , are the onely supporters of Peters Infallible ( but counterfeit ) Chaire . Unlesse you mean ( as you must doe ) those good men , which are your Confederates in your Idolatrous Altars , and other Superstitions and Idolatries , halting between two opinions . God and Baal , and have already one foot over Romes threshold● accounting themselves with your Church of England , one and the same Church with Rome , as two branches of the same tree ; as two Sisters of the same venter , ready to salute each other with the kisse of amity and unity , as * * 1 King . 20. A●ab did his Brother B●nh●da● : then much may be ; what should hinder your unity ? And for your Truth ( as we sayd before ) we know very well what it is : Rome will not want for that , which you call Truth .

L. ibid. But I never said , nor thought , that the Protestants made this rent .

P. I pray you do you think , as you speake ? But admit it ▪ Why should you think so ? Or why are you so zealous , in makeing such an Apology , which true Protestants indeed will never thank you for . But you are such a Protestant , as I dare say would not have been the first , that should have made the rent ; no nor the hindmost neither , so firme you are for peace . But I noted before a necessity of Seperation to be made by the Protestants from Rome , as Christ admonisheth , Rev. 18.4 . Come out of her my people , &c.

L. p. 135. He must leave my words to my selfe , and their sense either to me , or to the genuine construction , which an Ingenious Reader , can make of them .

P. 'T were well , If you would observe the same Law your selfe to others , Then you would not so frequently as you doe ‡ ‡ Isa. 29.21 . make a poore Minister an offender for a word , and lay a snare for him that reproveth in the gate , and turn aside the just for a thing of nought ▪ as the Prophet speaks .

L. ibid. The Protestants did not get that name , by protesting against the Church of Rome , but by protesting ( and that when nothing else would serve ) against her errors and superstitions . Do you but remove them from the Church of Rome , and our Protestation is ended , and the Seperation too .

P. Yes , by protesting against the very Church of Rome , got they , and that deservedly the name of Protestants . For were not those errors and superstions you speake of , yea and Antichristianisme , and abominable Idolatries , and universall Apostacie ; become the very body and soule of the Religion faith , and practise of that Church ? Was not your Dalilah , the Church of Rome , become that Harlot , and Mother of whoredomes , and all abominations , before the Seperation and rent was made ? Could they then protest against her corruptions , and not withall against her selfe ? Were not all her corruption : so incorporated unto her , as they were altogether inseperable from her , like the * * Ier. 13.23 ▪ Blackamores skin , or the Leopards spots , which cannot be changed ? And do not you confesse , that they protested against her Corruptions , when nothing els would serve , when there was no remedy left , when she was grown incorrigible , So as they might have said , as in the Prophet , ‡ ‡ Ier. 51.9 ▪ we would have healed Babylon , but she is not healed ▪ Forsake her and let us goe every one into his own Countrey : for her judgement reacheth unto heaven , and is lifted up even to the Skies . It applyes it selfe . And my Lord , you speake too late , and in vain to A.C. to remove Romes errors and superstition : A C. is not of the Faith , to remove such mountaines . He cannot w●sh the Blackmore white . You must procure such a Generall Councel , as is at least equall to that of Trent , to reverse all those Decrees , whereby all Romes superstitions and errors are so ratified , as England will sooner heare of a Parliament for Reformation , then Rome will indure the thoughts of any more Generall Councels , to question or meddle with her Trent Decrees . Rome is now setled upon her lees , and you shall sooner remove the City of Rome it selfe from her muddy Tiber , then the Church of Rome from her superstitions . Nor is the black skin more conaturall to the Ethiopian , nor spots to the Leopard , then Idolatry , Superstition , Infidelity , Apostacie , and all error is conaturall to the Beast with seaven heads , and ten hornes , as making up both the Complexion and Constitution of that painted Whore . And therefore you might have saved all this labour in vain , in writing such a Volume , out of a hope to worke an unity with Rome , when her superstitions and errors shal be removed ; and that is ad Graecas Calendas , when men sheere their Goates : so in this respect you may safely say , That when Romes errours and Superstitions are removed , our Protestations and Seperation is ended . And so may I.

L p. 136. Protestants doe but protest the sincerity of their Faith against the Doctrinall corruption , which hath invaded the great Sacrament of the Eucharist , and other parts of Religion

P. Well were it for you , and your present Church of England ( as you have lately made it , or would at least make it ) if you had such sincerity of Faith to protest against Romes doctrinall corruptions , as true Protestants have ▪ But why doe you call the Lords supper , The Great Sacrament of the Eucharist ? Is it Great , because you give it a Name , not known in Scripture . Or because it is so grandized in the Church of Rome , as it is made like the Great ‡ ‡ Act. 19.34 . Diana of the Ephesians , whom all the Pontifician world worshipeth ? Or it is Great comparatively to Baptisme , because this is celebrated in the Font at the Church doore , neere the Belfrey , and That upon your high Altar , which you have advanced at the chiefe ( as you esteem it ) and East end af your Chancels , and of your stately Cathedrals ? Or Great , because in your Devotion you bow towards that place , whence ( it seems ) you look for your help , yea so lowly fall down and worship before it , as before the Lord your maker ? Or what is it that your Eucharist is become with you so Great a Sacrament , Because it , or , your selfe is Great with Child of a young new God-Almighty ? But however , For my part , I reverence every Ordinance of God , but I dare not make nor esteem them greater , then God hath made them , nor give them other Names and Titles , then God hath given them , least I either seem to be wiser then my Maker , and their Author ; or should give more honour to them then is due : this being ( as wofull experience hath taught ) the ready way to rob God of his honour , to transferre it to the creature , and set it up instead of God . But loth you are , I know , to call the Sacrament * * 1 Cor. 11.20 the Lords Supper , as the Scripture calls it , least it might call for the ‡ ‡ 1 Cor. 10.21 Lords Table ( as the Scripture also terms it ) and so your high Altar should have no more Room in the Church . But doe the true Protestants protest the sincerity of their Faith , onely against the Doctrinall Faith , which hath invaded your Great Sacrament of the Eucharist ? Yes , you adde , and other parts of Religion . What be those ? That we may know those speciall Doctrinall Corruptions , against which you say Protestants do protest the sincerity of their Faith . For Rome hath many Doctrinall Corruptions against which true Protestants protest , which you do not so much as mention in all your Book , and such too , as do ●●atly overthrow the Foundation Christ . As Iustification by works for one , which we have touched before . Yea and Rome hath many , and those most damnable corruptions , which you are so farre from accounting corruptions , as you make them Essentiall parts of Gods worship . I name Altars for one . Of which also before . And these things we Protestants protest the sincerity of our Faith against . But you are none of those Protestants , as not professing , much lesse protesting the sincerity of any such Faith .

L ▪ p. 138. A right sober man may without the least touch of insolence or madnesse , dispute a businesse of Religion with the Roman either Church or Prelate ( as all men know Irenaeus did with Victor ) so it be with modesty , and for the finding out or confirming of truth free from vanity and purposed opposition against even a particular Church .

P. This passage I cited before in my Preface to your Lordship , yet I here recite it again , because perhaps all wil be little enough to put you in mind therof : For as I told you before , the Greatnesse of the Cause hath caused my stile and Spirit to mount upon the wings of zeale for my Christ , and for his Church in a higher degree and strain then ordinary . And that for this you Censure me of insolence or madnesse ( as I feare it wil be the best defence you can make for your Cause alwayes excepted the Bill in Starre-Chamber ) I have no remedy , but patience , committing the Cause to him that judgeth rightly . And as I have done it for the finding out of the truth , so this hath caused me a great deale of moyle in digging and removing away a masse of earth and rubbedge , which you had cast , to hide this Treasure from us . So as a purposed opposition was not it , that set me upon this Great taske , but yet I oppose you , and purpose to detect your falsities so fairly guilded over with hypocrisie , that you might not impose too much upon your Credulous Reader . You aledge for this purpose the Example of Irenaeus , arguing a Case with Victor Bishop of Rome , which you say all men know . But my Lord , I suppose all men do not know it . And because it is a matter both worthy , and not unnecessary for all men to know it : I will take occasion here to speake somthing of it , as not impertinent also to our present purpose .

Towards the end of the second Century , there was a difference between the Asian Church , and the Roman , about the Day of Celebrating the memory of the Lords Resurrection . The contention grew hot ( as commonly men are most eagre in propounding their own devises in matter of Religion ) so as , because the Asian Churches would not conforme to Victor Bishop of Rome , he began to fume and to thunder , and threaten them all with Excommunication . Irenaeus , who lived in France , for this reproves Victor , telling him , that he ought not to proceed and deale so with Asian Churches for such differences , as were of things at that time accounted Indifferent . Some , saith he , fast one day before Easter ; some , two ; some , more ; some , * * Tesparákonta hóras . 40. houres together ( whereupon by the way it seems , that those 40. houres were afterwards turned into forty dayes , for your Lent Fast ) kaì cudèn élatton pàntes o●uioi eirteneusàn tè , kaì eireneúomen pròs alluious : yet neverthelesse ( saith he ) all these lived peaceably together , and we also are at peace one with another . Kaì he diaphonìn tes nesteías tèn homónoian tes píst●os sunistesi : And this difference about Fasting commendeth ( saith he ) the unity of Faith . And he relates unto him also the examples of sundry of his Predecessors in the Sea of Rome , who neither kept it themselves , nor command of it to others ; and yet neverthelesse they that observed it not , were at peace with those that came to them from the neighbour Churches or Congregations , wherein it was observed . Nor were any at any time cast out of the Church about the Manner or Custome . But those Presbyters ( saith he ) who before you observed it not , * * Hoi prosou Presbuteros . Fpempon Eukaristían . sent Commendations or kind salutations and greetings , as tokens of Charity , to those of other neighbouring Churches , who did observe it . And blessed Polycarpus sojourning at Rome in the time of Anicetus , and they being at some small oddes between them , yet preserved peace , and did not fall out about this matter . For neither could Anicetus perswade Polycarpus not to observe it , nor did Polycarpus perswade Anicetus to observe it ; but each left other to their own Customes . And thus they communicated together ; and in the Church or Congregation Anicetus gave the Eucharist to Polycarpus out of a reverent respect , and so they dismissed each other in peace , and in all Churches , but those that observed it , and those that observed it not , had peace one with another . And thus Irenaeus pherònumos tìs , according to his Name , became a Peace-maker to all the Churches . So ‡ ‡ Eccl. Hist. l. 5. c. 26. Et Socr. lib. 5. Eccl. Hist. c. 22. Eusebius .

Now as these things I here relate by Occasion : so the Consideration that sundry particulars therein may be not unusefull . As 1. That things Indifferent , and of humane Ordinance in matters of Religion , ought not to be imposed upon mens Consciences as necessary to be observed , but in such things Christian Congregations or Churches ought to be left free . Secondly , in variety or difference in opinions , or manners and customes in things Indifferent , Christians may and should keep fast the unity of the spirit in the bond of peace , and testifie the unanamity of Faith in the diversity of Factions , nothing being done against Gods word . ‡ ‡ Rom. 14.5 . One man ( saith the Apostle ) esteemeth one day above another : another esteemeth every day alike . Let every man be perswaded in his own mind . And v. 13. Let us not judge one another in these things , but judge this rather , that no man put a stumbling blocke , or an occasion to fall , in his brothers way . And v. 19. Let us follow after the things that make for peace , and things wherewith one may edifie another . So , All meates are in their own nature cleane : but of any think this or that uncleane , to him it is uncleane . And that whole Chapter is of things indifferent ( such at least , as those Primitive times in the more tender infancie of the Church admitted and esteemed indifferent ) as of Dayes and Meates , wherein mens Consciences were not to be forced . And as concerning our Christian liberty , we must take heed ( saith the Apostle ) least by any meanes it become a stumbling block to them that are weak ▪ Thus we see what the Christians in the primitive Ages did . Thus did the Bishops of Rome themselves before Victor , whom Irenaeus calls Presbutérous , Presbiters . Thirdly , Victor is reprooved by Irenaeus for breaking this peace among the Christian Churches , and s●eking to bring their Christian liberty ●nto bondage , by forcing them is conforme to his assumed n●w Altar , wherein his Antichristian pride and Tyranny began to sh●w it selfe in attempting what his Predecessors 〈◊〉 not do● in this kind . Fourthly , Victor being thus reproved , defi●●ed from his violent course , and yeelded to Irenaeus his Allegations , and so gave way for Churches to injoy their liberty with peace .

Now , my Lord , to apply these things : Hereby you may see , how things in their own nature indifferent , ought to be left free , and not to be made burthens and bonds to mens Consciences ; that so Christian Liberty and Peace , may be preserved inviolate . You see , how those ancient Bishops or Presbyters of Rome , bound not this liberty , brake not this peace . You see , how Victor presuming to violate both , yet upon the reproofe of Irenaeus ( though inferiour to him in place ) he yeelded to reason , suffered not pride or passion to predominate , but left to the Churches both their Liberty and Peace . But now for you my Lord , you are not contented onely to impose with rigour upon mens Consciences those Ceremonies which you otherwise call Indifferent , yet enforce them as necessary as being also by mans Laws Commanded , and such , as in point of Indifferencie might justly be questioned , were they not superstitious : but also in erecting and imposing , both besides Mans Law , and against Gods Law , other both idolatrous and superstitious devises ( as your stone or woodden Altars , with their Equipage , and service in adorations , and the like ) and those borrowed from the Church of Rome her selfe , none ( since Victor ) infinitely corrupted , and deeply deceived , yea drowned in all Idolatries and Superstitions ; which have been of late so violently and universally pressed upon all Churches within your Reach , that what confusions or combustions it may further cause , the Lord knows : But this we are sure of , that as the liberty of Mens Consciences is hereby generally brought into bondage , and both the outward and inward peace of the Churches violated , and broken to pieces , while you cry for peace , and cease not to presse your Vniversall Conformity , as if it were the way of quenching the flame , to poure out the Oyle of a meere nominall Peace : so the Faith of Christ , and the salvation of Christian mens soules is hereby utterly subverted , as formerly is shewed . And of these things you have been sufficiently admonished , and convinced by some Ministers of Christ . But you say , It was too roughly done , not as Irenaeus reproved Victor . Is that all ? But consider how truly ; And how diseases the more desperate , require the sharper medicines . Yea as the Poet said , Immedicabile vulnus Ense recidendum est , ne pars sincera trahatur . I leave you to English it . But that the reproofe were true , though sharpe , did you as Victor did , who suffered himselfe to be victus , overcome by Irenaeus his reproofe and Allegation ? Nay you , though both victus & convictus , vanquished and convinced in your Conscience and knowledge of the truth of all those enormities which you were charged withall , yet you must be Victor , not resting till you had sent away your Reprover with a Censure more bitter , and sharper then the sharp reproofe could be ; and yet not desisting from your violent course to enforce an Universall Conformity , whereby the whole Land is infected with terrible combustions , and those no lesse further dangerous , then already full of dammage . Such a Peace-maker is your Conformity . Is this the way think you to make you Victor ? Soft and faire . For though perhaps you glory in your tyrannicall conquest over the poore Body of your Reprover , yet while your spirit doth ( to use the Apostles word to the same purpose ) hupernikan , become more then Victor ( as before is noted ) and so his Cause , not foyled but confirmed and crowned in his suffering for it : never think your selfe a Victor . No no , my Lord , never think to be victor , by fighting against Christ ; Lay down your violence in pressing your Conformity : fight not against the common peace , by disturbing the peace of mens Consciences : Lay not siege to Christian liberty in inforcing even things indifferent , and how much lesse such as are both in their nature and use Idolatrous , Superstitious , and directly against the expresse word of God . But that you will , that you must needs set up your Romish Altars , with your other devices sutable , yet inforce them upon Gods Ministers and People by your terrible commands and threats armed with High-Commission Power , or Princes Edicts . Convince men as much as you can by the strength of your powerfullest perswasive reasons , and draw them by your gentlest motives , but doe not hale and dragge them with the violence of your Archiepiscopall power , and Romish zeale Throw not Godly Ministers out of their Ministry and Means . and that by Hundreds , with their Wives and Children exposed to all miseries of poverty , and all because they will not , dare not yeeld to your lawlesse Prelaticall Impositions , Innovations , Usurpations . But if you will needs proceed on in that your violent course against Christ and Christian liberty , and peace of mens Consciences , assure your selfe you shall not pr●sper , you shall not be victor , Christ will confound you with all your Power and Pollicie . And He shal be both Irenaenus and Victor for his Church , both to Conquer his Enemies , and to restore Peace to his People . And thus much of your example of Irenaeus and Victor .

L. p. 141. Well , thus the whole Militant Church is holy , and so we beleeve . And if she erre in the Foundation , that is , in some one , or more Fundamentall points of Faith , * * A most 〈◊〉 conclusi●n of an erronious fai●h . then she may be a Church of Christ still , but not Holy , but becomes Hereticall ; And most certaine it is , that no Assembly ( be it never so Generall ) of such Hereticks , is or can be holy .

P. Doe you beleeve the whole Militant Church to be holy ? And so doe I. But your whole Militant Church is not the same with that , which I beleeve is holy . For your whole Militant Church whereof you professe to be a member , is , in plain terms , the Antichristian Church , and the Church Malignant , which is a persecuter of the true Militant Church of Christ ; as both hath been , and yet will be made more manifest . So as your Militant Church is properly so called , for no other reason , but because it makes Warre against Christ and his Saints , Rev. 12.7 . and 13.7 . and 16.14 . and 17.14 . but the true Militant Church of Christ , is so called , because she fights spiritually under Christs banner against Sinne , the World , the Flesh , the Devil , and cruell Persecuters , whom ‡ ‡ Rev. 13.12 . she overcomes by the blood of the Lambe , and by the word of her Testimony , not loving her life unto the death . So as your Militant Church is a name which you have usurped , abused , and perverted ; whereas it is to be named according to its nature , The Church Malignant . For further proofe hereof , you say , if she erre in some one , or more Fundamentall points , &c. Which implyes your Militant Church may erre in points Fundamentall . Which cannot possibly be understood of the onely true , holy , Catholicke Militant Church of Iesus Christ . For this whole Militant Church of the Elect cannot , either in whole , or in part , or in the least member of it , erre in any Fundamentall point , so as thereby to bec●me unholy . For this were else to fall from Christ , and from ●he Com●munion of Saints , by being seduced by Antichrists and ‡ ‡ Mat. 24.24 . false Prophets , who shall deceive , if it were possible ( but it is not possible ) the ver● Elect. This erring in the Foundation belongs , and extends to all the Reprobates of the world , who are by Antichrist seduced unto their perdition ; who * * 2 Thes 2 . 1●.11 . because they receive not the love of the Truth , that they might be saved , God shall send them strong Delusions , to b●leeve a lye , yea to beleeve that for truth , which their own ●eared Conscience tells them is a lye . For not to receive the love of the truth , implyes , that they had received the truth unto acknowledgement and conviction , but the love of this truth they imbraced not . But the whole Militant Church of Christ ( I say ) cannot be so seduced unto perdition , or to fall from Christ . What is it to fall from Christ ? To fall from Christ is to fall from that Faith and love of Christ , which once they professed ; that is , from the Faith of the Doctrine of Christ , and from that love , which they professed towards it . And this fa●ling from the Faith of Christ , is when any one Fundamentall point of faith is denyed , and persisted in , as we have formerly proved ; as in the ‡ ‡ 1 Cor. 15.14 Resurrection , and § § Gal. 5.2.4 . Circumcision , and sundry others . I might adde here many other Instances ; as the Deniall of all the Doctrines of Grace in Gods Free Election , Redemption , &c. which Grace and Merit of Christ is peculiar to the Elect onely . I will onely adde one more here which I but touched before . O● the Lords 〈◊〉 - Day . He that denyes the Lords day , to be the Sabbath day of Christians , commanded no lesse to Christians in the 4th Commandement , then the seventh , or last day of the week was to the Iewes : he erres in the Foundation , becomes unholy , and falls away from the Faith of Christ . This I demonstrate thus . First , The 4 th Commandement is Morall , and so eternall , and unchangeable . And as the eternall sabbatisme is in heaven , belonging to the Church Tryumphant , so there is a sabbatisme temporall , pertaining to the Church Militant in this world . This sabbatisme ( as the other ) is the rest of God . † † Psal. 95. His Rest , saith David . This Sabbatisme in the Church Militant is by God himselfe appointed to be solemnly observed of the whole Congregation on that seventh day of the week , wheron himselfe rested . This Sabbath or rest of God was on the seventh or last day of the week , upon the finishing of the worke of creation . And therfore , for that very cause , God commanded his People in the Old Testament to sanctifie that Sabbath day weekly . This is given as the Reason of its sanctification by the People : The seventh day is the Sabbath of the Lord thy God : For in six d●yes he made heaven and earth , and rested the seventh : Therfore , &c. Remember to sanctifie the Sabbath day , the Lords Sabbath day . And note , he saith not , Remember to sanctifie the seventh or last day of the week : but Remember to sanctifie the Sabbath day . These words are the Morall substance of the Commandement . The rest is an exposition and application of it , the exposition to keep holy that Day for Sabbath , which is the Lords own Sabbath day , wherein himselfe hath rested . Note this well ▪ for I will speak much here in few words . Weigh them therfore , number them not . The particular application of the seventh or last day of the week , as wherein God rested from his works of Creation , is commended and commanded to Gods people under the Old Testament . So as if there had not come in afterwards , a more glorious Sabbath , or rest of Gods , as from a more glorious worke of a more glorious Creation : we Christians also should have kept that seventh day that the Jewes kept . But that this more glorious day of a more glorious rest of God from a more glorious worke , being come : then the same 4 th Commandement commands us Christians to keep this new Day of Rest , of the Lord our God . So as though the Day be changed , yet the Commandement is the same . It binds us still to sanctifie the Sabbath of the Lord our God .

Secondly , for the application of the 4 th Commandement to us Christians . Remember to keep the Sabbath day holy . What Sabbath day ? Or what day for Sabbath ? The Sabbath day of the Lord thy God , wherein himselfe rested . What day is that ? The first day of the weeke . This is another seventh day , reckoning the weeke backward . Now on this first day of the week the Lord our God Iesus Christ , after that he had finished the worke of Redemption ( being a new Creation , and much more glorious then the former , in many respects ) rose againe from the dead , and so entred into his Rest that morning and moment of his Rising again . He entred then I say into the state of Rest , though not into the place of Rest , till his Ascension . This is sufficient . But the work of Redemption was finished on the Crosse. Not altogether ▪ on the Crosse , Christ indured and finished his suffering of the pangs and paines of death , when he said Consummatum est , It is finished : but there remained the bonds of death to be indured , and that was in the grave 3 dayes , to redeem us , aswell our bodies from the grave , as our soules from hell on the Crosse. Now all this being finished , to wit , the whole worke of Redemtion : Christ rising the 3 d day , therein rested from his worke . And this being the Sabbath or Rest of the Lord our God , surpassing the former Rest in glory , and into which rest or sabbatisme all beleeving Christians do enter , and have an Interest ( as Heb. 4.3 . ) it follows necessarily , that as by Christs example of Resting on that day , as by his Commandement to keep the Sabbath day of the Lord our God , wherein himselfe hath rested , that we Christians do sanctifie the Lords day , the first day of the week , for our Christian Sabbath day , according to the 4 th Commandement . Which if we doe not , as not holding our selves bound by the 4 th Commandement : Then all these errors in the fundamentalls of faith follow upon it :

As first , by not sanctifying the Lords day for our Christian Sabbath day , we utterly deny , overthrow and destroy the Morality of the 4 th Commandement , which to the Militant Church on earth stands in this , To sanctifie the Sabbath day of the Lord our God . It commands us this , or nothing ; and if nothing , it loseth both the Nature and Name of a Commandement . And if you doe acknowledge and beleeve it to be ( as it is ) one of Gods ten Morall Commandements : then of necessity you must either sanctifie the first day of the week for Sabbath , whereon Christ arose and rested : or else , you must sanctifie that seventh day of the Old Testament , which God rested on from his worke of Creation , which the Jewes observed . And if you keep the Jewes Sabbath , you must turn Jew , and deny Christ to be come in the flesh . For in * * Deut. 5.12.13.14.15 ▪ Deuteronomy God commands them to keep the Sabbath day , in memory of their Redemption from Aegipt ; and so their Sabbath day was turned into a type of another Sabbath or Rest , that was to be brought in upon the accomplishment of our spirituall Redemption . Which being now finished , that typicall Sabbath is vanished , being the last Type which was fulfilled by Christ , resting in his Grave on that day , and so utterly abolished in that more glorious Rest of his Resurrection . If then you keep the Jewes Sabbath ▪ you do with them deny Christ to be come . And if you sanctifie not the first day of the weeke , instead of , and succeding in place of the old Sabbath day : then as you utterly deny and destroy the 4 th Commandement , so you deny the worke of Redemption finished on the Crosse and in the Grave : you deny his Resurrection , wherein he rested from that worke : and you deny the very rest of heaven : and you deny the Communion of Saints , both in the Church Militant and Triumphant . First you deny the Accomplishment of the worke of Redemption on the Crosse , and in the Redemption it selfe , in denying the Rest of Christ in the day of his Resurrection . For if he then rested not , the worke of Redemption was not finished . And you deny he rested , in denying his rest to be the rest of the Lord our God , which the 4 th Commandement commands us Christians to keepe weekly on that day ; which if we keep not , Christ hath not rested , and so he hath not redeemed us . Secondly , in denying Christs rest , you deny his Resurrection . For if he rested not , he arose not . For the very first moment of his Resurrection began his rest . If then you sanctifie not the Day of his rest for the Christian Sabbath day , you deny as Christs rest , so his Resurrection , and the whole vertue of it , by which we arise from Sinne spiritually , and from the Grave corporally . And cursed is he , that hath not his part in the first Resurrection : for on him the second death , that is , eternall death shall have power : because * * Reve. 20.5 . Blessed and holy is he that hath his part in the first Resurrection : for on him the second death shall have no power . Thirdly , in thus denying Christs rest in his Resurrection ▪ while you deny that day to be the holy rest , or Sabbath day of Christians , you deny , as Christs eternall rest in heaven , so that rest , or sabbatisme , which remaines for the people of God . As the ‡ ‡ Heb. 4.9 . Apostle saith , There remaineth therfore Sabbatismòs , a sabbatisme , or Sabbaticall holy rest for the people of God . Therfore ? Wherupon is this inferred ? Upon the ‡ ‡ vers. 8. former verse , where he speaks of this very Sabbath , or Rest day of Christians , which is as the first fruits of the eternall sabbatisme . For saith he , If Iesus ( Iosua ) had given them rest , then would he not afterwards have spoken of another day . Another day ? What other day , but that rest day , which our Iesus rested on , and which is our rest day ? For when Christ in his Resurrection entred into his rest , he made that day the day of our rest , which gives us an Interest in , and brings us to his eternall rest . For Certainly if we doe not rest with Christ in the Day of his Rest weekly here , according to the Commandement , we shall never rest with him eternally in heaven . He that keeps not this § § Heb. 4.8.9 ▪ Other Day , which succeeded that under the Law , hath no sabbatisme remaining for him in heaven . Lastly , in denying this Rest-day of Christ to be our Christian Sabbath , to be sanctified according to the Commandment , you deny the Communion of Saints in the Church Militant , and consequently in the Church Triumphant . For except there be a Communion of Saints in the Church Militant , which is the seed of the Church Triumphant , what Communion of Saints can be in heaven . For none are Saints there , which were not fi●st Saints here . And what Communion of Saints can be here , but especially in the holy and solemne Assemblies , where they are to Communicate together in Prayer and Thanks-giving , and hearing of the Word , and receiving of the Sacrament . And how can this be , if there be not a set day for it ? And who shall appoint this day ▪ but God himselfe ? And what Day so fit , as his own Day of Rest , which he hath Commanded to be sanctified weekly of us ▪ if we be his people , and he the Lord our God , who hath redeemed us in his holy and eternall Law , and in which day we resting , do partake and communicate of his holy and eternall rest , begun here by Christ , and consummate in heaven in that pangúrei , solemne Generall Assembly and Congregation of the first borne written in heaven , Heb. 12.23 . And to conclude ) if the ten Commandements belong to us Christians under the Covenant of Grace , then certainly the 4 th Commandement , which commands to keep the Sabbath of the Lord our God , which is the Lords day .

Now by this which hath been spoken , you may examine how farre you and your Church of England have erred in the foundation , that is , in this , and other fundamentall points of Faith : at least if those Acts , ●dicts , and Books , that have been published against the aforesaid Doctrines , shal be avowed for the Doctrines of the Church of England , as they are pressed . And if with Rome you be thus fallen , holy you are not by your own confession ; nor onely so , but Hereticall : yea more then that , Infidel . For in the same page you say , If the Church can erre quite from the Foundation , Pag. 141. then she is nor Holy , nor Church , but becomes an Infidell . Now we have proved , that to erre in one , or more , though not in all fundamentall points of Faith , is to fall quite off from the foundation . But if you thus cease to be holy , how are you the Church of Christ still , as you say ? For holinesse is essentiall unto , and so is of the Difinition of the true Church of Christ : I beleeve the Holy Catholicke Church . And so of every particular Church , if it be a true member of the true Catholicke , it is holy For Eadem est ratio totius & partium : If the whole be holy , so every member and part . But the whole true Church is holy ; For 't is Christs body mysticall , whereof he the Head : he the root , and we the Branches : and * * Rom. 11.16 . if the root be holy , so are the branches , as the Apostle saith . And he saith againe , ‡ ‡ 1 Cor. 3.17 . The Temple of God is holy , which Temple ye are . And ( I say ) Christ being the Head ▪ and the Church h●s body , the spirit of holinesse and sanctification flows down from the Head to all the m●mbers , as the Oyle powred on Aarons head went down to the skirts of his clothing : which was a type of the holy anoynting oyle of Christs spirit powred on him , which he communicates to all the members of his misticall body ; even as a mans head communicates of Animal spirits of motion to all the parts of his body , as we touched before . Except with Bellarmine you will have a dead member to be a true member . Indeed a dead member of a dead body , is a true member of that body . And certainly , if a Church cease to be holy , it ceaseth to be a Church of Christ any more● But I pray you , what should move you to say thus : Though the Church ceaseth to be Holy , yet ceaseth not to be a Church of Christ . You have it not from the Schoole of Divinity ; not scarce can you rake it out of the puddle of the Iesuites themselves . But haply you might suspect , that the Church of Rome might be proved to be fallen quite from the Foundation ( as hath been already proved before ) and therfore your Charity would provide one refuge for it , that though thus she ceaseth to be holy , yet not to be a true Church still . But you may doe well to study this point a little better , how to make it good , How a Church may cease to be Holy , becoming Hereticall , and yet be a Church of Christ still .

L. p. 141.142 . Those Errors that are dyed in Graine , cannot consist with holinesse , of which Faith in Christ is the very Foundation . And therfore if we will keep up our Creed , the whole Militant Church must still be holy .

P. This confirmes , what before I concluded of the Church of Rome , as no Church of Chhist , because by your own verdict , not holy . For her Errors , and that in the fundamentall points of Faith , are all dyed in graine , so as they will never change colour , nor looke of another hue . For both they are of no small antiquity , and since their first hatching , they have been by sundry Councels confirmed , and at last most irrefragably in the Councel of Trent , as hath been shewed . For as those things which you elswhere instance : Worship of Images first erected in the 2 d Councel of Nice , the seventh Generall : Transubstantiation , first Decreed in the Councel of Laterian under Innocent the third and the taking away of the Cup in the Sacrament , first decreed in the Councel of Constance : so the Title of Antichrist , of Vniversall Bishop and Head of the Church , obtained first by Boniface 3. above a thousand yeares agoe : with many or most , or all the Rest of Popery , have been ever since their severall erections upon all occasions more and more ratified ( never any corrected ) and by generall practice upheld , and against all opposition and conviction stiffly maintained . Are they not dyed in graine then ? And if so , you confesse they consist not of holinesse . But ( say you ) if we will keep up our Creed , the whole Melitant Church must still be Holy . Here you enterfere againe . For notwithstanding all that is said , or ( I suppose ) can be said , you will have the Church of Rome to be holy still , as being a member of the Church Militant , in despight of the Pope . But let her be a member of your Church Militant , is she therfore holy ? Say not you , your Church Militant may fall into errors , so as to cease to be holy ? And if the Church of Rome hath thus fallen , hath she not for her part , ceased to be holy ? But not , if she keep up the Creed . What call you that ? To hold the letter of the Creed , and to deny the Faith of it ? so we have proved before . She hath lost the Faith of Christ , the foundation of Holinesse : Ergo she hath lost Holinesse . Ergo lost the Essence of a Church : Ergo she is not in the compasse of your Creed , I beleeve the Holy Catholicke Church .

L. p. 142. I say it , and most true it is , That it was ill done if those , who ere they were , A peremptory speech . that made the seperation .

P. It should be most true , if you doe but say it . Yet we find not all to be most true , you say . How true this is I know not yet ▪ Let us here . I remember a little before , you performed a thanklesse office for the Protestants , in making an Apology for them , as not the first in the fault of this seperation . Which I answered . And here you put the fault on those , that made the seperation who ere they were , which might be aswell the Protestants , as the Papists But speake out .

L. p. 145. For my part , I am of the same opinion for the continuing of the Schisme , that I was for the making of it ▪ That is , That it is ill , Plain dealing . very ill done of those ▪ who ever they be , Papists or Protestants , that give just cause to continue a seperation .

P. Here you speake plain : Papists or Protestants : and why not then Protestants as well as Papists , that did very ill in making the seperation , as they doe ill in continuing of it ? But yet your meaning here may possibly be , that as it was ill done of the Roman party to give the first cause of the separation : so it were no lesse ill done to continue the same cause to the continuing of the Schisme . You may doe well to perswade Rome to lay down all her Corruptions , which the Protestants have and doe protest against her , that so , if the Schisme be any long●r continued , it may then appeare to be long of the Protestants . ●ut if Rome be obstinate and incorrigible in her errors , you have no reason to say , it is ill done on the Protestant party to continue the Schisme . But it may be perhaps ill done of the Protestant Church of England notwithstanding , to continue the Schisme , for as it may be well done of you to sowder it againe . And therfore while the case is thus in agitation and Rome maks no more hast to meet you , the multitude of her impedimenta , bagge , and baggage , and all kind of Trumpery retaining her peace , and which in no sort she will part withall , and so will not stirre a foot over Tiber : what 's wanting on her part , you will supply , with all expedition dressing up her sister the Church of England in Romes fashion , unto such a conformity and symphony , as promiseth a making up of the ma●ch with all faults on both sides , sooner perhaps then Rome could hope for .

L. ibid. The Kings and the Church of England had no reason to admit of a publick Dispute with the English Romish Clergy , till they should be able to shew it under the Seale , or Powers of Rome , That that Church will submit to a third , who may be an Indifferent Iudge between us and them ; or to such a Generall Councel , as is after mentioned .

P. First , the English Romish Clergie are by the Laws of England Traitors , and therfore to be disputed withall at Tiburne . So as if you put them to shew their warrant to dispute with you under Romes seale : they will require of you perhaps to shew them under Englands seale an abrogation of the Laws against them . And you tell us before , that the Church of England knows well , that a Parliament cannot be called at all times . Nor will the Powers of Rome permit their Religion to be disputed on . And whom will you chuse to dispute with them ? some peaceable men , that will not be apt to fall out with the Jesuites , your Lordship being Moderator . But you know Rome denyes the Rule of Faith , the Scripture . And Contra negantem Principia non est disputandum . Who shall else be the Umpier ? Who the Third ? Who the Indifferent Iudge ? Could both the Churches joyntly chuse a more Indifferent Iudge , then your selfe ? Sure Rome her selfe would nominate you before Bellarmine himselfe if he were living . A Generall Councel indeed of Romish , English , and other Prelates , might do much : so you should be sure to exclude all the Protestant Reformed Churches for wranglers ▪ as Franciscus à S. Clara well adviseth . And then if a Generall Councel should reconcile and compose all differences , though never so erroniously , yet the Error must stand , till another Generall Councel shall reverse it , as you tell us at after . But you adde .

L. p. ibid. and 146. And this is an honest , and I think a full Answer . And without this , all Disputation must end in a clamour ; and therfore the more publick the worse , because as the Clamour is the greater , so perhaps wil be the Schisme too .

P Nay , my Lord , if you stand upon termes of honesty indeed , you should have nominated the Scripture for the onely sufficient and upright Iudge between you . This had been honest in one that professeth but the name onely of a Protestant . But for that you told us enough before , whereby we understand , that this point of honesty is no part of your meaning . But if your Answere were not in this respect honest , I must tell you , neither was it full , but an empty and frivolous Answere . To dispute of Divinity or Religion , where Scripture is not the onely Iudge , is as to judge of gold by the colour , without the touchstone . And so he that could shew the best colour for his matter by a false light , should carry it away . And I may say truely , without the Scripture be Iudge , your disputation must needs end in a clamour , where the voyce of God is of no authority . But then also if Scripture should be the Iudge , you might well say , The more publicke the worse . For it is such a light , as would discover all your fallacies ; and so raysing a clamour of the publicke Audience , when they should observe such collusion between the English Clergie , and the English Romists , it might breed such a detestation against all Reconciliation with Rome , as would make the rent the wider , and so all your labour should be in vaine . And then you might use the Proverbe , As good never a whit , as never the better .

L. p. 148. That there are errorr in Doctrine , and some of them such , as most manifestly indanger salvation in the Church of Rome , i● evident to them that will not shut their eyes .

P. To indanger Salvation , is much ; and for you to say so much , is much too ▪ and you saying so much , we need not make much doubt of the truth of that you say in this Case . And yet in saying so much , you speake not all truth . The truth is ( as we have proved , and shall yet further ) That Romes Errors in Doctrine are damnable , and cannot consist with salvation ; as is evident to those , whose eyes are truly opened .

L. ibid. A. C. himselfe confesses , that error in Doctrine of the Faith , is a just cause of seperation , so just , as that no cause is just but that . Now had I leasure to descend into particulars , or will to make the rent in the Church wider : The tender-hearted Prelate 〈◊〉 to make the rent wider . 't is no hard matter to prove , that the Church of Rome hath erred in the Doctrine of Faith , and dangerously too : And I doubt I shall afterwards descend to particulars , A. C. his importunity forcing me to it .

P. By A. C. his canfession then , the Protestants are able to justifie their seperation abundantly . As for your Lordship , you are so charitably and peaceably affected , that you are loth upon any termes ( though it concerne the salvation of mens soules in such a case to speake the truth home ) to make the rent wider , till by your Adversaries importunity ( I would say A. C. ) you be forced to it . You have too tender a heart to be a Surgion , when for feare , least the opening of the wound make it wider , you suffer it to fester inwardly It were well if you were halfe so tender hearted to the poore Sheepe and Lambs of Gods fold ; there you feare not most stoutly to make wide wounds , and make no b●n●s of it . Put true Protestants doe hold , that the wider the rent is made between them and Rome , the better it is . I know this is to you as the widening of a ghastly wound . But it is the truth Yet you put us in some hope to heare what you will say , when you are forced to it . As Cowards will fight most terribly , when they are forced to it Though I hope you will not indanger Rome more , then her errors indanger her own salvation .

L. p. 149. Nor can you say that Israel , from the time of the separation , was not a Church ; for there were true Prophets in it , Elias , Elizeus , and others , and thousands , that had not bowed knees to Baal .

P. But I can say ( and that upon good evidence ) that Israel , the ten Tribes , from the time of their setting up and following the Calves , were no true visible Church of God . For they had no visible signes or markes of a visible Church . Their whole Religion consisted in the worship of the two Calves : neither had they any Leviticall Priesthood , or Priests of Aarons order : nor went they up three times in the yeare to worship at Ierusalem , according the Law ( 1 King . 12.28 , 29 , 30 , 31 , 32 , ●3 . ) Here was not one footstep of a visible true Church of God , but of the Devil indeed , whom they worshiped in the Calves But ( say you there were true Prophets in it . True . * * 2 Chro. 11 ▪ 15. But that was upon some extraordinary occasion , when they were sent , and prophecied . But for all their Prophecyings , did the King and People abandon their Calves ? Yea when Elias had caused Baals Prophets to be slain : or when ‡ ‡ 2 King . 1● . Iehu slew all the remainder of them , and their worshipers : both he and the People followed the Calves still And besides , they had not true Priests , but those of Ieroboams Order . And if they had no true Priests , will you allow them ( for all their Prophets ) to be a true Church of God ? Doe you not exclude all the Reformed Churches beyond the Seas from being true Churches of God , because ( notwithstanding all their Prophets , to wit Preachers and Ministers of God ) they have no Priests , no Prelates , no Priesthood ? Would you account or call Rome a true Church , if she had not her Priesthood ? Although her Priesthood is of no other Order , then that of Ieroboam , of humane Ordinance , not of Divine Institution : sacrificing Priests , as those were . Now as Ierome saith ( as you cite at after ) Vbi non est Sacerd●s , non est Ecclesia : Where there is no Priest , there is no Church . Israel had no true Priest , and so no true worship of God . Nor doth Ierome ( and so the antient Fathers , when they used the word Sacerdos ) thereby meane any such sacrificing Priests ; as are at this day in the Church of Rome . For the Fathers held no Transubstantiation , ergo no sacrificing Priests . Whereas your Romish Priests , have no other Order , but of sacrificing Priests expresly in their Ordination , in these words , Take thou a power to sacrifice the body of Iesus Christ upon the Altar ; or to the like effect . And this by the way proveth Rome to be no better a Church of God , then that of the ten Tribes was , when they had their Calves and Priests sutable . And as for those Prophets you speake of , Elias , and Elizeus , were their Prophecies regarded ? Nay were they not persecuted , by Ahab and Iez●bel , and their Son Iehoram ? Yea and 100 Prophets of the Lord more , whom good Obadiah hid in a Cave , and fed with bread and water , and so preserved them from Iezebels fury ? Yea and all the Prophets , whom the Lord sent , were they not persecuted by the State , and Court of Israel ? Was not * * Amos 7.10 , 11 , 12 , 13. Amos forbid by Amasiah King Ieroboams Court-Priest , to preach at Bethel , saying , Prophecy no more at Bethel : for it is the Kings Chappell ▪ and it is the Kings Court ? And did not this Court-Priest complaine of the Prophet to King Ieroboam , saying , Amos hath conspired against ▪ thee in the midst of the house of Israel : the Land is not able to beare all his words ? And it were well if there were no such Priests in Christian Kings Courts , that doe such offices against the Lords Prophets and Preachers , complaining of them to the King , that they are a sort of factious Conspirators against him ( such as those whom you have called shallower waters , as before ) and the Land cannot beare all their words , although they speake nothing but truth , which Gods word teacheth , and gives them good warrant for . But this by the way . To return to Israel . Is a people presently a Church , upon the coming of a Prophet , or Minister of God to preach unto them : untill they doe imbrace Gods word , and set up his pure worship amongst them ? But those ten Tribes , still minced and contemned Gods word , and persecuted Gods Prophets that were sent unto them , and with a high hand maintained their Calfe-worship ▪ the Devils service ( though they pretend it was Gods service , as Exod. 32. These are thy Gods ô Israel , that brought thee out of Aegypt ) untill there was no remedy , that the Lord gave them up to perpetuall Captivity .

Againe , I cannot but a little wonder , that your Lordship should so grosly forget your selfe , as because of a Prophet , or two to give such a state the stile of a true Church of God . For do you any where allow a true Church , which hath no Priests ? And it is cleare , that Israel then had no true Priests , but counterfeit , such as Rome now hath . So in this respect rather I suppose you mean that was then a true Church , because of their Priests , such as they were , Baalish , such as your Babylonish Priests , as good an Argument to prove Rome a true Church .

But you alledge , there were thousands among them , that had not bowed knees to Baal . 'T is true , God told Elias , when he complained he was left alone , that he had reserved to himselfe 7000. that had not bowed the knee to Baal , nor kissed his mouth . But they were all so hid , that ( you see ) the Prophet himselfe knew no such thing , till the Lord told him . They made no open profession of the true Religion . And if they had any private meetings to pray together , and to read and expound the Law , will your Lordship call that a Church , Though those Assemblies were indeed the true Churches of God . But would not you , if you had been in Amaziah the Priests stead , have called those private meetings Conventicles , and would have hunted them out with your Pursuivants ? And therefore those seven thousand not being of the Kings Religion , nor Communion Ecclesiasticall with the other many thousands of Israel , and lying hid in Corners here and there , they would not denominate the whole state of the ten Tribes a true visible Church of God , themselves living as it were invisible , at least so invisible , as though others took notice of their Persons , where they conversed , yet they saw not their Religion , for themselves durst not openly professe it . So as those seven thousand I cannot more fitly compare , then to those , whom you call a sort of Puritanicall Separatists , whom you by your Altar services and other superstitions drive from your Communion , who will not bow the knee to your Baal , to your God-Altar , nor at your Name Iesus , and therfore you Ferret them out of their holes , because they will not do as their Neighbours do , goe with them like loving Neighbours , and good Fellows to Bethel and Dan , and there make merry , eat , drinke before their God , and rise up to play , as you give your people leave to doe on their Holy dayes , and on the Lords dayes too . Onely here is the difference , it seemeth that in those dayes of old of the ten Tribes , there were no Pursuivants to hunt out those poore Snakes , that lurked in holes , and would not bow the knee . For then sure Elias should have heard of them , and they should have been served with the same sawce , that the Lords Prophets tasted of . And again , there was in Israel ▪ one good Obadiah , that hid an hundred of the Lords Prophets in a Cave from wicked Iezebel , as there was in Iudah a good * * Ier. 38. Ebedmelech , that spake to the King for the Prophet Ieremiah whom the Princes had put into the muddy Dungion : but where there is an Arch-Prelate , or Arch-Priest , that takes upon him to rule the rost , there is not found one Obadiah , or one Ebedmeleck that dare so much as speake one good word to the King for the Prophets of the Lord , who are most unjustly and most cruelly confi●ed , and that to perpetuall imprisonment and banishment , for no other cause , but faithfully executing their Propheticall office ; as before .

But a little after you adde , That Israel is called the People of the Lord : 2 King . 9.6 . therfore a Church still . I answere : They might be so called , because they were Abrahams seed according to the flesh , ‡ ‡ Rom. 9.6.17 . which the Apostle distinguisheth from Abrahams ●eed according to the promise : For all they are not Israel , which are of Israel , neither because they are the seed of Abraham , are they all Children . Yet they were called the Children of Abraham , and so the people of God . Or secondly , they might still be called Gods people , in regard of the Covenant made with them in Abrahams ●oynes , the externall badge wherof they wore in Circumcision , and a type of the Promise wherof they injoyed in the Promised Land of Canaan , which now they possessed ; so as they might retain the name of Gods people in that respect , till they were quite cast out of that profession . Or Thirdly , as Antichrist is said to sit in the Temple of God ; that is , in that place , and over those , where was once the Church of God , or over mens Consciences , which of right are the Temple of God ; so as Antichrist usurping Gods right , and puting him as it were out of possession , is truly said to sit in the Temple of God , though now turned into the Temple of Antichrist : so the ten Tribes , have been once , with the rest of their brethren , the true Church of God , and now fallen from it , yet they might retain that name still , to be called the Lords people , untill there was no remedy , that they were utterly cast out , and cast off by a Bill of perpetuall Divorce . Even as the Church of Rome , untill the Councel of Trent , notwithstanding her manyfold corruptions , and abominable Idolatries , yet was generally taken for , and called a true visible Church of Christ , though in truth in the Generall it was not , but a false Antichristian Hierarchy , and Tyranny over mens Soules and Consciences : yet when ( after all admonitions and convictions of her Errors by many of Gods Prophets , who * * Ier. 51. ● ▪ wou●d ●av● cur● a Babylon , but she was not cured ; nay she was so farre off from cure , and 〈…〉 all remedy , or hope of remedy , as in her councel of Trent she hath for ever in perpetuam memoriam ratified and consumed all her damnable errors , and detestable Apostacie , so as all within her Verge must under Anathema be of the same Apostacy with her ) she remaines wilfully obdurate and obstinate : notwithstanding we must give you leave to call Rome still , A true Church of God .

L. p. 153.154 . The Councel of M●l●nis , in which S. Augustine was present , condemned the whole Course of Heresie of Pelag●●● , that great and bewitching Heresy , in the yeare ●16 . The second Councel at Aur●na , a Provinciall too , handled the great Controversies of Grace , and Free-will , and set the Church right in them in the yeare 444.

P. Call you the Heresie of Pelag●us , That great and bewitching Heresie ? So I have heard many say of Tobacco , complaining how they are bewitched with it , when they would same leave it , but have not the power . Is it in this respect , that your Lordship calls that Heresie of Pelagius , That great and bewitching Heresie ? Then it is in this respect , that I never heard of any willingnesse and desire you have to leave it ; yea the contrary whereof you have manifested , and doe dayly , by suppressing the Doctrines of Grace , which are directly contrary to that great bewitching Heresie . And surely as all Heresie is of a bewitching nature ( ‡ ‡ Gal. 3.1 . Who hath bewitched you , saith the Apostle ? &c. ) so this of Pelagius more especially , as advancing Mans Nature above Gods Grace . But had you indeed read the many ‡ ‡ As , De 〈…〉 . excellent Polem●call Tracts of the Malleus Pelagianorum , Augustine , it might have been of force ( were there but one sparke of true Grace ) to have conjured and unwitched this Pelagian spirit . There you might read in Terminis , all those Controversies about Grace discussed , and the Pelagian and Semipelagian Heresie in all o● them by cleare evidence , and abundant pregnant Testimony from Scripture , confuted : as , That Election and Pred●stinat●on of some to Salvation and Glory , and Reprobation of others is by an 〈◊〉 Decree : That , The Grace of Effectuall Redemption by Christ pertaines to the Elect onely , which he calls the world of the Elect , distinguishing it from the world of the Reprobate . As also Ambrose , who saith , that in mundo Electorum censetur specialis universitas : In the world of the Elect is reckoned a spirituall universality , as where it is said , Christ redeemed the whole world : that is , saith Augustine the whole world of the Elect. As also , that the * * Rom. 8.28 . Calling of Gods Elect is according to Gods Purpose , and so differing from the common Calling , of which , many are called , but few chosen ▪ And that the Elect are Called by an Omnipotent power of Grace working in them : and that they certainly persevere in Grace unto Glory , and never fall away ; and , that those who doe fall away , had never any true sanctifying Grace , nor ever were the true Children of God , though we called them such , while they professed the Truth . And all these points ( I say ) he proveth by such pregnant Testimonies of Scripture , that both Councels and Popes afterwards , that had to doe against the Pelagians , did set down whole large passages verbatim out of Augustins works , as you may read in Binius his Councels . And therfore ( I say ) had you indeed perused well those Tracts , and yet had persisted such a tanter of that Heresie , which Arminius of late hath raked out of hell , which Augustine and the Orthodox Fathers and Councels had remaunded to hell : you for your part ( and so others too ) might truly call it That Great Bewitching Heresie .

And that the Councel of Aurang , as you say , did set the Church right in those Doctrines of Grace and Free-will , wherein they followed Augustins judgement before them : how have you set the Now Church of England right , of being one Instrument at least ( if not the greatest , if not sole ) of seting forth such an Edict ( no Decree of a Councel , so much as Provinciall ) wherein those Articles of Religion concerning the foresaid Points , and Doctrines of Grace ( which were set so Right , before you unset them , as the whole Church of England maintained the Orthodox truth of them according to the Scriptures , and so Augustine and the Fathers , and that unanimously , and universally ) are made like Ianus with two faces , the one , looking ( but frowningly ) upon the Orthodox party ( who are forbid to preach the Orthodox Doctrines ) the other , looking upon your Arminian Favorites , and that with an Amiable aspect , as who may find their opinions in your Articles , and so not onely impunity for preaching them , but Dignities in your Church for but affecting and holding those Opinions , so Great a bewitching Heresie is it . O blind Guides of the Church of England ! and thou qui Primas tenes , the Pilot that steers the stern , if you be capable of any shame , and have not drunk of that Circaean Cup : blush at these things . And dost thou ( after all thy notorious practises in suppressing the Preaching of the Doctrines of Grace , and the Printing of Books written in defence of Gods saving Truth , in the Church of England too intollerable to be borne , and which the earth groaneth under , and for which the wrath of heaven is already kindled ) now come , thinking to blanch all by telling us a tale of this and that Councel , and of St. Augustine , and of that Great bewitching Pelagian Heresy ? Dost thou think the world is such a Baby grown , or the Old Mother Church of England come to that Dotage , as to beleeve , because her Arch-Prelate tells her , such a Provinciall councel wherein S. Augustine was condemned the whole course of the Great bewitching Heresy of Pelagius , and another Provinciall set the Church right in those great Controversies of Grace and Free-will ; therfore her Arminian Pilot is no Pelagian ? Thinkest thou ( I say ) to bewitch the world with these thy inchantments , which thou workest by the golden cup of thine hypocrisie ? Surely heavens patience cannot long brooke these darings , and deep dissemblings , which yet are so grosse , as they are not of a thread fine enough for Hypocrisie to make a veyle of .

L. p. 155. To these two ( to wit , Our Princes , and the Clergy ) Principally the power and direction for Reformation belongs .

P. You told us * * Epistle Dedicatory . before , how the King and the Priest , more then any other , are bound to looke to the Integrity of the Church in Doctrine and Manners , and that in the first place : Here you tell us of Princes and Clergy . This is some inlargement . For Clergy is not one Priest : except one Priest be so great , as that of Rome , or Canterbury , that he is equivalent to the whole Clergy , or is in himselfe the Clergy Collective . And yet suppose your whole Clergy of Priests were assembled in Convocation , what relation have you to the Princes ? you doe not meane ( I dare say ) the Princes assembled in Parliament . Beware of that . No you are content but to obtaine a Congè or License from the King to have your Convocation , and then let you alone for Reformation . The Princes shall not need to trouble themselves further . That 's your sole worke . But yet this agrees not with your two Patterns , which you set in the Margent ( touched before ) to wit of King Ezechiah , 2 Chro 29. and King Iosia , 4. Reg. 23. ( though you might as well have cited 2 King . 23. according to our English : but you love the old latine vulgar better ) Now as we noted before , the Kings of Israel in their Reformations of Religion did not mate themselves with the Clergy , but together with all the Princes , and chiefe Fathers in Israel ( like a Parliament for all the world ) commanded the Priests to execute their office according to the expresse Law of God , and they also looked strictly to have it done . And this you confesse elsewhere , * * Pag. 205. That those Kings reformed no otherwise , but according to the prescript Rule of Gods Law . Ergo ▪ The Priest reformed not , but was himselfe to be reformed by the King , and all according to Gods prescript Law . But now if the Prince and Clergy , or rather ( as I said ) the Clergy by the Princes leave ( which you can no where shew Gods prescript Law for ) should be the Principall , or rather sole for Reformation : I pray you what Reformation should we have , or could we expect ? The Church of England once thought her selfe to be under Reformation ( as you ‡ ‡ Epistle Dedicatory . tell us before ) although at the best it was but as one calls it ( in his Sermon preached in Queen Elizabeths dayes at Pauls Crosse , and published in Print by Authority ) a halfe Reformation , because ( as the Author of the Hunting of the Fox saith ) the great Fox , the Pope had but his eares cropt , but his whole body remained still in England in the Prelacy ; yet this was called a Reformateon , 〈◊〉 which the Church of England thought her selfe well separated from Rome , yet this is not that Reformation , that gives you content . And much lesse that Reformation beyond the Seas . Well , what Reformation is it then which you mean here ? Surely the same , which you meant before by sincerity and integrity in Doctrine and Manners in the Church , to which I referre the Reader , where he shall find this Reformation clearly expounded . And in summe your Reformation here will differ from the former Reformation of the Church of England in this : that as that was but a halfe Reformation , because it retained the Prelacy , with some of Romes Ceremonies : Englands halfe Reformation now made a whole Deformation . so this your Reformation shall make that up ; in reducing the Church of England to the Integrity and sincerity of the Church of Rome in Doctrine and Manners full and whole . A thing indeed , which can no otherwise but be expected , so long as the Hierarchy stands in its full ruffe , as it doth now in England . For like will to like , as you know who used the Proverbe to the Colyer . Or as the Philosopher saith , Every thing aspires after its perfection . And the Perfection of the Hierarchy is at Rome , and thence All Hierarchy and Prelacy now adayes hath and had its first Rise and Originall . And therfore no mervaile if Prelates naturally affect their native Countrey Rome . As the Romane * * Ovid. Poet said in his banishment , Nescio qua natale solum dulcedine cunctos Ducit , & immemores non sinit esse sui . Some secret sweetnesse in mans native home Draws him to mind it still , where ere become .

L. Ibid. In a corrupt Time , or Place , 't is as necessary in Religion to deny falshood , as to assert and vindicate truth . Indeed this latter can hardly be well and sufficiently done , but by the former : an affirmative verity being ever included in the negative to a falshood .

P. Then I hope in a corrupt Time and Place , is it not necessary in Religion to deny your falshoods , and to assert and vindicate the Truth , by you so undermined and oppugned ? And your own Words here are sufficient to leave your Deeds without excuse .

L. p. 157. If it be a Cause common to both parties , a third must judge , and that is the Scripture , Thus still no● the Scripture must be Iudge . or if there be jealousie or doubt of the sense of the Scripture , they must either both repaire to the exposition of the Primitive Church , and submit to that , or both call and submit to a Generall Councel .

P. The Scripture ? That 's honest as I noted before . Yea , and submit to , and rest in that , which you say not . But of the Scripture the onely Judge of all Controversies , we have spoken sufficiently before , and so for matters of jealousie or doubt ; and not either to your Primitive Church , or to a Generall Councel . For further Answere we shall have further occasion .

L. p. 171. Pope Urban 2 at the Councel held at Bari in Ap●lia , accounted my Worthy Predecessor S. Augustine , as his own comp●●●e , and said , He was as the Apostolicke , and Patriarch of the other world : so he then turned this Iland .

P. As worthy as your predecessor Anselme was , and though now one of Romes Saints , yet he was against your Priests Marriage . But perhaps therfore the more worthy . And he was so holy , it seems , that he said he never repented him of any thing in all his life , but about the eating of some Fish one time . But if the Pope gave your Worthy Predecessor the Title of Apostolicke , and Patriarch of the other world , of England : why should not the same Title descend to his successors . And it seems you are not a little affected with it . For you say , A Primate is greater then a Metropolitan ; and a Patriarch then a Primate . And none were above Patriarch but Pope . If then you succeed Anselme in his Patriarchate of the other world : you are in the next degree to succeed him , that is Papa totius Orbis . But how ever you glory in these titles : I assure you , for my part , I shall ever preferre a good honest Cobler , that feares God above them all . For he hath an honest calling : you none . And you all are persecuters of them that truly feare God , and so enemies of Christ . And though you would be called Apostolicke : yet to be Metropolitan , Primate , Patriarch , Pope , are all swelling Titles of pride , which the Apostles never knew , and which Christ expresly forbids ; as hath been noted , and will be more . As followeth .

L. p. 175. The calling and Authority of Bishops over the Inferiour Clergy , that was a thing of known use , and benefit , for preservation of unity and peace in the Church .

P. For this you cite Hierome . But you omit his other words , where he saith , That your Diocesan Bishops ( for of such onely the Question is ) were brought in , but , humana praesumptione , non Institutione Divina , by humane Presumption , not by Divine Institution , or Gods Ordinance : and this ( as men presumed ) in Schismata remedia , for a remedy of Schisme . But it proved to be Schisma magnum , the Great Schisme , that made up the body of Antichrist , the Great Rent from Christ , filling up the Mystery of Iniquity , as hath been shewed . And out of Ieromes Sacerdos , Priest , where he saith , No Priest , no Church , you conclude in the Pag. 176. Margent , so even with him , No Bishop , no Church . As if to be a Priest , must needs be a Bishop .

And idid . you say , This was to settle in the minds of men from the very Infancy of the Christian Church , as that it had not been to that time contradicted by any . In the very Infancy of the Church ? But your Prelacy was but an Infant then , and Innocent in comparison to the Giants now . We shewed * * Epistle Dedicatory . before how this Mystery wrought even in the Apostles times , which they knockt down : yet still Satan kept it afoot . The use of it hath great Antiquity , but the Apostles condemned it as a meere abuse , and Christ , as Heathenish . And you talke here of use , but you are not able to shew us any Authority from Scripture , either from Apostolik Ordinance and Example . The Apostles indeed before Christs Resurrection were blindly ambitious of being chief in Christs Kingdome : and Christ told his two kinsmen Iames and Iohn , They asked they knew not what : and yet Mark tells us , that Christ asking them , what they reasoned of by the way , they were ashamed to tell him , as being selfe-guilty of pride and ambition : and still when he had but newly told them of his Passion to be at Ierusalem , they not understanding what it meant , were still at it afresh , who should be the chiefe : but after that Christ was risen again , and his holy Spirit was breathed into them , then they were of another mind , they never after contended who should be chiefest , but rather who should be ●umblest , and ho●yest , and most painfull and faithfull in the spirituall Kingdome of Christ , in the execution of their Apostolicall Charge . Which argues plainly , that the Prelacy is a meere carnall thing , a temporall Kingdome ( contrary to Christs Kingdome ) which carnall men , voyd of Christs Spirit and Grace are blindly ambitious of , calling their Prelacy an Hierarchy , or ho●y Government , or Kingdome , but know not what holinesse , or Christs Kingdome meaneth . And doe we see any men in the world of any ranke whatsoever more Lordly , more proud , more ambitious , more covetous , more profane , more corrupt , then those of the Hierarchy ? Take the best of them now in England , the most learned of them : have they any zeale or courage for the truth , now , when they see Religion and the Faith of Christ turned topsie-turvie ? Doe they not all seeke their own , not that which is Iesus Christs ? And when your Chapleins gueld their Works , have they any virility left in them , to maintain the truth of that which they have written ? If their Metropolitan doe but speake the word , is it not with them , as in the Comedy of the Parasite , Ait quis ? Aio . Negat ? Nego . But what say I of those Prelates , that are fallen upon the very Lees and Dregges of the worst , and last times ? Alas , in the first Generall Councell of Nece under Constantine , in the Infancy of the Church , as you call it : what hot contentions among the Prelates one against another ? What bundels and fardels of complaints brought they into the Councel before Constantine ? Enough to set all in a combustion , had not the Emperour the more wisely put all their Bills and mutuall complaints in a combustion , by burning them in a faire fire before him in the view of all the Councel . And the maine point of their Contentions was about Precedency , which Bishoprick should be before another . Oh devout and humble Prelates ! O holy successors of the Apostles ! Are these men like to remedy Schisme in the Church , that are the Authors of them themselvs ? How came the great Schisme of Arius , but by the Prelates , when but * * Athanasius . one chiefly stood up against him ? How got Antichrist to be Caput Vniversale , Universall Head , or Bishop , but by the dessent of the Bishops , which causing their Appeales to Rome , brought the Roman Bishop to that height ? so as the Prelates being worse divided among themselves , then the Presbyters had been before them , for remedy of whose Schisme they were by mans prescription erected : gave occasion to the two Bishops of the two Imperiall Cities , Rome and Constantinople to stickle for one Headship over all , to reconcile all . And so the Popedome it selfe , the Throne of the Beast was erected in Schismatis remedium : for the onely Remedy of all Schisme . And it is to be noted how these two Prelates strove for this supremacy , and both under the veile of humility . Iohn of Constantinople becomes a great Faster ; whereupon he was styled Iohannes Iejunator , Iohn the Faster . Gregory , then of Rome , though he thundred against Iohns Ambition calling him that had , or affected that Title , the forerunner of Antichrist , yet seeing Iohn like to prevaile with pretence of holinesse and humility : Gregory stiles himselfe servus servorum Dei . He thought he would not come behind for humility , but indeed therein bewraying his pride , when his humility was but in emulation . And we see in Gregories Registrum , in sundry of his Epistles , how low he descends in most base flattery to that Parricide Phocas , and his Empres , to visit the thresholds of Peter and Paul , &c. But what will not Episcopall zeale doe for the Hierarchy ? But thus he kept Iohn off : and so made way for his own Prophecy which was , Filius superbiae prope est . The son of pride ( that is Antichrist ) is neere at hand . And neerer surely , then he was aware . For Gregory deceasing ; and Sabianus succeeding , and siting but one yeare : Boniface 3. the next successor obtaind this Title of Phocas : and so each confirmed other , the Emperour the Pope in the Throne of Antichrist , which is a Tyranny over mens Soules : and the Pope the Emperours Cruelty in a Tyranny over mens Bodyes . And thus came that Prophecy of the Angel ( Revel. 17.18 ) to be fulfilled , The Woman which thou sawest is that great City , which reigned over the Kings of the Earth . As Rome then did in S. Iohns time . So as according to Gods word , not Constantinople ( which was not the Imperiall C●ty , till Constantine so made it ) but Rome must be the feat of the Beast , and of the Whore thus described . Thus from Bishops emulation , ambition , contention , one against another , for honour , precedency , and greatnesse in the world , came Antichrist to mount upon that Beast which had 7 heads and ten hornes . And your selfe * * Pag. 176. confesseth , The difficulty was , to accommodate the Places and Precedencies of Bishops among themselves . And for this you say , The most equall and impartiall way was , that the ‡ ‡ H●w comes then Canterbury to have the 〈…〉 Y●●ke ra●●●r then 〈…〉 there Constantine was 〈◊〉 . And the the old Prop●e●● is , York● shal be . Honours of the Church , should follow the Honours of the State . So that the greater City , the greater Bishop . And thus Romes Primacy in Order , brought him to his supremacy in Authority .

Againe , you say , The Calling of Bishops , Whence this Calling ? Not from God . And of Aarons Priesthood it was said , No man takes this honour upon him , but he that is called of God , as was Aaron : Heb. 5.4 . So all the Apostles had a speciall Calling and Commission from Christ to preach , &c. Paul Called to be an † † Rom. 1.1 . 1 Cor. 1.1 . 2. Cor. 1.1 . &c. Apos●le of Iesus Christ . He stood upon his Calling , he had a lawfull Calling , wheron his Apostolicke Authority was founded Now you would be accounted Apostolick , and the Apostles successors : but where 's your Calling ? We find no such Calling , as of Lord-bishops in the Scripture . Therfore you have no Authority over the inferiour Clergy , not over Gods Ministers , I meane . Either therfore prove your Calling from God , or give us leave to deny your Authority , as being an usurped Tyranny . If you aledge those Bishops so called , Act. 20.28 . Phil. 1.1 . 1 Tim. 3.1 . Tit. 1.7 . &c. Prove they were Diocesan Bishops . We prove them by the plain Text to be but Presbyters over the severall Congregations , over which the Holy Ghost made them Episkópous , Bishops , or Overseers , as more fully at after . If you aledge Timothy and Titus for Bishops , that 's soon answered , they were onely Euangelists , no Bishops . Those Epigraphees in the end of that to 2 Tim. and Tit. they are no part of the Text , but were added long after , at the leas● 400. years . It behoves you therfore to prove your Calling better , before you so presse and oppresse us with your Authority . But you adde :

L. p. 177. Among these ( to wit , Patriarchs , Metropolitans , Bishops ) there was effectuall subjection respectively grounded upon Canon , and positive Law in their severall quarters .

P. Here you confesse , that all subjection of Metropolitans to the Patriarchs , and of Bishops to the Metropolitans , was but grounded upon Canon , and Positive Law : Ergo , not upon the Canon of Scripture nor the Law of God . As you confessed openly in High Commission , that no one Apostle had Authority or Iurisdiction over the Rest , or any of their fellows . so as though you call your calling Apostolicke , yet your Arch-Bishoprick is not Apostolicke , in exercising Authority and Iurisdiction over all the Bishops in your Province . This you have not from the Scripture : I know not from what Papall Canon . For as for Positive , if you meane the Politick Laws of Princes , you will not take your Authority from them . And the Judges have declared their judgement in the Kings Edict , that your exercising your Authority , and keeping Courts in your own Names , is now no more a trenching upon the Kings Prerogative , then formerly it hath been . Where the Judges are to be commended for their Discretion . But it is very well . Thus you are loose off from the Positive Law of the Prince : and we deny you any title either of Authority or Calling over the Ministry : and so you may prove to sit between two stooles ; or as he that hath not one string to his bow . But whereas you confesse before , that Bishops have no Jurisdiction one over another , because the Apostles had not : hence it is evident , that those who are true Bishops , to wit , Presbyters , have no jurisdiction over one another ; and so there is no such Order , or Calling of Lord Bishops , whereby they have Authority over the true Bishops and Pastors of the flocks of Christ . These things are noted sufficiently before : but as Augustine writing against the Pelagians , saith , By these things so often repeated , though the importunity of the Adversary will not be repressed , yet the Truth shal be the more confirmed , and the Faith of Beleevers the more firmly established .

L. p. 183. The Patriarch of Rome had potentiorem Principalitatem , a more powerfull Principality , then other Churches had . And that the Protestants grant too : and that not onely because the Roman Prelate was Ordine primus , First in Order and Degree , which some one must be , to avoyd confusion : but , &c.

P. What the Protestants grant to have been de facto , is one thing , that such a thing is , or was so and so : but what they grant to have been de Iure , but what Right is another . And this the Reformed Protestants never granted to the Pope , or any Prelate . But there must be some one ( say you ) to avoyd Confusion : and this according to the honour of the state and Place . And that must needs be the Pope of Rome . But for the purpose , or end , you are farre wide . For instead of avoyding Confusion , this strowed the way to build up Babylon , Confusion it selfe . And your selfe saith as much : * * Pag. 176. This was the very fountaine of Papall Greatnesse , the Pope having his Residence in the Great Imperiall City . So as Primacy joynd with Power , and Authority too , as that of the Pope in Rome , and yours in England , the Pope residing in the Imperiall City , and you in the Royall Court , What confusion the one hath brought to the Empire it selfe , the world knows , and what the other may bring to the State Royall , the Lord knows , and he in mercy prevent : and if such confusion to States , then what to the true Religion , and the Churches of Christ .

But hath the Pope then ( that pretended successor of the poore Fisherman ) such a Principality ? This is more then Primacy . Unlesse Primacy be , by your interpretation , Principality . Nay it must needs be so : because , if the Popes Principality be more potent , then other Churches : then surely your Primacy is at least a Principality too , though lesse potent . And who doubts of that . For at your High Commission Board at Dr BASTWICKS Censure , you did prove most bravely from Scripture it selfe , that you were Princes . What Scripture ? You aledged Psal. 45.16 . Instead of thy Fathers shal be thy Children , Psal. 45.16 . whom thou mayst make Princes in all the Earth . What conclude you hence ? Ergo , Prelates are Princes . We deny your inference , and consequence . How prove you it ? I know you will straight appeale to a Generall Councel , if we doubt of it . Stay awhile . A Generall Councel is an Assembly of Prelates . And then , They shal be their own Iudges . That 's not faire play . And Bellarmine would have a great stroke there , for he also aledges this place for you , and himselfe too , to prove that the Pope is a Prince , and so all Prelates under him . But by your leave we appeale to the Scriptures themselves for Interpretation , as best knowing their own meaning , and ablest to expresse themselves . Now comparing this with other Scriptures , we find , that those Princes there spoken of in all Lands , are understood of all Gods Children , true Beleevers , throughout the whole earth now under the Gospell . For of these the Spirit saith , He ( Christ ) hath made us Kings , Rev. 1.6 . and Priests to God his Father . Now if all true Beleevers be Kings , then also Princes . And in * * 1 Pet. 2.9 Rev. 5.9 , 10. Iam. 2.5 . Peter , we are called a royall Priesthood . So Rev. 5.9 , 10. Thou hast redeemed us to God by thy blood , and hast made us unto our God Kings and Priests , &c. And Jam. 2.5 . Hearken , my beloved brethren , hath not God chosen the poore of this world , to be rich in Faith , and heires of the Kingdome , which God hath promised to them that love him ? How if heires of the Kingdome , then Princes And Rom. 8.16 , 17. Rom. 8.16 , 17 ▪ The Spirit it selfe beareth witnesse with our spirit , that we are the Children of God . And if Children , then heires , heires of God , and joynt heires with Christ , if s● be we suffer with him , that we may be also glorified together . And many other places to this purpose . We are the * * Rom. 8.29 . Heb. 2.11 . brethren of Christ , the congregation of the first borne . Therfore Princes . And yet poore in this world . But if Prelates be Princes , they are such as Salomon describes , by another Title , being compared to the true Princes , Gods Children . There is ( saith he ) an evil , which I have seen under the Sun ( and he saw it by the eye of Prophecy ) as an error , which proceedeth from the Ruler . What is the evil ? What that error of Rulers ? Namely , Folly is set in great Dignity , and the Rich set in low place : I have seen Servants on Horses , and Princes walking as Servants upon the earth . Now who are these rich , that sit in a low place ? The rich in Faith saith Iames. And who are these Princes , that walke as Servants upon the earth ? Namely Gods Children , who are true Princes , heires of the Kingdome , that are afflicted and oppressed in the world . And what folly is that , which is set in great dignity ? Who more properly then Prelates , which are as those of whom Iames speakes , in rich and gorgeous apparell , who are set in a goodly place , while Gods poore Children sit below on the footstoole . And who those Servants on Horses ? Prelates on their footcloth , riding in pompe , while Gods people trudge a foot on the earth . If you say , you are not here meant : because you are no fooles , nor servants . Indeed you are no small fooles . For there are no greater fooles in the world , then such as seem wisest in their own conceit , as Prelates doe . As Salomon saith , ‡ ‡ Pro. 26.12 . Seest thou a man wise in his owne conceit ? there is more hope of a foole then of him ▪ Now doe not you make your selves the wisest men in the world , as the onely Guides and Oracles of the Church , and that even as you are Prelates ? And againe , are there any such fooles , as those , who preferre the riches and honours in the world , before heaven ? Or that warre and fight against Christ , and his Kingdome ? And doe not you Prelates so ? Your own vain profession , and practises proclaime you to be folly it selfe , set in great dignity ? And are you not servants , servants of sinne , servants of your own lusts , and other mens , ‡ ‡ Iude. 16. having them in admiration , for advantage ? And under colour of humility , as if you were servi servorum , servant of servantes as the proud Pope styles himself , which was § § Gen. 9. Chams curse ) doe you not exalt your selves as Domini dominantium , mounted on your rich and prancing Palphrys , while you † † Psa● . 66.12 . ride over the heads of the true heaven bred Princes , that goe afoot on the ground ? And how came you to be so mounted , but through the 〈◊〉 of Rulers of the earth . How mounted the Pope , but by the Emperours holding of his stirrup . And when the Pope was terrible angry with the * * Fredericke . Emperour , for holding the wrong stirrup , did not the Emperour trow you then begin to see his error ? But it was now too late . Having given ‡ ‡ Revel. 17. their Kingdome to the Beast , 't is just with God , they should become his Vasalls , till the time appointed .

But to conclude this your Ordine primus , which you apply to 〈◊〉 Pope , I cannot more properly and truly parallell or compare it , then to Iudas , the Standard-bearer of that troope , that came to apprehend Christ ; for Iudas came to Christ with Hale Master , and kissed him , and with this kisse , as by the signall given , betrayed him . And is not your Ordine primus by this very Character known to be Antichrist , while pretending to be Apostolick , and a Successor of the Apostles , he doth the more easily betray Christ in his Word and Members into the hands and bands of men ?

Object . But Peter was Ordine primus . What , such as to avoyd confusion ? As a head uniting all the members , and governing all the body , as your Ordine primus to avoyd confusion , necessarily imports ? Did Peter at any time convent the Apostles ? Was he that Ordine primus , that struck the stroke , and gave the Difinitive sentences in that first Generall and Apostolicall Councel , Act. 15. Did not Iames determine , and the whole Church assented ? And Gal. 2.9 . Is not Iames set before Peter : Act. 15. Gal. 2. ● . And was ‡ ‡ Act. 8.1 . ● ▪ not Peter and Iohn sent by the rest of the Apostles to Samaria ? When was this necessity then of an Ordine primus , to avoyd confusion ? And what confusion is avoyded this day in the Church of England by your being Ordine primus , nay prim-as , both in honour and Authority and Iurisdiction ? Have you not by that your Ordine primus brought a confusion upon Religion ? Upon the Doctrinall Articles ? Upon the Consciences and Faith of men , not knowing what to beleeve , or what to doe , or how to live in any peace , inward or outward ? But you thinke to shift well enough for one , so long as you put an other Ordine primus before ( as before is noted ) upon whose back you may lay all your burthens . So as if any thing be amisse , or succeed not well , you are not then the Ordine primus .

Lastly , one thing I observe more from your Ordine primus , and that is , the necessity of it , which say you , some one must be . What one soever this is , whether the Patriarch of the greater world , or he of the lesser , or other World , but Rome rather must be she , there 's a necessity for this , that one be Ordine primus . What 's this ? By the necessity of this Ordine primus , is brought in a necessity of your new Catholicke Militant Church , consisting of the Prelacy , or Hierarchy , which is so one , as one must be Ordine primus , as generall of the whole Army , as the Dragon and his Angels to warre against Michael and his Angels . So as here is an indissoluble and inseparable combination and confederacy of Prelates throughout the world , making up that one Militant or Malignant Church , whereof one must 〈◊〉 the chiefe , to order the battel , that there be no disorder , but that every one keep his ranke , and fight in his station against the true Militant Church of Christ , as was before noted .

L. p. 182. Let Rome reduce it selfe to the observation of Tradition Apostolicke , to which it held in Irenaeus his time , and I will say as he did , That it will be then necessary for every Church , and for the faithfull every where to agree with it .

P. Let Rome reduce it selfe to the rule of the Scripture in all things , which the faithfull there held in Pauls time , when he was prisoner , yet Preacher in Rome , and then I will say ( and wil be the first that will doe it ) I wil be one of the faithfull , that will agree with it . But for Tradition Apostolicke , I know not what you meane , and therfore I dare not say as you doe . But still you hold with Ordine primus , I am sure of it . You hold fast together for your Hierarchy , wherein you place the Pope your Ordine primus . Which while you doe , Whatsoever Tradition Apostolicke Rome shall reduce it selfe to , it wil be most perillous and pernicious too for any of the faithfull to agree with it . And I am sure the Hierarchy , and our Ordine primus in that , was no Tradition Apostolicke . So for that , ther 's no talke of reducing , either for Romes or Canterbury . And could you perswade the world to agree with with the Ordine primus at Rome , then that speech of yours ( pag. 182. ) would easily take place in these our times , as well as Irenaeus his time . * * pag. 182. Very great reason was there in Irenaeus his time , that upon any difference arising in the Faith , Omnes undique fideles , all the faithfull , or , if you will , all the Churches round about , should have recourse , that is , resort to Rome , being the Imperiall City , and so a Church of more powerfull Principality , then any other at that time , in those parts of the world . But the meaning of A.C. is , we must so have recourse to Rome , as to submit our faith to hers . And should I grant them their own sense , that all the faithfull every where must agree with Rome ( which I may give , but can never grant ) yet were not this saying any whit prejudiciall to us now . For first , here 's a powerfull Principality ascribed to the Church of Rome ▪ so you . Here are many words conningly woven , and packt up together , that to discover your full meaning , you had need to un●old your whole pack . Now all round about Rome , is a large compasse ; for the whole world lyes round about Rome , it being also ( at least there ) the Imperiall City , and so a Church of more powerfull Principality , then any other , which might therfore challenge resort of all unto it , as to the onely Oracle for resolving all your faithfull every where in doubts of Faith . Yea and if you should grant too , that all must submit their faith to Rome , you say , it were no whit prejudiciall to us now . And should you not grant it , how should it agree with your necessity of having one Ordine primus . For to what purpose should there be one Ordine primus to avoyd confusion , i● to his Call , Summons and Judgement all your faithfull resorting , they should not rest this their faith in his Determination . Otherwise , how should Confusion be avoyded . For then to what one Ordine primus should they goe ? But do you yeeld it , or no ? You say , you may give it , but can never grant it . I pray you , whether shall your affirmative giving , or your negative granting be of more force ? Or if you give it , how do you not grant it too ? Yea giving is more then granting . If therfore you give it , you doe more then grant it . But suppose you restrain it onely to Irenaeus his time . Had Rome then an Infallible Oracle in the Popes brest ? Or was his Iudgement the more infallible , because his Chaire was in the Imperiall City ? Or his sentence of the more credit , because his Church had the more powerfull Principality ? Then why in all doubtfull cases of Faith should not all the faithfull in England resort to the Chaire of Canterbury , as which hath the most powerfull Principality , of all the Prelates in England ? Why should not the thresholds of your Palace be as much worne with the footsteps of those that come to your Oracle for resolution in matters of faith : as the Shrine of your Predecessor S. Thomas of Canterbury , with the keyes of his blind votaries ? And so much the more in these dayes ; as wherein you have put all England to a stand and stagger what to beleeve in point of Faith , considering that the Articles of Religion , like Meteors hang in suspense in the ayre , no man knowing what to make of them , whether they be white or blacke , or what such Comets portend , untill to that Edict of the Court ( that binds up the sense of the Articles fast asleep , or in a slumber between Hawke and Buzzard , or as a speaking in a dreame ) you shall superadde the Definitive Decree of the Chaire of Canterbury , to interpret unto us what they have dreamed all this while . But I suppose , the Board calling you so much away from your Chaire , you are the more willing , and that in such a case of necessity to send all the faithfull to your Ordine primus at Rome , and to Peters Chaire there ( if any such thing be there ) which may like Iunoes three footed stoole , resolve all their doubts . And so ( as you * * idid . say to A C. ) Rome may thanke you for it . But alwayes provided , tha● Rome first reduce her selfe ( as you say ) to the Observation of Tradition Apostolicke , and then you will say Latinè , plainly , That it wil be then necessary for every Church , and for the faithfull every where to agree with it , to have recourse to Rome , and to rest their Faith there , where is the most Powerfull Principality . And thus ( as well as I could ) I have pickt up your meaning , wherein if I have come short , you must pardon me , and blame your selfe , for your being no more perspicuous in matters of such moment , as about consulting of Oracles , considering , that that of Apollo and Delphos was long agoe put to silence . But to proceed .

L. p. 199. The Bishop of Rome hath no power from Christ , over the whole Church to be Iudge in Controversies : nay out of all doubt , 't is not the least reason , why de facto he hath so little successe , because de Jure he hath no power given .

P. Not over the whole Church . This seems to imply , that the Bishop of Rome hath a power from Christ to be Iudge in Controversies over all the Churches at least within his own more powerfull Principality . And consequently , that the Primate of Canterbury hath the like power from Christ to be Judge in Controversies over the whole Church of England . If you have , yet it wil be some ease to the English , that they have an Oracle so neare home to resolve them in all doubts , so as they need not ( as formerly ) go trudge to Rome for the matter . But neither to the Pope in his Powerfull Principality , nor to you in your Primacy hath Christ given any power at all to be Judge in Controversies of Faith . And because you have no Calling , nor Commission from Christ , therfore 't is true you say in this , that the Pope hath no better successe . And I pray you ‡ ‡ Selfe-condemned . what successe have you had , since you took upon you to sway the Crosier staffe of Canterbury , and to be Judge in Controversies of Faith , making and raysing controversies there , where there was none before , as namely in the Articles of Religion ? 'T is true , you have put many a good Minister to Silence , thrust many a one out of his Cure , and Countrey , levied your way for an universall Conformity to Rome , prevailed much in your Designes that way : but yet have you any great cause to boast of your successe , all things Considered ? I say no more . Verbum sapienti : you understand me well enough . And certainly when you cast up your reckoning , you will find your selfe to be as much behind hand for successe , as you do the Pope . And your Reason is true : because you have no power , no Authority , no Calling , no Commission from Christ , either to possesse such a place , or to execute such an Office . For as the Lord saith in * * Ier. 23.32 . Ieremie ( speaking of false Prophets ) I sent them not , neither commanded them : therfore they shall not profit this people at all , saith the Lord . So , neither have you reason to thinke , that because you may do what you list in turning things upside down , in seting up your Altars , in suppressing Gods word , in oppressing Gods Ministers , in advancing your Arminian and Popish faction , and you hitherto prosper therein , while there is never a man left , that dare so much as mutter a word against these your practises , so great is your Power , and so terrible your Cruelty , and Ministers so Cowardly , so as by this meanes your Cause and Course seems to prosper , while you can crush any that shall interpose himselfe , or lawfully in his place oppose your violent courses : therfore Christ hath given you this power thus to tyrannise , wherein you doe so prosper . True it is , that Christ hath given way to Satan to rage in these times , because he knows he hath but a short time : and hereby Christ will try and humble his people , that he may doe them good , and be glorified in their deliverance , and in the destruction of all such Papall and Antichristian Tyranny .

L. p. 200. The Church being as large as the world , Blasphemy against Christ as being Author of the Antichristian Hierarchy . Christ thought it fitter to governe it Aristocratically , by Divers , rather then by One Viceroy . And I beleeve that this is true . For all the time of the first 300. yeares , and somwhat bettter , it was governed Aristocratically , to wit , by the Bishops , &c.

P. Here you give us occasion further to launch into the Deep of this Mystery , that we may sound the bottome of it , and so discerne what ground it floats upon ( mudde , or sand , or both ) although we have in part discovered it before . Here you say , and you say you beleeve it too ( it is an Article of your Creed ) that Christ thought it fitter to govern the Church Aristocratically by diverse , rather then by one Viceroy . And you give the Reason , The Church being as large as the world . We will first take an Assay of your words , and then of your Reason . For to a vulgar Reader some of your words are somwhat obscure , and some also very finely couched , that every eye cannot at the first discerne the Mystery of them .

And first , for Aristocratically : Aristotle , the famous Philosopher , and no meane statesman , in his Politicks layes down 3 kinds of Civil Government , taken in the better part : The first is Monarchia , which is a government by One : the second is , Aristocratia , which is a Government of the Best Men : the third is Democratia , which is a Government Popular , or of the People . Opposite to these three , he sets three sorts of bad Government : the first is Tyranny , which is opposed to Monarchy ; Tyranny ruling either without , or contrary to the good Laws established : but a Monarchy governing according to the established good Laws of the State , Kingdome , or Common-weale . The second is , Oligarchia , which signifies the Government of a few ; and this standing in opposition to Aristocratia ( the Government of the best men ) it signifieth the Government of a few of the worst men . The third is , Anarchia , that is , no Government at all , when without Law , or Ruler , every one doth that , which seems good in his own eyes ( as Jude 17 6. and 21.25 . ) and this is opposed to Democratia , a Government of the people by good Laws . These things thus plainly layd down , we shall the more clearly proceed in our Point .

Secondly , I note here your word Vice-Roy ; which every man knows doth signifie a Vice-King , or one Deputed by the King to governe a Kingdome in his personall absence , whereof there is usually but one in a Kingdome ; as the Vice-Roy of the Kingdome of Naples under the King of Spaine ; or the Lord Duputy of Ireland under the King thereof . But yet every one doth not perhaps understand , that among diverse Prelates , you make your selfe a Vice-roy . But looking more narrowly into your words , we shall find that sense easily resulting from them . For you say , That Christ thought it fitter to governe his Church by Diverse , then by One Vice-Roy : that is , by Diverse Vice-Roys , rather then by One. All comes to one reckoning . And besides you expresse the word Diverse , and the word One ▪ with a Capitall , to note , that both have reference to Vice-Roy . So as it runs Currant both wayes , whether you say , By Diverse , rather then by One Vice-Roy : or , By Diverse Vice-Roys , rather then by One. Thus 't is plaine enough .

Lastly , a third word here is of some difficulty : that you say , Christ thought it fitter . Now I never took you to be one of Christs Privy Councel , so as to be made Privy to Christs thoughts , and that in these things , which he hath no where expressed in his word . But this is familiar with you ( as before ) to tell us Gods thoughts . But shew us where Christ hath expressed any such thought of his in his expresse word , the Scripture . If you cannot ( as you cannot ) how presume you to say , Christ thought so . Certainly my Lord Iesus Christ , that * * 1 Tim 6.15 . onely Potentate , and ‡ ‡ Rom. 16.27 . onely wise King , useth not to entertaine such as you are to be of his Privy Councel , or Cabinet , that dare discover his secrets , nay dare report that of him , which never came into his thought . And if ye be so bold with Christ , others may be warned hereby how farre to trust you with their secrets , and others againe , how farre to beleeve your reports of Princes Pleasures , or Purposes , when perhaps 't is neither so nor so . But my Lord , your Places , and Grace , attended with all the Princely Pompe , suits not with Christs Privy-Councel-Board . He admitted none thither , but a company of poore simple Fishermen . Those were his ‡ ‡ Ioh. 15.14 , 15. Friends , to whom he did communicate and impart his councels and secrets . As § § Gen. 18.17 . Abraham being the † † Iam. 2.23 . Friend of God , God said he would hide nothing from him . No , nor from any of his true-bred seed . ‡̶ ‡̶ Psal. 25.14 . The secret of the Lord is with them that feare him ; and he will shew them his Covenant . They are either strangers in the world , as * * Dan. Daniel in Babylon : or exiles from the world , as ‡ ‡ Rev. 1. Iohn in the I le of Pathmos ; or such as live sub Dio , in the wildernesse , as Iohn Baptist : or dwell in a poore thatcht Cottage , or so , to whom the Lord Iesus Christ reveales his thoughts ; and not lightly to those that live deliciously , and are in Kings Cours , and goe in soft clothing , their ‡ ‡ Rev. 12.4 . Traine borne up after them , wherewith they draw the third part of the starres of heaven . As a Cardinall at the Election of a Pope , when there was a solemn Masse sung to call down the Holy Ghost , to set the dissenting Factions of the Cardinalls at one , and it would not be , said , Let us uncover the Roofe , for the Holy Ghost cannot find a way to passe through so many tyles . And my Lord , if you tell us this as a revelation , what Christ thought : we have no more , but your bare word ( as in many other things of like nature ) so as unlesse ( in a matter of such moment as this is ) you can shew us the truth hereof by some Miracle for confirmation , as the § § 2 Th●ss 2. Romish Priests doe for their Transubstantiation , and Purgatory , and such like secrets : you must pardon us , if we doe not give credit to what you so boldly say of Christs thought here .

But from your words come we to the matter , which they import , and which I say we still require proofe of , which will trouble you worse to find , then all the writing of your Book hath done . And seeing you compare your Episcopall Government with the Aristocraticall , which is the Government Optimatum , of the Best men : prove unto us ( to make your comparison good , and that in the prime notion of it ) that Prelates are the Best men in the Church . You are Megístoi indeed , the greatest : but are you Aristoi , Cicer. Offic. the Best . Riches and Honours ( saith Cicero ) make a man to be Majorem , greater : Meliorem verò quomodo ? but how , better ? I could never beleeve , that the Papall Miter , could infuse holinesse , or an Archiepiscopall Pall , Grace . Nor could I see any Reason why Prelates should take place in precedency one of another , according to the greatnesse of their Principality respectively , as if the Pope were ever the more learned , vertuous , religious , holy , because he is Bishop of Rome , or your Lordship because you are Titled His Grace of Canterbury . Whereas precedency of persons should goe by their personall worth , and age , and inward indowments , and not by any Prelaticall outward Prerogatives . But this by the way .

But for your Aristocratie : That Prelates are the best men to governe the Church of Christ ; will ye be tryed by the thoughts of Christ expressed by the Apostle , which he had heard in the * * 2 Cor. Third heaven , in Christs Privy Chamber ? There you shall see plainly , what both your , and our faith may infallibly build upon ; namely who , or what manner of persons they be , whom Christ thought fit to Govern his Church . You say , Bishops . So say we too . But whether our Bishops be the same with your Bishops ( and that not onely for their Function , yours being Diocesan , and ours ( such as the Apostle speaks of ) Pastors respectively over their particular Congregations : but for their qualities and conditions , such as are required in true Bishops indeed ) let us heare the Apostles words . ‡ ‡ 1 Tim. 3.1 , &c. Pistòs ho lógos . Eítis Episkopes o'régetai , kalou e'rgou e'pithumei : This is a faithfull saying : If any man desire the Office of a Bishop he desireth a worthy worke , Orégetay , signifieth an earnest desire , quasi porrectis manibus prehendere & arripere ; the Office of a Bishop perhaps you would translate e'piskopè , a Bishoprick : but our English hath turned it right , The office of a Bishop ; for 't is called here , a worthy worke . And therfore it is not one of your Prelaticall Bishopricks , which indeed you doe with both hands both o'rexasthai , & epithumesai , reach after with all earnest desire : for you reach after the Lordship , after the Honour , after the Revenues , after the Pleasures , after the Ease , and after the goodly Palaces and Demeanes of your Bishoprick● : in all which you cannot shew k●lòn ' érgon , a worthy worke . And so indeed these words of the Apostle ( and elswhere ) concerning a Bishop do nothing concerne you : but onely to convince you , that you are none of those Bishops , whom the Scripture so styleth . Well , what be those speciall qualities , which the Apostle requireth in a true Bishop , set over the Congregation of the Lord ? It shall suffice to mention for the present purpose but some of them . As first : He must be Anégkletos , unreprovable , such as cannot be justly accused of any crime . Now none of you come thus cleane to your Bishopricks : for you are , or may be justly accused of having been Pluralists ( which is against your Old Canons ) Non-Residents , Idle Dreanes , seldome Preaching in their own Cures , but by a poore Stipendary Curate , flattering Court-Preachers , and the like . Nay who is capable , or heire apparent of a Bishopricke , or Prelacie , that hath not two or three ●at livings , with a Prebend or two , and a Deanery , that being thus qualified , having his Purse well lyned ( I say not , that he may purchase his Bishopricke ) he may be able at least at his In-coming to defray five or six hundred Pounds , or a thousand Markes for Fees , and Feasts , and Gloves at his Consecration ? Well , secondly , He must not be Authádas , selfe-willed ( so our last Translation renders the word . ) And beleeve me this may come neere the proudest of your Coats , when you come with your Volumus & Iubemus , We will and command , and that without either Law , or Canon ? And you must have your will , ther 's no remedy for that , else ye will take the pet , or pepper in the nose , and cry out of contempt of Authority . And the word signifieth also one that is arrogant , and proud , a selfe-pleaser . You may take all these senses , if you will . Thirdly , He must not be , Plékges , a strik●r , whether with his own , or others hands , as delivering over to the secular Power , or Sword , whereby he so strikes , as he sheds the blood of the Innocents . He must be none of that society . Fourthly , he must not be Orgílos , soon Angry , testy , or touchy , such as Na●al , that one might not speake to him , he was so snappish , and curst , Fiftly , he must not be Aiskrokerdès , given to filthy lucre , as in exacting Fees ( he or his Officers ) of poore Ministers , either extraordinary at their Admissions , or ordinary at Visitations , and a thousand wayes besides Viis & modis sine modo in your Bishops Courts . Sixtly , He must be Philágados , a lover of good men , not a hater and persecuter of them . Seventhly , he must be Díkaies , just , not oppressing Innocents by a faction and confederacy of voyces forepacked in your Courts , before the Cause come to be heard . Eightly , He must be Osios , holy , not one that is an enemy to all true holinesse , and persecutes the very name of it , and suppresse the practise and meanes of it , as by crying down the sanctification of the Lords day , and the sincere Preaching of the word of God , and commending and dispensing with profane sports on that day ▪ Ninthly ▪ He must be Didáktikos , apt to teach : not onely sufficient and able , for his Scholarship , or one that can make a Sermon , if he will , but he must be diligent in preaching in season and out of season . He must hold fast the faithfull Word , that he may be able by sound Doctrine both to exhort , and to convince the Gainsayers . So farre must he be from abbetting and countenancing false Teachers , and unsound Doctrine , and old damned Heresies , and forbidding to preach sound Doctrine , and punishing those that doe . I might reckon up sundry more qualities , which Christ requireth in those , whom onely he allowes and appoints as fittest to govern and feed his People , as becom●th good Pastors to doe their flocks ; as 1 Tim. 3. and Tit. 1. and elsewhere . But because Lord Prelates , or Diocesan Bishops ( as I said before ) are none of those Bishops here which the Apostle requires to be thus qualified ; therfore I have said enough to convince you , that you are none of Christs Bishops , if you do but look your selves in this Glasse . And if you mark it well , these are those , that immediately succeded the Apostles and Euangelists , in the Ministeriall function . As we read , Eph. 4.11 . where the Pastors and Teachers are those , who are elswhere called Presbyters and Bishops , such as Paul and Barnabas did * * Act. 14.23 . Keirotonesi , elect , ordaine , or appoint by imposition of hands Kat' e'kklesían , in every Church , or particular Congregation . A place very remarkable . And these Presbyters , Bishops , Pastors , Teachers , Preachers , Ministers ( for all is one and the same Office ) as they succeded the Apostles , but with a particular limitation every one to their peculiar charges and Congregations respectively : so while the Apostles lived , they were still next unto them , as we see Act. 15.2.4.6.22 , 23. And these are those Elders that rule well , which especially doe Kopian , labour hard in the Ministry of the Word and Doctrine . These are those Aristoi , those Optimates , the best men , by whose Aristocraticall Government , according both to the thought ( we may boldly and truly say ) and to the expresse word of Christ , the severall Churches , and particular Congregations and flocks of Christ , are governed ; and that , not by any their own devised Canons , but by the onely Canon of Scripture , wherein are expressed all those Laws , and Rules , by which all true Ministers of Christ doe regulate themselves , and govern their severall Congregations . For although Christs faithfull and true Ministers are the best men , and therfore are but few in comparison ( and ‡ ‡ 2 Cor. 2.16 . who is fit , or sufficient for these things ? saith the Apostle ) yet Christ left them not to governe his Churches or flocks , as they should thinke best , but according to his own Laws : as Deputies are to govern the people according to the Kings Laws , and no otherwise . For such is the Government of Aristocratie , it is established upon good Laws of the Common-weale ; otherwise it should degenerate into the corrupt and bad Government of Oligarchia . So as here is no roome for your Diocesan Lord Bishops ; for you are none of those Aristoi , Optimates : the best m●n , whom Christ thought fit for the Aristocraticall Government of his Church , sith ye are neither qualified for it , as he requires in his true Bishops , nor will you confine your Prelaticall Government to the Laws of Christ expressed in his word , but will govern by your own Canons and lusts , as usurpers use to doe . And therfore ( by the way ) no mervaile if you speake so contemptibly and basely of the holy Scripture , seeing in them you can find no ground , either of Precept , or Apostolick Precedent for your Antichristian Hierarchy .

All which considered , doth in the second place give us just cause to doubt at least , or rather to be well assured indeed , that Diocesan Prelates , or Bishops ( as you usurpe the Title ) are no Vice-Roys under the Great King Iesus Christ : because your Government is nothing according to our Great Kings Laws , but according to your own devised Canons , and in nothing , in Nothing ( I say ) agreeable to the Laws of Christ in the Scripture , for the right Government of his Church . Nay that Government which Christ hath prescribed in his word , and which is practised in the best Reformed Churches beyond the Seas , you doe utterly and openly condemn , and the Churches themselves , that doe practise the Discipline of Christ and his Apostles , while you deny them to be any Churches of Christ at all .

Againe , Every Kingdome , as it hath but one King over it , so it is capapable of no more , then onely one Vice-Roy ▪ so as by that Title , he that is your Ordine Primus , and hath a more Potent Principality , the Pope , had he but a good Title , would carry that honour from you all , if you value the worth and Dignity of that Vice-Royship after the value of your Bishopricks , and not after vertue . Either then you must acknowledge the Pope to be the sole Vice-Roy , which you are loth to doe . ( For why should not the Patriarch of the other world be as capable of that honour , as he ) or you must give us leave to find out the onely true Vice-Roy of Christ in his Church , and that is , The Holy Ghost . For when our Great King went into his Celestiall Kingdome , to his Church Tryumphant , leaving his Militant here on Earth under the Kingdome of Grace , as touching his bodily presence : he sent the Holy Ghost to be his Vice-Roy , or Vice-Gerent , to be perpetually resident in his Kingdome of Grace here , for the Governing of his Church Militant , and that according to the Law of Christ in his written word , leading the People of Christ into all truth , by revealing unto them all the Mysteryes of Christs will contained in the Scripture . As Christ saith , * * Ioh. 16.14 . He shall g●orifie Me ; for he shall receive of mine , and shew it unto you . And v. 13. When the spirit of Truth is come , whom ( v. 7. ) I will send unto you , he will guide you into all Truth ; for he shall not speake of himselfe , but whatsoever he shall heare , that shall he speake . Loe here then a faithfull Vice-Roy indeed . And will , or dare you deny this Spirit of God to be an All sufficient Vice-Roy , who doth execute Christs Kingly Office in his Church , in all things just so , as Christ himselfe will●th . And therfore except you can prove , that Christ hath many Kingdomes of Grace here on earth , or any more Churches Militant , then one onely , here is no Rome for any such Vice-Roys , as you pretend to be . For here we see it plain , that of Christs one , and onely Kingdome of Grace here on earth , the Holy Ghost is the onely Vice-Roy . And who is fit to be Christs Vice-Roy in his spirituall Kingdome , but the Spirit of God , and of Christ● ? Ye are therfore no Vice-Roys , because you are altogether carnall , and your Kingdome is of this world .

And therfore Thirdly , how can you Prelates pretend to be Vice-Roys over Christs Church , whenas ( as is noted before ) ye are not so much as any members at all of Christs Kingdome . For you are the Members of Antichrists Kingdome , and so you are , or may be Antichrists Vice-Roys over his severall Provinces . 'T is true you style your selves spirituall , Lords spirituall , and your Courts spirituall , and you are an Hierarchy , as much to say , as a Holy Kingdome , or Government : but it is not spirituall of Christs spirit , but of that spirit that ruleth in the ayre , that gave you all that Authority . ‡ ‡ Eph. 2.2 . So as you do with Bellarmine turne those words of Christ to Peter , Pasce oves meas , Feed my Sheep , to Regio more Impera , Rule as a King . And what similitude is there between Christ and you , that you should be his Vice-Roys in his Church-Militant ? When he was here in person , he was among his own as a servant , and Minister . He had no sta●ely and Princely Palaces , he kept no such Pontificiall house , nor Court : he governed not his Church by Chancellors , Arch Deacons , Deanes Chapters , Commiss●●●●s , Offi●ialls , Pursuivants , Apparitors , and all that Rabble . Christ had no such face of a Kingly Government . So as you have altogether perverted the Kingdome of Christ , which is altogether spirituall , and holy , into a meere temporall and carnall Kingdome , wherein therfore you are none of Christ Vice-Roys , but Vi●ious Roys ▪ and Tyrannicall Lords . O Antich●istian Generation ! O notorious Hypocrites ! O proud and blind Guides ! How shall you escape the vengeance to come , that dare thus impiously ab●se the Name of our Lord Iesus Christ , and so impose upon the world by your bold usurpations ? Vsurpations indeed . You call your selvs Vice-Roys , Apostolicke , Bishops , Spirituall Church , Grace , Holinesse : meere Nominalls , which you have usurped , and patched together , to become a veile to cover your deep hypocrisie , and to seem glorious in the eyes of the world , and all to hold up your earthly Kingdome , which consists altogether of earthly things , honours riches , pleasures But blind world , that su●ferest thy selfe to be thus guld and befoold with such glittering stuffe , and to be made a slave to such Lords , and to be cheated of thy salvavation by these Antichristian Mountebanks . And yet they pretend and professe , that this their carnall ▪ pompous , and Pontificiall Kingdome is Christs spirituall Kingdome here , in the state of Grace . Let them then cleare themselves herein from that damned Heresy of that old Heretick ●erinthus , who lived in S. Iohns time . His Heresy was , That Christs Kingdome , after his Resurrection was earthly , and that now the flesh conversing in Ierusalem was to serve lusts and pleasures . [ See Euseb. Eccl. Hist. lib 3. cap. 22. Metà 〈…〉 . ] Now is not the Prelates Kingdome just that in practise , with Cerinthus his Heresy ? If so : As S. Iohn forsook the Bath wherein Cerinthus was , what cause have Christians to fly from that roofe , where such an Antichristian Hierarchy domineereth ?

But in the next place , let 's consider of your Reason How stands it good , that because Christs Church is as large as the world , therfore he thought it fitter to governe it by Diverse , then by One Vice-Roy ? Now we have proved your Hierarchy not to be an Aristocrasie , a Government of the Best men , and that by good Laws : seeing therfore you must needs be some Government , then it must be an Olegarchie , that is , the Government of a few of the worse men , such as rule by their lusts , and not by any good Laws , either of God , or Man . But now tell me , my Lord , if you argue upon this ground , that because the Militant Church is as large as the world , therfore 't is fitter it be governed by many Vice Roys , then by one : why may not aswell one Prelate , as the Pope , be sole Vice-Roy over the whole world , as my Lord of Canterbury be a Vice-Roy over all England . For doth not the Pope and you Governe your Churches by substitutes ? Why then may not the Pope Governe the whole by his Curates , as you doe all England by your Curates ? For all the Ministers in England are but your Curates . And suppose you were one of the Popes Bishops , and so his Creature : what difference would there be between your Governing of your Province under the Pope , as it were his Deputy , and Governing according to Romes Canons and Customes , and as you do now in your own Name ? And the Pope challenging the whole world for his Diocesse , and you the Province of Canterbury for yours : all the difference is , that he needeth the more Curates , which he may have with a wet finger , and you the fewer . Onely perhaps his Holinesse would now and then fleece your Graces Clergy , as he was wont of old to doe . But in the mean time both the Pope and your Lordship do much mistake the matter , in judgeing , or estimating , and measuring the latitude and extent of Christs Church . For you both measure it according to the extent of your large and Potent Principalities , Patriarchall Countries , Archiepiscopall Provinces , Episcopall Diocesse . But you are farre wide in casting your line . For though Christs Church is said to be dispersed over the whole earth , being confined to no place : yet of all this wide world he hath the least number , and fewest of all , where commonly your Hierar●hy is most predominant . For those that belong to Christ , are a sort of poore Snakes despised in the world , and alwayes persecuted and oppressed by your Hierarchy , so as they can hardly find so much as a little corner any where in the world , much lesse in all the Circuit of your Diocesse , or Provinces , where they may hide their heads , or live in any peace . So as of all your full Vintages , and fruitfull Fields , Christ is glad of the refuse of a few gleanings . And so Christs flock ( alas ! ) is so small , and so poore , and his Kingdome on earth so despised , as to set up such Lordly Vice-Roys , as the Prelates over it , the very Fees of your Courts would eat them out . And therfore because Christs sheep are here and there scattered in the world , and many times as sheep without a shepheard , being driven by your Dogges from their own pasture : Christ thought it fitter to place over his small and scattered flocks , poore sheheards , that should feed their severall flocks respectively with the wholesome food of the word of God : and therfore appointed to every particular Congregation a peculiar Pastor of their own , that should alwayes be personally resident with his flocks , keeping his watch over them night and day ; and so much the more , in regard of so many Wolves and Foxes , and wild Beasts , which without continuall watching , would make a prey of them . Neither would Christ permit his shepheards to commit their Flocks to Hirelings , or Stipenda●y Curates , while themselvs should take their pleasure and ease : for * * Ioh. 10.10 ▪ 12. the Hireling when he seeth the theef , or wolfe coming , fleeth , because he is an Hireling , neither careth he for the Sheep . Therfore Christ wisely and providently hath appointed to every particular Congregation or flocke of his , a shepheard of their own , and that ‡ ‡ Ier. 3.15 . after his own heart , to feed them with knowledge and understanding . And as the shepheard governes and guides his own flocke : so every faithfull Minister or Pastor is appointed by Christ to be the ‡ ‡ 1 Pet. 5.2 . Governour of his own Congregation , according to the Rule of Christ . So as in this respect , Christ thought it fitter to appoint many Governours in his Church , namely to each Congregation their own Shepheard : rather then a few , such as you speake of , as one over a whole Countrey or Province . Neirther let your Lordship thinke , that every such Congregation , having a faithfull Pastor over it , hath yet need of any your Episcopall Inspection , or Trienniall Visitations , or your Archdeacons , Annuall Visitation , wherein you inquire onely whether your owne Cano●s be observed , and if so Omnia bene , All is well , onely the poore Ministers paying their Procuration ; the Visitor never inquiring , if the Minister be diligent in preaching to his flocke : but whether he hath kept the Order for not preaching in the After-noons on the Lords day , and the Order for not Preaching such and such Doctrines , and such like : so as commonly your visitation is like that of the Plague , saving that this is from God immediately , and yours , from another sourse . And Ministers and People too could think themselves happy , to be freed from your awfull and terrible vi●its , wherein your maine ayme is to root out all good Ministers , for which the omission of one of your Ceremonies is sufficient . So as Christs Congregation ( I say ) needs not any such Inspection of the Bishops eye over them , which is as l' aeil de beuf , or the weather gall , called the Ox eye , L' aeil de beuf . which portends a storme to follow . For Christ hath promised his perpetuall Presence and residence with his people , and his eye § § Esa. 27.3 . watcheth over them night and day , least any hurt them . As he saith , † † Mat. 18.20 ▪ When two or three are gathered together in my Name , there am I in the midst of them . Loe here an intire , and compleat body of a Church , having Christ as head over them , and his Spirit in them , and his Word before them , and their own shepheard appointed by Christ to feed them . so as here is no place left for your Prelaticall Vice-Roys .

Object . Put you say , No Bishop , no Church : so say I too , but the Apostles Bishop he must be , not your Diocesan Lord Bishop . What order then ( say you ) wil be in the Church ? A good and decent order in every Congregation , where Christs order , and ordinance takes place , and where mans presumption breaks not this order . And consider here the excellent wisdome , and order of Oeconomy , that Christ hath appointed every Congregation to be governed by . For as that is the most perfect , and compleat form of Civil Government , which is mixed of all the 3 states , as the Monarchiall , Aristocraticall , and Democraticall , when the King governeth by his good Laws , using the best men , as the noble , and most vertuous in the higher places of the Kingdome , and the b●st and dis●reet●st of the common people in the bearing of inferiour offices , such as every one is most fit for ; a representation whereof we have in the 3 states in Parliament , the King , the Nobles , and the Commons : so the Lord Iesus Christ hath established this most compleat form of Government in his Church : First , himselfe rules as King over all , Governing by his Spirit : Secondly , he hath set over every particular Congregation such as are Arist●i , the optimates , the best and ablest to be Pastors and Teachers , each of his own flock : And thirdly , he hath added also the Denocraty , or government of the people , appointed to be chosen out of every Congregation the gravest , wisest , sobriest and discreetest , some as * * 1 Tim. 5.17 . Elders , some , as , ‡ ‡ 1 Tim. 3. Tit. 1. Deacons , to be helpers to the Minister in matter of Discipline , of Sacramentall Provision , of reliefe of the poore , of visiting the sicke , and of other Church affaires for that Congregation . And these are called by the Apostle Antil●pseis , kubern●seis , which our English ●enders , helps in Governments . And all this according to the expresse Law of Christ our King , recorded in the Scripture , as being the most perfect pattern of the Government of his Church for every particular Congregation to be regulated and ordered by . So as in truth those Congregations , that are thus governed , are the onely true Churches of Christ , as wherein himselfe , his spirit , his word doe govern both Minister and people : whereas on the other side , all Prelaticall Churches are false , and Antichristian , as wherein not Christ , and his spirit ▪ and his word do beare rule , but Antichristian men by the pride of their spirit , and by their Canons doe altogether beare sway , thrusting Christ out of his Throne , despising his word , and puting a yoake of bondage over the necks both of Ministers and people .

To conclude this point : because you are of such a beliefe , and so confidently tell us , and peremptorily avouch , that Christ thought it fitter to govern his Church by Diverse , then by One Vice-Roy : besides what is already sayd , I will a little more presse , and present before you Christs own words at full ; which I doe , to put you out of all such beliefe , or so much as any such conceit , that Christ had ever any such thought . Math. 20. upon occasion of those two ( at that time ) ambitious bretheren , Math. 20. sent to Christ by their Mother , to be chiefe about him in his Kingdome : Christ first tells them , Ye know not what ye aske . Then calling his Disciples to him , he saith thus unto them : Ye know that the Princes of the Gentiles exercise Dominion over them , and they that are great , exercise authority upon them . But it shall not be so among you : but wh●so ever wil be great among you , let him be your Minister , &c. Which the Euangelist Luke expresseth thus : * * Luke 22.25 ▪ The Kings of the Gentiles exercise Lordship over them , and they that exercise Authority upon them , are called Euergétai , Benefactors . But ye shall not be so . Ye ? Who ? Not the Apostles of Christ , not the Ministers of Christ in succeding ages . Not so ? How ? Ye shall not exercise Dominion , Lordship , Authority one over another ; you shall not be called Benefactors , Patrons , Lords , Gratious Lords , Honourable , your Grace , your Honour , &c. Why so ? For such are the Kings of the Gentiles , who exercise Dominion over them , and are called Benefactors . You shall not be as they , in exercising any Authority or Jurisdiction one over another . Nor shall ye be called Euerg●t●i , My Good lord , My Benefactor , My Patron , My lords Grace , or My Gratious lord , and the like . Thus under those words Christ cha●geth his Apostles not to affect , not to be ambitious of , not to exercise Superiority or Prelacy , Iurisdiction and Authority one over another , or over Christs Kingdome , his Church and 〈◊〉 ; as Peter saith , ‡ ‡ 1 P●t . 5 ▪ Not as Lords over Gods heritage : where the Apostle useth the same word that Christ his Master used , M● 〈◊〉 katakuriéuontes ton k●úron , not exercising Dominion or 〈…〉 Gods Inheritance : or if you will , over his Clergy , though they be not his onely Inheritance , but his people are no 〈…〉 unto him , and are kleros , Gods lot . But now for Christs 〈◊〉 : do you not think that Christ spake , as he thought , and 〈◊〉 as he spake ? Or can you beleeve any other ? And do not his 〈◊〉 to his Apostles , in them reach to all his Ministers 〈…〉 succeed them in future ages ? If you say ▪ you are the 〈◊〉 onely successors : why are you then l●rds ov●r Go●s 〈…〉 why do you exercise ●u●hority and Dominion over his 〈◊〉 and peop●e , as Heathen Kings doe over then people , 〈…〉 expresly forbid , to his Apostles , and to all their Successors ? But you shew your selves to be none of Christs Disciples , and so none of his Apostles successors : for you obey not Christs word , as the Apostles did .

What do you answere then to Christs words ? Or what interpretation can you devise to avoyd them ? You will answere perhaps with Bellarmine , that Christ forbad his Apostles to be like the Heathen Princes , in exercising a temporall Government , or Authority one over another . This is indeed all the evasion Bellarmine hath . But how vain ! Let 's bring it to the Touch. How shall it be tryed ? What saith Christ ? Humeis dè ouk outos : you shall not be so . Now if you be not so , all is well : you may prove Apostolicall men . But if you prove to be like the Heathen Princes in exercising Lordship over the people , under your Government , and in exercising Authority over them : what can you say for your selves why you should not be proclaimed for proud Contemners of Christs word , and for usurping Tyrants over his peopl ; and so for a rebellious Faction and Confederacy against Christs Kingdome ? Let 's therfore draw our Parallell . Those Heathen Powers were called Princes : so you call your selves : they were Kings , and so were Gods Vice-gerents : you call your selves Vice-Roys of Christ : they were called Benefactors , though they never did good : so you are styled , My lords Grace , and when in your Court , you condemn poore innocents , yet they must confesse the justice and favour of your Court : They were called Fathers of their Countrey , so you , Right Reverend Fatheres , Most Reverend Father , your Grace , &c. They were lords : so you , yea you are temporall lords , and so sit in Parliament , though styled spirituall : they exercised lordship , dominion , Authority over the people , and that with tyranny , and without Law : so do you : And in a word , Is not your Pompe and state , your Power and Greatnesse , your Palaces and Courts , your Traine and Attendants , your Fasces and Lictors , to wit , your Pursuivants and Apparitors , your Kinglike Attire in Purple and Scarlet and fine lynen , soft rayment of silkes and sattens , your Tables overflowing with delicacies of viands and wines in all abundance and variety , and what not , like that of Kings ! Thus doe you not beare the Image of the Beast , the Dragon , the Heathen Emperour , who gave power to that other Beast , the Pope , who in himselfe erected the Image of the first Beast from top to toe , namely the Imperiall state and magnificence being fully expressed and limmed out in the Papall , though but in somwhat a lower degree in your Episcopall Pontificiall state . As Pope Boniface 8. in the first day of his Jubilee came forth pompously arayed in all his Pontificalibus , and the next day in the Imperiall Ropes , with two Swords caried before him . And a lively Image of this is my Lord Bishop , a mixt Creature , partly temporall , and partly spirituall spirituall in name onely , and temporall in his whole outward state , as the Kings and Princes of the Gentiles were , as the Crea●ure called Amphibius , that lives now in the water , and now on the Land , and yet is neither good Fish , nor Flesh.

Now tell us , my Lord , whose Image you beare : Christs , or Caesars ? yea in all things you resemble Caesar , but not many one thing the Lord Iesus Christ . I say , not in one thing . Shew any one thing , wherein you instate either Christ , o● his Apostles after his Resurrection . Indeed you inatate ●he Apostles in their Phil●●●ikí● , emulation and contention , which should be the greatest , which Christ condemneth , and utterly forbiddeth in them . But this was in them onely before they knew the Mystery of Christs Kingdome aright They dreamed of a Temporall Kingdome : but after Christs Resurrection , when they had received the Holy Ghost , they were of another mind , no such emulation then who should be the chiefest there , but who should shew greatest love and fidelity to Christ in preaching the Gospell , and building up spirituall Temples to God . But you ( I say ) imitate them in their carnall estate , wherein that which they blindly imagined , you have erected an Image of , namely a Temporall Kingdome , like that of Heathen Kings and Princes , and other Temporall Lords . Which shews , that you are none of Christs Disciples ( I say ) or the Apostles successors , and that you have not Christs Spirit , but are altogether carnall and sensuall , as the * * Iude 1● . Apostle saith . For had you Christs Spirit , you would be truly spirituall , as the Apostles were . But you are ‡ ‡ Iude 19. s●nsuall , having not the Spirit . And if any man have not the Spirit of Christ , the s●me is none of his . And in that you veile your hypocrisie and all your sensuality , and carnall state which you call your Hierarchy , under the specious termes and Titles of spirituall Holy , Grace , Church , Bishops , Christs Vicars , or Vice-Roys , Apostoli●ke , successors o● the Apostles wherewith you gull the blind world : this is that very Mystery of Iniquity the Apostle speaks of , which began to work even in his dayes ( as we noted before ) you being those false Prophets that come in Christs Name , in sheeps clothing , Mat. 24. & 7 . 1● . but are inwardly ravening Wolves . You may think my language sharpe , but it cannot be too sharpe against such a cursed proud Generation , as you Prelates are , usurping Tyrants , Rebells against Christ , Perverters of all truth and faith , corrupters of all true honesty , holinesse , Religion , and the worship of God , who are made to be destroyed with that * * Rev. 19.19 , 20. Beast of Rome , whose Image you beare , and with whom the false Prophets , such as you are , and all those that in you do worship the Image of the Beast , and receive his marks , shall goe into the bottomlesse pit ▪ and burning lake .

L. p. 204. Now it ( the Church of Rome ) must be a Tryumphant Church here , Militant no longer .

P. I hope then , if Rome be here ( as she is ) a Church Triumphant , and no more Militant , but in warring against Christ and his Saints ( for ‡ ‡ Rev. 18.7 . she saith in her heart , I sit a Queen , and am no Widow , and shall see no sorrow : And in her Decretalls , she hath made a firme ‡ ‡ Vt sedeat , sedendo quiescat in Tabernaculis pacis , &c. As Rev. 18.7 . Sedeo Regina . Decree for her perpetuall tranquility and felicity here , in all pleasures , and prosperity , free from all incursions and invasions ; which is an estate Tryumphant ) there also you , and your Hierarchicall Lady Church of England will not be farre behind your Sister Queen at Rome . For you are both one and the same Church , and one in that especially , which makes you a Church Tryumphant , and that is your Kingly Hierarchy , and Lordly Prelacy : and therfore if that Queen be tryumphant at Rome , your Lordship and your Churches Ladyship must be tryumphant in England , as indeed you are , in all your Ruffe , and Gallantry . And as Rome hath now a long time tryumphed over the poore § § Rev. 17. Saints of God , and Martyrs of Iesus , martyring and massacring them , and garrowsing full cups of their blood even unto drunkennesse , and surfet : so your Tryumphant Chariot marcheth after her apace , trampling the Saints under your feet , and tryumphing over them in shedding their innocent blood , and so glorying in your Bestiall and Diabolicall cruelty in oppressing and tyrannizing over Gods people , and that so fiercely , as if you would outstrippe your Elder Sister in all her bloody barbarisme , and therein exalt your tryumph above hers . For wherein else should the Glory and magnificence of your Prelaticall Princes , and Heroicall Vice-Roys shine forth , but in being mounted on Horsebacke , while the true Princes lacky it by them on the earth ? And thus you ride in tryumph , as the Heathen Kings were wont to doe . Oh how you tryumphed , when you looked through one of your Court-windowes , when you passed your tryumphall Censure , to behold those THREE looking through your Pillory-windowes , whose blood you had before ( how justly your own Conscience can tell you condemned there to be shed ? But the wonder was , that they even the●e , as in their tryumphall Chariot , tryumphed over your Barbarous cruelty . But thus you are a Tryumphant Church too , and in nothing Militant , but ( as is noted before ) in your warring against , and persecuting the poore Saints of God . But your tryumph shall end in * * Phil. 3.19 . your shame and confusion , verifying that which shall be fulfilled in your Sister , or Mother Rome , ‡ ‡ Rev. 18.6 , 7 , 8 , &c. Reward her , even as she rewarded you , and double unto her double , according to her works : in the Cup which she hath filled , fill to her double How much she hath g●●rified her selfe , and lived delicioutsly , so much torment and sorrow g●ve her : for she saith in her heart , I sit a Queen , and am no widow , and shall see no sorrow . Therfore shall her plagues come in one day , &c.

L. p. 205. The Kings under the Law , but s●ill according to it , did proceed to necessary R●formations in Church-busin●sses , and therin commanded the very Priests themselves , as appeares in the Acts of ●lesechiah , and Iosiah , 2 Chro. 29.4 . and 4 King ●● . 2 .

P. All this is true you here affirme ▪ so as i● confirmes what we said before of Christian Kings in matters o● Religion , that they ought to doe nothing , but still according to the Law of God , All , Allways , in All things , not varying in the least Circumstance or Ceremony . All this is well . But what makes this for your Priest ? What saith your practise ? This : Ergo the King giving way to the Priest , or Prelate of Canterbury , he may of his own head appoint and impose what Ceremonies his Romish Devotion thinks fit in the worship of God . This is your usuall Logicke . This your usuall perverting and abusing of Scripture . Well : What more ? A little before ‡ ‡ Pag. 205. ( ibid. ) you tell us , Omnis anima , Every soule , All spirituall men even to the high●st Bishop and in spirituall Causes , so the foundations of Faith and good Manners be not shaken , must be subject to the Higher Powers . And where they are shaken , there ought to be Prayer and Patience , there ought not to be opposition by force . Now for your highest Bishop and all spirituall men , we have done withall , That all Obedience is due from all men to Kings and Princes in all things where the foundations of Faith and Good Manners be not shaken , we all acknowledge with you : and where they are shaken , there ought to be Prayer and Patience of every particular and private Christian , without his opposition by force , when he is pressed to doe that which is against Gods word , and his own Conscience . Now here by the way , I pray you resolve me , as in a Case of Conscience , § § 2 Chro. 26.16 , 17 , 18. Whether the High-Priest Azariah did transgresse or no , when King Vzziah in the Temple burnt Incense on the Altar , he with fourescore Priests of the Lord , that were valient men , went in after the King , and withstood him ▪ saying , It perteameth not unto thee , Vzziah , to burn Incense unto the Lord , but to the Priests , &c. Loe , here was a withstanding the King . But I will not presse you for your Judgement : for I find in the next verse Gods own Judgement of the Case : for Vzziah with the Censer in his hand being incensed , even while he was wroth with the Priests the leprosie even rose up in his forehead before the Priests in the house of the Lord , from beside the Incense-Altar ; And Azariah the Chiefe Priest , and all the Priests looked upon him , and behold he was leprous in his forehead , and they thrust him out from thence ; yea he himselfe hasted also to goe out because the Lord had smitten him . And Vzziah the King was a Leper unto the day of his death , and dwelt in a severall house , being a Leper , for he was cut off from the house of the Lord , and Iotham the Kings son was over the Kings house judging the people of the Land . Now to apply this to the present purpose : You make your self as the High-Priest of the Church of England . Now suppose the King of England should doe that , whereby the foundations of Faith and good Manners were shaken : what would your Lordship doe ? I aske not what you would doe , in case you should be the Chiefe Agent and Instrument , a Counceller , a Promoter , and a Contriver of such a thing . For then it were a vaine Question . But suppose you had no hand nor head in it at all , and were a man zealous of Gods glory , and truly pious , and found in the faith , and one that knew well what the foundations of Faith and good Manners are , and when they are shaken , and one that respected more the Kings good and Honour , then your own private ends , and more Christs Kingdome , then any Hierarchy , or spirituall-Temporall Principality on Earth , and one that loved more to speake the Truth to Kings , though you were sure of displeasure , then to flatter and speake pleasing things to the ruine of the State and Kingdome , though for the present it pleased : suppose ( I say ) all this ( for even impossibilities may be supposed ) then tell me what your selfe ( a man of such high Place and Grace in Court , and of so great Power to perswade and disswade ) would doe , when you should see the Foundations of Faith and good Manners to be shaken by the King , or supreme Magistrate . For the very Name of shaking the Foundations of Faith and good Manners , is enough to shake a Mans heart , and cause him to abhorre the very thought of it , if he were not either altogether senselesse , and ignorant what the Foundations of Faith and Good Manners do meane : or knowing them , were not either an open ▪ or secret enemy unto them For what is such a shaking , but a m●king way for the sodaine precipitation of the state of all things into inevitable Destruction , a dissepating of all humane society , a mingling of heaven and earth together in one Chaos of all Confusion ? And therfore , now that we are upon a point of such Moment , as it were the Center , wheron the worlds Globe is pitched , or as the two * * 1 King . 7 . 21· Pillars in Solomons Temple , I●chin and Boas , stability and strength , Faith and good Manners being the stability and strength of all true Religion , of humane society , and Civil Politie : it wil be worth our Inquiry a little , what it is to shake these Foundations , or when these Foundations are shaken . And it is possible , that these Foundations may at this very time be shaken in the Church and state of England , and so threaten , if not hasten Ruine ; in somuch as a speedy remedy for prevention , upon the discovery , may be required . You will say , God forbid . What ? God forbid , that in such a Case a speedy remedy should be used ? No , not so , by your leave . Well , what say you then to your Articles of Religion , wherein the Doctrines of Faith of the Church of England , and those of them that are according to the expresse Scriptures , as Gods Grace in Election , Predestination , Salvation , &c. are shaken ? Are they not shaken , and that terribly too by an Edict , or Declaration , so as they doe at the least nutare , et huc illuc f●luctuare , so reele too and ●ro , like a drunken man , as no sober man knows to which side they will fall ? And are not those Doctrines of Gods free and saving Grace in Christ , the foundations of Faith , which are contained in those Articles ? Can you deny this ? Again , what say you to the Two Tables , wherein are contained the Ten Commandements of Gods Morall Law ? Are they not also Foundations ? Yea and Foundations both of Faith , and Good Manners ? For the Foure Commandements of the First Table concern Faith and Religion : the Six of the Second , Good Manners . So much all confesse , and your selfe too . And you say , * * pag. 205. ●● ▪ Emperours and Kings are Cussodes utriusque Tabulae : They to whom the Custody and preservation of both Tables of the Law , for worship to God , and duty to man , are commited . And That a Booke of the Law was by Gods own command in Moses his time , to be given to the King , Deut. 17.18 . So you . Is it so then ? What say you then to those two Great Commandements , the Last of the First Table , and the First of the Second ? Do they not stand closse together , as those two formentioned Pillars in Solomons Temple , Iachin , and Boaz ? Is not holy Obedience to God in his worship on his own day , as Iachin , the stability of the the Church and Temple of God ? And is not Civil subjection to superiours , as Boaz , the strength of the Common-wealth ? So as when these two Commandements are shaken , are not two maine Pillars and Foundations of Faith and good Manners shaken , and so the Foundations both of Church and Common-weal●h shaken ? What say you to this , ô Great High Priest ? Is it true , or no ? For I must now put you to it You give just occasion . But you answere nothing , si●ence in this Case is consent , and such as proceeds fr●m guilt of Conscience . And how ever , Res ipsa clamat , The thing it selfe proclaimes it , and cleare evidence proves it . For doth not the Edict for Sports ( so often upon fresh occasions mentioned ) declare as much . And doth it not shake the Fourth Commandement , for the sanctification of the Lords Day , the Lords Sabbath-Day ? Which Dispensation of such profane and madde sports , can it consist with sanctification , or any holinesse , or common sobriety of a Christian , or with Christian Profession , or with our Baptismall vow to the Contrary ? much lesse with the direct and expresse immediate solemn sanctification of that day , commanded in that Fourth Commandement ? Is not here then a Foundation of Religion , and so also of Good Manners too , shaken ? For what Good Manners doth our May-pole-dances , and Moris-dances teach us ? Nemo saltat sobrius , could the very * * Cicero . Heathen say , No man Danceth that is sober . And as an English ‡ ‡ Wits Common-wealth . Author saith , licenced too , but in diebus illis : A Dancer and a mad man different , but in the duration . And to helpe to shake this Foundation yet more , you have licenced ‡ ‡ Dr. White of the Sabbath . Dr. Primrose . Dr. Heylin . Dr. Pocklinglon . Books , that do unmoralize the Fourth Commandement ( as before ) as antiquated now , and of no force to bind us Christians to the observation of a seventh day , or the Lords day , which we have proved before to be the Rest-day , or the Sabbath day of the Lord our God , Iesus Christ . And did not your Tyranny suppresse all Truth , all your Doctors had been ere now answered to the shame of their Divinity-Profession , and the confusion of their accursed Opinions , and Blasphemies against the holy Truth , and eternall Law of God . Well , here you are charged with shaking this Great Foundation of Faith and Religion . And though my Name be not here to the Bill ( which therfore you wil be ready by another Bill to make a Libell ) yet ( as I sayd before , I say againe ) let the King be but pleased to send forth a Proclamation , commanding the Author of this Charge to come forth , and avouch it before the High and Honourable Court of Parliament , where he shall have a faire , just , unpartiall and honourable hearing , and where your Lordship shall as well stand at the Barre , as your Accuser : and you shall see your Antagonist dare shew his face . But to prevent the trouble of Calling a Parliament , you will answere , this is none of Your doing ▪ 't is the Kings Edict , and of King Iames before him , and now by the Kings speciall command republished ? Is it so ? And therein are the Foundations of Faith and Good Manners shaken ? And that not onely in overthrowing the Morality of the 4 th Comm●ndement by Dispensaton of profane sports , but by dispensing with youth to use their lib●rty on that day without controule of their Superiours ( as Parents or Masters ) who if they shall hinder them the Magistrate shall punish them , and so the 5 th Commandement , which is a Foundation of Good Manners in all obedience due to Superiours , is shaken , if not pull'd down to the ground , as the Aprentices of London were wont on Shrove-Tuesday to pull down Infamous houses ? Is all this so ? Why then did you not step in , as good Azariah , and withstand the coming forth of such an Edict , and tell the King , It pertaineth not to Thee , ô King , to set forth such an Edict , to dispense w●th Gods Holy , Morall , Eternall Commandements , whereby the Foundations of Faith and Good Manners are shaken , least thereby shaking the Foundations both of Church and Common-Wealth , you doe , through Gods just wrath , bring your own Kingdome to suddain ruine . But did you at all interpose your selfe ? Or did you use Prayer and Patience , rather undergoing the Kings displeasure , then being either Agent or Instrument in the publishing of such an Edict ? No such thing . For it was the handsel of your Primacy to publish the Edict , as being the best Office , whereby you could testifie your thankfullnesse for so high a Preferment ? For why should you here leave the King alone in so weighty a Cause , when you tell us * * Epist. Dedicatory . before , that the King and the Priest , more then any other are bound to looke to the Integrity of the Church in Doctrine and Manners , and that in the first place ? And would you now leave the King in the lurch , to doe that , whereby the Foundations of Faith , and Good Manners are shaken , and the Church in Doctrine and Manners corrupted ? But you were an Instrument at least , and that at both end● of the businesse . As for Prayer and Patience , you were willing to leave them to others , that had more need , and could make better use of them : to wit , those poore honest Ministers , who seeing the danger of their publicke reading of the said Booke in their severall Congregations , so straightly imposed by the Prelates , and th●in● the Kings Name , wherein they well understood , that the very Foundations of Faith and Good Manners are shaken , so as their reading of it to their people , would make themselves acces●ary to all the mischiefe that might come thereby , as whereby the wrath of God must needs be greatly incensed against the whole Land : did thereupon refuse to read it , committing the Cause to God in Prayer , and arming themselves with resolved Patience to indure all the Censure , and punishment threatned in the Booke , and left to be inflicted by the Bishops . As not long after the Bishops thunderclap of threatning , they feele the thunderbolt it selfe , by Suspension , Silencing , Excommunication , Dispossession out of their Benefices , Cures , Houses , Freeholds , Dispersion of Family Wife and Children , now exposed to the wide world , and made a Prey to Wolves and Lyons ‡ ‡ Rev. 13.10 ▪ Here is indeed the Patience and Faith of the Saints . Here is use of their spirituall Armour , Prayer , Patience , Teares , the onely weapons of their warfaire against such enemies ▪ so as if Solomon the Preacher were now alive , he might see his words as truly and fully verified in these times , as ever they were in his , * * Eccl. 4.1 . I returned ( saith he ) and considered all the Oppressions that are done under the Sun , and behold , the teares of such as were oppressed , and they had no Comforter ; and on the side of their Oppressors there was power ; but those had no Comforter . But it is well , that you left the poore soules those weapons , which you could not take from them , but with their lives , Prayer , and Patience . Although how doe you labour to deprive them even of Prayer , when you will not suffer them to pray together , that suffer together in and for the same Cause , but your Beagles hunt them out . And would you not reduce all Prayer , and conjure down the very Spirit of Prayer , by confining it to the prescript letter and form in your Service Book where there is never a Prayer for poore afflicted , and distressed , soules in such a Case , complaining of the Bishops Cruelty , and Tyranny over them .

So as you see , they patiently suffer , they use no opposition by force . And yet what say you to one of your ‡ ‡ S. Edmund . Elect of Cant. Predecessors , who , when the King would not agree to his Nobles in the casheering of his Favorites , who were his Privy Councellors to the ruine of his Realme ; he being then but Lord Elect of Canterbury , took with him his Clergy , and went to the King , and threatned him , if he would not yeeld in the matter , he would Excommunicate him . Neither ( I suppose ) are you of opinion with once a Brother of Winchester , who in a Book of his , published by Authority , and Printed at Oxford , hath these words : ‡ ‡ Dr Bilson of Christian subjections , and Antichristian Rebellion . Part 3. pag. 52● . Printed 1585. If a Prince should goe about to subject his Kingdome to a forraigne Realme , or change the forme of the Common-wealth , from Empery to Tyranny : or neglect the Laws establlished by common consent of Prince and People , to execute his own Pleasure : In these and other Cases , which might be named , If the Nobles and Commons joyne together to defend their ancient and accustomed Liberty , Regiment , and Laws , they may not well be countod Rebells . So he . But this by the way .

But I have somthing more to say about the shaking of the Foundations of Faith and Good Manners ; though I mentioned it before , but now upon this occasion . And that is concerning Ceremonies of humane ordinance in Gods worship , which being imposed upon mens Consciences , is not onely a shaking of the Foun●ation of Faith , but an overthrowing of it ; for thereby Christ is denyed to be the onely King of his Church . And therfore , as the Kings of Israel did nothing in reforming of Religion and the worship of God , but what was expresly commanded and prescribed in Gods Law : so Christian Kings and Magistrates ought not to doe any thing , no not to impose any one humane Ceremony or Ordinance in Gods service , besides that which is written in Gods word ▪ otherwise the Foundations of Faith is overthrown . Of such moment is the least Ceremony in Gods service , that it is of the substance and Foundation of Faith .

L. p. 210. But 't is time to return , For A.C. in this Passage hath been very carefull to tell us of a Parliament , and of living Magistrates , and Iudges , besides the Law books . Thirdly therfore , The Church of England ( * * The Prelate here blasphemeth Gods Name , as if a favourer of his Prelaticall practises . God be thanked ) shines happily under a Gratious Prince , and well understands , that a Parliament cannot be called at All times ; and that there are visible Iudges besides the Law-books , and one supreme ( long may he be , and be hap●y ) to settle all Temporall Differences ( which certainly he might much better perform ▪ if his Kingdome were well ridde of A. C. and his Fellows . ) And ‡ ‡

A blasphemous 〈◊〉 ●f Faith .

Prelates C●nons equaled with Scripture for governing th● Church ▪

she beleeves too , that our Saviour Christ hath left in his Church besides his Law-books , the Scripture , Visible Magistrates and Iudges , that is , Arch-bishops and Bishops under a Gratious King , to governe both for Truth and Peace , according to the Scripture , and her own Canons and Constitutions , as also those of the Catholicke Church , which Crosse not the Scripture , and the Iust Laws of the Realme . But she doth not beleeve there is any Necessity to have one Pope or Bishop over the whole Christian world , more then to have one Emperour over the whole world .

P. It were time indeed for you to return from your Course , when once there is mention of a Parliament For thriving , If you mean , that your Church of England hath of late dayes well thriven , in her prevailing for the seting up of Images and Altars , for bringing in more Superstitions into your Service ; for puting down sincerity , Purity , and power of the true Religion , and of the Preaching of Gods word ; for suppressing the Doctrines of Grace forementioned ; for hampering the Puritans ( as you call them ) by puting down , suspending , and silencing of Godly and painfull Preachers , and by crying down both the Doctrine and Practise of the sanctification of the Sabbath , or Lords day , and by smothering in the birth all sound and Orthodox Books against Popery , and other Heresies , not suffering them to be Printed , and by licencing of Popish Books to be Printed and Publ●shed , and the like : and if this be the way of the well thriving of your Church , whomsover you have cause to thanke , yet surely you have small cause to thanke God ( whose Name herein you doe abuse and blaspheme ; as perhaps your own Conscience may tell you ) as if he favoured such practises of yours , because for a time he patiently suffers and winks at them ; and that in judgement to a sinfull Land , and for tryall of his own servants and people , and for a preparative to your certaine ruine , if speedy repentance prevent it not . For God is not mocked with such thanks ( though he be mocked ) but * * Gal. 6.7 . whatsoever a man soweth , that shall he reape . How then doth it concerne all Christian Magistrates to look to it , least if they suffer Christs Kingdome to be betrayed into the hands of Antichristian Usurpers , by giving way unto them to doe what they list , while themselvs seem to sleep , they provoke God too much . For as Samuel sayd to the People , ‡ ‡ 1 Sam. 12.25 If ye doe wickedly , you shall perish , both you and your King . For my part , though I will not joyne in Prayer with such a Profane Hypocrite , as you are , and an enemy of Iesus Christ , and his Truth ( no more then the Apostle Iohn would be in the same Bath with that Heretick Cerinthus ) yet my dayly Prayer is , and shall be , that God would more and more let the King see , how miserably he is abused , and the Peace and safety of his Kingdome distracted , and indangered , both by the late violent practises which have been held in Church-affaires , and now by the publishing of such a Book as this , so notoriously perillous , or rather most pernicious , and so much the more in these times of troubles about Religion lately sprung up in the Iland of Great Britaine . Which Book , though it make many faire pretences for Peace , yea Peace and Truth : yet in truth it will prove the greatest troubler of Israel , and the falsest friend to true Truth , that the light hath seen these many yeares . This I speake not by conjecture , much lesse out of malice to the Authors Person , but from the cleare evidence of the word of Prophecy in Scripture , in such cases .

But how comes your Church of England to be so well seen in State-Mysteries ( I pray you ) as so well to understand , that a Parliament cannot be called at all times ? Or by the Church of England doe you not meane the the Chaire of Catnterbury , as the Church Collective , or representative of England ? For you should better understand such State-matters , especially , for the not calling of Parliaments at all times ( or suppose it were at Notime , or Nevermas , least perhaps it might prove as a Frost to nippe your thriving , and overforward spring ) then your Lordship ? For my part , I am no States-man , and so I leave State matters to States-men , who should best understand them . But if your A.C. and his Fellows be such troublesome fellows , why doe you trouble your selves with them , when a good honest Parliament might ease the King and Kingdome ●oo of that trouble , provided , that good Laws , already enacted , and by the next Parliament ( if ever there shal be any ) quickned by a new Law , to put them in better execution , there may be also a good season to bring forth such Visible Iudges , as without straining the strings either of their Purses , or Consciences , coming clearly to their Benches , and not making them as Banks , but siting Rectè in Curia , they may without feare of any Prepotent Prelate , or Partiality in respect of Persons do Justice .

I passe now from the understanding of your Church of England , to her Beliefe , which you also tell us of . She beleeves too . A blaspemous Article of faith . What doth she beleeve ? That our Saviour Christ hath left in his Church , besides his Law-books , the Scriptures , visible Magistrates and Iudges , that is , Arch-bishops and Bishops . How ? Is this come already to be an Article of the Faith of the Church of England , because her Great Metropolitan a little before beleeves it ? Or because Ipse dixit , he said , Christ thought it fitter to governe his Church by Divers Vice-roys , then by One ? Is there such an Infallibility in your bare word , as for the Church of England to establish her beliefe upon ? Certainly this is an Addition to the Articles of the Faith of the Church of England , which in her former dayes she was not acquainted with . Well , for your Arch-bishops , and Bishops we have said ( I hope ) enough ( and perhaps you will say too much ) and desire no more to be troubled with them . Yet I see we must , whether we will or no. For first , here againe you doe most impiously , ne dicam , impudenter , ye blasphemously bely the Lord Iesus Christ , as before you have done more then once or twice , and are not yet ashamed , but rather hardned in your Habit , as being reserved to be confounded . Secondly , as before you would make Christ to be the Author of such Governours and Vice-Roys , as Arch bishops and Bishops , so here , Prelates ●●sphemy . Besides his Law-Books , the Scripture , he hath ( you say ) made you visible Magistrates and Iudges . Surely , That is besides the Scripture indeed ; yea not onely praeter , but contra , not onely besides , but against the expresse Scripture ( as is but a little before proved , that Arch-bishops and Bishops ( though they have gotten a degenerate Beeing , as Mules , in Rerum natura , ) yet should have any Beeing at all in the Church of Christ : much lesse that they should be Iudges at all in spirituall matters , being themselves altogether carnall . And For Arch-Bishops it hath not so much as a Name in Scripture , as your Bishops have usurped that Title from Scripture : and you confesse the Apostles were all equall : in what night then grew up this Mushrum ? And we have before given a touch and tryall , what kind of Iudges you would prove , would men but pin their faith on your White sleeve . But except you can bring some better Authority , then your own blasphemous speech , that Christ hath left such visible iudges to his Church : your Church of England will have but a cold pull of it , when she shal be put to give a reason of this her beliefe , that Christ did so . Or what ? Or why ? For truth and peace . These words are with you as Mel in ore , verba lactis , honey in the mouth , words of milke : but we can discerne by them Fel in Corde , fraus in factis : Gall in the heart , and fraud in actions . But by what means will you procure us truth and peace ? By governing . How , or by what Law , or Rule ? According to the Scripture , say you . Stay there , and govern according to that , for that is the onely way ( were your Pr●laticall Government according to the Scripture ) both to procure and preserve truth and peace But unlesse you can prove ( which you never can ) by the Scripture , and not by your own single-soled bold affirmation , that Christ hath made you Governours of his Church , you shall never perswade us to beleeve , or hope , that you will ever Govern according to the Scriptures . But yet is this all ? Will you be such honest Governours , as you will not go beyond Christs Law-books , the Scriptures ? Nothing lesse . For there follows immediately a dangerous Conjunction Copulative , And. According to the Scriptures , And. And what ? I hope you have no other Law-books to adde to Christs Law-books . Have you ? Produce them . And her own Canons and Constitutions . Nay then Farewell Christs Law-Books . Christ may put up his * * Mat. 11.17 . Pipes ( as it is said ) When your Canons and Constitutions come in Place . And then farewell Truth and Peace ; your own Canons and Constitutions can make no Room for them . For he that shall hold the truth never so right and firm , and shall transgresse but one of your Canons , what peace ? He shal be put to read the Canon , that is , he shal be shattered to pieces with your shooting off of your Canon . And he that comes under the command of your Canon , is ipso facto brought under the Babylonian and Antichristian yoak , so as not onely his peace is destroyed , but the truth , power , and verture of Christs death , which hath freed his people from the bondage of all humane ordinance ( as hath been shewed ) in Gods worship and service , is overthrown . As also your selfe elswhere saith , ‡ ‡ Pag. 274. That Peace and Truth are rent by superstitious de●i●es ; from which ( I hope ) all your Canons and Constitutions are not altogether free . How much lesse can that Church be free from most miserable slavery , that puts her neck under the yoak , and her shoulders under the intollerable burthen of your Canons and Constitutions ? Nay , I will say more : If you be the visible Magistrates and Iudges of the Church , as the High Priests , and Pharisees were ( although the High-Priests office was groun●ed upon Divine Ordinance and Authority ) ▪ and had Christ himselfe to stand at your Barre to be judged : though you had not ( as the Jews said they ‡ ‡ I●h 19·7 . had ) a Law to put him to death , yet you would find Church-Canons and Constitutions enough , or some new devise , though not to condemn him to be Crucified , yet to Censure him to be Pillorified , and to have his Eares closse cropt , and his blood shed in a great measure , and stript naked , and perpetually Imprisoned and exiled , as being the Arch-enemy of your Hierarchy , Tyranny , Hypocrisie , and all Impiety . And all this you would do by vertue of your Canons and Constitutions , which yet were never ratified by any Law of the Land , or Act of Parliament .

But yet seeing you must have your Church-Canons and Constitutions besides Christs Law-Books to govern by : yet the Church of England may think her selfe well appayd , and in some tolerable ( though intollerable ) case , if she have but her own Canons , such as her selfe hath constituted and assented to . For volenti non fit injuria : If the Church of England be willing to be an Asse to her Prelates , as once she was to the Pope , she may . And so she hath her amends in her own hands . If the yoak of Canons pinch her , she may thank her selfe for putting her neck under . I but this is not all . There be other Canons besides , that are not hers , that she must be governed by . What , more Bonds and Fetters yet for thee , poore Church of England ? Yes . As well her own Canons , and Constitutions , as Those also of the Catholicke Church . What are those ? Alas , your Church of England is an Ignoramus in all such Canons , as you call Catholicke . And your Church Catholike you know , and tell us , doth Comprehend that of Rome , and Rome hath innumerable Canons , Cons●itutions , and Decretalls : so as under the Canons of the Catholicke Church , you may bring upon the Church of England all the Canons and Decrees of Trent , all the Popes Decretalls , and the whole body of the Popes Canon Law , so large a field is your Canons and Constitutions of the Catholicke Church . But you qualifie the matter in adding , Which crosse not the Scripture , and the just Laws of the Realme . That 's somthing . But who shal be Judge of that ? Alas , we are never the nearer , if you Prelates be the visible Iudges . For then what Canons or Constitutions shall crosse either Scripture ▪ or Positive Law of the Land , A 〈…〉 , if Prelates be Iudges ▪ which you shall define and determine to be fit for you to govern the Church by ? What Laws of the Realme shal be just , which crosse one of your Canons ? Did not in a Cause pleaded in your High-Commission , the Popes Canon aledged by the Advocate on the one party , preponderate a Statute of Edw. 6. alledged by the Advocate of the adverse party ▪ so as the Popes Canon carryed the Cause ? So as , while you will be the visible Iudges , you will lead us all in a Circle , and make us so turne round ▪ as we should not know where we are , imagining that all the world went upon wheels .

Yea but there is yet one qualification may help at a pinch . For you say , Archbishops and Bishops under a Gratious Keng to governe , &c. 'T is true indeed , that under the shadow of a Gracious King to you , you are imboldened to do all you do .

Lastly you say , the Church of England doth not beleeve there is any necessity to have one Pope , or one Bishop over the whole Christian world . And are there not trow you many thousands in the Church of England , which doe not beleeve there is any necess●y of having One Pope , or Arch-Prelate over the whole Church of England , the other world ; as before ? And I beleeve there is no more necessity of the one , then of the other , but that they might be well spared , as Christ will one day not spare them . And ( as I said before ) the Pope by as good a Title may argue a necessity of his being uneversall Bishop over the whole Christian world , as you can ( setting the Law of England aside ) for your being Pope over the whole Church of England . And that upon your own Ground : for you say , The Church of England and the Church of Rome is one and the same Church , no doubt of that ; and The Church of England may find her selfe , where Romes is now , just there : then if so , that both are one , and the Popes Principality more powerfull , then that of Canterbury : and if there be a nccessity , that Canterbury be over the whole Church of England ( which is but a part of the Catholicke ) and that for order and unity : why not the like necessity for the Pope to be supreme over all , for preserving order and unity , seeing your Militant Church is but one ▪ and to make many heads , many Vice-Roys , is to divide the body , and Kingdome , and so make rents in it , which you like not of . But to conclude , I beleeve , and with me all true Beleevers , who have their judgements rightly informed , wherever they be in any part of the world , that there is a necessity of duty lying upon all Christian Magistrates , to exterminate and exterpate the whole Hierarchy and Prelacy , A spirituall duty necessary to all Christian Magistrates . as Antichristian enemies of Iesus Christ , and of his Kingdome , yea and the band of Civil States and people , out of the world For so we read , Rev. 17.16 , 17. A place worthy to be written in the hearts of all Kings Christian. And it is the duty of all true Christians to rowse up the Spirit of prayer in them , and to stirre up the coals of zeale to flame forth in offring up of pure Incense of fervent Prayer , & especially in these times , wherin Satan so rageth , and his Instruments grow so malapert and mischievous , that God would hasten the accomplishment of Antichrists Kingdome , that so the Kingdome of Iesus Christ may be exalted and inlarged , and he alone rule and raigne in his Church .

L. p. 212. Somwhat may be done by the Bishop and Governours of the Church to preserve the unity and certainty of Faith , and to keep the Church from renting , or for uniting it , when it is rent . And this ( pag. 198 ) one Pope cannot doe .

P. Somwhat ? Why , you tell us immediately before , that the Pope , or a Bishop may perhaps despense in some cases , with the Decrees of a Generall . And this ( I hope ) is somwhat more , then somwhat . Or perhaps at least . And we have shewed before , how you Prelates , do either preserve the Church from renting , or when it is rent , make up the breaches of it , namely by an uniting and confederating against Christ and his true Church , and by labouring tooth and nayle to support and keep safe and sound your Antichristian Hierarchy , which is not truly and properly an unity , but a conspiracie against Christ , from whose true Mysticall body you have made the Great and unreconciliable Rent . And therfore you to preserve the unity and certainty of Faith intire , which , even as you are Prelates , you are altogether Apostates from , and enemies unto ? Or is the spirit of Infallibility , intayld to the Prelates Chaire ? For doth not this necessarily imply either an Infallibility , or at least a greater dexterity , and a more excellent and Divine spirit to be in Prelates , qua Praelati , & Infulati , as they are Mitred Bishops , then in all those , that are no Prelates , when onely by Prelates , though but somwhat , to this purpose , may be done ? But we have shewed before what ability or soundnesse of judgement in divine & spiritual matters we may expect to be in Prelates , in comparison of others , who are both learned , pious , & judicious Divines .

L. p. 194. To draw all together , to settle Controversies in the Church , there is a visible Iudge and Infallible , but not living , and that is the Scripture , pronouncing by the Church : and there is a visible and living Iudge , and that is a Generall Councel .

P. Here I goe backe a little to fetch in this passage , as fi● here to usher in a many other Passages scattered here and there in your Book , which is hard to reduce to any order or forme . But we must do as we may . And I shall not wittingly offer violence to any part in the least , though somtimes here and there I am faine to pull them in by the head and shoulders . And here , you doe with the * * As Hes●us , Pignius e● alis . Papists make the Scripture to be but a dead letter ; for say you it is not a living Iudge : no nor yet a speaking Iudge ; but as it is pronounced by the Church . Wheras the Apostle saith of it Zon●o lógos tou Theou . The word of God is living or lively ▪ nor onely so , but e'nergès , effectuall ; as it is before noted And if you will apply this to the Word preached , that 's true too . Although you will not confesse preaching of Gods word to be the Scripture , or yet the word of God . But it must be pronounced by the Church , as the onely mouth of Scripture , and that must be also in the Churches sense . Of which sufficiently before . Yet this you adde to all your other indignities you put upon the Scripture , that you make it a dead Iudge , and so indeed no Iudge at all , as before you plainly tell For if it be blind , as wanting light ; and if it be mute or dumb , and needs the Churches mouth ; and if it be dead , as being not living : Certainly it can be no fit Iudge at all ; except ye will admit of a Judge , that is both blind , and dumb , and dead . As three Romans being sent in Ambassage , one a Foole , an other a Coward , the third having the Gout , Cato told the Senate , they had sent an Ambassage , that had neither Head , Heart , nor Feet . And such a Judge would you make the Scripture . But 't is visible you say . So are your dumb , dead , and blind Images in your Churches they are visible , and very conspicuous , when the Scripture oftentimes can neither be seen nor heard . Now to your Generall Councels .

L. p. 192. And surely what greater or surer Iudgement can we have , where sense of Scripture is doubted , then a Generall Councel , I do not see . And pag. 211. The making of Canons , which must bind all particular Christians , and Churches , cannot be concluded , and established , but there ( to wit , in a Generall Councel . ) P. 224. I said , The Determination of a Generall Councel erring , was to stand in force , and to have externall obedience yeelded to it , till evidence of Scripture ▪ or a Demonstration to the Contrary , made the errour appeare ; and untill thereupon another Councel of equall Authority did reverse it . And pag. 226. Now suppose a Generall Councel actually erring in some point of Divine Truth , I hope it will not follow , that this Errour must be so grosse as that forthwith it must be known to private men . And doubtlesse , till they know it , obedience must be yeelded ▪ Nay when they know ( if the Errour be not manifestly against fundamentall verity , in which case a Generall Councel cannot easily erre ) I would have A. C. and all wise men consider , whether externall obedience be not even then to be yeelded . And p 227 ▪ Therfore it may seem very fit and necessary , for the peace of Christendome , that a Generall Councel thus erring , should stand in force , till evidence of Scripture , or a Demonstration make the errour to appeare , as that another Councel of equall Authority reverse it . And ibid. No way must lye open to private men to refuse obedience , till the Councel he heard and weighed . And p. 261. A Councel hath power to order , settle , and define Differences arisen concerning Faith . This power the Councel hath not by an immediate Institution from Christ , but it was prudently taken up in the Church , from the Apostles example , Act 15. And ibid. If the Councel be lawfully Called , and proceed orderly , and conclude according to the Rule , the Scripture , then the D●finitions therof are binding : but not from calling another Councel to reverse or abrogate the former Asts upon just cause . P. 346. 'T is true , that a Generall Councel de pace facto , after 't is ended , and admitted by the whole Church ▪ is then Infallible , for it cannot erre in that , which it hath already clearly and truely determined without Errour . After 't is confirmed , 't is admitted by the whole Church , then being found true it is also Infallible , that is , it dece●ves no man . And p. 347. For a man upon the pride of his own Iudgement to refuse externall obedience to the Councel , was never lawfull , nor can error stand with any Government . P. 357.358 . Christ did just intend to leave an Infallible certainty in his Church , to satisfie either Contentious , or Curious , or presumptuous spirits . And therfore in things not fundamentall , nor necessary , 't is no matter if Councels erre in one , and another , and a third , the whole Church having power and meanes enough to see ▪ that no Councel erre in necessary things , &c. If it erre in things necessary , we can be Infallibly assured by the Scripture , the Creed , the 4. first Councels , and the whole Church , where it erres in one , and not in another . And pag. 360 For one Faith necessary to Salvation , a most infallible certainty we have already in the Scripture , the Creeds , and the 4. first Generall Councels , to which for things necessary and fundamentall in the Faith , we need no assistance from other Generall Councels . P. 378. I submit my Iudgement with all humility to the Scripture , interpreted by the Primitive Church , and upon new and necessary doubts , to the judgement of a lawfull and free General● Councel . And , I absolutely make a lawfull and free Generall Councel Iudge of Controversies , by and according to the Scripture . And p. 386. I have expresly declared , that the Scripture ▪ interpreted by the Primitive Church , and a lawfull and free Generall Councel , determining according to these , is judge of Controversies .

P. Thus in your Commending of Generall Councels , you are very large , that I may not say lavish too . And surely in one respect especially you have great Reason : for your Generall Councels must consist of Prelates onely : so as in exalting Generall Councels , you magnifie your Prelacie . But I remember a saying of Basill , that in his Observation ▪ he never knew any good to come of Generall Councels of Bishops , who when they met in Councel , were more zealous and eagre for their own particular Honours and Dignities , then of the Church of God . And as Bernard saith Totus fervet Ecclesiasti●us zelus sola pro Dignitate tuend● : All the zeale of Church-men is inf●amed altogether for the advancing and upholding of their Dignity . But let us now take a briefe view of your words , which we will collect and reduce to certain summary Heads . First , That Generall Councels are the supreme Iudge of the sense of Scripture , when and where 't is doubted , p. 192. Secondly , that the Canons and Decrees of Generall Councels bind all Christians of necessity , p. 211. Thirdly , yea though Generall Councels determine Errors , yet that requires at least externall obedience . Fourthly , That Generall Councels erring in some points of Divine Truth , yet you hope it will not be so grosse , as to come to the common view : or if it doe , yet obedience must be yeelded , p. 226. onely except the Error be not manifestly against the fundamentall Verities . Fifthly , That a Generall Councel hath no power from Christ to be Iudge in Controversies , but the Church prudently tooke it up from the Apostles example , Act. 15. Sixtly , That the Difinitions of Generall Councels bind , being according to the Rule the Scripture : yet that those may be reversed by an after-Councel . Seventhy , A Generall Councel in things clearely and truly determined , cannot erre , but in that is infallible . Eightly , That it is pride not to obey the Councels , Difinitions , yea unlawfull , and not standing with any Government . Ninthly , That Christ intended to leave an Infallible certainty in his Church , but not to satisfie contentions , or curious , or presumptuous spirits . Tenthly , That it is no matter if Generall Councels erre in one , two , three &c. things not fundamentall , nor necessary . Eleventhly , That for necessary Faith to Salvation , we have an Infallible certainty in the Scriptures , Creeds , and 4. first Generall Councels , to which for things necessary we need not the Assistance of any other Generall Councel . Twelfthly , That the Scripture interpreted by the Primitive Church and Generall Councels , is the Iudge of Controversies , whereunto you professe to submit in all humility . Thus these 12 Conclusions be as the 12 Articles of your Faith .

But now let 's a little examine what Truth or Force there is in all these . I confesse some of them are somwhat coincident , and like Brookes fall one into another , but all have their Confluence into your Generall Councel , as one maine Ocean . But we will take a say of each , as they run along .

For the first , and so the rest , which have any generall concurrence with it , I deny , that a Generall Councel is a sufficient , and competent Iudge of Controversies in matters of Faith . My Reasons are these . First , Because Generall Councels consisting of Prelates , and more especially in these latter times , are so much the unabler to judge of the sense of Scripture , where 't is deep , or doubtfull . As Nicolaus de Clemangus in his Tract De Concilus Generalibus , discourseth very largely and pregnantly of this very Circumstance , shewing , that Prelates are none of those , to whom God doth reveale the mysteries of his will in his Word , which are altogether spirituall , but Prelates are carnall , proud , ambitious , covetous , minding the things of the world . His whole Discourse is worth the Reading . And * * See Aeneas Sylvi●s of the Councel of Bas●● , who was after Pope Pius 2. See also Book of Martyrs . Arelatensis Arch-Bishop of Arles in France , in the Councel of Basil , said that they had no zeale , nor love , nor knowledge of the Truth , but every one would be of his Kings Religion , and was ready to say as his King would have him ; and that the poore Priests were those , by whom the Truth was upholden . And ( not to goe farre from home ) If a Generall Councel were assembl●d of such Prelates as you are , who have no savour of , and lesse favour to the Truth , having bewrayd in this your Book ( besides your usuall practises ) how contrary your spirit is to Christs spirit and wisdome : Certainly ( asmuch as in you were ) you would bring utter confusion upon the world , in seting up and establishing your Babilonish Faith and Religion . And I have noted before , how the poore in spirit , such as feare the Lord , are those ‡ ‡ Mat. 24.28 . Eagles Christ speaks of , whose eyes are sharpest to pierce into the Mysteries of the Scriptures , as having Gods holy Spirit to guide them into all Truth . Heare what the wiseman saith , ‡ ‡ Pro. 28.11 . The rich man is wise in his own conceit : but the poore that hath understanding searcheth him out . I leave it to your Application . And Christ § § Luk. 10.21 . rejoycing in Spirit , saith , I thanke thee ô Father , Lord of heaven and earth , that thou hast hid these things from the wise and prudent , and hast revealed them unto babes : even so Father ; for it seemed good in thy sight . Againe , Prelates , especially such as your selfe , are taken up with State-matters , and all of them generally with their worldly affaires , and great Revenues , so as they have little leasure so much as to thinke of Divine matters , or to care for the state of mens soules , or to seek to advance Christs Kingdome , as being † † Ephes. 2.12 ▪ a'pellotriomenoi tes politeías tou Israèl ( as the Apostle speakes ) Aliens from the Common-wealth of Israel . Yea even those , that have good learning and judgement in Divinity , which they had before they were Prelates , after they come once to be Prelates , they are so choked with the world , and so over-awed with the servile feare of man , that they dare doe nothing for the Truth , especially in a time wherein it is openly opposed and oppressed , but are willing to sleep in a whole skin , and to let Religion and Faith sinke , or swimme , so they may injoy their Lordships , and fill their Coffers . Againe , suppose a Generall Councel of Prelates were called ( for the purpose ) to judge and determine of the Controvesie about the Calling of Prelates , whether it be Iure divino , by Divine Authority , or no ( as it was in Question and agitation in the Councel of Trent ) would not such a Councel trow you be Partiall in their own Cause , and Define with one voyce , That Prelates are an Order , and of a Calling Jure divino , and that Christ thought it fittest to governe his Church by such visible Iudges and Vice-roys . Or , if the Controversie were , whether the Church alwayes collective in the Prelates , have power to ordaine Ceremonies in Gods service , to the Obedience and conformity whereof all mens Consciences are bound ; by which Imposition Gods people come to loose that liberty , which Christ hath purchased for them , and Christ should lose his Royall soveraignty as King in his Church ( as before is shewed ) it is not easie to Divine , what the Difinition of such a Councel would be ? Or is there any Question to be made , but that without any more adoe , they would Order , Determine , Define , and Conclude , that Prelates the Church Collective , have power to ordaine what Ceremonies they please in the worship and service of God , which shall bind all mens Consciences , to the necessary obedience , and observation therof ? Would they herein have any respect to Christian liberty , or Christs Prerogative ? Would they not with the Scribes , and Pharisees and High Priests in their Councel , condemn Christ , for his Title of King of the Iews .

And because you are so much for a Generall Councel , as Iudge in Controversies , What say you to the first Generall Councel of Nice , wherein there were above 300 Prelates ( as I remember ) Had they not all consented to the making of a Decree for the establishing of a * * 1 Tim. 4.1 . Doctrine of Devils , to wit , forbidding Marriage to all Ecclesiasticall Persons , had not one man Paphnutius , and he an unmarried man too , stood up , and withstood such a Decree , shewing by many Reasons and Arguments from Scripture and otherwise , how wicked and cruel such a Decree were . So early began the Mystery of Iniquity to bud forth , and that in the most Ancients , and in the very Prime or first Generall Councel , wherein these Fathers , the Prelates were so piously zealous ( though ignorantly ) to lay the foundation of a generall Aposticie from the Faith , in establishing such a Doctrine of Devils , as the Apostle calls it ; of which suffciently before . Yet by your Doctrine , If that Generall Councel of so many Prelates had determined it , and ratified it by Decree , all Priests then were bound to obedience , untill another Generall Councell , equall to that , should reverse it ; which should have been long enough , when every Age grew successively worse then other . And thus in the very first , and best Generall Councel ( after the Apostles ) a Doctrine of Devils should have been ratified , and therein an Apostacie from the Faith , and all men must have yeelded obedience , at least externall ( enough to keep all your Priests from Marriage ) and so all Prelates and Priests should so quickly have proved a Generation of Apostates from the Faith .

Againe , if you have a Generall Councel , you must not ( according to the Councel of Frier Franciscus à S. Clara ) admit of any Puritans , or the precise Party of the Reformed Churches beyond the Seas , no not such as you call Puritan Bishops . For you see what one wise and honest man did in preventing so wicked a Decree of a whole Generall Councell of many Prelates . And assure your selfe , were there but a few sound Puritans admitted to your Generall Councel , and might have free liberty to speake , you would not be able to resist the evidence of Truth , which they should bring in , as Arelatensis told the Prelates in the Councel of Basil , concerning the poore inferiour Priests . But if you shall exclude the Puritans ▪ and so all Reformed Non Prelaticall Churches , out of your Prelaticall Councel Generall , how should it be a Generall Councel ? But I cry you mercy , Puritan Reformed Churches are already by you doomed for no members of your Catholicke Church , whereof and wherein yours and Romes Church are one and the same , and therfore as Heathen , they ought to be shut out for Wranglers , as they were from the Councel of Trent .

Another Reason against a Generall Councel , being Iudge in Controversies is , because all sound and Orthodox Divines , both Ancient and Moderne , both Forraigne and Domesticke in the Church of England formerly , with all the Orthodox Fathers in this point , have held , professed , and beleeved , That the holy Scripture is the sole sufficient Iudge in all Controversies of Faith . And for proofe hereof , What say you to Dr Whitakers Lectures against Bellarmine and Stapleton in this Point ? Or how do or can you answere any of his Arguments drawn from cleare Scriptures , and Testimonies from the Ancient Fathers . But it seems you have not been acquainted with him , as not once mentioning him in all this . For that were besides your Purpose . But you will except against him , as a Puritan , which is a sufficient confutation with one puffe of your mouth . And so you doe all honest , sound , learned , Religious , Orthodox Divines whatsoever , whom particularly to alledge here , would but make your stomacke rise , and so I passe on to the rest .

Secondly and Thirdly , and againe , and againe , I deny , that the Decrees of Generall Councels , 2.3 . bind any true Christians Faith and Conscience , so much as to outward obedience to any one Ceremony ; as before . Yea though your Councel Decree according to the Scripture , yet jure proprio , and absolutely of its own Authority it binds not the Conscience . That 's proper and peculiar to the Scripture alone immediatly , the onely binding Rule of Faith and Conscience . How much lesse doth a Councel bind in a matter of error in a point of Faith ? This is such an abominable point of Divinity , as never any Arch-Prelate of Canterbury since the Reformation and ( I presume ) before , ever uttered . Divinity , say I , yea Divinity Diabolicall , and monstrous Impiety , and Antichristian Tyranny , to be hissed out by all that beare but the bare name of Christians . And this Answereth also to the Fourth , 4. which is as full of ridiculous absurdity , as of impious folly . You hope ( forsooth ) that a Councels errors will not be so great as all men shall discerne them . That may well be , when many thousands take no notice at all of any such Councel Decrees . And how many men have not the eyes to discern even the grossest errors ? How many in the Church of England doe discerne the grossenes and danger of your seting up of your Altars in all the Churches of England , as namely , that it is a denying of Christ the onely Altar , And the bringing in of the Popish Priesthood , and sacrifice ? But what if you could in a Provinciall Councel of Canterbury make a Decree for seting up , and worshiping of Altars , as you doe , and that all men did see the grossnes of it ? Would the sight of it exempt them from at least externall obedience , being once defined in that your Synod ? And so of a Generall Councel , for universall obedience . No , the knowledge of the grossnes of the error will not serve their turnes , to excuse them from obedience . For you tell us , We must notwithstanding yeild obedience . If so , surely it were the safest way then for men to close their eyes , that they may not see at all , and so yeeld blind obedience to your Decrees , pinning their soules ( as I said ) to the Prelates Innocent white sleeve , to be led blindfold to hell , then seeing and knowing , to sin against their Conscience , in yeelding obedience . But how ever , seeing , or not seeing , hang , or be damned , the Decree of a Generall Councel , even in point of error in the Truth , yea though men know it to be against Gods word , must be universally obeyed , till evidence of Scripture or a Demonstration to the contrary made the error appeare , and untill thereupon another Generall Councel equall to that , did reverse it . Which may be long enough , before all these things concurre . What ? Must the Decree of the seventh Generall Councel , the second of Nice , for the worship of Images bind all men to Obedience , till another Generall Councell equall to that , upon Demonstration to the contrary , shall reverse it ? Or must the Decree of the Councel of Lateran under Pope Innocent 3. for Transubstantiation , be beleeved and obeyed by all men , at least in externall obedience , to worship the Altar and Hoast till another Councell equall unto that shall reverse it ? Or must the Decree of the Generall Councel of Constance ▪ for the taking away of the Cup in the Sacrament from the People , bind all to obedience , till another Councel equall unto that shall reverse it ? Or lastly , shall the Decrees of the Councel of Trent ( which calls it selfe a Generall Councel ) ratifying the worship of Images , Transubstantiation , and the taking away of the Cup , wi●ing the Peoples nose of it , besides all those other damnable and damning errors against the cleare Truth and Faith of Christ , bind all to obedience till another Councell equall to that shall reverse it ? Then certainly all Papists , by your sentence , are bound to be damned . Nay , are not you and your Church of England bound to obey all those Decrees of Former Generall Councels , as that of the second of Nice , for worship of Images , not yet reversed by a Generall Councel equall to that , though by a Councel at Frankford called by Carolus Magnus , Emperour of the West , that wicked Decree was condemned . But the Decrees of this Councel are smothered , and kept in hugger mugger , as being outfaced by such a prevailing generallity of unblishing Images , and so have lost their place among the Records of the Councels . And besides , that Councel at Frankford was not for generallty equall to that of Nice under that wicked Empresse Irene . Which being so , and so , that Decree of Nice not yet reversed , why ( say I ) doe not you obserue your own Rule in obeying that Decree , in worshiping of Images ? Or why at least ( though you here write somthing against them to some small purpose , as coming neare to Idolatry ) doe you not yeeld externall obedience , in doing corporall Reverence to those Images you have set up , onely reserving your internall worship , and keeping your Faith to your selfe ? But to satisfie us for that , you have over or upon your Altar in your own Chappel at Lambeth sufficient Images and Crucifixes , which , when you doe honour and homage to your Altar , can●ot but participate of it . And againe the Councel of Constance being a Generall Councel , and the Decree therof for the Cup being not yet reversed by another Councel equall to that : And seeing your Church of England is one and the same with the Catholick Church when it was represented in that Councel : why doe you not presse your Doctrine unto Practise in your Church of England , telling them that they are all bound to the obedience of that Decree of the Councel of Constance , for the taking away of the Cup in the Sacrament , at least they are bound to externall obedience , not to drinke of that Cup till another Councel equall to that , shall reverse that Decree , which hath not yet been ; but on the contrary the Generall Councel of Basill since that hath ratified that Decree of Constance , notwithstanding all the Bohemians supplications and demonstrations to the contrary ? But you will say , you have here in your Book made a demonstration both against worship of Images , and the taking away of the Cup. But this will not free you from externall obedience to the Decrees of the said Councels , till another Councel thereupon equall to those shall reverse them . Therefore by your own Doctrine you have put upon your selfe and Church a necessity of externall obedience to the said Decrees , from which because you cannot otherwise be exempted , how doth it concerne you , and your Church of England too ( if indeed you desire to be freed from the obedience of those Decrees ) to use all meanes for the expediting , and speedy calling of a Generall Councel , to reverse the said Decrees ? And so much the rather now , when you have made such Demonstrations against those said Decrees , as being against Truth , which therfore you cannot obey , without offering manifest violence to your Conscience . And if your Protestants of the Church of England shall aledge , that these Errours , Heresies , Idolatries , Sacriledges , have been cryed down by one unanimous voyce of all Protestants , and in particuler , by the established Doctrines of the Church of England , yet your Doctrine tells them still , that being never yet reversed by a Generall Councel equall to those wherein they were Decreed ; and seeing that the Reformed Churches beyond the Seas are no true Churches , for fault of Prelates ; And the Doctrines of the Church of England are declared to be doubtfull : therfore your Doctrine stands in force still , that externall obedience at least must be yeelded of all . Otherwise , it cannot stand with any Government , as you tell us here . But how stands it with Faith , with Conscience , with Scripture , with the Apostle , that a man is bound knowingly to obey an Errour in the Faith ? For the Apostle saith , * * Rom. 14.23 . whatsoever is not of Faith is sinne , that is , whatsoever a man doth against his Conscience , is sinne . So as you hereby teach men directly to sinne against their Consciences , and all to uphold the Credit of your Prelaticall Government and Decrees . Thus the Church of England may see what an Oracle she hath got in the Chaire of Canterbury .

To the Fift , A Generall Councell hath not power from Christ immediately to be Iudge in Controversies . Imediately ? No nor mediately neither , nor any way at all . For it is denyed , that your Generall Councel of Prelates are lawfull , seeing all the members of the Councel are neither visible Iudges , nor Vice-Roys , appointed and allowed by Christ to Governe his Church , as hath been proved ▪ Now if all the members of your General● Councel be of no Authority Divine , then neither your Generall Councel it selfe , with all the Decrees of it . For there is ●he same reason of the whole , and of all the Parts . Christ then will not have his truth to receive Testimony , much lesse subject his word to the Judgement of those , who are usurping Tyrants , and enemies of his word , and especially since Antichrist hath prevailed , * * Mat. 3.12 . Christ would not receive testimony from the Devils that they knew him . No more doth he allow ‡ ‡ 2 Cor. 11.13 any of Sathans Ministers , false Apostles , to be Iudges in Controversies of Faith . And you confesse , A Generall Councel hath no power from Christ Immediately ( at least ) to be Iudge in Controversies .

Whence then hath your Generall Councels this power ? Th● Church ( say you ) prudently tooke it up from the example of the Apostles , Acts 15. Prudently tooke it up ? Nay surely rather , you craftily stole it . You took it up where it was not layd down , for you to take up , and so to abuse . But you have Prudently , that is Politickly and presumptuously taken up , that is , usurped that power which was never given you , nor yet by any Apostolicke Legacy left unto you , seeing you are neither their h●ires , nor successors , nor Executors , nor Administrators , nor Assignes of the Apostles , but ( in one word for all ) meere Usurpers . Yea though by the Name of Church we should understand ( which you doe not ) the true Church of Christ successively after the Apostles in all Ages ; yet she hath learned another gates Prudence , then to take up such an example from the Apostles , as is neither warrantable for her to doe , nor imitable ▪ For the Apostles , a● they had their Immediate Calling from Christ , so by him they were immediately inspired with the Holy Ghost , so as then judgement in all matters of Faith was infallible . But the succeeding beleevers had not the like fullnesse and abundant measure of the Spirit , as to make them competent and sufficient Judges in matters of Faith , on whose judgement men might infallibly rest their faith , and settle their Conscience . Yea it pleased the wisdome of Christ to give that fullnes of his Spirit to his Apostles , that being thereby led into all Truth , they might , not onely preach that truth to that present age , wherein they lived , but also leave the same truth written to all succeeding Ages of the Church of Christ , to be guided and directed by that Truth in the Scripture , as the sole competent , and every way sufficient and compleat Iudge in all controversies and matters of faith whatsoever . Againe , that particular Example of the Apostles ( Acts 15. ) was an A per se. It was a particular Act proper onely to that present occasion , and not to be stretched to aftertimes , when the Church should be settled . For that very determination of the Apostles , was but proskairos , for that very season , to compose some Differences arising between the Iews and Gentiles , newly converted to Christianity . And the Apostle Iames layes this for the ground of the Determination or Decree ; * * Acts. 15.20.21 . Moses ( saith he ) of old time hath in every City those that preach him , being read in the Synagogues every Sabbath day . Here is the occasion of this Assembly , the mixture of the Iews living amongst the Gentiles . And though the Gentiles converted were free from Jewish ordinances , yet the Iews being offended at it , and not yet strong enough in the faith , and pressing the Gentile Christians with Circumcision ; hereupon the Assembly met , and by the speciall and immediate assistance and guidance of the Spirit of God , determined what was fittest to be done for the present necessity . And the determination was , that those Christian Gentiles should abstaine from Blood , and strangled , and Idoll-offerings , and Fornications . And this Decree lasted no longer , then the present occasion required . Though to abstaine from Idoll-offering and from Fornication ( so frequent among the Gentiles ) is perpetuall , according to Gods Morall Law : but abstinence from Blood , and strangled was a Ceremoniall Law ▪ and so was not to outlast that time , of the Iews tendernesse . For otherwise all the Leviticall Ceremonies were abrogated in Christs death . And yet for that time and occasion , these abstinences were called Necessary things , that is , onely in regard of the occasion ; though to abstanain from Idoll offerings , and from Fornication we are for ever and to all necessary . But now this example ought not to be drawn into a Rule , no not to the true Church of God , and to the Ministers of his word , or to any humane power , to impose what Ceremonies they please upon the Consciences of Gods people . This did not the Apostles . What they did here , was by the Holy Ghosts direction , and for the occasion aforesaid . And such an evidence can no Generall Councell of Prelates shew us .

And in a word , you that have so prudently taken up that Power for Generall Councels to be Iudges in Controversies of Faith from the example of that Councel of the Apostles , Acts 15. doe you truly conforme to the pattern of that Assembly ? You must understand that that Assembly , or Councel consisted not of the Apostles alone , but also of the * * Act. 15.6 . Elders , the Presbyters ; nor onely so , but also of the ‡ ‡ ve . 22 , 23 ▪ 25. Brethren , the beleevers , who were also members of that Assembly , and who with the Apostles and Elders are mentioned in the Epistle , as whose joynt Assent was to the Decree . Here was then a Compleat Pattern of a Generall Councel , when the Ministers and Brethren , the people are the joynt body of the Councel . For otherwise , how is it a Generall Councel , if it consist of the Ministers alone ? So as that 's a true difinition of a Generall Conucel , which consists Generally of the Ministers and People together . But you have prudently left out of your Generall Councels , not onely the People of God , but also his true Ministers , the Presbyters ; these you shut out , not onely from your Councel , but also from your Catholicke Church , as not members of it ; as they are not indeed . So as your Generall Synod or Councel , may truly be called ( how prudently soever you have taken it up ) as that second Councel of Ephesus was , lustrikè ▪ a stollen Councel . Thus though you Prelates would be thought to be the Apostles successors , and propose their example here , yet in nothing do you follow them , no not in that , which you say you have here prudently taken up from their example : But your prudence is no other ▪ but to make the Apostles states for your tyranny while you Challenge the office of being the sole Iudges in Controversies of Faith ▪ and of the Scriptures too , which not even the Apostles themselves did ever take upon them , though they had the Spirit of Christ , which you have not .

To the Sixth , it is answered in the former . For Difinitions of your Generall Councels , though they be for the matter according to Scripture , yet doe they not bind , as the Councels Difinitions ▪ Gods word in and of it selfe onely bindeth , as is said before . Nor doe your Generall Councels bind , for the manner and forme , which is ever false , seeing they are not such Councels , as the Scripture alloweth And againe , neither doe they bind , because they are alwayes fallible , because never Infallible ( by your own confession ) and they are often erronious , as you also confesse . And therfore as when false , they bind not , so neither when true , are men bound to beleeve them , as he that is accustomed to lye , is ever suspected , although he somtimes tell truth .

For the Seventh , it is as ridiculous , as some of its fellows ▪ For you say , That in things truly determined by the Councel , being done , In that , it cannot erre . Which being understood in the most perfect sense of the words , is as if a man should say , He that tells the truth , being told , therein he cannot lye . But yet things may be said to be truly determined , which yet being so determined , may be said to be erronious . For a thing may be said to be truly Determined , quoad externam formam & modum determinandi ; when the externall forme and manner of the Determination is observed : And yet quoad materiam ipsam determinata ▪ in regard of the matte● and thing it selfe determined , it may be false and erronious . As those * * 1 King . 22. 400. Prophets in the case of Ahab , did truly consent with one unanimous voyce ; but yet it was a lye , which they truly consented in . So a thiefe may be said to be a true man , in respect of the substance of a man , or truly to live , because he liveth , yet he is a thiefe , and lives a lewd life . So your Generall Councel may observe all its accustomed forms and manners of Determining matters by voyces , and the like , yea and also may do it according to the letter of Scripture , as they take , and interpret it , and yet the thing so determined may be erronious ; because they mistook and misinterpreted the Scripture . So as neither in this speech of yours is there a truth . Or doe you meane , being rightly after your manner done , hath it some vertue ex opere operato , not to erre ? Or do you mean , That so being once done , for the manner , it must not for the matter be questioned , but then , right or wrong , must be obeyed as truth ? And againe , your expression is very improper , to say , of a thing already done , and past , It cannot erre . Non posse , or possibility is properly of a thing not yet done , So as you should have said , A Generall Councel in the things so and so done , hath not erred , nor cannot erre . But who shall reduce your words to reason , or free them from being ridiculous ? For , Perlectum admissi , risum ●eneatis amici ? Can any refrain laughter that reads your words ? Or from saying , They are as a fooles coat made up of sundry pieces and sundry colours For thus they are framed ; 1. 'T is true , that a Generall Councel de post facto , after 't is edded , and admitted by the whole Church , is then Infallible . 2. The reason , For , it cannot erre in that ▪ which it hath clearly and truly determined without errour . 3. After 't is confirmed , 't is admitted by the whole Church . 4. Then being found true , it is also Infallible ▪ that is , it deceives no man . Is not here Mira verborum complexio , as the Orator saith , A ridiculous babling ? Or as the Poet saith , is not this Humano Capiti Cervicem sungere equinam ? to paint a mans head standing upon a Horses neck ? Would ever any man have spoken thus , that had not first bid adieu ●o common Sense , Reason , Judgement ? And if the Reader require a larger Commentary , let him but read the words over againe .

To the Eighth I answere , It is not in it selfe pride , not to obey Councels , Difinitions ; and much lesse , when a man knows them to be erronious . Nor is it against any Iust and Godly Government ▪ but onely against that which is Papall , Antichristian , Tyrannicall . And is it not high and Antichristian pride , to impose Difinitions of Generall Councels of Prelates , yea even when they are erronious , and known apparently to be so , yet to be as Gods own holy Commandements necessarily obeyed of all ? This is the highest and most Diabolicall Tyranny in the world , thus to bring into bondage the faith , soule and conscience of men to a necessary subjection to errour and falshood . Yea , thus not to obey , you call it also unlawfull . Unlawfull ? By what Law ? Or what Law either of God , or of any lawfull Authority of Man , or of Civil state , is here broken ? Are mens lufts a Law ? Or are your Prelaticall Councels any true Generall Councels ? Generall they may be , in respect of Prelates , but Generall they are not in respect of the true Catholicke Church of Christ , the Body whereof is not represented in your Generall Councels : as is shewed before . No nor is your Generall Councel Generall , in respect of the Catholicke Church , whereof you call your selfe the representative body . For the lay-people are not admitted into your Councel , nor any to represent them : therfore it is not Generall : therfore not to obey the difinitions of it , is it unlawfull ? And suppose the Councel were lawfull , are the Decrees therof to be obeyed , when erronious .

To the Ninth : That Christ intended not to leave an Infallible certainty in his Church , to satisfie either contentious , or curious , or presumptuous spirits . Here is one thing expressed , and another implyed : the thing expressed is negative , Christ intended not , &c. the thing implyed is affirmative : That Christ intended to leave an Infallible certainty in his Church . And sutable hereunto are your precedent words ; There is , there can be no necessity of an infallible certainty in the whole Catholicke Church , and much lesse in a Generall Councel , of things not absolutely necessary in themselves , Which words imply this Affirmative , That there is a necessity of an infallible certainty in the whole Catholicke Church of things absolutely necessary in themselves So as here also , it is all one , as if you had said thus : Christ intended to leave an infallible certainty in hi● Church , but not to satisfie either contentious , or curious , or presumptuous spirits . Oney you doe still in such things of this na●ure , prudently avoyd the plainer and least deceitfull way of expressing your selfe ▪ Now what Christ intended , he certainly performs and makes good . But to that your Imaginary Catholicke Church Prelaticall , I deny , that Christ ever intended to leave an infallible certainty . For to such he never made any such promise . And therfore you cannot say , and say truly , That Christ intended that . For you are no part of his true Church , as having no calling from Christ , as before is proved . And you your selfe confesse in many places of your Booke , that the Authority of your Church is not Divinely infallible : And for instance , you make your present Church Authority , in inducing beliefe of Scripture to be Gods word , to have a prim● place in things absolutely necessary in themselves ; and yet you confesse , that this Authority is not Divine and infallible . So here is a Contradiction , which I leave with you to reconcile . Againe , you tell us before , that our Saviour Christ hath left in his Church besides his Law-books , the Scripture , visible Iudges , to wit , Arch-Bishops and Bishops . And of such are made your Generall Councels , Ergo , of necessity Christ must intend to leave unto you an Infallible Certainty in judging Controversies of Faith . For the Scripture you deny to be a compleat and sufficient Iudge in doubtfull cases ; and that in such cases the visible Iudges , the Prelates in a Generall Councel are to determine . Now if you have not certain infallibility of Judgement , in what case is the Church ? Then it may be said , as * * Bellarmine . Bellarmine and other Jesui●es say , Christ hath provided very ill for his Church , if he had not left a visible Iudge , and withall a certaine infallibility unto him , to determine controversies of Faith . This he speakes of the Pope ; and upon the very same ground , that you doe for all Prelates in a Generall Councel . And the ground is , that you and they both deny the Scripture to be sole Iudge in Controversies of Faith . Well then , what say you ? Doe you confesse this , that you have this Infallible certainty ? If you say you have it not ( as you do ) and yet you will be the true Church of Christ , then you bely Christ , both here , saying He intended to leave it : and before , in saying , He hath left you to be visible Iudges : For had he intended to leave such an Infallibility certain to such a Church , as you speake of , and to leave such to be visible Iudges , as are Archbishops and Bishops : then certainly he would have given you such an Infallible certainty , as wherby you should have been qualified and furnished , to be sufficient and competent Iudges , whose Judgement should be such in matters of Faith , as men might secretly and safely rely , and rest their Faith upon . For otherwise if you have not this Infallibility , but that somtimes at least , and that in weighty Controversies you might erre in Judgement , then men should have no more ground whereon to settle their Faith , then the Dove in the Deluge had to set her foot upon , you have so covered the Scripture as with a Deluge of Criminations , as to be no sufficient Judge in Controversies of Faith . And you confesse ( ibid ) That a Generall Councel ( which is an Universall Assembly of Prelates , and Grand Bench of visible Iudges ) is not of infallible credit , but that they may erre , yea and possibly manifestly too against fundamentall verity , as pag. 226. So as if the Scripture be , though Infal●ible , yet not living , but a dead Iudge , that cannot speake , or pronounce the sentence : And if the Prelates , the visible living Iudges , have not infallible certainty , nor a Generall Councel infallible credit in their Decrees ; you leave the Church in a most perplexed case . Whither shall she goe in all her doubts ? To what Judge or Oracle for resolution ? To the Scriptures ? That 's dead , and cannot say , Mum· To a Generall Councel of Prelates ? That 's of no certain credit ; their Judgement is not infallible ; yea not in fundamentall Truths . Alas , poore Church , what wilt thou doe ? What wilt thou doe ? Why , surely , beleeve none of all these false Prophets , no not all of them together , when assembled in a Generall Councel , for they may and will miserably deceive and seduce you , if you trust to their Judgement . Whither then ? To the Scripture . But it is dead , say they . They are false Prophets , and blind guides : beleeve them not : follow them not . * * Io● 5.39 . Search the Scriptures , as Christ bids you . ‡ ‡ Esa. 8.20 . To the Law , and to the Testimony , if they speake not according to this word ; it is because there is no light in them . Art thou not Christs Spouse ? Then heare Christs voyce , the Scripture . Say with the Spouse in the Canticles : ‡ ‡ Cant. 1.7 . Tell me , O thou whom my soule loveth , where thou feedest , where thou causest thy flocks to rest at noone : For why should I be as one that turneth aside by the flocks of thy companions ? To whom Christ , her beloved Spouse , answereth , § § vers. 8. If thou know not , O thou fairest among women , goe thy way to the footsteps of the Flocke , and feed thy Kiddes besides the shepheards Tents . Here the true Church , Christs Spouse , in her perplexities , and doubts , wherein she is like to loose her selfe , goes to Christ , to her shepheard , and asks of him , where he feedeth , where he causeth his Flocks to rest at † † Psal. 91.1 . Mat. 6.21 . Noon , where his Congregations may find a shady layre , rest , and refreshing from the meridian heat of Persecutions ; or her Faith find rest in doubtfull cases of Faith , or Conscience . For why ( saies she ) should I be as one , that turneth aside by the flocks of thy companions ? Why should I be uncertain and unsettled in depending upon the guidan●● and conduct of false shepheards , such as pretend to be as thy fellow-shepheards , that sit as God in the Temple of God , shewing themselves to be God , equall to thee in power and Regall Authority over thy Kingdome and Church , making what Laws they please , in binding our Consciences and that even to their erronious Decrees ? To whom Christ Answereth , If thou know not ( O thou fairest among women , although despised by men ) goe thy way forth by the footsteps of the Flocke , to the green * * Psal 23.1 , 2. Pastures , and the waters of comfort ; the Scriptures where my flocke doth ordinarily find pasture . ( ‡ ‡ Mat. 4.4 . For man liveth not by bread onely , but by every word that proceedeth out of the mouth of God ) there thou shalt find the true Pasture , by the footsteps of the flocke , by the continuall treading of my sheep , which know no other pasture but this ; For here my sheep heare my voyce , even here by the shepheards Tents my Ministers whom I have set over the flocks , ‡ ‡ Ier. 3.15 . to feed them with understanding and knowledge ; § § Isay. 55.1 , 2 , 3. Here , be those waters for every one that thirsteth , here is the milke and wine that 's to be had without money : Hearken diligently unto me ; incline thine Eare , and come unto me , and thy soule shall live : search the Scriptures for in them is eternall life , and they are they that testifie of me . These are the onely † † Psal. 119. - light which I have left to be a lampe for thy feet , and a light for thy steps . These are the onely * * Lógiatheo● . 1 Pet. 4.11 . Oracles of God , which shall clearly resolve thee in all thy perplexed doubts : These are my onely faithfull witnesses , which I have left to witnesse the truth , and to establish thy heart in the faith , in me , ‡̶ ‡̶ 2 Tim. 6.3 . if any man teach otherwise , and consenteth not to the wholsome words of Scripture , which are mine * * Heb. 4.12 . own l●vely voyce , and which containe all things pertaining to faith and godlinesse , he is puft up and knoweth nothing , he is a false Prophet , a false shepheard , a blind Guide , a seducer , an Antichrist . Thus Christ speaketh to his Spouse in the Scripture , his owne voyce , the onely true , living and infallible Iudge ▪ And to this Judge , Christs voyce in the Scripture , the true Spouse of Christ in all Ages hath still resorted , and therein been resolved in her doubts , and comforted in her distresse . For ‡ ‡ Mat ▪ 11.19 . here is that wisdome which is justified of all her Children . And ‡ ‡ Rom. 15.4 . whatsoever is therein written is written for our learning , that we through patience , and comfort of the Scriptures might have hope . Nothing can comfort us in our calamities , nothing can confirm and establish our faith and hope in all our perplexed doubtings , but this . Before we shewed , how all the Fathers with one voyce took this sanctuary , came to this Iudge , made this the onely Rule , to determine all doubts and disputes by : so Augustine , so Tertullian : so the incertain Author upon Mat. 24. in Chrysostome saith , that in the times of Antichrist ( even in these our Times ) one cannot know the true Church but by the Scripture , because Antichrist with his wicked Clergy , make such a faire shew and pretence , that they are the Catholicke Church , just as your Lordship doth . Therfore let all true Christians in these perillous times of Antichrist , and Antichristian Prelates ( which cry down the Scriptures as an insufficient Iudge in Controversies of faith , and cry up their own usurped Authority as the supreme Iudge of the Scripture , at least in all doubtfull cases , though they confesse their Judgement not to be of Infallible Credit ) fly to the * * Mat. 24. Mountaines , and to the ‡ ‡ Ad Fontes the common voyce of the Primitive Fathers . Fountaines , the Scriptures , the lively voyce of Christ , they , they onely will resolve us , and settle our faith in all doubts and difficulties , and will discover unto us the true Church of Christ , from all false , pretended , counterfeit , Antichristian , Prelaticall , Hierarchicall Churches and Synagogues .

Now seeing , though you arrogate , but are not able to prove , that Christ hath left your Catholicke Church an Infallible certainty , which yet you confesse to be uncertaine : give us leave ( though we touched this before ) now againe upon a fresh occasion to vindicate the Truth of Christ , that he not onely intended , but indeed hath left unto his true Church an infallible certainty of his Spirit , which by the rule of his word doth guide his Elect into all truth in all ages successively unto the end of the world . When he took his long Farewell of his Apostles and Disciples as concerning his bodily presence with them upon earth : he left them this Promise yet to comfort them concerning his perpetuall spirituall presence with them , saying , ‡ ‡ Mat. 28.20 . Lo I am with you alwayes unto the end of the world , To the end of the world , Ergo with all those that are his true Disciples unto the end of the world . So as wheresoever Christs Churches and Congregations be , there his Spirt is . This § § Ioh. 16.13 . Spirit leads his into all Truth , into all necessary and saving Truth infallibly , and most certainly . This is that † † 1 Ioh. 2 . 2● . Anoynting of which before . He that hath not this Spirit of ‡̶ ‡̶ Rom. 8.9 . Christ , this Spirit of truth , is none of his . And he that hath it , is preserved from the seducements of false Prophets , which come in Christs Name , and shall deceive many , but not the Elect ; for that 's not possible . Every true beleever cannot , will not willingly erre in any point of faith , and truth necessary to Salvation . I say , not wittingly . For many of Gods deare Children doe that ignorantly , whereby Christ is denyed , as in yeelding obedience to mans devices in Gods worship , and that through custome , wheras if they were rowsed , and put to it , and asked if they beleeved not that Christ is the onely King of his Church , and Lord over the Conscience ; oh , they beleeve and acknowledge none other King . Aske them againe , whether they beleeve that any man may exercise this Authority over them ; oh , they renounce all such lords . Aske them againe , why they subject their Consciences , soules and bodies to the will and lust of man in will-worship , forbidden by the Apostle : ô , they answere , they never knew that before : and now that they know it , they repent of it , and from henceforth they renounce it , and resolve to loose rather life and all , then they will doe so any longer . Thus even a good Christian , through ignorance may for a time in a dangerous errour ; but so soon as he is convinced of it , he will not for all the world continue in it . So he that hath true saving faith in Christ , resting on Christs merits alone for his justification , he neither will nor can be brought to beleeve , that he must be justified by his works . For this is against the very nature of saving faith , which rests onely on Christ , renouncing all other respects . So that 't is impossible , that any true member of Christ , should by any errour be so seduced , as to be seperated from Christ , for he is * * 1 Pet. 1.5 . preserved by the spirit of Grace , by the power of God through faith unto salvation . So that , as the whole body of the Church of Christ , so every particular member of this body , hath the certaine and infallible seale of the Spirit of Truth given him of Christ , according to his promise , purpose , and intention , for all truth absolutely necessary to salvation , having both his Spirit and word to guide them into all truth .

Finally , 't is very true ( being taken in a true sence ) that Christ never intended to leave an infallible certainty in his Church , to satisfie either contentious , or curious , or presumptuous spirits . And if not presumptuous spirits , certainly not such spirits , as usurpe a Prelaticall and Lordly Authority , and to sit as visible Iudges of Scripture in Generall Councels ▪ imposing upon all men a servile yoake of obedience to their Decrees , whether right or wrong , true or false . Nay to such presumptuous spirits God hath given eyes not to see , and hath made their hearts fat , not to understand the truth , not to see the light , that shineth in his word , and therfore they say it is darke , and speake disgracefully of it . So as the presumptuous is properly yours . As for the contentious , and curious , these are they that contend for the truth against your undermining and oppugning of it , and are curious ●o search and sound the bottome of that Mystery of Iniquity , which is cunningly , yet grosly enough folded up in the voluminous leaves of this your Booke . So as for these so contentious and curious , Christ did intend to leave an Infallible certainty in his Church to satisfie them , and to assure them of the Truth , so as not all the opposition and contradiction in the world can beate them from it .

To the Tenth , you make no matter of it , if Generall C●uncels erre , in one , or a second , or a third ; so it be not in things necessary . In other cases it makes no matter , if they erre . And what matter is it then , if there be none of your Generall Councel at all . For you confesse that they may possibly ( though not easily ) erre in things necessary , and in fundamentall points of Faith ; Pag. 226. and yet obedience must be given . If then it be no matter if in other things they erre , on●e , twice , thrice , yea or if you will in a hundred things : take all these together , and the world should be free from many dangers , if it were rid of Generall Councels altogether . But in the meane time , you make no matter of it , if in so erring , they load the world with an intollerable burthen of errours , which all men must bow their necks under , till another Generall Councel doe free them : and perhaps in stead of freeing them , may lay as much more load upon them . Truly , my Lord , if you had not a liberty to talk with your pen what you please , and a strong opinion also , that whatsoever you write or speake , must needs be of every body highly applauded , as if all you write were Oracles : you would never have suffered such foule blots to have dropped from your pen. But 't is no matter . If you erre in this , and that , and another , &c. aswell as your Generall Councels ; so as we knowing them may not in obeying , or assenting erre with you .

To the Eleventh you say , for necessary faith to salvation , we have the Scriptures , Creeds , 4 first Generall Councels . So then , being furnisht of necessaries , what need we any more ? I think the Apostles rule for temporall things , may hold well in spirituall , he saith , * * 1 Tim. 6.8 . having food and rayment , let us therewith be content : So Having all things necessary for faith to salvation , let us use these well and b● content , not affecting to be loaden with a multitudo of humane devises , which Prelaticall Councels , Courts , and Canons put upon us . And are Generall Councels so Cheape , as that you should keep such a doe , having no Necessaries to trouble them withall But it seems you have some other necessaries , besides those of faith , that will require a Generall Councel . For you tell us ( pag 211. ) The setling of the Divisions of Christendome ( as the reconciling of England with Rome ) the making of Canons , which must bind a●l particular Christians and Churches , cannot be concluded 〈…〉 , but there , to wit , in a Generall Councel . Why but there ? For the Church of England you may doe what you please ; onely you desire perhaps a Generall Councel , to conclude for Altars , and other utensils , and so ease your shoulders of the envy , and crime of Innovation , but for that also you have a sufficient put off , as is shewed before . But the reconciliation and setling of the Divisions of Christendome will conclude all . But still the Scripture with you , is not alone sufficient for necessary faith to salvation , without the Creed , and ( at least ) the 4 first Generall Councels : Why , was the Scripture , before there were any either Creeds , or Councels ? And was not the Scripture then alone sufficient for all things necessary to salvation ? The Creeds and Councels are not to be added to the Scripture , as if without them it were not an absolute and compleat Rule . As for the Creeds , they were for the summe and substance of them extracted from Scripture , and must still be reduced to Scripture for their true sense and interpretation , as before . And for the Decrees of the 4 Generall Councels , we approve of them , no further , then the Scripture warrants them . And therfore though

Twelfthly , you humbly submit to the Scripture , as it is interpreted by the Primitive Church and Generall Councels , and not els : yet we submit our faith onely to the Scripture , as it is interpreted by it selfe , and by the spirit of Christ speaking and breathing in it , which by the Scripture interprets the Scripture unto us ; as Augustine doth well observe in his Second Book de Doctrina Christiana . And herein you shew your faith not to be Divine , but humane , as which you submit not meerly to the Scripture , but unto the Iudgment of men , as they shall interpret the same unto you . And so I leave you to your faith , wherein you declare your selfe to be quite from the true Catholicke Church of Christ , whose Faith is built upon the onely foundation of the Apostles and Prophets , Iesus Christ being the Chiefe corner stone , without any depending upon humane testimony and Authority . And so here an end of your Generall Councels .

But yet one thing remains unresolved on your part , for you have told us that Generall Councels may erre even in fundamentall truths : but whether at any time they doe actually so erre , you resolve us not . Nay in some places you make it so ambiguous , whether they can erre , or no , that we know not what to make of it , fish or flesh . For ( pag. 223. ) you propound the Question , saying , whether a Generall Councel may erre , or not , is a Question of great consequence in the Church of Christ . To say it cannot erre , leaves the Church not onely without remedy against an errour once determined , but also without sense that it may need a remedy , and so without care to seeke it , which is the mystery of the Church of Rome at this day . To say it * * See a little before fol. ●● Bellarmine . can erre , seems to expose the members of the Church to an uncertainty , and wavering in the Faith , to make unquiet spirits not onely to disrespect former Councels of the Church , but also to slight and contemn whatsoever it may now determine , into which errour some opposes of the Church of Rome have fallen . Thus you . Now this Question of so great consequence , and that in utramque partem , on both sides , pro & con : you seem in your last words here to resolve and determine , as if to say it can erre , were an errour , into which some opposers of the Church of Rome have fallen . Now the Church of Rome hath had many opposes , many Protestant , Learned and Judicicious Divines of former times in the Church of England , who have clearly proved , that Generall Councels can erre : as we have shewed before . Now then do you prove they erred in so saying ? Or ( which is all one ) how do you prove , that a Generall Councel cannot erre ? For if it be an errour , to hold they can erre ; 't is no errour in you , to hold they cannot erre . Thus I find you fast upon the hooks , get off , and quit your selfe as well as you can . But pag. 239 you distinguish ; which in summe is , That all those Popish Authors alledged by Bellarmine for Generall Councels not erring , either speake of the Church ( including the Apostles ) as all of them doe : and then all grant the voyce of the Church is Gods voyce , and infallible ; Or also they are Generall , unlimited , and appliable to private Assemblies , as well as Generall Councels , which none grant to be infallible , but some madde Enthusiasts . Or else they are limited , not simply into all truth , but all necessary to salvation . In which I shall easily grant a Generall Councel cannot erre , suffering it selfe to be led by this spirit of Truth in the Scripture , and not taking upon it to load both the Scripture and the spirit , Thus there . Now here I would aske the most perspications and Judicious Reader , that reads these lines , and ponders them well'-what certain conclusions or resolutions he can picke , or deduce out of your words , either for Infallibility , or not . First : That all grant , The voyce of the Church is Gods voyce , divine and infallible , if you speake of the Church including the Apostels . Whence your conclusion should be this : That Generall Councels , being the Church representative , are infallible , their voyce is Gods voyce , divine and infallible , understanding the Church , whereof they are the Representative ▪ to include the Apostels . Ergo by vertue of the Apostles understood to be included in the Church , wherof Gen. Councels are the Representative , their voyce is Gods voyce , divine and infallible , and so can not erre in any age unto the end of the world , still understanding that in the name of the Church the Apostles are included ; can any rationable man , or reasonable creature make hereof any other conclusion ? Secondly , In all truth necessary to salvation , you easily grant a Generall Councel cannot erre , suffering it selfe to be led by the spirit of Truth in the Scripture . This is just as Arminius said in answere to that place in * * 1 Io● . 3.9 . Arminius Examen . Iohn , for the certaine Perseverance of Gods Saints : Whosoever is borne of God , doth not commit sinne ; for his seed remaineth in him ; and he cannot sinne , because he is borne of God . Now how doth that Heretick avoyd so cleare a Testimony and evidence ? That is , saith he , so long as the seed of God remaineth in him ; but it may depart . But the Apostle gives this as a reason , why the Saints cannot fall away , Because seed of God abideth in them , being Regenerate . Ergo it ever abideth in them : and therfore they cannot fall away . And as he , so you here ; A Generall Councel is infallible , while it suffers it selfe to be led by the spirit of Truth in the Scripture . As if you said , A Generall Councel , while it doth not erre , it doth not erre , but in that i● infalliblepunc ; as you told us before : But what if a Generall Councel doe not suffer it selfe to be led by the spirit of Truth in the Scripture ? That is , what if a Generall Councel have not this spirit of Truth in it , to keep it , that it suffer it selfe to be led by the spirit of Truth in the Scripture ? What is your Resolution here ? you leave us still upon uncertainties concerning Generall Councels infallibility . And you seem to grant , that a Generall Councel may take upon it to lead both the Scripture and the spirit . O miserable perplexities of a man , whose spirit itcheth to speak somthing which he dare not . But tell us ingeniously and plainly ( if there be any ingenuity in you ) Hath a Generall Councel this spirit of Truth in the Scripture alwaies , to make it Infallible in all necessary Truths , or not ? That 's the point . But this you doe not , dare not grant . Yet thus much you are bold to say , ‡ ‡ Pag. 230. That the Assistance of the Holy Ghost is without Errour . That 's no Question ; and ‡ ‡ A comparison fa●se and bl●sphemous . as little there is , that a Councel hath it . How ? Is there as little Question to be made , that a Councel of Prelates hath the Assistance of the Holy Ghost , as , That the Assistance of the Holy Ghost is without errour ? No more Question ? I Question , whether a Generall Councel have the Assistance of the Holy Ghost ; will you therfore as well question , whether the Assistance of the Holy Ghost is without errour ? Nay I am so farre from making question , that I am confident , and that upon cleare evidence , that your Generall Councels of later times especially under Antichrist , neither have had , ●or have beene capable of the Assistance of the Holy Ghost to preserve them from errour . For they have been still assembled against Christ , and his Truth , and the true Church and Children of God , and either for the decreeing of wicked errours in in Faith , or confirming of them , and establishing of the throne of the Beast , and power of Antichrists Kingdome against Iesus Christ . Nor were it a hard matter to demonstrate this by many instanecs , which for the present I omit . In the meane time , How prove you here your , As little Question ? Or how come you to name This spirit of Truth in the Scripture ? What , after all that you have said before of the Scripture , that it is not bright enough , that it hath no light , till it be lighted by the Authority of the present Church , and the like ; come you now to confesse , that The spirit of Truth is in the Scripture ? Told you us not a while agoe , That the Scripture is no living Iudge ? What , not living , when the spirit of Truth breaths in it ? Is not the spirit in the Scripture , living ? And is not a Iudge a living Iudge , when , and while his spirit is in him ? What , nothing but absurd and sencelesse contradictions with you ? Nothing but Babilonish language ? But thus we may see into what gulfes of perplexities they plunge themselves , that presume and undertake to exalt their high imaginations against the Truth of God . And you say againe , * * Ibid. A Generall Councel hath not this Assistance ( to Infallibility ) but as it keeps to the whole Church and Spouse of Christ , whose it is to heare his word , and determine by it . As it keeps closse ? Why ? is it not your Catholicke Churches Representative ? How can it then , but keep closse , being of the same Body , and spirit , with your Church ? Secondly , speaking here of the whole Church , the Spouse of Christ , you doe equivocate , applying that to a false Church , which is univocè , univocally proper and peculiar to the misticall body of Christ . For your whole is Prela●icall , that of the Hierarchy , and none other , which we have before proved , to be the Synagogue of Antichrist , which heareth not Christs voyce , but as your Church is pleased to interpret it , and to give it Authority . And that which you say of your Generall Counc●ls , may be truly said of any particular Assembly , two , or three , met in Christs name , which doth not erre , being led by the spirit of Truth , in the Scripture , Christ himselfe ( according to his Promise ) being in the midst of them . No nor yet any particular single Beleever erreth , being so led , So as you speake to no purpose , when you say , A Generall Councel cannot erre , in that wherin it hath already determined according to the Scripture ; the vanity wherof we shewed before . But the conclusion is , you still leave the the Infallibility of your Generall Councel unresolved , upon yea and nay , sometimes affirming , somtimes denying ; except your negative be according to that Rule in Logicke , That one Negative is of more Force , then a thousand Affirmatives .

L. p. 213. Sect. 27. My Answere was , That the Councel of Trent was not onely not legall in the necessary conditions to be observed in a Generall Councel , but also that it was no Generall Councel .

P. Though this be true , you say , yet the Councel of Trent was so legall , according to Romes own Law , that it wanted no conditions observable , to make it in that behalfe , not onely a legall , but a Generall Councel too . And secondly , so Generall for the Romane Catholicke Church of Rome , that all the Decrees thereof doe bind all Papists to a necessary obedience , and conformity unto them , and that under Anathema . And your Rule is , That a Generall Councells Decrees and Canons bind all Christians : and a Provinciall Councels Decrees bind all of that Province . And therfore I hope you will grant , that the Papall Councel of Trent is of force to bind all Papists , who acknowledge and accept the Pope for their Head , or Primate . So as though it were not a Generall Councel in the largest sense , yet it was a Generall Councel for the Roman Catholicke Church , which ( say they ) is the onely Catholicke Church . And with which ( say you ) the Church of England is one and the same . Now this I doe here touch by the way , as whereof I shall have occasion to make some use anon , though perhaps your thus Arguing against the generallity of Trents Councels , is one of those Passages , which you think may be an ingredience of the salve of your Reputation . But this ( I say ) by the way .

L. p. 227. It may seem very fit and necessary for the Peace of Christendome , that a Generall Councel thus Erring should stand in force , till evidence of Scripture , or , &c.

P. This passage I cited before upon occasion , among sundry other of like nature ; and now I repeat it onely for this , to shew how your zeale for Peace made you forget Truth . For still you are telling us of Peace and Truth , or , Truth and Peace . But here your Peace stands single , without Truth . What Peace , without Truth ? For you say , It may seem very fit and necessary for the Peace of Christendome that a Generall Councell erring should stand in force . What , will you force a Peace against Truth , by an Authorised errour ? O blush for shame .

L. p. 254. Suppose they Key of Doctine be to let in Truth , and shut out errour , and suppose the Key , rightly used , infallible in this : yet this infallibility is prime●y in the Church , in whose person ( not strictly in his own ) S. Peter received the Keys .

P. Suppose ? Do you make it but a supposit on that the key of Doctrine , is to let in Truth , and shut out Errour ? So it seems with you , when you use that Key of your Doctrine to shut out Truth , and let in errour ; as both , your Practises , and writings do shew . But what is this Key of Doctrine ? Is it not the sincere Preaching of Gods word ? And then this Key is rightly used , and here is the use therof Infallible But ( say you ) this Infallibility is primely in the Church . How ? Can we get no other language from you ? Still , all Primely in the Church ? Certainly not at all in your Antichristian Church , where the spirit of errour raigneth , and where the whole bunch of Keys hangeth at the Prelates g●r●le . As Pope Paschall 2. when he rode in Pompe , had his seven Keys hanging at his girdle , the Chiefe wherof was to open and shut Paradise to whom he pleased . But we say still ▪ that this infallibility is primely in the Scripture , and not in the Church , not in Christs own Church . For the Scripture containes that infallible Truth , which the Ministeriall key , Christs own ordinance and voyce openeth to the Church , or Congregation of Gods people . And this Ministeriall key Christ committed to Peter , not simply as sustaining the person of the whole Church , but chiefly and properly as he was an Apostle and Minister of Christ to preach the Gospel ; in which respect also he might represent the person of all faithfull Ministers of the G●spel rightly and truly called to the Function , to whom Christ did in Peter , as afterward he did * * I●hn 2● . in all the Apostles , commit and entrust the key of knowledge of the Doctrine of Christ , to be used and imployed to that end ▪ to the end of the world . Whereas by saying , Peter represented the Person of the Church , you must meane , that the Church is wholly contained in the Ministers ; For you usually call your Clergy the Church , as if you had no Church but that ; whereas the Congregation or society of all the Faithfull is the Church of God , as is shewed before . So as in no respect did Peter receive the Keys in the person of your Priest and Prelaticall Church .

L. p 258. Where 't is said , That Christ makes to himselfe a Church without spot or wrinckle , Eph. 5. That is not underst●●d of the Church Militant , but of the Church Tryumphant . And to maintain the contrary is a brand of the spreading Heresie of Pelagianisme .

P. That speech of the Apostle includes as well the tru● Church Militant , as the Tryumphant ▪ both which containe , and consist of all the El●ct onely . And these Elect , that in the Church Militant live by Faith , though they have * * Rom. 7.20 . enoikou●an kì ‡ ‡ Heb. 12.1 . euperístton a●mratían , as the Apostle saith , sinne dwelling in them , and easily besetting them , yet they are in Gods sight , through Faith in Christs blood , that ‡ ‡ Zach. 13.1 . fountaine set open for Israel , washed from all the spot● of sinne , being in Christs § § 1 Cor. 1.30 . imputed Righteousnesse and holynesse presented , and accepted in Gods sight , as most pure , without spot or wrinkle . As the the Apostle Iohn saith , † † 1 Ioh. 1 7. The blood of Christ cleanseth us from all sinne . And Christ saith to his Spouse his Church Militant , ‡̶ ‡̶ Cant. 4.7 . Thou art all faire , my Love , there is no spot in thee . Concerning that place , which you cite out of Augustine , where he saith , The whole Church prayeth , forgive us our debts . 'T is true , speaking there of the visible Church , quae in toto terrarum orbe clamat ad deum , which over all the earth crys to God . And if he meane it of the Elect onely , which are the onely true Spouse of Christ in all the world , their praying , forgive us our debts , hinders not , nor interrupteth their perpetuall purity in Gods sight notwithstanding . For we may be , and are , through faith in Christ , accepted for pure in Gods eyes , when in our own eyes , through sin , and manifold corruptions still dwelling , but not raigning in us , we are impure . And therfore we pray , forgive us our debts , because we have dayly failings and infirmities , whereof our Consciences accuse us , and the confession of them with deprecation is a meanes to have that stain , and guilt , cleaving to our Conscience and corrupt nature wiped off , Faith still renewing the application of Christs merits as a Balme to heale our wounds , and to assure us that our sinnes are blotted out in his blood . For as Iohn saith , 1 Io● . 1.9 . If we confesse our sinnes , he is faithfull and just to forgive us our sinnes , and to cleanse us from all unrighteousnes . Now as for the Pelagians , One of their errours was , in Arrogating purity to their own sect , and that they had no Originall sinne , but that they were Justi by a selfe-Righteousnesse , calling those of their own sect Justi , Righteous , as Augustine tells us . But where you name the spreading Heresie of the Pelagians : I know none to whom that is more beholden then to him , ( your selfe I meane ) who hath given it a footing and rooting too in the Articles of the Doctrines of the Church of England , and under whom it hath shot forth its branches both in height and breadth , that it dare both overtop , and overdrop the Truth without controule .

But I had almost forgot one thing , and that is this : you allow not Purity in your Church Militant in this life . If therfore there be not a full purgation of the Church and her Children here in this world , where will you have her purged ? Purged she must be , and that thorowly , that she be without spot or wrinkle , before she come into heaven . For in thither no unclean thing ent●eth . Me thinks then I smell here the smoke of some Purgatory fire , after this life , which must purge away all the reliques of sins spots . And upon this very ground , that you goe on , it is , that the Papists have very prudently , as in a case of necessity , devised their Purgatory to cleanse all after this life , seeing here ( they say ) there is no Perfection of Purity . But perhaps you thought not of this consequence , when you writ those words , That the Church Militant is not without spot or wrinkle . But so , how will you avoyd the consequence of Purgatory . So as while you pretend to avoyd the Pelagian Rocke , you fall into the Roman fiery ▪ Phlegetom , or Purgatory-Gulfe . According to the old Proverbe , Incidit in Scyllam dum vu●t vitare Char●●●in . But you seem afterwards , not to allow of Purgatory , telling some stories of it , but bringing not one Argument from Scripture against it , as , That the blood of Christ doth cleanse a true beleever from all sinne in this life , and the like . But hereof in its place . Againe , In saying , That Christ doth not make the Church Militant in this life , to be without spot or wrinkle ; you doe 〈◊〉 overthrow that Article of Faith , I beleeve the holy Catholicke Church . Now doth not the holy Catholicke Church 〈…〉 Church Militant ? Is not the Church Militant 〈…〉 if holy , is it not then without spot or wrinkle ? 〈…〉 But this is no Article of your Faith : because your Catholicke Church is not thus holy , without spot or wrinkle .

L. p. 275. In and by the Councel of Trent , the Pope 〈…〉 of Saints , and Adoration of Images , to the 〈…〉 of Christianity , and as great hazzard of the weake .

P. What , no more but so ? First , In the Councel ●f 〈…〉 the Pope teach no more , but these two ? And these two he could teach long before the Councel of Trent . There they had the P●p● confirmation , but not their Christendome . But you tell us not ● word in all your Booke of the Popes teaching of 〈…〉 mans works and merits : and of his Anathematizing of 〈…〉 by Faith onely , which the Scripture teacheth . Nor a 〈…〉 teaching the Masse to be a Propitiatory sacrifice for 〈…〉 quicke and dead : Nor , how he teacheth a New order of sacri●●●cing Priests . Nor , That Originall sinne , is no sinne , saying , * * Council . Trid. Sess. 4. Although the Apostle define it to be sinne yet the holy Councel ( of Trent ) decreeth it not to have the nature of sinne . And all these , and many more such , the Pope teacheth in the Councel of Trent . Secondly , Are Invocation of Saints , and Adoration of Images , no more but a great hazzard to the weake ? Are they not so also to the strong , while they make the strongest to stoope to them ▪ and therfore so much the more hazardous ? Except you meane , that to the strong they are damnable , not onely dangerous . But is plaine Idolatry in both these , both adoration of Images , and Invoca●i●n of Saints , onely hazardous to the weake ? Is not Idolatry damnable ? Nay is it not damnation to Idolaters ? Doth it not shut them out of heaven ? For ‡ ‡ 1 Cor. 6.9 . no Idolaters shall inherit the Kingdome of God . Know ye it not , saith the Apostle .

But Thirdly , you say , These are a great scandall of Christianity . No more ? Why , sure they are the very badges and proper markes of the whore of Babylon , and the Doctrines of Antichristianity . For they are spirituall whoredome . And as for true Christianity , it so abhorres them , and that whore that uses them , that it is not easily scandalized with them , as you are , that would so faine be ●econci●ed to Rome , For what communion hath the Temple of God with Idolls ? Or Christ with Beliall ? Or true Christianity with Antichristianity ?

L. p ibid. Transubstantiation taken properly , cannot stand with the ground of Christan Religion .

P. Why , is there some other taking of Transustantiation , then properly ? Is there a Transubstantiation improperly taken ? shew it us ▪ I pray you . Is not Transubstantiation ▪ Transubstantiation ? To 〈◊〉 , a C●anging of one substance into another ? As the changing of the substance of water into the substance of wine : which Christ truly did miraculously ? As the changing of § § waters into blood , which Moses did miraculous●y ? As the changing of the brea● into Christs body , and of the wine into Christs blood , which the Papists falsly teach , and beleeve , as if done miraculously , when no Miracle at all doth appeare ? Or they say it is done , by verture of pronouncing the words of Consecration , Hoc est corpus meum , † † M●t. 2● . This is my body : whereas the Text plainly sheweth , that these were not the words of Consecration ( as also some Schoolmen confesse ) for Christ had Consecrated before in his blessing , or giving of thanks ▪ after which , and after he had broken the bread , giving it to his Disciples , he uttered these words , This is my body . But what is your Transubstantiation improperly taken ? Indeed some of the Ancient Fathers speaking of the Sacramentall Elements after Consecration , being then set apart from common use , called it a Mutation , saying , that the Elements were changed into another Nature ; but withall they expresse their meaning to be , not the changing of their substance , but of their use , from being common bread and wine to become Sacramentall , or Sacred . But for Transubstantiation , they never so much as dreamed of any such kind of Metamorphosis ▪ or Metousíosis , or monstrous Paradox , as Transubstantiation . But this your Distinction of properly and improperly , may perhaps prove usefull for to make a Reconciliation with Rom● in this matter , and so to remove this mégakásma , so as both you and the Church of Rome may hold Transubstantiation onely with this difference , or rather verball distinction , Rome holding it properly , and you improperly .

L. ibid. As for communion in one kind , Christs Institution to cleare against that .

P. And is not Christs institution as cleare against Tr●nsubstantiation , upon which you immediately adde this ? And first even naturall Reason , or the blind light of Nature is against it . For the Heathen man can tell you , * * 〈…〉 D●●rum . who is so madde or vaine , as to beleeve or imagine that to be God , which he eateth ? Although ( saith he ) we call Bread by the name of the Goddesse Ceres , and Win● by the name of Bacchus , &c. Againe , to beleeve Transubstantiation is against those very words of institution , This is my body , For these words are an usuall Sacramentall Phrase , or manner of speech , which the Scripture useth in all the Sacraments both of the old Testament , and of the new , As in all of them to call the outword visible signes by the name of the thing signified , As Circumsition was called the Covenant , Gen. 17.10 . though but a signe of it vers. 11. Gen. 1● . 1● . ●● And a seale of it also Rom. 4.11 . so the eating of the Paschall Lambe it was a ‡ ‡ Ex● ▪ 12 1● . memoriall or commemorative signe and ‡ ‡ 2● sacrifice of the Passover , and yet it is called the § § 11 . 2● Passover So Baptisme succeeding Circumcision , though it be a visible signe and Sacrament of the washing of Christs bloud to remission of sinnes : And so as Circumcision , a signe , and seale of the Covenant ▪ yet it is called † † Tit. 3 5. r●generation ▪ be●ng but a signe of it . And so also the Lords supper , the Elements the●ein bread and wine Consecrated , being signes to remember , and seales by Faith to apply Christs death , the one is called his body , the other his blood . And thus Christs institution is as cleare against Transubstantiation , as it is against communion in one kind . Thirdly , Transubstantiation is against the Article of our Faith of Christs incarnation of the Virgin , and of his sitting at Gods right hand , * * Act. 3 21. whom the heavens must receive till his coming againe . And so against our Faith of his coming againe , as before , seeing Transubstantiation makes him Corporally present every day . And as for communion in one kind though it be commonly so called , yet both improperly and untruly , For it is not communion so much as in one kind , Transubstantiation being admitted , as Papists beleeve it , for they destroy the very substance of the Element of bread , by their Transubstantiation , and how then is it a communion in one kind ? They have left nothing of the bread , but the bare Accidents . And Accidents we know do not constituere speciem , do not constitute any species or kind of things . Nay according to the Rule of Philosophy , the Papists have , by taking away the substance of bread , not left so much as the Accidents of Bread , but in a meeer Phantasme , or Apparition For Philosophy and Logicke teacheth , that Accidentis Esse est messe , The Beeing of an Accident i● its immediate In-beeing in its proper subject . Now the substance of bread is the proper subject of the Accidents of bread , which are no longer the Accidents of Bread , then they inhere in the bread ; so as the Bread being destroyed , the Accidents are destroyed . And if ( as they say ) the substance of Bread is vanished in Transubstantiation : then certainly the Accidents . And lesse proper is it , that accidents proper to bread , should have their inherence in humane flesh , as they say , Christs flesh is under the accidents of bread ; as if it were coloured over with the accidents of bread , which yet cannot subsist , but in some body , yea and in their naturall and proper body , which is bread . Againe , wheras you say Transubstantiation was never heard of , till the Councel of Lateran : 't is true , that ●s was never decreed to be beleeved and publi●kly received as a Doctrine of the Church of Rome , till in the Councel of Lateran under Innocent 3 , as before is touched : But it was ‡ ‡ hatched before , and was privately crope into the bosome of many mens beliefe , and there fostered as a tender Chicke , before it came to get spurres , and so to be made a Cocke of the Game in that Councel . So also Communion under one Kind ( as you call it secundum Apparentiam ) grew into use in sundry places , through ●egligence of the Priest , or otherwise , before it came to be Decreed in the Councel of Constance to be of necessity universally received .

L. p. 277. For Adoration of Images , the modern Church of Rome is too lik● to Paganisme in the Practise of it .

P. The Moderne , say you ? Nay the Church of Rome hath been an Old stickler for Images , ever since her S. Gregory first set them up in Churches to become Laymens Books . Wherein in processe of time the Laity was so well read , and grew such profound Proficients , that those dumb Masters had taught them to put no difference at all between the Images , and the Saints themselves , whom they represented . For the Images were layd so thick on with beautifull and lively colours , as the eyes of the simple Beholders being dazled therewi●h , were not able to penetrate or pierce through them , to discern the Saints themselves , who were farre enough off . Whereupon the Images grew prouder and prouder , as taking all the honour done to themselves , like the Asse that bore the Image of the god ●s●s● , he imagined that the people adored him . So as becoming every day more gay then other , and to follow the fashions , even the clergy also began to fall in love with them , and so to do●e upon them , as they not onely adored them ( and that as devoutly , as you do your Altars , and that which hangs over them ) but writ Books in commendation of them , and found out a Mistery , which the Heathen never knew , nor acknowledged ( the ‡ ‡ A● 〈◊〉 and 〈…〉 say . learned of them at least ) That Images were to be adored with the same honour , that was due to the Saints they represented , as the Image of Christ ▪ and the Crucifix , and the Crosse , with La●ria which is divine worship , due to Christ , and to God ( as they distinguish ) the Images of the Saints with Doulia , such a worship , as they have devised for the Saints , and ( if you knew all ) no way inferiour to divine worship : and the Image of the Virgin Mary with a certain worship , which they call Huperdoulia , which is proper ( say they ) to the Virgin Mary ; a worship ( I will warrant you , if it were well examined ) above that worship , which they give to God himselfe . And all these worships they give to the very Images themselves respectively . Nor are they any small ●ools that teach these things , as no lesse then Aquinas among the School-men , and Bonaventure ( both Saints for this their meri● ) and Bellarmin● among the Jesuites , besides many more of such l●arned R●bbi●s . In so much , as their golden Legends , and other Authors report , that the said S. Thomas coming into a Church , in Naples , a goodly Cruifix saluted him , saying , My good friend Thomas , th●u hast written well of me : what recompense d●st thou desire ▪ He answered the Crucifix , None but your selfe . Now p●rhaps i● was of good massy Gold , or Silver . But this by the way . Thus we see those simple A. B. C. Books ( and scarce that ) which a● first were onely for simple Laicks , became in time Books to teach those that were of the highest forme in their Schooles , even their Angelicall and Seraphicall Doctors . And thus even in them came Augustins words to be verified , which he then spake of the Heathen : Qu●s intuetur simulacrum , &c. Who beholdeth an Image that is not so affected with it , as to beleeve that to be God which he seeth , and adoreth ? And againe ▪ Plus valeat ●imulacr● ad incurvandum in foelicem animam , quod oculos habent , &c. quàm ad corrigendum ▪ quod ●on vident , &c. Images are of more force to crooke an unhappy soule , that they have eyes , and eares , and mouth , and nose , and hands , and feet : then to correct it , that they see not , heare not , speak not , smell not , handle not , walke not . As David saith , * * Psal. 115. They that make them , are like unto them , and so are all they that put their trust in them , that is , that adore them . The Makers and worshipers , learned and unlearned , are even as blockish , as the senselesse Images themselves , as the Prophet Esay also saith , Esa. 44.19 . chap. 44.19 .

Besides , had not Rome a finger at least ( if not a whole hand ) in that Decree of the 7 th Generall Councel of the 2. of Nice , for worship of Images , though then they went not so farre as Divine worship in words at least , untill the worship it selfe do prove it . And how many good and Godly Emperours were most grievously vexed and troubled from time to time by the Bishops of Rome , for causing the Idolatrous Images in Churches to be broken down , and cast out .

But what more ? Moderne Rome is too like to Paganisme in the practise of Image-worship . Too like ? Nay doth she not farre outstrip the Heathen in this her Idolatry ? Da veniam verbo : pardon the word , Idolatry ; as being too grosse a word to brand the Church of Rome withall in all your Booke , and therfore I suppose more grosse , then your tender Eares can well brooke to heare to be layd to Romes Charge , or cast in her dish , as being too bitter a sauce , and able to put the good motion of Reconciliation quite out of taste . And ( it seems ) it is Religion with you to call Image-worship Idolatry , or an Image and Idol , because that second Councel of Nice made a Decree ; Qui sacras Imagines Idola vocant Anathema : They that call the sacred ●mages Idols , let them be Anathema : or such as alledge against them sentences of Scripture , against Idols ; let them be Anathema . So loth are you to come under that cursed Councels Anathema . But a spade is a spade . And if Modern Rome outstrip old Heathen Rome ●n the Idolatry of Image-worship : and if the Heathen were Idolaters : then let Rome passe for an Idolatresse . But the old Heathen , though they adored the Images , yet when it was objected to them , their usuall answere was , that they worshiped not the Image it selfe , but that which it represented ; as Lactantius , and Augus●ine , and others report of them . But your Moderne Rome teacheth and professeth ( not onely practiseth ) that she gives the same honour to the Image , which is due to that , which it representeth , and that the honour or worship of Chris● is terminated in his Image , or Crucifix , or Crosse , and doth not passe , through it , or beyond it ; that is , reacheth not to Christ , but is wholly intercepted and preoccupated by the Image . So Atheistically impudent is that Who●● grown in her Idolatry of Images , that ●he surpasseth all the Heathen that ever were . But you cite a saying of Cassender , That in this present case of the Adoration of Images , the Church of Rome came full home to the superstition of the Heathen . Full home : that 's somwhat more like yet , then too like . But it seems you have Cassanders ancient Copy , which hath not passed through the fire of Romes Index Expurgatorius , which would never have suffered such an Heresy as this to escape a Deleatur . And you know ( I suppose ) that Cassanders works are marked out in their Indices to be purged of all such stuffe , as this is . Then , after sundry other passages out of Romish Authors , bewraying their gr●sse Idolatry , but teaching it onely , none I hope doth practise it tho : say you ; wherein you shew , that you have as good a hope of the learned Teachers of Idolatry , as hereafter you shew charity to their simple Disciples for their salvation ( notwithstanding ) after all this ( I say ) you inferre :

L. p. 280. These and their like , have given so great a scandal● among us , to some Ignorant , though I presume well meaning men , that they are affraid to testifie their duty to God even in his own house , by any outward gesture at all . In so much , that these very Ceremonies , which by the Iudgement of godly and learned men , have now long continued in the practise of this Church , suffer hard measure , for the Romish superstition sake . But I will conclude this point with a saying of Beatus Rhenanus : Who could indure the People , sayes he , rushing into the Church , like swine into a sty ? Doubtlesse Ceremonies do not hurt to the People , but profit them , so there be a meane kept , and that By be not put for the Maine , that is , so we place not the Principall part of our Piety in them .

P. Concerning These , to wit , Images , as also Ceremonies , we have spoken somthing before , what more is requisite for this Passage , we shall briefly adde . And first , If Images in Churches so scandalous , why are you so curious and zealous for the setting of them up , and the garnishing of them ? Is it because Afternoon-Sermons on the Lords dayes being put down , so as the people having little imployment for their Eares , they may instead thereof have such goodly objects for their Eyes to gaze upon ( Populo ut placerent ) and so by such Books learne , that they may aswell goe to their May-pole , and spend their time in beholding a Morice-dance , as gaze upon such dumb shews . But if they be scandalous , you know who sayd , * * Math. 18 . 7· Wo to that man , by whom th● scandall cometh . But to whom are they scandalous ? Alas , it is but to some ignorant ( say you ) though perhaps well meaning men . And for such , it matters not much , if they stumble at those blocks . But perhaps that ignorant , but well meaning man , who takes offenee at your Images , and for that , and other your Idolatrous Romish superstitions about your Altars , abhorres communion with you ( perhaps , say I ? Surely this is one signe of a true Child of God , and of a well-meaning , and no ignorant Christian ) is one of God Allmighties fooles , as you , and the world call and account them . And then heare what Christ saith againe , ‡ ‡ Math. 18.6 . Who so shall offend one of these little ones , which beleeve in me , it were better for him , that a milstone were hanged about his necke , and that he were drowned in the depth of the Sea . What thinke you of this , as small account as you make of those your ignorant well meaning men , who are scandalised by your many Romish superstitions ? And the least true beleever in Christ , however you take him for an Ignoramus , yet he knows more of Christ , then you doe : and if you have more litterall knowledge , the greater is your sinne , in both giving scandall to such , and punishing of them , for not sinning against their Conscience so scandalized .

But are onely ignorant well-meaning men offended with your Popish or Romish Images , and ragged Reliques of superstition and Idolatry , wherwith your Churches are pestered , and the pure worship of God corrupted , so as they are affraid to testifie their duty to God in that place , which you call his house ? Certainly , if they be such , as are indeed ignorant of Christ , and have not the power of Religion , and the Spirit of Christ in them , but such Protestants at large , as look to be saved by their well-meaning : these are least of all affrayd to testifie such duty , as you doe , as taking your superstition for the best part of their Religion ( aswell as you doe ) being brought up in no other Schoole , but yours . But such as are offended , wherfore are they affrayd ? Of doing their duty to God in his house ? What , call you that Gods-house , which you make the Tyring-house of all your superstitious guises , and the stage or Theater of your pompous service ( wherein you please your selves , and not God ) and that his Temple , wherein you erect an Altar to the Devil ? Doe you startle at it ? I say , To the Devil . For is not that the Devils Altar , whereon our onely True Altar Iesus Christ is crucified afresh , denyed , and destroyed ? And is not all superstitious , and will-worship , and that Altar-worship , a sacrifice offered to the Devil on your Altar ? Doth not the Apostle say , * * 1 Cor. 10.20 that the things , which the Gentiles sacrificed , they sacrificed to Devils , and not to God ? Why , they meant it to God , they erected their Altars to God , and not to the Devil . ‡ ‡ Act. 17.23 ▪ Agnosto ●eo : To the unknown God , was that Altar in Athens dedicated . How then was it to the Devil ? Because it was a strange worship , which God never commanded ; The Altar was strange , and so the service too . And even so is your Altar , and Altar-worship and service : though you pretend it , and intend it to God , and to Christ ; yet because therein you doe with ‡ ‡ Num. 16 ▪ Corah and his company offer strange fire , and strange incense , such as he hath not commanded , and such , as whereby Christ Iesus is denyed , and renounced : it is no better , then the service of the Devil . In the Law we read , that all § § Num. 30.9 ▪ strange Incense of mans devising , was straitly forbidden to be offered to the Lord . Yea whosoever † † Num. 30 38. made any composition of Incense like unto that , which the Lord commanded , was to dye the death . For the breach of which Law in this point , besides that of Corah and his Company , we have a terrible example in ‡̶ ‡̶ Lev. 10.1 , 2 ▪ Nadab and Abihu , the sons of Aaron , who tooke either of them Censers , and put fire therein , and put Incense thereon , and offered strange fire before the Lord , which he commanded them not : And there went out fire from the Lord , and devoured them , and they dyed before the Lord . And it is noted also of them , that * * Num. 3.4 . they had no Children , so as their Name and Memory perished with them . Now Incense signified ‡ ‡ Rev. 5.8 . & 8.3 . Prayer and the service of God , which if it be not that which the Lord hath expresly commanded , it is death to him that offereth it , or deviseth it . So as your Altars , and Altar-service being such , as the Lord hath not commanded , but forbidden and condemned , being ‡ ‡ Esa. 29.13 . taught by the Precept of men , and are a denying of Iesus Christ ( as before is proved ) your sinne therein is so much greater , then that of the Heathen ; for they offered upon a strange Altar to the unknown God : but you with your Eyes open at noon-day doe presume to set up Altars of wood and stone of your own devising , and theron offer the strange Incense of your Prayers and service , thinking them to be the more effectuall , and more acceptable to God , because they are offered up upon your Altar . For which your high presumption what can you expect but terrible * * Heb. 10.26 , 27. Judgements , and fiery indignation , which shall destroy the adversaries ? such as ( the Apostle there saith ) sin willingly ( Ekousíos ) that is , wittingly and willingly , after they have received the knowledge of the truth , for whom there remaineth no more sacrifice for sin .

And yet for all this , doe you call such ignorant , though perhaps well-meaning men , that refuse to communicate with you in your Romish superstitious Idolatrous Altars and service . I tell you , who ever they be that doe so , they are out of all question the deare Children of God . And are they not warned by the Apostle to beware of all such ‡ ‡ 1 Cor. 10.21 will worship ? Ye cannot drinke ( saith he ) the cup of the Lord , and the cup of Devils : ye cannot be partakers of the Lords Table , and the Table of Devils . If then your Altars , and Altar-service be a worship done to the Devil , because it is of mans presumption in devising and imposing it , whereby Christ , and his true worship is overthrown : call you such service a duty to God ? No , God abhorres it , as he did the Altars of Bethel , set up for the Calves , as he did Aarons Calfe , though they said , These are thy Gods ô Israel , which brought thee out of Aegypt . Even as you say , Christ , God Allmighties seat is there , the Mercy-seat there , the Sanctum Sanctorum there ( as in your Printed allowed Books ) Christ , that redeemed Israel out of Aegipt , there . No surely , as those by their false representations , and Altars , worshiped the Devils : so doe you ; as before is shewed . Ye have no shift for it . So as when truly Religious Christians see you set up and use all your Popish Superstitions in that place , which you call Gods house : so your Altars , Images , Adorations , Praying towards the East ▪ where your Altar standeth , and a Crucifix over it , and round about guarded with your Images : have they not cause to be affraid even to step over your Church-threshold ? And may I not here justly and rightly apply to your now Church of Englands Altars and Images , that which the Prophet Hosea doth to revolted Israel● ? ‡ ‡ Hos. 10.11 . Israel is an empty vine , he brought forth fruit unto himselfe ( to wit his own Devises in Religion ) according to the multitude of his fruit , he hath increased the Altars , according to the goodnesse of his land , they have made goodly Images . Their heart is divided : now shall they be found faulty , he shall breake down their Altars : he shall spoyle their Images .

Ye● by this meanes , your hoysing up your Altars and Images , well-minded Christians come now to be affraid of your old Ceremonies allowed by statute . They now begin to find they smell ranke of Romish superstition , and to appeare to be links of the same Chaine , now made up with your Altars , and other Superstitions , whereby they see themselves bound , and carryed captive backe to Babylon and Aegipt againe . Wheras till your New came in , their stomack did ( though with much difficulty ) digest the Old . But now it is with many Christians , as with Man , who seeing a bare hand , and foot , and habit of one that is a notorious thiefe , yet till they come to see his face clearly , cannot by those judge whose parts and members they be , whether an honest mans , or a knaves : so the Church of England , having formerly seen but a hand ( as in signing with the Signe of the Crosse ) and a legge , or foot ( as kneeling at the Sacrament ) and a habit ( as a Surplice ) and all these 3 being called by * * Hooker in his Eccles. Politi● . some of note , The three innocent Ceremonies : she generally took them to belong to some honest Matron : but now Popery beginning to put off her maske , and to shew her face more clearly then before , as in hoysing up of Altars in all Churches , setting up of Images in many , and repayring of some old , as in Pauls , and other Cathedralls , and Chappels , Adorations before , towards , and to them , Publication of Popish Pamphlets in English by Authority , oppression of Gods word and Ministers , open and allowed Profanation of the Lords day ; open and most terrible Persecution of Gods witnesses testifying against such notorious Innovations , and the like : And now , that the Church of England openly professeth and proclaimeth to the world by you in this your Booke ( if indeed she have made you her mouth ) ▪ that she and the Church of Rome are one and the same Church , no doubt of that : Now ( I say ) men , and even the most ignorant ( unlesse they be stone-blind ) begin to see , The Old Ceremonies suspecte● ▪ that all those Ceremonies formerly so pressed by the Prelates , whereby they held the poore peoples noses to the grindstone , and yoaked their perhaps tender Consciences , were but the hand , legge , foot , habit of the whore of Babylon , who durst never have shewed her impudent face so boldly in these dayes , where the Gospell hath been so long professed , and the beames thereof ( till now with such ‡ ‡ Rev. 9. mysts out of the bottomlesse pit , darkened ) had shinned forth so bright : had not your Old Ceremonies ushered her in ; so as now , as those ‡ ‡ 1 King 20. Syrians with halters about their necks , when Ahab said of Benhadad , He is my brother , catcht the word presently out of his mouth , replying , Thy brother Benhadad : so the Church of Rome , being styled by you a § § In your f●rmer Namel●ss● Boo●● . sister of England , and you being in all things suited Sister-like in Romes Rites and Reliques , dare and doth quickly catch the word out of your mouth , Thy sister ( if not , Thy mother ) Rome ; so as the Proverb may come to be in all other things verified , Like Mother , like Daughter , if you may prove the Father .

Again , One thing I cannot well passe over , which seems to me very ridiculous , where you say , that by the judgement of godly and learned men , those former Ceremonies have continued in the practise of this Church . Now who knoweth not , that these Ceremonies have so continued even by the judgement of profane and ignorant men . And what needs then the judgement of godly and learned men for the matter , as to testifie this ? Except you meane by the judgement of godly and learned men , that godly and learned men have had most cause to know it , by undergoing the severe judgement of Censure of suspension and silencing , and other vexations , onely for not conforming to the practise of your Old Ceremonies , as many doe now , for not conforming to your New . Or els you so shuffle these words in , and so packe them together , that when they meet with a Reader , that weighs your words more by the sound , then by the sense ( or rather want of sense ) he may run away with this apprehension , as if godly and learned men had in their judgement approved of those Ceremonies ; whereas few godly and learned , but rather wished them all long agoe at Rome again , from whence they came .

But to come to your Conclusion out of Rhenanus , which by puting it down with approbation , you make to be your own : Doubtlesse Ceremonies doe not hurt the people , but profit them . Doubtlesse ? How prove you that ? Nay doubtlesse , we have already proved , that both they doe hurt , and no way profit the people ; they are good for nothing , for no body , unlesse for you Prelates , to uphold and exercise your Tyranny over Gods people , and to bring Fees into your Courts . And Beatus Rhenanus spake according to the Time , and Place , and Church he lived in ; although he was a moderate man , and saw more , then he durst speake of . And the same Rhenanus ( as was before touched ) in his Annotations upon T●rtullian , and I take it in that Book , out which you cite this sentence ( De Corona Militis ) observes , how sundry Heathen Ceremonies crope into the Church , by occasion of many old men newly converted to Christianity , whom it was hard to waine from their old Heathenish fashions , which therfore were thought fit to be admitted , as not hurting , but profiting those old Heathen new Christians . But godly and learned men ( as I said before ) could tell you what infinite dammage your tyrannicall pressing of your Ceremonies upon mens Consciences hath brought to the Gospell , and so to the soules of men , by depriving them of so many worthy Ministers , onely for Non-conformity . But this is one speciall end , for which you so presse your Ceremonies , to suppresse Godly and learned Preachers , and so the sincere Preaching of the word of God , that the people being brought up in ignorance and profanesse , might be the lesse sensible of bearing the yoake of your Antichristian Tyranny over them . But as for your Carnall Ceremonies , which the Apostle saith are good for nothing , * * Col. 2.23 ▪ pròs plesmonen , in comparison of satisfying the flesh , the carnall pride of will-worshipers : we have spoken sufficiently before .

But Rhenanus addes a qualification : so there be a meane kept . I think you might have done well to have omitted this , till you had been better acquainted with this meane ; of which before . And the Author might have expressed this Meane a little more fully , thus : So there be either no Ceremonies at all , or if any , those very few , and those few not pressed , with rigor , or necessity upon mens Consciences , but left free to every one to use them , or not , according to the Christian liberty , which Christ hath purchased for them , as is said before . Whereas you are not satisfied with a few Ceremonies , nor with the Old , but you must have New added , with a Tot quot , and all of them you presse so hard upon the Conscience , as you wring blood . And this is all the Meane you keep .

Lastly , So the By be not put for the Maine : that is ( say you ) so we place not the principall part of our Piety in them . And doe not you so ? For you put your Altar , and all the solemn Service , and Ceremonies of Devotions and Adorations attending upon it , even all your humane Inuentions and Will worship , for the very Maine of all your Religion . Do you not ? I know you willingly confesse it . And what 's the By , but Gods-word , and the sincere Preaching thereof , which you put By , and by seting up your Altar-service , do thrust out of the Church by the head and shoulders , as is noted before ? And I say , The Maine , the All and some of all your Religion , is your Altar : On this your Goddesse , all your other Devotions and Ceremonies , as so many Hand-mayds give their devout attendance . Your face prayeth towards your Altar : your body boweth towards your Altar : your second solemn service ( as the secundae Mensae ) for your daintier Cates , must be served up upon your Altar , which the maine Body of the Church must not tast of : your Third service ( which is instead of the Preachers concluding prayer & blessing after his halfe-houres Sermon ) must be served by your Priest at your Altar , when with his blessing he dismisses the people with an Ite , Missa est ; And all the while of your solemn Second and Third service your Serving men in their Liveries , or Rich Copes , stand and give their Attendance about your Altar : your Crucifixes and Images , like the Cherubims , have their aspect and respect upon your Altar : All must come and offer at your Altar , while for joy your Organs merrily play . Thus as the Romish Altar-service ( as Bellarmine tells us ) is the maine substance of all their Religion : just so is yours . That 's the Maine But What 's the By then ? Namely all the Intralls or Inwards of externall Devotion and worship , these are the appurtinances , these are the By. What are those Inwards ? The Inwards of True Externall worship , are Faith , Feare of God , Love of God , Zeale of Gods Glory , sincerity of heart in spirit and Truth . Now these with you are altogether the By ; for these you have layd quite By , as before .

L. p. 280. F. ( Fisher reports ) After this , we all rising , the Lady asked the Bishop whether she might be saved in the Romain Faith ? He answered she might . L. What ? Not one Answere perfectly related ? My Answere to this was Generall , for the ignorant , that could not discerne the errours of that Church , so they held the foundation , and conformed themselves to a Religious life . Pag. 285. We have not so learned Christ , as to deny salvation to some ignorant silly soules , whose humble peaceable obedience makes them safe among any part of men , that professe the foundation Christ . And pag. 288. some Protestants there be , which doe as stiffly and as churlishly deny ( All Papists ) salvation , as they doe us . And 283. In this * * False Charity of the Prelate Our Charity is not mistaken : and if it be mistaken Charity is better , then none at all .

P. From all these words together , we observe this one Maine , That silly ignorant Papists , living and dying in the Romish Faith , may be saved ; with these conditions : 1. If they discerne not the errour of that Church : 2. So they profes the foundation Christ : 3. So they conforme to a Religious life , in an humble and peaceable obedience . The second Maine I observe is , That we ought not to deny to such in that case salvation And that upon these Reasons , 1. Because we have not so learned Christ . 2. Because it is stiffnesse and Churlishnesse in Protestants , to deny all Papists salvation . 3. That in granting them salvation , it is true Charity not mistaken . 4. That if Charity herein be mistaken , 't is better then none at all . Of all these brefly .

First then I Answere : That the Roman Faith being Infidelity it selfe , 't is impossible , that any living and dying in that faith , can be saved . And we have before proved it to be flat Infidelity , and Apostacy . Nor will it excuse any Ignorant , that he discerneth not this Infidelity , and Apostacy . For ignorance , though it excuse à Tanto ( as the Schoolmen speake ) from the muchness● of sinne , yet not à Toto , from the Maine of sinne . A man that is blind , and knows not the danger of the way he walkes in , doth as well fall into the pit , as he that seeing , runs headlong into it ? The Heathen knew not , that they lived and dyed in Idolatry and Infidelity : yet they were damned for all their ignorance . Secondly , for their Professing the foundation Christ : Is Profession sufficient ? Many ( sayth the Apostle ) * * Tit. 1.16 . professe Christ , that in works doe deny him , being abominable , disobedient , and unto ●very worke Reprobate . Is it enough then to professe all that is in the Creed ( did ignorant silly Papists know what their Latin-Creed meaneth ) and yet want faith ? Againe , they professe , as they are taught . How is that ? They are taught this one Maine Principle , That they must be saved not by Faith onely , but by their good Works , whereby they must merit their Salvation . Now this all Papists , learned and unlerned , professe . This ( unlesse they cease to be Papist ) they live and dye in ; and so they are necessarily and certainly damned . For to adde any thing to Faith in Iustification , is damnation ; as before it shewed . And saith the Prophet , ‡ ‡ Io● . 2.8 . They that observe lying vanities , forsake their own mercy . But , Thirdly , you say , They may be saved , so they conforme to a Religious life . Now what is the Religious life of a Papist , and especially of a silly ignorant Papist ? Namely , to goe to Shrief , or Confession to the Priest , his Ghostly Father , as often as may be ( as the Fernall Glory , published by your Chapleins licence , teacheth ) or at the least once a yeare against Easter : to keep his Lent-fast strictly , so as upon paine of damnation , or greivous penance , not to eat an egge all that time , and so observe all othor Fasting-dayes in the yeare , together with all Holydayes : to say over their Beads every day in repeating their Pater Noster , Ave Mary , Creed , and ten Commandements , ●f either they be so learned , or devout : to goe to their dayly Masse and Mattens , where it is their safety to understand never a word , nor to say Amen to the Priest , but by the sound of his voyce : which they understand no more , then the chattering of a Magpy : to call upon such a Saint , his speciall Mediator , and say a Pater Noster , and Ave Mary before such an Image , and especially of their Lady : and a thousand such like observations , wherein a Popish Religious life consisteth . And so this is the Religious life of your ignorant silly Papist , wherin living and dying , he may be saved , if he may beleeve your Doctrine . But to this you adde , An humble and peaceable obedience . To What ? Or to whom ? As to the Priests Ghostly Discipline , when he injoynes sore penance , as whipping-cheare in Lent , or the like . Or if you meane peaceable obedience to the Civil Magistrate , as in England : that must be according to their Ghostly Fathers direction and limitation : they must not take the Oath of Supremacy , nor in some cases , the Oath of Allegiance , when it makes for the Catholick Cause . And though to satisfie the Law , and save his purse , he come once a moneth to Church , and heare your service : yet Sermon he must not heare , especially if the Preacher be Puritannicall , for that might turn him quite from his Popery . And thus such , partly by their peaceable civill life , and partly by their humble Popish Religious life , so living and dying may be saved .

And therfore to such silly Ignorants , we must not deny salvation . Why so ? For first , We have not so learned Christ , say you . Wee ? What wee ? Wee , to wit , you , and your present Church of England . And surely you had not need to deny salvation to that Church , with which you and your Church is one and the same Church , least otherwise you might leave your selves as little hope of salvation , as others doe them . But this is a piece of your learning of Christ , it seems , to beleeve , that a silly ignorant Papist , that knows not the right hand from the left , that is drowned in Ignorance , blindnesse , superstition , Idolatry , Infidelity , and as a drowned man knows it not , may securely wrappe himselfe in the shrowd or mantle of his silly ignorance , and so goe to heaven . Thus have you learned Christ . But Wee , Wee ( I say ) that renounce all communion with the Whore of Babylon , and with all her Abominations , * * Ephes. 4.21 . have not so learned Christ ( as having heard him , and been taught by him , as the truth is in Iesus ) as to beleeve there is salvation to be hoped for of any , but such as walke according to Christs rule , and live and dye in his Faith . And what 's Christs rule ? Even that which follows in the same place , vers. 22 , To put off , and renounce the former conversation of the Old Man , which is corrupt according to the deceitfull lusts , wa●king ( v. 18. ) in the vanity of our minds , having the understanding darkened , being alienated from the life of God , through ignorance ( as the Gentiles ) because of the blindnesse of their heart , who being past feeling , have given themselves to all ●●s●viousnesse , to worke all uncleannes with greedinesse : Wherupon the Apostle addes : But have not so learned Christ , so , as to thinke to be saved in a Heathenish life drowned in ignorance : ( from which you cannot distinguish the life of an ignorant Papist , except that it is infinitely more stupid and fuller of grosse ignorance , and all abominations , then the Heathen were ; and saving that Papists professe the name of Christians ) We have not ( I say ) so learned Christ . What is then the learning of Christ ? To put off the Old Man , and that ye be ( saith the Apostle ) renewed in the spirit of your mind , putting on the New man ▪ which after God is created in Righteousnesse , and true Holinesse . This is the learning of Christ . So as without this learning , neither any silly ignorant Papist , nor the most pregnant , acute , learned Arch-Prelate can be saved . We must have both the Righteousnesse of justification by Faith imputed , and of Sanctification of the spirit of Christ inherent , and shining forth in a holy life and conversation . It is not a Pope-holynesse in keeping of a Lent , fast , or worshiping of an Altar , and such like counterfeit holines of mans devising . This you learne not of Christ . For Christ saith , * * Mat. 15. ● ▪ In vaine they worship me , teaching for Doctrines the Commadements of men , or humane Traditions . This holinesse saves not , but shuts men out of the Kingdome of Heaven .

But secondly , You call it stifnesse , Protestants Churlishnesse , better then the Prelates Charity . and churlishnesse in Protestants to deny all Papists salvation . We shall by and by see your Charity to Papists , which is so extreame great , as we need not wonder at your malice against those some Protestants you speake it . Is it stifnesse to avouch the truth ? And if they do bebaiousthai ( as the ‡ ‡ Tit. 3.8 ▪ Apostle exhorteth Titus ) constantly affirme , what not onely is truth , but also necessary to be spoken , as being a matter of such moment and consequence , as concernes the savation of soules , by denying salvation , to whom it belongeth not , and when men are seduced in a false perswasion therof : call you this churlishnesse ? Certainly this churlishnesse in so denying , is better then your charity in affirming a falshood . Nay what will you say , if this , which you call churlishnesse , be found to be true Charity ? when your Charity will be found to be deadly hatred against the soule of that silly ignorant Papist ? For true Charity ever consists with verity : els it is no Charity , but vanity . Now those Protestants , which deny salvation to all Papists living and dying in the Roman faith , doe it upon sound and solid grounds , even upon cleare evidence of Scripture . For the Roman Faith is not the true Christian Faith ; as we have proved . And without the true Christian Faith , no salvation . And that one Doctrine of Justification by works ( were there no more ) which all Papists professe and hold , is alone sufficient to shut out all Papists , living and dying therein , from salvation . This being so cleare , should Protestants grant notwithstanding a possibility of salvation to any Papist , living and dying in that Romish faith , they should utter a manifest untruth and falshood , and so should bewray themselves to be notoriously uncharitable . How ? First to Protestant Professors : 2. to Papists . To Protestant Professors , causing the weake at least to waver in their faith , and make them the apter to be seduced by Romish Priests and Jesuites , who prevaile not a little with vulgar Protestants , and that by this very Argument which you hold , That Protestants ( yea the Primate of Canterbury ) grant a possibility of salvation in the Roman Church . Whereas we ( say the Jesuites ) deny salvation to be had in the Protestant Church . Although I hope they will not extend this to the Church of England , which you say is one and the same Church with that , of which Rome is . Againe secondly , Protestants in not affirming this truth , Then it is impossible for any Papist , living and dying in the Roman faith , to be saved , should be very uncharitable to the Papists themselves . For seeing them running on in a way , which is full of false ground , and deep pits , covered over with green leaves , and the end whereof is certaine and unavoydable destruction : should they not cry out unto them , to abandon that way , and by all meanes and speed to get them out of it , they were very uncharitable . And the Scripture calls this hatred of our Brother . As Levit. 19.17 . Thou shalt not hate thy broth●r in thy heart : thou shalt in any wise rebuke him , and not suffer sin upon him . And for ignorant Papists , we are not to cast off all hope of them , but erranti comiter monstrare viam , shew those wanderers the right way , instructing them with meeknesse , proving * * 2 Tim. 2.25 , 26. if God peradventure will give them repentance to the acknowledgement of the truth , And that they may recover themselves out of the snare of the Devil , being taken captive of him at his will .

Ob. But for Protestants to have no better an opinion of Papists , and of their Religion , would ( as you tell us before ) make the rent wider , which you are loth to doe . The rent is too wide , so to be sowed up with the rotten thread of your Charity . Nay such your Charity keeps Papists the further off from the true Protestant Religion , when they may be provided of salvation nearer home , and that so easily too . But however , the truth must be spoken , Aug. de Praedest . et Gratia ▪ as you ●old us before . As Augustine saith in the point of Predestination , at the Preaching whereof some in his dayes ( as too many in ours ) taking offence , he answereth , Numideo tacenda est veritas , &c. Is the Truth therfore to be concealed , because some unjustly are offended with it to their damnation : and not rather to be spoken , that he which is able to receive it , may receive it to his salvation ? And here the Papists take offence at Protestants , for speaking the truth , it is not scandalum datum , but acceptum , not an offence given , but taken . And though some take offence , yet others weighing by reason , may thereby through Gods grace forsake their errour , and imbrace the truth . If they will not , we have freed our own soules , and Truth is Truth still . We must keep our distance , and not ( because they will not come to us ) goe the halfe way at least to draw them to us ; as before . As the Lord saith to his Prophet concerning revolted Israel , * * Ier. 15.19 . Let them return unto thee , but return not thou unto them . And if thou take forth the Precious from the vile , thou shalt be as my mouth . We must not mingle and confound the precious and pure gold with the base drosse , not truth with errour , not light with darknesse .

Yet for your part , you say Thirdly , Not to deny Papists salvation , living and dying Papists , to wit , in the Roman Faith , is not mistaken Charity ; and if it be , mistaken Charity is better then none at all . But first , we have shewed , that this is no Charity at all , but an erronious opinion , arising from a spirit destitute of the Truth , and too much in love with the Romish whore . And Secondly , such mistaken Charity is worse then no Charity at all in this kind . It were better , if ye had no such Charity . For your Charity towards your silly ignorant Papists , in perswading them , that they are safe enough in any society of men , and there is salvation for them living and dying in the Roman Faith , is a nuzzling of them in their ignorance ; and ( like the Apes Charity to her young one ) a strangling of them with too much hugging , and bewrayes you to be of the spirit of those false Prophets , that ‡ ‡ Eze. 13.22 . strengthen the hands of the wicked , that he should not return from his wicked way , by promising him life ▪ that ‡ ‡ v 11. dawbe with untempered morter , that § § Esa. 5.20 . call evil good , and good evil : that put darknesse for light , and light for darknesse ( and wo to such ) that say , † † Ier. 6.14 ▪ peace , peace , when there is no Peace .

Ob. But you will say , shall we shut out silly ignorant Papists from Gods mercy . Nay you your selfe shut them out from Gods mercy , while you shut them up in their blindnesse , and so from the meanes of Gods mercy . For meanes of mercy they have none in their Popish Religion , and blind faith , and therein you lull them fast asleep , while you tell them , so long as they are ignorant of the Errours of Popery , they are safe among any part of men ▪ Thus you shut them out from Gods mercy ( as much as in you is ) when we by shewing them the truth , and their errour , would lead them to Gods mercy . Nor doe we deny , but God may in the riches of his Grace and mercy prevent and overtake a silly Papist , in causing him to imbrace Christ by Faith , even when he lyes on his death bed , and truly beleeving in Christ , and so dying , he is undoubtedly saved . But dying thus a true Beleever , he dyes not in the Roman faith , but in the saving faith of Christ , which the Roman faith is not . So as thus dying within the Verge of the Roman Church , yet he dyes no member of the Roman Church , but of the true misticall body of Christ . And this Charity we have towards silly Papists , praying that God would shew them mercy , in delivering them from under Antichrists yoake , to take Christs yoake upon them , and bring them out of darknesse into his marvellous light . To proceed .

L. p. 294 , 295. Io. Frith saith , Of the presense of Christs naturall body in the Sacrament , Fox . Martyr . Tom. 2. pag. 943. Lond. 1597. that neither side ought to make it an Article of Faith , but leave it indifferent . And B. Ridley , we confesse all one thing to be in the Sacrament ▪ onely we differ in modo , in th● manner of Beeing .

P , And of this of Ridley you say ( ibid. ) 'T is well if some Protestants except not against it . For this difference de Modo , of the manner of the Presence of Christs naturall Body in the Sacrament , we have spoken before at large . And was this Difference , trow you so small that cost both Ridley , and Cranmer , and Frith their lives ? For you cite them all 3 in one Page , calling them the learned of those zealous in Queen Maries dayes . Martyrs you do not call them : beware of that . So as times kàrin for honour sake you mention them not . So you cite Calvin a little before , whom in the High Commission you honoured with the Title of Rascall . And these Martyrs are they , whom one of your Divines of note and worth ( Dr. Heylin ) in a Booke licensed by your Chaplein stiles with the Honourable Title of Schismaticall Hereticks . But to let this passe for currant with you : The summe of your whole passage touching this point , from pag. 292. to 296. is to perswade us to acknowledge a reall presence of Christs naturall body in the Sacrament , onely differing from the Papists quoad moaum , as touching the manner of presence . Now I confesse this is a very pretty and ready way to lead to your Reconciliation . But let me tell you , even words , and names , and verball expressions are of no small force many times , to lead men into great errours , although at first they meant no harme , that used them . For instance . The Primitive Fathers , when they began to call the Lords Table an Altar : they little dreamed what an Altar it would prove afterwards , as wheron to offer up in sacrifice Christs naturall body ▪ So when they called Ministers Priests , they imagined not , that those Priests would prove afterwards such sacrificing Priests , as now are in the Church of Rome . And when they called the Lords supper a sacrifice , which they meant to be Eucharisticall , of thanksgiving , they never suspected , that this would become afterwards a corporall sacrifice of Christs very body and b●ood . And yet these very Names so taken up , gave occasion afterwards of setting up the greatest Idol that ever was in the world , as we see at this day . So dangerous is it to expresse Divine matters by any other Name , then what the Scripture hath given them . Seeing then that in Scripture we find no such words as Reall Presence of Christs naturall body in the Sacrament : it is not safe for Christians to take them up . And so much the more , because we see by experience the mischiefes , that this reall presence ( so called and so understood , as the Papists doe ) hath done in the Church of God . How many Martyrs hath it made ? How much innocent blood hath it spilt ? So as it hath gotten ( and that deservedly ) a very bad Name . And it is the Name , or Word , wherby the Romanists expresse their Great Idol in the Masse . And David saith , * * Psal. 16.4 . Their Drinke offerings of Blood will I not offer , nor take up their Names into my lips . So as Christians ought not to use the Names of Idols , invented by man , to expresse Divine things of Scripture by . Yea K. Hezechiah , when the Brazen Serpent ( which God himselfe had ‡ ‡ Num. 21.9 ▪ commanded to be made for the present occasion in the Wildernesse ; though he commanded it not to be kept for a Monument ) began to be abused unto ‡ ‡ 2 Kin. 18 . 4● ▪ Idolatry , he brake it to pieces . And so in this case , though these words The Reall Presence , may beare a good sense : yet being , and that of long time abused to the setting up and upholding of most grosse Idolatry : we are to stamp it to powder , and never use it more . And we have as little reason to be perswaded hereto by your Lordship as by any . For as this word , Reall presence , is very suspicious , in it selfe , and much more in regard of the Papists abusing of it : so it wants not suspicion , that you so commend it unto us . First , in regard of the whole matter of your Book , which generally complyes with Popery : Secondly , in regard of the main scope of your Booke , which is to bring on a Reconciliation with Rome . And Thirdly , and more especially , in regard of some speeches , which have now and then dropped from you in publick Court , where speaking of Altars-placing , you said , you would have none to sit above God-Allmighty ; which must needs imply ( as before is noted ) that either your Altar is your God Allmighty ; or els God Allmighty hath a locall presence and residence there upon your Altar . And so Fourthly , your eager zeale , in promoting of Altars , makes us much to suspect your Reall Presence , as fearing all will not be well , when once we have taken up , and let down this Reall presence of God Allmighty into our bellies . And so also , Fiftly , your Priests ( by that Name ) doe increase the suspition . And Sixtly , because you tell us before of a Transubstantiation , taken properly , and improperly . And Seventhly , Because you tell us by and by , that Transubstantiation , Purgatory , Forbearance of the Cup , are but Disputed and Improbable Opinions . Lastly , it is used to Idolatry : and so to be broken in pieces , as the Brazen Serpent was . And therfore for all these Reasons , we desire not to be troubled with your Reall presence , but leave it to the Papists , or to you , to restore it where you had it , or if you like it so well to use it , let it be to your selfe , or Chappell at Lambeth , trouble not the Church of England with it any more , which desireth not more matter for a new Booke of Martyrs .

Now to come to the Martyrs . First for Ioh. Friths words , Not to make it an Article of Faith , but leave it Indifferent . First , However the words sound , we must weigh them by the sense . And the best Commentary of his words , is his death , which he suffered even therfore , because he made it an Article of his faith to beleeve , that Christ was not Really Present in the Sacrament , as the Papists do hold ; and therfore on the contrary , he held it as an Article of his faith , That Christ was onely vertually and spiritually present to the Faith of the Receiver , according to the true meaning of those Sacramentall words , This is my body ; as a little before we shewed .

Secondly , to take Friths words in your sense , doth overthrow a Christians faith , as touching the Sacrament , wherein the beleever receives and applyes by faith the merits of Christs death to the comforting , nourishing , and strengthning of his soule . And a man is bound to beleeve aright concerning the Sacrament , and to put a maine difference between truth and erro●● therein . And is it not an Article of Faith to beleeve Christs body not to be corporally present in the Sacrament , seeing he saith , * * Mat. 26.11 ▪ Me have you not alwayes . ‡ ‡ Ioh. 16.7 . It is expedient for you that I goe away : ‡ ‡ Rom. 8.34 . who sits at Gods right hand : § § Act. 3.21 . whom the heavens must receive , till his coming againe ? And lastly , admit his words may be stretched to the full bredth of your sense ( which is erronious ) wee must measure all mens words by the Rule of Scripture in divin , matters . If they dissent , or come short , or goe over , or besides consider men are men . But I say , we cannot conceive that those words of Iohn Frith could have any other sense , then that which was sound and good , considering ( as I said before ) he dyed for that very difference in Faith touching Christs presence in the Sacrament ▪

Now for Dr Ridley , saying we differed in Modo , in the manner : 'T is true . And the manner is the whole matter of difference . Papists say , Christs naturall Body is present : we that the merit and vertue of his Body broken upon the Crosse , and the merit and vertue of his Blood , shed upon the Crosse , is present to the beleeving soule in the Sacrament . I may expresse it by this similitude , of the Sun , and the beames . The body of the Sun is in heaven , in its spheare locally , and circumscriptively , but the Beames are on the earth . And when the Sun beames shine into our house , we say , here 's the Sun , though it be the beames , not the body of the Sun . And so the Scripture saith of the Sacrament , This is my Body , because with the bread the faithfull Communicant receives the beames of Christs Body crucified into his soule , his merits , but not the Body it selfe . But the Papists say as much , as , The very body of the Sun is in their house , when it shineth . But enough of this here , having spoken sufficiently of it before . Yet for a conclusion : If your Lordship hold it to be a matter so indifferent , about the manner of Christs naturall-bodyes presence in the Sacrament , which you put upon the Martyrs , if you were put to it as they were ; would you be of their mind , and resolution , rather to loose Canterbury , life and 〈◊〉 , then beleeve as the Church of Rome beleeves of the reall presence . But I leave you to the Resolution .

L. p. 297. Transubstantiation , Purgatory , Forbearance of the Cup in the Sacrament , are disputed and improbable Opinions : yet so imposed ▪ as this may be enough for us to leave Rome , though the Old Prophet forsooke not Israel . 3 Reg. 13. ( And a little after ) And therfore in this present case , ther 's perill , and great perill of damnable both Schisme and Heresie , and other sin , by living and dying in the Roman faith ▪ tainted with so many superstitions , as at this day it is , and their Tyranny to boot .

P. I told you , I feared some such thing , when you commended last unto us the indifferencie of admitting of Termes of Reall Presence . For now I perceive your Reall presence even in Transubstantiation it selfe , is but an improbable and disputed opinion , as also Purgatory , and the Forbearance of the Cup. And by Disputed , I suppose you meane Disputable , such as either hath been disputed , or may be disputed againe ▪ so as these things are matters of dispute , and improbable . And somtimes a thing that is improbable , may prove true . For Improbabile is not alwayes falsum . It may seem improbable to us , and yet be true in it selfe . But for Transubstantiation : is that which is clearly against Faith , against Reason , against the nature of Christs Body naturall , against the nature of the Sacrament , but an improbable opinion ? And for Purgatory : Is that which is against Faith , and overthrows the infinit vertue , merit , and efficacie of the blood of Christ , but an improbable opinion ? And is that , which you confesse to be against the expresse institution of our Saviour Christ ( as the taking away of the Cup in the Sacrament ) but an improbable opinion ? And doe you so favourably call that , but a Forbearance , which is a most notorious and shamelesse Sacriledge ?

And then secondly , All this ( say you ) may be enough for us to leave Rome . May be : Much may be : but Is not , I hope . And so long , well enough . And though Actu it be , yet not affectu . But you might have said , All this , and much more besides , if not onely disputable and improbable things , but abominable and damnable . But this is enough , were there no more . Yet ( say you ) the old Prophet forsook not Israel . What then ? Ergo the Protestants , though they might have had cause enough to leave Rome , yet should have done rather as the old Prophet did , not to have made a separation from Rome . Ergo they were not so kind , as the old Prophet . But the old Prophet might continue in Israel upon better terms , then the Protestants could have done in Rome . For Israel had no Inquisition , as Rome hath . And you confesse that men might live in Israel , and injoy the liberty of their Conscience , seeing there was no Law made to restrain them from going to the one Altar at Ierusalem , or to constrain them to sacrifice in the high places . And yet that 's more , then I beleeve can well be proved . For those 7000. that had not bowed to Baal did hide themselves , as not daring to professe and avow their Religion and Faith towards God , as before . So as it seems there was no open toleration in Israel for any to goe up to Ierusalem . And it can hardly be thought , that Ieroboam being a great Politician , should give toleration to his subjects to goe up to Ierusalem to worship , least they should fall back to Iuda againe , for prevention whereof the two Calves were set up , to keep the people at home . The like policie used the High Priests , Scribes and Pharisees to suppresse those that should confesse Christ , in making a Decree to * * Ioh. 9.22.34 ▪ excommunicate them , and so in puting Christ to death , least his Kingdome should put down theirs . And I hope your Hierarchy wants not the like policie , for the rooting out of Puritans , the true Professors and People of Christs Kingdome , being Christs Kingdome and yours cannot consist together .

But you conclude , somwhat dangerously , when you say , Therfore in the present case ther 's perill , great perill of damnable both Schisme , and Heresie , and other sins , by living and dying in the Roman faith , tainted with so many superstitions , as at this day it is , and their Tyranny to boot . This conclusion you apply , not to the silly ignorant Papists ( for you leave them secure , and out of danger , as afore ) but to the knowing men of Rome , having shewed them , that though the silly ignorants may perhaps through the thick fogge and Aegyptian Myst of their palpable ignorance steale , or stumble into heaven : yet for the learned , as A.C. and his fellowes , 't is danger , yea great danger to live and dye ( and that knowingly ) in the Roman faith . But me thinks neither here do you buckle your selfe to such a serious businesse as this is , so as to pull these wilfull men out of their puddle , wherein they wittingly stick so fast . You doe not with the spirit of zeale , which Iude requires in good Ministers , saying , ‡ ‡ Iude 23. some save with feare , a●prázontes , snatching or plucking them out of the fire , hating even the garment spotted with the flesh . Nor doe you with Peters zeale tell these men , ‡ ‡ Act. 2.40 . save your selves from this crooked and wicked Generation ; such as the Scribes and Pharisees , and High-Priests were . But you onely tell them , Ther 's danger , great danger . Of what ? Of no lesse then Heresie and Schisme , and other sinne too , living and dying in the Roman faith . Nay if there be but perill , though great perill , these pregnant Wits have wayes and wiles enough to avoyd all such perills ; and that by the cleane strength of their Art of equivocation , wherein they are become the most expert Masters in the world . Except they have forgotten it , it is so long agoe since our Judges were wont to put them shrewdly to it , as to confesse whether they were Priests or no ; which confession then was as good , as to be hangd . And you say elsewhere , § § See before . such can make a short cut to heaven , when they lye a dying , saying , They renounce all their own merits ( whither their many bad , or their few Good merits , is not known ) and rely onely upon Christs merits for salvation . As your good Brother Stephen Gardiner did at his death ( as before But when they dye in so good a mood , though they may seem ( as Gardiner seemed ) to dye in the faith , yet in charity they do not , while they leave not the same gappe open for the people , by which themselves get through , concealing Iustification by Faith from the silly vulgar . In which desperate case had not your Lordships charity put in to helpe at a dead lift , to teach them a blind way to heaven , which scarce any Jesuites , before you , ever knew : What had become of them ? But ( alas ! ) As you delude those silly ignorants , by telling them such a way leads to heaven , which will carry them straight to hell : so on the other side you doe but dally with A. C. and his fellows , in telling them they are in perill onely , when they are in the very precipice of perdition . But if you intended to be their Ghostly Father indeed , you should have told them plainly , Their Religion is Idolatry , Heresie , Schisme , Apostacie , Antichristianisme , Infidelity , and all manner of In●quity , and Impiety , so as to live and dye therein is inevitable damnation to all Papists whatsoever , but double damnation to those that know it . For as Christ saith , * * Luk. 12. ●7 . 48 . That servant , which knew his Lords will , and prepared not himselfe , neither did according to his will shal be beaten with many stripes : But he that knew not , and did commit things worthy of stripes , shal be beaten with few stripes But what should a man speake to ‡ ‡ Psa. 58.4.5 . the deafe Adder ▪ that stoppes her eare , and will not hearken to the voyce of Charmers , charming never so wisely ? I will follow my Lords Councel , ‡ ‡ Mat. 15.14 . Let them alone , They be blind leaders of the blind ; and if the blind lead the blind they shall both fall into the pit . And as he saith to the Pharisees , § § Mat. 23.32 . Fill ye up the measure of your Fathers . But how come you to say , Ther 's danger of Schisme , living and dying in the Roman faith . What ? Can a man be a Schismaticke ▪ being a Romanist ? Then is not the Church of Rome her selfe a Schismatick ? And so the Church of England all one Church . And so your Catholicke Church , of which you and Rome are , all Schismaticks ? Look to it .

But I may not leap over that , which you have stumbled upon , namely , Romes Tyranny to boot . And it were well , if such Tyranny were confined to Rome ; saving that all Tyranny is such , as it will not be confined to any place , within any bounds . You say , that the Church of England , and that of Rome , are one and the same Church . Certainly then , this One Church ( what ever you pretend of the Catholick Church ) is of such a constitution , as whose very foundation is Tyranny , because Hierarchicall . As Pope Hadoian ▪ 4. an English man , lying extreme sick , said , That there was no life more wicked , then the Popes , whose Popedome was founded in blood , and is maintained with blood , wherein he is Romulus his successor , who in laying the first foundation of Rome , slew his brother Remus . And wherein doth the Tyranny of your Popedome in the Church of England come short of the Popes , saving that he hath a more powerfull Principality , then you have . Have not you in your hand , like that Roman Iupiter , ( the Pope ) your thunderbol● of Excommunication , to blast and cast out of the Church whom you please , or those who do not please you ? Do not the Censures of your High Commission ( like the Popes Court of Inquisit●●n ) extend to the spoyling of good Ministers and Christians of all liberty and livelyhood ? You will say , You use no * * Pag. 298. fagots , as Rome doth . 'T is true : 't is not yet come to that . But whe●'s the default ? You onely want a Law . But in the mean time , you want not your devises , armed both with your own power , and borrowed of others , to afflict men worse , then with death , as before is shewed in the forenamed examples . And therfore from all such Tyranny both English , and Romish , the Lord deliver us .

L. p. 299. I do indeed for my part ( leaving other men free to their own judgement ) acknowledge a possibility of salvation in the Roman Church . But so , as that which I grant to Romanists , is not as they are Romanists , but as they are Christians , that is , as they beleeve the Creed , and hold the Foundation Christ himselfe , not as they associate themselves wittingly and knowingly to the grosse superstitions of the Romish Church .

P. Now you speake a little more plaine , then before . But how do you leave other men free to their own judgement , when for not being of your judgement in this point , you cens●re them of stiffenesse , and churlishnesse , and want of Charity . And yet you your selfe say , that there is no possibility of Salvation for Romanists as they are Romanists . So as your judgement is , That Romanists , as , they are Romanists , have no possibility of Salvation . Ergo no Papist , as a Papist , living and dying in the faith and Religion of Popery , can possibly be saved . And just so say those Protestants whom you Censure for stiffe , churlish , and uncharitable . Onely you qualifie it with this Condition , If they wittingly and knowingly associate themselves to the grosse Superstition , of the Romish Church , so as still you save harmlesse your silly ignorant Papists , that know nothing at all , whether they doe and beleeve right , or wrong . And you distinguish , That , as Romanists , they cannot be saved , but as Christians , beleeving the Creed , and holding the foundation Christ . But we told you before , that your silly ignorant Papists do not so much as understand or know the very letter of the Creed , how much lesse beleeve it ? If they can mumble over their Creed as many a blind Priest doth his M●sse , 't is in a strange tongue , and they say it for one of their blind and superstitious Prayers , as they doe their Ave Marie . So , that way , what hope , or possibility can they have of salv●tion ? And for holding the foundation Christ : to that we have before sufficiently proved the Contrary . But say you they are Christians . So you say , they are Romanists too . As one telling the Emperour Sigismund of Iulianus the Cardinal , speaking somthing in his Commendation : he answered , Tamen Romanus est : yet he is a Romanist . And this Romanist is like the Colloquintida in the * * 2 Kin. 4.40 . pot of pottage , of which the young Prophets said to Elizeus , Ther 's death in the pot . Or like the ‡ ‡ Eccl. 10.1 . flye in the Apothecaries box of oyntment , it marres and corrupts the whole oyntment . And a man may say of your Roman Christians , or Christian Romanist ( which you will ) as one said of a wicked Prelate , who was also a Temporall Prince ( as you be ) when he gloryed of his greatnesse , as being both a Prelate , and a Prince , or Earle : What shalbecome of the Bishop , when the Earle is in hell ? So what shal become of your Romanist , as a Christian , when your Christian as a Romanist , is in hell ?

L. p. ibid I am willing to hope , there are many among them , which k●ep within the Church , and yet wish the Superstitions abolished , which they know , and which pray to God to forgive their errours in what they know not , and which hold the foundation firme , and live accordingly , and would have all things amended , that are amisse , were it in their power . And to such I dare not deny a possibility of Salvation , for that which is Christs in them , though they hazzard themselves extremely , by keeping so closse to that , which is Superstition , and in the case of Images comes too neare to Idolatry .

P. Your Hope and Charity may be much , but in this can doe but little . But 't is possible , that some may keep within the Confines of that Church-Dominions , and more powerfull Principality , and yet not be of that Church : as those seven thousand in Israel forementioned . Of such ( if any such there be ) we may well hope of their salvation : although they cannot live in those places , where Popery beares sway , but with much danger to their bodies and estates , and some to their soules too . As I perswade my selfe , for all your diligent Inquisition and hunting with your Hounds , Beagles , and Prosecutions , or ( if you will persecutions in your High Commission , and other spirituall Co●ts , there are many poore honest soules in England , that truly feare God , and abhorre your superstitions , and oppressions , but in regard of their bodies and estates cannot be but in dayly danger of falling into your Lyons denne , if but once detected . But for others , who are sensible of your Tyrannicall yoake , and groane under the burthens of your superstitions and Ceremonies , yet have not the heart , and courage of the spirit of Christ to with-draw their necks , but indure all your bondage , so they may injoy the fleshpots of Aegipt : however they may wish to be free , yet you know the Proverbe , Wishers and Woulders . And so of those in the Church of Rome : some Errours some may see , and be sensible of them , and wish them removed : but in the mean time , will they , nill they , they must undergoe them , and that even against their Conscience ; so as me thinks , this should somwhat abate and snibbe your willingnesse to hope of any possibility of salvation for such , as against their Conscience , and for worldly respects , live in known errour . Nor can he possibly avoyd it , so long as he lives in and of that Church . For as Solomon saith , * * Prov. 6.27 , 28 , 29. Can a man take fire in his bosome , and not be burnt ? Can one goe upon hot coales , and his feet not be burnt ? so who so toucheth a whorish woman , shall not be innocent . Now he that lives in and of the Romish Church , lives in the whores bosome , and is a ‡ ‡ 1 Cor. 6.16 . member of the whore . And perhaps many a one feeling how hot the bosome is , wisheth he were out of it ; but hath not the Power , being ( as Solomon saith ) plunged into a deep pit . ‡ ‡ Pro. 22.14 . The mouth of a strange Woman is a deep pit : he that is abhorred of the Lord , shall fall therin . And once in , 't is hard getting out . Nor all a mans wishing will doe it . But ( say you ) he prayes to God to forgive him his Errours , that he knows not . What then ? Is he the nearer salvation , when he still lives in the errour that he knows , and onely wisheth to be amended ? And doth not many a man live in a known sinne as whoredome , or drunkennesse , or the like , and being convinced of the foulenesse of it , and the many evils it brings upon him , wishes he could leave it , and prayes God to forgive him , and yet lives in it still ? Is he ever the neare to mercy ? Nay he is the further off , as being habituated and hardened in his sin , known sin , wherein he lives unpenitently . Wheras Solomon saith , § § Pro. 28.13 . He that confesseth , and forsaketh his sins , shall have mercy : But he that hideth his sins shall not prosper . And you here bring some Papist in , confessing the errours which he knows not , as praying God to forgive them : but never a word of his confessing and praying God to forgive those errours which he knows ▪ and wherein he lives . So here is a hiding of his known errours . But it were too grosse to bring him in , confessing , and deprecating God for his known errours , wherein he still liveth , and though he wish them amended in the Church of Rome , yet amends them not himselfe , nor doe you tell us , that he doth so much , as wish them amended in himselfe , and therfore you prudently forbeare the mention of any such thing , as his praying to have his known errours forgiven . For that should put a man into a desperate case , shuting him out of all hope and possibility of salvation , to mock God to his face ▪ in praying to have those Errours and sins forgiven him , in which against his Conscience he both liveth , and resolveth no other ( though he wisheth ) but to dye .

But yet ( say you such hold the foundation Christ . How ? As they that held him fast , when they crucified him . For such as live in known sin , and errour , they ( as the Apostle saith ) * crucifie to themselves the Son of God afresh , and put him to an open shame . Such holding of Christ , is not to hold him as a foundation , but to overthrow the foundation . For Christ dyed , not to hold to deliver us from the punishment of sin , but from the guilt and dominion of sin , by working in us Faith and Repentance . So as to professe Christ , and to want these , yea to live in known sin and errour , onely with a faint wishing of amendment , is not to hold the foundation Christ , but to make him a false foundation , as if he were a Saviour of such , as so live in known sin and errour , as they resolve no other , but to live and dye in it . And we have proved before , that Romes Religion quite overthrows the foundation Christ : so as none , living and dying in the Faith of that Church can be saved , and the more he knows it , and yet lives in it , the greater is his damnation , though he wish never so much to have the errour amended .

But you say , Christ hath a part in them . I answere with the Apostle , ‡ ‡ Heb. 6.6 . The Foundation of God stands sure , and hath this seale , The Lord knoweth them that are his : and ▪ let every one , that nameth the name of Christ , depart from iniquity . Loe , here be two things joyned together , which must not be parted : 1. The Lord knoweth who are his : here 's Gods foundation , layd in his Eternall Counsell and Purpose , according to that of the Apostle , O'ùs proégno , Whom he foreknew ( not foresaw ) he preaestinated to be conformed to the Image of his Son ▪ &c. Here 's Gods foundation , that stands sure , and hath this seale , The Lord knoweth who are his . Now they that are Christs , do so hold this foundation , as that they are firmly built upon it ; which is properly to hold the Foundation . For if a house stand not upon the foundation , how can it be said to hold the foundation ? Now how come we to know , whether a man doe thus truly hold the foundation Christ or no ? Why , if he be built upon this Foundation . And what is it to be built upon this Foundation ? The Apostle tells us ( which is the second part of this seale , that settles us upon this Foundation ) And , let every one , that nameth the name of Christ , depart from iniquity . Now to name the Name of Christ , is not to professe Christ , as nominall Christians , as Papists doe . To apply this then to your hopefull Papist , or Christian Romanist : He names the name of Christ , he professeth Christ . Thus say you ) he holds the Foundation Christ . No say I : No , saith the Apostle . For being a Roman-Christian , he professeth , he practiseth , he liveth in the Religion and faith of Rome , to wit , Popery ; and this Pop●ry is iniquity , yea the very Mystery of Iniquity , and the Religion of the Whore of Babylon , whose golden Cup of Christian Profession * * Revel. 17. is full of abominations , and spirituall fornications . This being iniquity , he that holds the foundation Christ , must depart from it : Or els , for all his naming the Name of Christ , he holds not the foundation of God ; nor doth God know or acknowledge that man to be one of his , he is not ‡ ‡ Revel. 7. ● . 4.6 & sealed . And therfore your hope of such , that are thus purblind , seeing their errour , but not departing from it , is as vaine , as your charity towards those , that are stone-blind . And you adde : Hold the Foundation , and live accordingly . That is , have the bare name of a Christian , and live and dye a Papist ; which to doe , you must needs confesse , cannot stand with the possibility of Salvation . And then what becomes of your hope ? For how can holding the foundation , and living accordingly stand with the profession and practise , Faith and Religion of Popery ? And know ye not , ‡ ‡ Mat. 7.21 . That not every one that saith , Lord , Lord , shall enter into the Kingdome of heaven , but he ( saith Christ ) that Doth the will of my Father , which is in heaven . And what is that will ? That every one that nameth the Name of Christ , depart from Iniquity . What Iniquity ? All Iniquity . But what is iniquity ? All iniquity is either morall , or spirituall . Morall iniquity is all that , which is a breach of any of the Commandements of the second Table , as murther , Adultery , theft , falsewitnesse , covetousnesse , lust , dis●bedience to Parents , and lawfull Governours in lawfull things , and the like . Spirituall iniquity , is such ▪ as is against the Commandements of the first Table , as Infidelity , hatred of the Truth , Idolatry , as in the worship of Images , will-worship , superstition in Gods worship , taking of Gods name in vaine , in professing Christ , and obeying Antichrist , profanation of the Lords Sabbath day , &c. Now all such iniquity , both morall , and spirituall , even all such * * Ephes. 6.12 . spirituall wickednesses in high places a true Christian must not onely wrestle against , but depart and flee from . Otherwise , though he shall say to Christ in that day , ‡ ‡ Mat. 7.22 . Lu. 13.26 , 27. Lord Lord , H●ve we not prophecied in thy Name , and in thy Name have cast out Devils , and in thy Name have done many wonderfull works ( as perhaps the Mountebank Friers and Priests will say of their ‡ ‡ 2 Thes. 2 lying wonders , the marks of Antichrist ) ( Loe here , all in Christs name , no lesse ) yet Christ will professe unto them , I never knew you , depart from me , ye workers of iniquity . Thus Christ professeth , he knows not those , that onely professe him . So as , whatever Papists may boast of , or pretend , and professe , that they are Catholicks , that they are Christians , that they hold the Creed , and live a Religious life , as their Ghostly Fathers teach them ( as we noted before ) yet living and dying Papists , Christ shall certainly say unto them all , aswell the starke blind , as the purblind , and aswell both these as the knowing men of Rome , Depart from me , all ye workers of Iniquity , ye Idolaters , ye Infidels , ye Antichristians , ye Hypocrites , ye blind and ignorant : I never knew you .

And you adde , They hazzard themselves extremely , by keeping so closse to that , which is superstition , and in the case of Images , comes too neare to Idolatry . Thus I perceive you will not rayse up your voyce one note higher , then to superstition , or at the most , too ●eare Idolatry . Not Idolatry outright , onely bordering closse upon it , too neare it God wote , as Purgatory is too neare hell , onely a Wainscot between , and how soon burnt down , and long ere now , with so hot a fire on both sides , so as 't is to be more then feared , Purgatory and Hell , by this time , are become both one , and so while your too neare Borderers upon Idolatry , your worshipers of Images , might hope to find some cold comfort , when they should be in their hot Purgatory , that by the vertue of a few Masses , they may quickly be dispatched thence , they find now such a confusion and mixture of Hell and Purgatory , that they cannot find the way out . And so neare Idolatry is your case of Images , that it is not possible for the subtilest Schoolman to distinguish between them , such is their not onely contiguity , but continuity , the Scripture calling an Image an Idol : cídolon , being in the Grammaticall and common construction an Image , and in the Ecclesiasticall use of the Word , any Image or Representation which men have devised to set up for a Religious use , as in or by it to worship God or Saint . And we have shewed before , that if the Heathen in the worship of ther Images were Idolaters : then how much more the Papists , which both in their Doctrine and Practise do farre outstrippe the Heathen . Nor in the case of Images alone , are Papists most grosse and desperate Idolaters , but also in the worship of their breaden God , and in their worship of Angels , and Invocation of Saints , making them so many Gods , as also the Crosse it selfe , which they both invocate , and worship with Latria , which they call divine worship ; as before .

L. p. 302. Worth once mislead , is of all other the greatest misleader .

P. And who of more worth in the account of some in the world , then your Lordship . If then this worth be misled ( as your Charity and Hope of misled Papists ) it becomes of all other the greatest misleader . For this worth is become the greatest misleader both of Papists and Protestants , both of the Church of Rome , and of the Church of England . And that the greatest too . And I am perswaded , the Church of England , since it professed the Gospell , never had such a monstrous and Bayeyard-like bold misleader , as this Great worth of Canterbury hath proved to be , or will certainly proove in effect , if it find as blind Disciples to deale witthall , as it selfe is a Master . Although it is much hoped , that if any Man hath conceived such an high Opinion of your worth , as to account you for the most Profound Divine , the most Pregnant Politician , and the most potent Champion of the Church of England , the very Reading of this your Book , with a corrected judgement , will either convert him from this errour , or at least prevent , that this errour of your Doctorship shall not Commence , or Proceed to the degree of Heresie

L. p. 303. 'T is safest to beleeue the Article of Christs Descent into hell , as both the Churches of England , and of Rome , do agree upon , that is , That he descended into the place of the damned . And this is the truth .

P. Surely , if this be the truth , that Christ descended locally into hell , the place of the damned , it were safest to beleeve it , whether you and Rome consent in the beliefe of it ▪ or no. But because you beleeve , as the Church of Rome beleeves , will you thereupon conclude , This is the truth ? Certainly we have the more cause to suspect that truth for a falshood , wherein you and Rome doe both agree . But how true your beliefe with Rome is , and how true this Truth , we have before sufficiently discovered . But will this hold for a good Rule , that in what you and Rome agree it is safest to beleeve it ? You agree in Altars , Priests , Sacrifice , all manner of wil-worship , Antichristianisme , and many things more forespecified : Ergo is 't safest to beleeve these things ? Or for whom safest ? safest for all those , that affect , to be of your Church Tryumphant here , and would not come under your persecution . But how agrees this with that which you adde ( ibid. ) that Rome will not indure this , that Christ descended into the place of the damned , but onely in Limbum Patrum , a Region in the upper part of Hell Ergo rather then faile , if Rome will not beleeve as you doe , That Christ discended into the place of the damned , you will beleeve as she beleeves , that he d●scended in Limbum Patrum . For agree you must : and that 's the safest beliefe .

L. p. 307. I my selfe have heard some Iesuites confesse , that in the Liturgie of the Church of England , ther 's no positive errour .

P. 'T is a signe then your Liturgie agrees pretty well with the Romish Messal , as is noted by the way before . For surely such a Testimony from a Jesuites mouth , gives us the more cause of suspicion , that all is not so well in your Liturgie , as it should be . As Diogenes sayd , when the people applauded him : he began to suspect himselfe , that he had committed some absurdity , or other , saying , Wherein have I miscarryed my selfe , that this people doth so commend me ?

L. p. 318. Though Dr. White , late Bishop of Ely , was more able to answere for himselfe , yet since he is now dead , and is thus drawn into this Discourse , I shall , as well as I can , doe him the right , which his learning and paines for the Church deserved . And I grant as well as he , that there must be some one Church or other , continually visible .

P. First , for Dr. White , he being now dead ( which he was long before ) I will say no more , but this : For his deserving pains for the Church ( the Church of England you meane , as now it stands , the same Church with that of Rome , and of the same Faith with her ; and of which Faith he also declared himselfe to be , when he told a Minister , that the Difference between the Church of Rome and of England in the Doctrines of the sixt Session of Trent , and by name , of Grace and Justification was little or nothing ) how great it was , his Works extant can witnesse ; as namely his Approbation prefixed to your now Brother of Chichester ; his Appeale to Caesar , wherein is maintained the whole Body of your Arminian Heresie , together in all , or most of the grossest points of Popery , as worship of Images at least with Doulia , and the like , and assaying to prove the Pope not to be Antichrist , as if he would solem è coelo tollere : also Dr. Whites Book of the Sabbath , to prove no Sabbath to Christians , and the fourth Commandement not to be Morall , for the keeping of one day in the weeke , as the Lords Day : allowing also of vaine sports , and profane pastimes on that Day : and commending of praying towards the East , where your Altar is placed , and such like stuffe : in all which he so well deserved of your Church of England , as he scarce had his fellow ; onely if he were now living againe , he would yeeld the Bucklers to your Lordship as the bravest Champion of the now Chuch of England that hath risen up in this latter Age , or yet succeeding times may hope to produce .

But let us now heare the right , which your Lordship does him , and which his paines for the Church deserved . But first ▪ let me tell you , you forget here to give him his Title of Lord Bishop , which you indeed gave him in the very first page of your Booke . But now his Lordship is dead let not Lord and Bishop be separated in any case , no not by death it selfe . For indeed Lord-Bishop is a peculiar Title , differencing you from all true Bishops indeed , as the Scripture commendeth for the onely Bishops , as is shewed before : yet I know not how it is come to passe , that in the best Reformed Churches beyound the Seas , the Pastors are never called Bishops . I suppose it is , because as Kings of old were stiled Tyranni , and that in melior●m partem , untill degenerating into Lawlesse Tyrants indeed , good Kings would thereupon never after be called Tiranni , but Kings : so the Reformed Churches , seeing how the name of Bishop gr●w to be odious , the Office and Calling of it being changed 〈◊〉 that of a Parochiall Pastor into a Diocesan Lordship , and so 〈◊〉 ▪ have for this cause layd aside the Name of Bishop , though otherwise the Name is good , as it pertaines to the true 〈◊〉 and Presbyters over particular Congregations , as is before sh●wed : so as the Reformed Churches doe herein as the Ancient Romans did , who when their Kings turned Tyrants , the l●st whe●of was Tarquinius surnamed Super●us , for his extreme 〈◊〉 ▪ they for ever banished both the name of Kings , and 〈◊〉 out of their Commonweale . But let us see , how you recompense the omission of this Lordly Title in this place , to such a well deserving man . You adde : And I grant , as well as he , that there 〈◊〉 be some one Church or other continually visible . A● well a● he . This then may seem to be some recompense , by way of honour , and 〈◊〉 some doing of him Right ( for indeed his main reward he had in his life time : and what he hath now I cannot tell ) that the Lords Grace of Canterbury is pleased to Grace the late Lord Bishop of Eli , by being of the same opinion with him . Well : what 's the Opinion ? That there must be some one Church or other continually visible ; That some one Church or other hath still been visible , I shall not grudge you . But take my meaning withall . Some false Church or other hath been ( though why must be , I see no reason ; saving that there * * 1 Cor. 11.19 must be Heresies even among the Churches of God ) continually visible , ever since the Apostles times . And the Church of Rome for Instance hath bore the bell away : which degenerating into an Antichristian Church , hath been still visible , though not alwayes in one and the same place , but most . What at Rome , and somtimes at Aninion in France ▪ ( for where the Popes Court is , there is the Church in its glorious conspicuity ) yet somtime without a Head , somtime with two Heads , somtime with three Heads , that a man might say , The Porter of Heaven-gates had three Heads , as the Poets fained Cerberus the Porter of Hell to have had . But for the true Church of God , that may somtimes be hid . For first ( as we shewed before ) there was no true Church visible among the revolted Ten Tribes . Secondly , not in ‡ ‡ 2 Chron 28. Ahaz his time , when he shut up the Temple ▪ and and served Idols in every Corner of Ierusalem ; and then where was the Church visible the while , when the whole publick service and worship of God was suppressed , the Temple being shut up . Againe , also in Ioah his time was the like , as ye may reade , 2 Chro. 24.17 . to 22 , &c. Lastly , when the Temple was burnt , and all the people of God dispersed Captives in Babylon , where they could ‡ ‡ Psalm . 137. not sing one song of Sion : Where was then the visible Church the while ? But you will say , They might have Synagogues in Babylon . But you cannot prove it . And the Prophet Esay saith , That § § Esa. 42.22 . they were hid in Prisons : As many of Christs deare servants are at this day in your Church of England . And what say you for that 30 dayes Interdiction , that no man should make any suit , to God or man during that space . Where was then the Church visible But that was but for 30 dayes . But you and Dr. White are for a continuall visibility . And it seems you herein jumpe with the Jesuites , who stand upon a continuall visibility every day , alledging that of Christ † † Mat. 28 20. And loe I am with you pa●as tàs e m●meras , which our English turnes , Allwayes , but they , * * Vulgar Latin , 〈◊〉 Di●r . All the dayes , to wit , everyday Which they doe , to puzzle Protestants in shewing their visible succession every day without fayle , since Christs time . But you will say perhaps Daniel was found praying in those dayes . But he was but one single Man , and so not Ecclesiâ , a Church or Congregation . And if he prayed with his Family , it was but in his private house , and you will hardly allow that for a visible Church , but rather call it a private Conventicle . And if with this Family , then ( if at least you had but sent your Pursuivants ) not onely Daniel , but ( according to the Kings strict Decree ) his whole Family should have been cast with him into the Lyons denne . So during the Aegyptian servitude , what conspicuity of a Church in Israel ? Now and then perhaps , in some godly Families , there might be two or three assembled . Yet this private still , visible you will not call it . For you will not allow Churches in private Families , though they * * Rom. 16.5 . were in the Apostles time . And such Churches ( so visible , as two or three are visible when you see them , but the world takes no notice of them as Churches ) Christ never fayles to have in the world . And these Congregations in private Families , being driven from your publick Idolatrous Superstition in your Churches , are so hid many times , that your blood-hounds cannot trace them , or hunt them out . But as for such a Conspicuous , Glorious , Visibility of succession of such Prelaticall Heads of Hierarchicall Churches , though such may be alwayes in some Countrey or other resplendent , eminent , and apparent , yet Christs poore Church the while may be , and commonly is hid , as little starres , especially where such great ‡ ‡ Mat. 13.6.21 ▪ Luminaria as your Lordships spread out your hot and fiery beames . As the Woman , the Church ( as before ; which here we recapitulate , to incounter two such Giants ) when she fled from the Dragon , and his flood of persecution into the Wildernesse , who saw her then and there ? And when the whole world was turned Arian , where was the true Church visible ? And so since Antichrist came to his Xenith , or Vereticall point , to his Meridian brightnesse , how hath Christs Church been hid in corners , as among the Merindolians , Cabriers , Waldensis , and others , who were still persecuted by that Beast , and his Crew . As Solomon saith , ‡ ‡ Pro. 28.28 . When the wicked rise , men hide themselves . And so we may truly say , When Prelates rise , and beare sway , and grow most resplendent and predominant in their Potent Principalities : then Gods people hide themselves . And the Apostle saith of the beleevers , in the Old Testament , in times of persecution , or captivity , or of the Maccabees . They wandred about in sheep-skins , and Goat-skins , being destitute , afflicted , and tormented , of whom the world was not worthey : they wandred in Deserts , and in mountains , and in dennes and caves of the earth And who were all those trow you , but the true Church of God ? And how was then the Church of God visible , but that one might see another . But such you will not allow to be visible Churches : 1. because you cannot see them : 2. because you do not allow to be Churches visible , no more then you do the Reformed Churches in Geneva , and among the Can●o●s , and those mountains , where you cannot see them ; which is their safety , as not to feele you . And where was the visibility of Gods true Church in England , in Queen Maries dayes , in the midst of the black tempest of persecution , where you could not discerne one true Professour and Protestant , but by the light of that fire , which was by the Prelates kindled to burn them for Martyrs ? Or if you , or your Beagles had hunted among the Woods , perhaps ye might have found halfe a dozen poore soules under some Tree shading them from the present heat of persecution , where they did solace their soules with having among them some few leaves of St. Pauls Epistles , which they read to strentghen and arme them against their ●urne came . Call you this a visible Church ? But you will say , The Church of England was then visible and conspicuous in the Bishops , and the publick Congregations throughout the Churches of the land , where Divine service , or Masse , was sung or sayd every day . Then was the Church visible in * * Bonner . Edmund of London , and ‡ ‡ Gardener . Stephen of Winchestr , and other their Associates , who were as Zealous Champions for the Church of England then , as you are now . So as that Church then ( as now ) was no lesse sensible , then visible , when sitting most conspicuous in their Courts they condemned Christs true Church for an Hereti●ke , delivering it over to the seculer power for a burnt sacrifice . And was not this that Church then , of which you tell us , when you say , Our Church was just there then , where Romes is n●w ? So as we need make no doubt , but your now conspicuous Church of England was one and the same with that in Mary●s dayes ; onely that Church by vertue of a Law , burned the Saints of God : and you without Law bury them quick You a●e all for a conspicuous visibility of a Prelaticall or Hierarchicall Church . But Christs true Church as before ) is otherwise : which hath for the Bishop of her soule , ‡ ‡ 1 Pet. 2.25 . the Lord Iesus Christ , who is no Non Resident Bishop , but perpetually resident and present with all his Congregations . Yea § § Mat. 15.20 . where but two or three are ass●m●led in his Name , there is He in the midst of them . He saith not In a Cathedrall , or other Church ; but indefinitely , Wheresoever : as in a Chamber , in a private room , * * Act. 1. ●3 . as the Apostles were for feare of the High Priests . During which time , where was the conspicuous visibility of the true Church , untill the day of Penticost came , when there was a new Church coll●ctive of ‡ ‡ Act. 2. all nations under heaven ? Againe , Christ saith not , Where there is a multitude : but , Where two or three : nor assembled , in a Prel●t●s name as members of a Prelaticall Church , but , In may Name saith Christ ) in the faith of me , according to my word : then and there am I in the midst of them , to rule and protect , as King , to teach as Prophet , as Priest to present their persons and sacrifices to my Father . These , these are those Churches or Congregations , which you scorne and scoffe at , and which you persecute and punish as ●alefactors for so assembling , as where Christ is present among them : which plainly bewrayes your selves to be the false Church , which you say must be continually visible

L. p. 320. A Church may hold the Fundamentall point literally , and as long as it stay●s there , be without controwle , and yet erre grosly , dangerously , nay damnably in the exposition of it . And this is the Church of Romes case . For most true it is , it hath in all Ages maintained the Faith unchanged in the expression of the Articles thems●lves : but it hath in the exposition both of Creeds and Councels quite changed and lost both the sense and meaning of some of them . So the Faith is in many things changed both for life , and beliefe , and yet seems the same . Now that which deceives the world is , that because the barke is the same , men thinke this old decayed tree is as sound , as it was at first , and not wether-beaten in any age . But when they can make me beleeve , that painting is true beauty . I le beleeve too , that Rome is not onely sound , but beautifull .

P. First here I must note the perplexed and confused frame of your first sentence . You say , A Church may hold th● fundamentall point literally , and as long as it stayes there , be without controwle , and yet erre grosly , dangerously , nay damnably in the exposition of it . As much as if you had sayd , That a Church may hold the fundamentall point literally , and erre grosly , dangerously , nay damnably in the exposition of it , and yet be without Controwle . As for , As long as it stayes there , namely in holding the fundamentall point literall● ▪ how is it without controwle , when notwithstanding the holding of the letter , it erre grosly , dangerously , nay damnably in the exposition of it ? For you joyne and jumble all together , the holding of the letter , and the overthrowing of the sense , and yet want controwle . And what 's the letter , where the sense is lost ? What 's the barke , when the pith and marrow is gone ? As I●rome saith , Gods word standeth , non in verborum cortice , sed in medulla sententiarum : not in the barke of words , but in the pith of the sense . Well : And this is Romes case , say you . How ? Most true it is ( say you ) that it hath in all ages maintained the faith unchanged in the expression of the Articles themselves : but it hath in the exposition both of Creeds and Councels , quite changed and lost the sense , and meaning of some of them . So the faith is in many things changed both for life and beliefe , and yet seems the same . Here againe do you not most pittifully enterfere ? Faith is lost in the exposition , and yet kept in the expression of the Articles . Have not you lost sense in this expression , except you can recover it by a better exposition ? For you separate the expression from the exposition . So you leave the Articles as a dead carcase , without a soule . For there is no faith kept in the expression of the letter , without the true exposition of the sense . And if the sense be lost , the faith is lost . And what expression of faith doe you call that , which is abstracted from the sence ? But Rome hath lost the sense but of some of them . Of which ? And whether of Creeds or Councels ? For here you shuffle both together too , as making Councels of equall Authority with the Creeds . I did not thinke before this ( nor yet ) that Councels Decrees are to be taken as Creeds . Onely I might have learned of you before , That Councels Decrees , though they be erronious , must bind all to obedience : and then sure , they are little inferiour to Creeds : saving that those may be reversed by another Generall Councel , but these not .

But however , Rome is the same barke of a Church still . Ergo a true Church still . Why , the Barke is not the Tree : no more then a Sheep-skin is a Sheep No , nor yet hath Rome so much as the barke of the true Church of Christ left . Looke upon her outward hew and habit : and there we shall find nothing , but the habitements of the * * Revel. 17.3 , 4 , 5 , 6. great Whore , and the Ensignes of Antichrist with his Church Malignant , warring against the true Spouse , and Church of Christ . And both these we find in that one Chapter , where the Woman is set out to the life Her Habilements : She fits upon a scarlet coloured Beast , full of Names of Blasphemy , having seven Heads and Ten Hornes , and she is arayed in purple and scarlet colour , and decked with gold , and precious stone , and Pearle , having a golden Cup in her hand , full of abominations , and filthinesse of her fornications : with a Label on her forehead to know her the Better , a Name written , Mystery , Babylon the Great , the Mother of Harlots and abominations of the Earth : and she is drunken with the blood of the Saints . And a little after we see her Ensignes set up , and those be her ten Hornes , the power of Kings , which she instigateth to * * ver. 14.17 . make warre with the Lamb , and those on his side , the Called , and Chosen , and Faithfull . Now the Whores habit is not the habit of Christs Spouse . This is not the barke of the weather-beaten Tree of Gods Church ▪ whose outward beauty is ‡ ‡ Cant. 1.5 , 6. black , but inwardly is ‡ ‡ Esay . 6.13 . glorious , outwardly blasted as an § § Dan ▪ 4.11 ▪ 12 &c. Iude. 12. Oake , but the holy seed is the substance thereof . And if by black you understand the bare name of a Church , and profession of Christianity : That she hath changed too , as the Snake doth her skin slipping off the old , and taking on a new . For she is not content to be called Christs holy Church , but the Roman Catholicke Church . Whereas Christs Church is not denominated from any place . And as she is the Roman Church , so the Papall Church , being denominated from the Pope as her Head . Ergo none of Christs Church ; for this acknowledgeth none for her Head , but Christ alone , who is the root of this Vine , and Olive Tree , that ministers sap and fatnesse unto it . If therfore Rome be any Tree at all , she is such , as is in Daniel , the Embleme of the Old Babylonian Tyranny and so a Type of Romes Babylonish usurped Power : § That Tree stretched out its boughs over the whole Earth , under whose shadow all the Beasts must have their sanctuary , as Rome applyeth , that of the Psalme 8.6 , 7. And is this Tree ( say you ) but wether-beaten ? Or but in some things unsound ? When it hath lost not onely the barke , but the pith of Christs Church ; being all rotten within ? Being such a Tree , as Iude describes , déndron phthinoporinòn akarpon , dìs apothanòn , a corrupt Tree without fruit , twice dead , and to be hewed down , plucked up by the roots , and cast into the fire . So as Rome is altogether naught , Intus & incute , Pith and Barke , Root and Branch , Fruit and Leafe . Onely a painted Tree , by which painting ( as you say ) she deceives the world , and your Lordship too , while you would be glad to take her with all faults , and be reconciled to her , takeing her painting for true beauty , or at the least on her outside more beauty , then painting , and in her inside more soundesse , then corruption . For you say , In some things onely , both for life , and beliefe corrupted .

L. p. 321. Dr. White sayd onely , that some Errours of the Church were fundamentall reductive , that is , if they which imbrace them , did pertinaciously adhere to them , having sufficient meanes of Information . And againe expresly , That none were damnable , so long as they were not held against Conscience .

P. Thus we come to know Dr. Whites judgement , and therein yours also . But against you both , as erronious in this point , I alledge the Scripture . What saith Christ of the Pharisees . * * Mat. 15.14 . Let them alone , They are blind leaders of the blind : and if the blind lead the blind , they both fall into the ditch . So you may see here ( if ye be not blind ) that blindnesse is damnable . But you will say , This was obstinate blindnesse , fighting against the light , 'T is true , that the blindnesse of the Pharisees was obstinate , against the cleare light , and their own Consciences : but the blind people whom they led , were simply blind , out of meere ignorance , and so not against their Conscience : and yet both the leader and the led , fall into the ditch of damnation He that drinks deadly poyson ignorantly perisheth , as he that wittingly drinks it . The poyson is in it selfe mortall to all that drinke it , with what mind soever they doe it . And such is the poyson of sin and errour . Onely he that erres of ignorance , is more easily recovered , then one that is obstinate in his errour : and both , living and dying in the same errour , as of infidelity , and the like ( which all Popery is ) both are tormented in hell , but the obstinate more then the other : yet God is just in punishing both . So as all errour is damnable in all , but in some more , in some lesse . And it is of the same righteous judgement of God to deny to the ignorant means , and to others the right use of the means , by withholding his grace : and accordingly he is just in punishing all with a due proportion . And so ther 's a difference between simple Papists living in the midst of the Aegyptian darknesse , where there is no light , nor meanes of knowledge , and simple Papists living in Goshen , where the light shineth where the Gospell is preached , and doe close their eyes wilfully , so as they obstinately refuse to see or heare ▪ The sin of these certainly is much more damnable , then of the other , who have no meanes at all ▪ Againe , Errours that are in their own nature damnable , are damnable in whomsoever they be , onely in some more , in some lesse , but we cannot say , they are to some damnable , and to others not damnable . All sinne in its owne nature is damnable , and brings damnation with it to every Mothers son : is it then damnable to some , and not to others ? ‡ ‡ Rom. 5.12 . Did not death come upon all men , in asmuch as all men had sinned ? And is not Errour whether in life , or beliefe , whether in the ignorant , or men of knowledge , sinne ? Thus you and Dr. White mazzle ignorants in sinne . And if the blind lead the blind , both shall fall into the pit . But enough of this .

L. p. 32● . I would faine soe any one point maintained by the Church of England , that can be proved to depart from the Foundation .

P. Would you see it againe ? We have proved it before , and that abundantly , that you maintain not one , but sundry points , wherein you depart from the foundation . Look before , and you shall see how you depart from the Foundation in your Tyrannicall Hierarchy or Prelacie , in your Altars , in overthrowing the Doctrines of Grace , in destroying the Doctrine and Practise of the 4 th Commandement in sanctifying the Lords day , in forbidding Meates and Marriage at certaine times , which the Apostle calls directly and expresly a departing from the Faith , and Doctrines of Devils . Look backe , and see .

L. p. ibid. There is a latitude in the faith , especially in reference to different mens salvation . To set bounds to this , and strictly to define it for particular men . Iust thus farre you must beleeve in every particular , or incurre damnation , is no worke for my pen.

P. For the ground of this your speech , you quote Bellarmine in the Margent . I thought you raked it out of some puddle , seeing the Fou●taine it selfe , the Scripture , affords you no such corrupt stuffe . Nay more then that , you expresse your selfe in farre worse termes , then Bellarmine doth For Bellarmines words , which you quote , are these , Multa sunt de fide , quae non sunt absolutè necessaria and salutem : There be many things of Faith ▪ which are not absolutely necessary to salvation . But you bring it down to every mans salvation , as if some things of faith were more absolutely necessary for some mens salvation , then for others . I passe by Bellarmine , and insist upon your own words , leaving him to cleare himselfe , There is ( say you ) a latitude of faith , especially in reference to different mens Salvation O● saving and justifying faith , you must meane , no question : For what faith is necessary for every mans salvation , but the saving faith , which comprehends in it whatsoever faith is requisite and necessary to salvation , as the beliefe of Scripture to be the word of God ▪ as is shewed before . And this saving faith is the faith of all them , that are * * Heb. ● . ●4 ▪ heires of salvation , to wit , of all Gods ‡ ‡ Tit. 1.1 . Elect , and all the ‡ ‡ Iude 3. Saints . But it seems with Father Bellarmine you have an Implicit faith for your ignorants , and an Explicit for you that are great Clerks : or the letter of the Creed for those , and the sense for these . But I handled this also before . Onely you propound a Paradox , which is no worke for your pen ; wherein you are the wiser not to take upon you to read or expound such riddles , had you been so wise , as not to have propounded ● . And yet it is the worke of every good Minister of Chr●●t to teach the people what to beleeve , and to exhort them to grow in Grace ▪ and knowledge , and Faith , and so * * Col. 2.7 . Phil. 1.9 . Act. 20. 2 Tim. 2. 2 Pet. 1. Heb. 6.1 . &c. declare unto them the whole Coun●el of God , and to keep nothing backe , and to build men up in knowledge more and more unto perfection . As the Preacher saith ‡ ‡ Eccles. 12.9.10.11 . Because the Preacher was wise , he still taught the people knowledge , yea he gave good heed , and sought out , and set in Order many Proverbs , The Preacher sought to find out acceptable words ▪ and that which was written , was upright , even words of truth . The words of the wise are a● Goads and Nayles fastened by the Masters of Assemblies , which are given from one shepheard . But this is not a patterne for you to follow , neither by your tongue , nor pen. You have other imployment for them . But though we cannot set a bound to faith , in respect of perfection of degrees , yet we ought to teach the people all the parts of saving faith and knowledge , striving unto perfection . And besides it is the duty of every good Minister of Christ , to limit and set bounds to all the negatives of faith , in discovering all manner of sins and errours , which are all contrary , and enemies to faith and salvation . For which end , they must open all the ten Commandements , as Christ did Mat. 5. and all other points of saving Doctrine , in the Scriptures . Now though you have not the skill or will to set bounds how farre men shall beleeve : yet you want no will , nor power to inhibit and restraine Preachers , shewing them how little a way they must goe in teaching the people , and so consequently how little a way the people must goe in beleeving and saving knowledge : as in restraining and forbidding to preach the Doctrines of Grace ( as before ) forbidding Lectures , and especially all Sermon● on the Lords day afternoon , forbidding long Preaching at any time , forbidding expounding of the Catethisme , as many of your Prelates doe , and the like . Thus you can finely set men bounds how little thy shall beleeve , or know of God to their salvation . That 's a worke , if not for your pen , or hand , yet for your head , and not unlikely of your hand and pen too .

L. p. 327. The Romanists dare not beleeve , but as the Roman Church beleeves . And the Roman Church at this day doth not beleeve the Scripture , and the Creeds in the sense , in the which the ancient Primitive Church received them .

P Dare they not ? How then say you there is possibility of salvation in the Roman Church for any , when it condemneth and accurseth saving faith and justification thereby , with other saving truths ? For if the Papists dare not beleeve , but as their Church beleeves , then they are bound to good behaviour , they dare not beleeve to their salvation . And if they dare not beleeve to their salvation , then they cannot be saved . And if they cannot be saved , what possibility of salvation for them , living and dying in that faith ? And here , Why do you no● say in the sense of the Scriptures themselves , and not of the Primitive Church ? But you doe not like the Scripture sense , except the Church interpret it . You allow not Scriptures to speake for , or testifie for themselves . You are the same man still . And as we sayd before , you doe wisely in that , to stoppe the mouth of Scripture , as Ahab did Michaiahs , for it never speaks good of you , but evil alwayes .

L. p. 232. I will acknowledge every fundamentall point of faith , as proveable out of the Canon , as we account it , as if the Apochryphall were added unto it .

P. As if Apocryphalls were any divine proofe at all of the fundamentall points of faith in Scripture , or ought any way in that respect to be so much as named with the Scripture . Apocryphalls ( saith Ierome ) may be read for instruction of manners , but not for confirmation of faith , as before .

L. p. 336. I have lived , and shall ( God-willing ) dye in that faith of Christ , as it was professed in the ancient Primitive Church and as it is professed in the present Church of England .

P. As you handle the matter , ther 's a vast difference between the faith of Christ professed in the ancient Primitive Church , and that which is now professed in the present Church of England . For the Ancient Primitive Church , taken properly and strictly , as somtime in your Booke ( as before ) you put it , was that wherein the Apostles lived . Now will ye be tryed by the Ancient Primitive Church of the Apostles held and professed ? What say you my Lord , for your faith in this case ? Will you put your faith and Religion to the tryall of the most intire and upright J●ry , the Twelve Apostles ? Certainly if you decline this tryall , 't is a shrewd suspicion that the faith of yours , wherein you are so resolute to live and dye , is not right . Therfore for shame of the world , you must at least professe or pretend , that you wil be tryed by the the Faith and Religion which the Apostles and the true Church of God in their time ( as being the most Pure , Prime , Ancient Primitive Church ) held and professed . First then : That Primitive Church neither held nor professed , nor practised any Hierarchicall government of Prelates or Bishops , but have c●ndemned it in their writings , the Scriptures of the New Testament . And yet I ▪ are say , you resolve to live and dye Primate of Canterbury , and Metropolitan of all England . Secondly , The Apostles , and the ancient Primitive Church in their Age and time , had no Altars , but onely the Lord Iesus Christ , Heb. 13.10 . ( as it is formerly proved ) but you and your Church of England both set up and worship Altars , and ●each the people both by your Books and practise to do so too , and force Ministers to erect Altars , or force them out of their Churches . And this Faith and Religion also I dare say you resolve to live and dye in . Thirdly , The Apostles , and the ancici●nt Primiti●e Church in their time celebrated and sanctified every Lords day in holy duties onely , and in preaching as well in the * * Cor. 16 1. Ioh. ●0 . 19 , 26. Act. 20. ● . Rev 1.10 . afternoon , as in the f●●enoon , never forbidding , but still exhorting to preach in season and out of season , giving no liberty to vaine and profane sports and Pastimes either upon that day , or any other day , but admonishing Christians to abhore them as ‡ ‡ Gal. 5.21 . ● Pet. 4.3 . Ro. 13.13 , 14. Heathenish : and is this the faith and practise of the present Church of England at this day , wherein you resolve to live and dye ? Fourthly , The Apostles and ancient Primitive Church in their dayes taught , held , and professed all chose excellent saving Doctrines of Election , Predestination , Redemption of the Elect , their Effectuall vocation and conversation by Gods saving and Omnipotent Grace , their assurance of Salvation by Faith , and their certaine perseverance in Grace unto Glory ; and none of these Doctrines were forbid to Ministers to be preached ; but they were commanded of God to declare the whole Councel of God to his people . Is this your faith and practise of the Church of England , wherein you resolve to live and dye ? Fiftly , The Apostles and the ancient Primitive Church in their dayes , taught , professed , and practised that Discipline , which was according to Christ , forbidding all w●ll-worship , and imposition of humane Ordinances , as snares upon mens Consciences , whereby that Christian liberty is overthrowne , which Christ purchased for his people with his own blood . Is this the Faith , which you and the present Church of England professeth and practiseth , and wherein you resolve to live and dye ? Sixtly , The Apostles and the ancient Primitive Church in their time condemned the forbidding of Marriage and of Meates , as a Doctrine of Devils , taught by seducing sp●ri●s , and a departing from the faith of Christ Is this that faith and Religion , which you and the present Church of England hold , professe , and practise , and wherein you resolve to live and dye ? O ye Prelates , O thou Church of England , blush , and be ashamed of that Faith , Profession and Practise of yours , so 〈◊〉 contrary to that Faith which the holy Apostles taught , and that pure and Primitive Church in their times imbraced , and professed : and be not so desperately bent , as being so clearly convinced of these thy foule practises , to professe and vow notwithstanding to live and dye in them : least herein , your condition prove ( as it must doe ) infinitly more desperate and damnable , then that of the Jesuites themselves , whose knowledge ( by your own confession ) of their wicked and damnable F●●ours , with their obstinate persisting in them , and res●sting the truth , yea even the Holy Ghosts Testimony therein , leaves them , as without excuse , so without all hope of salvation , as to whom nothing remaines ( as the Apostle upon the like occasion , saith ) but * * H●b . 〈…〉 . H●● . 6.4 , 5 , ● ▪ 8. a fearefull expectation of Iudgement , and of fiery indignation , which shall devour the Adversaries .

L. p. 338. Yea , but he saith againe , That I acknowledge there is but one Saving Faith , and that the Lady might be saved in the Roman Faith , which was all the Iesuite tooke upon his soule . Why but i● this be all , I will confesse it againe . The first , that there is but one Faith , I confesse with St. Paul , Eph. 4. And the other , That the Lady might be saved in the Roman faith or Church I confesse with that Charity which St. Paul teacheth me , namely , to leave all men , especially the weaker sex and sort , which hold the foundation , to stand or fall to their own Master , Rom. 14.4 . And this is no mistaken Charity .

P. This you confesse , that as there is but one saving faith , so this faith is in the Church of Rome , The saving faith not in the Church of Rome as in and by which the Lady may be saved . And of this one faith with the Church of Rome , you and your Church of England are , if you hope to be saved with Rome by her saving faith . This is the All and summe of your Confession . Now we have clearly proved before , that the faith of the Church of Rome , is not that one saving faith of Gods Saints and Elect , which the Scripture every where speaks of . For first Romes faith is in its kind and nature ( and that by their own confession ) a dead faith : but the saving faith is a ‡ ‡ Gal. 2 ▪ 20 ▪ living faith . Secondly , they confesse , that with their faith they may goe to hell , as they say of their Fid●les Fornicarii , Adulteri , &c. therfore Romes faith is no saving faith : for the saving faith is so called , because it effectually , perfectly and certainly saveth all those that have it , as Christ saith , Joh. 5.24 . Thirdly , The Romish ●aith , is a doubting , wavering , uncertaine faith , or ra●her opinion● and wan hope , as the Councel of Trent defineth , accu●sing certain●y of beleeving : whereas the saving faith is a certain● assurance , and cleare ‡ ‡ Heb. 11 ▪ ● ▪ evidence , a plerophoria as Heb 10.22 . Rom. 4 . 21.● a full assurance or perswasi●n in the truth of beleeving , though not in fullnesse of degrees of perfection in all , and at all times , the operation of it being many times hindered by corruptions , and infirmities of the flesh , and manifold temptations . Fourthly , Romes faith , is , and may be without hope and charity : but true saving faith is never without hope and charity ; for it is the sure * * Heb 11.1 . foundation of things hoped for , and it ‡ ‡ Gal 6. worketh by Love . Fifty , The Roman faith is not the Iustifying faith , for the ‡ ‡ Sess. 6. Councel of Trent saith , Faith justifieth not , till Hope and Charity come to it , and then all 3 together , and that as inherent Graces , and works in us , do justifie : whereas true saving faith is therfore called the Iustifying faith , because it is that onely Grace , whereby as an Instrument applying Christ and his righteousnesse , and not as works in us , the beleeving sinner is justified , Rom. 3.28 . so as though this saving justifying faith be never without hope and charity , no more then fire is without light and heat : yet hope and charity have no hand at all with faith in justification ; so as not even faith it selfe as it is a Grace inherent , with hope and charity , doth justifie , but onely as it is considered as a hand or instrument applying Christ , as before . But the Roman Faith ( as the Councel of Trent confesseth ) justifieth not as an instrument or hand applying Christ , whereby his Righteousnesse is of God imputed to the beleever ( which Imputation the Councel in plain termes accurseth ) but onely as a Grace and worke inherent with hope and charity . Sixtly , saving faith is not onely a justifying faith , whereby we stand righteous in Gods sight , having Christs Righteousnesse imputed : but also a sanctifying faith , as Act. 26.18 . called therfore a holy Faith , Jude 20. as wherby a man is regenerate , borne againe , made a member of Christ , and partaker of his Spirit , and lives and dyes in holinesse : but the Roman Faith doth not sanctifie ; for they confesse , that wicked , ungodly , and profane persons may have it ▪ and goe to hell with it , as before . Lastly , saving and justifying faith is a spirituall worke and gift of Grace , wrought in the soule by the spirit of God , and it is his sole worke , without the concurrence or mans Will , which is not free , untill Grace hath given it both life and freedome : but the Roman Faith is confessed by them in the Councel of Trent , not to be a meere worke of Grace , nor at all of sanctifying and saving Grace , in the first act of beleeving : but after the Will of man is but a little stirred and moved by a certaine Grace , which they call the first Grace , which they confesse not to be the saving and sanctifying Grace , then thereupon they have the merit of Congruity to receive the second Grace , whereby hope and charity come to be added to faith . And this is the expresse Doctrine of Trent . The Conclusion then is , That neither the Lady , nor any Papist living and dying in the Roman Faith , nor your selfe , nor any in the Church of England , that hold and professe no other Faith , then the Roman Faith , can possibly be saved , living and dying in that Faith and though you tell us againe with great confidence , as a most certaine Truth , that it is no mistaken Charity to grant a 〈◊〉 of salvation to a Papist living and dying in the Roman Faith : yet we have so discovered this your Charity before , as I Hope your Charity wil be no more so mistaken . Onely here I must tell you withall , that as you either wilfully , or most ignorantly and 〈◊〉 rather , mistake that one saving faith of the Apostle : so doe you also that Charity , which you say he teacheth you . Doth the Apostle teach you such a Charity , as teacheth you to beleeve and affirme that , which is contrary to the cleare Truth of the Scripture ? is it your Charity to attribute a saving faith to the Church of Rome , which without all Charity accurseth the onely true faith , and the truly faithfull of Iesus Christ , which professe that onely saving faith ? Whereas you must know , that Charity , which the Apostle there teacheth ( Rom. 14.4 . alledged by you ) is in judgeing Charitably of your Brethren , in the use of things indifferent ▪ For there the Apostle speaks of eating , or not eating : of observing a day , or not observing : whereupon he inferreth , Who art thou , that judgest anothers servant . To his own Master he standeth or falleth ; so as in such cases Christians must judge Charitably , and not rashly censure others , that do not as themselves doe , in things simply indifferent . This is then the Charity , which there the Apostle teacheth . But have you learned this Charity of the Apostle ? You tell us , This Charity the Apostle teacheth me . The Apostle teacheth you true Charity : but it doth not thereupon follow , that you have learned that Charity of the Apostle . Doe you deale so with your Brethren in the use of things indifferent , as not to judge them this way , or that way ▪ in the using , or not using of them ? Doe you leave them to their own Master Christ ▪ to stand or fall ? Nay do you not cause them necessarily to fall by the stumbling blocks of your Ceremonies , which you say , are things indifferent , and yet you impose such a necessity upon the observation of them , as they altogether cease to be indifferent , and become a y●ake of bondage to the People of God ? And if they be so strong that they will not thus fall down to your Ceremonies , no more then the 3 Children would to the Kings Image : what then ? What Charity use you then towards them ? Doe you leave them to their own Master to stand or fall ? Not such thing . But you take upon you to be ther Master and Lord , and to be their Judge , and to Judge them , while sitting in your High Commission Chaire , you convent them , censure them , as by Susp●nding , Silencing , Depriving , Degrading , Dispossessing , or Fining , Imprisoning , undoing of their wives and children , and without all hope of remedy , or mercy from you , till they shall acknowledge the Justice , yea and perhaps the Clemencie of your Court in dealling so mercifully with them . This , This is that Charity which you have learned , and which you dayly put in practise , so as in this kind , never any was more zealously and fervently Charitable , then your selfe . But this Charity you never learned of the Apostles , nor did he ▪ or Christ , or any of the Apostles ever teach you any such Charity . No sure , This wisdome , This Charity of yours ( as Iames speakes ) cometh not from above , but is Earthly , sensuall ▪ and Divelih . If you have no other Charity but this , the Lord deliver us from your Charity . And so I leave you to your mistaken Charity . Onely for Conclusion hereof : Immediately before you tell us , you will dye , as you live in that faith professed in the Church of Engdand . Here you say , Rome holds the same faith : Ergo as you live so you will dye in the Roman faith ▪ And secondly , Ergo The Faith of the Church of England and of Rome is one and the same Faith : as before you tell us they are one and the same Church : and at after ( as pag. 3●7 ) they are of one and the same Religion , not different . Thus you have made a fine Confusion : and this you meane to make your finall Conclusion . Such is your Faith : such your Religion : such your Charity : all mistaken . The foulest , and fearefullest mistaken , that ever any man was overtaken with .

L. p. 339. The truth is you doe hold new Devises of your own , which the Primitive Church was never acquainted with . And some of those so farre from being conformable , as that they are * * Halting and 〈◊〉 . little lesse , then contradictory to Scripture .

P. And is it not as true , that in holding new devises , which the the Primitive Church ( of which we spake but now ) was never acquainted with , you may shake hands with Rome and her Jesuites ? who may therfore retort upon you that of the Poet , Parcius ista viris tamen objicienda memento , Novimus et qui te : Be sparing such things to us to object : Who know the like do on your selfe reflect . And we have shewed before , how both Romes new devises , and yours ( for they are all one and the same ) are not onely ( as you still mince the matter ) little lesse then contradictory to Scripture : but doe directly overthrow the cleare and evident truth 〈…〉 , and that also even in fundamentalls . And what say you to Romes new-old devise of worshiping Images ( to instance in no more , though I might in many , yea in all Romes Popish Doctrines , as Popish ; as before ) is it but little lesse then contradictory to Scripture ? Doth not the Scripture say , Thou shalt not worship any graven Image ? And what saith Rome , I pray you ? Or if you , or she , for modesty sake will not tell us ; or if she dare not say in plain and expresse termes , and in form of a Precept , Thou shalt worship Images : yet aske her whorish practises , and her pretty devises , wherewith she allures her children to the adoration of them , and that even to dotage , as by promising them pre●ty lakons , and new-nothings , as pardon of sins for so many yeares for praying so many Avies and Pater nosters before such a 〈◊〉 , or Image : is not this Equipollent to a Commandement ? yea their very setting up , and ad●ring these their ga● Gods in their Churches , the place of worship , is it not an inviting and silent whispering in the Peoples eares , worship and fall down before these sacred Images and Reliques , giving them the same honour , that you give to the Saints , which they represent , as divine honour to the Crosse , and Crucifix , as they teach , as we have shewed . Is not here a full and home contradiction to the Scripture ? * * Contradiction what it is . For Contradiction is not onely in an expresse Negative , but in an impi●●● Negation , when such and such a Doctrine doth necessarily imply a contradiction to the Scripture . And in this kind all the Doctrines of Popery ( whereof we have given sundry Instances before ) are direct contradictions to the truth of the Scriptures .

L. p. 340. It doth not follow , since the Councel of Trent hath added a new Creed , that this Roman faith is now the Catholick ▪ Halting againe . For it hath added extravea , things without the foundation , disputable , if not false Conclusions to the Faith . So that now a man may beleeve the whole and intire Catholicke faith , even as St. Athanasi●● requires , and yet justy refuse for Dr●sse , a great part of that , which is now the Roman faith .

P. Is it so then ? Hath the Councel of Trent added a new Creed , and so Roman faith is not now the Catholicke , but to be refused as drosse , extraveous , false , without the foundation ? How then doth this agree with that faith , which even now you confessed ; that the Church of Rome had and hath the saving Faith , that One Faith of the Apostles , as whereby a Papist , living and dying in that Faith , may be saved ? And if Rome hath added a new Creed , how holds she still that one Faith ? Prelates Contradiction . And do not you beleeve Romes new Creed ? For what is this Creed ? That the Roman faith is now the Catholicke . How is this then a new Creed , That Romes faith is now the Catholicke ? For ( say you ) it hath added extravious things , without the foundation , Disputable , if not false conclusions to the Faith . Is this all ? Par●urient M●ntes . I expected here some monstrous evidence against the Church of Rome , when you began to tell us she had brought forth a new Creed . But this your Rumor will not be taken for a Creed , without some sounder proofe , then we see you yet bring , for all your faire florish . For what 's this new Creed ? Alas , a poore Cento patcht up of certaine extravious things . What ? without the Foundation . Good enough yet , so long as n● Canon against the Foundation , or a mine of Powder to blow up the foundation . Onely without the foundation ? Alas , that 's not worth the talking of . If the new Creed be of things onely without the foundation , you may leave them out of your Creed , as things not necessary to be beleeved , or at least , not to be beleeved of all Christians , alike ; as you teach us before , and Bellarmine too , that All things de fide are not necessary to be beleeved of all men , or are not necessary to salvation . And perhaps Bellarmine means Romes new Creed you speak of , which though the Councel of Trent hath made it to be de fide , yet it is not necessary for every man to beleeve it , or not absolutely necessary for every mans salvation . But what more ? 2. Disputable . As you sayd before ; Disputed Qu●stions . Disputed , and Disputable still : Ergo what can you make o● such a Creed at the worst , but some disputable matter , not yet sufficiently discussed , though determined in the Councel of Trent , and sit perhaps to be reserved to be determined upon some clearer demonstrations in your next Generall Councel , whose Decrees then , true or false , shall be received as your Creed . And ( as we said before ) things Disputable may yet prove to be truth , being throughly scanned : and thus Romes ne●● Creed may prove as Credible , as you call it disputable . But any more yet ? yes : if not false conclusions . If ? Which receiving a faire interpretation from your mouth , may be all one , as if you had said , N●t false Conclusions , because as yet Disputable . And while things are but disputable , and in dispute , they are as yet no false Conclusions . For the Premisses of the Argument must goe before the Conclusion . But yet your Conclusion is somwhat 〈◊〉 . For you say , A man may beleeve the whole and intire Catholick faith , and yet justly refuse for drosse a great part of that , which is now the Roman faith . What ? Drosse ? And , Ius●ly refu●e as Drosse ? What , are you that man , that may doe thus ▪ And will you doe thus ? Nay , you for your part have bound your hands from taking any thing as drosse , which Rome hath put in her new Creed . For those things , even the worst of them , you say are disputable . Therfore not yet concluded and determined for Drosse . And if you shall now take those things for drosse , which with you are but disputable , how can you justly doe it : For if mettall be in dispute among the r●siners , it is not presently doomed for drosse , being yet in their best judgements but disputable : the Test must first try it , whether it be drosse or not . And so it is the Test ▪ or the Testaments of Christ , that must try all false mettals , shine they never so gold like , and discover and condemne them for Drosse . And surely my Lord your single judgement ( through never so singular ) will never be taken by any , as solid enough to preponderate the Decrees of a whole Councel , as Trent , to conclude those Decrees to be Drosse , both after you have called them but disputable , and after Rome hath Decreed them for her new Creed . But you goe no further yet , then Posse : a man may take them , &c. And you may in time come actually to take those disputables for no Drosse , but good Currant Coine , not onely passing for Currant in Rome , but also in England , as holding the same Creed , and being one Church . So as a little more Allay then Ordininary shall not disable the currantnesse of it . And what is there in all Romes new Creed of Trent , which you say is of things Disputable , which is any worse drosse , but rather as good silver , as those her Altars and o●her superstitions , which you have borrowed of her ? Which were they but soundly disputed , would prove drosse indeed , as formerly also is proved .

Againe , here you confine the whole and intire Catholicke faith to Athanasius his Creed You might have at least taken in the other two Creeds to boot : and yet not all of them together will make up the adequate Rule of the whole and intire Catholicke faith . For the Catholicke faiths full latitude , whole and intire , cannot be measured , but by the line and Rule of Scri●ture alone , The onely * * R●m . 6 ▪ 1● ▪ túpos did●kus as the Apostle ca●ls 〈◊〉 the Matrix or Mold , wherein faith must be cast 〈◊〉 ) to receive its perfect forme ▪ which is not , cann●● be whole , and intire , but as it is according to the whole and 〈◊〉 Scripture conformed And you adde :

Popish faith infi●ility , by the Prelates confession . L. p. 3●2 . No man can properly be said to beleeve the whole Creed , that beleeves not the whole sense , as well as the letter of it , and as intirely .

P. Now you told us before , that Rome hath lost the sense of the Creed , at least in some things : whence I conclude , upon your own words , that Rome holds not , beleeves not the whole Creed , and consequently she hath lost and overthrown the whole Creed . For overthrowing the sense of any one Articl● , she overthrows the whole ; as before . And in a word , the Church of Rome overthrows the whole Creed , in overthrowing the first word of it , Credo , I beleeve : which gives denomination , life , and beeing to the whole . And a maine flaw in the foundation , overthrows the whole building . And that Rome doth this , is cleare : for , as she hath made a new Creed all of drosse : so she hath coyned a new sense to the Credo of the old Creed . For she doth not beleeve the Creed with a saving , justifying , lively faith ( as is shewed before ) but hath cancelled and accursed it in her Councel of Trent . And so though she hold Credo Deum , beleeving that there is a God , as even the Heathen doe ( for quae gens tam barbara , Ci● de Natu●a Deorum . &c. what nation so barbarous , that beleeves not there is a God ; as the heathen Roman Orator sayd ) yet she doth not hold any other Creed of God . For she holds not simply and absolutely ( no more then you ) Credo Deo , beleeving God speaking in the Scripture , but dependently upon the Authority and Interpretation of the Church . And least of all doth she hold Credo in Deum , which is the justifying and saving Faith , as Augustine , Bernard , and others of the more Ancients distinguish and define . Augu●t . Bernard . For as Bernard saith , Credere in Deum , est credendo diligere , credendo in eum ire , & ei uniri , &c. To beleeve in God is by beleeving to love God , by beleeving to goe into him , and to be united unto him . Now this faith Romes is not : for ( as is shewed before out o● the Councel of Trent ) their faith is without love ▪ and doth not goe into God , but with which going to hell , they are separate from God for evermore . So as the Article or Decree of Trent having destroyed the old Credo in Deum , she must have some new Credo , or els none at all . And you doe ibid. rightly interpret the word V●g●ès , which Athanasius expresseth the ●ustif●i●g faith of the Creed by , namely sound and intire : so as if it be not a sound and intire faith , such as the Scripture commends , and is proper to all true Beleevers , the Elect , a 〈…〉 is to no purpose . And a little after you say :

〈…〉 This is true Divinity that he which hopes for salvation , 〈…〉 whole Creed , and in the right sense too ( if he be able to 〈…〉 it . )

P. Till this If , hem'd in with a Parenthesis , I was halfe in hope you had assented to my former speech , That the Church of Rome in not holding the right sense of the Creed , overthr●ws the wh●le . But your Parenthesis so hedgeth in your silly ignorant , that it is a sanctuary to secure their ignorance from R●m●s damnation ; so as though they have no hope of salvation , yet they are in no feare of Romes damnation , as being not able to beleeve the whole Creed , because not able to comprehend the right sense of it within the narrow circumference of their shallow brainpan . But behold closse by another hedge :

L. p. 343. To hold the Creed inviolate , is not ( as I take it● the holding of the true sense , but not to offer violence , or a forced se●se and meaning upon the Creed , which every man doth not , that yet beleeves it not a true sense . For not to beleeve the true sense of the Creed , is one thing : but 't is quite another , to force a wrong sense upon it .

P. Thus still the Lady , and all silly ignorant Papists , if ever by their blindnesse they shall happen to stumble upon salvation , trusting to the meere simplicity of their ignorance , living and dying in the Roman faith , not knowing what it is , nor able to beleeve any one Article of the Creed in a right sense : may thank you , for thus incouraging them upon this hope of possibility of an impossible salvation . And the case stands thus : The Church of Rome in her Councel of Trent hath put a forced sense upon the Creed , and so hath made a violation of the faith : This forced sense Romes Clergie in the Catechisme of Trent forceth and presseth upon their blind people to beleeve : Now tell me , What difference is there between the forcing of a false sense upon the Creed , which the Councel of Trent hath done , and all Romes Clergy conveys the false sense ( if any at all ) as ●ank poyson into the minds of their Blindlings , so farre as they are capable of any errour ( being capable of nothing els ) and the voluntary receiving and imbracing of that false sense , and that not onely in beleeving it , but so obstinately adhereing to it , as they will not , they dare not ( as you befo●e confesse beleeve otherwise , though the truth be tendered unto him : which is the generall condition of all ignorant Papists . And being in this case , what way now can you find out for them , which may bring these misbeleevers ; or rather no-beleever , to salvation . What hope can you give them , that have no faith ? And what faith can they have , that cannot bel●eve , that cannot , may not , dare not , have no meanes , to comprehend the r●ght sence of the Creed , but the forced sense that Rome puts upon it and them ?

L. p. 349. As for Origen , I thinke , he was the first founder of Purgatory

P. This here of Purgatory bordering so neere your last Passage of your misbeleeving Papists , gives me occasion to imagine how necessary it were for you to be the first Inventer of some other place in hell , like unto that Limbus Infantum , where provision may be made to intertaine your silly Infant-Papists , that are not able to give any one reason of that hope of salvation , which you force upon them , and which you have been the first inventer of . That as Popish Infants dying without Baptisme , goe to their Limbus , where they are sensible neither of joy , nor paine : so your silly ignorants , having no sense of any true faith and knowledge of God , or of themselves here , when they dye , they may goe to such a like place or Limbus , where they may neither injoy blisse , nor suffer paine . But a word of Purgatory in the mean time . For the first Founder of it , in my poore reading I find the Heathen * * Plato in Timaeo . Plato . For he tells us , as of 3 sorts of men in this world , some very good , and some starke nought , and some indifferent : so he fits 3 places for these 3 sorts after this life : 1 ▪ Elysium , the Elysian fields , meaning thereby a place of pleasure , as , Paradise , into which went those immediately , who were very good : 2. Hell , whither the very worst went : 3. a middle place , or lake , into which the moderate or indifferent men were cast after death , and after a certaine time there , as a yeare , or two , or more , as they were lesse or more good or bad , being well purged , were cast forth againe , Whence they went into the Elysian fields . And Virgil also , a heathen Roman Poet , did afterwards take and borrow this from Plato , expressing it in his Aeneads . And so from these two might Origen borrow his Purgatory , and the Church of Rome from them all three , might out of this lake of Plato , or Pluto if you will , borrow so much Bitumen , or Pitchy matter , and so casting into it the stone Asbestos , which being once kindled , is not quenched againe , it became the hot-burning lake of Purgatory , as namely for the purging of Indifferent men , such as are neither hot nor cold : neither Beleevers , nor Infidels : neither Christians , nor Heathen : neither good fish , nor flesh : Indifferent between Papists and Protestants : halfe for Christ , and halfe or rather All for Belial : Reconcilers of light and darknesse : of Truth and Errour : or ( as the Papists say ) such as had onely veniall sinnes , not throughly purged with holy-water in this life , and therfore must be purged with fire , what water could not doe , untill after a Venal Masse chanted for their soules , they should be delivered , and so passe the Pikes into the El●sian Fields . And this is both Authority and Antiquity sufficient for your Purgatory , though you bestow much sweat in this hot Stove , and in pursuing this Ignis fatuus , yet haply it may purge you● Reputation of that venial opinion , which men have of you .

L. p. 375. Rome , but with all other particular Churches , and no more then other Patriarchall Churches , was and is radix existentiae , the root of the Churches existence And , The uni●ersall Nature and Beeing of the Church , hath no actuall ●xistence in all her particulars . And this I say for her existence onely , not the purity or forme of her existence , which is not here considered .

P. These words confirm what you have said before of your Catholicke Church , consisting of particular Patriarchall , Prelaticall , or Hierarchicall Churches throughout the world , all of them visible , and conspicuous ; in these it existeth as in the root : this existence may be without the consideration of purity , as a Church may be a true Church of Christ , and yet not be holy . Having then answered these things before , it is sufficient for this . And this still confirmes what I have said of Christs true and onely holy Catholick Church , which is a matter of faith in the Creed . This true and onely holy Catholick Militant Church of Christ hath for its prime Radix , or Root Christ , in whom it existetth , subsisteth , and hath its beeing . Then it is diffused into all the members of Christs mysticall body , all the Elect , over the world , or in any corner thereof , to the end of the world , and hath no existence at all in the Hierarchy , or Prelacie , or in any one visible Church , or particular place , or Countrey , but it lyes hid , as the sappe in the root , in all the Persons of the Elect onely , and the substance and * * Col. 3. life thereof is hid with Christ in God , the ‡ ‡ Rom. 11. Prime root . And the existence of this Catholicke Church cannot be considered possibly , without Purity , and Holinesse ▪ for it exists no where , but in purity and holynesse : so as every person is holy , in whom it existeth : And so much for this .

L. p. 370 , 371. But if she be not the Catholicke , nor the root of the Catholicke Church , yet Apostolick I hope she is ▪ Indeed Apostolicke she is , as being the sea of one , and he a Prime Apostle . But then not Apostolicke , as the Church is called in the Creed , from the Apostles , no nor the onely Apostolicke . Visible , I may not deny , God hath hitherto preserved her , but for a better end doubtlesse then they turne it to .

The Church of Rome indeed Apostolicke ? Why so ? As being the sea of one , and he a prime Apostle That was Peter you mean sure . He was a Prime Apostle , though not the Prime . 〈◊〉 somtimes Iames is placed before him , Gal. 2.9 . And Paul was no whit inferiour to those 3. Iames , Peter , and Iohn , who were Pillars , and seemed to be somwhat . And in this respect may you not possibly meane Paul , rather then Peter : for Paul ( we are sure ) was in Rome , and there preached , though in prison . But we read no where in Scripture , that Peter was at Rome , much lesse that he sate there Bishop of Rome , and so fixed his Chaire there . If therfore you mean Peter , and pitch upon him ( though the Popes are faine to use somtimes two strings to their bow , and to challenge their succession both from Peter and Paul , and some stories speake both of Peter and Paul , as Bishops there . ) I say if you pitch upon Peter , how doe you prove that Peter was at Rome : and if at Rome , whether Bishop there : and if a Bishop there , why consequently must that Sea be still Apostolicke , O'uk e'n te Kathédra ea proedria , all' e'n to●s e'rgois . Herodian . lib. 1. seeing non sedes , sed fides , not the seat , but the Faith makes Apostolicke . But there be many reasons and arguments from Scripture , some that Peter was not at Rome , others , and those more demonstrative , that he was never Bishop of Rome , as Pontifex , or Prelate , such a Bishop as you meane . I have seen a Booke Printed in English by Authority , which proveth that Peter was never at Rome . And this he doth by computing and comparing the times and other Circumstances in the Acts , and Pauls Epistles with those Histories , which say he was there , and Bishop there , which stories neither agree with the Scripture , nor with themselves , nor with other Histories profane . And if Peter were at Rome , how cometh it , that Paul being there , doth not in all his Epistles make mention of him ? Was Peter either so obscure , as Paul should not know him to be at Rome ? Or so proud of his new Prelacie , as not to acknowledge his fellow Apostle , now a Prisoner ? Or what was it , that Paul doth not so much as mention him ? Because Peter , being for the Circumcision , Allotrioepiskopein . 1. Pet. 4.15 . should a'llotrtoepiskopoin , take Pauls Bishoprick over his head , who was for the Uncircumcision , whereof Rome was the Metopolis ? Or had Peter with Demas forsaken Paul ; imbracing this present world in a Lordly Bishopricke ? But let it be given you , that Peter was at Rome , and Lord Bishop of Rome : what then ? Ergo is the Church of Rome indeed Apostolicke ? Did Peter leave his Apostolick Bishopricke by an Intayle ●o all his successors in Rome ? Are ●hey Apostolicke , when they are become Apostates from the faith ? Alas , alas : your words utter your spirit , but no truth Onely one thing you deliver , as doubtlesse , where you say , Visible I may not deny , God hath hitherto preserved her , but for a better end doubtlesse , then they turne it to : Visible : Ergo the Pope is Peters successor : Ergo the sea of Rome is indeed Apostolicke : Ergo a true Church of Christ . For visible it is . Revel. 17. It is indeed that visible and conspicuous City on its seven tops or hils ( whereon it stood in Iohns time and now that Woman , that sits and rides mounted on her seven-headed , ten-horned Beast . Visible with a witnesse , otherwise all her pompe would loose the Grace , if it wanted spectators , as her Scarlet , and Purple , and Pearle , and Precious stones , metà polles phantasías , with her great pompe . Visible no question , and so visible , and sensible too , as otherwise we could not know her to be the Great Whore . Thus she was shewed first to Iohn in a visible representation , by which we also come to know her to be the same Woman , when we doe but looke upon her . Well , visible we all grant her to be . What more ? God hath hitherto preserved her . That 's true too . For even the wickedest men upon earth , and the most Tyrannicall states , that they are for a time , yea and a long time too preserved in life , and doe prosper also they owe it to God . But to what end are the wicked preserved ? Their finall * * 2 Pet. 2.9 . Phil 3.19 . end is destruction , to which they are r●served , as Peter speaks , and Paul too . Cain and his Posterity ( whose Family was a type of Antichrists succession ) continued and were preserved , and grew great , for almost two thousand yeares , till at last the Flood swept them all away . But of Rome you have better hopes , doubtlesse . Gen. 6. For you say God hath preserved her for a better end doubtlesse , then they have turned it to . Now doubtlesse I will shew you what that better is , for which God hath hitherto preserved that Woman , which hath been made drunke with the blood of the Saints . ‡ ‡ 2 Thes 2.8 ▪ Whom ( saith the Apostle ) the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth , and shall destroy with the brightnesse of his coming And Rev. 14.8 . Babylon is fallen , is fallen , that great City , because she made all Nations drinke of the wine of the wrath of her fornication . And Rev. 18. read the whole Chap●er of Romes ruine . Yea and all that partake with Rome , shall drinke of the wine of the wrath of God , &c. Rev. 14 9 ▪ 10. What the Scripture hath spoken of Romes fall , would fill a Volume . And is not this the best end , that God is pleased to preserve her for , when he shal be glorified in executing his justice and judgements upon her for all her abominations , and for all the blood of his Saints which she hath shed ? And in her confusion God will magnifie and exalt the Honour , and Kingdome of Iesus Christ , which tha● Woman and her Crew had oppressed , and the Saints shall tryumph over her . Yea , saith the Lord , * * Rev. 18.20 . Rejoyce over her thou heaven , and the holy Apostles and Prophets ; for God hath avenged you on her . And Chap. 19.1 , 2. I heard ( saith Iohn ) a great voyce of much people in heaven ( that is , in the true Church of Christ ) saying , Alleluja , salvation , and Glory , and Honour , and Power unto the Lord our God : For true and righteous are his Iudgements , for he hath judged the great Whore , which did corrupt the Earth with her fornication , and hath avenged the blood of his servants at her hand . Behold here for what a glorious end , the Lord hath preserved that Great Whore . But it seemeth you do not mean to make one of that Company , either to sing Alleluja , or to say Amen , when the Lord shal be magnified in that day . For you hope doubtlesse for better , then all this . And so I am perswaded you have the like hopes , that God hath preserved and prospered you thus long for no lesse , then to be after scores of yeares in a flourishing estate here , Canonized for a Saint in heaven , for all the blood of the Saints , both of their soules and bodies , which you have shed . Wherein you may have as much hope for your selfe , as for old Mother Rome , and all one . But I leave you to the Righteous Judge , who knows how and when to glorify himselfe , as well upon the wicked his enemies , by destruction , as in his own Saints and servants by deliverance . ‡ ‡ Rev. 14.12 . Here is the Patience of the Saints .

L. p. 375. Truly I say the same thing with him . Neither may a Protestant , that is resolved in Conscience that the profession of the true faith is in the Church of England goe to the Romish Church , there and in that manner to serve and worship God .

P. Thus you jumpe with the Jesuite in this , that , as he saith , 'T is not lawfull for one affected , as the Lady was , that is , for one that is resolved of the truth of the Roman Church , to goe to the Church of England , there and in that manner to serve and worship God : so , &c. Why , will you let the Jesuite run away with it so ? Do you not know that the Law of England injoynes all Papists under penalty to come to your Church ? Now doth the Law injoyne that , which in it selfe is unlawfull for a man to doe , that is otherwise resolved in Conscience ? Nor is this Law repeald , though ( as before ) it be a ●leep , and grown justly in the sheath . Now reconcile these two . And what say you then in the Case of Conscience touching your Ceremonies ? There be some Ceremonies ▪ which the Law prescribes to be observed in your Church . Now a poore soule is not in Conscience perswaded , that he ought to conforme to such Ceremonies of necessity imposed , as being ag●inst Christian ●●●erty , and Christs Prerogative royall , in being sole King over his Church , ruling in the Conscience of his People . Well you say , in this case such a man is bound against his Conscience to observe such Ceremonies ? And if he be not bound , why doe you so severely and terribly punish him , for not daring to doe that , which is against his Conscience ? Wheras the Papist , otherwise resolved in Conscience , you hold not bound to come to your English Church . And so of your Protestant , for going to the Romish Church , being against his Conscience . Will you not allow to the Conscience of the first as good Law , as you doe to the two last ? Againe , you allow a greater and larger liberty of Conscience to your Protestant to go to the Romish Church , then the Jesuite doth to his Romanist , to come to your English Church . For he allows not his Romanist to come to your English Church , that is resolved in Conscience of the truth of the Roman Church , that it is a true Church , and that the truth is there : whereas you doe not allow your Protestant to goe to the Romish Church , that is onely resolved in Conscience , that the profession of the truth is in the Church of England Now there is great difference between the truth , and the profession of the truth . So as he that is resoled in Conscience , that the truth is onely professed in the Church of England , and is not withall resolved , that the truth it selfe is in the Church of England , may with more liberty goe to the Romish Church , then the Romanist may come to yours , that is resolved of the truth of and in the Romish Church . So as herein also the Jesuite hath the advantage of you . Againe , if the Jesuite did meane , by the truth of the Roman Church the profession of the truth in that Church , he therein comes no whit behind you . For the Church of Rome as well makes a false profession of the truth , as your Prelaticall Church of England doth . Againe , you make it no great matter of difference in this case between your Protestant and the Romanist , whither this or that goe to each others Church , so his Conscience put not a barre . As you tell us a little after , That the Church of Rome , and the Protestants , do not set up a different Religion ▪ Of which in its place . And here also you put no difference , but that the Romanist doth as well serve and worship God , after his Roman manner in his Idolatrous Masse , as your Protestant doth after your English manner . And perhaps the difference will not be found so great between you , but that you will well enough agree , when you have cast up your reckoning . But now , what if one of your simple Protestants , be not resolved in Conscience of the profession of the truth in the Church of England , more then of that in the Church of Rome ? Is it not then lawfull for him to goe to the Romish Masse ? With ●ou it seems so , so his Conscience hinder him not . And what Conscience hath your ignorant Protestant to hinder him in this case ? Nay , I will say more : What knowing Protestant have you at this day in the present Church of England , since the publishing of your Declaration before the 39 ▪ Articles ( which makes some of the principall of them to beare a double and contrary sense ) that is , or can be resolved in his Conscience , that either the true faith , or so much as the Profession of the true faith , is in the Church of England ? For those Articles , which containe the Doctrine of your Church , you confesse to be ambiguous , and doubtfull , and doe not resolve either way , but leave your Church in suspense : how then can any Protestant of the Church of England be resolved in Conscience , that the Profession of the true faith is in the Church of England , when neither your selfe seems to be resolved , or at least you doe not resolve your Church concerning your Articles what to beleeve ? Which being so , may you not fairely hence conclude , that it is lawfull for any Protestant of the Church of Engdaud to goe to the Romish Church , there and in that manner to serve and worship God untill he shal be resolved in his Conscience , that the profession of the true faith is in the Church of England : which resolution is not like to be , till your Lordship hath resolved them , which is the true and orthodox sense of your Articles , and that by a publicke ed●ct athenticke , and every way equall to the former ; as in the case of Generall Councels , when the errours of one must be obeyed , till another , equall to that , shall reverse it . As before . But in the meane time , unlesse you make the more hast with your Edict for Resolution , your whole Church of England is now at liberty to goe to Masse and so to turne Romanist , as having nothing to restrain them ( were there but Masses enough to intertaine them , as no doubt there be Priests enough for the purpose , had they but Churches ( so long as their Conscience is not resolved of the profession of the true faith in the Church of England . And so the Broad Gates are set upon for the Consummation of your so much wished and plotted Reconcliation with the Church of Rome . And you adde :

L. p 376. Nor do the Church of Rome , and the Protestants set u● a different Religion ( f●r th● Christian Religion is the same to both ) but they differ in the same Religion : and the difference is in certaine gr●ss● corruptions , to the very indangering of salvation , which each side s●y●s the other is guilty of .

P. By Protestants here , 't is plain enough you mean those of the Church of England , not those of the Reformed Churches beyond the Seas , I am sure of it . For they utterly renounce the Romish Religion and Faith as Antichristian , which you avow for Christian , the same with yours . But they differ ( say you ) in the same Religion . How ? They do not set up a different Religion , and yet they differ in the same Religion ? I understand not this Babylonish language . But wherein then doe they differ in the same , and undiffering Religion ? In some certaine grosse corruptions , say you . But in some , not in all grosse corruptions , which are indifferent , and common to you both . And what grosse corruptions are common to both , those shall not be put in the reckoning of corruptions at all , each covering other with the mantle of Charity . Yea such as you both agree in , are the very substance of your Religion . And the whole substance of the Romish , yea of all Christian Religion ( saith Bellarmine ) is the Masse . This then must be That same undiffering Christian Religion , which you both set up . And herein how much doe you dister ? Have you not both your Altars , the main substance , on the service whereof all the rest attend , as your Priests , Sacrifice , Images , Crucifixes , Adorations , Organs , curious musicke , and many other devises for your pompous service , your Liturgie differing more in the language , then in the matter and forme ? But you will say you differ in Transustantiation . Yet you are willing to have a reall Presence confessed ▪ and professed with you , as is noted before . But you say , the difference is in certaine grosse corruptions indangering salvation . On which side ? Each side ( say you ) charges other . I have heard two butter women scold , and each layd to other grievous things , and the one said , Thou playdst the whore , and the other sayd , Thou playdst the whore . Which of these ( trow you ) was the honester Woman ? She haply that had lesse playd the whore , then the other , which perhaps was not for want of will , but opportunity . You and Rome charge each other with grosse corruptions , which yet , are one and the same in both . Doth not thus the shame of both the more appeare ? Your grosse corruptions on both sides can agree well enough , if you can be quiet . Yea and that to the indangering of Salvation too . For have you not ( to be silent in the rest ) both your Altars , which are alone sufficient to sacrifice upon all your faith and salvation , and so to leave you neither faith nor salvation in Christ , as whom also you sacrifice thereon , together with your faith and salvation ? For we shewed before , that your Altars doe overthrow and deny Iesus Christ the onely Altar of true beleevers ▪ If then you both doe agree in the grossest corruptions , as those whereby your salvation is not onely indangered , but destroyed , which is the maine of your Religion wherin you differ not : what need there be any oddes between you for the rest ? Both sides complain of each other , both have their corruptions , and grosse ones too , such as overthrow salvation . Then let your conscious ingenuity confesse to each other , and your conscientious Charity * * Det veniam ille facile , cui ven●a opus . Senec. pardon each other . And so let the world be troubled no more with your Differences , but be good friends , and agree as sisters .

L. p. ibid. It may appeare by all the former Discourses , to any Indifferent Reader , that Religion , as it is professed in the Church of England , is nearest of any Church now in Beeing to the Primitive Church . Therfore not a Religion known to be false . And thus I both doe , and can prove , were not the deafnesse of the Aspe upon the eares of seduced Christians in all humane and divided Parties whatsoever .

P. You doe wisely to put it to the judgement of the indifferent Reader , who unlesse he be a most indifferent man between your Church of England , and that of Rome , and so undifferent from you both in judgement and affection , to whom this which you say shall appeare to be true . For no such thing can appeare to any Reader , that is not so affected , as to beleeve your bare word , so soon as ever it sounds in his eare , or whose eyes doe not looke through the false glasse of your Perspective . Indeed you have proved to all men sufficiently both by this your Discourse , and by your Practises , that you and Rome do not set up a different Religion . We all beleeve it . And consequently we beleeve , that herein you come full as neare to the Primitive Church as Rome doth , alwayes excepted Romes lineall Pedegree from Peter ; and you know you are a Degree once removed . And how neare you both come to the Primitive Church of the Apostles especially , the primest and purest , we have before shewed sufficiently . And if you come nearest , who ( I pray you ) are furthest off ? Surely the most pious , the most religious , the most zealous , the most painfull and faithfull preachers of the Gospel , the greatest contemners of the world , the most humble and meeke , the most patient in suffering persecution for the truth , the most pure and precise in their life and conversation , the most exact conformist to the onely Rule of Faith and true Religion , the word of God ; such as are not ambitious , covetous , carnall , and worldly minded , envious , malicious , cruel , haters and persecuters of Gods word , of his Ministers and people : Such , such ( I say ) must be furthest off from the Doctrine and practise of the Apostles , and of the most pure and Primitive Church in their time , if you the Prelates and Churches of England and Rome come the nearest unto them .

L. p. 377. But is there no superstition in Adoration of Images ? None , in Invocation of Saints ? Se Pag. 27● . None in Adoration of the Sacrament ?

P. Yes : and grosse Heathenish Idolatry too , yea and infidelity to boote ; though you would mince it never so small into a matter of superstition onely . And may not I say to you : But is there no superstition , yea no Idol●try , in your Adoration of Altars ? ( yea and worse then that of the Papis●s : for they worship their God , you the Altar . ) None , in your Adoration of the Name IESVS ? None , in bowing before your Crucifixes over your Altars ? No inducement at least to Idolatry in your goodly Images erected in your Churches ? No 〈◊〉 smell of Popish superstition and Idolatry in y●ur Adorations in the presence of such Im●ge● ? The * * Sinag●g● 〈◊〉 . Iewes would not ●o much as stoop to tye the latchet of their shooe in the place , where an Image was , least their bowing might seem to be to the Image . And who knoweth , with what mind you do your humble and lowly D●votion before such sacred Reliques ? And ( to summe up all together ) is there no superstion , yea no Idolatry in all that will-worship of yours , and of the Church of Rome , attended with so many Rites and Ceremonies of mans invention ? For what is all Will-worship , but Idolatry , yea and the highest kind of Idolatry ? As Vincentius saith : ‡ ‡ V●ncent . 〈…〉 Haer. What are strange Gods , but strange errours , for that Hereticks reverence their Opinions no lesse , then the Gentiles doe their Gods ? And ‡ ‡ Aug. De 〈…〉 . C. 83. Augustine saith : It is the vilest and 〈◊〉 kind of Idolatry , when m●n worship their own fancies , observing that for a Religion , which their erronious and swelling minds imagine . Thus we see ( § § Dr Bilst●n . as a learned Divine of the Church of England , and of great Eminencie said ) that a corrupt and vicious Religion ( such as Popery is , and such as you have made yours of the Church of England , Will worship 〈…〉 of 〈◊〉 . not a different Religion ▪ 〈◊〉 an inward and ghostly worship of Idols , which ( saith he ) Prince ought not to 〈◊〉 at , or tolerate , seeing no man , and therfore no Prince can 〈◊〉 two Masters . For ( saith he ) if God be truth , they which presume to worship him with lyes ( as in contrary faith must needs come to passe ) serve now not God , but the Devil , a lyer himselfe , and the fa●her of 〈◊〉 , whose service no Christian Prince may so much as 〈◊〉 ▪ so he ▪ Thus our Divines of the Church of England in former ages shall 〈◊〉 up as witnesses to condemn you in the day of Judgement , who teach and maintain things contrary to that truth , which they delivered .

L. p. 378. What not prove any superstition , any errour at Rome , but by pride , and that intolerable . Truly I would to God A.C. saw my heart , and all the pride that lodgeth in it .

P. This you speake to A.C. as to a Jesuite , or some Frier , or some Priest . All is one : such a one being a Ghostly Father , you may safely sub sigillo Conf●ssionis , or sub stola , under the seale of Confession , or under the Friers frocke , under the Rose ( as we say ) open the windows of your Brest , and let him look in , and view all the Roomes , and corners of your heart , to see what pride hath taken up her lodging there ; and so the world shal be never a whi● the wiser for it . But you need not to wish any such thing . The pride of your heart cannot so easily be hid , as that you need wish , with Momus , if there were a glasse window in your Brest , for men to look in and see it , much lesse a subtile prying Jesuite . Alas , though the glaring light of it blind your own eyes , that you cannot see it your selfe : yet any other , that is but purblind , may through the Glasse , or spectacles of this your Book see the monstrous multiformious shape of it , had they not seen it before expressed in the Capitall Characters of your most insolent , and all daring practises . And that you yet see it not , there is not a more infallible argument or signe of a more monstrous proud heart , which is ever selfe blinded But look to it . What saith * * Ier. 17.10.11 . Ieremie ? The heart is deceitfull above all things , and desperately wicked : who can know it ? I the Lord search the heart , and try the reynes , even to give every man according to his wayes , and according to the fruit of his doing●s

L. p. 379. I hope God hath given the Lady mercy .

P. Namely , that same Lady , who formerly had been either brought unto , or confirmed in that Romish Religion , by that which you resolved her in , namely , That she might be saved , living and dying in the Roman faith and Religion ; wherein it seems , as she lived , so she dyed . Now truly my Lord , If God did give her mercy , it is little God hamercy to you . But what ground have you for this your hope ? Even as much , as for giving her hope , that she might be saved , living and dying in the Roman faith . Is it so easie trow you to send such a Lady to heaven securely wrapped in the Mantle-lap of her silly ignorance ? But what if she be now in hell ? Are not you guilty of her damnation , by muzzling her in her blind ignorance , as wherein onely you taught her to place the hope of her salvation ? But you told her of some danger But you did not possesse her with such a feare of the danger ( as both there was cause , and you should have done ) as you puffed her up with the hope of safety , and that in the onely confidence of her silly ignorance ; so as her vain hope overcame just feare . And if now by this meanes she be in hell ( as you set her in the ready high way ) look you to it ; Paries cum proximus ard●t , Tunc tua res ●gitur : if she by your leading be fallen into the pit , what is like to befall you the leader when , the blind , leading the blind , both fall into the pit ? But if God hath had mercy on her , it was not since her death , by delivering her out of Purgatory , i● she dyed a Papist : but before her death , by delivering her from her Popery , worse then any Purgatory , causing her to renounce and repent of that , and to beleeve in his mercy , and Christs merit onely for salv●tion , without which faith of Christ ●here is no hope of mercy And we shewed before , that this faith of Christ is not the Roman faith , but quite opposit unto it .

L. p. ●88 . But 't is time to end , especially for me , that have so many things of weight lying upon me , and disabling me from these Polem●ck ●isccurses ; besides the burthen of sixty five yeares compleat , which draw on a pace to the period set by the Prophet David , Psal. ●0 . and to the Time , that I must goe , and give God and Christ an account of the Talent committed to my Charge ; in which God , for Christ Iesus sake , be mercifull to me , who knows , that however in many weaknesses , yet I have with a faithfull and single heart ( bound to 〈◊〉 free Grace for it ) laboured the meeting the blessed meeting of Truth and Peace in his Church , and which God in his own good time , will ( I hope ) effect . To him be all Honour and Prayse for ever . Amen .

P. How fitly doth this your Conclusion suit with , and succeed that , which was last mentioned , as matter for your more serious and sad meditation , and which I cannot but tremble 〈◊〉 ! And well weighing also the words of this your Conclusion with all that you have written in this your Booke , and with all your Practises in your life ( all so uniforme , and sutable ) I am surprized with great astonishment . The reasons hereof will further appeare in the more particular animadversions upon your words asunder . And because we use to take most speciall notice of a mans last words : give me l●ave to take a full and particular view of yours here , as being , though not the last words of a dying man , yet the finall Conclusion of this your Booke , which so soon as I have read over , it passeth away tanquam Fabula as the Prophet speaks of a mans life * * ●al . 90 ▪ 9. as a ta●● th● is told . And as we looke , tha● however you have dealt in your Book , yet in the close of all you should deale candidly , ingeniously , and cordially , and not dubble with God , and the world , and with your own Conscience : yet for my part , as the Spirit of sincerity and truth ( without flattery , or respect of Persons , where the truth is wronged ) hath rnd doth run through all the veines of this my Reply to your Relation : so I shall by Gods grace close all with the same spirit , not sparing you to the last , where still you give just cause . And the truth cannot better , nor more seasonably be spoken home , then as to a dying man , who though he have been never so notorious an hypocrite ▪ and desperate man in the Course of his life , yet when he lyes upon his death-bed , and utters some words , which seem to savour of some sensiblenesse of his Condition , then , if ever , there may be some hope of working upon him ( as when the yron is hot ) by putting home unto him , and laying before him his former life , that so at the last , though late ( as the Thiefe on the Crosse ) he may through Gods mercy be brought to repentance , and so to salvation . Although examples of such penitents indeed and in truth , be very rare . For as one observeth , * * August . One Thiefe was saved on the Crosse , that none should d●spaire : and but one , that none should presume . ●or the saying too ordinarily proves true , Qualis vita , finis it● : As a man lives , so he dyes . And Paenitentia sera , rarò vera : Late Repentance is seldome true . And the Prophet gives the reason of it : ‡ ‡ Ier. 13.23 . Can the Ethiopian change his hew or skin ? Or the Leopard his spots ? Then may ye also do good : that are accustomed to doe evil . For as one ●aith , Consuetudo peccandi , tollit sensum pecca●i : Custome of sinning , takes away the sense of sin And where there is no● sense of sin , there can be no Repentance for sin . And therfore commonly , when a man that hath lived wickedly , and hath been used to lying and dissembling all his life , comes to ●ay on his death bed , or at the last gaspe , Lord have mercy upon me : however we may not judge him , leaving him to his Judge , yet this is no sufficient argument to perswade us , that this is 〈◊〉 Repentance . For lightly when such men , promising and vowing , it God restore them , to reforme their life , do recover : they ‡ ‡ 2 Pet 2 22. ●●turn ●s the Scripture speaks ) with the dog to his vomit , and with 〈…〉 that is washed , to her wallowing in the mire . According to that 〈◊〉 or Apologie : 〈◊〉 Daemon , Monachus tunc esse volebat : 〈◊〉 Daemon : nec tamen est Monachus . Which 〈…〉 thus : 〈…〉 was 〈◊〉 , the De●il a Monke would be : 〈…〉 was well : the ●evil a Monke was he . But I must not doe you wrong in applying of these things to you : or that I have any hope of doing good upon you even now at last , in the close of all : seeing you give me no incouragement of hope at all this way . For in all this your Closse , not a word expressing the least sorrow for your most enormious iniquites , but on the contrary you justifie them , and glory in them . Wherein you shew the pride of your heart to be out of measure desperate , and not to be named with the pride of that Pharisee . For though he gloryed in himselfe , yet he gloryed not in his evil , but in those things that were in themselves good and commendable , and for which he gave God thanks , as the Author of them : but here I find a proud Prelate vaunting in his impiety , and in all his wicked practises , the ayme whereof is , to reconcile the Church of England , and that of the Whore of Babylon together , and all under a faire pretence of the meeting of Truth and Peace . And not content herwith , he must needs make God , and his free Grace the Author of all this Mystery of Iniquity , and deep hypocrisie , which here he veileth under the name of a single heart .

But stay before I begin , is there no hope of doing good upon you ? It is not impossible , but that the greatnesse of your zeale for this Peace , hath been so strong in you , as whereby you have been perswaded , whatsoever you either have done , or yet can further doe , for the effecting thereof ( be it by throwing down of Gods word , casting out his Ministers , chasing away G●ds people , howting out all power of holynesse out of the Land , and so removing all such impediments , as you thought stood in your way , and that per ●as , aut nefas , by right or wrong all wa● , and is well , yea very well done . Haply the lovely and amiable name of an Imaginary Truth , and deceitfull Peace , and counter●et C●urch : and the strength of your beliefe , that Rome was yet a true Church , and so true , that England and she were and are one and the same Church , no doubt of that , did so wholly possesse you , that ●o bring England and Rome together againe , you thought even 〈◊〉 of the Truth it selfe to be true piety , and the 〈◊〉 of the peace of all to be an establishment of unity , and confusion of light with darknesse to a perfect Reconciliation . Yet this I must say wi●hall , as Christ said , * * M●t. 23. If the light that is in thee be darknesse , how great is that darknesse ! And if in all that you have done for the advancing of this your maine Project , you have not wilfully 〈◊〉 against the ●ight of your Conscience , and so gone on in that 〈◊〉 course with a high hand : certainly it seems to me a 〈…〉 highest admiration , and so much the more , 〈…〉 have long lived in the midst of such a cleare 〈…〉 ▪ as no Age since the Apostles hath seen a greater ; though now of late it hath suffered ( and that since your elevation especially ) no smal Eclipse . But if my words shall have no better effect with you , then onely to convince you , and discover your damnable Hypocrisie , jam liberaui animam meam , I have now freed mine own soule . And now to your words .

'T is time for me ( say you ) to end . And I say ( as I sayd before ) it had been ( in my judgement ) much better for you , if you had never begun this worke . But 't is well , that at length ( as Iob speaks ) * * Iob. 16.3 . vaine words have an end . Though it be not for this reason , that you make an end . But you alledge those many things of weight lying upon you . What , what weighty things hath this mighty Apostolicall Man lying upon him ? Such as the Apostle had , ‡ ‡ 2 Cor. 11.28 . The care of all the Churches ? That you pretend too , while you would so faine have Altars up in all the Churches in England . But the Apostle addes there : Who is weake , and I not weake ? Who is offended and I burn not ? Can you say so ? You can say , Who is offended at my Cerimonies , and I burn not with zeale against that man , till I have consumed ? But why do I name the Apostle ? Your many things of weight lying upon your shoulders : are State-matters , high and deep State-mysteries , the burthen of a vast Iland , heavier then Etna it selfe . What , such , so weighty , so many things lye upon your weake shoulders ? Enough to presse you down as low as hell . What doe not you professe to be a Priest ? a Clergy man ? And is not the Charge of that one Profession , being rightly executed ( had you ever felt the weight of it ) a burthen heavy enough to breake your backe , ( which as one said ) the shoulders of Angels would tremble under ? And the Apostle speaking of a Ministers office , saith , ‡ ‡ Onus Aetnâ 〈◊〉 . Proverbu●m . No man that warreth , intangleth himselfe with the affaires of this life , that he may please him , § § 2 T●m . 2 4. who hath chosen him to be a souldier . But it seemeth you are none of those , whom Christ hath chosen to be his souldier , except he chose you for such a purpose , as he did but one man of the twelve . For you are one that warreth , and as Iudas , the Captain of the rout against Christ in his Ministers and members . But you intangle your selfe with the affaires of this life . And by this means you have the more power to warre against Christs Kingdome . So as Ieromes speech may take place here : Negotia●orem Clericum , & ex inope divitem , ex ignobile gloriosum , tanquam quandam pestem ●uge : Hier●n . ad 〈◊〉 . A negotiating or Polypragmaticall Clerke , or Clergy man , and who of poore bcomes rich , of base vain-glorious , fly from him , as from a kind of Plague . But who hath compelled you to take the burthen of so many and great things upon you ? What did the Pillars of the State shake and tremble , and threaten a fall , and therupon 〈…〉 in , and put under your shoulder to stay it up ? As the Pope at the Councel of Lateran dreamed , that the Lateran shooke and was ready to fall , but that Dominicus came in the nicke , and upheld it ; wherupon the next day the Pope made Domi●i●us the Father of his Order . And so well may you prove a supporter of the Popes Lateran , but how a supporter of Civil States , I know not , nor meddle with , but negatively , shewing a disparity and incongruity between your Profession , and that , sa●ing that you are rather a Civilian , then a Divine , as having proceeded Doctor , not in Divinity , but of the Civil Law . But suppose you had been compell'd to it . * * Io● 6.15 ▪ Christ would not be made King , when they would have forced him . For ‡ ‡ Ioh. 18.36 . his Kingdome was not of this world . But yours is . And your shoulders are able to beare two such intolerable burthens , as never any man in the world could beare one of them well , and as he should doe Well , I will say no more but this , ‡ ‡ Luk 12.48 ▪ To whom much is committed , of him shall much be required .

But you adde also another reason , why 't is time for you to end : as bearing now the burthen of 65. yeares compleat . A great age , and yet I suppose you feele it not to be a burthen . If you doe , then as the Poet saith , § § Ho●at ▪ Solve senescentem maturè sanus equum , ne Peccet ad erremum ridendus , & ilia ducat . And you say , it draws on apace to the Period set by the Ppophet David , Psal 90. You mistake the Pen-man : for it was Moses . But to let that passe , as a common mistake : and as a Law , which it seems you have imposed your selfe , and observed throughout your Book , not to cite any Scripture without perverting of it . Doth your Lordship hope to reach the period of three-score and ten ? Alas , should you live out but one Lustrum of five yea●es more , what would become of ( I say not , the Civil state , but ) the poore Church of God yet in England ? But our comfort is , The Lord Iesus Christ is both against you , and above you . In the meane time were it not safer for you , to think of a shorter period of your life least promising to yourselfe , and sleeping in the security of so many yeares more , you should be suddainly taken napping , as that rich man in the Gospell , to whom it was said , † † Luk 12 20 ▪ Thou foole this night shall they take away 〈◊〉 soule from thee . And besides , you are ‡̶ ‡̶ Psal. 73 . 1● . ●et in a slippery place , 〈◊〉 you may fall into suddain destruction , as in a moment ; as the Prophet saith . So as there is lesse confidence to be put in that , then in your Age. And therfore bethinke your selfe how suddain the time may be , that you must goe , and give account ( as you say ) to God and Christ of the Talent committed to your Charge , which you cannot so easily answere before that Judge , as you could doe in the Starre-Chamber . And remember what you said to the Jesuite ( pag. 316. ) Our reckoning wil be heavier , if we thus mislead on either side , then theirs that follow us ? But I see I must looke to my selfe , for you are secure ? And are not you full out as secure , as the Jesuite ? But in that , you pray that God for Christs sake would be mercifull to yo u. But is that enough to wipe off all old scores , to say , God be mercifull to me ? When the Course of a mans life hath been a very Enmity and Rebellion against Christ : when he hath spent the Talent of his Strength and Wit , Meanes , and Friends to the dishonour of God , in oppressing Christs word , persecuting his Ministers and People , profaning and polluting the service of God with humane Ordinances , and will-worship , forcing mens Consciences to conformity , and the like : doe you think to salve all with a Lord have mercy upon me ? Nay , you seem to be in good earnest , when you say , and pray , if God for Christs sake would be mercifull unto you . But wherein , or for what , should God for Christs sake be mercifull unto you ? Which of your sins , your scarlet sins , your Episcopall sins , doe you confesse to God , and ( because publick ) unto the world , that truly repenting of them , God for Christs sake may be mercifull to you ? Doe you confesse and repent of your persecuting of Gods Ministers and People , for their Conscience sake ? Nay you are so farre from this , that you say , God forbid ( not , God forgive ) that I should perswade to persecution in any kind , or practise it in the least . So as you in all this persecute none ; no , not you ; nor yet perswade others to it ; nor disswade , neither . And yet you still continue a persecutor , as accounting it not a sin , but a vertue , not vicious , but rather meritorious , to root out the Puritans . And what say you to your more then Barbarous shedding of the Innocent Blood of Gods servants , and Christs witnesses , mangling their Bodies , and breaking them in pieces , causelesly separating Man and Wife , to satisfie your wicked malice , and so to murther them with your intollerable oppressions ? Doe you crave mercy of God for this ? Or is your guilty Conscience still seared , and stupified ? Is your heart still hardened ? Do you need no mercy for such cruell shedding of Innocent blood ? David * * Psalm . 51. confessed his blood-shed , and found mercy . But you continue your cruelty still in cold blood . What ? Do you think , that because Gods people are as sheep appointed for the slaughter , and you the chiefe Butcher , therfore you sin not , in devouring and spoyling so many good Ministers with their Families and Flocks ? O stupid Conscience ! O desperate soule ! And so still desperately you goe on , in justifying your selfe in all that you have done , and calling God to be witnesse too : saying , Who knows , that however in many weaknesses , yet I have with a faithfull and single heart ( ‡ ‡ Blaspemy of the Prelate against Gods 〈◊〉 Grace , as if that had been the Author of all his wicked Pract●ses . bound to his free Grace for it ) laboured the meeting , the blessed meeting of Truth and Peace in his Church . O shamelesse hypocrisie ! O blasphemous wretch ! Doth God know ? Is God the Author of all thy impiety , iniquity , cruelty ▪ craft , hypocrisie and dissimulation , of thy faithlesse and false heart , in thy plotting to bring thy false Truth , and thy turbulent Peace with the Whore of Babylon , that notorious enemy of Christ and his true Spouse his Church , to a meeting , to a blessed , yea to a cursed meeting ?

O GOD , thou searcher of all hearts , behold this blaspemous Wretch , calling thee for a witnesse of his notorious and perfidious false heart , and ascribing it to thy free Grace , as the moving and helping cause of all his impious practises . O Lord , Be not mercifull to any wicked Transgressor , that dare thus desperately take thy sacred Name in vaine , and make thy Grace , the father of his gracelesse actions Seest thou not , ô thou All-seeing , and All-revenging GOD , how this man hath been a prime Instrument of oppressing thy Word ? of forbidding it to be preached ( therein denying and destroying the Doctrine of thy free Grace , which here he hypocritically nameth ) of persecuting thy faithfull Ministers and People even to root them out ? Of proclaming Libertinisme in the publicke profanation of thy Sabbaths , and violation of thy holy Commandement ? Of setting up Idolatrous Altars , to the denying of the Lord Iesus Christ , our onely Altar , whereon our Persons and sacrifices offered up unto thee , are accepted of Thee ? Of bringing into thy worship sundry supers●tious Idolatrous Rites and Ceremonies , in Adoration of Altars , Names , praying towards the East ? Of setting up Images and Crucifixes those Idols in the publick place of Worship ? Of putting down preaching of thy holy Word upon thy holy Sabbaths especially in the Afternoones , when there is most need , and people should be aptest , and best at leasure generally to heare ? Of inlarging and making heavier the yoake of Bondage and Tyranny upon the necks of thy People , in increasing of more Ceremonies , to the intollerable vexation of thy Children , and incrochment and usurpation upon Christs Kingdome , and royall soverainty , as sole King over his Church , and Lord of the Consciences of his people ? Yea * * Psal. 10. surely thou hast ▪ seen all these things ; for thou beholdest mischiefe and spight , even to requite it with thy hand : and therfore the poore committeth himselfe unto thee : For thou art the helper of the fatherlesse . Therfore , arise ô Lord ; ô God , Lift up thine hand , forget not the humble . Wherfore doth the wicked contemn thee , ô God : He hath said in his heart , Thou wilt not require it . But Lord , break thou the arme of the wicked , and the evil man ; seek out his wickednesse , till thou find none . For wherfore should the Heathen say , where is their God ? Psal. 79.10 . O let our God be known among the Heathen in our fight , by the revenging of the blood of th● servants , which is shed And let the sighing of the Prisoners come before thee : according to the greateesse of thy power preserve thou those , that are appointed to dye . And render unto our Neighbours sevenfold into their bosome their reproach , wherewith they have reproched thee ô Lord . So we thy People and Sheep of thy pastture will give thee thanks for ever : we will shew forth thy praise to all Generations .

Now , to return to you againe and so ridde my hands of you . All that you have done , is ( you say ) for the blessed meeting of Truth and Peace . This is the upshot of all , Englands Reconciliation with Rome . So as when these two are reconciled ( as I doubt they are already , while you hold us in expectation , untill you expect but time ( the Contract being already made ) for Confirmation ) when this is come to passe , then wil be a blessed meeting , a mercy meeting For it is a meeting of Truth and Peace . Indeed when Truth and Peace , in the true sense , do meet , 't is a blessed meeting indeed . But what Truth ? What Peace ? The Truth is , When this Peace is once Consummate , that it comes to be openly avowed and professed ( for which we must not looke for a Generall Councel , that 's but a flourish , and a Blind , while you are undermining the Bulwarke of our Truth , and the beauty of our Peace ) then ( as when Herod and Pilate were made friends ) you shall see ( which is already in execution ) open persecution of all true Piety , and Purity , and perturbation of all true Peace , and that not onely in the Churches of God , but in Civil states and Kingdomes , when for the maintenance of this Peace , Princes shal be set against their People , and People are forced to stand for the liberty of their Consciences against Prelaticall Antichristian Tyranny . For what is Romes Truth , but Trechery ? And what is Romes Peace , but Perturbation , perplexity , confusion , Babylon , even to all those , that confederate with her ? Ye● your hope is , that God in 〈◊〉 good time 〈…〉 meeting . God will certainly effect , and bring to 〈…〉 Councel and Purpose , in his good time for the good of all his People , and the confusion of all his enemies , and theirs . And one of his Councels and Purposes he hath declared to be ( which shall certainly , and I trust very shortly come to passe , and in due 〈…〉 ) the destruction of the Whore of Babylon , together withall 〈◊〉 , that are linkt in a league with her , and that under a pretence ●f the blessed meeting of your Truth and Peace . And then * * Rev 19.1 , 2 ve●s . ● . sha●b● 〈◊〉 that great voy●a of much People in heaven ( to wit , in the Chu●ches of Christ ) saying , Alleluja : salvation , and Glory , and 〈…〉 Power unto the Lord our God ; for true and righteous are his ●udgements , for he hath judged the Great W●ore , which did corrup● the Eearth with her fornication , and hath avenged the blood of his servants at her hand . Amen . ALLELUJA .

Pántote Dóxa Theo. June , 26. 1639. FINIS .