William Rogers's Scourge of Tow fired, Richardson, Richard, 1623?-1689. This text is an enriched version of the TCP digital transcription B09709 of text R181644 in the English Short Title Catalog (Wing P1401). Textual changes and metadata enrichments aim at making the text more computationally tractable, easier to read, and suitable for network-based collaborative curation by amateur and professional end users from many walks of life. The text has been tokenized and linguistically annotated with MorphAdorner. The annotation includes standard spellings that support the display of a text in a standardized format that preserves archaic forms ('loveth', 'seekest'). Textual changes aim at restoring the text the author or stationer meant to publish. This text has not been fully proofread Approx. 20 KB of XML-encoded text transcribed from 7 1-bit group-IV TIFF page images. EarlyPrint Project Evanston,IL, Notre Dame, IN, St. Louis, MO 2018 B09709 124064260 Wing P1401 ESTC R181644 124064260 ocn 124064260 192317 2240961978

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 Early English books online. (EEBO-TCP ; phase 2, no. B09709) Transcribed from: (Early English Books Online ; image set 192317) Images scanned from microfilm: (Early English books; 1641-1700 ; 2915:6) William Rogers's Scourge of Tow fired, Richardson, Richard, 1623?-1689. 7, [1] p. Printed and sold by John Bringhurst ... in Leaden-Hall Mutton-Market, [London : ca. 1684] Caption title. P 7. signed: Richard Richardson. Place of publication and printer from printer's ad on p. [1] at end. Date of publication suggested by Wing. Reproduction of original in the Haverford College Library. eng Rogers, William, d. ca. 1709. -- Scourge for George Whitehead. Whitehead, George, 1636?-1723. Quakers -- Apologetic works -- Early works to 1800. eebo A penny well bestowed, or a brief account of the new design contrived for the great increase of trade. and ease of correspondence, to the great advant [no entry] 1680 14 3363 14 0 0 0 0 0 41.63 D The rate of 41.63 defects per 10,000 words puts this text in the D category of texts with between 35 and 100 defects per 10,000 words. 2011-02 Assigned for keying and markup 2011-02 Keyed and coded from ProQuest page images 2011-04 Sampled and proofread 2011-04 Text and markup reviewed and edited 2011-06 Batch review (QC) and XML conversion
William Rogers's Scourge of Tow fired , with a Discharge By Protestants from his Charge of Popery .

WILLIAM ROGERS has writ , A Scourge for George Whitehead , as he calls it ; but it is as of Tow untwisted , confirmed neither with Reasons , Authoritys , nor Instances . The Summe is this , viz. 1. Outward Church-Government , is a thing Popish . 2. Believeing as the True Church believes , is a thing Popish . 3. Complying with a general Implying , is a thing Popish . His Paper consisting of six leaves , he inculcates , Pope , Papist , Popery , &c. in five of them fifty times at least . As for the other being mostly Personal reflections on G. W. he sleighting them as not worth adversion , thinks them not worth answering n●r trouble , but to be left : and W. R. to the Lord for it .

These his Positions implyed in his sheet and half , ( as far as I can understand it in the drift ) being unproved , his Suppositions applyed to us thereabout , prove nothing . Neither that R. R's Ingredients are Papistical , much less , sufficiently Papistical ; seeing W. R. though challenged before hand to do it , hath not at all offered to prove it , much less , sufficiently proved it ; having not brought any instances denying that , which R. R. hath confirmed by several Protestants . Only W. R. says , ( p. 2. ) These Doctrines are opposed by Reformed Protestants , that 's all . If he makes these 2 words , Reformed and Protestants all one , he should have instanced some at least , and cited them for proof . If he make Reformed a kind of Protestants , he should have instanced whom he means , surely , himself , Crisp , Pennyman , Bullock & Bugg , &c. But most surely Himself , whom he overthrows & his position against all Implicit Faith , which he would have implyed in himself , in willing Men to believe his bare assertion without any Instances , saying , All Reformed Protestants , &c. As the Papist cry , All the Fathers , &c. securely , because the People , through Ignorance in them , cannot disprove them .

Richard Richardson hath mentioned Implicit Faith , in some degree , owned by Protestants with instances .

William Rogers says , 'T is opp●sed by them , and hateful to them ; Autos ephe but instances none but himself . His say so , seems to himself sufficient , as he would have it to others . Is he not then sufficiently Papistical by his own Position ?

And as to his instance , which he cites R. R. a witness to , viz. that some Papists hold themselves not bound , if not voting , &c.

R. R. answers with another instance , viz. that some Protestants have maintained , that Men are bound to obedience , not only by the nature of the thing it self ( which they make account is unquestionably confessed ) but further in respect of the command of them that are in Authority , if nothing appear contrary to Scripture , &c. See Roger Fenton , B D his Treatise against Usury , Patronized by th● Lord Chancellor , 1612.

This is far beyond his instance . Therefore to assert , that the nature of the thing it self binds ( though not so much ) though not assented to , is not Papistical ; Prot●st●nes holding it generally , ( as here afterwards also appears ) and some far further . So that W. R. may as well accuse them all , as us ; notwithstanding what he alledges ( de facto ) of the practice of some Papists , &c. upon politick grounds , siding with their Prince . This sort are his instances to prove us Popish , namely , That Papists own the same that Protestants do . And he shews aspiring to have implicit Faith placed on himself , because he affirms anew what is answered already , without taking notice thereof ; therefore his deserves the less taking notice of : But only to answer his repeating by repeating , what was answered , viz G. W. explained his meaning to be , ( as might appear to any simple mind ) that a true Man must believe in God , &c. as the true Church believes in God , &c. not because it doth . And likewise R. R. answer'd , The true Protestants receive something infolded or implyed in anothers declaration , and instanced from D. Potter , Keckerman , &c. As the Samaritans believed the Woman's saying first , and afterward they saw and knew Christ themselves , Joh. 4.16 .

Calvin says , Many things are implicit to us , in which it is expedient for us to suspend our Judgment , and confirm our mind to hold Unity with the Church . They ( to wit Papists ) define , that they believe rightly who are stupid in their Ignorance . We ( to wit Protestants ) grant Faith to be implicit . The best Teacher must be ready to learn . There were notable examples of implicit Faith in the Disciples . It 's call'd The Preparation of Faith , John 4.50 , 53 , 42. Calvin , Institut. l. 3. c. 2. §. 3. §. 4. The Papists affect to hnow nothing . So Calvin , of whom they that are accounted the best Reformed amongst Protestants , have the Name of Calvinists given them .

His Successor Beza , calls the Papists Implicit Faith . A Diabolical Insensibility , and Believing in general . Beza Annotation on Rom. 1.17 .

Peter du Molin , calls it , A resting on the Faith of another without further enquiry ; and a believing the Church , without seeking what the Church ought to believe ; so an Idle Faith , affected Ignorance ; fearing to know the will of God , lest they should be obliged to follow it P. Molin , his Epistle to the Church of Rome .

This is the Implicit Faith , hateful to the Reformed Church , such as Du Molin intitules himself of ( as the other ) who was the chief Man in the French Protestant Church in Paris , which are accounted of the best Reformed . See Tho. Aquin. 1.2 . qu. 13. Art , 5. Arg. 3. And this is also hateful to us , but grateful to our Adversaries , who think to be excused by affected or pretended Ignorance . To whom , as to this point , this may serve for answer ; as to T. C. his ignorant yet also malicious Reflections . In. vin. p. 11. And F. B's . in very many places of his Books . and to their general clamour , not worthy of further notice at present , than what is here and followes . And as for W. R's . owning no setled Church-Government . ( for no other sort is in question ) He is either for none , and so a Libertine ; or for that he speaks of , and accounts Popish . So let him free himself from the Dilemma if he can . A short answer to his short position , either he confesses them of his mind , of no outward Church Society , so unchurching themselves ; contrary to the Primitive Christians , who had such Society , or else that Society without Government . 2 Cor. 8.4 . 1 Tim. 3.4 . & 5.17 . Heb. 3.7 , 17 , 24. Cont●ary also therein to them , who had Government or Rule . And they that had it , were to be submitted to , or else that Government is Unstable and Arbitrary , and always altogether uncertain , and so fails into that he finds fault with , the Papists unwritten ve●ities , as they call them , written only in the Popes brest , as they speak of some unwritten Laws in the Lawyers brests . But Cook says , That the great●st Authority is of the written . And the Protesants believe and hold against the Papists , that what the Apostle delivered to the Churches , was writ also in his Epistles . 2 Thess 2. 15. & 3 6. John 14 25. & 16.13 . And in all Ages those ●hom God raised up extraordinarily , in every dispensation left in writing their Doctrine and Discipline . Which W. R. it seems disowns . And therefore the Scriptures containing generals , and so left for our learning , times and other circumstances distinguished . And so contradicts his Associate F. B. ( who would make himself the head of their Society , in propounding a cessation ) for he makes the Scriptures the rule exactly , even to circumstances , challenging G. F. in them .

But that he has called me for a Witness to , he thinks , belike , his Master piece worth twice Printing ; what pity his Memory ( equalling his reading and skill in Translating ) should no sooner hit the Mark , to make us in Union or Disunion with the Papists . And so it might have been thrice Printed , ( and I the third time call'd to witness it ) what he says he read in Polario . Indeed I remember'd I had read such a thing there , before I read it in his ; and the scope , namely state matters to be in the case , and Policy , to please their Prince , that those Politicians acted from , not Conscience in Religion , nor necessity and use , but privare interest . A Difference depending , and a War impending between the Pope and French King , as the pages adjoyning shew ; and it seems to be his scope to conceal this scope , that he cited not the page 320. read it & p. ●●● and 321.

Put the Testimonys of the Fathers , Hilarius , Theodoret , &c. ( cited by them ) we do own ; for exceptions in Rules or Canons , upon the grounds of Necessicy or Vse , which those Papists neither shewed on their supposition then ; nor can these Men sufficiently shew on theirs now . And I can sufficiently prove , that we are so far from going beyond the Papists , that we come short of the Protestants , accounted the best reformed in this matter of exercising Church power about Rules , Orders , &c. And thereto I have made choice of an Epitome of the Doctrine of Calvin , Beza , Zanchy , Hemingius , Aretius , Z●gedinus , Sadeel , Grynaeiui , Danaeus , Whittak●r and other the famousest Men of the Protestant Churches in Germany , Helvetia , Danemark , Hungaria , France , England , &c. Bucan . loc. co see his preface . Which I may well oppose to his assertion of all Resormed Protestants , naming none , not one proof or instance , for all his pretended reading , as if he knew them all , and all they said . Take all aforesaid epitomized in Bucan , having gathered from them , as followeth . Loc. 43. Of the Power of the Church and Discipline .

The power of the Church in delivering or making Laws is constitutive , so far , as that Pastors and Governours of the Church may establish and abrogate certain Canons , Rules and Laws in outward and indifferent things , to appoint Polity , Order , Decency , and certain rites for Honesty ( or good report ) and to cherish a consent of all the outward Members of the Church in outward Worship , as the necessity or use ( usefulness ) of the Church seems to require . For such Canons are not universal , in a great part , nor perpetual . Example , First Meeting at Jerusalem , and Paul . The same by Word and Epistle , taught by the Holy Ghost . Examples of such Canons are : To Pray bare-headed ; Decency to be kept in burying the Dead ; Solemnizing Marriages ; Certain days , hours and places ; Order in Prayers and Preachings ; and many other such like things . Col. 2.5 . 1 Cor. 14.40 . 1 Tim. 3.15 . Act. 15.29 .

Thus fur there , wherein we come a large step short of those Protestants in imposing , much less beyond the Papists , as he charges us .

Again they say , These Laws are established or abrogated in particular Churches , by Pastors and Elders ; the whole Flock knowing and approving . Not rashly to be receeded from being confirmed by the Judgment of the Pastors and Elders , and Gods word , and agreeing , and just reasons . Act. 15.2.22 , 2● , 25. General Meetings of the whole Church represented by Delegates ( or chosen Men ) excelling in gifts of the Holy Ghost : As then , so now Christ ought to be present and President in the Counsel of Doctors ( or Teachers ) to drive away Wolves , and determine Controversies raised in the Church ; and to constitute outward good order , such as is expedient for the whole Church . Mat. 18.20 . Act. 15.28 . 1 Cor. 5.4 . And it is the duty of Pastors to foresee ( or provide ) that no hurt befal the Church ; but to stir up one another to meet in the Name of the whole Church in common Counsel ; the Laies ( or Common People ) not being excluded . And the Judgment of Meetings in the midist whereof Christ is , who are gathered in his Name , is not to be despised . And such Constitutions or Canons none can wittingly violate or contemn with a clear Conscience ; both in respect of Offence and contumacy . 1 Cor. 12.28.29 . But without offence of weak Brethren , and being hindered by just causes , it is lawful sometimes to omit things with a clear Conscience . 1 Cor. 14.40 . The effect and use hereof is Order , whereby Peace and Concord is kept in the well composed state of the Church ; and Decency for Piety , Modesty and Gravity . If one offend another , admontion is to be used according to Christs rule . Mat. 18.15 , 16. And they that profess themselves Members of the Church are to be called to this Judgment . 1 Cor. 5.11 . &c. This Judgment of the Church hath been from the Beginning of the World , and Christ continued it . Gen. 4.26 . & 6.4 . & 26.4 . Lev. 5.1 . & 13.2 , 40. & 14.2 . Numb 5.2 , 6. & 19 1. &c. Mat. 18.18 . 1 Cor. 5.1 , 2 , 3. &c. 1 Tim. 1.20 . And Paul , &c.

Much more there appertaining to this Question , which I have set down in as much brevity as the matter will allow . And but for that , I could add to confirm this the particular Judgments of Vrsin , Zanchy , Keckerman , Pareus , Junius , and several others in their systems and Works . See Hookers Church Government , and other writers on that Subject of our own Country ; the Harmony of Confessions of Protestant Churches . And then judge whether we go beyond the Papists or Protestants either in this matter of imposing of Discipline and Church Government . Which if W. R. and his party reject in general , seeming to own none ( p. 1. ) then he may take for his Authors , Coppin , Quatin , Claudin , Poquius , Bertrand , &c. and those runners out among the ranting Libertines , Antimonians , Anabaptists , &c. of those times , whom Calvin , Luther , Melancton , Brentius , and others write of . Beyond whom he takes a large step , ( his own phrase ) like those whom Paul writes of , Heb. 10.25 . whose manner was to forsake assembling themselves together And Platonicks , who thought the Church to be at all times altogether invisible . Id. ibid. Ioc. 41. So he goes a large step , going beyond all outward Society and Government ; and is far short of having in double honour the Elders that rule well , &c. 1 Tim. 5.17 ,

As for that wherein he charges us , for going a large step beyond the Papists . They have been answered that we disown it deny it , and have disproved it again and again ; and shewed that they of Barbadoes themselves have disown●d it : And also G. F G. W. and A. P. in their Letter to them , which I have formerly illustrated by t●elve Reasons , whereof Scandal is one ; which T. C. pertinaciously , and W R yet here will have the only reason And their manner is , taking no notice of the answer , to affirm and reprint the same Charge over and over , after the manner of T. Hicks , and other our Adversaries , very unfairly ; to deceive the Reader , and abuse both him and us . And they might with more colour of reason charge the Apostle Peter , Exhorting to well doing and good Conversation , that he did it only to avoid Scandal , stop the Mouth , put to shame and silence foollish Accusers ; because in that place that one motive is only mentioned by him . 1 Pet. 2. 15 & 3.16 . Whereas in the said Letter to Barbados it is a twelveth motive , there being eleven other weighty ones . yet all those will not silence the Ignorance and Malice of W. R. T. C. F. B. &c. so profound they are and inveterate . But without mentioning them , they repeat and reprint . Retorting and perverting not only the thing disown'd , but the very letter disowning it , because therein Scandal is alledged as a motive or reason , amongst eleven other reasons , why we disown it .

Richard Richardson . THE END .
ANSWERS Printed and Sold by John Bringhurst , at the Sign of the Book and Three Black-Birds in Leaden-Hall Mutton-Market . 1. AN Epistle of Cantion to Friends , to have a care of that Treacherous Spirit that is entered into W. Rogers and his Abettors , &c. 2. The Accuser of our Brethren cast down in Righteous Judgment , &c. in Answer to W. R. 3. R. R's . Ingredients against W. Rogers . 4. An Exalted Diotrephes Reprehended , &c. in Answer to W. R. 5. Truth and Innocency triumphing over Falshood and Envy , &c. in Answer to W. R. 6. Something in answer to W. R's . Sixth and Eighth part of his Christian Quaker , &c. 7. Righteous Judgments placed upon the Head of Malicious Opposers , &c. 8. The Liberty of an Apostate Conscience discovered , &c. Both in Answer to F. B. 9. William Rogers's Scourge of Tow fired , &c. 10. The Line of Truth and true Judgment , &c.